Re: IDCAMS ALTER and GDGs - From A(0) to B(+1) - Relative Generations

[Robert A. Rosenberg]

At 11:04 -0500 on 11/07/2010, Shmuel Metz (Seymour J.) wrote about 
Re: IDCAMS ALTER and GDGs - From A(0) to B(+1) - Relative G:



 >However, I'd prefer not to have to recommend absolute generations

and  versions.


Why, as long as it's not hard coded?


Years ago I was involved with a GDG setup where the files were 
originally allocated on DASD and after a designated number of 
generations, the older ones where copied to tape with the GV00 
changed to Gv01. Thus you could have 21 generations with only the 
most recent 7 being on DASD (ie: -7 to -20 were tape). This was done 
by creating the tape copies as absolute generation named and this 
replaced the DASD reference in the catalog. The same thing could be 
done by moving a DASD file to another volume (with the V01 name).


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Re: IDCAMS ALTER and GDGs - From A(0) to B(+1) - Relative Generations

[Shmuel Metz (Seymour J.)]

In
,
on 11/05/2010
   at 07:54 PM, Martin Packer  said:

>In this case it boils down to renaming FILE1(0) to FILE2(+1). IDCAMS
>ALTER will do it with hardcoded generations and versions.

What's wrong with using CSI to extract the data, then using RENAME
from REXX?

>However, I'd prefer not to have to recommend absolute generations
>and  versions.

Why, as long as it's not hard coded?
 
-- 
 Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz, SysProg and JOAT
 ISO position; see  
We don't care. We don't have to care, we're Congress.
(S877: The Shut up and Eat Your spam act of 2003)

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Re: IDCAMS ALTER and GDGs - From A(0) to B(+1) - Relative Generations

[R.S.]

Scott Barry pisze:

If a tape dataset name is 17 characters or longer (and the last 17
characters do not change), I believe that it can be renamed, using a DEFINE
NVSAM command (with DEVTYPE, VOLUMES and optionally FSEQN), along with the
requisite DELETE '' NOSCRATCH command.  At least with CA-1, there are
TMC update utilities TMSUPDTE and TMSUDSNB ("restricted use" though), as
well, to consider using with this activity, where any DSN length is a
candidate for change.


Well, in this case last 17 characters do contain GoooVoo.
All the commands above do change catalog and/or TMS entry, but not 
physical DSN recorded on tape in the HDR label. Inconsistence between 
label and JCL DD could lead to x13 abend (813 AFAIR). Maybe CA-1 could 
help here, but I'm not sure, guess that no.



IMHO the solution would be:
a) Leave it as it is.
b) Change the process. Eliminate the need. Maybe it's much simpler than 
tweaking with dsnames.



--
Radoslaw Skorupka
Lodz, Poland


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Re: IDCAMS ALTER and GDGs - From A(0) to B(+1) - Relative Generations

[Robert A. Rosenberg]

At 09:53 -0500 on 11/06/2010, Scott Barry wrote about Re: IDCAMS 
ALTER and GDGs - From A(0) to B(+1) - Relative G:



If a tape dataset name is 17 characters or longer (and the last 17
characters do not change), I believe that it can be renamed, using a DEFINE
NVSAM command (with DEVTYPE, VOLUMES and optionally FSEQN), along with the
requisite DELETE '' NOSCRATCH command.  At least with CA-1, there are
TMC update utilities TMSUPDTE and TMSUDSNB ("restricted use" though), as
well, to consider using with this activity, where any DSN length is a
candidate for change.

Scott Barry
SBBWorks, Inc.


Interestingly the fact that only the LAST 17 characters of a 18-44 
character dataset name are stored in a TAPE HDR1/EOF1/EOV1 label 
allows the dataset to be renamed and still be acceptable so long as 
the last 17 remain constant and the 1-27 character prefix is changed. 
For GDGs, the .GVyy is stored as the last 9 characters leaving 
only 8 characters of the actual name for comparing to the supplied 
18-44 character DSN. Since the Gxxx and Vyy are replicated as 
separate fields in the labels, IN THEORY, for 18-27 character GDG 
names the name could fully be stored in the labels by storing the 
1-17 character GDG Base Name in the DSN area and the G and Vyy 
values in their dedicated fields thus closing this loophole for under 
26 character long GDG Dataset Names stored on Tape.


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Re: IDCAMS ALTER and GDGs - From A(0) to B(+1) - Relative Generations

[Martin Packer]

Note: This ISN'T tape we're talking about. (I'm sorry I mentioned it in 
passing.)

Thanks for all the replies!

Martin Packer,
Mainframe Performance Consultant, zChampion
Worldwide Banking Center of Excellence, IBM

+44-7802-245-584

email: martin_pac...@uk.ibm.com

Twitter / Facebook IDs: MartinPacker





Unless stated otherwise above:
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Registered office: PO Box 41, North Harbour, Portsmouth, Hampshire PO6 3AU






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Re: IDCAMS ALTER and GDGs - From A(0) to B(+1) - Relative Generations

[J R]

With the nature of the last eight characters of a GDS name, the likelihood of 
it not changing between FILE1 and FILE2 is very low.  If the GDS is on tape, 
renaming is not an option.  

 
> Date: Sat, 6 Nov 2010 09:53:53 -0500
> From: sba...@sbbworks.com
> Subject: Re: IDCAMS ALTER and GDGs - From A(0) to B(+1) - Relative Generations
> To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu
> 
> If a tape dataset name is 17 characters or longer (and the last 17
> characters do not change), I believe that it can be renamed, using a DEFINE
> NVSAM command (with DEVTYPE, VOLUMES and optionally FSEQN), along with the
> requisite DELETE '' NOSCRATCH command. At least with CA-1, there are
> TMC update utilities TMSUPDTE and TMSUDSNB ("restricted use" though), as
> well, to consider using with this activity, where any DSN length is a
> candidate for change.
> 
> Scott Barry
> SBBWorks, Inc.
> 
> 
> On Fri, 5 Nov 2010 14:37:21 -0700, Ulrich Krueger  wrote:
> 
> >Martin,
> >Unless something changed since the last time I looked at this ...
> >You cannot rename a dataset on tape.
> >1) Your tape management system probably wouldn't like it.
> >2) The physical tape label info can not be changed after the tape has been
> >created.
> >
> >AFAIK, your only way to "rename a tape dataset" is to copy it to a new tape.
> >
> >
> >Regards,
> >Ulrich Krueger
> >
> >-Original Message-
> >From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:ibm-m...@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf
> >Of Martin Packer
> >Sent: Friday, November 05, 2010 12:54 PM
> >To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu
> >Subject: IDCAMS ALTER and GDGs - From A(0) to B(+1) - Relative Generations
> >
> >I'm looking at a customer batch job and they are rolling over 12 monthly
> >files by 1 - the oldest going off to another data set on tape. They are
> >doing this with ICEGENER copy steps. Each monthly file is a different GDG.
> >Rather than do the actual copying I'd like them to explore using some form
> >of rename.
> >
> >In this case it boils down to renaming FILE1(0) to FILE2(+1). IDCAMS ALTER
> >will do it with hardcoded generations and versions. I checked this and
> >that the structure of the target GDG was intact - by coding some JCL on my
> >own system.
> >
> >However, I'd prefer not to have to recommend absolute generations and
> >versions. Does anyone know how to do this with (0) and (+1)?
> >
> >Yes, I'm aware there may be some operational difficulties with this
> >approach - we didn't keep n generations this way. I'm not convinced the
> >customer actually wants to. I want to present them with options.
> >
> >Thanks, Martin
> >
> >Martin Packer,
  
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Re: IDCAMS ALTER and GDGs - From A(0) to B(+1) - Relative Generations

[Scott Barry]

If a tape dataset name is 17 characters or longer (and the last 17
characters do not change), I believe that it can be renamed, using a DEFINE
NVSAM command (with DEVTYPE, VOLUMES and optionally FSEQN), along with the
requisite DELETE '' NOSCRATCH command.  At least with CA-1, there are
TMC update utilities TMSUPDTE and TMSUDSNB ("restricted use" though), as
well, to consider using with this activity, where any DSN length is a
candidate for change.

Scott Barry
SBBWorks, Inc.


On Fri, 5 Nov 2010 14:37:21 -0700, Ulrich Krueger  wrote:

>Martin,
>Unless something changed since the last time I looked at this ...
>You cannot rename a dataset on tape.
>1) Your tape management system probably wouldn't like it.
>2) The physical tape label info can not be changed after the tape has been
>created.
>
>AFAIK, your only way to "rename a tape dataset" is to copy it to a new tape.
>
>
>Regards,
>Ulrich Krueger
>
>-Original Message-
>From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:ibm-m...@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf
>Of Martin Packer
>Sent: Friday, November 05, 2010 12:54 PM
>To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu
>Subject: IDCAMS ALTER and GDGs - From A(0) to B(+1) - Relative Generations
>
>I'm looking at a customer batch job and they are rolling over 12 monthly
>files by 1 - the oldest going off to another data set on tape. They are
>doing this with ICEGENER copy steps. Each monthly file is a different GDG.
>Rather than do the actual copying I'd like them to explore using some form
>of rename.
>
>In this case it boils down to renaming FILE1(0) to FILE2(+1). IDCAMS ALTER
>will do it with hardcoded generations and versions. I checked this and
>that the structure of the target GDG was intact - by coding some JCL on my
>own system.
>
>However, I'd prefer not to have to recommend absolute generations and
>versions. Does anyone know how to do this with (0) and (+1)?
>
>Yes, I'm aware there may be some operational difficulties with this
>approach - we didn't keep n generations this way. I'm not convinced the
>customer actually wants to. I want to present them with options.
>
>Thanks, Martin
>
>Martin Packer,
>Mainframe Performance Consultant, zChampion
>Worldwide Banking Center of Excellence, IBM
>
>+44-7802-245-584
begin_of_the_skype_highlighting  +44-7802-245-584  end_of_the_skype_highlighting
>
>email: martin_pac...@uk.ibm.com
>
>Twitter / Facebook IDs: MartinPacker
>

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Re: IDCAMS ALTER and GDGs - From A(0) to B(+1) - Relative Generations

[Ulrich Krueger]

Martin,
Unless something changed since the last time I looked at this ...
You cannot rename a dataset on tape.
1) Your tape management system probably wouldn't like it.
2) The physical tape label info can not be changed after the tape has been
created.

AFAIK, your only way to "rename a tape dataset" is to copy it to a new tape.

 
Regards,
Ulrich Krueger

-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:ibm-m...@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf
Of Martin Packer
Sent: Friday, November 05, 2010 12:54 PM
To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu
Subject: IDCAMS ALTER and GDGs - From A(0) to B(+1) - Relative Generations

I'm looking at a customer batch job and they are rolling over 12 monthly 
files by 1 - the oldest going off to another data set on tape. They are 
doing this with ICEGENER copy steps. Each monthly file is a different GDG. 
Rather than do the actual copying I'd like them to explore using some form 
of rename.

In this case it boils down to renaming FILE1(0) to FILE2(+1). IDCAMS ALTER 
will do it with hardcoded generations and versions. I checked this and 
that the structure of the target GDG was intact - by coding some JCL on my 
own system.

However, I'd prefer not to have to recommend absolute generations and 
versions. Does anyone know how to do this with (0) and (+1)?

Yes, I'm aware there may be some operational difficulties with this 
approach - we didn't keep n generations this way. I'm not convinced the 
customer actually wants to. I want to present them with options.

Thanks, Martin

Martin Packer,
Mainframe Performance Consultant, zChampion
Worldwide Banking Center of Excellence, IBM

+44-7802-245-584

email: martin_pac...@uk.ibm.com

Twitter / Facebook IDs: MartinPacker

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Re: IDCAMS ALTER and GDGs - From A(0) to B(+1) - Relative Generations

[Sam Siegel]

On Fri, Nov 5, 2010 at 12:54 PM, Martin Packer wrote:



> However, I'd prefer not to have to recommend absolute generations and
> versions. Does anyone know how to do this with (0) and (+1)?
>
> Yes, I'm aware there may be some operational difficulties with this
> approach - we didn't keep n generations this way. I'm not convinced the
> customer actually wants to. I want to present them with options.
>
> 

write a simple program that determines the absolute generation and version
number.  This could be done with and SVC99.

Then generate the IDCAMS control cards dynamically.

You can then call IDCAMS from the same program or have IDCAMS run in the
next step.

If you call IDCAMS in the same step I'm pretty sure (but not completely)
that you will have to ensure that the 'renamed' datasets are not allocated
to your JOBSTEP.

Cheers,
Sam

Thanks, Martin
>
> Martin Packer,
> Mainframe Performance Consultant, zChampion
> Worldwide Banking Center of Excellence, IBM
>
> +44-7802-245-584
>
> email: martin_pac...@uk.ibm.com
>
> Twitter / Facebook IDs: MartinPacker
>
>
>
>
>
> Unless stated otherwise above:
> IBM United Kingdom Limited - Registered in England and Wales with number
> 741598.
> Registered office: PO Box 41, North Harbour, Portsmouth, Hampshire PO6 3AU
>
>
>
>
>
>
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IDCAMS ALTER and GDGs - From A(0) to B(+1) - Relative Generations

[Martin Packer]

I'm looking at a customer batch job and they are rolling over 12 monthly 
files by 1 - the oldest going off to another data set on tape. They are 
doing this with ICEGENER copy steps. Each monthly file is a different GDG. 
Rather than do the actual copying I'd like them to explore using some form 
of rename.

In this case it boils down to renaming FILE1(0) to FILE2(+1). IDCAMS ALTER 
will do it with hardcoded generations and versions. I checked this and 
that the structure of the target GDG was intact - by coding some JCL on my 
own system.

However, I'd prefer not to have to recommend absolute generations and 
versions. Does anyone know how to do this with (0) and (+1)?

Yes, I'm aware there may be some operational difficulties with this 
approach - we didn't keep n generations this way. I'm not convinced the 
customer actually wants to. I want to present them with options.

Thanks, Martin

Martin Packer,
Mainframe Performance Consultant, zChampion
Worldwide Banking Center of Excellence, IBM

+44-7802-245-584

email: martin_pac...@uk.ibm.com

Twitter / Facebook IDs: MartinPacker





Unless stated otherwise above:
IBM United Kingdom Limited - Registered in England and Wales with number 
741598. 
Registered office: PO Box 41, North Harbour, Portsmouth, Hampshire PO6 3AU






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