Re: Another Golden Anniversary - Dartmouth BASIC
In m338hdm22d@garlic.com, on 04/16/2014 at 04:50 PM, Anne Lynn Wheeler l...@garlic.com said: IBM Boston programming center did CPS for os/360 supporting Basic and conversational PLI. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conversational_Programming_System Wasn't CPS a rebranded RUSH? -- Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz, SysProg and JOAT ISO position; see http://patriot.net/~shmuel/resume/brief.html We don't care. We don't have to care, we're Congress. (S877: The Shut up and Eat Your spam act of 2003) -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Another Golden Anniversary - Dartmouth BASIC
shmuel+ibm-m...@patriot.net (Shmuel Metz , Seymour J.) writes: Wasn't CPS a rebranded RUSH? re: http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2014e.html#74 Another Golden Anniversary - Dartmouth BASIC is this your work? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Allen-Babcock pg20 RUSH as a PL/I Subset http://www.iron-spring.com/PLI_Bulletins/PLI_Bulletin_4.pdf and this: Conversational Programming System http://home.uchicago.edu/~rthielen/cps.html from above: Conversational Programming System is a time-sharing system that runs in a partition of OS/360 Release 17 MFT II or MVT. The CPS language is a conversational dialect of PL/I and includes a modified subset of the BASIC language of IBM CALL/360. The system also provides Remote Job Entry to batch processing and Remote Job Output to a designated terminal from a dataset designated by any batch job. (This was hot stuff!) ... snip ... Call/360 terminal reference guide http://www.bitsavers.org/pdf/ibm/360/os/call_360/CALL_360_Terminal_Reference_Manual_Sep69.pdf 1968 ... http://www-03.ibm.com/ibm/history/exhibits/dpd50/dpd50_chronology3.html The Information Marketing Department is transferred on October 22 from the Data Processing Division to IBM's Service Bureau Corporation. The department is responsible for marketing QUIKTRAN, as well as the company's new CALL/360 time sharing subscriber services, BASIC and DATATEXT. ... snip ... at the time the cp67 group takes over the IBM Boston programming center on the 3rd flr ... Jean Sammet was part of the group http://computer.org/computer-pioneers/sammet.html http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jean_E._Sammet as well as nat rochester http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nathaniel_Rochester_%28computer_scientist%29 trivia ... further expansion of the vm370 group ... they eventually outgrow the 3rd flr (they only had part of the 3rd flr, the other occupant was listed in bldg. directory as a law firm, however the telco closet was on the ibm side and it clearly listed the other occupant as certain 3letter gov. agency) ... and they move out to the vacant former SBC bldg at burlington mall http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Service_Bureau_Corporation Jean Sammet and Nat Rochester don't move out to Burlington. posts mentioning 545 tech sq http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/subtopic.html#545tech recent posts mentioning burlington mall location: http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2014.html#4 Application development paradigms [was: RE: Learning Rexx] http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2014b.html#92 write rings http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2014b.html#105 Happy 50th Birthday to the IBM Cambridge Scientific Center http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2014e.html#16 23Jun1969 Unbundling Announcement http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2014e.html#39 Before the Internet: The golden age of online services -- virtualization experience starting Jan1968, online at home since Mar1970 -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Another Golden Anniversary - Dartmouth BASIC
On 4/16/2014 1:12 PM, Eric Chevalier wrote: Maybe not a BIG mainframe impact, but BASIC certainly had it's place in the mainframe sun, starting with VS BASIC, program product 5748-XX1. Between 1979 and 1981 I worked for Ryan-McFarland, developers of RM-BASIC, RM-FORTRAN and RM-COBOL. My last project at RMC was to help port RM-BASIC to both VM and OS/MVS. I left before the project was completed, but it did eventually come to market as BASIC/VM (Program Number 5668-996) and BASIC/MVS (Program Number 5665-948). My very first programming language was BASIC on a mainframe (under CALL/OS). -- Edward E Jaffe Phoenix Software International, Inc 831 Parkview Drive North El Segundo, CA 90245 http://www.phoenixsoftware.com/ -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Another Golden Anniversary - Dartmouth BASIC
On 4/9/14, 9:29 AM, John McKown wrote: OK, not a big mainframe impact. But how many of us started programming by using Basic on something like an Apple ][? https://www.dartmouth.edu/basicfifty/ Maybe not a BIG mainframe impact, but BASIC certainly had it's place in the mainframe sun, starting with VS BASIC, program product 5748-XX1. Between 1979 and 1981 I worked for Ryan-McFarland, developers of RM-BASIC, RM-FORTRAN and RM-COBOL. My last project at RMC was to help port RM-BASIC to both VM and OS/MVS. I left before the project was completed, but it did eventually come to market as BASIC/VM (Program Number 5668-996) and BASIC/MVS (Program Number 5665-948). -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Another Golden Anniversary - Dartmouth BASIC
et...@tulsagrammer.com (Eric Chevalier) writes: Maybe not a BIG mainframe impact, but BASIC certainly had it's place in the mainframe sun, starting with VS BASIC, program product 5748-XX1. Between 1979 and 1981 I worked for Ryan-McFarland, developers of RM-BASIC, RM-FORTRAN and RM-COBOL. My last project at RMC was to help port RM-BASIC to both VM and OS/MVS. I left before the project was completed, but it did eventually come to market as BASIC/VM (Program Number 5668-996) and BASIC/MVS (Program Number 5665-948). IBM Boston programming center did CPS for os/360 supporting Basic and conversational PLI. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conversational_Programming_System Also had microcode assist for the 360/50. a lot was subcontracted out to allen-babcock ... some old http://www.bitsavers.org/pdf/allen-babcock/cps/CPS_Progress_Report_may66.pdf http://www.bitsavers.org/pdf/allen-babcock/cps/raft_Eval_Microprogram_Mar66.pdf I've mentioned before that CP67 group split off from science center (on 4th flr) ... and took over the ibm boston programming center on the 3rd flr ... in the process of morphing into the vm370 group. misc. past posts mentioning the science center http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/subtopic.html#545tech one of the former cps people even did a port to CMS. http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2010e.html#14 Senior Java Developer vs. MVS Systems Programmer (warning: Conley rant) http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2013c.html#8 OT: CPL on LCM systems [was Re: COBOL will outlive us all] other past references http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2008s.html#71 Is SUN going to become x86'ed ?? http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2012e.html#100 Indirect Bit http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2012n.html#26 Is there a correspondence between 64-bit IBM mainframes and PoOps editions levels? http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2012o.html#72 AMC proposes 1980s computer TV series Halt Catch Fire http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2013c.html#36 Lisp machines, was What Makes an Architecture Bizarre? http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2013l.html#24 Teletypewriter Model 33 http://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2013l.html#28 World's worst programming environment? -- virtualization experience starting Jan1968, online at home since Mar1970 -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Another Golden Anniversary - Dartmouth BASIC
For those who might care to relive their youth (or for those youngsters who'd like to see what the fuss was about) there is the DTSS emulator project, described at: http://dtss.dartmouth.edu/ The original DTSS was apparently built on a GE-235, which ran the BASIC and ALGOL systems, and a Datanet-30 to handle telecommunications (and presumably the SIMON CLI and line editor). Six or seven years ago a project was undertaken to revive DTSS from old listings; the listings were transcribed into machine-readable form, an assembler was written in TrueBASIC, and the resulting code run on a GE-235 emulator (also written in TrueBASIC). The simulator is available as Windows or Mac downloads. John McGeachie once maintained a web-based version, but it has been off the 'net for several months and I don't know its status. -- David Andrews A. Duda Sons, Inc. david.andr...@duda.com -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Another Golden Anniversary - Dartmouth BASIC
In 00ce01cf5528$e52d0760$af871620$@mxg.com, on 04/10/2014 at 08:53 PM, Barry Merrill ba...@mxg.com said: As the EE Lab Professor (name now forgotten, but rather aged as I recall) finished the instructions for that lab project, he said I have been instructed to read this note to all EE students, and picking up a one-page, dittoed notice, he continued The IBM Corporation has donated a Model 610 digg-it-tal, er, digital, computer, located in room 240, and students can sign up for blocks of time to use it. Slamming the sheet of paper face down, he then said those digital things will never amount to anything, but next year, as Juniors, you will be able to go across the hall to room 241 and use the Bendix G15 Analog Computer - that's how we Electrical Engineer's solve real problems! Bendix G15 Analog Computer? Digital, Shirley. -- Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz, SysProg and JOAT ISO position; see http://patriot.net/~shmuel/resume/brief.html We don't care. We don't have to care, we're Congress. (S877: The Shut up and Eat Your spam act of 2003) -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Another Golden Anniversary - Dartmouth BASIC
On 04/11/2014 08:49 AM, Shmuel Metz (Seymour J.) wrote: In 00ce01cf5528$e52d0760$af871620$@mxg.com, on 04/10/2014 at 08:53 PM, Barry Merrill ba...@mxg.com said: As the EE Lab Professor (name now forgotten, but rather aged as I recall) finished the instructions for that lab project, he said I have been instructed to read this note to all EE students, and picking up a one-page, dittoed notice, he continued The IBM Corporation has donated a Model 610 digg-it-tal, er, digital, computer, located in room 240, and students can sign up for blocks of time to use it. Slamming the sheet of paper face down, he then said those digital things will never amount to anything, but next year, as Juniors, you will be able to go across the hall to room 241 and use the Bendix G15 Analog Computer - that's how we Electrical Engineer's solve real problems! Bendix G15 Analog Computer? Digital, Shirley. The base G-15 was indeed digital, but when connected to one of its peripheral devices, the DA-1 Differential Analyzer, it took on the characteristics of a digital/analog hybrid, with programming based on integrators and multipliers like an analog computer. If the EE Professor was convinced the G-15 was analog, it was probably always used with a DA-1 and he just didn't understand that the control functions of the system resided in a digital computer capable of independent operation and that the seemingly analog elements of the combined system were actually emulated digitally within the DA-1. -- Joel C. Ewing,Bentonville, AR jcew...@acm.org -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Another Golden Anniversary - Dartmouth BASIC
Joel is quite right. On of thr earliest 'serious' routines I wrote, circa 1950, was one that permitted EE's to continue to indulge in the fiction that they were still setting dials on pots/potentiometers in what was by then an all-digital setting. It made them happy for a time, but all or most of them shortly learned to write code that called appropriate library subroutines, and some of them learned to right the subroutines themselves. John Gilmore, Ashland, MA 01721 - USA -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Another Golden Anniversary - Dartmouth BASIC
Joel is correct, the G-15 was used at that time ONLY with the Differential Analyzer. Hell, that prof couldn't pronounce digital correctly! Barry -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Joel C. Ewing Sent: Sunday, April 13, 2014 11:45 AM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Re: Another Golden Anniversary - Dartmouth BASIC On 04/11/2014 08:49 AM, Shmuel Metz (Seymour J.) wrote: In 00ce01cf5528$e52d0760$af871620$@mxg.com, on 04/10/2014 at 08:53 PM, Barry Merrill ba...@mxg.com said: As the EE Lab Professor (name now forgotten, but rather aged as I recall) finished the instructions for that lab project, he said I have been instructed to read this note to all EE students, and picking up a one-page, dittoed notice, he continued The IBM Corporation has donated a Model 610 digg-it-tal, er, digital, computer, located in room 240, and students can sign up for blocks of time to use it. Slamming the sheet of paper face down, he then said those digital things will never amount to anything, but next year, as Juniors, you will be able to go across the hall to room 241 and use the Bendix G15 Analog Computer - that's how we Electrical Engineer's solve real problems! Bendix G15 Analog Computer? Digital, Shirley. The base G-15 was indeed digital, but when connected to one of its peripheral devices, the DA-1 Differential Analyzer, it took on the characteristics of a digital/analog hybrid, with programming based on integrators and multipliers like an analog computer. If the EE Professor was convinced the G-15 was analog, it was probably always used with a DA-1 and he just didn't understand that the control functions of the system resided in a digital computer capable of independent operation and that the seemingly analog elements of the combined system were actually emulated digitally within the DA-1. -- Joel C. Ewing,Bentonville, AR jcew...@acm.org -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Another Golden Anniversary - Dartmouth BASIC
Newbie. TRS-80 Model 1 16KB with cassette tape at high school. Later, the first computer I bought was a used TRS-80 Model 4 with 3 5.25 in floppies. On Wed, Apr 9, 2014 at 5:36 PM, Frank Swarbrick frank.swarbr...@yahoo.com wrote: TRS-80 Model III for me. From: John McKown john.archie.mck...@gmail.com To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Sent: Wednesday, April 9, 2014 8:29 AM Subject: Another Golden Anniversary - Dartmouth BASIC OK, not a big mainframe impact. But how many of us started programming by using Basic on something like an Apple ][? https://www.dartmouth.edu/basicfifty/ -- There is nothing more pleasant than traveling and meeting new people! Genghis Khan Maranatha! John McKown -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- Mike A Schwab, Springfield IL USA Where do Forest Rangers go to get away from it all? -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Another Golden Anniversary - Dartmouth BASIC
In 99d5c.23d3405a.40771...@aol.com, on 04/09/2014 at 05:07 PM, Ed Finnell efinnel...@aol.com said: Fortran II on SS80 Rara avis! I started on the IBM 650, which was much more common. -- Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz, SysProg and JOAT ISO position; see http://patriot.net/~shmuel/resume/brief.html We don't care. We don't have to care, we're Congress. (S877: The Shut up and Eat Your spam act of 2003) -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Another Golden Anniversary - Dartmouth BASIC
Basic on a Commodore 64 as a hobby. -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of John McKown Sent: Wednesday, April 09, 2014 7:30 AM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Another Golden Anniversary - Dartmouth BASIC OK, not a big mainframe impact. But how many of us started programming by using Basic on something like an Apple ][? https://www.dartmouth.edu/basicfifty/ -- There is nothing more pleasant than traveling and meeting new people! Genghis Khan Maranatha! John McKown -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Another Golden Anniversary - Dartmouth BASIC
Wow, I'm getting old. I learned basic at the Dartmouth DTSS facility in 1975. Thanks! BobL -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of John McKown Sent: Wednesday, April 09, 2014 8:30 AM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Another Golden Anniversary - Dartmouth BASIC [ EXTERNAL ] OK, not a big mainframe impact. But how many of us started programming by using Basic on something like an Apple ][? https://www.dartmouth.edu/basicfifty/ -- There is nothing more pleasant than traveling and meeting new people! Genghis Khan Maranatha! John McKown -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN This e-mail transmission may contain information that is proprietary, privileged and/or confidential and is intended exclusively for the person(s) to whom it is addressed. Any use, copying, retention or disclosure by any person other than the intended recipient or the intended recipient's designees is strictly prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient or their designee, please notify the sender immediately by return e-mail and delete all copies. OppenheimerFunds may, at its sole discretion, monitor, review, retain and/or disclose the content of all email communications. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Another Golden Anniversary - Dartmouth BASIC
On Wed, 9 Apr 2014 09:29:52 -0500, John McKown wrote: OK, not a big mainframe impact. But how many of us started programming by using Basic on something like an Apple ][? https://www.dartmouth.edu/basicfifty/ Heck. A lustrum earlier than the Apple ][. -- gil -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Another Golden Anniversary - Dartmouth BASIC
I learned at Mc Master in 1973. WOW! - -teD - Original Message From: Lester, Bob Sent: Wednesday, April 9, 2014 13:33 To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Reply To: IBM Mainframe Discussion List Subject: Re: Another Golden Anniversary - Dartmouth BASIC Wow, I'm getting old. I learned basic at the Dartmouth DTSS facility in 1975. Thanks! BobL -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of John McKown Sent: Wednesday, April 09, 2014 8:30 AM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Another Golden Anniversary - Dartmouth BASIC [ EXTERNAL ] OK, not a big mainframe impact. But how many of us started programming by using Basic on something like an Apple ][? https://www.dartmouth.edu/basicfifty/ -- There is nothing more pleasant than traveling and meeting new people! Genghis Khan Maranatha! John McKown -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN This e-mail transmission may contain information that is proprietary, privileged and/or confidential and is intended exclusively for the person(s) to whom it is addressed. Any use, copying, retention or disclosure by any person other than the intended recipient or the intended recipient's designees is strictly prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient or their designee, please notify the sender immediately by return e-mail and delete all copies. OppenheimerFunds may, at its sole discretion, monitor, review, retain and/or disclose the content of all email communications. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Another Golden Anniversary - Dartmouth BASIC
Fortran/Cards/370 Then PASCAL on a PDP -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Paul Gilmartin Sent: Wednesday, April 09, 2014 8:03 AM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Re: Another Golden Anniversary - Dartmouth BASIC On Wed, 9 Apr 2014 09:29:52 -0500, John McKown wrote: OK, not a big mainframe impact. But how many of us started programming by using Basic on something like an Apple ][? https://www.dartmouth.edu/basicfifty/ Heck. A lustrum earlier than the Apple ][. -- gil -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
