Re: The Friday Report (was Re: Weekly posting summary for ietf@ietf.org)
I agree with you John, I also not objecting it but wanted more meaning into the report when I receive it, as I suggested before for clarifications. I don't think majority in IETF think it is meaningless so that is why I want to clarify the meaning and discuss what most may not want to discuss. If this was already discussed could some one point me to a discussion about a weekly post that is done for long and which it may be meaningless by some and understoond the meaning by others. I will add that the report can be misleading, and that I have no intention to write a code for something that is not IETF procedure, but I have intention to clarify such message received each week in IETF that has a lack of information or meaning agreed on. AB On Sun, Aug 4, 2013 at 9:55 PM, John C Klensin john-i...@jck.com wrote: --On Sunday, August 04, 2013 19:53 + John Levine jo...@taugh.com wrote: If there is a serious drive to discontinue the weekly posting summary - I strongly object. As far as I can tell, one person objects, everyone else thinks it's fine. I do not want to be recorded as thinking it is fine. If nothing else, I think was is being reported is meaningless statistically (which doesn't mean people can't find value in it). However, I do not object to its being posted as long as it isn't used to justify personal attacks on individuals for their ranking. It seems to me that isn't quite what you said, rough consensus or not. best, john
Re: The Friday Report (was Re: Weekly posting summary for ietf@ietf.org)
If one or two people are doing most of the posting to a list, that means something is out of balance. Summary statistics can be used as an indicator that something should be done to encourage diversity, or get people back on topic, etc.
Re: The Friday Report (was Re: Weekly posting summary for ietf@ietf.org)
On Aug 5, 2013, at 8:03 AM, Abdussalam Baryun abdussalambar...@gmail.com wrote: I agree with you John, I also not objecting it but wanted more meaning into the report when I receive it, as I suggested before for clarifications. It's just a weekly posting summary of raw stats - it's not a ranking system, popularity contest, or twitter trending list. It's not important, and doesn't matter. Lots of people have been at the top of that list, and we didn't get a reward or rebuke. Even if the summary script was stopped, people who care can generate their own. What's more important is the content quality of the emails, and no automated script can measure that (except for ones the NSA has I guess). I don't think majority in IETF think it is meaningless so that is why I want to clarify the meaning and discuss what most may not want to discuss. Dude, the majority of the IETF probably thinks this entire mailing list is meaningless. -hadriel
Re: The Friday Report (was Re: Weekly posting summary for ietf@ietf.org)
On 3 Aug 2013 11:14, Ole Jacobsen (ole) o...@cisco.com wrote: It was never a distraction until AB started complaining about it. Been serving a useful purpose for many, many years. Procmail is your friend. +1 for that --- Roger --- Ole J. Jacobsen Editor Publisher http://cisco.com/ipj Sent from my iPhone On Aug 3, 2013, at 9:12, Heasley h...@shrubbery.net wrote: Am Aug 3, 2013 um 9:05 schrieb Abdussalam Baryun abdussalambar...@gmail.com: On 8/3/13, Patrik Fältström p...@frobbit.se wrote: On 3 aug 2013, at 08:46, Abdussalam Baryun abdussalambar...@gmail.com wrote: I prefer if you post at end of Friday (as in the end of working days of 5 in each week). However, in my comment below I will follow the week as done in world calender, start from Sunday (mornings) and ends on Saturday (nights). The day a week starts, and what days are working days in a week, differs between cultures. Many have Sunday-Thursday as working days. Many have Monday as the first day of the week. I suggested to Thomas to submit report in end of Friday (read what i I suggest eliminating the report. As it doesn't measure content quality, one's contribution can't be measured by the email they produce. So, it is only a guage of the distraction they produce. The report itself is a distraction.
Re: The Friday Report (was Re: Weekly posting summary for ietf@ietf.org)
All, If there is a serious drive to discontinue the weekly posting summary - I strongly object. I don't think its main benefit is be to stop excessive or of topic posting. I'm not saying that list managers and list owners should look at that aspect. At least for me it serves as a safety net where I can look if I missed anything and need to go back and look. /Loa On 2013-08-04 10:31, Roger Jørgensen wrote: On 3 Aug 2013 11:14, Ole Jacobsen (ole) o...@cisco.com mailto:o...@cisco.com wrote: It was never a distraction until AB started complaining about it. Been serving a useful purpose for many, many years. Procmail is your friend. +1 for that --- Roger --- Ole J. Jacobsen Editor Publisher http://cisco.com/ipj Sent from my iPhone On Aug 3, 2013, at 9:12, Heasley h...@shrubbery.net mailto:h...@shrubbery.net wrote: Am Aug 3, 2013 um 9:05 schrieb Abdussalam Baryun abdussalambar...@gmail.com mailto:abdussalambar...@gmail.com: On 8/3/13, Patrik Fältström p...@frobbit.se mailto:p...@frobbit.se wrote: On 3 aug 2013, at 08:46, Abdussalam Baryun abdussalambar...@gmail.com mailto:abdussalambar...@gmail.com wrote: I prefer if you post at end of Friday (as in the end of working days of 5 in each week). However, in my comment below I will follow the week as done in world calender, start from Sunday (mornings) and ends on Saturday (nights). The day a week starts, and what days are working days in a week, differs between cultures. Many have Sunday-Thursday as working days. Many have Monday as the first day of the week. I suggested to Thomas to submit report in end of Friday (read what i I suggest eliminating the report. As it doesn't measure content quality, one's contribution can't be measured by the email they produce. So, it is only a guage of the distraction they produce. The report itself is a distraction. -- Loa Anderssonemail: l...@mail01.huawei.com Senior MPLS Expert l...@pi.nu Huawei Technologies (consultant) phone: +46 739 81 21 64
Re: The Friday Report (was Re: Weekly posting summary for ietf@ietf.org)
If there is a serious drive to discontinue the weekly posting summary - I strongly object. As far as I can tell, one person objects, everyone else thinks it's fine. Seems like rough consensus to me. R's, John
Re: The Friday Report (was Re: Weekly posting summary for ietf@ietf.org)
On 8/4/13 11:53 AM, John Levine wrote: As far as I can tell, one person objects, everyone else thinks it's fine. More to the point, the objections that are being raised appear to be bogus and based in a misunderstanding of how the IETF operates. Melinda
Re: The Friday Report (was Re: Weekly posting summary for ietf@ietf.org)
On 04/08/13 20:53, John Levine wrote: If there is a serious drive to discontinue the weekly posting summary - I strongly object. As far as I can tell, one person objects, everyone else thinks it's fine. Seems like rough consensus to me. +1 Aaron R's, John
Re: The Friday Report (was Re: Weekly posting summary for ietf@ietf.org)
On 4 Aug 2013, at 20:53, John Levine jo...@taugh.com wrote: If there is a serious drive to discontinue the weekly posting summary - I strongly object. As far as I can tell, one person objects, everyone else thinks it's fine. Seems like rough consensus to me. And the code is running… Tim
Re: The Friday Report (was Re: Weekly posting summary for ietf@ietf.org)
--On Sunday, August 04, 2013 19:53 + John Levine jo...@taugh.com wrote: If there is a serious drive to discontinue the weekly posting summary - I strongly object. As far as I can tell, one person objects, everyone else thinks it's fine. I do not want to be recorded as thinking it is fine. If nothing else, I think was is being reported is meaningless statistically (which doesn't mean people can't find value in it). However, I do not object to its being posted as long as it isn't used to justify personal attacks on individuals for their ranking. It seems to me that isn't quite what you said, rough consensus or not. best, john
Re: The Friday Report (was Re: Weekly posting summary for ietf@ietf.org)
First, I'd like to highlight something that is important. There is no inherent preference to posting a lot, a moderate amount, or none at all. Everything depends on context. If you are providing useful input and furthering the discussion, a lot of mails is ok. And no mails can be a problem, too, if you were supposed to participate, such as when you are an author of a document on the topic. For instance, when I look at Thomas' report, if I don't appear there I probably should have paid more attention. In other words, you should not look at how much people post on lists alone… and no matter what you post, please be considerate of other people, avoid repetition, stay on topic, etc. Secondly, don't we have better things to do than to argue about e-mail list summary reports? Several people find them useful. I'm sure there is something in the Internet that still needs fixing :-) Jari
The Friday Report (was Re: Weekly posting summary for ietf@ietf.org)
On 8/3/13, Patrik Fältström p...@frobbit.se wrote: On 3 aug 2013, at 08:46, Abdussalam Baryun abdussalambar...@gmail.com wrote: I prefer if you post at end of Friday (as in the end of working days of 5 in each week). However, in my comment below I will follow the week as done in world calender, start from Sunday (mornings) and ends on Saturday (nights). The day a week starts, and what days are working days in a week, differs between cultures. Many have Sunday-Thursday as working days. Many have Monday as the first day of the week. I suggested to Thomas to submit report in end of Friday (read what i prefered done above) to include both Sun-Thur and Mon-Fri working days, so all can see the result of working days in IETF. There is not *one* definition of when a week start and end. I have worked both (Sun-Thur) and (Mon-Fri), my definition never matters, it is the definition of the organisation we work for that matters. So is there a definition in IETF or does Thomas have a definition or it was selected randomly morning of Friday. AB Patrik
Re: The Friday Report (was Re: Weekly posting summary for ietf@ietf.org)
Am Aug 3, 2013 um 9:05 schrieb Abdussalam Baryun abdussalambar...@gmail.com: On 8/3/13, Patrik Fältström p...@frobbit.se wrote: On 3 aug 2013, at 08:46, Abdussalam Baryun abdussalambar...@gmail.com wrote: I prefer if you post at end of Friday (as in the end of working days of 5 in each week). However, in my comment below I will follow the week as done in world calender, start from Sunday (mornings) and ends on Saturday (nights). The day a week starts, and what days are working days in a week, differs between cultures. Many have Sunday-Thursday as working days. Many have Monday as the first day of the week. I suggested to Thomas to submit report in end of Friday (read what i I suggest eliminating the report. As it doesn't measure content quality, one's contribution can't be measured by the email they produce. So, it is only a guage of the distraction they produce. The report itself is a distraction.
Re: The Friday Report (was Re: Weekly posting summary for ietf@ietf.org)
Hi, I don't care if this report is published or not, but I will point out that the 1 week sample period is not that useful if the intent is to spot excessive posting. Somebody could be following up on 1 thread, and not post again for a year. Somebody could be participating in an IETF Last Call discussion, which should not even count as extra since that is a critical part of our review process. Andy On Sat, Aug 3, 2013 at 12:12 AM, Heasley h...@shrubbery.net wrote: Am Aug 3, 2013 um 9:05 schrieb Abdussalam Baryun abdussalambar...@gmail.com: On 8/3/13, Patrik Fältström p...@frobbit.se wrote: On 3 aug 2013, at 08:46, Abdussalam Baryun abdussalambar...@gmail.com wrote: I prefer if you post at end of Friday (as in the end of working days of 5 in each week). However, in my comment below I will follow the week as done in world calender, start from Sunday (mornings) and ends on Saturday (nights). The day a week starts, and what days are working days in a week, differs between cultures. Many have Sunday-Thursday as working days. Many have Monday as the first day of the week. I suggested to Thomas to submit report in end of Friday (read what i I suggest eliminating the report. As it doesn't measure content quality, one's contribution can't be measured by the email they produce. So, it is only a guage of the distraction they produce. The report itself is a distraction.
Re: The Friday Report (was Re: Weekly posting summary for ietf@ietf.org)
It was never a distraction until AB started complaining about it. Been serving a useful purpose for many, many years. Procmail is your friend. Ole J. Jacobsen Editor Publisher http://cisco.com/ipj Sent from my iPhone On Aug 3, 2013, at 9:12, Heasley h...@shrubbery.net wrote: Am Aug 3, 2013 um 9:05 schrieb Abdussalam Baryun abdussalambar...@gmail.com: On 8/3/13, Patrik Fältström p...@frobbit.se wrote: On 3 aug 2013, at 08:46, Abdussalam Baryun abdussalambar...@gmail.com wrote: I prefer if you post at end of Friday (as in the end of working days of 5 in each week). However, in my comment below I will follow the week as done in world calender, start from Sunday (mornings) and ends on Saturday (nights). The day a week starts, and what days are working days in a week, differs between cultures. Many have Sunday-Thursday as working days. Many have Monday as the first day of the week. I suggested to Thomas to submit report in end of Friday (read what i I suggest eliminating the report. As it doesn't measure content quality, one's contribution can't be measured by the email they produce. So, it is only a guage of the distraction they produce. The report itself is a distraction.
RE: The Friday Report (was Re: Weekly posting summary for ietf@ietf.org)
I prefer if you post at end of Friday (as in the end of working days of 5 in each week). There are seven days in most weeks, in my experience. I suggested to Thomas to submit report in end of Friday I suggest that anyone who wants something different simply writes code for something different. I suggest eliminating the report. As it doesn't measure content quality, one's contribution can't be measured by the email they produce. So, it is only a guage of the distraction they produce. The report itself is a distraction. = Have you considered not reading it? Adrian
Re: [IETF] RE: The Friday Report (was Re: Weekly posting summary for ietf@ietf.org)
On Aug 3, 2013, at 11:48 AM, Adrian Farrel adr...@olddog.co.uk wrote: I prefer if you post at end of Friday (as in the end of working days of 5 in each week). There are seven days in most weeks, in my experience. I suggested to Thomas to submit report in end of Friday I suggest that anyone who wants something different simply writes code for something different. I suggest eliminating the report. As it doesn't measure content quality, one's contribution can't be measured by the email they produce. So, it is only a guage of the distraction they produce. The report itself is a distraction. = Have you considered not reading it? Or, better yet, not appearing prominently on it? W Adrian -- Don't be impressed with unintelligible stuff said condescendingly. -- Radia Perlman.
Re: The Friday Report (was Re: Weekly posting summary for ietf@ietf.org)
On 08/03/13 05:48, Adrian Farrel allegedly wrote: Have you considered not reading it? +1. Especially during IETF week, people on various lists are losing track of their delete key, or the ability to set mail filter rules.
