Re: Can murder be used for IMAP server migration?
On 18 Jan 2007, at 20:16, Gary Mills wrote: Is there any documentation on how to configure and manage a unified Murder? See the man page for imapd.conf: mupdate_config: standard The configuration of the mupdate servers in the Cyrus Murder. The "standard" config is one in which there are discreet frontend (proxy) and backend servers. The "unified" config is one in which a server can be both a frontend and backend. The "replicated" config is one in which multiple backend servers all share the same mailspool, but each have their own "replicated" copy of mail- boxes.db. Allowed values: standard, unified, replicated AFAIK, that's all there is to it. :wes Cyrus Home Page: http://cyrusimap.web.cmu.edu/ Cyrus Wiki/FAQ: http://cyrusimap.web.cmu.edu/twiki List Archives/Info: http://asg.web.cmu.edu/cyrus/mailing-list.html
Re: Can murder be used for IMAP server migration?
Gary Mills wrote: On Thu, Jan 04, 2007 at 07:47:54AM -0500, Ken Murchison wrote: Gary Mills wrote: On Wed, Jan 03, 2007 at 08:18:15AM -0500, Ken Murchison wrote: Gary Mills wrote: Can I use the old server as both a front end and one of the back ends for a murder configuration, with the new server as the second back end? Will that allow me to migrate mailboxes at my convenience? How do I prevent a port conflict between the IMAP server and the proxy on the old server? You'll have to run the frontend + mupdate master on a separate machine. so the frontend has to run there. Of course, the old IMAP server has to run there too. Is there not a way to have the old IMAP server listen on different ports, so that only the frontend connects to it? If not, could it listen on a secondary IP address only? It *might* make sense to upgrade the existing server to 2.3.x, since imapd can both proxy and serve local mailboxes (a "unified" Murder). Is there any documentation on how to configure and manage a unified Murder? I couldn't find anything in the 2.3.7 source that described Bascially build your config using both the backend and frontend instructions and set mupdate_config:unified it. In fact, the examples in the documentation still show the proxy daemons, which no longer exist. True, but we make hardlinks from proxyd -> imapd, etc so that older cyrus.conf continue to work as expected. -- Kenneth Murchison Systems Programmer Project Cyrus Developer/Maintainer Carnegie Mellon University Cyrus Home Page: http://cyrusimap.web.cmu.edu/ Cyrus Wiki/FAQ: http://cyrusimap.web.cmu.edu/twiki List Archives/Info: http://asg.web.cmu.edu/cyrus/mailing-list.html
Re: Can murder be used for IMAP server migration?
On Thu, Jan 04, 2007 at 07:47:54AM -0500, Ken Murchison wrote: > Gary Mills wrote: > >On Wed, Jan 03, 2007 at 08:18:15AM -0500, Ken Murchison wrote: > >>Gary Mills wrote: > >>>Can I use the old server as both a front end and one of the back ends > >>>for a murder configuration, with the new server as the second back end? > >>>Will that allow me to migrate mailboxes at my convenience? How do I > >>>prevent a port conflict between the IMAP server and the proxy on the > >>>old server? > >>You'll have to run the frontend + mupdate master on a separate machine. > > >so the frontend has to run there. Of course, the old IMAP server has > >to run there too. Is there not a way to have the old IMAP server listen > >on different ports, so that only the frontend connects to it? If not, > >could it listen on a secondary IP address only? > > It *might* make sense to upgrade the existing server to 2.3.x, since > imapd can both proxy and serve local mailboxes (a "unified" Murder). Is there any documentation on how to configure and manage a unified Murder? I couldn't find anything in the 2.3.7 source that described it. In fact, the examples in the documentation still show the proxy daemons, which no longer exist. -- -Gary Mills--Unix Support--U of M Academic Computing and Networking- Cyrus Home Page: http://cyrusimap.web.cmu.edu/ Cyrus Wiki/FAQ: http://cyrusimap.web.cmu.edu/twiki List Archives/Info: http://asg.web.cmu.edu/cyrus/mailing-list.html
Re: Can murder be used for IMAP server migration?
On Thu, Jan 04, 2007 at 07:47:54AM -0500, Ken Murchison wrote: > Gary Mills wrote: > >On Wed, Jan 03, 2007 at 08:18:15AM -0500, Ken Murchison wrote: > >>Gary Mills wrote: > >>>Can I use the old server as both a front end and one of the back ends > >>>for a murder configuration, with the new server as the second back end? > >>>Will that allow me to migrate mailboxes at my convenience? How do I > >>>prevent a port conflict between the IMAP server and the proxy on the > >>>old server? > >>You'll have to run the frontend + mupdate master on a separate machine. > > > >Unfortunately, all the clients know the IP address of the old server, > > They actually use the IP address instead of a DNS name? They actually use a CNAME, but the same one for SMTP and IMAP, with the same SSL certificate for both. It would be painful to split them up now. > >so the frontend has to run there. Of course, the old IMAP server has > >to run there too. Is there not a way to have the old IMAP server listen > >on different ports, so that only the frontend connects to it? If not, > >could it listen on a secondary IP address only? > > AFAIK, the proxy is hardcoded to talk to the backend(s) on port 143. > Perhaps you could force imapd to only listen on localhost, but then you > have to find a way to get the mailboxes.db used by the proxy to use > localhost as the servername for the existing mailboxes. > > It *might* make sense to upgrade the existing server to 2.3.x, since > imapd can both proxy and serve local mailboxes (a "unified" Murder). That sounds like the way to go. I'll investigate and try it on my test servers. Thanks for the suggestion. -- -Gary Mills--Unix Support--U of M Academic Computing and Networking- Cyrus Home Page: http://cyrusimap.web.cmu.edu/ Cyrus Wiki/FAQ: http://cyrusimap.web.cmu.edu/twiki List Archives/Info: http://asg.web.cmu.edu/cyrus/mailing-list.html
Re: Can murder be used for IMAP server migration?
On Thu, Jan 04, 2007 at 09:22:24AM +0100, Miros?aw Jaworski wrote: > On Wed, 2007-01-03 at 20:08 -0600, Gary Mills wrote: > > On Wed, Jan 03, 2007 at 08:18:15AM -0500, Ken Murchison wrote: > > > Gary Mills wrote: > > > > > > > >Can I use the old server as both a front end and one of the back ends > > > >for a murder configuration, with the new server as the second back end? > > > >Will that allow me to migrate mailboxes at my convenience? How do I > > > >prevent a port conflict between the IMAP server and the proxy on the > > > >old server? > > > > > > You'll have to run the frontend + mupdate master on a separate machine. > > > > Unfortunately, all the clients know the IP address of the old server, > > so the frontend has to run there. > > Yes. But not the way you think - assign old server ip to the new machine > with frontend. That won't work either. There are many different services linked to that IP address. I don't want to move all of them. > > Of course, the old IMAP server has to run there too. > > Wrong. Assign new ip to the old server. > > Frankly there are simplier ways to do the migration than playing with > frontend and mupdate -> perdition. You will use same scheme though - > assign the ip users are used to use to the perdition and give new ip > to the old server. I've investigated perdition, but I don't think it supports all of the SASL mechanisms that our clients use. Some use NTLM, for example. So many things work nicely with Cyrus that I'd like to stick with it. -- -Gary Mills--Unix Support--U of M Academic Computing and Networking- Cyrus Home Page: http://cyrusimap.web.cmu.edu/ Cyrus Wiki/FAQ: http://cyrusimap.web.cmu.edu/twiki List Archives/Info: http://asg.web.cmu.edu/cyrus/mailing-list.html
Re: Can murder be used for IMAP server migration?
On Thu, 2007-01-04 at 07:47 -0500, Ken Murchison wrote: > >>> Can I use the old server as both a front end and one of the back ends > >>> for a murder configuration, with the new server as the second back end? > >>> Will that allow me to migrate mailboxes at my convenience? How do I > >>> prevent a port conflict between the IMAP server and the proxy on the > >>> old server? > >> You'll have to run the frontend + mupdate master on a separate machine. > > > > Unfortunately, all the clients know the IP address of the old server, > > They actually use the IP address instead of a DNS name? Various broken client resolvers ruin the idea of shortening ttl of the mail service record(s) and switching traffic by changing it/them to another ip. Best approach is to made the service accessible under same ip and play with ip address(es) of the old server(s) acting as backends. M. -- Mirosław "Psyborg" Jaworski GCS/IT d- s+:+ a C++$ UBI$ P+++$ L- E--- W++(+++)$ N++ o+ K- w-- O- M- V- PS+ PE++ Y+ PGP t 5? X+ R++ !tv b++(+++) DI++ D+ G e* h++ r+++ y? "The hen is an egg's way of producing another egg." Cyrus Home Page: http://cyrusimap.web.cmu.edu/ Cyrus Wiki/FAQ: http://cyrusimap.web.cmu.edu/twiki List Archives/Info: http://asg.web.cmu.edu/cyrus/mailing-list.html
Re: Can murder be used for IMAP server migration?
Gary Mills wrote: On Wed, Jan 03, 2007 at 08:18:15AM -0500, Ken Murchison wrote: Gary Mills wrote: Can I use the old server as both a front end and one of the back ends for a murder configuration, with the new server as the second back end? Will that allow me to migrate mailboxes at my convenience? How do I prevent a port conflict between the IMAP server and the proxy on the old server? You'll have to run the frontend + mupdate master on a separate machine. Unfortunately, all the clients know the IP address of the old server, They actually use the IP address instead of a DNS name? so the frontend has to run there. Of course, the old IMAP server has to run there too. Is there not a way to have the old IMAP server listen on different ports, so that only the frontend connects to it? If not, could it listen on a secondary IP address only? AFAIK, the proxy is hardcoded to talk to the backend(s) on port 143. Perhaps you could force imapd to only listen on localhost, but then you have to find a way to get the mailboxes.db used by the proxy to use localhost as the servername for the existing mailboxes. It *might* make sense to upgrade the existing server to 2.3.x, since imapd can both proxy and serve local mailboxes (a "unified" Murder). -- Kenneth Murchison Systems Programmer Project Cyrus Developer/Maintainer Carnegie Mellon University Cyrus Home Page: http://cyrusimap.web.cmu.edu/ Cyrus Wiki/FAQ: http://cyrusimap.web.cmu.edu/twiki List Archives/Info: http://asg.web.cmu.edu/cyrus/mailing-list.html
Re: Can murder be used for IMAP server migration?
On Wed, 2007-01-03 at 20:08 -0600, Gary Mills wrote: > On Wed, Jan 03, 2007 at 08:18:15AM -0500, Ken Murchison wrote: > > Gary Mills wrote: > > > > > >Can I use the old server as both a front end and one of the back ends > > >for a murder configuration, with the new server as the second back end? > > >Will that allow me to migrate mailboxes at my convenience? How do I > > >prevent a port conflict between the IMAP server and the proxy on the > > >old server? > > > > You'll have to run the frontend + mupdate master on a separate machine. > > Unfortunately, all the clients know the IP address of the old server, > so the frontend has to run there. Yes. But not the way you think - assign old server ip to the new machine with frontend. > Of course, the old IMAP server has to run there too. Wrong. Assign new ip to the old server. Frankly there are simplier ways to do the migration than playing with frontend and mupdate -> perdition. You will use same scheme though - assign the ip users are used to use to the perdition and give new ip to the old server. M. -- Mirosław "Psyborg" Jaworski GCS/IT d- s+:+ a C++$ UBI$ P+++$ L- E--- W++(+++)$ N++ o+ K- w-- O- M- V- PS+ PE++ Y+ PGP t 5? X+ R++ !tv b++(+++) DI++ D+ G e* h++ r+++ y? "We are no more than candles burning in the wind." Cyrus Home Page: http://cyrusimap.web.cmu.edu/ Cyrus Wiki/FAQ: http://cyrusimap.web.cmu.edu/twiki List Archives/Info: http://asg.web.cmu.edu/cyrus/mailing-list.html
Re: Can murder be used for IMAP server migration?
On Wed, Jan 03, 2007 at 08:18:15AM -0500, Ken Murchison wrote: > Gary Mills wrote: > > > >Can I use the old server as both a front end and one of the back ends > >for a murder configuration, with the new server as the second back end? > >Will that allow me to migrate mailboxes at my convenience? How do I > >prevent a port conflict between the IMAP server and the proxy on the > >old server? > > You'll have to run the frontend + mupdate master on a separate machine. Unfortunately, all the clients know the IP address of the old server, so the frontend has to run there. Of course, the old IMAP server has to run there too. Is there not a way to have the old IMAP server listen on different ports, so that only the frontend connects to it? If not, could it listen on a secondary IP address only? -- -Gary Mills--Unix Support--U of M Academic Computing and Networking- Cyrus Home Page: http://cyrusimap.web.cmu.edu/ Cyrus Wiki/FAQ: http://cyrusimap.web.cmu.edu/twiki List Archives/Info: http://asg.web.cmu.edu/cyrus/mailing-list.html
Re: Can murder be used for IMAP server migration?
Gary Mills wrote: My current e-mail server has both SMTP and IMAP running on the same machine. I'm building a new IMAP server on a different machine that will ultimately have ten times the capacity. I'm looking for a way to migrate mailboxes from the old server to the new one without shutting down the whole service for an extended period of time. Can I use the old server as both a front end and one of the back ends for a murder configuration, with the new server as the second back end? Will that allow me to migrate mailboxes at my convenience? How do I prevent a port conflict between the IMAP server and the proxy on the old server? You'll have to run the frontend + mupdate master on a separate machine. Do I have to run the same Cyrus version on both machines? Currently, the old server runs cyrus-imapd-2.1.14 and the new one runs cyrus-imapd-2.3.6. No, assuming that 2.1.x has support for the XFER/DUMP commands (I don't recall). -- Kenneth Murchison Systems Programmer Project Cyrus Developer/Maintainer Carnegie Mellon University Cyrus Home Page: http://cyrusimap.web.cmu.edu/ Cyrus Wiki/FAQ: http://cyrusimap.web.cmu.edu/twiki List Archives/Info: http://asg.web.cmu.edu/cyrus/mailing-list.html
Can murder be used for IMAP server migration?
My current e-mail server has both SMTP and IMAP running on the same machine. I'm building a new IMAP server on a different machine that will ultimately have ten times the capacity. I'm looking for a way to migrate mailboxes from the old server to the new one without shutting down the whole service for an extended period of time. Can I use the old server as both a front end and one of the back ends for a murder configuration, with the new server as the second back end? Will that allow me to migrate mailboxes at my convenience? How do I prevent a port conflict between the IMAP server and the proxy on the old server? Do I have to run the same Cyrus version on both machines? Currently, the old server runs cyrus-imapd-2.1.14 and the new one runs cyrus-imapd-2.3.6. Is there anything that won't work in this configuration? -- -Gary Mills--Unix Support--U of M Academic Computing and Networking- Cyrus Home Page: http://cyrusimap.web.cmu.edu/ Cyrus Wiki/FAQ: http://cyrusimap.web.cmu.edu/twiki List Archives/Info: http://asg.web.cmu.edu/cyrus/mailing-list.html
