Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List (Summary)
Lukas Kahwe Smith wrote: Pierre wrote: Also, is it not George S, Ilia and Wez that are listed as mainters of PDO_MYSQL? Yes, as they do all the initial work. What's the point? Mysql was not a maintainer/initiator of any of the .net db layers (or any other language). I will try to discuss this and get a commitment at the developers meeting in Heidelberg next week. Ok, it seems that MySQL AB is finally committing to fix up PDO_MySQL and to generally accept the fact that PDO is the future. Of course mysqli will also be actively maintained. But they will also make mysqlnd play nicely with PDO etc. They have a budget allocated for PDO development. They will soon assign a developer on this I am told. As part of this effort it is expected that the entire PDO test suite will also benefit. Furthermore they have allocated someone from the doc team to check over the ext/mysql and ext/mysqli docs. I will poke the relevant people at regular intervals, that any MySQL specific features in PDO will make it into the docs. regards, Lukas -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List (Summary)
On 9/24/07, Lukas Kahwe Smith [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Ok, it seems that MySQL AB is finally committing to fix up PDO_MySQL and to generally accept the fact that PDO is the future. Of course mysqli will also be actively maintained. But they will also make mysqlnd play nicely with PDO etc. They have a budget allocated for PDO development. They will soon assign a developer on this I am told. As part of this effort it is expected that the entire PDO test suite will also benefit. Furthermore they have allocated someone from the doc team to check over the ext/mysql and ext/mysqli docs. I will poke the relevant people at regular intervals, that any MySQL specific features in PDO will make it into the docs. Thanks, Lukas! That's a great news! -- Alexey Zakhlestin http://blog.milkfarmsoft.com/ -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List (Summary)
Those are very welcome news indeed. I look forward to participation of MySQL AB folks in the PDO development. On 24-Sep-07, at 7:31 AM, Lukas Kahwe Smith wrote: Lukas Kahwe Smith wrote: Pierre wrote: Also, is it not George S, Ilia and Wez that are listed as mainters of PDO_MYSQL? Yes, as they do all the initial work. What's the point? Mysql was not a maintainer/initiator of any of the .net db layers (or any other language). I will try to discuss this and get a commitment at the developers meeting in Heidelberg next week. Ok, it seems that MySQL AB is finally committing to fix up PDO_MySQL and to generally accept the fact that PDO is the future. Of course mysqli will also be actively maintained. But they will also make mysqlnd play nicely with PDO etc. They have a budget allocated for PDO development. They will soon assign a developer on this I am told. As part of this effort it is expected that the entire PDO test suite will also benefit. Furthermore they have allocated someone from the doc team to check over the ext/mysql and ext/mysqli docs. I will poke the relevant people at regular intervals, that any MySQL specific features in PDO will make it into the docs. regards, Lukas -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php Ilia Alshanetsky -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List (Summary)
On Sun, 16 Sep 2007, Ilia Alshanetsky wrote: On 16-Sep-07, at 1:02 PM, Steph Fox wrote: Mmm... but that means dictating which features can or can't go into an extension or a specific build system purely on the level of outside interest in them. Steph, isn't the goal of core to contain things that are of common use and are not for niche uses and wouldn't lack of interest imply its a niche feature? It's not so simple, because not everything can be done in extensions; and as Lukas said... not everybody felt qualified to vote on all the different points either. regards, Derick -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List (Summary)
Hi Lester, On 9/17/07, Lester Caine [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: ( And I'd still like to know what use the code for mysqlind is for those of us who will never enable mysql ? ) Only ext/mysql and ext/mysqli use it. PDO is somehow planed but I have serious doubts about the motivations of mysql to ever support pdo like they support other generic connectors (see .net...). Cheers, --Pierre -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List (Summary)
Hey all, On 9/17/07, Stanislav Malyshev [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: So while I think making list and voting is great, I think we shouldn't replace good old per-case consideration and discussion with arithmetics. If we have clear winners and losers, it's fine, but in between we still need to hear the case. I couldn't agree with this more. The vote was very helpful in narrowing the field of debate: Now there's only three things to be discussed and work can start on making ready the majority of 5.3. However, there were a lot of no-votes on those topics due to lack of information and further discussion would lead to a more informed decision. There probably should be a separate round of voting on just those three issues after some discussion. Speaking in particular about the GC :-), I know there hasn't been widespread review of it (only those who have downloaded my working copy from a separate repository) and I certainly don't think everyone who voted on it have actually played around with it. My personal opinion is that it is ready for 5.3 and should be put into 5.3. It is stable, end-users will not be affected unless they want to use it, extension writers should not even be affected, there is no performance degradation and it would help make PHP a much more credible language to use for anything that runs for longer than a web script. I've been bumping the prerequisite macro patch thread for so long to no avail that it's starting to get embarrassing. Could people take another look at it and tell me whether a vote between the two versions of it would now be appropriate? David -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List (Summary)
David Wang wrote: My personal opinion is that it is ready for 5.3 and should be put into 5.3. It is stable, end-users will not be affected unless they want to use it, extension writers should not even be affected, there is no performance degradation and it would help make PHP a much more credible language to use for anything that runs for longer than a web script. I think this key point wasnt clear. I think most people thought GC would be enabled by default and could introduce BC issues. Since then my understanding of the issue has changed that its disabled by default and can be enabled via php.ini or a userland call .. regards, Lukas -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List (Summary)
Pierre skrev: Only ext/mysql and ext/mysqli use it. PDO is somehow planed but I have serious doubts about the motivations of mysql to ever support pdo like they support other generic connectors (see .net...). The first posts on the net from MySQL-people talked about mysqli first, PDO second and not the old mysql-functions at all. I think that if the PHP community really starts commit to PDO, like in teaching PDO *first* to beginners and using PDO for normal examples in blog posts and on book pages, the people at MySQL will make sure that PDO_MYSQL moves to the new lib as well. Also, is it not George S, Ilia and Wez that are listed as mainters of PDO_MYSQL? Lars Gunther -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List (Summary)
On 9/17/07, Keryx Web [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Pierre skrev: Only ext/mysql and ext/mysqli use it. PDO is somehow planed but I have serious doubts about the motivations of mysql to ever support pdo like they support other generic connectors (see .net...). The first posts on the net from MySQL-people talked about mysqli first, PDO second and not the old mysql-functions at all. And the facts are: mysql first, then mysqli and pdo if it works well when you are done. I think that if the PHP community really starts commit to PDO, like in teaching PDO *first* to beginners and using PDO for normal examples in blog posts and on book pages, the people at MySQL will make sure that PDO_MYSQL moves to the new lib as well. Well, it is already the case, did not change anything. Also, is it not George S, Ilia and Wez that are listed as mainters of PDO_MYSQL? Yes, as they do all the initial work. What's the point? Mysql was not a maintainer/initiator of any of the .net db layers (or any other language). --Pierre -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List (Summary)
Pierre wrote: Also, is it not George S, Ilia and Wez that are listed as mainters of PDO_MYSQL? Yes, as they do all the initial work. What's the point? Mysql was not a maintainer/initiator of any of the .net db layers (or any other language). I will try to discuss this and get a commitment at the developers meeting in Heidelberg next week. regards, Lukas -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List (Summary)
Ilia Alshanetsky wrote: On 15-Sep-07, at 7:18 PM, Stanislav Malyshev wrote: NP ;-) Btw the detailed breakdown of the votes is available here http://bb.prohost.org/53Features.pdf I have taken the data from this PDF and slightly reworked things [1] so that its easy to see which topics got more attention with votes than others. I think its critical to understand that several items were hard for the general community to vote on because of lack of expertise (as noted in several votes). As such I find it questionable to apply a +10 threshold on all items. Furthermore I ask everybody to review if his vote was interpreted as they wanted in Ilia's PDF. Some people made their votes conditional, which is not supported by the formats chosen for tallying up the votes. regards, Lukas [1] http://oss.backendmedia.com/PhP53VoteResult -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List (Summary)
On 16-Sep-07, at 11:02 AM, Lukas Kahwe Smith wrote: Ilia Alshanetsky wrote: On 15-Sep-07, at 7:18 PM, Stanislav Malyshev wrote: NP ;-) Btw the detailed breakdown of the votes is available here http://bb.prohost.org/53Features.pdf I have taken the data from this PDF and slightly reworked things [1] so that its easy to see which topics got more attention with votes than others. I think its critical to understand that several items were hard for the general community to vote on because of lack of expertise (as noted in several votes). As such I find it questionable to apply a +10 threshold on all items. Furthermore I ask everybody to review if his vote was interpreted as they wanted in Ilia's PDF. Some people made their votes conditional, which is not supported by the formats chosen for tallying up the votes. Lukas has a good point about the 0 votes, however if there are niche features most people don't really care/know about that in itself means that there is not much support for said functionality. IMHO the point of the vote was to identify KEY features general community (developers users) would like to see in 5.3, not to introduce feature creep, which re-enumeration of the vote does to some extent, please keep that mind when reviewing the #s. Additionally, remember that 5.3 is a minor release and is not the most appropriate platform for anything everything inclusion. Ilia Alshanetsky -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List (Summary)
Hi Ilia, If it helps any we can count everything else in and just look at the ones that failed: No quorum: == Switch for disabling/enabling materialized cursors in mysqli - 25/28 no vote, 3 positive votes Merge the GCC 4 -fvisibility patch - 20/28 no vote, 7 positive votes, 1 negative vote Voting anomalies: Introduce concept of strict classes that do not permit dynamic property creation - 12/28 no vote, 12 positive, 4 negative Implement David's Circular Garbage collection patch - 13/28 no vote, 11 positive, 4 negative Link phar extension from PECL into core - 12/28 no vote, 11 positive, 5 negative Definitely out: == Remove safe_mode, register_globals and magic_quotes - 6/28 no vote, 4 positive, 18 negative I think it's probably fair to say that the mysqli-specific issue shouldn't be on this agenda in the first place, and the GCC 4 patch most likely failed because those that aren't directly affected by it don't understand it enough to vote over it. That leaves just three features that fail under your voting system but might pass under others. The question is whether those three are up for debate now, or later. - Steph - Original Message - From: Ilia Alshanetsky [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Lukas Kahwe Smith [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: Stanislav Malyshev [EMAIL PROTECTED]; PHP Developers Mailing List internals@lists.php.net Sent: Sunday, September 16, 2007 4:31 PM Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List (Summary) On 16-Sep-07, at 11:02 AM, Lukas Kahwe Smith wrote: Ilia Alshanetsky wrote: On 15-Sep-07, at 7:18 PM, Stanislav Malyshev wrote: NP ;-) Btw the detailed breakdown of the votes is available here http://bb.prohost.org/53Features.pdf I have taken the data from this PDF and slightly reworked things [1] so that its easy to see which topics got more attention with votes than others. I think its critical to understand that several items were hard for the general community to vote on because of lack of expertise (as noted in several votes). As such I find it questionable to apply a +10 threshold on all items. Furthermore I ask everybody to review if his vote was interpreted as they wanted in Ilia's PDF. Some people made their votes conditional, which is not supported by the formats chosen for tallying up the votes. Lukas has a good point about the 0 votes, however if there are niche features most people don't really care/know about that in itself means that there is not much support for said functionality. IMHO the point of the vote was to identify KEY features general community (developers users) would like to see in 5.3, not to introduce feature creep, which re-enumeration of the vote does to some extent, please keep that mind when reviewing the #s. Additionally, remember that 5.3 is a minor release and is not the most appropriate platform for anything everything inclusion. Ilia Alshanetsky -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List (Summary)
Hello Steph, speakin as a looser - we should keep what we just decided on and do it. Do it as in work on it. As in code. As in no more politics for the moment. marcus Sunday, September 16, 2007, 6:12:14 PM, you wrote: Hi Ilia, If it helps any we can count everything else in and just look at the ones that failed: No quorum: == Switch for disabling/enabling materialized cursors in mysqli - 25/28 no vote, 3 positive votes Merge the GCC 4 -fvisibility patch - 20/28 no vote, 7 positive votes, 1 negative vote Voting anomalies: Introduce concept of strict classes that do not permit dynamic property creation - 12/28 no vote, 12 positive, 4 negative Implement David's Circular Garbage collection patch - 13/28 no vote, 11 positive, 4 negative Link phar extension from PECL into core - 12/28 no vote, 11 positive, 5 negative Definitely out: == Remove safe_mode, register_globals and magic_quotes - 6/28 no vote, 4 positive, 18 negative I think it's probably fair to say that the mysqli-specific issue shouldn't be on this agenda in the first place, and the GCC 4 patch most likely failed because those that aren't directly affected by it don't understand it enough to vote over it. That leaves just three features that fail under your voting system but might pass under others. The question is whether those three are up for debate now, or later. - Steph - Original Message - From: Ilia Alshanetsky [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Lukas Kahwe Smith [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: Stanislav Malyshev [EMAIL PROTECTED]; PHP Developers Mailing List internals@lists.php.net Sent: Sunday, September 16, 2007 4:31 PM Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List (Summary) On 16-Sep-07, at 11:02 AM, Lukas Kahwe Smith wrote: Ilia Alshanetsky wrote: On 15-Sep-07, at 7:18 PM, Stanislav Malyshev wrote: NP ;-) Btw the detailed breakdown of the votes is available here http://bb.prohost.org/53Features.pdf I have taken the data from this PDF and slightly reworked things [1] so that its easy to see which topics got more attention with votes than others. I think its critical to understand that several items were hard for the general community to vote on because of lack of expertise (as noted in several votes). As such I find it questionable to apply a +10 threshold on all items. Furthermore I ask everybody to review if his vote was interpreted as they wanted in Ilia's PDF. Some people made their votes conditional, which is not supported by the formats chosen for tallying up the votes. Lukas has a good point about the 0 votes, however if there are niche features most people don't really care/know about that in itself means that there is not much support for said functionality. IMHO the point of the vote was to identify KEY features general community (developers users) would like to see in 5.3, not to introduce feature creep, which re-enumeration of the vote does to some extent, please keep that mind when reviewing the #s. Additionally, remember that 5.3 is a minor release and is not the most appropriate platform for anything everything inclusion. Ilia Alshanetsky -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php Best regards, Marcus -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List (Summary)
On 16-Sep-07, at 1:02 PM, Steph Fox wrote: Mmm... but that means dictating which features can or can't go into an extension or a specific build system purely on the level of outside interest in them. Steph, isn't the goal of core to contain things that are of common use and are not for niche uses and wouldn't lack of interest imply its a niche feature? Ilia Alshanetsky -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List (Summary)
Hi Ilia, Mmm... but that means dictating which features can or can't go into an extension or a specific build system purely on the level of outside interest in them. Steph, isn't the goal of core to contain things that are of common use and are not for niche uses and wouldn't lack of interest imply its a niche feature? But build systems and extensions are part of the core I'm failing to see why a Windows user's lack of interest in GCC 4 should mean that GCC users don't get something they voted for, is all. Or why a patch affecting only the mysqli extension should be part of a vote about core features. I do see your point when it comes to genuine core features that didn't get the required number of votes. Honest! - Steph -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List (Summary)
Mmm... but that means dictating which features can or can't go into an extension or a specific build system purely on the level of outside interest in them. That's the main problem here. The three contentious items, I'd probably (reluctantly) agree with you. - Steph - Original Message - From: Marcus Boerger [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Steph Fox [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: Ilia Alshanetsky [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Lukas Kahwe Smith [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Stanislav Malyshev [EMAIL PROTECTED]; PHP Developers Mailing List internals@lists.php.net Sent: Sunday, September 16, 2007 5:47 PM Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List (Summary) Hello Steph, speakin as a looser - we should keep what we just decided on and do it. Do it as in work on it. As in code. As in no more politics for the moment. marcus Sunday, September 16, 2007, 6:12:14 PM, you wrote: Hi Ilia, If it helps any we can count everything else in and just look at the ones that failed: No quorum: == Switch for disabling/enabling materialized cursors in mysqli - 25/28 no vote, 3 positive votes Merge the GCC 4 -fvisibility patch - 20/28 no vote, 7 positive votes, 1 negative vote Voting anomalies: Introduce concept of strict classes that do not permit dynamic property creation - 12/28 no vote, 12 positive, 4 negative Implement David's Circular Garbage collection patch - 13/28 no vote, 11 positive, 4 negative Link phar extension from PECL into core - 12/28 no vote, 11 positive, 5 negative Definitely out: == Remove safe_mode, register_globals and magic_quotes - 6/28 no vote, 4 positive, 18 negative I think it's probably fair to say that the mysqli-specific issue shouldn't be on this agenda in the first place, and the GCC 4 patch most likely failed because those that aren't directly affected by it don't understand it enough to vote over it. That leaves just three features that fail under your voting system but might pass under others. The question is whether those three are up for debate now, or later. - Steph - Original Message - From: Ilia Alshanetsky [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Lukas Kahwe Smith [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: Stanislav Malyshev [EMAIL PROTECTED]; PHP Developers Mailing List internals@lists.php.net Sent: Sunday, September 16, 2007 4:31 PM Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List (Summary) On 16-Sep-07, at 11:02 AM, Lukas Kahwe Smith wrote: Ilia Alshanetsky wrote: On 15-Sep-07, at 7:18 PM, Stanislav Malyshev wrote: NP ;-) Btw the detailed breakdown of the votes is available here http://bb.prohost.org/53Features.pdf I have taken the data from this PDF and slightly reworked things [1] so that its easy to see which topics got more attention with votes than others. I think its critical to understand that several items were hard for the general community to vote on because of lack of expertise (as noted in several votes). As such I find it questionable to apply a +10 threshold on all items. Furthermore I ask everybody to review if his vote was interpreted as they wanted in Ilia's PDF. Some people made their votes conditional, which is not supported by the formats chosen for tallying up the votes. Lukas has a good point about the 0 votes, however if there are niche features most people don't really care/know about that in itself means that there is not much support for said functionality. IMHO the point of the vote was to identify KEY features general community (developers users) would like to see in 5.3, not to introduce feature creep, which re-enumeration of the vote does to some extent, please keep that mind when reviewing the #s. Additionally, remember that 5.3 is a minor release and is not the most appropriate platform for anything everything inclusion. Ilia Alshanetsky -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php Best regards, Marcus -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List (Summary)
Hello Steph, I did neither meant to dictate anything nor did I said never ...and pure lack of interest belongs into democracy, so if we go that route we have to accept that route :-) If not we can proceed as we did in the past. Have votings and politics but in the end ignoring decisions anyway. marcus Sunday, September 16, 2007, 7:02:28 PM, you wrote: Mmm... but that means dictating which features can or can't go into an extension or a specific build system purely on the level of outside interest in them. That's the main problem here. The three contentious items, I'd probably (reluctantly) agree with you. - Steph - Original Message - From: Marcus Boerger [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Steph Fox [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: Ilia Alshanetsky [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Lukas Kahwe Smith [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Stanislav Malyshev [EMAIL PROTECTED]; PHP Developers Mailing List internals@lists.php.net Sent: Sunday, September 16, 2007 5:47 PM Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List (Summary) Hello Steph, speakin as a looser - we should keep what we just decided on and do it. Do it as in work on it. As in code. As in no more politics for the moment. marcus Sunday, September 16, 2007, 6:12:14 PM, you wrote: Hi Ilia, If it helps any we can count everything else in and just look at the ones that failed: No quorum: == Switch for disabling/enabling materialized cursors in mysqli - 25/28 no vote, 3 positive votes Merge the GCC 4 -fvisibility patch - 20/28 no vote, 7 positive votes, 1 negative vote Voting anomalies: Introduce concept of strict classes that do not permit dynamic property creation - 12/28 no vote, 12 positive, 4 negative Implement David's Circular Garbage collection patch - 13/28 no vote, 11 positive, 4 negative Link phar extension from PECL into core - 12/28 no vote, 11 positive, 5 negative Definitely out: == Remove safe_mode, register_globals and magic_quotes - 6/28 no vote, 4 positive, 18 negative I think it's probably fair to say that the mysqli-specific issue shouldn't be on this agenda in the first place, and the GCC 4 patch most likely failed because those that aren't directly affected by it don't understand it enough to vote over it. That leaves just three features that fail under your voting system but might pass under others. The question is whether those three are up for debate now, or later. - Steph - Original Message - From: Ilia Alshanetsky [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Lukas Kahwe Smith [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: Stanislav Malyshev [EMAIL PROTECTED]; PHP Developers Mailing List internals@lists.php.net Sent: Sunday, September 16, 2007 4:31 PM Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List (Summary) On 16-Sep-07, at 11:02 AM, Lukas Kahwe Smith wrote: Ilia Alshanetsky wrote: On 15-Sep-07, at 7:18 PM, Stanislav Malyshev wrote: NP ;-) Btw the detailed breakdown of the votes is available here http://bb.prohost.org/53Features.pdf I have taken the data from this PDF and slightly reworked things [1] so that its easy to see which topics got more attention with votes than others. I think its critical to understand that several items were hard for the general community to vote on because of lack of expertise (as noted in several votes). As such I find it questionable to apply a +10 threshold on all items. Furthermore I ask everybody to review if his vote was interpreted as they wanted in Ilia's PDF. Some people made their votes conditional, which is not supported by the formats chosen for tallying up the votes. Lukas has a good point about the 0 votes, however if there are niche features most people don't really care/know about that in itself means that there is not much support for said functionality. IMHO the point of the vote was to identify KEY features general community (developers users) would like to see in 5.3, not to introduce feature creep, which re-enumeration of the vote does to some extent, please keep that mind when reviewing the #s. Additionally, remember that 5.3 is a minor release and is not the most appropriate platform for anything everything inclusion. Ilia Alshanetsky -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php Best regards, Marcus -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php Best regards, Marcus -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List (Summary)
Lukas has a good point about the 0 votes, however if there are niche features most people don't really care/know about that in itself means that there is not much support for said functionality. IMHO the point of There's a difference. Let't take two features which got similar voting record - -fvisibility and strict classes. I think these things are redically different. First is the small build change that would not change anything in the language and will not influence anybody except PHP extensions builders, where it can provide small benefit. Second changes the language and adds a feature which is controversial - some think it adds much needed capabilities, while other think it goes contrary to the very spirit of the language. Clearly these are not equal. While the first can be implemented with little impact the second needs much more consideration and I think it can't be decided by simple voting. So while I think making list and voting is great, I think we shouldn't replace good old per-case consideration and discussion with arithmetics. If we have clear winners and losers, it's fine, but in between we still need to hear the case. -- Stanislav Malyshev, Zend Software Architect [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.zend.com/ (408)253-8829 MSN: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List (Summary)
Mmm... but that means dictating which features can or can't go into an extension or a specific build system purely on the level of outside interest in them. Steph, isn't the goal of core to contain things that are of common use and are not for niche uses and wouldn't lack of interest imply its a niche feature? But build systems and extensions are part of the core I'm failing to see why a Windows user's lack of interest in GCC 4 should mean that GCC users don't get something they voted for, is all. Or why a patch affecting only the mysqli extension should be part of a vote about core features. exactly! Nuno P.S.: some text, so that this isn't the shortest post in the world :P -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List (Summary)
Ilia Alshanetsky wrote: For the most part it seems that there is a general consensus on the features to go into PHP 5.3, my suggestion is that all features with 10 points are to be put into the 5.3 TODO and the rest can have another change for PHP 6 and/or PHP 5.4 (if that comes to pass). Either way, there definitely appears to be a set a solid reasons to start the 5.3 branch. Will there be also 5.2.5? From the feature set looks like 5.3 is going to take some time and in the meantime we have bugfixes, etc. - so it makes sense to me. The agenda for 5.3 looks to be fairly busy, and I don't think we can wait 6-7 months between releases, so 5.2.X branch will need to be maintained while 5.3 is being made ready for production. Does that statement imply that PHP6 is at least another 12 months away :( Does all this effort simply push the adoption of PHP6 as the main branch further back. ( And I'd still like to know what use the code for mysqlind is for those of us who will never enable mysql ? ) -- Lester Caine - G8HFL - Contact - http://home.lsces.co.uk/lsces/wiki/?page=contact L.S.Caine Electronic Services - http://home.lsces.co.uk MEDW - http://home.lsces.co.uk/ModelEngineersDigitalWorkshop/ Firebird - http://www.firebirdsql.org/index.php -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
[PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List (Summary)
Just over a week has passed since the suggested list of features for PHP 5.3 was posted and it looks like all of the people who wanted to throw in their votes managed to do so. My thanks to all of the people who voted and kept the discussion on track. Here is the end result of all the hoopla. Feature Suggestion Total Votes -- Backport the namespaces patch for PHP 6 20 Symlink the intl extension from PECL 12 Apply the Late Static Binding Patch 21 Implement David's Circular Garbage collection patch 7.5 Implement Sqlite3 support via the ext/sqlite extension 14.5 Remove safe_mode, register_globals and magic_quotes -14 Introduce mysqlind library into core 19.5 OpenID enabling patch for OpenSSL and PHP 5 20 Add array_replace[_recursive] functions (patch is already available) 13 Split off deprecation from E_STRICT into E_DEPRECATED 22 Merge the zend_arg_info const'ify patch 15 Merge the GCC 4 -fvisibility patch 6 Switch for disabling/enabling materialized cursors in mysqli 3 Link phar extension from PECL into core 6 Merge Matt's ZEND_SIGNED_MULTIPLY_LONG() optimization patch 17.5 Introduce new php.ini files parser/scanner + CGI/FastCGI 13 Merge __callStatic patch from PHP 6 20.5 Introduce concept of strict classes that do not permit dynamic property creation 6 There were a total of 28 people who voted, so a maximum vote was 28. For the most part it seems that there is a general consensus on the features to go into PHP 5.3, my suggestion is that all features with 10 points are to be put into the 5.3 TODO and the rest can have another change for PHP 6 and/or PHP 5.4 (if that comes to pass). Either way, there definitely appears to be a set a solid reasons to start the 5.3 branch. Ilia Alshanetsky -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List (Summary)
Hi! Thanks for organizing the things! What we do wih low score ones? I think it's good to note that -1 and +1 isn't the same as two 0's... Will the TODO be on http://oss.backendmedia.com/PhP53? For the most part it seems that there is a general consensus on the features to go into PHP 5.3, my suggestion is that all features with 10 points are to be put into the 5.3 TODO and the rest can have another change for PHP 6 and/or PHP 5.4 (if that comes to pass). Either way, there definitely appears to be a set a solid reasons to start the 5.3 branch. Will there be also 5.2.5? From the feature set looks like 5.3 is going to take some time and in the meantime we have bugfixes, etc. - so it makes sense to me. -- Stanislav Malyshev, Zend Software Architect [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.zend.com/ (408)253-8829 MSN: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List (Summary)
On 15-Sep-07, at 7:18 PM, Stanislav Malyshev wrote: Hi! Thanks for organizing the things! NP ;-) Btw the detailed breakdown of the votes is available here http://bb.prohost.org/53Features.pdf What we do wih low score ones? I think it's good to note that -1 and +1 isn't the same as two 0's... Will the TODO be on http://oss.backendmedia.com/PhP53? Given that the low score items is fairly well separated from the ones that got a significant score, I think due to lack of interest or consensus we should shelve them at least for the time being. 5.3 is not the last PHP release, and there will definitely be chances in the future to revisit the points. For the most part it seems that there is a general consensus on the features to go into PHP 5.3, my suggestion is that all features with 10 points are to be put into the 5.3 TODO and the rest can have another change for PHP 6 and/or PHP 5.4 (if that comes to pass). Either way, there definitely appears to be a set a solid reasons to start the 5.3 branch. Will there be also 5.2.5? From the feature set looks like 5.3 is going to take some time and in the meantime we have bugfixes, etc. - so it makes sense to me. The agenda for 5.3 looks to be fairly busy, and I don't think we can wait 6-7 months between releases, so 5.2.X branch will need to be maintained while 5.3 is being made ready for production. Ilia Alshanetsky -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
[PHP-DEV] RE : [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List
From: Stanislav Malyshev [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) Link phar extension from PECL into core (possibly enabling it by default) -1, we discussed why :) 0 if not enabled by default. Yes, it was discussed, and I thought it was clear for everybody that phar had to remain in pecl and was not mature enough for core. Once again, as we don't have any formal RFC/decision process, people whose proposal was clearly rejected/delayed can still have it approved: they just have to wait a little and, then, hide it in the middle of a bunch of more important votes. Once your software is in the core, it is easy: if somebody wants to remove it, you invoke BC breaks ! That's exactly what is done here. As most people forgot the discussion about PHAR vs PHK, it is proposed again, but today it is hidden into a lot of more problematic decisions, like register_globals and safe_mode, which will generate a lot of buzz and help keep it hidden. I proposed several times to implement a more formal RFC process for PHP but didn't get much success. As the Zend Framework has implemented such a tool, what would you think of a similar site for the PHP core ? Francois -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP-DEV] RE : [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List
Hello LAUPRETRE, to cut this short. Noone tried to overrule anyone and noone tried to outsmart or trick in any sense either. In the past we decided on the following. First it is to early to ring in Phar for a variety of reasons. As development went on it was more than appropriate for the RM to ask whether this might have related in a change of opinions. And btw, basically you are doing the same thing here, by mentioning PHK again and again you do not get any benefit either :-) Instead you need to put PHK into PECL and follow all rules before being able to oppose Phar with PHK. marcus Wednesday, September 12, 2007, 2:07:28 PM, you wrote: From: Stanislav Malyshev [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 14) Link phar extension from PECL into core (possibly enabling it by default) -1, we discussed why :) 0 if not enabled by default. Yes, it was discussed, and I thought it was clear for everybody that phar had to remain in pecl and was not mature enough for core. Once again, as we don't have any formal RFC/decision process, people whose proposal was clearly rejected/delayed can still have it approved: they just have to wait a little and, then, hide it in the middle of a bunch of more important votes. Once your software is in the core, it is easy: if somebody wants to remove it, you invoke BC breaks ! That's exactly what is done here. As most people forgot the discussion about PHAR vs PHK, it is proposed again, but today it is hidden into a lot of more problematic decisions, like register_globals and safe_mode, which will generate a lot of buzz and help keep it hidden. I proposed several times to implement a more formal RFC process for PHP but didn't get much success. As the Zend Framework has implemented such a tool, what would you think of a similar site for the PHP core ? Francois Best regards, Marcus -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List
On Sun, 9 Sep 2007, Ilia Alshanetsky wrote: 1) Backport the namespaces patch for PHP 6 -1 2) Symlink the intl extension from PECL, but leave it disabled by default as is the case with all extensions dependent on external libs 1 3) Apply the Late Static Binding Patch 1 4) Implement David's Circular Garbage collection patch 1 5) Implement Sqlite3 support via the ext/sqlite extension (patch is already available) 0 6) Remove safe_mode, register_globals and magic_quotes -1 7) Introduce mysqlind library into core and use it as a backend for PDO and mysqli extensions (possibly enabling them by default) Only 1 if it's optional, -1 otherwise 8) OpenID enabling patch for OpenSSL and PHP 5 1 9) Add array_replace[_recursive] functions (patch is already available) 0 10) Split off deprecation from E_STRICT into E_DEPRECATED 1 11) Merge the zend_arg_info const'ify patch 0 12) Merge the GCC 4 -fvisibility patch 0 13) Switch for disabling/enabling materialized cursors in mysqli 0 14) Link phar extension from PECL into core (possibly enabling it by default) 0 for adding it to core, -1 to enable it by default 15) Merge Matt's ZEND_SIGNED_MULTIPLY_LONG() optimization patch 0 16) Introduce new php.ini files parser/scanner + CGI/FastCGI? htaccess style ini file support 0 17) Merge __callStatic patch from PHP 6 1 18) Introduce concept of strict classes that do not permit dynamic property creation 1 -- Derick Rethans http://derickrethans.nl | http://ez.no | http://xdebug.org -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
RE: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List
Hey Steph, PECL, right. Ilia's initial post mentioned possibly enabling them by default which set off some red flags for me because it's very much alpha. It'd definitely help things along if it goes into the core, in terms of exposure / usage / testing. Best, Mike Robinson -Original Message- From: Steph Fox [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Tuesday, September 11, 2007 6:40 PM To: Mike Robinson; 'Ilia Alshanetsky'; 'PHP Developers Mailing List' Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List Hi Mike, 7) Introduce mysqlind library into core and use it as a backend for PDO and mysqli extensions (possibly enabling them by default) 1 0 -1 The mysqlind driver is currently alpha. Wherever it goes it should be marked EXPERIMENTAL and off by default Frankly, I'm wondering (out loud) if PEAR wouldn't be a better place for it until PHP6? ouf PEAR is for PHP code, PECL is for C code. This is C code. It's also a *native* PHP driver, meaning it's faster than the libmysql library used currently for all MySQL-related extensions. The difference in build terms is simply a configure switch, and I don't see anyone recommending it should be mysqlnd by default at this stage. - Steph No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.485 / Virus Database: 269.13.15/1002 - Release Date: 9/11/2007 5:46 PM -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
RE: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List
On Mon, 2007-09-10 at 13:47 -0700, Andi Gutmans wrote: 16) Introduce new php.ini files parser/scanner + CGI/FastCGI? htaccess style ini file support 1 0 -1 0 (this can be nice but we need to make sure it's optional because those stat()'s can be very hard on performance which is why many sites turn off .htaccess). Already is optional and only is used with sapi/cgi right now. Also the .htaccess results are cached to minimize the performance penalty. Another thing is that you can put the stuff in the main php.ini, using the special section stuff I implemented. Thus you don't need the .htaccess files at all if necessary. IMO, this isn't just nice, this is essential functionality that should have been done years ago. But I'm biased. :) --Jani -- Patches/Donations: http://pecl.php.net/~jani/ -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List
On Mon, 2007-09-10 at 22:56 +0200, Pierre wrote: On 9/10/07, Andi Gutmans [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 16) Introduce new php.ini files parser/scanner + CGI/FastCGI? htaccess style ini file support 1 0 -1 0 (this can be nice but we need to make sure it's optional because those stat()'s can be very hard on performance which is why many sites turn off .htaccess). For the record here, a cache is planed once we have a stable version. Something like what htscanner does, it already caches the entries (cache + stat check once ttl is over). Just clarification: the caching is there already. :) But I didn't use any stat calls for sake of KISS. When cached results expire, the file (if it exists..) is re-scanned. Maybe someone has better idea. But that remains to be seen. :) --Jani -- Patches/Donations: http://pecl.php.net/~jani/ -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List
On 9/11/07, Jani Taskinen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mon, 2007-09-10 at 22:56 +0200, Pierre wrote: On 9/10/07, Andi Gutmans [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 16) Introduce new php.ini files parser/scanner + CGI/FastCGI? htaccess style ini file support 1 0 -1 0 (this can be nice but we need to make sure it's optional because those stat()'s can be very hard on performance which is why many sites turn off .htaccess). For the record here, a cache is planed once we have a stable version. Something like what htscanner does, it already caches the entries (cache + stat check once ttl is over). Just clarification: the caching is there already. :) But I didn't use any stat calls for sake of KISS. When cached results expire, the file (if it exists..) is re-scanned. Maybe someone has better idea. But that remains to be seen. :) Oh damned me, I did not notice it in the patch :) And I agree, for this feature, a cache system like this one is the easiest way (to maintain and to keep the performance impact as a very low level) and works well. I use such system since months with htscanner (and some ISPs too) and did not notice a significant slow down. Cheers, --Pierre -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List
Ilia Alshanetsky wrote: 1) Backport the namespaces patch for PHP 6 0 2) Symlink the intl extension from PECL, but leave it disabled by default as is the case with all extensions dependent on external libs 0 3) Apply the Late Static Binding Patch 1 4) Implement David's Circular Garbage collection patch 1 5) Implement Sqlite3 support via the ext/sqlite extension (patch is already available) 0 6) Remove safe_mode, register_globals and magic_quotes 0 7) Introduce mysqlind library into core and use it as a backend for PDO and mysqli extensions (possibly enabling them by default) 1 8) OpenID enabling patch for OpenSSL and PHP 5 1 9) Add array_replace[_recursive] functions (patch is already available) 1 10) Split off deprecation from E_STRICT into E_DEPRECATED 1 11) Merge the zend_arg_info const'ify patch 1 12) Merge the GCC 4 -fvisibility patch 1 13) Switch for disabling/enabling materialized cursors in mysqli 0 14) Link phar extension from PECL into core (possibly enabling it by default) 0 15) Merge Matt's ZEND_SIGNED_MULTIPLY_LONG() optimization patch 0 16) Introduce new php.ini files parser/scanner + CGI/FastCGI? htaccess style ini file support 0 17) Merge __callStatic patch from PHP 6 1 18) Introduce concept of strict classes that do not permit dynamic property creation 1 -- Sebastian Bergmann http://sebastian-bergmann.de/ GnuPG Key: 0xB85B5D69 / 27A7 2B14 09E4 98CD 6277 0E5B 6867 C514 B85B 5D69 -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List
That patch is a very good idea, but it does not work there are symbols that are no lomger exported on libxml extension , and although everything compiles, I ended with a broken PHP. Can you give a bit more details on what is broken? Does it mean there's a problem on Windows too, since Windows doesn't allow accessing un-exported symbols? I'm aware of this problem. The problem is that each extension defines its own PHP_EXT_API (where EXT is the name of the extension). This means we need to change every such macro out there to make them aware of gcc 4. My proposal to avoid future problems is to reuse the PHPAPI macro, as can be seen in that patch (I only changed the hash extension as an example): --- ext/hash/php_hash.h 16 Jan 2006 23:04:23 - 1.13.2.7 +++ ext/hash/php_hash.h 9 Nov 2006 16:50:55 - (...) -#ifdef PHP_WIN32 -#define PHP_HASH_API __declspec(dllexport) -#else -#define PHP_HASH_API -#endif +#define PHP_HASH_API PHPAPI When the patch goes in, I'll change all that stuff. Nuno -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
RE: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List
1) Backport the namespaces patch for PHP 6 +1 3) Apply the Late Static Binding Patch +1 6) Remove safe_mode, register_globals and magic_quotes -1 8) OpenID enabling patch for OpenSSL and PHP 5 +1 10) Split off deprecation from E_STRICT into E_DEPRECATED +1 11) Merge the zend_arg_info const'ify patch +1 14) Link phar extension from PECL into core (possibly enabling it by default) +1 BTW, I would prefer something more toolable (like TAR or ZIP) 15) Merge Matt's ZEND_SIGNED_MULTIPLY_LONG() optimization patch +1 17) Merge __callStatic patch from PHP 6 +1 18) Introduce concept of strict classes that do not permit dynamic property creation -1 Thanks. Dmitry. -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List
1) Backport the namespaces patch for PHP 6 1 2) Symlink the intl extension from PECL, but leave it disabled by default as is the case with all extensions dependent on external libs 1 3) Apply the Late Static Binding Patch 1 4) Implement David's Circular Garbage collection patch 0 5) Implement Sqlite3 support via the ext/sqlite extension (patch is already available) 1 6) Remove safe_mode, register_globals and magic_quotes -1, and only RG has had appropriate warning/info thus far. 7) Introduce mysqlind library into core and use it as a backend for PDO and mysqli extensions (possibly enabling them by default) 1 8) OpenID enabling patch for OpenSSL and PHP 5 1 9) Add array_replace[_recursive] functions (patch is already available) 1 10) Split off deprecation from E_STRICT into E_DEPRECATED 1 11) Merge the zend_arg_info const'ify patch 1 12) Merge the GCC 4 -fvisibility patch 1 13) Switch for disabling/enabling materialized cursors in mysqli 0 14) Link phar extension from PECL into core (possibly enabling it by default) 0 15) Merge Matt's ZEND_SIGNED_MULTIPLY_LONG() optimization patch 0 16) Introduce new php.ini files parser/scanner + CGI/FastCGI? htaccess style ini file support 1 17) Merge __callStatic patch from PHP 6 1 18) Introduce concept of strict classes that do not permit dynamic property creation -1 E_FATAL, +1 E_STRICT Regards, Philip -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List
If it counts for anything, here's my vote on the bits I know/care about: 2) Symlink the intl extension from PECL, but leave it disabled by default as is the case with all extensions dependent on external libs +1, I've a feeling this will become important later 3) Apply the Late Static Binding Patch +1, I'll probably never use it but I can see where others might 5) Implement Sqlite3 support via the ext/sqlite extension (patch is already available) +1, assuming this won't kill sqlite2 support (where's the patch?) 6) Remove safe_mode, register_globals and magic_quotes -1, should be on a major release - but as someone (Stas?) wrote earlier, it might be a good time to start emitting deprecation warnings 7) Introduce mysqlind library into core and use it as a backend for PDO and mysqli extensions (possibly enabling them by default) +1 but nothing by default until stable 8) OpenID enabling patch for OpenSSL and PHP 5 +1, is there even an argument against this? 10) Split off deprecation from E_STRICT into E_DEPRECATED +1, about time! 14) Link phar extension from PECL into core (possibly enabling it by default) +1, I think this could help tremendously with application deployment 15) Merge Matt's ZEND_SIGNED_MULTIPLY_LONG() optimization patch +1, we all love Matt 16) Introduce new php.ini files parser/scanner + CGI/FastCGI? htaccess style ini file support 0 - very torn over this idea 17) Merge __callStatic patch from PHP 6 +1 18) Introduce concept of strict classes that do not permit dynamic property creation -1, this whole idea just sounds so weird for PHP. - Steph -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List
Am 09.09.2007 um 19:07 schrieb Ilia Alshanetsky: Its been about a week since RFS for features to go into 5.3 has gone out and while there was not a flood of ideas there is a substantial list of key changes people would like to go into this release. I've compiled a list of all of the suggestions I've received, they are listed below in a form that will hopefully make it easy for people to vote their yeys and nays. My hope that we can reach an agreement within 1-2 weeks so 5.3 can be branched and work on it can begin. List of Feature Ideas 1) Backport the namespaces patch for PHP 6 1 0 -1 +1 2) Symlink the intl extension from PECL, but leave it disabled by default as is the case with all extensions dependent on external libs 1 0 -1 -1 Wait until it is stable and feature complete (guess it wouldn't be in time a for a 5.3 release), otherwise, we might run into the problem that minor releases have different functionalities. 3) Apply the Late Static Binding Patch 1 0 -1 +1 4) Implement David's Circular Garbage collection patch 1 0 -1 -1 Is that really tested well enough already? 5) Implement Sqlite3 support via the ext/sqlite extension (patch is already available) 1 0 -1 0 6) Remove safe_mode, register_globals and magic_quotes 1 0 -1 -1 Why break BC in a .x release? 7) Introduce mysqlind library into core and use it as a backend for PDO and mysqli extensions (possibly enabling them by default) 1 0 -1 0 8) OpenID enabling patch for OpenSSL and PHP 5 1 0 -1 0 9) Add array_replace[_recursive] functions (patch is already available) 1 0 -1 0 10) Split off deprecation from E_STRICT into E_DEPRECATED 1 0 -1 +1 And 0 for the rest of them. -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List
Steph Fox wrote:
18) Introduce concept of strict classes that do not permit dynamic
property creation
-1, this whole idea just sounds so weird for PHP.
Sure, but how PHPish is this fatal error?
[EMAIL PROTECTED]:~/build/php-5.2-debug$ cli -r 'class c{} c::$x=1;'
Fatal error: Access to undeclared static property: c::$x in Command
line code on line 1
The idea, as far as I understood, was to allow this things with
non-strict classes once we have strict classes.
Regards,
--
Michael
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Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List
Heya Mike,
-1, this whole idea just sounds so weird for PHP.
Sure, but how PHPish is this fatal error?
[EMAIL PROTECTED]:~/build/php-5.2-debug$ cli -r 'class c{} c::$x=1;'
Fatal error: Access to undeclared static property: c::$x in Command
line code on line 1
The idea, as far as I understood, was to allow this things with
non-strict classes once we have strict classes.
Nothing like telling it backwards, mm?
OK, for some reason I was under the impression that that behaviour had been
reverted and this was an attempt to put it back in sigh /
Make that a +1 for exactly the same reason it was a -1 before. If it counts,
which it probably doesn't.
- Steph
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RE: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List
Since my vote counts for shyte, I'll humbly offer brief remarks instead. Ilia Alshanetsky queried: 6) Remove safe_mode, register_globals and magic_quotes 1 0 -1 *Major* BC break in a minor version? Ouch. This should wait I think. 7) Introduce mysqlind library into core and use it as a backend for PDO and mysqli extensions (possibly enabling them by default) 1 0 -1 The mysqlind driver is currently alpha. Wherever it goes it should be marked EXPERIMENTAL and off by default Frankly, I'm wondering (out loud) if PEAR wouldn't be a better place for it until PHP6? Best Regards Mike Robinson -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List
Hi Mike, 7) Introduce mysqlind library into core and use it as a backend for PDO and mysqli extensions (possibly enabling them by default) 1 0 -1 The mysqlind driver is currently alpha. Wherever it goes it should be marked EXPERIMENTAL and off by default Frankly, I'm wondering (out loud) if PEAR wouldn't be a better place for it until PHP6? ouf PEAR is for PHP code, PECL is for C code. This is C code. It's also a *native* PHP driver, meaning it's faster than the libmysql library used currently for all MySQL-related extensions. The difference in build terms is simply a configure switch, and I don't see anyone recommending it should be mysqlnd by default at this stage. - Steph -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List
On 9/9/07, Ilia Alshanetsky [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 1) Backport the namespaces patch for PHP 6 1 0 -1 +1 2) Symlink the intl extension from PECL, but leave it disabled by default as is the case with all extensions dependent on external libs 1 0 -1 0 3) Apply the Late Static Binding Patch 1 0 -1 +1 4) Implement David's Circular Garbage collection patch 1 0 -1 +1 5) Implement Sqlite3 support via the ext/sqlite extension (patch is already available) 1 0 -1 +1 6) Remove safe_mode, register_globals and magic_quotes 1 0 -1 -1 (Some php.net webs still use register_globals AND magic_quotes, I don't think we can expect people to upgrade their scripts when not even we have done so) 7) Introduce mysqlind library into core and use it as a backend for PDO and mysqli extensions (possibly enabling them by default) 1 0 -1 +1 8) OpenID enabling patch for OpenSSL and PHP 5 1 0 -1 +1 9) Add array_replace[_recursive] functions (patch is already available) 1 0 -1 0 10) Split off deprecation from E_STRICT into E_DEPRECATED 1 0 -1 +1 11) Merge the zend_arg_info const'ify patch 1 0 -1 +1 12) Merge the GCC 4 -fvisibility patch 1 0 -1 0 13) Switch for disabling/enabling materialized cursors in mysqli 1 0 -1 +1 (wasn't this voted, and agreed, for for 5.2?) 14) Link phar extension from PECL into core (possibly enabling it by default) 1 0 -1 0 15) Merge Matt's ZEND_SIGNED_MULTIPLY_LONG() optimization patch 1 0 -1 +1 16) Introduce new php.ini files parser/scanner + CGI/FastCGI? htaccess style ini file support 1 0 -1 +1 17) Merge __callStatic patch from PHP 6 1 0 -1 0 18) Introduce concept of strict classes that do not permit dynamic property creation 1 0 -1 +1 -Hannes -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List
Stanislav Malyshev wrote: 10) Split off deprecation from E_STRICT into E_DEPRECATED 0. Why do we *need* it again? E_STRICT is about general coding style that we feel should be encouraged. Its sort of the comp sci teacher in a box. E_DEPRECATED is things we drop are replace. People that need to retain compatibility to earlier minor versions of PHP will likely have to ignore these, as often the reason why something was deperecated is that we added a new shiny alternative that was not there before. Without it, we mix 2 different concepts, we also make it needlessly hard for library maintainers to leverage E_STRICT. As a result library maintainers have the choice of either jumping to every new minor version as the minimum requirement or more or less ignoring E_STRICT all together. regards, Lukas -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List
1) Backport the namespaces patch for PHP 6 0 2) Symlink the intl extension from PECL, but leave it disabled by default as is the case with all extensions dependent on external libs 1 3) Apply the Late Static Binding Patch 1 4) Implement David's Circular Garbage collection patch 0 5) Implement Sqlite3 support via the ext/sqlite extension (patch is already available) 0 6) Remove safe_mode, register_globals and magic_quotes 0 7) Introduce mysqlind library into core and use it as a backend for PDO and mysqli extensions (possibly enabling them by default) 1 (not by default) 8) OpenID enabling patch for OpenSSL and PHP 5 Which one? (from the looks you are refering to Wez's origional) I though it was already decided a while back that the patch from Dmitry was going in. 9) Add array_replace[_recursive] functions (patch is already available) 0 10) Split off deprecation from E_STRICT into E_DEPRECATED 0 11) Merge the zend_arg_info const'ify patch 1 12) Merge the GCC 4 -fvisibility patch 1 13) Switch for disabling/enabling materialized cursors in mysqli 1 14) Link phar extension from PECL into core (possibly enabling it by default) 0 15) Merge Matt's ZEND_SIGNED_MULTIPLY_LONG() optimization patch 1 16) Introduce new php.ini files parser/scanner + CGI/FastCGI? htaccess style ini file support 0 17) Merge __callStatic patch from PHP 6 0 18) Introduce concept of strict classes that do not permit dynamic property creation 0 Rob -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List
Hi Rob, On 9/10/07, Rob Richards [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 8) OpenID enabling patch for OpenSSL and PHP 5 Which one? (from the looks you are refering to Wez's origional) I though it was already decided a while back that the patch from Dmitry was going in. For what we discussed, Dmitry's version will be applied. It is more complete. --Pierre -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List
Ilia Alshanetsky wrote: 1) Backport the namespaces patch for PHP 6 +1 3) Apply the Late Static Binding Patch +1 5) Implement Sqlite3 support via the ext/sqlite extension (patch is already available) +1 6) Remove safe_mode, register_globals and magic_quotes -1 7) Introduce mysqlind library into core and use it as a backend for PDO and mysqli extensions (possibly enabling them by default) +1 (I assume we will make it easily possible to stick with libmysql if the user so chooses) 8) OpenID enabling patch for OpenSSL and PHP 5 +1 9) Add array_replace[_recursive] functions (patch is already available) +1 (I agree we have a ton of array methods already, but particularly functions that operate recursively over multi dimensional arrays are best done in C) 10) Split off deprecation from E_STRICT into E_DEPRECATED +1 14) Link phar extension from PECL into core (possibly enabling it by default) +1 16) Introduce new php.ini files parser/scanner + CGI/FastCGI? htaccess style ini file support +1 18) Introduce concept of strict classes that do not permit dynamic property creation +1 (I would like this to be even more expanded in that non strict classes would also not be hit with artificial fatal errors). regards, Lukas -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List
1) Backport the namespaces patch for PHP 6 1 2) Symlink the intl extension from PECL, but leave it disabled by default as is the case with all extensions dependent on external libs 0 3) Apply the Late Static Binding Patch 1 4) Implement David's Circular Garbage collection patch 0 5) Implement Sqlite3 support via the ext/sqlite extension (patch is already available) 0 6) Remove safe_mode, register_globals and magic_quotes 1 ( as long we allow old codes to functions ) 7) Introduce mysqlind library into core and use it as a backend for PDO and mysqli extensions (possibly enabling them by default) 0 8) OpenID enabling patch for OpenSSL and PHP 5 0 9) Add array_replace[_recursive] functions (patch is already available) 1 10) Split off deprecation from E_STRICT into E_DEPRECATED 1 11) Merge the zend_arg_info const'ify patch 0 12) Merge the GCC 4 -fvisibility patch 0 13) Switch for disabling/enabling materialized cursors in mysqli 0 14) Link phar extension from PECL into core (possibly enabling it by default) 0 15) Merge Matt's ZEND_SIGNED_MULTIPLY_LONG() optimization patch 0 16) Introduce new php.ini files parser/scanner + CGI/FastCGI? htaccess style ini file support 0 17) Merge __callStatic patch from PHP 6 1 18) Introduce concept of strict classes that do not permit dynamic property creation 0
[PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List - Off Vote comments.
PLEASE can we have an assessment of how this new list of features will affect users porting from PHP4 rather than simply assuming that this is just a simple 'upgrade' from PHP5.2.X. As discussion has already been shouted down on the vote list ... we have to get people to convert *TO* PHP5 before PHP6 becomes practical. Lets not create yet another roadblock in that path :( -- Lester Caine - G8HFL - Contact - http://home.lsces.co.uk/lsces/wiki/?page=contact L.S.Caine Electronic Services - http://home.lsces.co.uk MEDW - http://home.lsces.co.uk/ModelEngineersDigitalWorkshop/ Firebird - http://www.firebirdsql.org/index.php -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List - Off Vote comments.
On 9/10/07, Lester Caine [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: PLEASE can we have an assessment of how this new list of features will affect users porting from PHP4 rather than simply assuming that this is just a simple 'upgrade' from PHP5.2.X. As discussion has already been shouted down on the vote list ... we have to get people to convert *TO* PHP5 before PHP6 becomes practical. Lets not create yet another roadblock in that path :( If you fear a magic_quotes GPC and register globals removal, you can sleep quiet. It is not going to happen. I wonder why it is the poll as it can't be made in 5.3, in no way, even if we all dream about that :) The rest are mostly new features or fixes that have to be applied, they do not affect old code (besides what we already know and what has been discussed in all possible ways). --Pierre -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List
Hello Ilia, Sunday, September 9, 2007, 7:07:37 PM, you wrote: 1) Backport the namespaces patch for PHP 6 +1 2) Symlink the intl extension from PECL, but leave it disabled by +1 3) Apply the Late Static Binding Patch +1 4) Implement David's Circular Garbage collection patch +1 5) Implement Sqlite3 support via the ext/sqlite extension (patch is already available) +1 6) Remove safe_mode, register_globals and magic_quotes remove register_globals only, rest for 6.* 7) Introduce mysqlind library into core and use it as a backend for PDO and mysqli extensions (possibly enabling them by default) +1 8) OpenID enabling patch for OpenSSL and PHP 5 +1 9) Add array_replace[_recursive] functions (patch is already available) +1 10) Split off deprecation from E_STRICT into E_DEPRECATED +1 11) Merge the zend_arg_info const'ify patch +1 (even though it is me who has to do it i guess :-) 12) Merge the GCC 4 -fvisibility patch 0 13) Switch for disabling/enabling materialized cursors in mysqli 0 14) Link phar extension from PECL into core (possibly enabling it by default) +1 15) Merge Matt's ZEND_SIGNED_MULTIPLY_LONG() optimization patch +1 16) Introduce new php.ini files parser/scanner + CGI/FastCGI? htaccess style ini file support +1 17) Merge __callStatic patch from PHP 6 +1 18) Introduce concept of strict classes that do not permit dynamic property creation 0, we could eventually do this via an interface Best regards, Marcus -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List - Off Vote comments.
On Monday 10 September 2007 02:43:52 pm Pierre wrote: On 9/10/07, Lester Caine [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: PLEASE can we have an assessment of how this new list of features will affect users porting from PHP4 rather than simply assuming that this is just a simple 'upgrade' from PHP5.2.X. As discussion has already been shouted down on the vote list ... we have to get people to convert *TO* PHP5 before PHP6 becomes practical. Lets not create yet another roadblock in that path :( If you fear a magic_quotes GPC and register globals removal, you can sleep quiet. It is not going to happen. I wonder why it is the poll as it can't be made in 5.3, in no way, even if we all dream about that :) Removing register_globals can be worked around using a one line patch (- import_request_vars) so the break would be minimal but I don't think we win that much from removing that setting Removing magic_quotes has an easy fix, too but there I see more problems: Quite many people have the default value On and their applications therefore are, by accident, a bit more secure (no, they won't be safe, I know) removing , magic_quotes without flooding people without that information would create many holes without people realizing. Therefore such a change can imo only be done in a major version change like 5 - 6 where people expect more stuff to break. As a sidenote: Maybe interesting for this discussion: I have some statstics about such settings on hosts running some average PHP application (phpMyFAQ). These information is collected from the application's installer and can then be reported to the phpMyFAQ developers. The relevant information here is this chart showing the percentage of systems using the mentioned settings by PHP version: http://phpmyfaq.de/stats/svg/settings_20070910160921.png Of course that's no complete picture of the situation but some indication that r_g isn't used that much anymore but magic_quotes is. (Please keep in mind that theses stats are counting only people who agreed sending the information, it also includes people using test systems and you can absolutely forget the 4.3 information - by far not enough hosts using phMyFAQ using that version) My personal conclusion: Removing these doesn't really bring benefits for us but might make problems for users since they don't expect such changes (especially magic_quotes...as sad as it is...) in a minor release. johannes -- Johannes Schlüter http://schlueters.de -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List
Hi, Ilia Alshanetsky wrote: List of Feature Ideas 1) Backport the namespaces patch for PHP 6 +1 2) Symlink the intl extension from PECL, but leave it disabled by default as is the case with all extensions dependent on external libs 0 3) Apply the Late Static Binding Patch +1 4) Implement David's Circular Garbage collection patch -1 5) Implement Sqlite3 support via the ext/sqlite extension (patch is already available) 0 6) Remove safe_mode, register_globals and magic_quotes +1 7) Introduce mysqlind library into core and use it as a backend for PDO and mysqli extensions (possibly enabling them by default) 0 8) OpenID enabling patch for OpenSSL and PHP 5 0 9) Add array_replace[_recursive] functions (patch is already available) +1 10) Split off deprecation from E_STRICT into E_DEPRECATED +1 11) Merge the zend_arg_info const'ify patch 0 12) Merge the GCC 4 -fvisibility patch 0 13) Switch for disabling/enabling materialized cursors in mysqli 0 14) Link phar extension from PECL into core (possibly enabling it by default) +1 15) Merge Matt's ZEND_SIGNED_MULTIPLY_LONG() optimization patch 0 16) Introduce new php.ini files parser/scanner + CGI/FastCGI? htaccess style ini file support 0 17) Merge __callStatic patch from PHP 6 +1 18) Introduce concept of strict classes that do not permit dynamic property creation +1 Best regards, Stephan -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List
Hello Ilia, Monday, September 10, 2007, 3:08:57 PM, you wrote: Hello Ilia, Sunday, September 9, 2007, 7:07:37 PM, you wrote: 6) Remove safe_mode, register_globals and magic_quotes remove register_globals only, rest for 6.* Actually we should get E_DEPRECATED and mark all as deprecated and be done for 5.3. Even though I hate globals and hate me for saying this. But it is better to go with deprecated first. That way we reduce the WTF factor of our users by finally telling them what is going to change in the future to give them preparation time. Best regards, Marcus -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List
Lukas Kahwe Smith skrev: Stanislav Malyshev wrote: 10) Split off deprecation from E_STRICT into E_DEPRECATED 0. Why do we *need* it again? Without it, we mix 2 different concepts, we also make it needlessly hard for library maintainers to leverage E_STRICT. As a result library maintainers have the choice of either jumping to every new minor version as the minimum requirement or more or less ignoring E_STRICT all together. Being a teacher who tries to explain PHP daily I am definately +1 on this one. Separating these two concepts really helps. Lars Gunther -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List
Without it, we mix 2 different concepts, we also make it needlessly hard for library maintainers to leverage E_STRICT. As a result library maintainers have the choice of either jumping to every new minor version as the minimum requirement or more or less ignoring E_STRICT all together. OK, I understand this, still 0 on it :) -- Stanislav Malyshev, Zend Software Architect [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.zend.com/ (408)253-8829 MSN: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
RE: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List
See below: -Original Message- From: Ilia Alshanetsky [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, September 09, 2007 10:08 AM To: PHP Developers Mailing List Subject: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List List of Feature Ideas 1) Backport the namespaces patch for PHP 6 1 0 -1 +1 (pending it's stable and complete). 2) Symlink the intl extension from PECL, but leave it disabled by default as is the case with all extensions dependent on external libs 1 0 -1 +1 3) Apply the Late Static Binding Patch 1 0 -1 +1 (We will do some perf tests on Dmitry's latest patch to make sure the impact is minimal). 4) Implement David's Circular Garbage collection patch 1 0 -1 +1 (depending on tests, perf and maturity we can decide on optional/experimental/etc...) 5) Implement Sqlite3 support via the ext/sqlite extension (patch is already available) 1 0 -1 0 6) Remove safe_mode, register_globals and magic_quotes 1 0 -1 -1 7) Introduce mysqlind library into core and use it as a backend for PDO and mysqli extensions (possibly enabling them by default) 1 0 -1 0 8) OpenID enabling patch for OpenSSL and PHP 5 1 0 -1 +1 9) Add array_replace[_recursive] functions (patch is already available) 1 0 -1 +1 10) Split off deprecation from E_STRICT into E_DEPRECATED 1 0 -1 +1 11) Merge the zend_arg_info const'ify patch 1 0 -1 0 12) Merge the GCC 4 -fvisibility patch 1 0 -1 0 13) Switch for disabling/enabling materialized cursors in mysqli 1 0 -1 0 14) Link phar extension from PECL into core (possibly enabling it by default) 1 0 -1 -1 (I'd prefer a standard format which can be manipulated with standard tools (also some tests we did with TAR format we got much better performance). In general though the use-case should be clear as I don't think Web apps are the real target here)) 15) Merge Matt's ZEND_SIGNED_MULTIPLY_LONG() optimization patch 1 0 -1 +1 16) Introduce new php.ini files parser/scanner + CGI/FastCGI? htaccess style ini file support 1 0 -1 0 (this can be nice but we need to make sure it's optional because those stat()'s can be very hard on performance which is why many sites turn off .htaccess). 17) Merge __callStatic patch from PHP 6 1 0 -1 +1 18) Introduce concept of strict classes that do not permit dynamic property creation 1 0 -1 -1 -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List
On 9/9/07, Ilia Alshanetsky [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 12) Merge the GCC 4 -fvisibility patch That patch is a very good idea, but it does not work there are symbols that are no lomger exported on libxml extension , and although everything compiles, I ended with a broken PHP. -- http://www.kissofjudas.net/ -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List
On 9/10/07, Andi Gutmans [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: See below: -Original Message- From: Ilia Alshanetsky [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, September 09, 2007 10:08 AM To: PHP Developers Mailing List Subject: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List List of Feature Ideas 1) Backport the namespaces patch for PHP 6 1 0 -1 +1 (pending it's stable and complete). 2) Symlink the intl extension from PECL, but leave it disabled by default as is the case with all extensions dependent on external libs 1 0 -1 +1 3) Apply the Late Static Binding Patch 1 0 -1 +1 (We will do some perf tests on Dmitry's latest patch to make sure the impact is minimal). 4) Implement David's Circular Garbage collection patch 1 0 -1 +1 (depending on tests, perf and maturity we can decide on optional/experimental/etc...) 5) Implement Sqlite3 support via the ext/sqlite extension (patch is already available) 1 0 -1 0 6) Remove safe_mode, register_globals and magic_quotes 1 0 -1 -1 7) Introduce mysqlind library into core and use it as a backend for PDO and mysqli extensions (possibly enabling them by default) 1 0 -1 0 8) OpenID enabling patch for OpenSSL and PHP 5 1 0 -1 +1 9) Add array_replace[_recursive] functions (patch is already available) 1 0 -1 +1 10) Split off deprecation from E_STRICT into E_DEPRECATED 1 0 -1 +1 11) Merge the zend_arg_info const'ify patch 1 0 -1 0 12) Merge the GCC 4 -fvisibility patch 1 0 -1 0 13) Switch for disabling/enabling materialized cursors in mysqli 1 0 -1 0 14) Link phar extension from PECL into core (possibly enabling it by default) 1 0 -1 -1 (I'd prefer a standard format which can be manipulated with standard tools (also some tests we did with TAR format we got much better performance). In general though the use-case should be clear as I don't think Web apps are the real target here)) 15) Merge Matt's ZEND_SIGNED_MULTIPLY_LONG() optimization patch 1 0 -1 +1 16) Introduce new php.ini files parser/scanner + CGI/FastCGI? htaccess style ini file support 1 0 -1 0 (this can be nice but we need to make sure it's optional because those stat()'s can be very hard on performance which is why many sites turn off .htaccess). For the record here, a cache is planed once we have a stable version. Something like what htscanner does, it already caches the entries (cache + stat check once ttl is over). Cheers, --Pierre -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List
Andi Gutmans wrote: 14) Link phar extension from PECL into core (possibly enabling it by default) 10 -1 -1 (I'd prefer a standard format which can be manipulated with standard tools (also some tests we did with TAR format we got much better performance). In general though the use-case should be clear as I don't think Web apps are the real target here)) Care to share how you benchmarked? I found an exponential performance improvement when I moved from tar to the current file format. Greg -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
RE: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List
-Original Message- From: Pierre [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, September 10, 2007 1:56 PM To: Andi Gutmans Cc: Ilia Alshanetsky; PHP Developers Mailing List Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List For the record here, a cache is planed once we have a stable version. Something like what htscanner does, it already caches the entries (cache + stat check once ttl is over). We've wanted to do a stat() cache for quite a while. If you work on it, please make it generic in TSRM and then we can use it in various places in PHP including this feature. Thanks! ANdi -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List
Ilia Alshanetsky wrote: List of Feature Ideas 1) Backport the namespaces patch for PHP 6 -1 2) Symlink the intl extension from PECL, but leave it disabled by default as is the case with all extensions dependent on external libs 1 3) Apply the Late Static Binding Patch 10-1 1 4) Implement David's Circular Garbage collection patch -1 5) Implement Sqlite3 support via the ext/sqlite extension (patch is already available) 1 6) Remove safe_mode, register_globals and magic_quotes -1 7) Introduce mysqlind library into core and use it as a backend for PDO and mysqli extensions (possibly enabling them by default) 0 8) OpenID enabling patch for OpenSSL and PHP 5 1 9) Add array_replace[_recursive] functions (patch is already available) 1 10) Split off deprecation from E_STRICT into E_DEPRECATED 1 11) Merge the zend_arg_info const'ify patch 1 12) Merge the GCC 4 -fvisibility patch 1 13) Switch for disabling/enabling materialized cursors in mysqli 0 14) Link phar extension from PECL into core (possibly enabling it by default) 1 15) Merge Matt's ZEND_SIGNED_MULTIPLY_LONG() optimization patch 1 16) Introduce new php.ini files parser/scanner + CGI/FastCGI? htaccess style ini file support 0 17) Merge __callStatic patch from PHP 6 0 18) Introduce concept of strict classes that do not permit dynamic property creation Good idea, but I'd leave it for PHP 6. -Andrei http://10fathoms.org/vu - daily photoblog -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List
That patch is a very good idea, but it does not work there are symbols that are no lomger exported on libxml extension , and although everything compiles, I ended with a broken PHP. Can you give a bit more details on what is broken? Does it mean there's a problem on Windows too, since Windows doesn't allow accessing un-exported symbols? -- Stanislav Malyshev, Zend Software Architect [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.zend.com/ (408)253-8829 MSN: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
[PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List
Its been about a week since RFS for features to go into 5.3 has gone out and while there was not a flood of ideas there is a substantial list of key changes people would like to go into this release. I've compiled a list of all of the suggestions I've received, they are listed below in a form that will hopefully make it easy for people to vote their yeys and nays. My hope that we can reach an agreement within 1-2 weeks so 5.3 can be branched and work on it can begin. List of Feature Ideas 1) Backport the namespaces patch for PHP 6 1 0 -1 2) Symlink the intl extension from PECL, but leave it disabled by default as is the case with all extensions dependent on external libs 1 0 -1 3) Apply the Late Static Binding Patch 1 0 -1 4) Implement David's Circular Garbage collection patch 1 0 -1 5) Implement Sqlite3 support via the ext/sqlite extension (patch is already available) 1 0 -1 6) Remove safe_mode, register_globals and magic_quotes 1 0 -1 7) Introduce mysqlind library into core and use it as a backend for PDO and mysqli extensions (possibly enabling them by default) 1 0 -1 8) OpenID enabling patch for OpenSSL and PHP 5 1 0 -1 9) Add array_replace[_recursive] functions (patch is already available) 1 0 -1 10) Split off deprecation from E_STRICT into E_DEPRECATED 1 0 -1 11) Merge the zend_arg_info const'ify patch 1 0 -1 12) Merge the GCC 4 -fvisibility patch 1 0 -1 13) Switch for disabling/enabling materialized cursors in mysqli 1 0 -1 14) Link phar extension from PECL into core (possibly enabling it by default) 1 0 -1 15) Merge Matt's ZEND_SIGNED_MULTIPLY_LONG() optimization patch 1 0 -1 16) Introduce new php.ini files parser/scanner + CGI/FastCGI? htaccess style ini file support 1 0 -1 17) Merge __callStatic patch from PHP 6 1 0 -1 18) Introduce concept of strict classes that do not permit dynamic property creation 1 0 -1 Ilia Alshanetsky -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List
On Sunday 09 September 2007, Ilia Alshanetsky wrote: Its been about a week since RFS for features to go into 5.3 has gone out and while there was not a flood of ideas there is a substantial list of key changes people would like to go into this release. I've compiled a list of all of the suggestions I've received, they are listed below in a form that will hopefully make it easy for people to vote their yeys and nays. My hope that we can reach an agreement within 1-2 weeks so 5.3 can be branched and work on it can begin. Response from a random PHP guy who doesn't work on the engine itself (so take with appropriate quantities of NaCl): List of Feature Ideas 1) Backport the namespaces patch for PHP 6 1 2) Symlink the intl extension from PECL, but leave it disabled by default as is the case with all extensions dependent on external libs I have no opinion. 3) Apply the Late Static Binding Patch -1, unless we can guarantee no BC breakage with 5.2. 4) Implement David's Circular Garbage collection patch I am not qualified to offer an intelligent opinion. 5) Implement Sqlite3 support via the ext/sqlite extension (patch is already available) 1 6) Remove safe_mode, register_globals and magic_quotes -1 These must die, but that's also a huge BC break, even if those are already unrecommended. That would almost certainly slow adoption by shared hosts, which means that 5.3 would have a 5.0-like adoption curve. :-) Save the code breaking for PHP 6. 7) Introduce mysqlind library into core and use it as a backend for PDO and mysqli extensions (possibly enabling them by default) 0 I have not tested it personally, but I'm all for stuff getting faster. I would recommend making it a simple toggle with default no for now, until it's more battle-tested in the field. Change the default in 5.4, perhaps. 8) OpenID enabling patch for OpenSSL and PHP 5 I have no opinion. 9) Add array_replace[_recursive] functions (patch is already available) 1 0 -1 10) Split off deprecation from E_STRICT into E_DEPRECATED 1 11) Merge the zend_arg_info const'ify patch I have no opinion. 12) Merge the GCC 4 -fvisibility patch I am not qualified to offer an intelligent opinion. 13) Switch for disabling/enabling materialized cursors in mysqli I have no opinion. 14) Link phar extension from PECL into core (possibly enabling it by default) I have no opinion. 15) Merge Matt's ZEND_SIGNED_MULTIPLY_LONG() optimization patch I am not qualified to offer an intelligent opinion. 16) Introduce new php.ini files parser/scanner + CGI/FastCGI? htaccess style ini file support I have no opinion. 17) Merge __callStatic patch from PHP 6 1 18) Introduce concept of strict classes that do not permit dynamic property creation 0 I think I missed that discussion, so I can't say anything useful here other than please make such classes optional, not required (or inherent upon using E_STRICT). -- Larry Garfield AIM: LOLG42 [EMAIL PROTECTED] ICQ: 6817012 If nature has made any one thing less susceptible than all others of exclusive property, it is the action of the thinking power called an idea, which an individual may exclusively possess as long as he keeps it to himself; but the moment it is divulged, it forces itself into the possession of every one, and the receiver cannot dispossess himself of it. -- Thomas Jefferson -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List
On 9/9/07, Ilia Alshanetsky [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Its been about a week since RFS for features to go into 5.3 has gone out and while there was not a flood of ideas there is a substantial list of key changes people would like to go into this release. I've compiled a list of all of the suggestions I've received, they are listed below in a form that will hopefully make it easy for people to vote their yeys and nays. My hope that we can reach an agreement within 1-2 weeks so 5.3 can be branched and work on it can begin. List of Feature Ideas 1) Backport the namespaces patch for PHP 6 1 0 -1 1 2) Symlink the intl extension from PECL, but leave it disabled by default as is the case with all extensions dependent on external libs 1 0 -1 Too early, we don't even have a release now. If it is stable by the end of the year (before RC1), then +1. 3) Apply the Late Static Binding Patch 1 0 -1 1 4) Implement David's Circular Garbage collection patch 1 0 -1 0 5) Implement Sqlite3 support via the ext/sqlite extension (patch is already available) 1 0 -1 +1 6) Remove safe_mode, register_globals and magic_quotes 1 0 -1 7) Introduce mysqlind library into core and use it as a backend for PDO and mysqli extensions (possibly enabling them by default) 1 0 -1 optional not by default. 8) OpenID enabling patch for OpenSSL and PHP 5 1 0 -1 +1 (there is nothing to vote on btw...) 9) Add array_replace[_recursive] functions (patch is already available) 1 0 -1 +1 10) Split off deprecation from E_STRICT into E_DEPRECATED 1 0 -1 +1 11) Merge the zend_arg_info const'ify patch 1 0 -1 +1 12) Merge the GCC 4 -fvisibility patch 1 0 -1 0 13) Switch for disabling/enabling materialized cursors in mysqli 1 0 -1 0 14) Link phar extension from PECL into core (possibly enabling it by default) 1 0 -1 -1 15) Merge Matt's ZEND_SIGNED_MULTIPLY_LONG() optimization patch 1 0 -1 1 16) Introduce new php.ini files parser/scanner + CGI/FastCGI? htaccess style ini file support 1 0 -1 +1, for the record, it allows what htscanner does (http://pecl.php.net/htscanner) but adding a tons of good things. More to come very soon, docs from me and patch from Jani. 17) Merge __callStatic patch from PHP 6 1 0 -1 1 18) Introduce concept of strict classes that do not permit dynamic property creation 1 0 -1 1 --Pierre -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List
On 9/9/07, Ilia Alshanetsky [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Its been about a week since RFS for features to go into 5.3 has gone out and while there was not a flood of ideas there is a substantial list of key changes people would like to go into this release. I've compiled a list of all of the suggestions I've received, they are listed below in a form that will hopefully make it easy for people to vote their yeys and nays. My hope that we can reach an agreement within 1-2 weeks so 5.3 can be branched and work on it can begin. List of Feature Ideas 1) Backport the namespaces patch for PHP 6 1 0 -1 1 2) Symlink the intl extension from PECL, but leave it disabled by default as is the case with all extensions dependent on external libs 1 0 -1 0 3) Apply the Late Static Binding Patch 1 0 -1 1 4) Implement David's Circular Garbage collection patch 1 0 -1 -1 This is a big change and would probably have to be in PHP6 unless it's extensively tested on production environment. If it's the case, then I'm all up for it. 5) Implement Sqlite3 support via the ext/sqlite extension (patch is already available) 1 0 -1 1 6) Remove safe_mode, register_globals and magic_quotes 1 0 -1 -1 I am scared of the HUGE BC break this is gonna be causing. I really do hate those parameters and make all my customers not use it, however, some people still sadly use it. 7) Introduce mysqlind library into core and use it as a backend for PDO and mysqli extensions (possibly enabling them by default) 1 0 -1 1 Not by default, --enable-mysqlnd 8) OpenID enabling patch for OpenSSL and PHP 5 1 0 -1 1 9) Add array_replace[_recursive] functions (patch is already available) 1 0 -1 1 10) Split off deprecation from E_STRICT into E_DEPRECATED 1 0 -1 1 YES! 11) Merge the zend_arg_info const'ify patch 1 0 -1 1 12) Merge the GCC 4 -fvisibility patch 1 0 -1 0 13) Switch for disabling/enabling materialized cursors in mysqli 1 0 -1 1 14) Link phar extension from PECL into core (possibly enabling it by default) 1 0 -1 1 15) Merge Matt's ZEND_SIGNED_MULTIPLY_LONG() optimization patch 1 0 -1 1 16) Introduce new php.ini files parser/scanner + CGI/FastCGI? htaccess style ini file support 1 0 -1 0 17) Merge __callStatic patch from PHP 6 1 0 -1 1 18) Introduce concept of strict classes that do not permit dynamic property creation 1 0 -1 1 Ilia Alshanetsky -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php One question remains, has SPL been ignored? Forgotten? or just refused? -- David Coallier, Founder Software Architect, Agora Production (http://agoraproduction.com) 51.42.06.70.18 -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List
Ilia Alshanetsky wrote: Its been about a week since RFS for features to go into 5.3 has gone out and while there was not a flood of ideas there is a substantial list of key changes people would like to go into this release. I've compiled a list of all of the suggestions I've received, they are listed below in a form that will hopefully make it easy for people to vote their yeys and nays. My hope that we can reach an agreement within 1-2 weeks so 5.3 can be branched and work on it can begin. List of Feature Ideas 6) Remove safe_mode, register_globals and magic_quotes PHP6 ONLY Lets not have another round of broken systems when just upgrading a minor version. 7) Introduce mysqlind library into core and use it as a backend for PDO and mysqli extensions (possibly enabling them by default) ? - Would they get in the way if you are NOT using PDO or mysqli Why force us to load something that is not generally used by everyone? In general PERSONALLY I would rather PHP5.3 was bug fixes rather than distracting from getting PHP6 out of the door? -- Lester Caine - G8HFL - Contact - http://home.lsces.co.uk/lsces/wiki/?page=contact L.S.Caine Electronic Services - http://home.lsces.co.uk MEDW - http://home.lsces.co.uk/ModelEngineersDigitalWorkshop/ Firebird - http://www.firebirdsql.org/index.php -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List
1) Backport the namespaces patch for PHP 6 2) Symlink the intl extension from PECL, but leave it disabled by default as is the case with all extensions dependent on external libs I haven't looked at it yet. 3) Apply the Late Static Binding Patch +0 4) Implement David's Circular Garbage collection patch +1 5) Implement Sqlite3 support via the ext/sqlite extension (patch is already available) +1 6) Remove safe_mode, register_globals and magic_quotes -1 7) Introduce mysqlind library into core and use it as a backend for PDO and mysqli extensions (possibly enabling them by default) +1, but maybe not by default yet 8) OpenID enabling patch for OpenSSL and PHP 5 +1 9) Add array_replace[_recursive] functions (patch is already available) +0 10) Split off deprecation from E_STRICT into E_DEPRECATED +0 11) Merge the zend_arg_info const'ify patch +1 (biased) 12) Merge the GCC 4 -fvisibility patch +1 (biased) 13) Switch for disabling/enabling materialized cursors in mysqli 14) Link phar extension from PECL into core (possibly enabling it by default) 0, but not by default. 15) Merge Matt's ZEND_SIGNED_MULTIPLY_LONG() optimization patch +1 The patch is pretty simple. it just needs some typedefs to work on windows. 16) Introduce new php.ini files parser/scanner + CGI/FastCGI? htaccess style ini file support +1, but with the option to disable it. 17) Merge __callStatic patch from PHP 6 18) Introduce concept of strict classes that do not permit dynamic property creation -0 Nuno -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List
On 09.09.2007 21:07, Ilia Alshanetsky wrote: Its been about a week since RFS for features to go into 5.3 has gone out and while there was not a flood of ideas there is a substantial list of key changes people would like to go into this release. I've compiled a list of all of the suggestions I've received, they are listed below in a form that will hopefully make it easy for people to vote their yeys and nays. My hope that we can reach an agreement within 1-2 weeks so 5.3 can be branched and work on it can begin. List of Feature Ideas 1) Backport the namespaces patch for PHP 6 1 0 -1 I thought most of us agreed that 5.3 should be == (PHP6 - Unicode). 1 2) Symlink the intl extension from PECL, but leave it disabled by default as is the case with all extensions dependent on external libs 1 0 -1 Once it's ready for production - why not? 1 3) Apply the Late Static Binding Patch 1 0 -1 0 4) Implement David's Circular Garbage collection patch 1 0 -1 IIRC that's one of the reasons for 5.3 branch. 1 5) Implement Sqlite3 support via the ext/sqlite extension (patch is already available) 1 0 -1 0/-1 (see on reason to touch a working extension, but I don't really care). 6) Remove safe_mode, register_globals and magic_quotes 1 0 -1 Let's leave this for HEAD. -1 7) Introduce mysqlind library into core and use it as a backend for PDO and mysqli extensions (possibly enabling them by default) 1 0 -1 1 Same as PECL/intl - once it's ready, I see no reason to keep it hidden. 8) OpenID enabling patch for OpenSSL and PHP 5 1 0 -1 0 9) Add array_replace[_recursive] functions (patch is already available) 1 0 -1 Do we really need more array functions? I believe we already have quite a number. -1 10) Split off deprecation from E_STRICT into E_DEPRECATED 1 0 -1 -1 Didn't see any arguments for this. 11) Merge the zend_arg_info const'ify patch 1 0 -1 0 12) Merge the GCC 4 -fvisibility patch 1 0 -1 0 13) Switch for disabling/enabling materialized cursors in mysqli 1 0 -1 0 14) Link phar extension from PECL into core (possibly enabling it by default) 1 0 -1 0 (-1 for enabling it by default). 15) Merge Matt's ZEND_SIGNED_MULTIPLY_LONG() optimization patch 1 0 -1 From what I recall, all Matt's patches were really good. So I'm 0/+1. 16) Introduce new php.ini files parser/scanner + CGI/FastCGI? htaccess style ini file support 1 0 -1 0 AFAIK it's too early. 17) Merge __callStatic patch from PHP 6 1 0 -1 1/0. I believe we should decide on more general problems first, i.e. what is 5_3 - is this (5_2 + a couple of patches) or (HEAD - Unicode)? 18) Introduce concept of strict classes that do not permit dynamic property creation 1 0 -1 0 -- Wbr, Antony Dovgal -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List
On 9/9/07, Antony Dovgal [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 09.09.2007 21:07, Ilia Alshanetsky wrote: Its been about a week since RFS for features to go into 5.3 has gone out and while there was not a flood of ideas there is a substantial list of key changes people would like to go into this release. I've compiled a list of all of the suggestions I've received, they are listed below in a form that will hopefully make it easy for people to vote their yeys and nays. My hope that we can reach an agreement within 1-2 weeks so 5.3 can be branched and work on it can begin. List of Feature Ideas 1) Backport the namespaces patch for PHP 6 1 0 -1 I thought most of us agreed that 5.3 should be == (PHP6 - Unicode). 1 2) Symlink the intl extension from PECL, but leave it disabled by default as is the case with all extensions dependent on external libs 1 0 -1 Once it's ready for production - why not? 1 3) Apply the Late Static Binding Patch 1 0 -1 0 4) Implement David's Circular Garbage collection patch 1 0 -1 IIRC that's one of the reasons for 5.3 branch. 1 5) Implement Sqlite3 support via the ext/sqlite extension (patch is already available) 1 0 -1 0/-1 (see on reason to touch a working extension, but I don't really care). 6) Remove safe_mode, register_globals and magic_quotes 1 0 -1 Let's leave this for HEAD. -1 7) Introduce mysqlind library into core and use it as a backend for PDO and mysqli extensions (possibly enabling them by default) 1 0 -1 1 Same as PECL/intl - once it's ready, I see no reason to keep it hidden. 8) OpenID enabling patch for OpenSSL and PHP 5 1 0 -1 0 9) Add array_replace[_recursive] functions (patch is already available) 1 0 -1 Do we really need more array functions? I believe we already have quite a number. -1 10) Split off deprecation from E_STRICT into E_DEPRECATED 1 0 -1 -1 Didn't see any arguments for this. http://marc.info/?l=php-devm=116163053224532w=2 11) Merge the zend_arg_info const'ify patch 1 0 -1 0 12) Merge the GCC 4 -fvisibility patch 1 0 -1 0 13) Switch for disabling/enabling materialized cursors in mysqli 1 0 -1 0 14) Link phar extension from PECL into core (possibly enabling it by default) 1 0 -1 0 (-1 for enabling it by default). 15) Merge Matt's ZEND_SIGNED_MULTIPLY_LONG() optimization patch 1 0 -1 From what I recall, all Matt's patches were really good. So I'm 0/+1. 16) Introduce new php.ini files parser/scanner + CGI/FastCGI? htaccess style ini file support 1 0 -1 0 AFAIK it's too early. 17) Merge __callStatic patch from PHP 6 1 0 -1 1/0. I believe we should decide on more general problems first, i.e. what is 5_3 - is this (5_2 + a couple of patches) or (HEAD - Unicode)? Good point 18) Introduce concept of strict classes that do not permit dynamic property creation 1 0 -1 0 -- Wbr, Antony Dovgal -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php -- David Coallier, Founder Software Architect, Agora Production (http://agoraproduction.com) 51.42.06.70.18 -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List
All none listed are zero for me. 1) Backport the namespaces patch for PHP 6 1 6) Remove safe_mode, register_globals and magic_quotes -1 7) Introduce mysqlind library into core and use it as a backend for PDO and mysqli extensions (possibly enabling them by default) 1 8) OpenID enabling patch for OpenSSL and PHP 5 1 9) Add array_replace[_recursive] functions (patch is already available) 1 10) Split off deprecation from E_STRICT into E_DEPRECATED 1 16) Introduce new php.ini files parser/scanner + CGI/FastCGI? htaccess style ini file support 1 -- Brian Moon Senior Developer -- http://dealnews.com/ It's good to be cheap =) -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List
1) Backport the namespaces patch for PHP 6 1 as soon as we have it stabilized. 2) Symlink the intl extension from PECL, but leave it disabled by default as is the case with all extensions dependent on external libs 1 3) Apply the Late Static Binding Patch 1 4) Implement David's Circular Garbage collection patch Only if no significant performance degradation or one could turn it on/off at will. 5) Implement Sqlite3 support via the ext/sqlite extension (patch is already available) 1 6) Remove safe_mode, register_globals and magic_quotes -1 I think it's still too early. If we have E_DEPCRECATED however we might add some annoyances to them ;) 7) Introduce mysqlind library into core and use it as a backend for PDO and mysqli extensions (possibly enabling them by default) Introduce - +1, use as default - not sure, does mysqlnd has any downsides? If not, +1 too. 8) OpenID enabling patch for OpenSSL and PHP 5 1 9) Add array_replace[_recursive] functions (patch is already available) 0 10) Split off deprecation from E_STRICT into E_DEPRECATED 0. Why do we *need* it again? 11) Merge the zend_arg_info const'ify patch 1 12) Merge the GCC 4 -fvisibility patch 1 13) Switch for disabling/enabling materialized cursors in mysqli 0 14) Link phar extension from PECL into core (possibly enabling it by default) -1, we discussed why :) 0 if not enabled by default. 15) Merge Matt's ZEND_SIGNED_MULTIPLY_LONG() optimization patch 1 16) Introduce new php.ini files parser/scanner + CGI/FastCGI? htaccess style ini file support 0. We need to check very thoroughly we won't have security trouble with it like we had with .htaccess. If it's ok then 1. 17) Merge __callStatic patch from PHP 6 1 with all other __static too. 18) Introduce concept of strict classes that do not permit dynamic property creation -1 for now, not sure it's that useful, we are dynamic language ;) I also think the following items are not mentioned: Dynamic class access ($class::method) (binary) operator which is the same as (string) remove --enable-fastcgi and family, always enable them remove warning for var Non-parsed heredocs (nowdocs) goto __construct in interfaces Constant folding in compile-time -- Stanislav Malyshev, Zend Software Architect [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.zend.com/ (408)253-8829 MSN: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List
Hi Ilia, On Sunday 09 September 2007 07:07:37 pm Ilia Alshanetsky wrote: List of Feature Ideas 1) Backport the namespaces patch for PHP 6 1 0 -1 +1 2) Symlink the intl extension from PECL, but leave it disabled by default as is the case with all extensions dependent on external libs 1 0 -1 From what I read that extension offers interesting stuff. +1 3) Apply the Late Static Binding Patch 1 0 -1 0 4) Implement David's Circular Garbage collection patch 1 0 -1 I can see the need for this but would like to see the impacts first. Therefore +0.5 5) Implement Sqlite3 support via the ext/sqlite extension (patch is already available) 1 0 -1 I think this would make sense as long as the patch isn't to messy. (I can't remember seeing it) +/- 0 6) Remove safe_mode, register_globals and magic_quotes 1 0 -1 -1 7) Introduce mysqlind library into core and use it as a backend for PDO and mysqli extensions (possibly enabling them by default) 1 0 -1 From what I saw this looks quite good +1 8) OpenID enabling patch for OpenSSL and PHP 5 1 0 -1 +1 9) Add array_replace[_recursive] functions (patch is already available) 1 0 -1 I can see some use for these functions but we already have that many array functions 0 10) Split off deprecation from E_STRICT into E_DEPRECATED 1 0 -1 0 11) Merge the zend_arg_info const'ify patch 1 0 -1 +1 12) Merge the GCC 4 -fvisibility patch 1 0 -1 0 13) Switch for disabling/enabling materialized cursors in mysqli 1 0 -1 0 14) Link phar extension from PECL into core (possibly enabling it by default) 1 0 -1 +1 15) Merge Matt's ZEND_SIGNED_MULTIPLY_LONG() optimization patch 1 0 -1 +1 16) Introduce new php.ini files parser/scanner + CGI/FastCGI? htaccess style ini file support 1 0 -1 the ini parsing is a fundamental part of PHP therefore we should really test that stuff to catch as many edge-cases as possible but if we test it well: +1 17) Merge __callStatic patch from PHP 6 1 0 -1 +1 18) Introduce concept of strict classes that do not permit dynamic property creation 1 0 -1 0 johannes -- Johannes Schlüter http://schlueters.de -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List
On 9 Sep 2007, at 13:07, Ilia Alshanetsky wrote: Its been about a week since RFS for features to go into 5.3 has gone out and while there was not a flood of ideas there is a substantial list of key changes people would like to go into this release. I've compiled a list of all of the suggestions I've received, they are listed below in a form that will hopefully make it easy for people to vote their yeys and nays. My hope that we can reach an agreement within 1-2 weeks so 5.3 can be branched and work on it can begin. List of Feature Ideas 1) Backport the namespaces patch for PHP 6 1 0 -1 +1 2) Symlink the intl extension from PECL, but leave it disabled by default as is the case with all extensions dependent on external libs 1 0 -1 +1, this will be useful for many people but it would need to make a lot of progress in a short period of time at least before RC1. 3) Apply the Late Static Binding Patch 1 0 -1 +1 4) Implement David's Circular Garbage collection patch 1 0 -1 0, I see no problem in adding it but making it an option would be desirable depending on the overhead. 5) Implement Sqlite3 support via the ext/sqlite extension (patch is already available) 1 0 -1 +1, Is this the email I sent you regarding SQLite3? As what I sent was a new extension that re-implemented everything as OO, I intend to add it to PECL shortly once I've finished a few more things. The API for SQLite has changed so much since version 2 that it would require a lot of re-engineering to keep it backwards compatible. The extension I have is bundled with 3.4.2 but works with the new 3.5.0 alpha already, I've been using it internally for the past few weeks without problem, mainly for the extension support in SQLite3. 6) Remove safe_mode, register_globals and magic_quotes 1 0 -1 +1, The sooner we get rid of this the better, though I could see things going wrong if its not properly documented for everyone. I'd perhaps not remove the functions such as get_magic_quotes_gpc and the likes and just have them acting like they are disabled. This would prevent bc breaks for most applications. 7) Introduce mysqlind library into core and use it as a backend for PDO and mysqli extensions (possibly enabling them by default) 1 0 -1 +1 8) OpenID enabling patch for OpenSSL and PHP 5 1 0 -1 0 9) Add array_replace[_recursive] functions (patch is already available) 1 0 -1 0 10) Split off deprecation from E_STRICT into E_DEPRECATED 1 0 -1 +1 11) Merge the zend_arg_info const'ify patch 1 0 -1 +1 12) Merge the GCC 4 -fvisibility patch 1 0 -1 0 13) Switch for disabling/enabling materialized cursors in mysqli 1 0 -1 0 14) Link phar extension from PECL into core (possibly enabling it by default) 1 0 -1 -1 15) Merge Matt's ZEND_SIGNED_MULTIPLY_LONG() optimization patch 1 0 -1 +1 16) Introduce new php.ini files parser/scanner + CGI/FastCGI? htaccess style ini file support 1 0 -1 +1 17) Merge __callStatic patch from PHP 6 1 0 -1 +1 18) Introduce concept of strict classes that do not permit dynamic property creation 1 0 -1 +1 Scott -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List
Comments inline On Sun, 2007-09-09 at 13:07 -0400, Ilia Alshanetsky wrote: Its been about a week since RFS for features to go into 5.3 has gone out and while there was not a flood of ideas there is a substantial list of key changes people would like to go into this release. I've compiled a list of all of the suggestions I've received, they are listed below in a form that will hopefully make it easy for people to vote their yeys and nays. My hope that we can reach an agreement within 1-2 weeks so 5.3 can be branched and work on it can begin. List of Feature Ideas 1) Backport the namespaces patch for PHP 6 1 0 -1 1 2) Symlink the intl extension from PECL, but leave it disabled by default as is the case with all extensions dependent on external libs 1 0 -1 0 3) Apply the Late Static Binding Patch 1 0 -1 0 4) Implement David's Circular Garbage collection patch 1 0 -1 1 5) Implement Sqlite3 support via the ext/sqlite extension (patch is already available) 1 0 -1 1, but should be anything newer than sqlite-3.4.0. Versions prior to that had some issues with concurrency and locking under extreme load 6) Remove safe_mode, register_globals and magic_quotes 1 0 -1 0 7) Introduce mysqlind library into core and use it as a backend for PDO and mysqli extensions (possibly enabling them by default) 1 0 -1 1 8) OpenID enabling patch for OpenSSL and PHP 5 1 0 -1 1 9) Add array_replace[_recursive] functions (patch is already available) 1 0 -1 0 10) Split off deprecation from E_STRICT into E_DEPRECATED 1 0 -1 1 11) Merge the zend_arg_info const'ify patch 1 0 -1 0 12) Merge the GCC 4 -fvisibility patch 1 0 -1 0 13) Switch for disabling/enabling materialized cursors in mysqli 1 0 -1 0 14) Link phar extension from PECL into core (possibly enabling it by default) 1 0 -1 1 15) Merge Matt's ZEND_SIGNED_MULTIPLY_LONG() optimization patch 1 0 -1 1 16) Introduce new php.ini files parser/scanner + CGI/FastCGI? htaccess style ini file support 1 0 -1 1 17) Merge __callStatic patch from PHP 6 1 0 -1 0 18) Introduce concept of strict classes that do not permit dynamic property creation 1 0 -1 1, if you can disable it to have dynamic property creation (a great feature of PHP in my opinion) Ilia Alshanetsky -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List
Scott MacVicar wrote: 6) Remove safe_mode, register_globals and magic_quotes 10-1 +1, The sooner we get rid of this the better, though I could see things going wrong if its not properly documented for everyone. I'd perhaps not remove the functions such as get_magic_quotes_gpc and the likes and just have them acting like they are disabled. This would prevent bc breaks for most applications. Don't forget that the majority of users have yet to move FROM PHP4. So making things even more difficult to port over is not a good idea. I have two legacy sections of code that I STILL have not worked out what is stopping me switching off register_globals - code that I inherited from others. -- Lester Caine - G8HFL - Contact - http://home.lsces.co.uk/lsces/wiki/?page=contact L.S.Caine Electronic Services - http://home.lsces.co.uk MEDW - http://home.lsces.co.uk/ModelEngineersDigitalWorkshop/ Firebird - http://www.firebirdsql.org/index.php -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List
On Monday 10 September 2007, Lester Caine wrote: Scott MacVicar wrote: 6) Remove safe_mode, register_globals and magic_quotes 10-1 +1, The sooner we get rid of this the better, though I could see things going wrong if its not properly documented for everyone. I'd perhaps not remove the functions such as get_magic_quotes_gpc and the likes and just have them acting like they are disabled. This would prevent bc breaks for most applications. Don't forget that the majority of users have yet to move FROM PHP4. So making things even more difficult to port over is not a good idea. I have two legacy sections of code that I STILL have not worked out what is stopping me switching off register_globals - code that I inherited from others. The correct time to break BC is PHP 6. Shared hosts, what most PHP code ends up running on, are very conservative by nature. They won't upgrade to something that has any chance of breaking their customers' code unless they really have to. That means the best way to encourage adoption of new PHP versions is to save up BC breaks and do them all at once, so that there's only one speed bump to get over instead of several. Such big-BC-breaks are known in most circles as major versions. :-) However, those settings seem like a text-book case where E_DEPRECATED would be desirable, as it gives everyone explicit fair warning that those mis-features are going away soon. That should help PHP 6 adoption in the long run rather than hinder it. -- Larry Garfield AIM: LOLG42 [EMAIL PROTECTED] ICQ: 6817012 If nature has made any one thing less susceptible than all others of exclusive property, it is the action of the thinking power called an idea, which an individual may exclusively possess as long as he keeps it to himself; but the moment it is divulged, it forces itself into the possession of every one, and the receiver cannot dispossess himself of it. -- Thomas Jefferson -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 5.3 Suggested Feature List
On 9/10/07, Larry Garfield [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Monday 10 September 2007, Lester Caine wrote: Scott MacVicar wrote: 6) Remove safe_mode, register_globals and magic_quotes 10-1 +1, The sooner we get rid of this the better, though I could see things going wrong if its not properly documented for everyone. I'd perhaps not remove the functions such as get_magic_quotes_gpc and the likes and just have them acting like they are disabled. This would prevent bc breaks for most applications. Don't forget that the majority of users have yet to move FROM PHP4. So making things even more difficult to port over is not a good idea. I have two legacy sections of code that I STILL have not worked out what is stopping me switching off register_globals - code that I inherited from others. The correct time to break BC is PHP 6. Shared hosts, what most PHP code ends Please don't use this thread to discuss such problems, it is a vote only thread. Besides a small comment to explain your vote, there is no need to start again endless discussions here. Thanks for your understandings, --Pierre -- PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
