Re: Big props to the list membership

[Pete Mundy]

Hi Loernzo

No bug filed because I wasn't sure it was actually a bug. I figured it could 
just as easily have been something caused by other configuration changes I had 
made over time. To be sure it was a bug I'd need to first set up a box with 
factory settings and replicate the fault, and after the time I put in today 
getting my setup working, that further step fell into the 'too hard' bin.

I shouldn't be so lazy ;)

In answer to your second question; no and so hence the latter.

Pete


> On 27/04/2016, at 2:18 pm, Lorenzo Colitti  wrote:
> 
> Pete,
> 
> Did you file a bug on openwrt? My openwrt device here announces its ULA 
> address, but I think it does reply on that address.
> 
> Were you able to configure the ISP DNS servers using luci, or did you 
> hardcode them in the configuration file?
> 
> Cheers,
> Lorenzo
> 
> On Wed, Apr 27, 2016 at 11:11 AM, Pete Mundy  > wrote:
> Dear ipv6-ops list members,
> 
> I just wanted to send a big props to you guys for the robust discussion on 
> the Marshmallow problem that Eric reported wrt slow web-page loading when v6 
> is enabled. It found myself bursting into laugher reading Tim's replies 
> (specifically the one including the phrase 'jammin on the jim jam frippen on 
> the krotz') and decided right there and then that bugger it, I need to get to 
> the bottom of the same problem that was happening here.
> 
> I had last week committed the cardinal sin of disabling v6 on my CPE (yes 
> barely a router, Jeroen) to get around exactly the same symptoms on my 
> Masrhmallow device. So today I spent no less than six (6!) hours digging down 
> to the bottom of it all using the combined knowledge I had gained, tcpdump, a 
> whole bunch of RTFM and many many binary tests.
> 
> To cut a long story short, my OpenWRT CPE was assigning it's LAN ULA v6 IP 
> via RDNSS, but it wasn't responding to any DNS queries sent to that address. 
> So DNS was borked for v6 queriers and the Marshmallow device wasn't elegantly 
> routing around the damage like all the other hosts on my (W)LAN were. A 
> similar run of events to those experienced by the ISP customers Eric reported.
> 
> The eventual work-around was to manually configure my ISP's (working :) v6 
> DNS resolver IPs into the odhcpd configuration.
> 
> So thanks everyone for your entertaining and informative discussions. Those, 
> coupled with a 1/2 day of my time have provided the pleasant outcome of 
> having v6 enabled again and all systems working :)
> 
> Pete Mundy
> Nelson, New Zealand



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Big props to the list membership

[Pete Mundy]

Dear ipv6-ops list members,

I just wanted to send a big props to you guys for the robust discussion on the 
Marshmallow problem that Eric reported wrt slow web-page loading when v6 is 
enabled. It found myself bursting into laugher reading Tim's replies 
(specifically the one including the phrase 'jammin on the jim jam frippen on 
the krotz') and decided right there and then that bugger it, I need to get to 
the bottom of the same problem that was happening here.

I had last week committed the cardinal sin of disabling v6 on my CPE (yes 
barely a router, Jeroen) to get around exactly the same symptoms on my 
Masrhmallow device. So today I spent no less than six (6!) hours digging down 
to the bottom of it all using the combined knowledge I had gained, tcpdump, a 
whole bunch of RTFM and many many binary tests.

To cut a long story short, my OpenWRT CPE was assigning it's LAN ULA v6 IP via 
RDNSS, but it wasn't responding to any DNS queries sent to that address. So DNS 
was borked for v6 queriers and the Marshmallow device wasn't elegantly routing 
around the damage like all the other hosts on my (W)LAN were. A similar run of 
events to those experienced by the ISP customers Eric reported.

The eventual work-around was to manually configure my ISP's (working :) v6 DNS 
resolver IPs into the odhcpd configuration.

So thanks everyone for your entertaining and informative discussions. Those, 
coupled with a 1/2 day of my time have provided the pleasant outcome of having 
v6 enabled again and all systems working :)

Pete Mundy
Nelson, New Zealand




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Re: Slow WiFi with Android Marshmallow & IPv6?

[Ted Mittelstaedt]

On 4/26/2016 1:37 AM, Bjørn Mork wrote:

Ted Mittelstaedt  writes:


3rd party:

https://sourceforge.net/projects/rdnssd-win32/


The question is: Why would any "normal" user care enough to install
that?  Heck, I don't even bother running rdnssd on my (Debian) laptop.
I run BIND instead :)


I would assume that a network admin with hundreds of win systems in a
domain could put this in a GPO or login script, if they were really
anal about not setting up DHCPv6

However, the truth of it is that this program almost certainly was
created to prove that RDNSS CAN work on Windows and that there is
no technical barrier to it working on Windows.

It allows people like me to embarrass Microsoft sales droids at the
various presentations I get dragged to that Microsoft puts on by
proving this decision is just more Microsoft baloney attempts to
politicize the industry.

The conversation goes like this:

Sales Droid:  "Blah Blah Microsoft products are so great Blah Blah does
anyone have any questions"

Me:  "When will Microsoft fully support IPv6"

Sales Droid:  "Let me have my trained technical monkey answer that"

Sales Engineer: "Microsoft fully supports IPv6"

Me: "No, it doesn't.  It does not support RDNSS"

Sales Engineer:  "RDNSS can't be supported by Windows because of
jammin on the jim jam frippen on the krotz baloney technical reason"

Me:  "Oh really.  Then you better tell the author of THE PROGRAM
THAT MAKES IT WORK ON WINDOWS that his code don't work.  In fact
I'M USING IT RIGHT NOW"

Unfortunately, since I don't spend $100M a year with MS that's when
the uniformed goons show up to throw me out of the Microsoft
Worship Church Service AKA Dog And Pony Show.   Then I go over to the
Cisco Worship Service AKA Dog And Pony Show next door and have some fun 
with them.


The day that a customer who does spend $100M a year with MS demands it,
is the day Windows will support RDNSS.



But let's face it: name-server config is not something that interests a
large group of end users. Any feature which is not part of the default
OS installation is not worth considering at all.


is that a fact?  I suppose you don't use SSH then to access your
command line servers and devices. 

Ted

Re: Slow WiFi with Android Marshmallow & IPv6?

[Jeroen Massar]

On 2016-04-26 10:52, Thomas Schäfer wrote:
> @Jeroen
> Thanks for the definition of router and cpe.
> 
> 
> But the chain of problems must be long:
> 
> dead DNS-resolvers by isp
> 
> dead DNS-resolvers not recognized by the "cpe" as a cache resolver

Dead-detection is a standard thing. Only apparently Android does not do
this.

> slow/no switch to alternative DNS-resolvers at the enduser device.

The enduser device uses the CPE, if that does not work for whatever
reason the user will just consider this as "broken internet" (as they do
not know better, and they should not).

Their first thing is to power off then power on the device, if that does
not work, they will call their ISP for support who will then do whatever
magic to fix things.

> All three instances with bad software / without monitoring?

When all ISP resolvers are dead, the ISP will have a *LOT* of support
calls (which is a costly thing).

That next to hoping the monitoring they have in place.

If they do not have functioning monitoring in place, and also actually
check those alerts, I don't think one should consider calling that "ISP"
a ISP. But yes, those places do exist. Likely this does not happen
though when they dogfood their own servers, which is likely, as then
their own stream of cat pictures stop functioning...

Best Internet monitoring well over a decade ago: Gamers playing Quake...

Greets,
 Jeroen

Re: Slow WiFi with Android Marshmallow & IPv6?

[Thomas Schäfer]

@Jeroen
Thanks for the definition of router and cpe.


But the chain of problems must be long:

dead DNS-resolvers by isp

dead DNS-resolvers not recognized by the "cpe" as a cache resolver

slow/no switch to alternative DNS-resolvers at the enduser device.

All three instances with bad software / without monitoring?

Thanks for sharing this experience.


Thomas

Re: Slow WiFi with Android Marshmallow & IPv6?

[Bjørn Mork]

Ted Mittelstaedt  writes:

> 3rd party:
>
> https://sourceforge.net/projects/rdnssd-win32/

The question is: Why would any "normal" user care enough to install
that?  Heck, I don't even bother running rdnssd on my (Debian) laptop.
I run BIND instead :)

But let's face it: name-server config is not something that interests a
large group of end users. Any feature which is not part of the default
OS installation is not worth considering at all.  Windows supports
DHCPv6 and that's that.  You all know what you have to do.


Bjørn

Re: Slow WiFi with Android Marshmallow & IPv6?

[Jeroen Massar]

On 2016-04-26 10:09, Thomas Schäfer wrote:
> Am 25.04.2016 um 17:40 schrieb Eric Vyncke (evyncke):
>> Thanks to all people pointing me towards a DNS issue.
>>
> 
> I read this thread with great interest. I have a Marshmallow dualstacked
> via Wifi (and via mobile), and I have no issues so far.
> One thing troubles me.
> In my configuration the router gets at least four dns-resolvers two ipv4
> and two ipv6 from the isp. The router itself checks the reliability and
> announces its own ip-address as resolver to the clients. A dead resolver
> would theoretically never reach the client.
> 
> Is this a special feature of avm?

With "avm" you likely mean "AVM Fritz!Box", which btw is not
specifically a 'router' but a CPE (that for IPv4 NATs and for IPv6 sorta
'routes'; on a list like this, please don't call those "routers" though
that is an insult to the real boxes).

Like any other CPE in the world, it will receive DNS servers from the
upstream connection and then offer a local recursive DNS server to the
network behind the device.

And that recursive DNS server will forward DNS queries to the upstream
DNS servers, and indeed, in most implementations (unlike Android which
is a enduser device and does not do what every other platform in the
world does) it will use the fastest responding upstream DNS and keep on
using that till that one fails and then retry the next one till it does
not have any left.

Greets,
 Jeroen

Re: Slow WiFi with Android Marshmallow & IPv6?

[Thomas Schäfer]

Am 25.04.2016 um 17:40 schrieb Eric Vyncke (evyncke):

Thanks to all people pointing me towards a DNS issue.



I read this thread with great interest. I have a Marshmallow dualstacked 
via Wifi (and via mobile), and I have no issues so far.

One thing troubles me.
In my configuration the router gets at least four dns-resolvers two ipv4 
and two ipv6 from the isp. The router itself checks the reliability and 
announces its own ip-address as resolver to the clients. A dead resolver 
would theoretically never reach the client.


Is this a special feature of avm?

Regards,
Thomas






--

There’s no place like ::1

Thomas Schäfer (Systemverwaltung)
Ludwig-Maximilians-Universität
Centrum für Informations- und Sprachverarbeitung
Oettingenstraße 67 Raum C109
80538 München ☎ +49/89/2180-9706  ℻ +49/89/2180-9701

Re: Slow WiFi with Android Marshmallow & IPv6?

[Ted Mittelstaedt]

3rd party:

https://sourceforge.net/projects/rdnssd-win32/

Ted

On 4/25/2016 10:52 AM, Jens Link wrote:

Gert Doering  writes:


(I'm not sure about Windows and 6106 right now, so not commenting on that)


I checked last week and the answer is No.

Jens