RE: [jug-discussion] [dec presentation] survey of O/R tools
Hey folks - I just ran across an old work email of mine with some JDO discussion. I'm not sure where the link is on the website, but when I first joined the list, I think Simon sent around a link to a previous discussion on Solarmetrics JDO product (Kodo JDO). http://www.solarmetric.com/ Warner - howabout the first part of your talk maybe you could provide a simple matrix that outlines the differences between the JDO / EJB / Roll-Yer-Own-Persistence approaches? Just a thought. :-) Oh...and uh, has anybody actually tried out and used the KodoJDO stuff? Thanks, Timo - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: [jug-discussion] [dec presentation] survey of O/R tools
I would add to your list. Is it well documented? Is it easy to configure? Does it have community support? (more people that use it, more bugs get found and fixed) Can you get other support? Can you find info on it and best practices with it (with books, articles, etc.)? Can you hire someone off the street who can do it? Is it a standard? Does it have XDoclet support? I would like to offer a presentation for December's topic covering Object-Relational mapping tools. An emphatic +1 :-) Some of the tools I would be reviewing will be: Castor (castor.exolab.org) Hibernate (http://hibernate.sourceforge.net/) Torque (jakarta.apache.org/turbine/torque) OJB (jakarta.apache.org/ojb) TJDO (http://tjdo.sourceforge.net/) I'm most interested in Hibernate and TJDO personally, but might be worth adding this project to just the comparison grid: jRelationalFramework version 2.0 http://jrf.sourceforge.net/ The author of SimpleORM has this document that might be a good starting point for some comparisons: http://www.uq.net.au/~zzabergl/simpleorm/ORMTools.html Personally I think that this is more than enough to review in an hour, Agree. Perhaps on the list there are other folks who have intimate experience with one or more of these technologies already? Could split things up to multiple folks, but work on the same example scenario? If this is selected as the next topic. I would like some specific questions asked now, so I can prepare the answers for the presentation. 1) Is it easy to use? 2) Is it easy to use? ;-) 3) Does it impose any constraints on the DB design? (or conversely, will it work with a schema that you didn't design, wouldn't have designed, and was just plain designed by a raving lunatic...but now can't be changed?) 4) Does it adapt well to changes in schema? 5) Does it have cacheing built in? 6) How query-intensive is it? (i.e. how many queries does it take to restore a listed of objects that have nested objects) Looking forward to this! Tim - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Richard Hightower CTO | LearningPatterns, Inc. Global Java Education, Mentoring, Courseware Consulting Services +520-290-6855 direct 55 Broad Street , 18th Floor | New York NY 10004 w w w . l e a r n i n g p a t t e r n s . c o m w w w . t r i v e r a t e c h . c o m (new merger) - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [jug-discussion] [dec presentation] survey of O/R tools
At 07:29 PM 11/13/2002 -0800, you wrote: See more below: --- Warner Onstine [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Wednesday, November 13, 2002, at 06:14 PM, Lesiecki Nicholas wrote: Warner says: I'd prefer not to [cover EJB/CMP] for a few reasons: 1) While I know that it is a kind of O/R it is not the kind I am interested in at the moment What kind are you interested in? Well, I personally have some issues with EJB ;-). If I saw a good presentation on it maybe I'd change my mind. But I have problems with any framework that requires me to create multiple files just in order to get some data from a database as an object. You have a point. That's why I want to see EJB covered. Everyone I talk to says EJB sucks. We use it and it doesn't seem so bad. (Back me up Rick, Andy). But I'm always interested in another better idea. So I want to see it compared side by side to other frameworks so that I can make up my mind a little better. I can understand this but Warner's original idea was to cover some of the containerless O/R products. His scope was TOO BIG from the beginning and certainly doesn't need widening! I advocate that we stick with the original idea (maybe even cut it down to 3 or 4) and save the EJB stuff for sometime later (maybe the following month). -tom - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: [jug-discussion] [dec presentation] survey of O/R tools
His scope was TOO BIG from the beginning and certainly doesn't need widening! +1 (That's why I want to get my favorites near the top. grin) I advocate that we stick with the original idea (maybe even cut it down to 3 or 4) and save the EJB stuff for sometime later (maybe the following month). +1 EJB is a vast topic. Perhaps after a good rundown on the containerless persistence frameworks, we can form a generic picture of how they work. Then the EJB 2.x can be presented and finally an educated comparison pro/con? Cheers, Tim - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [jug-discussion] [dec presentation] survey of O/R tools
At 08:41 PM 11/13/2002 -0700, Warner wrote: Uncle! ;-) Ok, so the lineup will be (contingent on getting some help on unknown frameworks + a consensus): Castor (castor.exolab.org) Hibernate (http://hibernate.sourceforge.net/) Torque (jakarta.apache.org/turbine/torque) OJB (jakarta.apache.org/ojb) TJDO (http://tjdo.sourceforge.net/) and EJB (2.x ?) (http://java.sun.com/products/ejb/docs.html) - need help with this one Come on Warner --- don't cave in. There's already too much here to do it all justice without adding the EJB monster, which is a completely different animal anyway. Besides, we just had an EJB presentation a couple of meetings ago, didn't we? -tom - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: [jug-discussion] [dec presentation] survey of O/R tools
I would add to your list. Is it well documented? Is it easy to configure? Does it have community support? (more people that use it, more bugs get found and fixed) Can you get other support? Can you find info on it and best practices with it (with books, articles, etc.)? Can you hire someone off the street who can do it? Is it a standard? Does it have XDoclet support? Do these questions refer to the difference between EJB CMR/P and OR Tools? If so then my biggest issue is the container dependent implementations of J2EE. As I remember Resin was been pretty horrific in regards to many of these questions. Weblogic is WAY better, but costs a lot of $$. Has Resin improved in relation to: 1 2 3 4 and 6? I would like to offer a presentation for December's topic covering Object-Relational mapping tools. An emphatic +1 :-) Some of the tools I would be reviewing will be: Castor (castor.exolab.org) Hibernate (http://hibernate.sourceforge.net/) Torque (jakarta.apache.org/turbine/torque) OJB (jakarta.apache.org/ojb) TJDO (http://tjdo.sourceforge.net/) I'm most interested in Hibernate and TJDO personally, but might be worth adding this project to just the comparison grid: jRelationalFramework version 2.0 http://jrf.sourceforge.net/ The author of SimpleORM has this document that might be a good starting point for some comparisons: http://www.uq.net.au/~zzabergl/simpleorm/ORMTools.html Personally I think that this is more than enough to review in an hour, Agree. Perhaps on the list there are other folks who have intimate experience with one or more of these technologies already? Could split things up to multiple folks, but work on the same example scenario? If this is selected as the next topic. I would like some specific questions asked now, so I can prepare the answers for the presentation. 1) Is it easy to use? 2) Is it easy to use? ;-) 3) Does it impose any constraints on the DB design? (or conversely, will it work with a schema that you didn't design, wouldn't have designed, and was just plain designed by a raving lunatic...but now can't be changed?) 4) Does it adapt well to changes in schema? 5) Does it have cacheing built in? 6) How query-intensive is it? (i.e. how many queries does it take to restore a listed of objects that have nested objects) Looking forward to this! Tim - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Richard Hightower CTO | LearningPatterns, Inc. Global Java Education, Mentoring, Courseware Consulting Services +520-290-6855 direct 55 Broad Street , 18th Floor | New York NY 10004 w w w . l e a r n i n g p a t t e r n s . c o m w w w . t r i v e r a t e c h . c o m (new merger) - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [jug-discussion] [dec presentation] survey of O/R tools
At 04:59 PM 11/13/2002 -0700, Warner wrote: If this is selected as the next topic. I would like some specific questions asked now, so I can prepare the answers for the presentation. 1. What entity relationships does the ORMapping support? 11. one-to-one 22. one-to-may 33. many-to-many 44. dependent (weak) entities (class dependent on another) aa. Does it also handle cascaded deletes and such constraints? 55. strong entities (class relating to another) 66. class extending another aa. how does it do this (one-inheritance-tree-one-table or otherwise)? 2. Does it autogenerate unique IDs? 3. Does it allow a Java class to map to more than one DB table? 4. What kind of Query processing does it support? (ODQL, SQL, proprietary)? 5. Read vs. Write performance? 6. Space vs. performance? 7. Does it have a programmable API? If so, what languages does it support? 8. Which platforms does it run on? Other requirements (libraries, packages, etc.)? 9. What is the cost? (probably not applicable to the ones you picked). 10. How does it persist? (alter byte code, Persistance Manager class, XML config file Looking forward to your presentation. -tom - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [jug-discussion] [dec presentation] survey of O/R tools
answers for EJB CMP CMR At 04:59 PM 11/13/2002 -0700, Warner wrote: If this is selected as the next topic. I would like some specific questions asked now, so I can prepare the answers for the presentation. 1. What entity relationships does the ORMapping support? 11. one-to-one yes 22. one-to-may yes 33. many-to-many yes 44. dependent (weak) entities (class dependent on another) vendor specific aa. Does it also handle cascaded deletes and such constraints? yes 55. strong entities (class relating to another) don't uderstand question 66. class extending another aa. how does it do this (one-inheritance-tree-one-table or otherwise)? not easily 2. Does it autogenerate unique IDs? yes. (vendor specific) 3. Does it allow a Java class to map to more than one DB table? yes. (vendor specific) 4. What kind of Query processing does it support? (ODQL, SQL, proprietary)? EJBQL 5. Read vs. Write performance? vendor specific Fast... (it can cahce data and opt how data is loaded) 6. Space vs. performance? ? 7. Does it have a programmable API? If so, what languages does it support? supports java... 8. Which platforms does it run on? Other requirements (libraries, packages, etc.)? any j2ee compliant app server 9. What is the cost? (probably not applicable to the ones you picked). free for open source, $1000 for server deployment, up to $10 per server for high end 10. How does it persist? (alter byte code, Persistance Manager class, XML config file Handled by ejb container Looking forward to your presentation. -tom - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Richard Hightower CTO | LearningPatterns, Inc. Global Java Education, Mentoring, Courseware Consulting Services +520-290-6855 direct 55 Broad Street , 18th Floor | New York NY 10004 w w w . l e a r n i n g p a t t e r n s . c o m w w w . t r i v e r a t e c h . c o m (new merger) - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: [jug-discussion] [dec presentation] survey of O/R tools
True but even then weblogic had a much better community and documentation base. 6 of one... -Original Message- From: Richard Hightower [mailto:rhightower;learningpatterns.com] Sent: Thursday, November 14, 2002 3:25 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: [jug-discussion] [dec presentation] survey of O/R tools John, Yes. Resin EE has improved. For that matter if you compare WebLogic 6.0 from that time period when you were working with Resin CMP to the 7.0 release of WebLogic you would notice that WebLogic has improved too. WebLogic works really well now. It had problems back then too. It takes a few releases to get the kinks out. WebLogic 6.1 does not fully implement EJB CMP 2.0. WebLogic 7.0 does. I would add to your list. Is it well documented? Is it easy to configure? Does it have community support? (more people that use it, more bugs get found and fixed) Can you get other support? Can you find info on it and best practices with it (with books, articles, etc.)? Can you hire someone off the street who can do it? Is it a standard? Does it have XDoclet support? Do these questions refer to the difference between EJB CMR/P and OR Tools? If so then my biggest issue is the container dependent implementations of J2EE. As I remember Resin was been pretty horrific in regards to many of these questions. Weblogic is WAY better, but costs a lot of $$. Has Resin improved in relation to: 1 2 3 4 and 6? I would like to offer a presentation for December's topic covering Object-Relational mapping tools. An emphatic +1 :-) Some of the tools I would be reviewing will be: Castor (castor.exolab.org) Hibernate (http://hibernate.sourceforge.net/) Torque (jakarta.apache.org/turbine/torque) OJB (jakarta.apache.org/ojb) TJDO (http://tjdo.sourceforge.net/) I'm most interested in Hibernate and TJDO personally, but might be worth adding this project to just the comparison grid: jRelationalFramework version 2.0 http://jrf.sourceforge.net/ The author of SimpleORM has this document that might be a good starting point for some comparisons: http://www.uq.net.au/~zzabergl/simpleorm/ORMTools.html Personally I think that this is more than enough to review in an hour, Agree. Perhaps on the list there are other folks who have intimate experience with one or more of these technologies already? Could split things up to multiple folks, but work on the same example scenario? If this is selected as the next topic. I would like some specific questions asked now, so I can prepare the answers for the presentation. 1) Is it easy to use? 2) Is it easy to use? ;-) 3) Does it impose any constraints on the DB design? (or conversely, will it work with a schema that you didn't design, wouldn't have designed, and was just plain designed by a raving lunatic...but now can't be changed?) 4) Does it adapt well to changes in schema? 5) Does it have cacheing built in? 6) How query-intensive is it? (i.e. how many queries does it take to restore a listed of objects that have nested objects) Looking forward to this! Tim - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Richard Hightower CTO | LearningPatterns, Inc. Global Java Education, Mentoring, Courseware Consulting Services +520-290-6855 direct 55 Broad Street , 18th Floor | New York NY 10004 w w w . l e a r n i n g p a t t e r n s . c o m w w w . t r i v e r a t e c h . c o m (new merger) - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Richard Hightower CTO | LearningPatterns, Inc. Global Java Education, Mentoring, Courseware Consulting Services +520-290-6855 direct 55 Broad Street , 18th Floor | New York NY 10004 w w w . l e a r n i n g p a t t e r n s . c o m w w w . t r i v e r a t e c h . c o m (new merger) - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: [jug-discussion] [dec presentation] survey of O/R tools
i agree. resin's is good. the question was not better, but good. all True but even then weblogic had a much better community and documentation base. 6 of one... -Original Message- From: Richard Hightower [mailto:rhightower;learningpatterns.com] Sent: Thursday, November 14, 2002 3:25 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: [jug-discussion] [dec presentation] survey of O/R tools John, Yes. Resin EE has improved. For that matter if you compare WebLogic 6.0 from that time period when you were working with Resin CMP to the 7.0 release of WebLogic you would notice that WebLogic has improved too. WebLogic works really well now. It had problems back then too. It takes a few releases to get the kinks out. WebLogic 6.1 does not fully implement EJB CMP 2.0. WebLogic 7.0 does. I would add to your list. Is it well documented? Is it easy to configure? Does it have community support? (more people that use it, more bugs get found and fixed) Can you get other support? Can you find info on it and best practices with it (with books, articles, etc.)? Can you hire someone off the street who can do it? Is it a standard? Does it have XDoclet support? Do these questions refer to the difference between EJB CMR/P and OR Tools? If so then my biggest issue is the container dependent implementations of J2EE. As I remember Resin was been pretty horrific in regards to many of these questions. Weblogic is WAY better, but costs a lot of $$. Has Resin improved in relation to: 1 2 3 4 and 6? I would like to offer a presentation for December's topic covering Object-Relational mapping tools. An emphatic +1 :-) Some of the tools I would be reviewing will be: Castor (castor.exolab.org) Hibernate (http://hibernate.sourceforge.net/) Torque (jakarta.apache.org/turbine/torque) OJB (jakarta.apache.org/ojb) TJDO (http://tjdo.sourceforge.net/) I'm most interested in Hibernate and TJDO personally, but might be worth adding this project to just the comparison grid: jRelationalFramework version 2.0 http://jrf.sourceforge.net/ The author of SimpleORM has this document that might be a good starting point for some comparisons: http://www.uq.net.au/~zzabergl/simpleorm/ORMTools.html Personally I think that this is more than enough to review in an hour, Agree. Perhaps on the list there are other folks who have intimate experience with one or more of these technologies already? Could split things up to multiple folks, but work on the same example scenario? If this is selected as the next topic. I would like some specific questions asked now, so I can prepare the answers for the presentation. 1) Is it easy to use? 2) Is it easy to use? ;-) 3) Does it impose any constraints on the DB design? (or conversely, will it work with a schema that you didn't design, wouldn't have designed, and was just plain designed by a raving lunatic...but now can't be changed?) 4) Does it adapt well to changes in schema? 5) Does it have cacheing built in? 6) How query-intensive is it? (i.e. how many queries does it take to restore a listed of objects that have nested objects) Looking forward to this! Tim - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Richard Hightower CTO | LearningPatterns, Inc. Global Java Education, Mentoring, Courseware Consulting Services +520-290-6855 direct 55 Broad Street , 18th Floor | New York NY 10004 w w w . l e a r n i n g p a t t e r n s . c o m w w w . t r i v e r a t e c h . c o m (new merger) - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Richard Hightower CTO | LearningPatterns, Inc. Global Java Education, Mentoring, Courseware Consulting Services +520-290-6855 direct 55 Broad Street , 18th Floor | New York NY 10004 w w w . l e a r n i n g p a t t e r n s . c o m w w w . t r i v e r a t e c h . c o m (new merger) - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Richard Hightower CTO | LearningPatterns, Inc. Global Java Education, Mentoring, Courseware Consulting Services +520-290-6855 direct 55 Broad Street , 18th Floor | New York NY 10004 w w w . l e a r n i n g p a t t e r n s . c o m w w w . t r i v e r a t e c h . c o m (new merger
Re: [jug-discussion] [dec presentation] survey of O/R tools
On Wednesday, November 13, 2002, at 03:47 PM, Tim Colson wrote: I would like to offer a presentation for December's topic covering Object-Relational mapping tools. An emphatic +1 :-) Some of the tools I would be reviewing will be: Castor (castor.exolab.org) Hibernate (http://hibernate.sourceforge.net/) Torque (jakarta.apache.org/turbine/torque) OJB (jakarta.apache.org/ojb) TJDO (http://tjdo.sourceforge.net/) I'm most interested in Hibernate and TJDO personally, but might be worth adding this project to just the comparison grid: jRelationalFramework version 2.0 http://jrf.sourceforge.net/ The author of SimpleORM has this document that might be a good starting point for some comparisons: http://www.uq.net.au/~zzabergl/simpleorm/ORMTools.html Cool, thanks! Personally I think that this is more than enough to review in an hour, Agree. Perhaps on the list there are other folks who have intimate experience with one or more of these technologies already? Could split things up to multiple folks, but work on the same example scenario? That's the idea ;-). I personally am intimately familiar with Torque, although I haven't played with any of it's higher-level functions (they have a large-select function for dealing with large record-sets). If this is selected as the next topic. I would like some specific questions asked now, so I can prepare the answers for the presentation. 1) Is it easy to use? 2) Is it easy to use? ;-) 3) Does it impose any constraints on the DB design? (or conversely, will it work with a schema that you didn't design, wouldn't have designed, and was just plain designed by a raving lunatic...but now can't be changed?) 4) Does it adapt well to changes in schema? 5) Does it have cacheing built in? 6) How query-intensive is it? (i.e. how many queries does it take to restore a listed of objects that have nested objects) Great questions, thanks! -warner Looking forward to this! Tim - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [jug-discussion] [dec presentation] survey of O/R tools
Warner says: I'd prefer not to [cover EJB/CMP] for a few reasons: 1) While I know that it is a kind of O/R it is not the kind I am interested in at the moment What kind are you interested in? 2) It isn't standalone - it requires an EJB container Point taken, but every framework requires something be it build tools or classes to install in your app. In the case of Resin CMP we only use the O/R mapping part--hardly anything else. 3) I don't have an intimate knowledge of EJB Would anyone like to volunteer instead? Rick Hightower? 4) EJB can be an hour long all on it's own Of course. Surely the subtleties of any of these frameworks would merit an hour at least. The idea would be to cover it side by side with the other persistence frameworks *as a persistence framework* and focus on how it can be used as such and how it stacks up against the others. Cheers, Nick __ Do you Yahoo!? U2 on LAUNCH - Exclusive greatest hits videos http://launch.yahoo.com/u2 - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [jug-discussion] [dec presentation] survey of O/R tools
On Wednesday, November 13, 2002, at 06:14 PM, Lesiecki Nicholas wrote: Warner says: I'd prefer not to [cover EJB/CMP] for a few reasons: 1) While I know that it is a kind of O/R it is not the kind I am interested in at the moment What kind are you interested in? Well, I personally have some issues with EJB ;-). If I saw a good presentation on it maybe I'd change my mind. But I have problems with any framework that requires me to create multiple files just in order to get some data from a database as an object. Make it easy for me to do it and I might be interested. But I also like a light-weight approach in regards to containers - I know servlets and I know servlet containers, I don't want to have to learn how to configure JBoss just to use EJB's. 2) It isn't standalone - it requires an EJB container Point taken, but every framework requires something be it build tools or classes to install in your app. In the case of Resin CMP we only use the O/R mapping part--hardly anything else. See above. 3) I don't have an intimate knowledge of EJB Would anyone like to volunteer instead? Rick Hightower? I would gladly develop the framework and have others contribute pieces to it. 4) EJB can be an hour long all on it's own Of course. Surely the subtleties of any of these frameworks would merit an hour at least. The idea would be to cover it side by side with the other persistence frameworks *as a persistence framework* and focus on how it can be used as such and how it stacks up against the others. Sounds good. -warner Cheers, Nick __ Do you Yahoo!? U2 on LAUNCH - Exclusive greatest hits videos http://launch.yahoo.com/u2 - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: [jug-discussion] [dec presentation] survey of O/R tools
Well, [Warner] personally have some issues with EJB ;-). If I saw a good presentation on it maybe I'd change my mind. I agree with you, especially with the 1.1 spec, but I did see a compelling preso on 2.x last year at JavaOne...Tyler Jewell from BEA gave a talk on EJB 2.x and fired me up to want to use 2.0, but I'm limited by the availability of the tech in my environment, along with a lurking fear of the learning curve to deploy something simple. TS-3043 Why Enterprise JavaBeansTM ( EJBTM) 2.X Technology --Stuff That You Have Never Seen http://servlet.java.sun.com/javaone/sf2002/conf/sessions/20-all-regular. en.jsp Make it easy for me to do it and I might be interested. Amen, brotherman. :-) Nick ( or anyone else ) have you worked with EJB 2.x stuff? Cheers, Tim - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [jug-discussion] [dec presentation] survey of O/R tools
See more below: --- Warner Onstine [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Wednesday, November 13, 2002, at 06:14 PM, Lesiecki Nicholas wrote: Warner says: I'd prefer not to [cover EJB/CMP] for a few reasons: 1) While I know that it is a kind of O/R it is not the kind I am interested in at the moment What kind are you interested in? Well, I personally have some issues with EJB ;-). If I saw a good presentation on it maybe I'd change my mind. But I have problems with any framework that requires me to create multiple files just in order to get some data from a database as an object. You have a point. That's why I want to see EJB covered. Everyone I talk to says EJB sucks. We use it and it doesn't seem so bad. (Back me up Rick, Andy). But I'm always interested in another better idea. So I want to see it compared side by side to other frameworks so that I can make up my mind a little better. Make it easy for me to do it and I might be interested. But I also like a light-weight approach in regards to containers - I know servlets and I know servlet containers, I don't want to have to learn how to configure JBoss just to use EJB's. From my cursory look at Torque and Hibernate I say the exact same thing: I don't want to have to configure this tool just to get my persistence. But we're debating before the presentation! [...snip...] I would gladly develop the framework and have others contribute pieces to it. Gosh, when's the next meeting? After all my bitching I should probably attend and present. But my schedule has allowed no free evenings for the last two months...sigh. Cheers, nick __ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Web Hosting - Let the expert host your site http://webhosting.yahoo.com - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: [jug-discussion] [dec presentation] survey of O/R tools
Nick ( or anyone else ) have you worked with EJB 2.x stuff? Yep, it's all we use at eBlox. We use Resin as our EJB and servlet container and it has served us very well. The crucial savings comes through the use of CMR and EJB-QL. We use local entity beans so performance hasn't been an issue for us. (Resin also does simple read caching). Rick Hightower (JUG member and esteemed colleague) has written several Tutorials on EJB 2.X/CMP. You can find an index of them here: http://www.rickhightower.com/ejbcmpcmrtut.html There's one specific to Resin at: http://java-tools.eblox.com/index.php?ResinCMPCMRXDocletTutorial Cheers, Nick __ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Web Hosting - Let the expert host your site http://webhosting.yahoo.com - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re[2]: [jug-discussion] [dec presentation] survey of O/R tools
Wednesday, November 13, 2002, 6:14:23 PM, you wrote: 3) I don't have an intimate knowledge of EJB LN Would anyone like to volunteer instead? Rick Hightower? I'd be happy to represent EJB in a comparison of different O/R tools. We're using it very successfully and are very productive with it. Believe me, we have no room for any inefficiency at eBlox (ask anyone who has worked at eBlox or who has done a project with us and they will confirm this fact). With EJB 2.0, you can do a lot of things and your code can get very complicated. But if you use just what you need to solve a given problem, EJB can be very effective. The cool thing is EJB scales well. So, the same tools we use for simple problems can and has been used for more complicated (distributed) solutions. That said, my mind is always open. If we can fine a better tool for the job we'll try it on a small project and roll into future projects if it makes the cut. I look forward to the next meeting! Andy -- Andrew Barton Technical Director eBlox, Inc. Discover storeBlox and webBlox at the new eblox.com! http://www.eblox.com 520.615.9345 x102 (Tucson) 520.906.5278 (mobile) mailto:andrewb;eblox.com - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
