Re: Jujucharms

[Tom Barber]

Sad times! Stick a quid in the meter!

On Sat, Sep 9, 2017 at 3:21 PM, John Meinel  wrote:

> It appears to be a more general Canonical outage, as irc.canonical.com is
> also affected.
>
> John
> =:->
>
>
> On Sat, Sep 9, 2017 at 6:03 PM, Tom Barber  wrote:
>
>> Okay, own up, who killed Jujucharms.com whilst i'm trying to catch up on
>> work? :)
>>
>>
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Re: Jujucharms

[John Meinel]

It appears to be a more general Canonical outage, as irc.canonical.com is
also affected.

John
=:->


On Sat, Sep 9, 2017 at 6:03 PM, Tom Barber  wrote:

> Okay, own up, who killed Jujucharms.com whilst i'm trying to catch up on
> work? :)
>
>
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Jujucharms

[Tom Barber]

Okay, own up, who killed Jujucharms.com whilst i'm trying to catch up on
work? :)
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Re: Use of Jujucharms to launch non-opensource code

[Marco Ceppi]

This is actually a non-issue. The codebase was moved to LGPL over a year
ago, there was just two places this was not updated. First LaunchPad and
second was the setup.py file. I've corrected both.

On Tue, Feb 9, 2016 at 7:09 AM Marco Ceppi 
wrote:

> I'll take a look into this. charm-helpers seems to suffer a bit from
> license schizophrenia. LP lists it as GPLv3, the code has both GPL and LGPL
> license in root and setup.py lists it as AGPL. I will investigate this a
> bit more and email the list in a separate thread when this is resolved.
>
> On Tue, Feb 9, 2016 at 7:07 AM Mark Shuttleworth  wrote:
>
>>
>> OK, let's explore moving that to LGPL which I think would be more
>> appropriate for things like that and layers.
>>
>> Mark
>>
>> On 09/02/16 12:04, John Meinel wrote:
>> > I agree, I was a bit surprised that charmhelpers was AGPL instead of
>> LGPL.
>> > I think it makes sense as you still would contribute back to the layers
>> you
>> > touch, but it doesn't turn your entire charm into GPL.
>> >
>> > John
>> > =->
>> >
>> >
>> > On Tue, Feb 9, 2016 at 3:38 PM, Mark Shuttleworth 
>> wrote:
>> >
>> >> On 09/02/16 09:25, John Meinel wrote:
>> >>> The more edge case is that charmhelpers itself is AGPL, so if your
>> charm
>> >>> imported charmhelpers, then that is more of a grey area. You likely
>> need
>> >> to
>> >>> open source the actual charm, which sets up configuration, etc of the
>> >>> program. However, you still don't have to give out the source to the
>> >>> program you are configuring.
>> >> For stuff that we publish as libraries, we tend to prefer LGPL, which
>> >> doesn't force a license on the end product or codebase. So if we need
>> to
>> >> revisit the charmhelpers license we will do so.
>> >>
>> >> Mark
>> >>
>> >>
>>
>>
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Re: Use of Jujucharms to launch non-opensource code

[John Meinel]

I agree, I was a bit surprised that charmhelpers was AGPL instead of LGPL.
I think it makes sense as you still would contribute back to the layers you
touch, but it doesn't turn your entire charm into GPL.

John
=->


On Tue, Feb 9, 2016 at 3:38 PM, Mark Shuttleworth  wrote:

> On 09/02/16 09:25, John Meinel wrote:
> > The more edge case is that charmhelpers itself is AGPL, so if your charm
> > imported charmhelpers, then that is more of a grey area. You likely need
> to
> > open source the actual charm, which sets up configuration, etc of the
> > program. However, you still don't have to give out the source to the
> > program you are configuring.
>
> For stuff that we publish as libraries, we tend to prefer LGPL, which
> doesn't force a license on the end product or codebase. So if we need to
> revisit the charmhelpers license we will do so.
>
> Mark
>
>
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Re: Use of Jujucharms to launch non-opensource code

[Mark Shuttleworth]

On 09/02/16 09:25, John Meinel wrote:
> The more edge case is that charmhelpers itself is AGPL, so if your charm
> imported charmhelpers, then that is more of a grey area. You likely need to
> open source the actual charm, which sets up configuration, etc of the
> program. However, you still don't have to give out the source to the
> program you are configuring.

For stuff that we publish as libraries, we tend to prefer LGPL, which
doesn't force a license on the end product or codebase. So if we need to
revisit the charmhelpers license we will do so.

Mark


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Re: Use of Jujucharms to launch non-opensource code

[Mark Shuttleworth]

OK, let's explore moving that to LGPL which I think would be more
appropriate for things like that and layers.

Mark

On 09/02/16 12:04, John Meinel wrote:
> I agree, I was a bit surprised that charmhelpers was AGPL instead of LGPL.
> I think it makes sense as you still would contribute back to the layers you
> touch, but it doesn't turn your entire charm into GPL.
>
> John
> =->
>
>
> On Tue, Feb 9, 2016 at 3:38 PM, Mark Shuttleworth  wrote:
>
>> On 09/02/16 09:25, John Meinel wrote:
>>> The more edge case is that charmhelpers itself is AGPL, so if your charm
>>> imported charmhelpers, then that is more of a grey area. You likely need
>> to
>>> open source the actual charm, which sets up configuration, etc of the
>>> program. However, you still don't have to give out the source to the
>>> program you are configuring.
>> For stuff that we publish as libraries, we tend to prefer LGPL, which
>> doesn't force a license on the end product or codebase. So if we need to
>> revisit the charmhelpers license we will do so.
>>
>> Mark
>>
>>


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Re: Use of Jujucharms to launch non-opensource code

[Mark Ramm-Christensen (Canonical.com)]

Thanks Marco!

On Tue, Feb 9, 2016 at 1:33 PM, Marco Ceppi 
wrote:

> This is actually a non-issue. The codebase was moved to LGPL over a year
> ago, there was just two places this was not updated. First LaunchPad and
> second was the setup.py file. I've corrected both.
>
> On Tue, Feb 9, 2016 at 7:09 AM Marco Ceppi 
> wrote:
>
>> I'll take a look into this. charm-helpers seems to suffer a bit from
>> license schizophrenia. LP lists it as GPLv3, the code has both GPL and LGPL
>> license in root and setup.py lists it as AGPL. I will investigate this a
>> bit more and email the list in a separate thread when this is resolved.
>>
>> On Tue, Feb 9, 2016 at 7:07 AM Mark Shuttleworth  wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> OK, let's explore moving that to LGPL which I think would be more
>>> appropriate for things like that and layers.
>>>
>>> Mark
>>>
>>> On 09/02/16 12:04, John Meinel wrote:
>>> > I agree, I was a bit surprised that charmhelpers was AGPL instead of
>>> LGPL.
>>> > I think it makes sense as you still would contribute back to the
>>> layers you
>>> > touch, but it doesn't turn your entire charm into GPL.
>>> >
>>> > John
>>> > =->
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > On Tue, Feb 9, 2016 at 3:38 PM, Mark Shuttleworth 
>>> wrote:
>>> >
>>> >> On 09/02/16 09:25, John Meinel wrote:
>>> >>> The more edge case is that charmhelpers itself is AGPL, so if your
>>> charm
>>> >>> imported charmhelpers, then that is more of a grey area. You likely
>>> need
>>> >> to
>>> >>> open source the actual charm, which sets up configuration, etc of the
>>> >>> program. However, you still don't have to give out the source to the
>>> >>> program you are configuring.
>>> >> For stuff that we publish as libraries, we tend to prefer LGPL, which
>>> >> doesn't force a license on the end product or codebase. So if we need
>>> to
>>> >> revisit the charmhelpers license we will do so.
>>> >>
>>> >> Mark
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Juju mailing list
>>> Juju@lists.ubuntu.com
>>> Modify settings or unsubscribe at:
>>> https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/juju
>>>
>>
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Re: Use of Jujucharms to launch non-opensource code

[Ramesh Nethi]

Hi Marco,


It is the former. Using Juju and charms in a commercial project/product.

regards
Ramesh

On Sun, 7 Feb 2016 at 20:11 Marco Ceppi <marco.ce...@canonical.com> wrote:

> Could you elaborate on your usage? Are you wrapping Juju itself in a
> commercial project, using the charms in a commercial project, or producing
> a commercial charm?
>
> Either way, IANAL, so my responses would be moot, but I can try to offer
> some guidance.
>
> Marco
>
> On Sun, Feb 7, 2016 at 11:01 PM Ramesh Nethi <ramesh.ne...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>> Hello Jujucharmers,
>>
>> If one use Jujucharms in commercial projects where non-open source code
>> is deployed using jujucharms,  is this bound by AGPL ?  I understand that
>> modifying jujucharms code itself would call for open sourcing it.
>>
>> Are there any known commercial uses of jujucjarms ?
>>
>> regards
>> Ramesh
>>
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Re: Use of Jujucharms to launch non-opensource code

[Tim Penhey]

IANAL either, but if you are just using Juju and public charms to deploy
a commercial project or product, then I think that is fine. Like
deploying a private django app (which is what I do). This is just using
the tools for what they were designed for.

However, if you are modifying Juju source, and using that code as
commercial project, then changes to Juju need to come back - as part of
the AGPL.

Tim

On 09/02/16 05:17, Ramesh Nethi wrote:
> Hi Marco,
> 
> 
> It is the former. Using Juju and charms in a commercial project/product.
> 
> regards
> Ramesh
> 
> On Sun, 7 Feb 2016 at 20:11 Marco Ceppi <marco.ce...@canonical.com
> <mailto:marco.ce...@canonical.com>> wrote:
> 
> Could you elaborate on your usage? Are you wrapping Juju itself in a
> commercial project, using the charms in a commercial project, or
> producing a commercial charm?
> 
> Either way, IANAL, so my responses would be moot, but I can try to
> offer some guidance.
> 
> Marco
> 
> On Sun, Feb 7, 2016 at 11:01 PM Ramesh Nethi <ramesh.ne...@gmail.com
> <mailto:ramesh.ne...@gmail.com>> wrote:
> 
> Hello Jujucharmers,
> 
>     If one use Jujucharms in commercial projects where non-open
> source code is deployed using jujucharms,  is this bound by AGPL
> ?  I understand that modifying jujucharms code itself would call
> for open sourcing it.
> 
> Are there any known commercial uses of jujucjarms ?
> 
> regards
> Ramesh
> 
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> 
> 


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Re: Use of Jujucharms to launch non-opensource code

[Tom Barber]

Also I would assume your charm code only needs to be open source if you are
uploading it to the store. Local deployment etc wouldn't apply...

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On 8 February 2016 at 19:58, Tim Penhey <tim.pen...@canonical.com> wrote:

> IANAL either, but if you are just using Juju and public charms to deploy
> a commercial project or product, then I think that is fine. Like
> deploying a private django app (which is what I do). This is just using
> the tools for what they were designed for.
>
> However, if you are modifying Juju source, and using that code as
> commercial project, then changes to Juju need to come back - as part of
> the AGPL.
>
> Tim
>
> On 09/02/16 05:17, Ramesh Nethi wrote:
> > Hi Marco,
> >
> >
> > It is the former. Using Juju and charms in a commercial project/product.
> >
> > regards
> > Ramesh
> >
> > On Sun, 7 Feb 2016 at 20:11 Marco Ceppi <marco.ce...@canonical.com
> > <mailto:marco.ce...@canonical.com>> wrote:
> >
> > Could you elaborate on your usage? Are you wrapping Juju itself in a
> > commercial project, using the charms in a commercial project, or
> > producing a commercial charm?
> >
> > Either way, IANAL, so my responses would be moot, but I can try to
> > offer some guidance.
> >
> > Marco
> >
> >     On Sun, Feb 7, 2016 at 11:01 PM Ramesh Nethi <ramesh.ne...@gmail.com
> > <mailto:ramesh.ne...@gmail.com>> wrote:
> >
> >     Hello Jujucharmers,
> >
> > If one use Jujucharms in commercial projects where non-open
> > source code is deployed using jujucharms,  is this bound by AGPL
> > ?  I understand that modifying jujucharms code itself would call
> > for open sourcing it.
> >
> > Are there any known commercial uses of jujucjarms ?
> >
> > regards
> > Ramesh
> >
> > --
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> >
> >
> >
>
>
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Use of Jujucharms to launch non-opensource code

[Ramesh Nethi]

Hello Jujucharmers,

If one use Jujucharms in commercial projects where non-open source code is
deployed using jujucharms,  is this bound by AGPL ?  I understand that
modifying jujucharms code itself would call for open sourcing it.

Are there any known commercial uses of jujucjarms ?

regards
Ramesh
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Re: Use of Jujucharms to launch non-opensource code

[José Antonio Rey]

You can deploy proprietary software with a juju charm. However, the code
for the charm (what installs the proprietary software) should have an open
source license.

--
José Antonio Rey

On Sun, Feb 7, 2016, 23:01 Ramesh Nethi <ramesh.ne...@gmail.com> wrote:

> Hello Jujucharmers,
>
> If one use Jujucharms in commercial projects where non-open source code is
> deployed using jujucharms,  is this bound by AGPL ?  I understand that
> modifying jujucharms code itself would call for open sourcing it.
>
> Are there any known commercial uses of jujucjarms ?
>
> regards
> Ramesh
> --
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Re: Use of Jujucharms to launch non-opensource code

[Marco Ceppi]

Could you elaborate on your usage? Are you wrapping Juju itself in a
commercial project, using the charms in a commercial project, or producing
a commercial charm?

Either way, IANAL, so my responses would be moot, but I can try to offer
some guidance.

Marco

On Sun, Feb 7, 2016 at 11:01 PM Ramesh Nethi <ramesh.ne...@gmail.com> wrote:

> Hello Jujucharmers,
>
> If one use Jujucharms in commercial projects where non-open source code is
> deployed using jujucharms,  is this bound by AGPL ?  I understand that
> modifying jujucharms code itself would call for open sourcing it.
>
> Are there any known commercial uses of jujucjarms ?
>
> regards
> Ramesh
> --
> Juju mailing list
> Juju@lists.ubuntu.com
> Modify settings or unsubscribe at:
> https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/juju
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