Re: Bringing Cantata under the KDE umbrella?

[Harald Sitter]

On Mon, Feb 20, 2023 at 1:18 PM Aleix Pol  wrote:
>
> On Mon, Feb 20, 2023 at 12:28 AM Heiko Becker  wrote:
> >
> > On Sunday, 19 February 2023 23:36:22 CET, Albert Astals Cid wrote:
> > > El diumenge, 19 de febrer de 2023, a les 16:29:24 (CET), Heiko Becker va
> > > escriure:
> > >> Cantata is a Qt based MPD client, which was archived by its
> > >> original author
> > >> [1]. I started some porting to Qt6 but I wondered (and was asked in
> > >> #kde-devel today) if it would make sense to move it to KDE's
> > >> infrastructure? Despite being archived, it still works quite
> > >> nicely. And ...
> > >
> > > My only 2 concerns are:
> > >
> > >  * Is anyone going to work on it? I guess you?
> >
> > Yes.
>
> Part of the incubation process is to gather what's the team working on it.
> https://community.kde.org/Incubator/Projects/DescriptionTemplate

+1. That said, what we could do is incubate into playground and see if
we can assemble the required "Healthy team (healthy proportion of
volunteers, inclusive towards new contributors, ideally more than one
developer)" if not the incubation would simply fail.

> It feels wrong to incubate a project that is already out of
> development. Especially when we already have a number of music
> players...

I feel like there is a bit of nuance here. AFAIK neither libvlc nor
gstreamer have support for mpd so this does occupy a niche of its own.
Now, whether that justifies having yet another UI instead of investing
into backend abstraction of one of our existing UIs is another
question entirely. A question I would expect to get an answer TBH. Why
incubate cantata when we could make elisa or juk grow mpd support?
There is a substantial amount of code in the UI.

HS

Re: Bringing Cantata under the KDE umbrella?

[Reindl Harald]

Am 20.02.23 um 23:27 schrieb Tobias Leupold:

Am Montag, 20. Februar 2023, 23:15:41 CET schrieb Reindl Harald:

Am 20.02.23 um 22:45 schrieb Justin Zobel:

"Music player" daemon


Cantata is the client and don't play anything itself

but what do i expect from someone converting text mails to HTML, post a
one-liner on top of inline-quotes and use reply-all on a
maling-list...


Hey, we're quite a mellow crowd here I think. Stay nice, friendly and
professional everybody ;-)


sorry, but i can't stand such one-liners still hanging on "music player" 
which Cantata by definition isn't which was explained enough


mpd + cantata are a different beast than a "music player" playing local 
files


my homeserver continues playing the last track at the same position 
after reboot "long" before the graphical login appears and can be 
controlled by smatphone, my own website (using the native mpd protocol) 
or a GUI client like Cantata on whatever machine


and when it comes to mpd clients i have seen none within the past 15 
years which comes anywhere near to Cantata


especially on a KDE system - most other clients are coming with a ton of 
GTK/GNOME deps for half of the usability

Re: Bringing Cantata under the KDE umbrella?

[AnnoyingRains]

Correct, but the original issue was using reply-all instead of just
replying to the list, which is not configurable in gmail unless it is
changed manually for each and every reply AFAIK.
Either way, this is getting off topic, we should move back to Cantata

On Tue, Feb 21, 2023 at 9:32 AM Neal Gompa  wrote:
>
> On Mon, Feb 20, 2023 at 5:30 PM AnnoyingRains  wrote:
> >
> > Let's keep things civil here, this is just a mail client configuration
> > issue, gmail does all of this by default.
> > If I just clicked "reply" to this message on gmail, it would only
> > reply to you, as gmail does not understand mailing lists at all!
> >
>
> This is configurable in Gmail, you can change it to "reply all" by
> default when multiple recipients are in the email you're replying to.
>
>
>
>
> --
> 真実はいつも一つ！/ Always, there's only one truth!

Re: Bringing Cantata under the KDE umbrella?

[Heiko Becker]

On Sunday, 19 February 2023 23:36:22 CET, Albert Astals Cid wrote:


My only 2 concerns are:

 * Is anyone going to work on it? I guess you?
 * Can we have an agreement by the original author so we can take over the 
trademark?


I got an answer from him:

"You are more than welcome for fork Cantata, move to KDE, and use the name, 
its all fine with me :) Glad someone wants to look after it."


Regards,
Heiko

Re: Bringing Cantata under the KDE umbrella?

[Neal Gompa]

On Mon, Feb 20, 2023 at 5:30 PM AnnoyingRains  wrote:
>
> Let's keep things civil here, this is just a mail client configuration
> issue, gmail does all of this by default.
> If I just clicked "reply" to this message on gmail, it would only
> reply to you, as gmail does not understand mailing lists at all!
>

This is configurable in Gmail, you can change it to "reply all" by
default when multiple recipients are in the email you're replying to.




--
真実はいつも一つ！/ Always, there's only one truth!

Re: Bringing Cantata under the KDE umbrella?

[AnnoyingRains]

Let's keep things civil here, this is just a mail client configuration
issue, gmail does all of this by default.
If I just clicked "reply" to this message on gmail, it would only
reply to you, as gmail does not understand mailing lists at all!


On Tue, Feb 21, 2023 at 9:16 AM Reindl Harald  wrote:
>
>
>
> Am 20.02.23 um 22:45 schrieb Justin Zobel:
> > "Music player" daemon
>
> Cantata is the client and don't play anything itself
>
> but what do i expect from someone converting text mails to HTML, post a
> one-liner on top of inline-quotes and use reply-all on a
> maling-list...
>
> > On Tue, 21 Feb 2023, 1:15 am Reindl Harald,  > > wrote:
> >
> >
> > Am 20.02.23 um 15:18 schrieb Aleix Pol:
> >  > From a product description perspective it definitely is a music
> >  > player. MPD is an implementation detail.
> >
> > that must be why the first page of the settings is "library" with the
> > IP-Adress of your mpd server and other then you i am using mpd/canata
> > for many years :-)
> >
> > https://github.com/CDrummond/cantata
> > 
> > About: Qt5 Graphical MPD Client
> >
> > don't get me wrong but do you even know what MPD is?
> > https://www.musicpd.org/ 
> >
> > a music player / server without any interface, the interface is by
> > definition a seperate application like canatata or android apps
> > connecting to mpd via tcp which can run on localhost but don't need to
> >
> >  >> Am 20.02.23 um 13:18 schrieb Aleix Pol:
> >  >>> On Mon, Feb 20, 2023 at 12:28 AM Heiko Becker
> > mailto:heiko.bec...@kde.org>> wrote:
> >  
> >   On Sunday, 19 February 2023 23:36:22 CET, Albert Astals Cid wrote:
> >  > El diumenge, 19 de febrer de 2023, a les 16:29:24 (CET),
> > Heiko Becker va
> >  > escriure:
> >  >> Cantata is a Qt based MPD client, which was archived by its
> >  >> original author
> >  >> [1]. I started some porting to Qt6 but I wondered (and was
> > asked in
> >  >> #kde-devel today) if it would make sense to move it to KDE's
> >  >> infrastructure? Despite being archived, it still works quite
> >  >> nicely. And ...
> >  >
> >  > My only 2 concerns are:
> >  >
> >  >* Is anyone going to work on it? I guess you?
> >  
> >   Yes.
> >  >>>
> >  >>> Part of the incubation process is to gather what's the team
> > working on it.
> >  >>>
> > https://community.kde.org/Incubator/Projects/DescriptionTemplate
> > 
> >  >>>
> >  >>> It feels wrong to incubate a project that is already out of
> >  >>> development. Especially when we already have a number of music
> >  >>> players...
> >  >>
> >  >> Cantata isn't a "music player"
> >  >> it's the by far best MPD client
>

Re: Bringing Cantata under the KDE umbrella?

[Heiko Becker]

On Monday, 20 February 2023 13:18:02 CET, Aleix Pol wrote:

On Mon, Feb 20, 2023 at 12:28 AM Heiko Becker  wrote:
Part of the incubation process is to gather what's the team working on it.
https://community.kde.org/Incubator/Projects/DescriptionTemplate

It feels wrong to incubate a project that is already out of
development. Especially when we already have a number of music
players...


The original author just switched to LMS, which apparently suited his 
usecase better. Considering the responses in this thread and the 165 forks 
on github, I think it's not really too bold to assume there's still 
interest in Cantata though.


If the team size is a critical problem, I could just do this on my personal 
github, see if its gets any traction and attracts helping hands and revisit 
this discussion at some point in the future.


Regards,
Heiko

Re: Bringing Cantata under the KDE umbrella?

[Tobias Leupold]

Am Montag, 20. Februar 2023, 23:15:41 CET schrieb Reindl Harald:
> Am 20.02.23 um 22:45 schrieb Justin Zobel:
> > "Music player" daemon
> 
> Cantata is the client and don't play anything itself
> 
> but what do i expect from someone converting text mails to HTML, post a
> one-liner on top of inline-quotes and use reply-all on a
> maling-list...

Hey, we're quite a mellow crowd here I think. Stay nice, friendly and 
professional everybody ;-)

Re: Bringing Cantata under the KDE umbrella?

[Reindl Harald]

Am 20.02.23 um 22:45 schrieb Justin Zobel:

"Music player" daemon


Cantata is the client and don't play anything itself

but what do i expect from someone converting text mails to HTML, post a 
one-liner on top of inline-quotes and use reply-all on a 
maling-list...


On Tue, 21 Feb 2023, 1:15 am Reindl Harald, > wrote:



Am 20.02.23 um 15:18 schrieb Aleix Pol:
 > From a product description perspective it definitely is a music
 > player. MPD is an implementation detail.

that must be why the first page of the settings is "library" with the
IP-Adress of your mpd server and other then you i am using mpd/canata
for many years :-)

https://github.com/CDrummond/cantata

About: Qt5 Graphical MPD Client

don't get me wrong but do you even know what MPD is?
https://www.musicpd.org/ 

a music player / server without any interface, the interface is by
definition a seperate application like canatata or android apps
connecting to mpd via tcp which can run on localhost but don't need to

 >> Am 20.02.23 um 13:18 schrieb Aleix Pol:
 >>> On Mon, Feb 20, 2023 at 12:28 AM Heiko Becker
mailto:heiko.bec...@kde.org>> wrote:
 
  On Sunday, 19 February 2023 23:36:22 CET, Albert Astals Cid wrote:
 > El diumenge, 19 de febrer de 2023, a les 16:29:24 (CET),
Heiko Becker va
 > escriure:
 >> Cantata is a Qt based MPD client, which was archived by its
 >> original author
 >> [1]. I started some porting to Qt6 but I wondered (and was
asked in
 >> #kde-devel today) if it would make sense to move it to KDE's
 >> infrastructure? Despite being archived, it still works quite
 >> nicely. And ...
 >
 > My only 2 concerns are:
 >
 >    * Is anyone going to work on it? I guess you?
 
  Yes.
 >>>
 >>> Part of the incubation process is to gather what's the team
working on it.
 >>>
https://community.kde.org/Incubator/Projects/DescriptionTemplate

 >>>
 >>> It feels wrong to incubate a project that is already out of
 >>> development. Especially when we already have a number of music
 >>> players...
 >>
 >> Cantata isn't a "music player"
 >> it's the by far best MPD client

Re: Bringing Cantata under the KDE umbrella?

[Justin Zobel]

"Music player" daemon.

On Tue, 21 Feb 2023, 1:15 am Reindl Harald,  wrote:

>
>
> Am 20.02.23 um 15:18 schrieb Aleix Pol:
> > From a product description perspective it definitely is a music
> > player. MPD is an implementation detail.
>
> that must be why the first page of the settings is "library" with the
> IP-Adress of your mpd server and other then you i am using mpd/canata
> for many years :-)
>
> https://github.com/CDrummond/cantata
> About: Qt5 Graphical MPD Client
>
> don't get me wrong but do you even know what MPD is?
> https://www.musicpd.org/
>
> a music player / server without any interface, the interface is by
> definition a seperate application like canatata or android apps
> connecting to mpd via tcp which can run on localhost but don't need to
>
> >> Am 20.02.23 um 13:18 schrieb Aleix Pol:
> >>> On Mon, Feb 20, 2023 at 12:28 AM Heiko Becker 
> wrote:
> 
>  On Sunday, 19 February 2023 23:36:22 CET, Albert Astals Cid wrote:
> > El diumenge, 19 de febrer de 2023, a les 16:29:24 (CET), Heiko
> Becker va
> > escriure:
> >> Cantata is a Qt based MPD client, which was archived by its
> >> original author
> >> [1]. I started some porting to Qt6 but I wondered (and was asked in
> >> #kde-devel today) if it would make sense to move it to KDE's
> >> infrastructure? Despite being archived, it still works quite
> >> nicely. And ...
> >
> > My only 2 concerns are:
> >
> >* Is anyone going to work on it? I guess you?
> 
>  Yes.
> >>>
> >>> Part of the incubation process is to gather what's the team working on
> it.
> >>> https://community.kde.org/Incubator/Projects/DescriptionTemplate
> >>>
> >>> It feels wrong to incubate a project that is already out of
> >>> development. Especially when we already have a number of music
> >>> players...
> >>
> >> Cantata isn't a "music player"
> >> it's the by far best MPD client
>

Reminder: KF6 Meeting

[Volker Krause]

Hello everyone,

please remember the KF6 meeting tomorrow, Tuesday 17:00 CET:
https://meet.kde.org/b/ada-mi8-aem

Topics and notes are collected here: 
https://invent.kde.org/teams/frameworks-devs/kf6-workboard/-/issues/29

Thank you,
Volker

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Re: Bringing Cantata under the KDE umbrella?

[Reindl Harald]

Am 20.02.23 um 15:18 schrieb Aleix Pol:

From a product description perspective it definitely is a music
player. MPD is an implementation detail.


that must be why the first page of the settings is "library" with the 
IP-Adress of your mpd server and other then you i am using mpd/canata 
for many years :-)


https://github.com/CDrummond/cantata
About: Qt5 Graphical MPD Client

don't get me wrong but do you even know what MPD is?
https://www.musicpd.org/

a music player / server without any interface, the interface is by 
definition a seperate application like canatata or android apps 
connecting to mpd via tcp which can run on localhost but don't need to



Am 20.02.23 um 13:18 schrieb Aleix Pol:

On Mon, Feb 20, 2023 at 12:28 AM Heiko Becker  wrote:


On Sunday, 19 February 2023 23:36:22 CET, Albert Astals Cid wrote:

El diumenge, 19 de febrer de 2023, a les 16:29:24 (CET), Heiko Becker va
escriure:

Cantata is a Qt based MPD client, which was archived by its
original author
[1]. I started some porting to Qt6 but I wondered (and was asked in
#kde-devel today) if it would make sense to move it to KDE's
infrastructure? Despite being archived, it still works quite
nicely. And ...


My only 2 concerns are:

   * Is anyone going to work on it? I guess you?


Yes.


Part of the incubation process is to gather what's the team working on it.
https://community.kde.org/Incubator/Projects/DescriptionTemplate

It feels wrong to incubate a project that is already out of
development. Especially when we already have a number of music
players...


Cantata isn't a "music player"
it's the by far best MPD client

Re: Bringing Cantata under the KDE umbrella?

[Aleix Pol]

>From a product description perspective it definitely is a music
player. MPD is an implementation detail.

On Mon, Feb 20, 2023 at 1:21 PM Reindl Harald  wrote:
>
>
>
> Am 20.02.23 um 13:18 schrieb Aleix Pol:
> > On Mon, Feb 20, 2023 at 12:28 AM Heiko Becker  wrote:
> >>
> >> On Sunday, 19 February 2023 23:36:22 CET, Albert Astals Cid wrote:
> >>> El diumenge, 19 de febrer de 2023, a les 16:29:24 (CET), Heiko Becker va
> >>> escriure:
>  Cantata is a Qt based MPD client, which was archived by its
>  original author
>  [1]. I started some porting to Qt6 but I wondered (and was asked in
>  #kde-devel today) if it would make sense to move it to KDE's
>  infrastructure? Despite being archived, it still works quite
>  nicely. And ...
> >>>
> >>> My only 2 concerns are:
> >>>
> >>>   * Is anyone going to work on it? I guess you?
> >>
> >> Yes.
> >
> > Part of the incubation process is to gather what's the team working on it.
> > https://community.kde.org/Incubator/Projects/DescriptionTemplate
> >
> > It feels wrong to incubate a project that is already out of
> > development. Especially when we already have a number of music
> > players...
>
> Cantata isn't a "music player"
> it's the by far best MPD client

Re: Bringing Cantata under the KDE umbrella?

[Aleix Pol]

Correct, so does KDE have what was missing in Cantata's github that
drove its contributors away?

On Mon, Feb 20, 2023 at 2:17 PM Neal Gompa  wrote:
>
> On Mon, Feb 20, 2023 at 7:18 AM Aleix Pol  wrote:
> >
> > On Mon, Feb 20, 2023 at 12:28 AM Heiko Becker  wrote:
> > >
> > > On Sunday, 19 February 2023 23:36:22 CET, Albert Astals Cid wrote:
> > > > El diumenge, 19 de febrer de 2023, a les 16:29:24 (CET), Heiko Becker va
> > > > escriure:
> > > >> Cantata is a Qt based MPD client, which was archived by its
> > > >> original author
> > > >> [1]. I started some porting to Qt6 but I wondered (and was asked in
> > > >> #kde-devel today) if it would make sense to move it to KDE's
> > > >> infrastructure? Despite being archived, it still works quite
> > > >> nicely. And ...
> > > >
> > > > My only 2 concerns are:
> > > >
> > > >  * Is anyone going to work on it? I guess you?
> > >
> > > Yes.
> >
> > Part of the incubation process is to gather what's the team working on it.
> > https://community.kde.org/Incubator/Projects/DescriptionTemplate
> >
> > It feels wrong to incubate a project that is already out of
> > development. Especially when we already have a number of music
> > players...
> >
>
> It's not without precedent though, didn't it happen with NeoChat,
> which forked from Spectral?
>
>
>
> --
> 真実はいつも一つ！/ Always, there's only one truth!

Re: Bringing Cantata under the KDE umbrella?

[Neal Gompa]

On Mon, Feb 20, 2023 at 7:18 AM Aleix Pol  wrote:
>
> On Mon, Feb 20, 2023 at 12:28 AM Heiko Becker  wrote:
> >
> > On Sunday, 19 February 2023 23:36:22 CET, Albert Astals Cid wrote:
> > > El diumenge, 19 de febrer de 2023, a les 16:29:24 (CET), Heiko Becker va
> > > escriure:
> > >> Cantata is a Qt based MPD client, which was archived by its
> > >> original author
> > >> [1]. I started some porting to Qt6 but I wondered (and was asked in
> > >> #kde-devel today) if it would make sense to move it to KDE's
> > >> infrastructure? Despite being archived, it still works quite
> > >> nicely. And ...
> > >
> > > My only 2 concerns are:
> > >
> > >  * Is anyone going to work on it? I guess you?
> >
> > Yes.
>
> Part of the incubation process is to gather what's the team working on it.
> https://community.kde.org/Incubator/Projects/DescriptionTemplate
>
> It feels wrong to incubate a project that is already out of
> development. Especially when we already have a number of music
> players...
>

It's not without precedent though, didn't it happen with NeoChat,
which forked from Spectral?



-- 
真実はいつも一つ！/ Always, there's only one truth!

Re: Bringing Cantata under the KDE umbrella?

[Reindl Harald]

Am 20.02.23 um 13:18 schrieb Aleix Pol:

On Mon, Feb 20, 2023 at 12:28 AM Heiko Becker  wrote:


On Sunday, 19 February 2023 23:36:22 CET, Albert Astals Cid wrote:

El diumenge, 19 de febrer de 2023, a les 16:29:24 (CET), Heiko Becker va
escriure:

Cantata is a Qt based MPD client, which was archived by its
original author
[1]. I started some porting to Qt6 but I wondered (and was asked in
#kde-devel today) if it would make sense to move it to KDE's
infrastructure? Despite being archived, it still works quite
nicely. And ...


My only 2 concerns are:

  * Is anyone going to work on it? I guess you?


Yes.


Part of the incubation process is to gather what's the team working on it.
https://community.kde.org/Incubator/Projects/DescriptionTemplate

It feels wrong to incubate a project that is already out of
development. Especially when we already have a number of music
players...


Cantata isn't a "music player"
it's the by far best MPD client

Re: Bringing Cantata under the KDE umbrella?

[Aleix Pol]

On Mon, Feb 20, 2023 at 12:28 AM Heiko Becker  wrote:
>
> On Sunday, 19 February 2023 23:36:22 CET, Albert Astals Cid wrote:
> > El diumenge, 19 de febrer de 2023, a les 16:29:24 (CET), Heiko Becker va
> > escriure:
> >> Cantata is a Qt based MPD client, which was archived by its
> >> original author
> >> [1]. I started some porting to Qt6 but I wondered (and was asked in
> >> #kde-devel today) if it would make sense to move it to KDE's
> >> infrastructure? Despite being archived, it still works quite
> >> nicely. And ...
> >
> > My only 2 concerns are:
> >
> >  * Is anyone going to work on it? I guess you?
>
> Yes.

Part of the incubation process is to gather what's the team working on it.
https://community.kde.org/Incubator/Projects/DescriptionTemplate

It feels wrong to incubate a project that is already out of
development. Especially when we already have a number of music
players...

Aleix