Re: KDE Frameworks & Plasma 5.8 LTS

[Dominik Haumann]

On Sun, Oct 23, 2016 at 2:03 PM, Luca Beltrame  wrote:
> Il giorno Sun, 23 Oct 2016 12:14:51 +0200
> Dominik Haumann  ha scritto:
>
>> Do we have any knowledge on whether distributions that ship Plasma 5.8
>> LTS still provide updates to KDE Frameworks 5.27 etc?
>
> openSUSE Tumbleweed will always have the last version of everything
> (barring issues). openSUSE Leap 42.2 will *not* get any major version
> update, so it will stick with Plasma 5.8 and KF 5.26.

If this decision has been made, this is fine.

Still, do you provide minor patches to KF 5.26?

And if so, where do you maintain these patches? Would it make sense to
share this in a public repo?

Greetings
Dominik

Re: KDE Frameworks & Plasma 5.8 LTS

[Dominik Haumann]

Hi Martin,

On Sun, Oct 23, 2016 at 12:38 PM, Martin Steigerwald
 wrote:
> Hi Dominik.
>
> Am Sonntag, 23. Oktober 2016, 12:14:51 CEST schrieb Dominik Haumann:
>> at the Frameworks BoF, the idea was raised to provide updates for the
>> KDE Frameworks 5.26 release, since this is the one that also is
>> typically shipped with the KDE Plasma 5.8 LTS version (at least, that
>> was the argument).
>>
>> Do we follow up on this?
>
> If you want to gather feedback what current distros use, it may make sense to
> also ask on distributions mailing list. I just found your mail as I monitor
> kde-frameworks-ml to some extent.
>
> If its just internal… and you do not intend to gather feedback from distros…
> please disregard my mail.

Actually it's not internal. In fact, I think we can only have a KF
5.26 if distros actively take over part of the maintainership, since
most developers work and test against newest KF version.

But would be nice to gather some infos here as well.

Greetings
Dominik

Re: KDE Frameworks & Plasma 5.8 LTS

[Dominik Haumann]

On Mon, Oct 24, 2016 at 1:47 PM, Ivan Čukić  wrote:
>> 2. We provide KF 5.26.1
>
> This would mean that we should also provide 5.27.1 (and .2, .3) for the
> distros that use KF 5.27 with the LTS release.

I don't think so: As I understand, the distros using KF 5.27 with
Plasma 5.8 LTS plan to continuously update, which is good. So no need
for additional minor releases.

> I'd love to have distros to **properly update KF** during the 5.8 LTS life,
> but if we can not get them to do so, I agree that we need to find an
> alternative.
> [...]

Let's try to get some facts:
1. we only unit test the latest KF on build.kde.org.
2. we typically develop and test against latest KF, so if we patch KF
5.26, it is likely not well / broadly tested.
3. given limited resources / man-power, maintaining additional KF
releases is not easy
4. With a LTS version we'd communicate our commitment to a
well-maintained KF version.

Given these constraints, having a stable KF 5.26 would mean to only
put critical patches into this branch.

It indeed would be much better to convince the distributions to update
continuously and work with KDE upstream. This seems to be the case for
some distributions, which is nice. However, if distributions decide
(for whatever reason) to go with KF 5.26, then we need to work with
them.

Maybe the most convenient way would be to let the distributions commit
the patches into the KF 5.26 branch, i.e. the distributions take over
part of the maintainership.

Greetings
Dominik

Re: KDE Frameworks & Plasma 5.8 LTS

[Ivan Čukić]

> 2. We provide KF 5.26.1

This would mean that we should also provide 5.27.1 (and .2, .3) for the
distros that use KF 5.27 with the LTS release.

I'd love to have distros to **properly update KF** during the 5.8 LTS life,
but if we can not get them to do so, I agree that we need to find an
alternative.

Keeping a list of bug-fix patches is one option, but we would need to keep
the list for each future release of KF which might be problematic. But,
if we had a common place to put them, it might be an OK option.

The same would go for the point releases. It would require some additional
work to tag the point releases in Git.

I think the list of patches might be easier to pull off -- we would not
need to provide releases for all frameworks -- just for those that need
to be updated. This way, the distros would know which ones need updating
at all.

Cheers,
Ivan

--

KDE, ivan.cu...@kde.org, http://cukic.co/
gpg key fingerprint: 8FE4 D32F 7061 EA9C 8232  07AE 01C6 CE2B FF04 1C12

Re: KDE Frameworks & Plasma 5.8 LTS

[Albert Astals Cid]

El dilluns, 24 d’octubre de 2016, a les 0:38:34 CEST, šumski va escriure:
> On Sunday 23 of October 2016 22:50:13 Albert Astals Cid wrote:
> > El diumenge, 23 d’octubre de 2016, a les 14:03:28 CEST, Luca Beltrame va
> > 
> > escriure:
> > > Il giorno Sun, 23 Oct 2016 12:14:51 +0200
> > > 
> > > Dominik Haumann  ha scritto:
> > > > Do we have any knowledge on whether distributions that ship Plasma 5.8
> > > > LTS still provide updates to KDE Frameworks 5.27 etc?
> > > 
> > > openSUSE Tumbleweed will always have the last version of everything
> > > (barring issues). openSUSE Leap 42.2 will *not* get any major version
> > > update, so it will stick with Plasma 5.8 and KF 5.26.
> > 
> > I don't really understand why you would want to stay with a KF version
> > that
> > has known bugs fixed in later versions, but i guess that's what stability
> > means nowadays :)
> 
> I don't really understand why you would want to upgrade to a KF5 version
> which has known bugs not present in earlier version -> is what the release
> managers are thinking =)

You're saying that we create more regressions than bugfixes? Can you share 
such data?

Cheers,
  Albert

> 
> 
> Cheers,
> Hrvoje
> 
> > Cheers,
> > 
> >   Albert

Re: KDE Frameworks & Plasma 5.8 LTS

[šumski]

On Sunday 23 of October 2016 22:50:13 Albert Astals Cid wrote:
> El diumenge, 23 d’octubre de 2016, a les 14:03:28 CEST, Luca Beltrame va
> 
> escriure:
> > Il giorno Sun, 23 Oct 2016 12:14:51 +0200
> > 
> > Dominik Haumann  ha scritto:
> > > Do we have any knowledge on whether distributions that ship Plasma 5.8
> > > LTS still provide updates to KDE Frameworks 5.27 etc?
> > 
> > openSUSE Tumbleweed will always have the last version of everything
> > (barring issues). openSUSE Leap 42.2 will *not* get any major version
> > update, so it will stick with Plasma 5.8 and KF 5.26.
> 
> I don't really understand why you would want to stay with a KF version that
> has known bugs fixed in later versions, but i guess that's what stability
> means nowadays :)

I don't really understand why you would want to upgrade to a KF5 version which 
has known bugs not present in earlier version -> is what the release managers 
are thinking =)


Cheers,
Hrvoje

> Cheers,
>   Albert

Re: KDE Frameworks & Plasma 5.8 LTS

[Albert Astals Cid]

El diumenge, 23 d’octubre de 2016, a les 14:03:28 CEST, Luca Beltrame va 
escriure:
> Il giorno Sun, 23 Oct 2016 12:14:51 +0200
> 
> Dominik Haumann  ha scritto:
> > Do we have any knowledge on whether distributions that ship Plasma 5.8
> > LTS still provide updates to KDE Frameworks 5.27 etc?
> 
> openSUSE Tumbleweed will always have the last version of everything
> (barring issues). openSUSE Leap 42.2 will *not* get any major version
> update, so it will stick with Plasma 5.8 and KF 5.26.

I don't really understand why you would want to stay with a KF version that 
has known bugs fixed in later versions, but i guess that's what stability 
means nowadays :)

Cheers,
  Albert

Re: KDE Frameworks & Plasma 5.8 LTS

[Martin Steigerwald]

Am Sonntag, 23. Oktober 2016, 12:20:49 CEST schrieb Nicolas Lécureuil:
> Le 2016-10-23 12:14, Dominik Haumann a écrit :
[…]
> > at the Frameworks BoF, the idea was raised to provide updates for the
> > KDE Frameworks 5.26 release, since this is the one that also is
> > typically shipped with the KDE Plasma 5.8 LTS version (at least, that
> > was the argument).
> > 
> > Do we follow up on this?
> > 
> > Do we have any knowledge on whether distributions that ship Plasma 5.8
> > LTS still provide updates to KDE Frameworks 5.27 etc?
> 
> In mageia we provide KF 5.27.0 and plasma 5.8 LTS.

Debian Sid also already has KF 5.27, together with Plasma 5.8.2 currently, on 
top of Qt 5.6.1 with Qt 5.7 in experimental (not sure whether that will be 
considered for Stretch at the moment, using 5.6 has the benefit of using an LTS 
release of Qt).

Thanks,
-- 
Martin

Re: KDE Frameworks & Plasma 5.8 LTS

[Martin Steigerwald]

Hi Dominik.

Am Sonntag, 23. Oktober 2016, 12:14:51 CEST schrieb Dominik Haumann:
> at the Frameworks BoF, the idea was raised to provide updates for the
> KDE Frameworks 5.26 release, since this is the one that also is
> typically shipped with the KDE Plasma 5.8 LTS version (at least, that
> was the argument).
> 
> Do we follow up on this?

If you want to gather feedback what current distros use, it may make sense to 
also ask on distributions mailing list. I just found your mail as I monitor 
kde-frameworks-ml to some extent.

If its just internal… and you do not intend to gather feedback from distros… 
please disregard my mail.

Thanks,
-- 
Martin

Re: KDE Frameworks & Plasma 5.8 LTS

[Luca Beltrame]

Il giorno Sun, 23 Oct 2016 12:14:51 +0200
Dominik Haumann  ha scritto:

> Do we have any knowledge on whether distributions that ship Plasma 5.8
> LTS still provide updates to KDE Frameworks 5.27 etc?

openSUSE Tumbleweed will always have the last version of everything
(barring issues). openSUSE Leap 42.2 will *not* get any major version
update, so it will stick with Plasma 5.8 and KF 5.26.

-- 
Luca Beltrame - KDE Forums team
GPG key ID: A29D259B


pgp79DaGH19rA.pgp
Description: Firma digitale OpenPGP

Re: KDE Frameworks & Plasma 5.8 LTS

[Nicolas Lécureuil]

Le 2016-10-23 12:14, Dominik Haumann a écrit :

Hi,

at the Frameworks BoF, the idea was raised to provide updates for the
KDE Frameworks 5.26 release, since this is the one that also is
typically shipped with the KDE Plasma 5.8 LTS version (at least, that
was the argument).

Do we follow up on this?

Do we have any knowledge on whether distributions that ship Plasma 5.8
LTS still provide updates to KDE Frameworks 5.27 etc?


In mageia we provide KF 5.27.0 and plasma 5.8 LTS.

--
Regards,
Nicolas Lécureuil
Mageia KDE Team

KDE Frameworks & Plasma 5.8 LTS

[Dominik Haumann]

Hi,

at the Frameworks BoF, the idea was raised to provide updates for the
KDE Frameworks 5.26 release, since this is the one that also is
typically shipped with the KDE Plasma 5.8 LTS version (at least, that
was the argument).

Do we follow up on this?

Do we have any knowledge on whether distributions that ship Plasma 5.8
LTS still provide updates to KDE Frameworks 5.27 etc?

There are two issues in KTextEditor 5.26 release that are not so nice
- that's why I'm asking.

For use, there are two solutions:
1. We just write to kde-distro-packagers to cherry-pick certain git commits
2. We provide KF 5.26.1

Both is fine for me ;)

Greetings
Dominik