Re: [libreoffice-l10n] [BUG] Fomula SYD description
On 07/20/2013 06:31 PM, Mirosław Zalewski wrote: Personally, I favor precise and hermetic language. People who need certain information will understand; people who don't, they don't care. That's elitism and is wrong, really wrong. Precision doesn't mean it has to be hermetic. People how know, don't need help. Don't you find contradictory to write _help_ in hermetic language? I'm not Calc user, but sometimes I do use it - and help witch doesn't help is worthless. Bunch of (techno)babble is hard to translete (even impossible sometimes), and hermetic _help_ can't really help user who is not skilled in English. If you have something which is hard to translate and understand in original is something which no one can benefit from. I know you didn't meant anything wrong, it's just a concern from part time Calc user. Sincerely, Krunoslav -- To unsubscribe e-mail to: l10n+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/l10n/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-l10n] [BUG] Fomula SYD description
Hi :) I have encouraged a few native-English speakers to join this list with the aim of 1. translating from geek or 2. smoothing out clunky English phrases that look like translations from other languages However, since they joined there have been no further requests for individual strings to be re-done in English. We had 'loads' of emails for a month or 2 but then suddenly nothing. Is there somewhere we could look through all the strings that get translated? Sadly i didn't manage to get many people to join this time and those that did do not have a high level of technical skill with the sorts of systems you find easy. I was hoping that more of the confusing strings would appear in the mailing list and that the technical side would be handled by the rest of you. Still, point us in the right direction and be gentle with us and then we/they might be able to help. Btw i wasn't clear what was meant by hermetic so i looked it up (even though context made it clear what the person meant by it) and got this from wikipedia http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hermetic No language is truly hermetic. Even pure maths can be ambiguous. It's part of the reason we need programming languages and things such as wiki-mark-up to communicate with machines. However, even they have moments of confusion or imprecision. We all just try to do a reasonably good job, in the time available, to make it easier for normal humans to read and we hope that the people following after us are able to improve on it if they need to. Regards from Tom :) From: Krunoslav Šebetić kruno0...@gmail.com To: l10n@global.libreoffice.org Sent: Sunday, 21 July 2013, 9:26 Subject: Re: [libreoffice-l10n] [BUG] Fomula SYD description On 07/20/2013 06:31 PM, Mirosław Zalewski wrote: Personally, I favour precise and hermetic language. People who need certain information will understand; people who don't, they don't care. That's elitism and is wrong, really wrong. Precision doesn't mean it has to be hermetic. People who know how, don't need help. Don't you find contradictory to write _help_ in hermetic language? I'm not Calc user, but sometimes I do use it - and help which doesn't help is worthless. Bunch of (techno)babble is hard to translate (even impossible sometimes), and hermetic _help_ can't really help user who is not skilled in English. If you have something which is hard to translate and understand in original is something which no one can benefit from. I know you didn't meant anything wrong, it's just a concern from part time Calc user. Sincerely, Krunoslav -- To unsubscribe e-mail to: l10n+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/l10n/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Errors in help pages
Hi :)
For the non-geeks, stripping out the coding gives us
Insert mode is enabled.
The text cursor is a blinking vertical line.
Click on the area to enable the overwrite mode.
Insert mode is enabled. When in Writer
The text cursor is a blinking vertical line.
Click on the area to enable the overwrite mode.
The overwrite mode is enabled.
The text cursor is a blinking block.
Click on the area to enable insert mode.
The overwrite mode is enabled. When in
Wrtiter The text cursor is a blinking block.
Click on the area to enable insert mode.
I think even after correcting 'obvious' typos the paragraphs are still unclear.
What is the area that it is saying needs to be clicked on? Why not just
press the insert key on the keyboard? A couple of the paragraphs specify
Writer but surely the same thing happens in the other apps/modules?
Perhaps a better generic paragraph would be something like;
When using insert mode
the text-cursor is a blinking block, █ .
Clicking on {the area} toggles the mode back to insert mode.
When using overwrite mode
the text-cursor is a blinking vertical line, | .
Clicking on {the area} toggles the mode back to insert mode.
Errr, i couldn't find a decent block but the vertical line is on the keyboard,
either around the Enter key or off to the far left besides the shift key.
Regards from
Tom :)
From: Sérgio Marques smarque...@gmail.com
To: Libreoffice Translation List l10n@global.libreoffice.org
Sent: Sunday, 21 July 2013, 1:44
Subject: [libreoffice-l10n] Errors in help pages
Insert mode is enabled. switchinline select=applcaseinline
select=WRITERThe text cursor is a blinking vertical line. /caseinline
/switchinlineClick on the area to enable the overwrite mode.
In help page wiki:
Insert mode is enabled. switchinline select=applWhen in Writercaseinline
select=WRITERThe text cursor is a blinking vertical line. /caseinline
/switchinlineClick on the area to enable the overwrite mode.
The overwrite mode is enabled. switchinline select=applcaseinline
select=WRITERThe text cursor is a blinking block. /caseinline
/switchinlineClick on the area to enable insert mode.
In help page wiki:
The overwrite mode is enabled. switchinline select=applWhen in
Wrtitercaseinline
select=WRITERThe text cursor is a blinking block. /caseinline
/switchinlineClick on the area to enable insert mode.
--
Sérgio Marques
--
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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Function IRR description
Hi :) Sorry i am not completely clear about 2 crucial things 1. What is the string as is? 2. What is the suggested alternative? I couldn't find the Oasis definitions and i loathe looking through MS Office anything. The link given seems to be specifically about healthcare but may not have been written by someone that really knows what they are talking about. I tried looking for something more generic and found this hopelessly detailed page in wikipedia http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Actuarial_science also this unclear (and also long-winded) definition http://www.investopedia.com/terms/a/actuarial-valuation.asp and this one http://definitions.uslegal.com/a/actuarial-value/ Would it be safer to just rewrite the equation it uses but rewrite in English? (probably not but sometimes it helps) Regards from Tom :) From: Sérgio Marques smarque...@gmail.com To: Mihovil Stanic mihovil.sta...@gmail.com Cc: LibreOffice-l10n l10n@global.libreoffice.org Sent: Sunday, 21 July 2013, 1:31 Subject: Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Function IRR description Actuarial value is mostly used in finance and insurance. Actuarial value is a measure of the percentage of expected health care costs a specific health plan will cover for the standard population. Actuarial value is generally calculated using the ratio of: *the total expected payments by the plan for essential health benefits* *__ * *the total expected costs of the standard population for essential health benefits * It´s the discipline that uses statistics and math in the way to determine risk and income (cash flow) and try to establish the present value of future cash flows. In a way it´s similar to TIR. http://www.zanebenefits.com/blog/bid/252609/What-is-Actuarial-Value-AV Regards 2013/7/20 Mihovil Stanic mihovil.sta...@gmail.com https://translations.**documentfoundation.org/hr/**libo_ui/sc/source/ui/** translate.html#unit=29744374https://translations.documentfoundation.org/hr/libo_ui/sc/source/ui/translate.html#unit=29744374 Currect desc: Returns the actuarial rate of interest of an investment excluding costs or profits. Oasis desc = MS Office desc: Compute the internal rate of return for a series of cash flows. http://docs.oasis-open.org/**office/v1.2/os/OpenDocument-** v1.2-os-part2.html#IRRhttp://docs.oasis-open.org/office/v1.2/os/OpenDocument-v1.2-os-part2.html#IRR I for one studied economics and had a hard time finding out what actuarial means... As far as I understood it it's math based on statistics and probabilities. That can be in some way applied to this formula, but it's t complicated description. Why can't it be just like it's in Oasis and MS Office? I also think that string should be as ODFF states. My translation states that way. I must say that many of descriptions were changed in my translations. Regards -- Sérgio Marques -- To unsubscribe e-mail to: l10n+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/l10n/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Function IRR description
2013/7/21 Tom Davies tomdavie...@yahoo.co.uk Hi :) Sorry i am not completely clear about 2 crucial things 1. What is the string as is? Returns the actuarial rate of interest of an investment excluding costs or profits 2. What is the suggested alternative? Compute the internal rate of return for a series of cash flows Stated by ODFF. I couldn't find the Oasis definitions and i loathe looking through MS Office anything. The link given seems to be specifically about healthcare but may not have been written by someone that really knows what they are talking about. I tried looking for something more generic and found this hopelessly detailed page in wikipedia http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Actuarial_science also this unclear (and also long-winded) definition http://www.investopedia.com/terms/a/actuarial-valuation.asp and this one http://definitions.uslegal.com/a/actuarial-value/ Would it be safer to just rewrite the equation it uses but rewrite in English? (probably not but sometimes it helps) Regards from Tom :) -- Sérgio Marques -- To unsubscribe e-mail to: l10n+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/l10n/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-l10n] [BUG] Fomula SYD description
On 21/07/2013 at 10:26, Krunoslav Šebetić kruno0...@gmail.com wrote: Precision doesn't mean it has to be hermetic. People how know, don't need help. Don't you find contradictory to write _help_ in hermetic language? Yes, no and no. First thing: by hermetic I mean understood by people with some preliminary knowledge about certain subject. Precise language does not have to be hermetic, agreed. But being hermetic is often the most efficient way to precisely communicate what you mean. Moreover, it is generally safe to use, because it is highly unlikely that someone without presumed knowledge will even look there. Example. When you write statistical software, you don't explain in help what median is, or how chi-square test is computed and how it could be used. You expect your users to know that. The reason is simple: someone without that knowledge wouldn't even bother to install statistical package. It is the same case with SYD function. It is fine that it's description is not understood by general audience, because general audience has no knowledge about investments. In turn, general audience has no use of this function. Any effort put into lowering entry barrier of usage of this function (e.g. by explaining what amount of depreciation is) would be wasted anyway. It all boils down to defining your target audience and purpose of help. I, for one, think that help is supposed to help you in using this particular implementation, not teach you general concept. People who do understand general concept still need help. Let's take QUARTILE function as example. If you know what quartile is, you still need help to tell you what arguments can be passed to function, in what order and what are acceptable values of them. In fact, this is a way that most of Calc help has been written. Take a look at ACOS help description. It will be useless if you don't know what trigonometric, cosine and radians are. But then, what possible use could you make of ACOS function if you don't know what trigonometric is? This is by no way elitism. There are bunch of sources that can teach you about general concept, like Wikipedia, online courses, schools, universities, bookstores and libraries. There is no need for Calc help to duplicate that effort. To sum up: - Being hermetic is fine. - Help for particular function should be understood by people who need it. We can safely assume they do have some preliminary knowledge. - If help is not understood by specialists, then there is a problem. I'm fine with anyone taking different course and making Calc help a teaching resource. But that persone should prepare for a awful lot of work. -- Best regards Mirosław Zalewski -- To unsubscribe e-mail to: l10n+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/l10n/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-l10n] [BUG] Fomula SYD description
But what about providing some clues in the help for those who know what they want but are unacquainted with the developing system in the first place? Your approach leaves too high entry threshold. Continuing with the Calc functions, I might know what statistical distributions are but to find the concrete function I'd still turn to the search function, to which I'll feed a set of plain English words which I would expect to be in description. -Yury On 07/21/2013 03:17 PM, Mirosław Zalewski wrote: On 21/07/2013 at 10:26, Krunoslav Šebetić kruno0...@gmail.com wrote: Precision doesn't mean it has to be hermetic. People how know, don't need help. Don't you find contradictory to write _help_ in hermetic language? Yes, no and no. First thing: by hermetic I mean understood by people with some preliminary knowledge about certain subject. Precise language does not have to be hermetic, agreed. But being hermetic is often the most efficient way to precisely communicate what you mean. Moreover, it is generally safe to use, because it is highly unlikely that someone without presumed knowledge will even look there. ... -- To unsubscribe e-mail to: l10n+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/l10n/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Function IRR description
Hi :) Thanks :) I think Computes the internal rate of return for a series of cash flows is a minor improvement on the 2nd one. Neither make any sense to me but some background reading about the topic made it clear i would never understand enough to get a short simple sentence. The 2nd one suggests that the function can handle a number of inputs and then generate a single output value. The first suggests that you have got to put in several different parameters in order to get a single output value. Regards from Tom :) From: Sérgio Marques smarque...@gmail.com To: Tom Davies tomdavie...@yahoo.co.uk Cc: Mihovil Stanic mihovil.sta...@gmail.com; LibreOffice-l10n l10n@global.libreoffice.org Sent: Sunday, 21 July 2013, 12:58 Subject: Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Function IRR description 2013/7/21 Tom Davies tomdavie...@yahoo.co.uk Hi :) Sorry i am not completely clear about 2 crucial things 1. What is the string as is? Returns the actuarial rate of interest of an investment excluding costs or profits 2. What is the suggested alternative? Compute the internal rate of return for a series of cash flows Stated by ODFF. I couldn't find the Oasis definitions and i loathe looking through MS Office anything. The link given seems to be specifically about healthcare but may not have been written by someone that really knows what they are talking about. I tried looking for something more generic and found this hopelessly detailed page in wikipedia http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Actuarial_science also this unclear (and also long-winded) definition http://www.investopedia.com/terms/a/actuarial-valuation.asp and this one http://definitions.uslegal.com/a/actuarial-value/ Would it be safer to just rewrite the equation it uses but rewrite in English? (probably not but sometimes it helps) Regards from Tom :) -- Sérgio Marques -- To unsubscribe e-mail to: l10n+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/l10n/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted -- To unsubscribe e-mail to: l10n+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/l10n/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-l10n] [BUG] Fomula SYD description
Well, I gave you few. :) To find more I would have to proof read all calc formulas and I'm not really sure I want to do that. I see a lot of errors of cosmetical type in Calc, which I'm notreporting. Things like consistency.In some formulas you have nper/ npery / NPER / NPERY , some strings start with capital letter others don't. Some strings end with dot, others don't. I'm not reporting that since it isn't affectingfunctionality of program and I would spam this list all day long. :) Maybe someone can tackle that in his free time if he things it's worth fixing, but except cosmetical value nothing will be gained. Dana 21.7.2013. 12:08, Tom Davies je napisao: Hi :) I have encouraged a few native-English speakers to join this list with the aim of 1. translating from geek or 2. smoothing out clunky English phrases that look like translations from other languages However, since they joined there have been no further requests for individual strings to be re-done in English. We had 'loads' of emails for a month or 2 but then suddenly nothing. Is there somewhere we could look through all the strings that get translated? Sadly i didn't manage to get many people to join this time and those that did do not have a high level of technical skill with the sorts of systems you find easy. I was hoping that more of the confusing strings would appear in the mailing list and that the technical side would be handled by the rest of you. Still, point us in the right direction and be gentle with us and then we/they might be able to help. Btw i wasn't clear what was meant by hermetic so i looked it up (even though context made it clear what the person meant by it) and got this from wikipedia http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hermetic No language is truly hermetic. Even pure maths can be ambiguous. It's part of the reason we need programming languages and things such as wiki-mark-up to communicate with machines. However, even they have moments of confusion or imprecision. We all just try to do a reasonably good job, in the time available, to make it easier for normal humans to read and we hope that the people following after us are able to improve on it if they need to. Regards from Tom :) From: Krunoslav Šebetić kruno0...@gmail.com To: l10n@global.libreoffice.org Sent: Sunday, 21 July 2013, 9:26 Subject: Re: [libreoffice-l10n] [BUG] Fomula SYD description On 07/20/2013 06:31 PM, Mirosław Zalewski wrote: Personally, I favour precise and hermetic language. People who need certain information will understand; people who don't, they don't care. That's elitism and is wrong, really wrong. Precision doesn't mean it has to be hermetic. People who know how, don't need help. Don't you find contradictory to write _help_ in hermetic language? I'm not Calc user, but sometimes I do use it - and help which doesn't help is worthless. Bunch of (techno)babble is hard to translate (even impossible sometimes), and hermetic _help_ can't really help user who is not skilled in English. If you have something which is hard to translate and understand in original is something which no one can benefit from. I know you didn't meant anything wrong, it's just a concern from part time Calc user. Sincerely, Krunoslav -- To unsubscribe e-mail to: l10n+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/l10n/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Function IRR description
Hi Tom Best to see for yourself what IRR is. http://www.investopedia.com/terms/i/irr.asp 2013/7/21 Tom Davies tomdavie...@yahoo.co.uk Hi :) Thanks :) I think Computes the internal rate of return for a series of cash flows is a minor improvement on the 2nd one. Neither make any sense to me but some background reading about the topic made it clear i would never understand enough to get a short simple sentence. The 2nd one suggests that the function can handle a number of inputs and then generate a single output value. The first suggests that you have got to put in several different parameters in order to get a single output value. Regards from Tom :) -- *From:* Sérgio Marques smarque...@gmail.com *To:* Tom Davies tomdavie...@yahoo.co.uk *Cc:* Mihovil Stanic mihovil.sta...@gmail.com; LibreOffice-l10n l10n@global.libreoffice.org *Sent:* Sunday, 21 July 2013, 12:58 *Subject:* Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Function IRR description 2013/7/21 Tom Davies tomdavie...@yahoo.co.uk Hi :) Sorry i am not completely clear about 2 crucial things 1. What is the string as is? Returns the actuarial rate of interest of an investment excluding costs or profits 2. What is the suggested alternative? Compute the internal rate of return for a series of cash flows Stated by ODFF. I couldn't find the Oasis definitions and i loathe looking through MS Office anything. The link given seems to be specifically about healthcare but may not have been written by someone that really knows what they are talking about. I tried looking for something more generic and found this hopelessly detailed page in wikipedia http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Actuarial_science also this unclear (and also long-winded) definition http://www.investopedia.com/terms/a/actuarial-valuation.asp and this one http://definitions.uslegal.com/a/actuarial-value/ Would it be safer to just rewrite the equation it uses but rewrite in English? (probably not but sometimes it helps) Regards from Tom :) -- Sérgio Marques -- To unsubscribe e-mail to: l10n+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/l10n/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted -- Sérgio Marques -- To unsubscribe e-mail to: l10n+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/l10n/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Errors in help pages
2013/7/21 Tom Davies tomdavie...@yahoo.co.uk
Hi :)
For the non-geeks, stripping out the coding gives us
Insert mode is enabled.
The text cursor is a blinking vertical line.
Click on the area to enable the overwrite mode.
Insert mode is enabled. When in Writer
The text cursor is a blinking vertical line.
Click on the area to enable the overwrite mode.
The overwrite mode is enabled.
The text cursor is a blinking block.
Click on the area to enable insert mode.
The overwrite mode is enabled. When in
Wrtiter The text cursor is a blinking block.
Click on the area to enable insert mode.
I think even after correcting 'obvious' typos the paragraphs are still
unclear. What is the area that it is saying needs to be clicked on? Why
not just press the insert key on the keyboard? A couple of the
paragraphs specify Writer but surely the same thing happens in the other
apps/modules?
My problem with this string is that Where in Writer does not appear for
translation. But it´s also true that the area is unclear.
Regards
Perhaps a better generic paragraph would be something like;
When using insert mode
the text-cursor is a blinking block, █ .
Clicking on {the area} toggles the mode back to insert mode.
When using overwrite mode
the text-cursor is a blinking vertical line, | .
Clicking on {the area} toggles the mode back to insert mode.
Errr, i couldn't find a decent block but the vertical line is on the
keyboard, either around the Enter key or off to the far left besides the
shift key.
Regards from
Tom :)
From: Sérgio Marques smarque...@gmail.com
To: Libreoffice Translation List l10n@global.libreoffice.org
Sent: Sunday, 21 July 2013, 1:44
Subject: [libreoffice-l10n] Errors in help pages
Insert mode is enabled. switchinline select=applcaseinline
select=WRITERThe text cursor is a blinking vertical line. /caseinline
/switchinlineClick on the area to enable the overwrite mode.
In help page wiki:
Insert mode is enabled. switchinline select=applWhen in
Writercaseinline
select=WRITERThe text cursor is a blinking vertical line. /caseinline
/switchinlineClick on the area to enable the overwrite mode.
The overwrite mode is enabled. switchinline select=applcaseinline
select=WRITERThe text cursor is a blinking block. /caseinline
/switchinlineClick on the area to enable insert mode.
In help page wiki:
The overwrite mode is enabled. switchinline select=applWhen in
Wrtitercaseinline
select=WRITERThe text cursor is a blinking block. /caseinline
/switchinlineClick on the area to enable insert mode.
--
Sérgio Marques
--
Sérgio Marques
--
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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Errors in help pages
Hi :)
+1
The When in Writer should be taken out of that 2nd and 4th examples.
I just quickly tested in all the apps except Base and it works the same in all
of them. In Calc you only notice it if the cursor is in the formula-bar /
function-bar, whatever you call that big 'white' field at the top where you
type in the contents of the cell if not typing directly into the cells! So, it
works in all of them (not just Writer).
Regards from
Tom :)
From: Sérgio Marques smarque...@gmail.com
To: Tom Davies tomdavie...@yahoo.co.uk
Cc: Libreoffice Translation List l10n@global.libreoffice.org
Sent: Sunday, 21 July 2013, 22:21
Subject: Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Errors in help pages
2013/7/21 Tom Davies tomdavie...@yahoo.co.uk
Hi :)
For the non-geeks, stripping out the coding gives us
Insert mode is enabled.
The text cursor is a blinking vertical line.
Click on the area to enable the overwrite mode.
Insert mode is enabled. When in Writer
The text cursor is a blinking vertical line.
Click on the area to enable the overwrite mode.
The overwrite mode is enabled.
The text cursor is a blinking block.
Click on the area to enable insert mode.
The overwrite mode is enabled. When in
Wrtiter The text cursor is a blinking block.
Click on the area to enable insert mode.
I think even after correcting 'obvious' typos the paragraphs are still
unclear. What is the area that it is saying needs to be clicked on? Why
not just press the insert key on the keyboard? A couple of the
paragraphs specify Writer but surely the same thing happens in the other
apps/modules?
My problem with this string is that Where in Writer does not appear for
translation. But it´s also true that the area is unclear.
Regards
Perhaps a better generic paragraph would be something like;
When using insert mode
the text-cursor is a blinking block, █ .
Clicking on {the area} toggles the mode back to insert mode.
When using overwrite mode
the text-cursor is a blinking vertical line, | .
Clicking on {the area} toggles the mode back to insert mode.
Errr, i couldn't find a decent block but the vertical line is on the
keyboard, either around the Enter key or off to the far left besides the
shift key.
Regards from
Tom :)
From: Sérgio Marques smarque...@gmail.com
To: Libreoffice Translation List l10n@global.libreoffice.org
Sent: Sunday, 21 July 2013, 1:44
Subject: [libreoffice-l10n] Errors in help pages
Insert mode is enabled. switchinline select=applcaseinline
select=WRITERThe text cursor is a blinking vertical line. /caseinline
/switchinlineClick on the area to enable the overwrite mode.
In help page wiki:
Insert mode is enabled. switchinline select=applWhen in
Writercaseinline
select=WRITERThe text cursor is a blinking vertical line. /caseinline
/switchinlineClick on the area to enable the overwrite mode.
The overwrite mode is enabled. switchinline select=applcaseinline
select=WRITERThe text cursor is a blinking block. /caseinline
/switchinlineClick on the area to enable insert mode.
In help page wiki:
The overwrite mode is enabled. switchinline select=applWhen in
Wrtitercaseinline
select=WRITERThe text cursor is a blinking block. /caseinline
/switchinlineClick on the area to enable insert mode.
--
Sérgio Marques
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Sérgio Marques
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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Errors in help pages
2013/7/21 Tom Davies tomdavie...@yahoo.co.uk
Hi :)
+1
The When in Writer should be taken out of that 2nd and 4th examples.
Or be added.
I just quickly tested in all the apps except Base and it works the same in
all of them. In Calc you only notice it if the cursor is in the
formula-bar / function-bar, whatever you call that big 'white' field at the
top where you type in the contents of the cell if not typing directly into
the cells! So, it works in all of them (not just Writer).
Regards from
Tom :)
If string is common, it´s best to remove instead of adding.
Regards
--
*From:* Sérgio Marques smarque...@gmail.com
*To:* Tom Davies tomdavie...@yahoo.co.uk
*Cc:* Libreoffice Translation List l10n@global.libreoffice.org
*Sent:* Sunday, 21 July 2013, 22:21
*Subject:* Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Errors in help pages
2013/7/21 Tom Davies tomdavie...@yahoo.co.uk
Hi :)
For the non-geeks, stripping out the coding gives us
Insert mode is enabled.
The text cursor is a blinking vertical line.
Click on the area to enable the overwrite mode.
Insert mode is enabled. When in Writer
The text cursor is a blinking vertical line.
Click on the area to enable the overwrite mode.
The overwrite mode is enabled.
The text cursor is a blinking block.
Click on the area to enable insert mode.
The overwrite mode is enabled. When in
Wrtiter The text cursor is a blinking block.
Click on the area to enable insert mode.
I think even after correcting 'obvious' typos the paragraphs are still
unclear. What is the area that it is saying needs to be clicked on?
Why
not just press the insert key on the keyboard? A couple of the
paragraphs specify Writer but surely the same thing happens in the other
apps/modules?
My problem with this string is that Where in Writer does not appear for
translation. But it´s also true that the area is unclear.
Regards
Perhaps a better generic paragraph would be something like;
When using insert mode
the text-cursor is a blinking block, █ .
Clicking on {the area} toggles the mode back to insert mode.
When using overwrite mode
the text-cursor is a blinking vertical line, | .
Clicking on {the area} toggles the mode back to insert mode.
Errr, i couldn't find a decent block but the vertical line is on the
keyboard, either around the Enter key or off to the far left besides the
shift key.
Regards from
Tom :)
From: Sérgio Marques smarque...@gmail.com
To: Libreoffice Translation List l10n@global.libreoffice.org
Sent: Sunday, 21 July 2013, 1:44
Subject: [libreoffice-l10n] Errors in help pages
Insert mode is enabled. switchinline select=applcaseinline
select=WRITERThe text cursor is a blinking vertical line.
/caseinline
/switchinlineClick on the area to enable the overwrite mode.
In help page wiki:
Insert mode is enabled. switchinline select=applWhen in
Writercaseinline
select=WRITERThe text cursor is a blinking vertical line.
/caseinline
/switchinlineClick on the area to enable the overwrite mode.
The overwrite mode is enabled. switchinline select=applcaseinline
select=WRITERThe text cursor is a blinking block. /caseinline
/switchinlineClick on the area to enable insert mode.
In help page wiki:
The overwrite mode is enabled. switchinline select=applWhen in
Wrtitercaseinline
select=WRITERThe text cursor is a blinking block. /caseinline
/switchinlineClick on the area to enable insert mode.
--
Sérgio Marques
--
Sérgio Marques
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Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Errors in help pages
Thanks, Sérgio, here we go: https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=67148 Lp, m. 2013/7/21 Sérgio Marques smarque...@gmail.com: Please check: https://help.libreoffice.org/Common/Switching_Between_Insert_Mode_and_Overwrite_Mode/sv https://help.libreoffice.org/Common/Switching_Between_Insert_Mode_and_Overwrite_Mode/ru https://help.libreoffice.org/Common/Switching_Between_Insert_Mode_and_Overwrite_Mode/ast -- To unsubscribe e-mail to: l10n+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/l10n/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Errors in help pages
2013/7/21 Martin Srebotnjak mi...@filmsi.net 2013/7/21 Sérgio Marques smarque...@gmail.com: My problem with this string is that Where in Writer does not appear for translation. But it´s also true that the area is unclear. Yeah, does that mean that string in English appears also on other wiki-help pages, like in Spanish, Slovenian etc.? That should be localizable, otherwise it is a serious bug. Lp, m. Yes it does. Please check: https://help.libreoffice.org/Common/Switching_Between_Insert_Mode_and_Overwrite_Mode/sv https://help.libreoffice.org/Common/Switching_Between_Insert_Mode_and_Overwrite_Mode/ru https://help.libreoffice.org/Common/Switching_Between_Insert_Mode_and_Overwrite_Mode/ast -- Sérgio Marques -- To unsubscribe e-mail to: l10n+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/l10n/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Errors in help pages
Thanks for the report. Regards 2013/7/21 Martin Srebotnjak mi...@filmsi.net Thanks, Sérgio, here we go: https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=67148 Lp, m. 2013/7/21 Sérgio Marques smarque...@gmail.com: Please check: https://help.libreoffice.org/Common/Switching_Between_Insert_Mode_and_Overwrite_Mode/sv https://help.libreoffice.org/Common/Switching_Between_Insert_Mode_and_Overwrite_Mode/ru https://help.libreoffice.org/Common/Switching_Between_Insert_Mode_and_Overwrite_Mode/ast -- Sérgio Marques -- To unsubscribe e-mail to: l10n+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/l10n/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Errors in help pages
Hi Tom, *, On Sun, Jul 21, 2013 at 12:44 PM, Tom Davies tomdavie...@yahoo.co.uk wrote: [...] The overwrite mode is enabled. When in Wrtiter The text cursor is a blinking block. Click on the area to enable insert mode. I think even after correcting 'obvious' typos the paragraphs are still unclear. What is the area that it is saying needs to be clicked on? The Indicator-area in the Statusbar that shows the status of overwrite mode. Why not just press the insert key on the keyboard? Many ways that lead to Rome.. But toggle with insert key and you should see the statusbar changing :-) ciao Christian -- To unsubscribe e-mail to: l10n+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/l10n/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Errors in help pages
Hi :) Thanks ! Good plan ! :) Now that i have found it i can't think of any better name than the area! I was hoping that some inspiration would leap out at me if i ever found the area but it didn't. Anyway i think i took this thread waaay off-topic and i am glad to see a few people have managed to get it back on-track. Btw It seems i have to double-click to get into Overwrite mode but just a single click to get back to insert mode. I think that is another side issue leading off-track again and most people will probably be able to work out that sort of thing. Regards from Tom :) From: Christian Lohmaier lohmaier+ooofut...@googlemail.com To: Tom Davies tomdavie...@yahoo.co.uk Cc: Sérgio Marques smarque...@gmail.com; Libreoffice Translation List l10n@global.libreoffice.org Sent: Sunday, 21 July 2013, 23:47 Subject: Re: [libreoffice-l10n] Errors in help pages Hi Tom, *, On Sun, Jul 21, 2013 at 12:44 PM, Tom Davies tomdavie...@yahoo.co.uk wrote: [...] The overwrite mode is enabled. When in Wrtiter The text cursor is a blinking block. Click on the area to enable insert mode. I think even after correcting 'obvious' typos the paragraphs are still unclear. What is the area that it is saying needs to be clicked on? The Indicator-area in the Statusbar that shows the status of overwrite mode. Why not just press the insert key on the keyboard? Many ways that lead to Rome.. But toggle with insert key and you should see the statusbar changing :-) ciao Christian -- To unsubscribe e-mail to: l10n+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/l10n/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted -- To unsubscribe e-mail to: l10n+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/l10n/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
[libreoffice-l10n] CRITBINOM function description is wrong
File: scalc/01.po Context: 04060183.xhp par_id3149254 49 help.txt Comments: yXdFy ahelp hid=HID_FUNC_KRITBINOMReturns the smallest value for which the cumulative binomial distribution is less than or equal to a criterion value. /ahelp Should be: ahelp hid=HID_FUNC_CRITBINOMReturns the smallest value for which the cumulative binomial distribution is greater than or equal to a criterion value./ahelp Also in: File: sc/source/ui/src.po Context: scfuncs.src RID_SC_FUNCTION_DESCRIPTIONS2.SC_OPCODE_KRIT_BINOM 1 string.text Comments: o6CUv Should be: Context: scfuncs.src RID_SC_FUNCTION_DESCRIPTIONS2.SC_OPCODE_CRIT_BINOM 1 string.text -- Sérgio Marques -- To unsubscribe e-mail to: l10n+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/l10n/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-l10n] CRITBINOM function description is wrong
Nice catch. Oasis says it's greater then http://docs.oasis-open.org/office/v1.2/os/OpenDocument-v1.2-os-part2.html#CRITBINOM MS Office says less then in function title description http://office.microsoft.com/en-us/excel-help/excel-functions-by-category-HA102752955.aspx?CTT=1 and then it says greater then in function description http://office.microsoft.com/en-us/excel-help/critbinom-function-HA102753199.aspx?CTT=5origin=HA102752955 LO says less then. Would be nice if someone could actually use this formula and say which is true. :) Best regards, Mihovil Dana 22.7.2013. 1:44, Sérgio Marques je napisao: File: scalc/01.po Context: 04060183.xhp par_id3149254 49 help.txt Comments: yXdFy ahelp hid=HID_FUNC_KRITBINOMReturns the smallest value for which the cumulative binomial distribution is less than or equal to a criterion value. /ahelp Should be: ahelp hid=HID_FUNC_CRITBINOMReturns the smallest value for which the cumulative binomial distribution is greater than or equal to a criterion value./ahelp Also in: File: sc/source/ui/src.po Context: scfuncs.src RID_SC_FUNCTION_DESCRIPTIONS2.SC_OPCODE_KRIT_BINOM 1 string.text Comments: o6CUv Should be: Context: scfuncs.src RID_SC_FUNCTION_DESCRIPTIONS2.SC_OPCODE_CRIT_BINOM 1 string.text -- To unsubscribe e-mail to: l10n+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/l10n/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
