Re: [Lazarus] Graeme would love this, or not, I think
On 12 October 2013 04:21, leledumbo leledumbo_c...@yahoo.co.id wrote: 3-4 comments to help promoting Lazarus/Free Pascal to them. Mind to help as well, guys? Yes, one of them would be me. (Rinkhals). Graeme will confirm that there is a lot of Microsoft-centric sentiment here and that open source is largely regarded with suspicion. You get what you pay for is a phrase I hear a lot. -- ___ Lazarus mailing list Lazarus@lists.lazarus.freepascal.org http://lists.lazarus.freepascal.org/mailman/listinfo/lazarus
Re: [Lazarus] Graeme would love this, or not, I think
On 11/10/13 20:18, vfclists . wrote: You couldn't make this up. Is it a joke or not? One of the comments sum it up perfectly: kickbacks rule once again... who gives a about the kids... Lets just hope this was a bad joke. Regards, G. -- ___ Lazarus mailing list Lazarus@lists.lazarus.freepascal.org http://lists.lazarus.freepascal.org/mailman/listinfo/lazarus
Re: [Lazarus] Graeme would love this, or not, I think
On 12/10/13 07:00, Dave Coventry wrote: Graeme will confirm that there is a lot of Microsoft-centric sentiment here and that open source is largely regarded with suspicion. The MS Office mandate is what is really confusing me. The South African government was always very pro to open source products and open standards. eg: using ODT file format for official government documents. The [Mark] Shuttleworth Foundation also did (or does - the last time I checked) fantastic work in South Africa, promoting open source and free alternatives like Ubuntu, Edubuntu, and setting up teaching centres etc. But this behaviour is typical South African government. The one hand has no idea what the other is doing! Regards, Graeme -- ___ Lazarus mailing list Lazarus@lists.lazarus.freepascal.org http://lists.lazarus.freepascal.org/mailman/listinfo/lazarus
Re: [Lazarus] Graeme would love this, or not, I think
On 12 October 2013 09:44, Graeme Geldenhuys gra...@geldenhuys.co.uk wrote: But this behaviour is typical South African government. The one hand has no idea what the other is doing! I'm afraid that corruption is rife in the Education Department, too, so some kind of ministerial incentive from Microsoft cannot be ruled out. -- ___ Lazarus mailing list Lazarus@lists.lazarus.freepascal.org http://lists.lazarus.freepascal.org/mailman/listinfo/lazarus
Re: [Lazarus] Graeme would love this, or not, I think
On Fri, Oct 11, 2013 at 08:18:16PM +0100, vfclists . wrote: Department of Basic Education bans Free and Open Source Software in SA Schools and mandates programming an ancient, moribund language in contradiction of government's own policy http://twitter.com/share http://dkeats.com/index.php?module=blogaction=viewsinglepostid=gen21Srv8Nme0_40332_1381256759userid=7050120123 Makes the classic mistake of assuming there is no difference between chosing a certain approach/tool/whatever for educational purposes and the use of that particular approach/tool after graduation. Remember, this is basic education. -- ___ Lazarus mailing list Lazarus@lists.lazarus.freepascal.org http://lists.lazarus.freepascal.org/mailman/listinfo/lazarus
Re: [Lazarus] Graeme would love this, or not, I think
On Fri, Oct 11, 2013 at 05:28:33PM -0400, Dmitry Boyarintsev wrote: There was something similar 1-2 years ago in Great Britain, where education commission recognized pascal languages (Delphi) as the best for education. So the next generation of good developers will come from South Africa. The Department of Education will purchase Delphi and students (and graduates) will be able to use FOSS solution like FPC/Lazarus. Another proof, that pascal is the language that makes sense. One could argue about language, but Delphi as RAD-IDE is definitely not a good choice. Students tend to overfocus on embellishing forms etc, and not spending their time on the more problem-solving oriented assignment. Probably because dolling up the UI is easier and gives instant-gratification. -- ___ Lazarus mailing list Lazarus@lists.lazarus.freepascal.org http://lists.lazarus.freepascal.org/mailman/listinfo/lazarus
Re: [Lazarus] Graeme would love this, or not, I think
On 12 October 2013 13:36, Marco van de Voort mar...@stack.nl wrote: Probably because dolling up the UI is easier and gives instant-gratification. My view is that instant gratification is the key. Once they see how easy it is to produce an application, some will look to develop the possibilities. The ones that get side tracked by making the Forms pretty; well, they'll probably concentrate on web design. -- ___ Lazarus mailing list Lazarus@lists.lazarus.freepascal.org http://lists.lazarus.freepascal.org/mailman/listinfo/lazarus
Re: [Lazarus] Graeme would love this, or not, I think
Am 2013-10-12 13:36, schrieb Marco van de Voort: One could argue about language, but Delphi as RAD-IDE is definitely not a good choice. Students tend to overfocus on embellishing forms etc, and not spending their time on the more problem-solving oriented assignment. Probably because dolling up the UI is easier and gives instant-gratification. Yes, that's true. But as always when learning the best motivation is rapid success. And learning without beeing able to make use of it is not useful. So a developement envrionment that lets you create a GUI program quickly is neccessary IMO. Although the language is only one part (libraries and IDE are nearly as important) it is still usefull to choose a clear and easy to learn language so I also would recommend to use Pascal at School (and of course in real life too if possible). The question is: Why *not* use Pascal? There maybe constraints that forces you to use another language later on but at School this is not the case (in general). And pupils should know how easy and clear a fast programming can be to judge all other awkward or slow languages so they *need* to know Pascal. -- ___ Lazarus mailing list Lazarus@lists.lazarus.freepascal.org http://lists.lazarus.freepascal.org/mailman/listinfo/lazarus
Re: [Lazarus] Graeme would love this, or not, I think
Marco van de Voort schrieb: One could argue about language, but Delphi as RAD-IDE is definitely not a good choice. Students tend to overfocus on embellishing forms etc, and not spending their time on the more problem-solving oriented assignment. What's a form worth without a task and event handlers? Probably because dolling up the UI is easier and gives instant-gratification. Modern (portable) devices are GUI based, so that mastering a GUI is important. Not everybody likes to control the progress and results of some task by writing WriteLn statements, so that a GUI *in addition* to console applications is a good base for all students. DoDi -- ___ Lazarus mailing list Lazarus@lists.lazarus.freepascal.org http://lists.lazarus.freepascal.org/mailman/listinfo/lazarus
[Lazarus] For QtLCL users - new feature, need testers
Hi all, Today I've commited new feature of qt widgetset (r43218) - scrollable forms. Now FCentralWidget isn't pure widget anymore but QAbstractScrollArea, which provides scrollbars on forms for us. IT'S DISABLED BY DEFAULT, so if you want to test and use scrollable forms with qt widgetset you must enable QTSCROLLABLEFORMS define in lcl/interfaces/qt/qtdefines.inc. It will be merged to 1.99. Known issues: When source autocomplete window is activated in source editor QPainter asserts in console (but window is painted correctly). What does not work (forms aren't scrollable) 1. FormStyle=fsMDIForm isn't scrollable form for LCL atm. 2. FormStyle=fsMDIChild isn't scrollable form atm. 3. QWidget_windowType(Widget) = QToolTip or QSplashScreen (that means hints and splash screen aren't scrollable). Please, if you find any problem when QTSCROLLABLEFORMS are enabled open an issue about it so I can fix it before 1.2 release. Thanks. zeljko -- ___ Lazarus mailing list Lazarus@lists.lazarus.freepascal.org http://lists.lazarus.freepascal.org/mailman/listinfo/lazarus
Re: [Lazarus] For QtLCL users - new feature, need testers
On 10/12/2013 04:38 PM, zeljko wrote: Hi all, Today I've commited new feature of qt widgetset (r43218) - scrollable forms. Now FCentralWidget isn't pure widget anymore but QAbstractScrollArea, which provides scrollbars on forms for us. IT'S DISABLED BY DEFAULT, so if you want to test and use scrollable forms with qt widgetset you must enable QTSCROLLABLEFORMS define in lcl/interfaces/qt/qtdefines.inc. It will be merged to 1.99. Not, 1.99 , but 1.0.99, it was typo .. sorry. zeljko -- ___ Lazarus mailing list Lazarus@lists.lazarus.freepascal.org http://lists.lazarus.freepascal.org/mailman/listinfo/lazarus
Re: [Lazarus] Graeme would love this, or not, I think
On Saturday, October 12, 2013 7:36 AM, Marco van de Voort mar...@stack.nl wrote: On Fri, Oct 11, 2013 at 05:28:33PM -0400, Dmitry Boyarintsev wrote: Another proof, that pascal is the language that makes sense. One could argue about language, but Delphi as RAD-IDE is definitely not a good choice. Students tend to overfocus on embellishing forms etc, and not spending their time on the more problem-solving oriented assignment. Probably because dolling up the UI is easier and gives instant-gratification. we've been seeing this for what? 20 years, now? even m$ operates in the mind set of a pretty interface trumps (unseen) sickness and disease al la yeah, i'd hit that unless someone tells me it has an STD... even then, i still might hit it al la we've redone the GUI to make it prettier but the seedy underworld of skiddies and hackers can still get in thru the same holes they've been using for the last decade :lol: :angel_horns: -- ___ Lazarus mailing list Lazarus@lists.lazarus.freepascal.org http://lists.lazarus.freepascal.org/mailman/listinfo/lazarus
Re: [Lazarus] For QtLCL users - new feature, need testers
I'm still dreaming about modular Qt :) . Now to deploy QtLCL application I need to provide all Qt libs (even webkit, but I don't use it). I'm working on project based on pure Qt 5.1, I needed to use C++ instead of FPC :/ . Those libs are amazing, not only GUI but for example QMultimedia, QNetwork and websockets. I'm wondering if exists any tool which can automatically convert Qt API headers into FPC. For example gtk3 headers for FPC are generated by some tool (don't remember the name). Was current Qt4Pas unit written manually line by line? My dream is to write pure Qt application (I'm not interested in LCL) using FPC for all platforms as I'm doing now with C++ 2013/10/12 zeljko zel...@holobit.net On 10/12/2013 04:38 PM, zeljko wrote: Hi all, Today I've commited new feature of qt widgetset (r43218) - scrollable forms. Now FCentralWidget isn't pure widget anymore but QAbstractScrollArea, which provides scrollbars on forms for us. IT'S DISABLED BY DEFAULT, so if you want to test and use scrollable forms with qt widgetset you must enable QTSCROLLABLEFORMS define in lcl/interfaces/qt/qtdefines.**inc. It will be merged to 1.99. Not, 1.99 , but 1.0.99, it was typo .. sorry. zeljko -- __**_ Lazarus mailing list Lazarus@lists.lazarus.**freepascal.orgLazarus@lists.lazarus.freepascal.org http://lists.lazarus.**freepascal.org/mailman/**listinfo/lazarushttp://lists.lazarus.freepascal.org/mailman/listinfo/lazarus -- ___ Lazarus mailing list Lazarus@lists.lazarus.freepascal.org http://lists.lazarus.freepascal.org/mailman/listinfo/lazarus
