Re: [LegacyUG] Ethnicity

2014-10-15 Thread Tessa Keough
Yes it is a nice start but very general - Newfoundland did not join
the confederation of Canada until 1949 however my ancestors get thrown
into Canada (Newfoundlanders through and through). And of course we
have the issue of the Austria-Hungary Empire - if your ancestors were
born in Austria, Slovenia, Croatia, Yugoslavia - and that all depends
on the date, so that is problematic as well. As another poster stated,
the same issue arises with Germany and Italy through time. Of course
depending on what we include in our databases makes a difference but I
am clear about Newfoundland and it makes no difference. Will just have
to superimpose the Newfoundland flag!

That said, it is a great quick and dirty view and it does give people
an approximation and get the conversation started. My sister knew to
ask the questions and we played with the basic report. All good as
long as you think critically (always important).

Tessa

Tessa Keough
Guild of One-Name Studies, Keough (Keogh, Kough  Kehoe) Registered ONS
Legacy Virtual Users' Group Community on Google+
Society for One-Place Studies - Plate Cove East, Newfoundland


On Tue, Oct 14, 2014 at 8:01 PM,  johnbernac...@iprimus.com.au wrote:


 Knowing the country of origin or nationality is a step toward finding an
 ancestor’s culture or ethnicity, but even recording an accurate name of the
 nation may immediately say a little more about an ancestor.

SNIP



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Re: [LegacyUG] Ethnicity

2014-10-14 Thread singhals
I hope consideration is given to the unfortunate fact that
ethnicity and birthplace are largely unrelated.

When I run that Origins report on myself in one ff, it
admits 33% of my ancestors were born in Virginia, 33% in
Pennsylvania, 33% in Germany, and 1% other.

We Virginians may THINK of ourselves as a race apart/above,
but I know Black Virginians, Red Virginians, White
Virginians and the full range of permutations.  Being born
in Virginia doesn't say a word about your race or culture.

For a more widely known example, look at the current
governor of Louisiana. His being born in Louisiana didn't
change his genetics.

Cheryl



Sherry/Support wrote:
 We welcome suggestions for enhancements to Legacy and its
 features.  You can find a link to our suggestion form in
 Legacy's Support section of the Legacy Home tab or by going
 directly to the website in your browser
 www.LegacyFamilyTree.com http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com 
 Help Center.

 Programmers are considering suggestions for future versions
 of Legacy.

 For issues on the no recognizable country, please contact
 Support - links to the Problem Report Form are in the same
 location as the Suggestion form.

 Sincerely,
 Sherry
 Technical Support
 Legacy Family Tree

 On Sun, Oct 12, 2014 at 4:21 PM,
 johnbernac...@iprimus.com.au
 mailto:johnbernac...@iprimus.com.au wrote:

 I have similar problems for my ancestors who are from
 different parts of
 Europe. The Origins Report is pretty useless for anyone
 serious about
 showing their ethnic or cultural origins.  A big part of
 this complex
 problem is that borders and names of many European
 countries have changed
 enormously throughout history. According to proper
 genealogical practice, I
 record names of locations as they were at the time of
 the event. For my
 ancestors the Origins Report states “No recognisable
 countries were found
 for this report†. I imagine the same would happen if
 you recorded locations
 according to how Native American nations or tribes named
 them or had
 boundaries/borders.

 The only way I can think of for a much more accurate and
 meaningful Origins
 Report is to make it more interactive for genealogists
 and include fields
 that can be added or customised so the Origins Report
 can be tailored to how
 the users would like it.

 John Bernacki





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Re: [LegacyUG] Ethnicity

2014-10-14 Thread Brian/Support
I wonder how the Origins Report suddenly became a report on ethnicity?
The help for the report says this:

It's nice to know where we came from - where our ancestors were born.
Most of us are a mixture of nationalities who have joined together and
split apart for centuries.  Legacy can gather all the ancestral birth
places in your family file and let you know what percentage of each
nationality makes up your heritage.

Should this preamble be reworded to remove nationality since the
report is only reporting based on ancestral birth places.

Brian
Customer Support
Millennia Corporation
br...@legacyfamilytree.com
http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com

On 14/10/2014 1025, singhals wrote:
 I hope consideration is given to the unfortunate fact that
 ethnicity and birthplace are largely unrelated.

 When I run that Origins report on myself in one ff, it
 admits 33% of my ancestors were born in Virginia, 33% in
 Pennsylvania, 33% in Germany, and 1% other.

 We Virginians may THINK of ourselves as a race apart/above,
 but I know Black Virginians, Red Virginians, White
 Virginians and the full range of permutations.  Being born
 in Virginia doesn't say a word about your race or culture.

 For a more widely known example, look at the current
 governor of Louisiana. His being born in Louisiana didn't
 change his genetics.

 Cheryl



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Re: [LegacyUG] Ethnicity

2014-10-14 Thread Sherry/Support
Brian and Cheryl,

Nationality and ethnicity are two different things -

Nationality (Merriam-Webster) is defined as

: a group of people who share the same history, traditions, and language,
and who usually live together in a particular country

: the fact or status of being a member or citizen of a particular nation
The same dictionary defines ethnicity as

1: ethnic http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/ethnic quality or
affiliation aspects of *ethnicity*
2*:*  a particular ethnic affiliation or group students of diverse

*ethnicities*
Ethnic is further defined as

: of or relating to races or large groups of people who have the same
customs, religion, origin, etc.

: associated with or belonging to a particular race or group of people who
have a culture that is different from the main culture of a country


So the preamble is correct in stating nationality and not including
ethnicity.


IMHO, ethnicity should be recorded as an event and if it's desired to see
the ethnic origins of the people in the database, either a Detailed Search
or an Event Report on that specific event.




Sincerely,
Sherry
Technical Support
Legacy Family Tree

On Tue, Oct 14, 2014 at 7:43 AM, Brian/Support br...@legacyfamilytree.com
wrote:

 I wonder how the Origins Report suddenly became a report on ethnicity?
 The help for the report says this:

 It's nice to know where we came from - where our ancestors were born.
 Most of us are a mixture of nationalities who have joined together and
 split apart for centuries.  Legacy can gather all the ancestral birth
 places in your family file and let you know what percentage of each
 nationality makes up your heritage.

 Should this preamble be reworded to remove nationality since the
 report is only reporting based on ancestral birth places.

 Brian
 Customer Support
 Millennia Corporation
 br...@legacyfamilytree.com
 http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com




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Re: [LegacyUG] Ethnicity

2014-10-14 Thread M Sandvig
I changed 'christening' to 'Tribe'.
On Oct 12, 2014 2:07 PM, fersken fers...@verizon.net wrote:

  Since the emergence of the Origin’s Report, I have been considering the
 difference between place of birth and ethnicity.  I have Montaukett Indian
 ancestry in my background but on the Origin’s report, the only thing they
 represent is U.S.  The *Montaukett* or *Montauk people* are a Native
 American
 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Native_Americans_in_the_United_States tribe
 of Algonquian http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Algonquian_languages-speaking
 people from the eastern end of Long Island
 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Long_Island, New York
 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_York.   I have in my direct ancestry a
 chief of the Montaukett named Wyandanch.  In the the second half of the
 1650s, Wyandanch had acquired enough power and influence to be considered
 the main alliance chief on a Long Island by the colonists.  My Origin’s
 Report  shows United States and I began to wonder if Legacy 8.0 had any way
 of showing ethnicity?  I could find nothing on the subject.  In this 21st
 century in the United States, there are many who are of mixed ethnicities.
 While I understand the problematic concept of setting up a column to show
 ethnicity and the possibility of offending some people, I wonder if there
 isn’t some way to include race* if the researcher wanted to*.   The census
 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Race_and_ethnicity_in_the_United_States_Census
  officially recognizes six ethnic and racial categories: White American,
 Native American and Alaska Native, Asian American, African American, Native
 Hawaiian and Other Pacific Islander, and people of two or more races; a
 race called Some other race is also used in the census and other surveys,
 but is not official.  The United States Census Bureau also classifies
 Americans as Hispanic or Latino and Not Hispanic or Latino, which
 identifies Hispanic and Latino Americans
 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hispanic_and_Latino_Americans as a
 racially diverse *ethnicity*
 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Race_and_ethnicity_in_the_United_States_Census
  that composes the largest minority group in the nation.  Apparently,
 this concept of including ethnicity rather that place of origin is too
 “touchy” for any genealogical software company to touch.  My question,
 therefore, is this:  Is there any way I can indicate (other than in the
 notes) that some of  my direct ancestors are Native American and not mix
 them together as United States?


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 http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Etiquette.asp
 Archived messages after Nov. 21 2009:
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Re: [LegacyUG] Ethnicity

2014-10-14 Thread johnbernacki1

Knowing the country of origin or nationality is a step toward finding an 
ancestor’s culture or ethnicity, but even recording an accurate name of the 
nation may immediately say a little more about an ancestor.

For example, Italy was not a nation-state until 1861. If an ancestor lived 
before then and you record their birth or other events as occurring in “Italy”, 
it is less accurate or genealogically “proper”, and it says less about the 
ancestor than it might. If however, you know the ancestor lived in the Republic 
of Venice and record that as the country/location, it is more interesting and 
immediately provides a little more “flesh on the bones” - period of history, 
culture and probable ethnicity. Different parts of what is now Italy have 
varying cultures, ethnic roots and histories, and the differences are 
especially different between the north and south.

 The Origins Report however does not recognise locations I use. I am not sure 
why and I have not bothered trying to find out. Perhaps it only recognises 
places like “Italy” rather than “Republic of”.

John

From: M Sandvig
Sent: Wednesday, October 15, 2014 11:57 AM
To: legacyusergroup@LegacyUsers.com
Subject: Re: [LegacyUG] Ethnicity

I changed 'christening' to 'Tribe'.

On Oct 12, 2014 2:07 PM, fersken fers...@verizon.net wrote:

  Since the emergence of the Origin’s Report, I have been considering the 
difference between place of birth and ethnicity.  I have Montaukett Indian 
ancestry in my background but on the Origin’s report, the only thing they 
represent is U.S.  The Montaukett or Montauk people are a Native American tribe 
of Algonquian-speaking people from the eastern end of Long Island, New York.   
I have in my direct ancestry a chief of the Montaukett named Wyandanch.  In the 
the second half of the 1650s, Wyandanch had acquired enough power and influence 
to be considered the main alliance chief on a Long Island by the colonists.  
My Origin’s Report  shows United States and I began to wonder if Legacy 8.0 had 
any way of showing ethnicity?  I could find nothing on the subject.  In this 
21st century in the United States, there are many who are of mixed ethnicities. 
 While I understand the problematic concept of setting up a column to show 
ethnicity and the possibility of offending some people, I wonder if there isn’t 
some way to include race if the researcher wanted to.   The census officially 
recognizes six ethnic and racial categories: White American, Native American 
and Alaska Native, Asian American, African American, Native Hawaiian and Other 
Pacific Islander, and people of two or more races; a race called Some other 
race is also used in the census and other surveys, but is not official.  The 
United States Census Bureau also classifies Americans as Hispanic or Latino 
and Not Hispanic or Latino, which identifies Hispanic and Latino Americans as 
a racially diverse ethnicity that composes the largest minority group in the 
nation.  Apparently, this concept of including ethnicity rather that place of 
origin is too “touchy” for any genealogical software company to touch.  My 
question, therefore, is this:  Is there any way I can indicate (other than in 
the notes) that some of  my direct ancestors are Native American and not mix 
them together as United States?


  Legacy User Group guidelines:
  http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Etiquette.asp
  Archived messages after Nov. 21 2009:
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Re: [LegacyUG] Ethnicity

2014-10-13 Thread Sherry/Support
We welcome suggestions for enhancements to Legacy and its features.  You
can find a link to our suggestion form in Legacy's Support section of the
Legacy Home tab or by going directly to the website in your browser
www.LegacyFamilyTree.com  Help Center.

Programmers are considering suggestions for future versions of Legacy.

For issues on the no recognizable country, please contact Support - links
to the Problem Report Form are in the same location as the Suggestion form.

Sincerely,
Sherry
Technical Support
Legacy Family Tree

On Sun, Oct 12, 2014 at 4:21 PM, johnbernac...@iprimus.com.au wrote:

 I have similar problems for my ancestors who are from different parts of
 Europe. The Origins Report is pretty useless for anyone serious about
 showing their ethnic or cultural origins.  A big part of this complex
 problem is that borders and names of many European countries have changed
 enormously throughout history. According to proper genealogical practice, I
 record names of locations as they were at the time of the event. For my
 ancestors the Origins Report states “No recognisable countries were found
 for this report†. I imagine the same would happen if you recorded
 locations
 according to how Native American nations or tribes named them or had
 boundaries/borders.

 The only way I can think of for a much more accurate and meaningful Origins
 Report is to make it more interactive for genealogists and include fields
 that can be added or customised so the Origins Report can be tailored to
 how
 the users would like it.

 John Bernacki




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[LegacyUG] Ethnicity

2014-10-12 Thread fersken
Since the emergence of the Origin’s Report, I have been considering the 
difference between place of birth and ethnicity.  I have Montaukett Indian 
ancestry in my background but on the Origin’s report, the only thing they 
represent is U.S.  The Montaukett or Montauk people are a Native American tribe 
of Algonquian-speaking people from the eastern end of Long Island, New York.   
I have in my direct ancestry a chief of the Montaukett named Wyandanch.  In the 
the second half of the 1650s, Wyandanch had acquired enough power and influence 
to be considered the main alliance chief on a Long Island by the colonists.  
My Origin’s Report  shows United States and I began to wonder if Legacy 8.0 had 
any way of showing ethnicity?  I could find nothing on the subject.  In this 
21st century in the United States, there are many who are of mixed ethnicities. 
 While I understand the problematic concept of setting up a column to show 
ethnicity and the possibility of offending some people, I wonder if there isn’t 
some way to include race if the researcher wanted to.   The census officially 
recognizes six ethnic and racial categories: White American, Native American 
and Alaska Native, Asian American, African American, Native Hawaiian and Other 
Pacific Islander, and people of two or more races; a race called Some other 
race is also used in the census and other surveys, but is not official.  The 
United States Census Bureau also classifies Americans as Hispanic or Latino 
and Not Hispanic or Latino, which identifies Hispanic and Latino Americans as 
a racially diverse ethnicity that composes the largest minority group in the 
nation.  Apparently, this concept of including ethnicity rather that place of 
origin is too “touchy” for any genealogical software company to touch.  My 
question, therefore, is this:  Is there any way I can indicate (other than in 
the notes) that some of  my direct ancestors are Native American and not mix 
them together as United States?


Legacy User Group guidelines:
http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Etiquette.asp
Archived messages after Nov. 21 2009:
http://www.mail-archive.com/legacyusergroup@legacyusers.com/
Archived messages from old mail server - before Nov. 21 2009:
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Re: [LegacyUG] Ethnicity

2014-10-12 Thread Wendy Howard
You could use an Event to record this detail.

Depending on your personal preferences, you could create one event to
record all ethnicities, or a series of events which are each dedicated
to a particular one of your interest. I think I would use one event, and
put the defining term in the Description field. One person could have
more than one event of this type.

You can choose to display a selected event amongst the five fields
displayed in Family View, if it's something you want up front and
visible. Right-click on the field names to bring up the Customise Family
View Information window and make your choices.

Hope this helps.  :-)

Wendy


fersken said the following on 13/10/2014 09:05:
 Since the emergence of the Origin’s Report, I have been considering
 the difference between place of birth and ethnicity.  I have
 Montaukett Indian ancestry in my background but on the Origin’s
 report, the only thing they represent is U.S.
 The*Montaukett*or*Montauk people*are aNative American
 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Native_Americans_in_the_United_Statestribe
 ofAlgonquian
 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Algonquian_languages-speaking people
 from the eastern end ofLong Island
 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Long_Island,New York
 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_York.   I have in my direct
 ancestry a chief of the Montaukett named Wyandanch.  In the the second
 half of the 1650s, Wyandanch had acquired enough power and influence
 to be considered the main alliance chief on a Long Island by the
 colonists.  My Origin’s Report  shows United States and I began to
 wonder if Legacy 8.0 had any way of showing ethnicity?  I could find
 nothing on the subject.  In this 21st century in the United States,
 there are many who are of mixed ethnicities.  While I understand the
 problematic concept of setting up a column to show ethnicity and the
 possibility of offending some people, I wonder if there isn’t some way
 to include race*if the researcher wanted to*. The census
 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Race_and_ethnicity_in_the_United_States_Censusofficially
 recognizes six ethnic and racial categories: White American, Native
 American and Alaska Native, Asian American, African American, Native
 Hawaiian and Other Pacific Islander, and people of two or more races;
 a race called Some other race is also used in the census and other
 surveys, but is not official. The United States Census Bureau also
 classifies Americans as Hispanic or Latino and Not Hispanic or
 Latino, which identifiesHispanic and Latino Americans
 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hispanic_and_Latino_Americansas a
 racially diverse/ethnicity/
 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Race_and_ethnicity_in_the_United_States_Censusthat
 composes the largest minority group in the nation.  Apparently, this
 concept of including ethnicity rather that place of origin is too
 “touchy” for any genealogical software company to touch.  My question,
 therefore, is this: Is there any way I can indicate (other than in the
 notes) that some of  my direct ancestors are Native American and not
 mix them together as United States?



Legacy User Group guidelines:
http://www.LegacyFamilyTree.com/Etiquette.asp
Archived messages after Nov. 21 2009:
http://www.mail-archive.com/legacyusergroup@legacyusers.com/
Archived messages from old mail server - before Nov. 21 2009:
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Re: [LegacyUG] Ethnicity

2014-10-12 Thread johnbernacki1
I have similar problems for my ancestors who are from different parts of
Europe. The Origins Report is pretty useless for anyone serious about
showing their ethnic or cultural origins.  A big part of this complex
problem is that borders and names of many European countries have changed
enormously throughout history. According to proper genealogical practice, I
record names of locations as they were at the time of the event. For my
ancestors the Origins Report states “No recognisable countries were found
for this report”. I imagine the same would happen if you recorded locations
according to how Native American nations or tribes named them or had
boundaries/borders.

The only way I can think of for a much more accurate and meaningful Origins
Report is to make it more interactive for genealogists and include fields
that can be added or customised so the Origins Report can be tailored to how
the users would like it.

John Bernacki

-Original Message-
From: Wendy Howard
Sent: Monday, October 13, 2014 9:59 AM
To: legacyusergroup@LegacyUsers.com
Subject: Re: [LegacyUG] Ethnicity

You could use an Event to record this detail.

Depending on your personal preferences, you could create one event to
record all ethnicities, or a series of events which are each dedicated
to a particular one of your interest. I think I would use one event, and
put the defining term in the Description field. One person could have
more than one event of this type.

You can choose to display a selected event amongst the five fields
displayed in Family View, if it's something you want up front and
visible. Right-click on the field names to bring up the Customise Family
View Information window and make your choices.

Hope this helps.  :-)

Wendy


fersken said the following on 13/10/2014 09:05:
 Since the emergence of the Origin’s Report, I have been considering
 the difference between place of birth and ethnicity.  I have
 Montaukett Indian ancestry in my background but on the Origin’s
 report, the only thing they represent is U.S.
 The*Montaukett*or*Montauk people*are aNative American
 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Native_Americans_in_the_United_Statestribe
 ofAlgonquian
 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Algonquian_languages-speaking people
 from the eastern end ofLong Island
 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Long_Island,New York
 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_York.   I have in my direct
 ancestry a chief of the Montaukett named Wyandanch.  In the the second
 half of the 1650s, Wyandanch had acquired enough power and influence
 to be considered the main alliance chief on a Long Island by the
 colonists.  My Origin’s Report  shows United States and I began to
 wonder if Legacy 8.0 had any way of showing ethnicity?  I could find
 nothing on the subject.  In this 21st century in the United States,
 there are many who are of mixed ethnicities.  While I understand the
 problematic concept of setting up a column to show ethnicity and the
 possibility of offending some people, I wonder if there isn’t some way
 to include race*if the researcher wanted to*. The census
 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Race_and_ethnicity_in_the_United_States_Censusofficially
 recognizes six ethnic and racial categories: White American, Native
 American and Alaska Native, Asian American, African American, Native
 Hawaiian and Other Pacific Islander, and people of two or more races;
 a race called Some other race is also used in the census and other
 surveys, but is not official. The United States Census Bureau also
 classifies Americans as Hispanic or Latino and Not Hispanic or
 Latino, which identifiesHispanic and Latino Americans
 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hispanic_and_Latino_Americansas a
 racially diverse/ethnicity/
 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Race_and_ethnicity_in_the_United_States_Censusthat
 composes the largest minority group in the nation.  Apparently, this
 concept of including ethnicity rather that place of origin is too
 “touchy” for any genealogical software company to touch.  My 
 question,
 therefore, is this: Is there any way I can indicate (other than in the
 notes) that some of  my direct ancestors are Native American and not
 mix them together as United States?



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