Re: New installation log

[Thomas Passin]

On Sunday, March 29, 2020 at 10:07:37 PM UTC-4, Matt Wilkie wrote:
>
>
> OTOH, I have installed as a user on Linux distros many times using pip 
>> install, and never had a problem. Never needed to consider using sudo.
>>
>
> Did/do you need to pass `--user` flag? 
>
> pip install --user foobaz
>

I don't think I ever used it. For sure I didn't use it when I have 
installed Leo and its dependencies.  I always used the python installations 
that came system-installed.  The systems were usually Mint and Ubuntu.   
Maybe that's a good reason for using the system-installed Python and not 
Python you installed outside of the system packaging mechanism.

-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
"leo-editor" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to leo-editor+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit 
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/leo-editor/23a612df-9d35-44ae-b5a6-87ae84e51293%40googlegroups.com.

Re: New installation log

[Edward K. Ream]

On Sunday, March 29, 2020 at 5:09:38 AM UTC-5, Edward K. Ream wrote:

> I am seriously considering ignoring Anaconda and miniconda in Leo's 
installation instructions:

Belay that. 

Your comments have convinced me that there is no reason to endorse pip, 
Anaconda or miniconda. In effect, these are preferences.

Leo's installation instructions are neutral about these options. I see no 
reason to change them.

Edward

-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
"leo-editor" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to leo-editor+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit 
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/leo-editor/fe7e24e6-6d23-44ba-8ad1-6380f80f8851%40googlegroups.com.

Re: New installation log

[Matt Wilkie]

> OTOH, I have installed as a user on Linux distros many times using pip 
> install, and never had a problem. Never needed to consider using sudo.
>

Did/do you need to pass `--user` flag? 

pip install --user foobaz

I got into the sudo mess because I didn't know about the user flag, tried 
to just `pip install foo`, got a permission denied error, so reached for 
sudo out of habit, because that's what you need for apt installs. That's 
when I discovered conda and have stayed there since. It would be be good 
news if they've since made user installs the default. (I was on Mint 17 or 
18 if memory serves).

-matt

-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
"leo-editor" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to leo-editor+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit 
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/leo-editor/1881553d-55c4-43d5-9d8f-76b35f412ea2%40googlegroups.com.

Re: New installation log

[Thomas Passin]

On Sunday, March 29, 2020 at 2:49:30 PM UTC-4, vitalije wrote:

> On Sunday, March 29, 2020 at 8:21:05 PM UTC+2, Matt Wilkie wrote:
>
>
>> Linux can add a wrinkle with system vs user installs. User is safer in my 
>> experience. Morale of a painful story I havn't shared: *never use `sudo 
>> pip install`*. It can take a looong time to extricate from mixed up  
>> package manager installs and pip installs in system.
>>
>> -matt
>>
>>
> That's exactly why I prefer anaconda. It never  requires root privileges, 
> so there is no need for doing `sudo pip install`.
>

OTOH, I have installed as a user on Linux distros many times using pip 
install, and never had a problem. Never needed to consider using sudo.

-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
"leo-editor" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to leo-editor+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit 
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/leo-editor/e8d6cd90-dcd5-4a95-8990-abfa736acbe2%40googlegroups.com.

Re: New installation log

[vitalije]

On Sunday, March 29, 2020 at 8:21:05 PM UTC+2, Matt Wilkie wrote:


> Linux can add a wrinkle with system vs user installs. User is safer in my 
> experience. Morale of a painful story I havn't shared: *never use `sudo 
> pip install`*. It can take a looong time to extricate from mixed up  
> package manager installs and pip installs in system.
>
> -matt
>
>
That's exactly why I prefer anaconda. It never  requires root privileges, 
so there is no need for doing `sudo pip install`.

Vitalije

-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
"leo-editor" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to leo-editor+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit 
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/leo-editor/6abcbc1f-216b-47db-8f01-5dcda3f24706%40googlegroups.com.

Re: New installation log

[Matt Wilkie]

>
> PyQt5 isn't the only requirement for leo. The setup.py file (used by pip) 
> has all the requirements. Maybe these instructions would be better as it 
> would get all the dependencies and not just PyQt5:
>
> Install python3
> if not using git:
>
> pip install leo
>
> If using git:
>
> git clone 
>
> pip install --editable leo-editor
>
>
 
As of py3.6 this should always work. 

Linux can add a wrinkle with system vs user installs. User is safer in my 
experience. Morale of a painful story I havn't shared: *never use `sudo pip 
install`*. It can take a looong time to extricate from mixed up  package 
manager installs and pip installs in system.

-matt

-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
"leo-editor" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to leo-editor+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit 
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/leo-editor/3cf7b60d-b516-4cfa-8456-a08211c6bc37%40googlegroups.com.

Re: New installation log

[Brian Theado]

On Sun, Mar 29, 2020 at 6:09 AM Edward K. Ream  wrote:
[...]

> I am seriously considering ignoring Anaconda and miniconda in Leo's
> installation instructions:
>
> Install python 3
> (ubuntu) apt-get install pip3
> pip install PyQt5
> (optional, if not using git) pip install leo
>

PyQt5 isn't the only requirement for leo. The setup.py file (used by pip)
has all the requirements. Maybe these instructions would be better as it
would get all the dependencies and not just PyQt5:

Install python3
if not using git:

pip install leo

If using git:

git clone 

pip install --editable leo-editor


I haven't personally tested these steps recently, but have done so at one
time or another (using virtual environment).

-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
"leo-editor" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to leo-editor+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit 
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/leo-editor/CAO5X8CwJQN2eHJ8ExABTBwGFJ3r7_c%3DnBy5FCeE%2BWvORvB7U8Q%40mail.gmail.com.

Re: New installation log

[Edward K. Ream]

On Sun, Mar 29, 2020 at 6:01 AM vitalije  wrote:

> I use anaconda on all my computers, but I install packages using `pip
> install`not `conda`. I also don't create nor use any conda environments.
>
> I like the fact that anaconda is installed, by default, in my home folder.
> So, installing packages doesn't require root privileges. The only trouble I
> sometimes have is that some programs rely on /usr/bin/python and not on
> python found in the PATH (which is anaconda python).
>

Thanks for these comments. I'm not ever going to dissuade people from using
Anaconda, but I'm not sure the present encouragement is all that helpful.

Edward

-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
"leo-editor" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to leo-editor+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit 
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/leo-editor/CAMF8tS0TAQ25AVRsT7vJr-iZGmFD6GGC3YOF%3DwtwNSmE6_FoHw%40mail.gmail.com.

Re: New installation log

[vitalije]

I use anaconda on all my computers, but I install packages using `pip 
install`not `conda`. I also don't create nor use any conda environments.

I like the fact that anaconda is installed, by default, in my home folder. 
So, installing packages doesn't require root privileges. The only trouble I 
sometimes have is that some programs rely on /usr/bin/python and not on 
python found in the PATH (which is anaconda python).

Vitalije

-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
"leo-editor" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to leo-editor+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit 
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/leo-editor/24108a5a-22ae-4faa-8e7c-7b5e081f5271%40googlegroups.com.

Re: New installation log

[Edward K. Ream]

On Saturday, March 28, 2020 at 9:00:14 AM UTC-5, Edward K. Ream wrote:

> It's easy to install python using an executable installer and `pip 
install PyQt5`.

Installation is *simple *because at each step it's clear what to install 
next. That's because of various console messages within Leo.

In other words, it's quite possible to install the prerequisites for Leo 
without having to remember anything, except maybe the line above.

Edward



-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
"leo-editor" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to leo-editor+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit 
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/leo-editor/db10ac1c-929d-4566-9026-1327649c4026%40googlegroups.com.

Re: New installation log

[Edward K. Ream]

On Sat, Mar 28, 2020 at 11:13 PM Matt Wilkie  wrote:

If you install Leo (or whatever) into the base environment instead of
> creating a distinct envs for projects you can get the simplicity of a
> single system environment, similar to installing python the regular way,
> and still use the conda package manager (if that's a desirable thing for
> your work).
>
> In this case add the base env bin to PATH so it's always available or use
> the system menu 'Anaconda Prompt' (which is the same as `activate` with no
> env specified).
>
> It should be noted this goes against the grain of Anaconda's design and
> they recommend against it. Still works though!
>

Thanks for these comments. Imo, Anaconda has become harder to use in the
last year or so. Not sure why.

*Aha*: Now that Leo requires python 3, we can assume pip is always
available. (Actually, people may have to use apt-get on Linux to get pip3.)
In my recent experience, pip is easier to use and more solid than conda.
Ymmv.

I am seriously considering ignoring Anaconda and miniconda in Leo's
installation instructions:

Install python 3
(ubuntu) apt-get install pip3
pip install PyQt5
(optional, if not using git) pip install leo

And that's it. Comments?

Edward

-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
"leo-editor" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to leo-editor+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit 
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/leo-editor/CAMF8tS339qXkd%3DDeYWOWnE3g4o%3Dy_kP0zMYke3OK%3DmhzUtX6wA%40mail.gmail.com.

Re: New installation log

[Matt Wilkie]

>
> I uninstalled Anaconda3. No more confusing envs. Bye bye activation woes.
>

For the benefit of the thread, not because I'm trying to persuade you or 
anyone else to go back to Anaconda or Miniconda:

If you install Leo (or whatever) into the base environment instead of 
creating a distinct envs for projects you can get the simplicity of a 
single system environment, similar to installing python the regular way, 
and still use the conda package manager (if that's a desirable thing for 
your work).

In this case add the base env bin to PATH so it's always available or use 
the system menu 'Anaconda Prompt' (which is the same as `activate` with no 
env specified).

It should be noted this goes against the grain of Anaconda's design and 
they recommend against it. Still works though!

-matt

-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
"leo-editor" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to leo-editor+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit 
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/leo-editor/3701ef09-61ee-4596-b648-6003af1d2e69%40googlegroups.com.

Re: New installation log

[Viktor Ransmayr]

Hello Thomas,

Am Sa., 28. März 2020 um 17:12 Uhr schrieb Thomas Passin <
tbp100...@gmail.com>:

> Linux Mint is still on Python 3.6.9.  I think that's what Debian is at
> too, since the Mint package is basically the Debian one, though I'm not
> 100% sure.   Ubuntu is up to 3.7.6
>

I did a quick check for Debian. - The Python 3 version for Debian 10 is
3.7.3

With kind regards,

Viktor

-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
"leo-editor" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to leo-editor+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit 
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/leo-editor/CAAeSrGLyed7H0_C6D79y2MWdjucxN_C5Jufv68udue7gu-qC8Q%40mail.gmail.com.

Re: New installation log

[Thomas Passin]

Linux Mint is still on Python 3.6.9.  I think that's what Debian is at too, 
since the Mint package is basically the Debian one, though I'm not 100% 
sure.   Ubuntu is up to 3.7.6

On Saturday, March 28, 2020 at 10:00:14 AM UTC-4, Edward K. Ream wrote:

>
> Leo is supposed to run on python 3.6, but python 3.7 looks like the 
> practical minimum for new python installations.
>

-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
"leo-editor" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to leo-editor+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit 
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/leo-editor/5f751f5d-6f9f-4627-bfbe-9282463687f2%40googlegroups.com.

Re: New installation log

[Edward K. Ream]

On Saturday, March 28, 2020 at 9:28:34 AM UTC-5, Edward K. Ream wrote:


matplotlib is giving a deprecation warning:
>

Rev 35ad24f in devel hacks vr3 to ignore *all* warnings for now.

Edward

-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
"leo-editor" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to leo-editor+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit 
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/leo-editor/9b2e5653-0fb6-444b-b7ad-28dd8fc73116%40googlegroups.com.

Re: New installation log

[Edward K. Ream]

On Sat, Mar 28, 2020 at 9:00 AM Edward K. Ream  wrote:

> I'll now experiment with installing the prerequisites for jupyter,
holoviews etc. This should be straightforward with pip.

Indeed it was. Everything is easy with pip. From my notes, not my memory:

*Install nbformat*

Starting Leo message gave this message: `import-jupyter-notebook requires
nbformat package`

> pip install nbformat

Successfully installed
  attrs-19.3.0'
  decorator-4.4.2
  importlib-metadata-1.6.0'
  ipython-genutils-0.2.0
  jsonschema-3.2.0
  jupyter-core-4.6.3
  nbformat-5.0.4
  pyrsistent-0.16.0
  pywin32-227
  six-1.14.0
  traitlets-4.3.3
  zipp-3.1.0

*Install holoviews*

This page  gives various ways of
installing holoviews with pip.

1. The complete installation failed: pip install "holoviews[all]"

ERROR: Could not find a version that satisfies the requirement bzip2; extra
== "all" (from holoviews[all])
   (from versions: none)
ERROR: No matching distribution found for bzip2; extra == "all" (from
holoviews[all])

2. The recommended installation worked: pip install "holoviews[recommended]"

The end of the console log was:

installing collected packages: param, pytz, numpy, python-dateutil, pandas,
pyviz-comms, tqdm, typing-extensions, tornado, MarkupSafe, jinja2, pillow,
PyYAML, pyparsing, packaging, bokeh, markdown, pyct, panel, cycler,
kiwisolver, matplotlib, parso, jedi, pickleshare, pygments, wcwidth,
prompt-toolkit, backcall, colorama, ipython, pyzmq, jupyter-client,
ipykernel, prometheus-client, Send2Trash, testpath, mistune, pandocfilters,
webencodings, bleach, defusedxml, entrypoints, nbconvert, pywinpty,
terminado, notebook, holoviews
Running setup.py install for backcall ... done
Running setup.py install for prometheus-client ... done
Running setup.py install for pandocfilters ... done
Successfully installed
  MarkupSafe-1.1.1
  PyYAML-5.3.1
  Send2Trash-1.5.0
  backcall-0.1.0
  bleach-3.1.4
  bokeh-2.0.0
  colorama-0.4.3
  cycler-0.10.0
  defusedxml-0.6.0
  entrypoints-0.3
  holoviews-1.13.1
  ipykernel-5.2.0
  ipython-7.13.0
  jedi-0.16.0
  jinja2-2.11.1
  jupyter-client-6.1.2
  kiwisolver-1.1.0
  markdown-3.2.1
  matplotlib-3.2.1
  mistune-0.8.4
  nbconvert-5.6.1
  notebook-6.0.3
  numpy-1.18.2
  packaging-20.3
  pandas-1.0.3
  pandocfilters-1.4.2
  panel-0.9.3
  param-1.9.3
  parso-0.6.2
  pickleshare-0.7.5
  pillow-7.0.0
  prometheus-client-0.7.1
  prompt-toolkit-3.0.5
  pyct-0.4.6
  pygments-2.6.1
  pyparsing-2.4.6
  python-dateutil-2.8.1
  pytz-2019.3
  pyviz-comms-0.7.4
  pywinpty-0.5.7
  pyzmq-19.0.0
  terminado-0.8.3
  testpath-0.4.4
  tornado-6.0.4
  tqdm-4.43.0
  typing-extensions-3.7.4.1
  wcwidth-0.1.9
  webencodings-0.5.1

*Install docutils*

Restarting Leo gave this message: Warning: viewrendered3.py running without
docutils.

>pip install docutils

Successfully installed docutils-0.16

*Running holoviews*

At last this script ran within Leo:

import holoviews as hv
hv.extension('matplotlib')
xs = range(-10, 11)
ys = [100-z**2 for z in xs]
curve = hv.Curve((xs, ys))
hv.save(curve, 'curve.png')
print('done')

matplotlib is giving a deprecation warning:

...\Python\Python37\lib\_collections_abc.py:841:
MatplotlibDeprecationWarning:
The datapath rcparam was deprecated in Matplotlib 3.2.1 and will be removed
two minor releases later.

Programs can call warnings.filterwarnings to suppress such things, so it
looks like we are good to go.

Edward

-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
"leo-editor" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to leo-editor+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit 
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/leo-editor/CAMF8tS3a68cjroiq00fff3WGxP9J3K7p3TD%3DMdvnNeSrHjY3bg%40mail.gmail.com.

New installation log

[Edward K. Ream]

I've lost patience with Anaconda3. This thread documents a clean install of 
*python 
*on Windows. I continue to use Leo's git code.

Imo, virtual environments are a pain in the butt. I've got enough trouble 
remembering what git branch I am on. Having multiple forks/envs is too much 
for my brain.

Happily, installing python is really simple w/o Anaconda:

*Download*

Python's download page  does not seem to 
have an executable installer for Python 3.6.x! Clicking 3.6 takes you here 
. There are security 
problems with 3.6.8, so we really want 3.6.10, but the page only shows two 
zipped tarballs. So while Leo is supposed to run on python 3.6, it looks 
like we may as well move to 3.7.6.

*Install*

I installed Python 3.7.6 to ~/python/python37, because I dislike installing 
anything to "program files". (The space in the name causes problems.) I 
checked the "Add python to the path" checkbox. I installed everything 
except the python test files.

Attempting to run leo *correctly* raises a Tk dialog saying that Qt can not 
be imported.

I upgraded to the latest version of pip, then did `pip install PyQt5`. Now 
Leo ran.

*Summary*

I uninstalled Anaconda3. No more confusing envs. Bye bye activation woes.

In the worst case I would would have to reinstall python and all libs. That 
would be better than the endless confusion of multiple envs.

It's easy to install python using an executable installer and `pip install 
PyQt5`.

Leo is supposed to run on python 3.6, but python 3.7 looks like the 
practical minimum for new python installations.

I'll now experiment with installing the prerequisites for jupyter, 
holoviews etc. This should be straightforward with pip.

Edward

-- 
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
"leo-editor" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
to leo-editor+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
To view this discussion on the web visit 
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/leo-editor/856fbc79-74db-4653-8d96-978971d4aee0%40googlegroups.com.