Re: [Libreoffice-ux-advise] conditional format dialog
Hey Astron, 2012/10/12 Stefan Knorr heinzless...@gmail.com: Hello Markus, find attached a quick shot at some icon sets, modelled mostly after what MS have. Please recognise that this is only a work in progress, they haven't been tested very much and I suspect some will look rather badly on colourful/dark backgrounds. As these are SVG's you should be able to scale them freely, but you might want to give precedence to displaying them at multiples of 16 pixels in either direction in some way. I have now a working prototype (attached you find a screenshot). The first step now will be the OOXML import and it would be great if we could have at least the icons for interoperability. We can of course add more if you/the UX team has additional missing icon sets. The only problem I see right now is that they will consume quite a bit of space. We also need a solution for them in the dialog. Do you have an idea? We can put them into the All Cells mode and show a variable amount of conditions based on the icon set. Regards, Markus attachment: icon_sets.png___ Libreoffice-ux-advise mailing list Libreoffice-ux-advise@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice-ux-advise
Re: [Libreoffice-ux-advise] conditional format dialog
Hi Markus, Le 10/10/2012 08:15, Markus Mohrhard a écrit : Hey, I have been in the last two weeks refactoring the conditional formats dialogs. I finally implemented most parts of the original proposal, including the correct menu structure and finally also the ref input edit fields. Additionally I remove some of the ugly hacks that were a result of the short time the dialog was written in. Impressive work ! :-) I saw that the button to select a range is came back. It's position at the bottom of the dialog surprised me. It would be great if you could have a look at the dialog and mention any problems you see or make proposals how to make the dialog more beautiful. 1/ I think that the dialogs should be less high, indeed it is unlikely to have enough conditions to completely fill the window. With only one or two conditions we have a large empty space which I think not very beautiful. And on a 16:10 screen you don't see the bottom border of the window. Is it technically possible to make these dialogs resizable ? 2/ When opening dialog Format CF condition when the current cell has a CF, the condition for Cell value is is still empty (LO 3.7.0.0.alpha0+ (Build ID: a7efb9b)). Best regards. JBF -- Seuls des formats ouverts peuvent assurer la pérennité de vos documents. ___ Libreoffice-ux-advise mailing list Libreoffice-ux-advise@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice-ux-advise
Re: [Libreoffice-ux-advise] conditional format dialog
Hello Markus, find attached a quick shot at some icon sets, modelled mostly after what MS have. Please recognise that this is only a work in progress, they haven't been tested very much and I suspect some will look rather badly on colourful/dark backgrounds. As these are SVG's you should be able to scale them freely, but you might want to give precedence to displaying them at multiples of 16 pixels in either direction in some way. I have been in the last two weeks refactoring the conditional formats dialogs. I finally implemented most parts of the original proposal, including the correct menu structure and finally also the ref input edit fields. Additionally I remove some of the ugly hacks that were a result of the short time the dialog was written in. Yes, looks a lot better than the version that was in 3.6.0 already. There are a few things that are wrong, at least in my build (~yesterday afternoon): * Once one closes a conditional formatting dialogue, one is seemingly unable to edit the condition again, instead you will get a completely fresh dialogue when reopening it. * There is no colour indicating which rule is selected in the editor window, instead, one sees deselected next to deselected conditions. IMHO, that's not so good. What I'd hope for is a toned down/more transparent version of the system selection colour. * There is no horizontal line after the last rule. That seem a bit odd. * I don't know if that's an artifact of my GTK theme, but the Shrink window button looks inset. * The range displayed in the title of the editor window does not update when one updates the range at the bottom of the editor. * There is a number of problems with UI item's width/height and positioning towards each other (i.e. these are often not consistent enough) – example: the Range input field at the bottom of the editor does not extend to the right edge, but stops somewhere at ~80. Similarly, with a 2-value colour scale, you get a huge empty space between the Minimum and Maximum. * When a condition is deleted, no other condition is selected, instead all stay deselected. Ideally the condition just above the deleted should be selected then. * I am not sure if the dialog checks the sanity of input values properly in all cases, for instance should something like Cell value is less than Ghandi work? IMHO, you should get an error bar about that and should not be able to save this. * Also, as Caolan's work on Glade import has now landed on master, would it make sense to convert these dialogues already or are there too many things in them that are custom? Sadly I still have a little problem with the manage conditional formats dialog after making the conditional format dialog a ScAnyRefDlg. Therefore I had to disable the Add and Edit button until I find an ugly hack to circumvent these problems. :( Well, I hope you'll be able to circumvent that, otherwise it doesn't make a lot of sense shipping this dialogue of course. Regards, Astron. attachment: cond-form-icons.svg___ Libreoffice-ux-advise mailing list Libreoffice-ux-advise@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice-ux-advise
Re: [Libreoffice-ux-advise] conditional format dialog
Hey Stefan, find attached a quick shot at some icon sets, modelled mostly after what MS have. Please recognise that this is only a work in progress, they haven't been tested very much and I suspect some will look rather badly on colourful/dark backgrounds. As these are SVG's you should be able to scale them freely, but you might want to give precedence to displaying them at multiples of 16 pixels in either direction in some way. Great. I can work with them for now. We can change them later if necessary. Also I hope that I can implement it so that extending the icons will be easily possible. I have been in the last two weeks refactoring the conditional formats dialogs. I finally implemented most parts of the original proposal, including the correct menu structure and finally also the ref input edit fields. Additionally I remove some of the ugly hacks that were a result of the short time the dialog was written in. Yes, looks a lot better than the version that was in 3.6.0 already. There are a few things that are wrong, at least in my build (~yesterday afternoon): * Once one closes a conditional formatting dialogue, one is seemingly unable to edit the condition again, instead you will get a completely fresh dialogue when reopening it. I noticed this regression too. I did not yet look into it because it will most likely conflict with the Manage Conditional Formats solution. * There is no colour indicating which rule is selected in the editor window, instead, one sees deselected next to deselected conditions. IMHO, that's not so good. What I'd hope for is a toned down/more transparent version of the system selection colour. * There is no horizontal line after the last rule. That seem a bit odd. Ok, I don't see this problem. I have attached a screenshot of how it looks for me. * I don't know if that's an artifact of my GTK theme, but the Shrink window button looks inset. I see this too, but still have no idea how this happens. I'm not doing anything else with dialog than in the range name dialogs. I'll inspect that until the release. * The range displayed in the title of the editor window does not update when one updates the range at the bottom of the editor. Known problem. * There is a number of problems with UI item's width/height and positioning towards each other (i.e. these are often not consistent enough) – example: the Range input field at the bottom of the editor does not extend to the right edge, but stops somewhere at ~80. Similarly, with a 2-value colour scale, you get a huge empty space between the Minimum and Maximum. I know about these. I untangled the dialog elements between the different modes so that they cna now be positioned in the src file without worrying about another mode. I'm open to suggestions how to improve the layout of each of the entries. * When a condition is deleted, no other condition is selected, instead all stay deselected. Ideally the condition just above the deleted should be selected then. Ok, will look into this one. * I am not sure if the dialog checks the sanity of input values properly in all cases, for instance should something like Cell value is less than Ghandi work? IMHO, you should get an error bar about that and should not be able to save this. It is valid. Most formula expressions are valid in the normal condition case. Only in the new color scale and data bar cases the checks are stricter and formulas are only allowed if you select formula. * Also, as Caolan's work on Glade import has now landed on master, would it make sense to convert these dialogues already or are there too many things in them that are custom? I have no idea if the widget layout code can deal with adding contrls dynamicall into another control. That is something Caolan needs to answer. THe DataBar Settings Dialog however seems like a good and easy candidate for this. Thanks a lot for your input. Regards, Markus ___ Libreoffice-ux-advise mailing list Libreoffice-ux-advise@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice-ux-advise
Re: [Libreoffice-ux-advise] conditional format dialog
Hey, 2012/5/24 Stefan Knorr (Astron) heinzless...@googlemail.com: Hello all, I've updated the proposal with data bars/color scales in mind... https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Design/Whiteboards/Conditional_Formatting I've tried to describe it in the wiki... if there are questions, don't hesitate to ask. This is an amazing proposal and I'll try to implement it as good as possible. Sadly I will not be able to merge color scales/data bars together with the old conditional formatting. It is on my TODO list but the feature freeze is coming quickly and we are having some problems when we merge them together. I'll use two separate dialogs in 3.6 for color formats (color scale + data bars) and the old conditional formats and will merge them with the necessary core changes for 3.7. Then I noticed that your dialog contains some really advanced features for data bars that I won't support in 3.6: - borders for data bars are not possible right now - there is no support for the data bar direction right now and I'm missing a bit an option to switch between single color data bars and two color data bars. I'm sorry that I did not make it for the 3-6 release with a perfect solution but the necessary changes to support this were just too big. Thanks to all design people who helped to make this possible. Regards, Markus ___ Libreoffice-ux-advise mailing list Libreoffice-ux-advise@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice-ux-advise
Re: [Libreoffice-ux-advise] conditional format dialog
Hello all, I've updated the proposal with data bars/color scales in mind... https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Design/Whiteboards/Conditional_Formatting I've tried to describe it in the wiki... if there are questions, don't hesitate to ask. Astron. ___ Libreoffice-ux-advise mailing list Libreoffice-ux-advise@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice-ux-advise
Re: [Libreoffice-ux-advise] conditional format dialog
Hello Markus, Old planning has been moved a bit. Color scales and maybe data bars will make it into 3.6. Is there a good way to integrate it into the conditional formatting dialog? I am working on it. Meanwhile, there's an implementation detail that I would find useful to know: how are data bars and colour scales implemented in ODF? Are there styles for them [1]? Would styles make sense from your perspective? Actually, are data bars a specced ODF feature, or is this an extension of the spec? Astron. [1] I guess there is a difference between having presets [2] and styles, which is mostly that the preset is stored within the application configuration file, but style would be embedded in the spreadsheet itself. [2] Presets seem vital to me, else we'd have to confront _every_ user with more configuration than anyone we should want. ___ Libreoffice-ux-advise mailing list Libreoffice-ux-advise@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice-ux-advise
Re: [Libreoffice-ux-advise] conditional format dialog
Hi Markus, As already discussed in Hamburg I'm happy with the current proposal but I have one point that I only noticed today. Would it be possible to add a concept for data bars and color scales? Possible, certainly. I think, in the combo box Cell value is we'd need a third choice like (Apply to) All values. Then, you'd get a new combo box replacing equal to and Enter value. In this combo box, you could then choose Color Scale, Data Bars (and possibly Icon Sets). So far, so good... However, now there would be a myriad of elements that we'd need to fit somewhere, for colour scales e.g.: * number of colours (Excel offers two or three – which makes sense) * type (percentage, absolute value etc.), value, colour for minimum * type (percentage, absolute value etc.), value, colour for maximum * type (percentage, absolute value etc.), value, colour for midpoint (only in the case of a three colour scale) Data bars in Excel offer even more customisability... What I am getting at, is: it should be no problem to fit the data bars and colour scales into the dialogue, but for the detailed configuration, we'd need two somewhat ugly new dialogues... We already have a simple proof of concept for data bars from Michael and I would like to implement color scales at least for 3.7. Cool. Regards, Astron. ___ Libreoffice-ux-advise mailing list Libreoffice-ux-advise@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice-ux-advise
Re: [Libreoffice-ux-advise] conditional format dialog
Hi Pierre, 1. For the record: the ability to create a new style is one of the items of the list of styles. Yes, that's the intention. 2. I understand that we will defer the option of sorting conditions. However I disagree with the proposition the Add button Appended to the last condition. - It adds the risks and constraints mentioned - It does not allow to insert a condition. The user has to delete and recreate all of the following to insert a new one. My proposal (with your mockup) would be to have an Add button (left to Remove button) for each condition. These two buttons would be located below the preview area. - Click Add to add a condition after the selected one. - Insert becomes possible - Defer the sorting feature is less penalizing We never had sorting, so at least that's not a regression. I know it's a somewhat basic feature to leave out, but here's hoping that there will be someone to implements the basics for nice drag-drop stuff within the whole app (i. e. a reliable animation framework to show status changes; and of course drag and drop if that's not already in place). The problem with an Add button inside every condition is one of UI hierarchy. All current buttons within the condition field act directly upon the condition, but Add would not. Also, I don't believe there should be so much need to add conditions at arbitrary places in the list, so, no, I don't feel like adding that... - No risk of hidden button The button is designed this way, so the newcomer instantly knows where to click to add a condition (ease the learning curve). It comes with a few drawbacks, but I also described on the wiki how the major ones can be mitigated. 3. It is crucial to know what cell is the current one when defining a formula condition. Area should include Current Cell. Space is not an issue here (ability to hide the area) Oh, sorry I forgot about Regina's and your criticism... I'll update the mockup to include Origin Cell (which seemed to be the most fitting name to me, but please do comment!) in the next minutes. 4. My proposal mockup was a first attempt in the discussion. It included the ability to disable (not delete) a condition. While this may be useful, especially for testing, this would require changes since this property is not currently available. I propose not to retain this proposal. Okay, this matches up with what I thought. :) Astron. ___ Libreoffice-ux-advise mailing list Libreoffice-ux-advise@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice-ux-advise
Re: [Libreoffice-ux-advise] conditional format dialog
Hi Markus, I don't see that much use in the Conditional Format Manager. Excel uses a totally different concept and treats each conditional format entry as one entry in the manager while we would a set of conditional formats treat as one entry. Maybe I'm ignorant of something else here. Is there an existing way to find what you had formatted before? I (admittedly not a regular user of the feature) found myself stuck with not knowing where I had placed conditions previously (and it's seemingly important to know the exact range you formatted before). Astron, I would propose that we take some minutes in Hamburg and discuss this together. Definitely. Astron. ___ Libreoffice-ux-advise mailing list Libreoffice-ux-advise@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice-ux-advise
Re: [Libreoffice-ux-advise] conditional format dialog
Cor Nouws wrote The plus and minus keys to add - delete conditions (delete reset the condition) Are those supposed to be available for each condition? something like that (I included the enable property if we can add it) http://nabble.documentfoundation.org/file/n3743459/Capture-1.png Pierre-Yves -- View this message in context: http://nabble.documentfoundation.org/Libreoffice-ux-advise-conditional-format-dialog-tp3724185p3743459.html Sent from the UX-Advise mailing list archive at Nabble.com. ___ Libreoffice-ux-advise mailing list Libreoffice-ux-advise@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice-ux-advise
Re: [Libreoffice-ux-advise] conditional format dialog
pierre-yves samyn wrote (08-02-12 15:09) In the same token, there are good ideas in the conditional formatting dialog of the extension report builder (see screenshot). - Up and Down keys to change the order of conditions - Indeed handy ! The plus and minus keys to add - delete conditions (delete reset the condition) http://nabble.documentfoundation.org/file/n3726029/Capture-1.png Are those supposed to be available for each condition? Note: of course characters attributes would be unnecessary here (should keep the style preview as now). ++1 -- - Cor - http://nl.libreoffice.org ___ Libreoffice-ux-advise mailing list Libreoffice-ux-advise@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice-ux-advise
Re: [Libreoffice-ux-advise] conditional format dialog
Hi I forgot to mention that it would be interesting to keep the check box for each condition, to add the management of the state Enabled Yes/No of the condition Regards Pierre-Yves -- View this message in context: http://nabble.documentfoundation.org/Libreoffice-ux-advise-conditional-format-dialog-tp3724185p3728728.html Sent from the UX-Advise mailing list archive at Nabble.com. ___ Libreoffice-ux-advise mailing list Libreoffice-ux-advise@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice-ux-advise
Re: [Libreoffice-ux-advise] conditional format dialog
Hello Markus Are you sure of the number ? This Issue (https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=45085) seems to me not related with conditionnal formatting ? Regards PYS -- View this message in context: http://nabble.documentfoundation.org/Libreoffice-ux-advise-conditional-format-dialog-tp3724185p3725548.html Sent from the UX-Advise mailing list archive at Nabble.com. ___ Libreoffice-ux-advise mailing list Libreoffice-ux-advise@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice-ux-advise
Re: [Libreoffice-ux-advise] conditional format dialog
Hey, 2012/2/8 pierre-yves samyn pierre-yves.sa...@laposte.net: Hello Markus Are you sure of the number ? You're right. This was another bug report for me. Correct is https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=43937 Thanks, Markus ___ Libreoffice-ux-advise mailing list Libreoffice-ux-advise@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice-ux-advise
