Re: KVM and FCP disk without SAN switch

[Robert J Brenneman]

aahhh yea. a dark corner of memory gets its first ray of light
in a while

V7000 and other storwize related products ( SVC, FS9xxx ) now do NPIV on
the storage side by default if you are doing a new install. You have to
explicitly enable it if you are upgrading from older versions.

Ostensibly this feature is there to enable easier storage migrations down
the line, since the WWPN you're configuring into the SAN zone and on the
operating system side is now virtual. It is supposed to make switching the
physical storage box out from under the running OS by using box managed
copy services like metro-mirror easier and more automate-able without
having to take a planned outage.

This obviously also requires a SAN switch for it to work since it uses NPIV.

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Re: KVM and FCP disk without SAN switch

[Christian Borntraeger]

On 17.09.19 17:18, Johan Schelling wrote:
> I remember that when we started with KVM on LinuxONE around 3/4 years ago we 
> connected our V7000 directly (without a SAN switch) to the LinuxONE.  zVM 
> worked like a charm, but we had a lot of problems with (the then IBM 
> supplied) KVM…..  We had a lot of discussion with both the LinuxONE and the 
> storage guys as the documentation wasn’t quite clear on what was supported or 
> not. Problems we faced had to do with (hope I recall correctly) with WWPN’s 
> returned from the V7000 were  all mixed up… At the moment we added a SAN 
> switch all our problems were gone … ;-)
> Haven’t had any problems with KVM since …..   but haven’t checked the 
> situation without a SAN switch in the last years.

Yes, there was a firmware issue with the V7000s back then. But this has been 
fixed.
I still have a v7000 directly connected to my test z13 as an outcome of that 
bug back then.
But as I said, unless this is officially supported by all components you should 
better 
use a switch. 

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Re: KVM and FCP disk without SAN switch

[Johan Schelling]

I remember that when we started with KVM on LinuxONE around 3/4 years ago we 
connected our V7000 directly (without a SAN switch) to the LinuxONE.  zVM 
worked like a charm, but we had a lot of problems with (the then IBM supplied) 
KVM…..  We had a lot of discussion with both the LinuxONE and the storage guys 
as the documentation wasn’t quite clear on what was supported or not. Problems 
we faced had to do with (hope I recall correctly) with WWPN’s returned from the 
V7000 were  all mixed up… At the moment we added a SAN switch all our 
problems were gone … ;-)
Haven’t had any problems with KVM since …..   but haven’t checked the situation 
without a SAN switch in the last years.

Regards
Johan Schelling
Infrastructure Solution Architect


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ICU Proclaimer

Op 17 sep. 2019, om 12:56 heeft Christian Borntraeger 
mailto:borntrae...@linux.ibm.com>> het volgende 
geschreven:

On 16.09.19 21:19, Jim Elliott wrote:
For z/VM you must have a SAN switch to connect FCP attached disk. Is this
also true for KVM (Ubuntu if it matters)?

As KVM borrows the FCP support from Linux the answer is the same as for Linux 
in LPAR.
In general the Linux code supports switched fabric and direct attachment. The 
code does
not support arbitrated loop.
What you also need is a support statement that tells about the storage server 
and the
Z system. For example a V7000 DOES work when connected to a z Box (there is no 
fencing)
but it is not a supported config (at least it was not when I check 3 years ago).
So in general you are on the safe-side with a switch. Without a switch requires 
to check
the certifications.

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Re: KVM and FCP disk without SAN switch

[Robert J Brenneman]

Also be aware that if you want to use NPIV you /must/ have a switch and the
switch must explicitly support NPIV since that is a function that requires
both FCP Host adapter and switch support to work.

On Tue, Sep 17, 2019 at 7:35 AM Jim Elliott  wrote:

> Christian:
>
> Thanks. We will go with a switch to attach the V5010 and decided on an
> IBM/Cisco SAN32C-6 with 8-port 16 Gb bundle.
>
> Jim Elliott
> Senior Consultant - GlassHouse Systems Inc.
>
>
> On Tue, Sep 17, 2019 at 6:58 AM Christian Borntraeger <
> borntrae...@linux.ibm.com> wrote:
>
> > On 16.09.19 21:19, Jim Elliott wrote:
> > > For z/VM you must have a SAN switch to connect FCP attached disk. Is
> this
> > > also true for KVM (Ubuntu if it matters)?
> >
> > As KVM borrows the FCP support from Linux the answer is the same as for
> > Linux in LPAR.
> > In general the Linux code supports switched fabric and direct attachment.
> > The code does
> > not support arbitrated loop.
> > What you also need is a support statement that tells about the storage
> > server and the
> > Z system. For example a V7000 DOES work when connected to a z Box (there
> > is no fencing)
> > but it is not a supported config (at least it was not when I check 3
> years
> > ago).
> > So in general you are on the safe-side with a switch. Without a switch
> > requires to check
> > the certifications.
> >
> > --
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> > visit
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> >
>
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Jay Brenneman

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Re: KVM and FCP disk without SAN switch

[Jim Elliott]

Christian:

Thanks. We will go with a switch to attach the V5010 and decided on an
IBM/Cisco SAN32C-6 with 8-port 16 Gb bundle.

Jim Elliott
Senior Consultant - GlassHouse Systems Inc.


On Tue, Sep 17, 2019 at 6:58 AM Christian Borntraeger <
borntrae...@linux.ibm.com> wrote:

> On 16.09.19 21:19, Jim Elliott wrote:
> > For z/VM you must have a SAN switch to connect FCP attached disk. Is this
> > also true for KVM (Ubuntu if it matters)?
>
> As KVM borrows the FCP support from Linux the answer is the same as for
> Linux in LPAR.
> In general the Linux code supports switched fabric and direct attachment.
> The code does
> not support arbitrated loop.
> What you also need is a support statement that tells about the storage
> server and the
> Z system. For example a V7000 DOES work when connected to a z Box (there
> is no fencing)
> but it is not a supported config (at least it was not when I check 3 years
> ago).
> So in general you are on the safe-side with a switch. Without a switch
> requires to check
> the certifications.
>
> --
> For LINUX-390 subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
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> visit
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Re: KVM and FCP disk without SAN switch

[Christian Borntraeger]

On 16.09.19 21:19, Jim Elliott wrote:
> For z/VM you must have a SAN switch to connect FCP attached disk. Is this
> also true for KVM (Ubuntu if it matters)?

As KVM borrows the FCP support from Linux the answer is the same as for Linux 
in LPAR.
In general the Linux code supports switched fabric and direct attachment. The 
code does
not support arbitrated loop.
What you also need is a support statement that tells about the storage server 
and the
Z system. For example a V7000 DOES work when connected to a z Box (there is no 
fencing)
but it is not a supported config (at least it was not when I check 3 years ago).
So in general you are on the safe-side with a switch. Without a switch requires 
to check
the certifications.

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Re: KVM and FCP disk without SAN switch

[Martha McConaghy]

Carlos is right.  It really doesn't matter what system is on the Z (VM 
or Linux), it has more to do with the FCP FICON adapters. The v 
boxes don't have the protocol to talk to FCP directly, while the more 
sophistcated DS8xxx do.  So, no matter what system you are talking to on 
Z, you would need a switch for the v5010.


Martha

On 9/16/2019 4:44 PM, Jim Elliott wrote:

Carlos:
  
Thanks. It will be a V5010 so we will configure a small SAN switch.
  
Jim Elliott

Senior Consultant - GlassHouse Systems Inc.
  
  
On Mon, Sep 16, 2019 at 4:39 PM Bodra - Pessoal  wrote:
  

 From our experience with KVM running on a zBox if you use as storage
devices IBM V5000 or V7000 you need to use a San Switch (2498-Bxx) to
connect. If you use storage devices IBM DS8800/8870, you can connect
directly. These are some tests that we did here at our shop.


Carlos Bodra
IBM zEnterprise Certified
São Paulo – SP – Brazil


-Mensagem original-
De: Linux on 390 Port  Em nome de Jim Elliott
Enviada em: segunda-feira, 16 de setembro de 2019 16:20
Para: LINUX-390@VM.MARIST.EDU
Assunto: KVM and FCP disk without SAN switch

For z/VM you must have a SAN switch to connect FCP attached disk. Is this
also true for KVM (Ubuntu if it matters)?

Jim Elliott
Senior Consultant - GlassHouse Systems Inc.

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--
Martha McConaghy
Marist: System Architect/Technical Lead
SHARE Association: Vice President
Marist College IT
Poughkeepsie, NY 12601

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Re: KVM and FCP disk without SAN switch

[Jim Elliott]

Carlos:

Thanks. It will be a V5010 so we will configure a small SAN switch.

Jim Elliott
Senior Consultant - GlassHouse Systems Inc.


On Mon, Sep 16, 2019 at 4:39 PM Bodra - Pessoal  wrote:

> From our experience with KVM running on a zBox if you use as storage
> devices IBM V5000 or V7000 you need to use a San Switch (2498-Bxx) to
> connect. If you use storage devices IBM DS8800/8870, you can connect
> directly. These are some tests that we did here at our shop.
>
>
> Carlos Bodra
> IBM zEnterprise Certified
> São Paulo – SP – Brazil
>
>
> -Mensagem original-
> De: Linux on 390 Port  Em nome de Jim Elliott
> Enviada em: segunda-feira, 16 de setembro de 2019 16:20
> Para: LINUX-390@VM.MARIST.EDU
> Assunto: KVM and FCP disk without SAN switch
>
> For z/VM you must have a SAN switch to connect FCP attached disk. Is this
> also true for KVM (Ubuntu if it matters)?
>
> Jim Elliott
> Senior Consultant - GlassHouse Systems Inc.
>
> --
> For LINUX-390 subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
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Re: KVM and FCP disk without SAN switch

[Adolph Kahan]

Yes, it is. With KVM you have more switch options than with z/VM

Adolph Kahan | Senior Consultant
Tel: +1 (416) 229-2950 x304 | Mobile: +1 (416) 822-3329
  

-Original Message-
From: Linux on 390 Port  On Behalf Of Jim Elliott
Sent: Monday, September 16, 2019 3:20 PM
To: LINUX-390@VM.MARIST.EDU
Subject: KVM and FCP disk without SAN switch

For z/VM you must have a SAN switch to connect FCP attached disk. Is this also 
true for KVM (Ubuntu if it matters)?

Jim Elliott
Senior Consultant - GlassHouse Systems Inc.

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