Re: [LAD] Open Source Design (paid and pro bono design)
On Thu, 2018-11-29 at 18:02 +0100, Thorsten Wilms wrote: > On 29/11/2018 17.32, Louigi Verona wrote: > > Interesting that on their goals page they never mention "users" or > > "customers". So how are they going to understand what works if users are > > never consulted? > > That's clearly up to every single project. So from the point of view of > "Open Source Design", the question is what works or doesn't work > regarding designer involvement and designer-developer interaction. An issue advertising agencies know is the medium-sized business customer of the advertising agencies who already has got an idea. "My wife likes red pullovers and penguins. The logo for my power drill company should contain a penguin wearing a red pullover." The advertising agencies try to explain that the logo should represent the power drills and perhaps something else, maybe environmental sustainability or what ever is up to date, but there's no chance, if the wife of the customer likes red pullovers and penguins. At least the https://opensourcedesign.net job offers come with this issue, too, see https://design.blog.documentfoundation.org/2017/06/28/competition-libreoffice-mascot/, the mailing list already knows what they like and every Tom, Dick and Harry has some bikeshedding to contribute. Regarding software development the users' needs are important, regarding logo design the designers are the experts and nobody else. Big companies usually know this. ___ Linux-audio-dev mailing list Linux-audio-dev@lists.linuxaudio.org https://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-dev
Re: [LAD] Open Source Design (paid and pro bono design)
On Thu, Nov 29, 2018 at 10:28 AM Paul Davis wrote: > > Lisp is an excellent user interface, for the right kind of user. > Good point, Paul. I was mostly lauding the article's main principle that adding a preference has a cost and it's worth evaluating the benefit of each preference offered in a program. I personally extended that to mean each available control in the audio programs I'm writing. ___ Linux-audio-dev mailing list Linux-audio-dev@lists.linuxaudio.org https://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-dev
Re: [LAD] Open Source Design (paid and pro bono design)
On Thu, Nov 29, 2018 at 12:24 PM Spencer Jackson wrote: > https://ometer.com/preferences.html was also very good. I plan to read > more later. > "Lisp is not a good user interface." this is a fallacy. Lisp is an excellent user interface, for the right kind of user. Knowing who you are designing for, or more generally, what expectations you are trying to meet, is critical. No doubt Lisp is a poor choice of user interface for a large majority of users. But most programs do not target "most users", rather a small subset of users with particular goals, workflows, skills and needs. For them, Lisp might be just the right thing. ___ Linux-audio-dev mailing list Linux-audio-dev@lists.linuxaudio.org https://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-dev
Re: [LAD] Open Source Design (paid and pro bono design)
On Thu, Nov 29, 2018 at 9:33 AM Louigi Verona wrote: > Interesting that on their goals page they never mention "users" or > "customers". So how are they going to understand what works if users are > never consulted? This could be a mistake that would make the whole > initiative void. Designers should help design the software, but it has to > be based on users feedback, with constant testing and iterations. I don't > see any process there that would actually involve actual users. > >From what I can tell, they're largely focused on advocacy, awareness, and focusing on improving tools and processes to allow designers and developers to work together more effectively. With some perusal of the forum and articles there, I get the impression that job board is already more populus than the design community surrounding it. And I believe any designer knows improvements must be user-centric, but that isn't the current obstacle preventing good design in FLOSS software. Its a great community to be aware of, and I think we could all learn some things by participating in it, even if we don't ever get designers contributing to our projects directly. _Spencer p.s. I read this article linked from their resources section: http://www.nngroup.com/articles/first-rule-of-usability-dont-listen-to-users/ from which I understand user feedback is a very poor way to design a useable program. :p :) https://ometer.com/preferences.html was also very good. I plan to read more later. ___ Linux-audio-dev mailing list Linux-audio-dev@lists.linuxaudio.org https://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-dev
Re: [LAD] Open Source Design (paid and pro bono design)
On 29/11/2018 17.32, Louigi Verona wrote: Interesting that on their goals page they never mention "users" or "customers". So how are they going to understand what works if users are never consulted? That's clearly up to every single project. So from the point of view of "Open Source Design", the question is what works or doesn't work regarding designer involvement and designer-developer interaction. Now one may complain that the Why is kinda missing. Obviously there's an assumption that "opening up the design process" and so on is a good thing that doesn't need to be explained. It is then up to said designers and developers to care about user feedback, iterations, testing. Or not. One may concentrate on general fitness for purpose, pay not too much attention to the subset of users that gets loud, and lack the resources to do real user testing, anyway! ;) The last time I got across that job listing, the few paid items were too old already. -- Thorsten Wilms thorwil's design for free software: http://thorwil.wordpress.com/ ___ Linux-audio-dev mailing list Linux-audio-dev@lists.linuxaudio.org https://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-dev
Re: [LAD] Open Source Design (paid and pro bono design)
On 2018-11-29 17:32:44 (+0100), Louigi Verona wrote: > Interesting that on their goals page they never mention "users" or > "customers". So how are they going to understand what works if users > are never consulted? This could be a mistake that would make the whole > initiative void. Designers should help design the software, but it has > to be based on users feedback, with constant testing and iterations. I > don't see any process there that would actually involve actual users. Valid point and maybe something worth mentioning to them :) The overall scope seems a little undefined, which could also be one of the reasons why user feedback to "products" is not mentioned. Best, David -- https://sleepmap.de signature.asc Description: PGP signature ___ Linux-audio-dev mailing list Linux-audio-dev@lists.linuxaudio.org https://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-dev
Re: [LAD] Open Source Design (paid and pro bono design)
Interesting that on their goals page they never mention "users" or "customers". So how are they going to understand what works if users are never consulted? This could be a mistake that would make the whole initiative void. Designers should help design the software, but it has to be based on users feedback, with constant testing and iterations. I don't see any process there that would actually involve actual users. Louigi Verona https://louigiverona.com/ On Thu, Nov 29, 2018 at 4:56 PM Louigi Verona wrote: > This is totally a great initiative! Will definitely read up on their > activities. > > > Louigi Verona > https://louigiverona.com/ > > > On Thu, Nov 29, 2018 at 4:54 PM David Runge wrote: > >> Hey all, >> >> I thought I'd spread the word about Open Source Design [1], which is a >> community of designers and developers that wants to improve usability of >> free software (never mind the name, I guess most people are not as >> strict about it as e.g. Richard Stallman ;-) ). >> >> A friend (hey Sam!) made me aware of this recently and I think the >> community can be a great opportunity to either learn about design or >> find someone to help your project get a facelift (or a logo, or >> whatever). This can be done by posting a request for a "job" (paid or >> unpaid) [2] on their site. >> >> Maybe it's of help to anyone here. >> >> Best, >> David >> >> [1] https://opensourcedesign.net/ >> [2] https://opensourcedesign.net/jobs/ >> >> -- >> https://sleepmap.de >> ___ >> Linux-audio-dev mailing list >> Linux-audio-dev@lists.linuxaudio.org >> https://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-dev >> > ___ Linux-audio-dev mailing list Linux-audio-dev@lists.linuxaudio.org https://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-dev
Re: [LAD] Open Source Design (paid and pro bono design)
This is totally a great initiative! Will definitely read up on their activities. Louigi Verona https://louigiverona.com/ On Thu, Nov 29, 2018 at 4:54 PM David Runge wrote: > Hey all, > > I thought I'd spread the word about Open Source Design [1], which is a > community of designers and developers that wants to improve usability of > free software (never mind the name, I guess most people are not as > strict about it as e.g. Richard Stallman ;-) ). > > A friend (hey Sam!) made me aware of this recently and I think the > community can be a great opportunity to either learn about design or > find someone to help your project get a facelift (or a logo, or > whatever). This can be done by posting a request for a "job" (paid or > unpaid) [2] on their site. > > Maybe it's of help to anyone here. > > Best, > David > > [1] https://opensourcedesign.net/ > [2] https://opensourcedesign.net/jobs/ > > -- > https://sleepmap.de > ___ > Linux-audio-dev mailing list > Linux-audio-dev@lists.linuxaudio.org > https://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-dev > ___ Linux-audio-dev mailing list Linux-audio-dev@lists.linuxaudio.org https://lists.linuxaudio.org/listinfo/linux-audio-dev
