Re: [RMS11] Re: Finally - A RMS talk in Tel-Aviv. Including details

2011-07-17 Thread Stan Goodman

On 07/18/2011 01:03 AM, Moish wrote:
So, free speech has nothing to do with individuals?  well,  isn't you 
right of free speech allows you to say

that I only the foggiest notion of "free speech"?

No, as I said, the concept of free speech has to do only with preventing 
governments from forbidding or punishing expressions of speech. I said 
nothing ad hominem, only that whoever (was that you?) wrote that 
paragraph never sat in a Civics class, i.e. knows nothing about the 
concept of free speech. You are not alone, by the way.


--
Stan Goodman
Qiryat Tiv'on
Israel


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[RMS11] Re: Finally - A RMS talk in Tel-Aviv. Including details

2011-07-17 Thread Moish

  
  
On 17/07/2011 21:58, Stan Goodman wrote:
On
  07/17/2011 11:20 PM, Moish wrote:
  
  On 17/07/2011 20:39, geoffrey mendelson
wrote:


  
  On Jul 17, 2011, at 8:43 PM, Mordecha Behar wrote:
  
  Hey, I'm not saying we should sue, I'm
just saying it's an option. And not a good one.

We will alienate ourselves in the worldwide community of
open software, and probably burn several bridges which will
be very hard to rebuild.

I too resent the whole idea of mixing computer science and
politics. It makes the whole thing stink like unwashed feet.

I'm just a little disappointed that the whole saga unraveled
like this. I had higher opinions of RMS before this.


  
  
  This pretty much says that he is supporting a boycott and that
  it's fsf.org's policy. IMHO he should be sued. I'm not going
  to do it, but if I were presented with a poll or petition
  would say so.
  
  
  If he did not want to be offensive or politicize himself or
  the fsf, he could of said "So I decided to not offend
  anyone.." but he did not he said that "decided to follow
  ... the boycott".
  
  
  To toss out some ad homynms, he's a blight on free speech and
  free software and he and his fsf have outlived their
  usefulness. He has crossed the line over which he should never
  cross, mixing free software with support of terrorists.
  
  
  
  Geoff.
  
  

Ad Hominem and Ad Rem:

  Have some of you gone mad ?!

  Gagging,  prosecution, do i hear execution ?


Perhaps he's an hypocrite
feeble-minded-self-hating-jewish-leftists,  a member of J
street, or god forbidden, a liberal,   SO WHAT?


BLOCKING free speech!  How DARE you!  Have you lost your mind !?

  
  
  Arguably, he alone (in concert with his Palestinian hosts), is the
  one limiting free speech. Nobody here has intimated that he can't
  voice his views, whatever they are, although there was some talk
  about expressing them in the name of FSF. The discussion has
  nothing whatever to dowith free speech.
  
  
  The fact is, by the way, that the right of free speech has nothing
  to do with individuals at all, but is entirely a fence against
  government. The government of a free country may not forbid
  _expression_ of protected speech (there are limitations to that as
  well). Individuals or groups are certainly not obligated to
  listen. You can't holler "free speech" if somebody insists upon
  telling you his views that you don't want to hear. The only
  free-speech issue that would arise in connection with Stallman
  would be if the Government should forbid or punish him for
  expressing them.
  
  
  The quotations above, beginning with "Ad hominem" and ending with
  "Have you lost your mind!?" were written by someone who never sat
  in a Civics class, and who has only the foggiest notion of what
  "free speech" actually means.
  


So, free speech has nothing to do with individuals?  well,  isn't
you right of free speech allows you to say
that I only the foggiest notion of "free speech"?

Oh my oh my,  and I expected gushing intelect and shrewd arguments.

And that's the end of me trolling :) 

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary

  1ad ho·mi·nem
   adj \(ˈ)ad-ˈhä-mə-ˌnem, -nəm\
Definition of AD HOMINEM

  
1
 :
appealing to feelings or prejudices rather than intellect 
  
  
2
 :
marked by or being an attack on an opponent's character
rather than by an answer to the contentions made 
  



  ad rem
   adv or adj \(ˌ)ad-ˈrem\
Definition of AD REM

  
 : to
the point or purpose : relevantly
  
  


-- 
Moish
  



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[RMS11] Re: Finally - A RMS talk in Tel-Aviv. Including details

2011-07-17 Thread Omer Zak
On Sun, 2011-07-17 at 22:58 +0300, Stan Goodman wrote:
> Arguably, he alone (in concert with his Palestinian hosts), is the one 
> limiting free speech.

This statement does not correspond to the facts of the case.

The principle that RMS is violating is not the principle of free speech.
The principle being violated is that of communications and cooperation
in pursuit of a worthwhile endeavor (academic research or Free Software
development) overriding political differences.

Granted, the principle of academic research/Free Software development
cooperation could force us to swallow rather giant foul-tasting frogs.
Such as hypothetical cooperation with the Hizbollah in development and
perfection of FriBidi or an hypothetical collaboration with Nazis in a
project of developing a Free genealogical software, with accompanying
database of freely-available genealogical information.

--- Omer
-- 
Palestinians did not firmly and vocally and strongly denounce the Hannover 
attack 
(http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/06/24/german-youths-attack-jewi_n_623922.html)
 but rather supported the attack, even though it is yet another proof why Jews 
need their own country in which they can live safely.
My own blog is at http://www.zak.co.il/tddpirate/

My opinions, as expressed in this E-mail message, are mine alone.
They do not represent the official policy of any organization with which
I may be affiliated in any way.
WARNING TO SPAMMERS:  at http://www.zak.co.il/spamwarning.html


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