Re: Commercial/FOSS C++ dev env for Linux?
Hi Amos, I had the chance to help developer, which use to work with Visual Studio, start using Linux/Unix environment. My conclusions were: - Most Linux IDE use gdb as a debugger, some wrap it more user friendly and some less. - Kdevelope, DDD and Emacs plug-in are very useful for the Unix/Linux users. - From the few that I've talked with SlickEdit is good value for money, It has most of the feature you expect moving from visual studio (but I don't have any personal experience) Eclipse: - A very friendly environment and 3.2 works great for me. - It offers a variety of plug-ins which make life very easy. - you can integrate Vi/emacs or what ever as your editor. The gdb as a straightforward GUI - when trying to run in a debug mode it will open a few option choosing windows, which you can press the default OK or use it to set you multithreaded or what ever specific options you require. - There are plug-ins for most known source control - And for your specific situation it has slides which instruct you how to get started. To sum things up: moving from Visual Studio, you would probably save your worker time with SlickEdit, but if your planning to use it in the future by more then one developer and you'll have the time to learn it, Eclipse is a very good choice. Nevertheless if your worker wish to consult, please feel free to give him my details, you can find them in the bottom. Amos Shapira wrote: On 01/09/07, Yotam Rubin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: What's the main issue? Is it that it's impossible to work with GDB because it crashes, or is it gdb's command line interface? If the problem is the latter, then have him use a decent frontend. I use emacs's gdbsrc mode, which integrates control of the debugger with your existing code buffers. Some people use external tools, but I prefer to integrate debugging with editing. I think his main issue is that gdb is not very convenient to debug multi-threaded applications. He already has a huge learning curve to tackle just to use the Linux shell and on top of that his ACE-based application is far from trivial so adding to this having to go through reams of gdb documentation while he has a very tight deadline to deliver working code for production is just too much so something that can help him do this with the convenience of a GUI would be much appreciated. Love or hate Microsoft, last time I heard all serious programmers agreed that they did well with Visual Studio as a C++ IDE, and that's what I have to stack up against. Emacs popped to my mind too as something that I remember that many many years ago was the greatest way to use gdb, but as someone who have since switched mostly to VI and X11-based editors I suspect it'll take even myself a good few hours to start feeling comfortable again with it. How is its debugging point-and-click interface these days? --Amos -- Ravid Baruch Naali [EMAIL PROTECTED] +972 4 6732729 +972 52 5830021 = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Commercial/FOSS C++ dev env for Linux?
Amos Shapira wrote: On 01/09/07, *Yotam Rubin* [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: What's the main issue? Is it that it's impossible to work with GDB because it crashes, or is it gdb's command line interface? If the problem is the latter, then have him use a decent frontend. I use emacs's gdbsrc mode, which integrates control of the debugger with your existing code buffers. Some people use external tools, but I prefer to integrate debugging with editing. I think his main issue is that gdb is not very convenient to debug multi-threaded applications. He already has a huge learning curve to tackle just to use the Linux shell and on top of that his ACE-based application is far from trivial so adding to this having to go through reams of gdb documentation while he has a very tight deadline to deliver working code for production is just too much so something that can help him do this with the convenience of a GUI would be much appreciated. Love or hate Microsoft, last time I heard all serious programmers agreed that they did well with Visual Studio as a C++ IDE, and that's what I have to stack up against. Use Eclipse and CDT. It's the only tool that will stack up against Visual Studio. It also has a wonderful multi-threaded debugging support. Gilad = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Commercial/FOSS C++ dev env for Linux?
i Agree, The CDT is a great tool, it's saves development time by supporting realtime compilation. Visual Studio does not support this feature unless installing the visual assist application. -Udi. On 9/2/07, Gilad Ben-Yossef [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Amos Shapira wrote: On 01/09/07, *Yotam Rubin* [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: What's the main issue? Is it that it's impossible to work with GDB because it crashes, or is it gdb's command line interface? If the problem is the latter, then have him use a decent frontend. I use emacs's gdbsrc mode, which integrates control of the debugger with your existing code buffers. Some people use external tools, but I prefer to integrate debugging with editing. I think his main issue is that gdb is not very convenient to debug multi-threaded applications. He already has a huge learning curve to tackle just to use the Linux shell and on top of that his ACE-based application is far from trivial so adding to this having to go through reams of gdb documentation while he has a very tight deadline to deliver working code for production is just too much so something that can help him do this with the convenience of a GUI would be much appreciated. Love or hate Microsoft, last time I heard all serious programmers agreed that they did well with Visual Studio as a C++ IDE, and that's what I have to stack up against. Use Eclipse and CDT. It's the only tool that will stack up against Visual Studio. It also has a wonderful multi-threaded debugging support. Gilad = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Udi Shamir, System Security Hacker Linux, Unix System Developer, Senior System Administrator http://sf.net/projects/dirstat http://sf.net/projects/em-module http://www.linkedin/in/udishamir +972-054-6-583337
Re: Commercial/FOSS C++ dev env for Linux?
Shamir Udi wrote: i Agree, The CDT is a great tool, it's saves development time by supporting realtime compilation. Heheh... actually, that's the first thing I turn off in a new installation of Eclipse/CDT ;-) But this is a question of taste, nothing more. Seriously, I've walked through and hand held more then 40 different code developing corporations in the last 4 years from zero Linux knowledge to developing whole products based on it. Eclipse/CDT is really your only option and it's a very good option (but Visual SlickEdit is a very close second, some would claim the first option). Tips to remember: 1. Always use the latest version stable version. 2. If something doesn't work that should, use the in program menu to look for and install updates. 3. If a functionality that your developer wants is not available by default, look for a plug in. Oh, and get a fast machine. It is a huge JAVA program after all... :-) Gilad = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Commercial/FOSS C++ dev env for Linux?
On 02/09/07, Gilad Ben-Yossef [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Shamir Udi wrote: i Agree, The CDT is a great tool, it's saves development time by supporting realtime compilation. Seriously, I've walked through and hand held more then 40 different code developing corporations in the last 4 years from zero Linux knowledge to developing whole products based on it. Eclipse/CDT is really your only option and it's a very good option (but Visual SlickEdit is a very close second, some would claim the first option). Thanks for the tips and recommendations - it gives a lot of weight for CDT to hear this. Cheers, --Amos
Re: Commercial/FOSS C++ dev env for Linux?
On 01/09/07, Marc Volovic [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hiya. First - SlickEdit costs US$250-450 per seat. And while it is ok as an IDE, it has quite a few limitations especially as far as debugging is concerned. From its web site I didn't see it mention debugger interface at all, actually. There are NO good integrated development environments for Linux. Slickedit, Eclipse, etc, are a reasonable set of editing tools, but very very very mediocre debugging tools. You could try TotalView and Code Insight (Debugger and Editor). TotalView is the only commercial one I found when Googl'ing for linux debugger, but the price is pretty steep: http://www.totalviewtech.com/Purchase/Storefront/TotalViewIndividual.php I'll try to give him another push to give KDevelop and CDT a go - it'll require him to install X11 on his Windows laptop and hopefully the dev server will handle the Java app. Cheers, --Amos
Re: Commercial/FOSS C++ dev env for Linux?
Amos Shapira wrote: On 01/09/07, *Marc Volovic* [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] I'll try to give him another push to give KDevelop and CDT a go - it'll require him to install X11 on his Windows laptop and hopefully the dev server will handle the Java app. Here's a another tip: use VNC (or tight vnc, or NX or any of that sort), not X11. Gilad = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Commercial/FOSS C++ dev env for Linux?
Hello, We are at this stage were the lead C++ developer needs to switch over our mostly ACE-based applications from Windows to Linux and needs a GOOD and CONVENIENT debugging environment for multi-threaded applications. He's giving a honest effort to use gdb but so far found it very hard to work with and at least once he managed to get gdb itself to crash. Can anyone recommend a REALLY USEFUL(TM) debugger for Linux, even cheap commercial ones (up to around 100$ per seat)? Please spare me the preaching about gdb being so great - that guy, who haven't touched Linux until last week, is already doing a tremendous effort to convert and needs any tool he can to help him. At least one of the target environments will be RHEL4 (due to customer's demands) but there is a good chance the Debian will be our internal SOE. Thanks, --Amos
Re: Commercial/FOSS C++ dev env for Linux?
On 9/1/07, Amos Shapira [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hello, We are at this stage were the lead C++ developer needs to switch over our mostly ACE-based applications from Windows to Linux and needs a GOOD and CONVENIENT debugging environment for multi-threaded applications. He's giving a honest effort to use gdb but so far found it very hard to work with and at least once he managed to get gdb itself to crash. Can anyone recommend a REALLY USEFUL(TM) debugger for Linux, even cheap commercial ones (up to around 100$ per seat)? Please spare me the preaching about gdb being so great - that guy, who haven't touched Linux until last week, is already doing a tremendous effort to convert and needs any tool he can to help him. At least one of the target environments will be RHEL4 (due to customer's demands) but there is a good chance the Debian will be our internal SOE. Have him look at http://www.slickedit.com/ Thanks, --Amos -- Cheers, Maxim Veksler Free as in Freedom - Do u GNU ? = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Commercial/FOSS C++ dev env for Linux?
Hiya. First - SlickEdit costs US$250-450 per seat. And while it is ok as an IDE, it has quite a few limitations especially as far as debugging is concerned. There are NO good integrated development environments for Linux. Slickedit, Eclipse, etc, are a reasonable set of editing tools, but very very very mediocre debugging tools. You could try TotalView and Code Insight (Debugger and Editor). Marc - Maxim Veksler [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 9/1/07, Amos Shapira [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hello, We are at this stage were the lead C++ developer needs to switch over our mostly ACE-based applications from Windows to Linux and needs a GOOD and CONVENIENT debugging environment for multi-threaded applications. He's giving a honest effort to use gdb but so far found it very hard to work with and at least once he managed to get gdb itself to crash. Can anyone recommend a REALLY USEFUL(TM) debugger for Linux, even cheap commercial ones (up to around 100$ per seat)? Please spare me the preaching about gdb being so great - that guy, who haven't touched Linux until last week, is already doing a tremendous effort to convert and needs any tool he can to help him. At least one of the target environments will be RHEL4 (due to customer's demands) but there is a good chance the Debian will be our internal SOE. Have him look at http://www.slickedit.com/ Thanks, --Amos -- Cheers, Maxim Veksler Free as in Freedom - Do u GNU ? = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED] = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Commercial/FOSS C++ dev env for Linux?
What's the main issue? Is it that it's impossible to work with GDB because it crashes, or is it gdb's command line interface? If the problem is the latter, then have him use a decent frontend. I use emacs's gdbsrc mode, which integrates control of the debugger with your existing code buffers. Some people use external tools, but I prefer to integrate debugging with editing. Yotam, P.S. Have him use emacs22 On 9/1/07, Amos Shapira [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hello, We are at this stage were the lead C++ developer needs to switch over our mostly ACE-based applications from Windows to Linux and needs a GOOD and CONVENIENT debugging environment for multi-threaded applications. He's giving a honest effort to use gdb but so far found it very hard to work with and at least once he managed to get gdb itself to crash. Can anyone recommend a REALLY USEFUL(TM) debugger for Linux, even cheap commercial ones (up to around 100$ per seat)? Please spare me the preaching about gdb being so great - that guy, who haven't touched Linux until last week, is already doing a tremendous effort to convert and needs any tool he can to help him. At least one of the target environments will be RHEL4 (due to customer's demands) but there is a good chance the Debian will be our internal SOE. Thanks, --Amos
Re: Commercial/FOSS C++ dev env for Linux?
Kdevelop is a really nice IDE and has great gdb integration, I prefer it over eclipse. On 9/1/07, Yotam Rubin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: What's the main issue? Is it that it's impossible to work with GDB because it crashes, or is it gdb's command line interface? If the problem is the latter, then have him use a decent frontend. I use emacs's gdbsrc mode, which integrates control of the debugger with your existing code buffers. Some people use external tools, but I prefer to integrate debugging with editing. Yotam, P.S. Have him use emacs22 On 9/1/07, Amos Shapira [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hello, We are at this stage were the lead C++ developer needs to switch over our mostly ACE-based applications from Windows to Linux and needs a GOOD and CONVENIENT debugging environment for multi-threaded applications. He's giving a honest effort to use gdb but so far found it very hard to work with and at least once he managed to get gdb itself to crash. Can anyone recommend a REALLY USEFUL(TM) debugger for Linux, even cheap commercial ones (up to around 100$ per seat)? Please spare me the preaching about gdb being so great - that guy, who haven't touched Linux until last week, is already doing a tremendous effort to convert and needs any tool he can to help him. At least one of the target environments will be RHEL4 (due to customer's demands) but there is a good chance the Debian will be our internal SOE. Thanks, --Amos
Re: Commercial/FOSS C++ dev env for Linux?
On Sat, 2007-09-01 at 08:16 +, Amos Shapira wrote: Hello, We are at this stage were the lead C++ developer needs to switch over our mostly ACE-based applications from Windows to Linux and needs a GOOD and CONVENIENT debugging environment for multi-threaded applications. Can anyone recommend a REALLY USEFUL(TM) debugger for Linux, even cheap commercial ones (up to around 100$ per seat)? At the time, I was working with kdedevelope from The Kompany (the product is now called Kode). It was very useful and had very good project management capabilities (including building make scripts for you that you could edit w/o breaking the ide) as well as debugging - I think its using gdb as the backend, but never bothered to find out. -- Oded = To unsubscribe, send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] with the word unsubscribe in the message body, e.g., run the command echo unsubscribe | mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Commercial/FOSS C++ dev env for Linux?
On 01/09/07, Yotam Rubin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: What's the main issue? Is it that it's impossible to work with GDB because it crashes, or is it gdb's command line interface? If the problem is the latter, then have him use a decent frontend. I use emacs's gdbsrc mode, which integrates control of the debugger with your existing code buffers. Some people use external tools, but I prefer to integrate debugging with editing. I think his main issue is that gdb is not very convenient to debug multi-threaded applications. He already has a huge learning curve to tackle just to use the Linux shell and on top of that his ACE-based application is far from trivial so adding to this having to go through reams of gdb documentation while he has a very tight deadline to deliver working code for production is just too much so something that can help him do this with the convenience of a GUI would be much appreciated. Love or hate Microsoft, last time I heard all serious programmers agreed that they did well with Visual Studio as a C++ IDE, and that's what I have to stack up against. Emacs popped to my mind too as something that I remember that many many years ago was the greatest way to use gdb, but as someone who have since switched mostly to VI and X11-based editors I suspect it'll take even myself a good few hours to start feeling comfortable again with it. How is its debugging point-and-click interface these days? --Amos
