Re: Hebrew on Android (and other issues)
Dov Grobgeld wrote: I'm curious. Did your Hebrew support modifications include full BiDi support? Did you write the bidi code yourself, or did you use some known library? I wrote about it extensively at the time: http://blog.shemesh.biz/?p=726 As for the BiDi support, each Android installation already arrives with TWO BiDi implementation. One inside the framework and another inside ICU for C++, which is compiled for the platform in its completion, but only used, as far as I can tell, to perform the BiDi character classification. It might be used by non-Java code, or else why they did not use ICU for Java is beyond me. Why they re-implemented that BiDi algorithm (badly) and not used JNI is also beyond me. As such, I saw it as a smart move not to add a third implementation. In fact, I always try to avoid re-implementing complicated algorithms for which good implementations already exist. As such, in all of my years of dong BiDi work on various platforms, the number of complete implementations of the UBA I have coded is zero. This is a fact I am, actually, proud of. Shachar -- Shachar Shemesh Lingnu Open Source Consulting Ltd. http://www.lingnu.com ___ Linux-il mailing list Linux-il@cs.huji.ac.il http://mailman.cs.huji.ac.il/mailman/listinfo/linux-il
Re: Hebrew on Android (and other issues)
Nice! I missed that blog. So that this mean that plain vanilla Android still does not have proper BiDi support? You didn't say it explicitely, but I understand from what you wrote that you choose JNI to access ICU for your BiDi solution. Was that JNI layer ever introduced to the open source Android to replace their buggy Java implementation? Regards, Dov On Sun, Sep 26, 2010 at 10:48, Shachar Shemesh shac...@shemesh.biz wrote: Dov Grobgeld wrote: I'm curious. Did your Hebrew support modifications include full BiDi support? Did you write the bidi code yourself, or did you use some known library? I wrote about it extensively at the time: http://blog.shemesh.biz/?p=726 As for the BiDi support, each Android installation already arrives with TWO BiDi implementation. One inside the framework and another inside ICU for C++, which is compiled for the platform in its completion, but only used, as far as I can tell, to perform the BiDi character classification. It might be used by non-Java code, or else why they did not use ICU for Java is beyond me. Why they re-implemented that BiDi algorithm (badly) and not used JNI is also beyond me. As such, I saw it as a smart move not to add a third implementation. In fact, I always try to avoid re-implementing complicated algorithms for which good implementations already exist. As such, in all of my years of dong BiDi work on various platforms, the number of complete implementations of the UBA I have coded is zero. This is a fact I am, actually, proud of. Shachar -- Shachar Shemesh Lingnu Open Source Consulting Ltd.http://www.lingnu.com ___ Linux-il mailing list Linux-il@cs.huji.ac.il http://mailman.cs.huji.ac.il/mailman/listinfo/linux-il
Re: Hebrew on Android (and other issues)
Dov Grobgeld wrote: Nice! I missed that blog. So that this mean that plain vanilla Android still does not have proper BiDi support? You didn't say it explicitely, but I understand from what you wrote that you choose JNI to access ICU for your BiDi solution. No. I would have, but for the HTC project I had not way to perform changes to the framework, so it would have been pointless to go that route. Shachar -- Shachar Shemesh Lingnu Open Source Consulting Ltd. http://www.lingnu.com ___ Linux-il mailing list Linux-il@cs.huji.ac.il http://mailman.cs.huji.ac.il/mailman/listinfo/linux-il
Re: Hebrew on Android (and other issues)
I'm curious. Did your Hebrew support modifications include full BiDi support? Did you write the bidi code yourself, or did you use some known library? Moadim lesimcha! Dov 2010/9/3 Shachar Shemesh shac...@shemesh.biz Dotan Cohen wrote: I have heard that the Hebrew on Android devices is lacking. Orange does not have a Galaxy to test drive at the moment, so could any Android users let me know of any (all) problems with Android devices? Hebrew- and non-Hebrew related. Thanks. I'll try to summarize the information, though things are not simple by a long stretch. Vanilla Android 2.2 comes, built in, with Hebrew and Arabic fonts. These, however, arrive as separate files, so expect device manufacturers to pull them off. Aside from that, 2.2 is identical to all previous releases, which is another way of saying that Hebrew is somewhat supported, but sucks. Main bugs: - Appointment text in day view in Calendar is displayed the wrong way - Numbers in Hebrew context are displayed from right to left (makes it extremely difficult to receive SMS instructions for, say, an address to get to). - Scrolled lists with mixed English/Hebrew items have items disappearing when scrolled. Of these, I have not confirmed whether the first one is still in 2.2. The other two definitely are. Phones, and possibly other devices, sold in Israel get special Hebrew adaptations done to them. The two I've checked are the Samsung Galaxy and the HTC Magic. For the later, I was the one doing the i18n adaptations. Both did not suffer the full scale of the first two problems. Both did suffer the third one, to various degrees. Also, both had varying degrees of completeness to the work done. Also, many people do not run vanilla or device provided Android at all. Many run the Cyanogenmod[1] distribution (recently on slashdot[2]). I know for a fact that it incorporates a solution to at least some of the problems spelled above (the Calendar one at least used to incorporate a patch[3] sent in by me, that was never merged into Android proper), and thus might provide far better Hebrew support than vanilla Android. Shachar 1 - http://www.cyanogenmod.com/ 2 - http://linux.slashdot.org/story/10/09/01/0343231/Android-Fork-Brings-Froyo-To-12-Smartphones 3 - https://review.source.android.com/#change,12661 -- Shachar Shemesh Lingnu Open Source Consulting Ltd.http://www.lingnu.com ___ Linux-il mailing list Linux-il@cs.huji.ac.il http://mailman.cs.huji.ac.il/mailman/listinfo/linux-il ___ Linux-il mailing list Linux-il@cs.huji.ac.il http://mailman.cs.huji.ac.il/mailman/listinfo/linux-il
Re: Hebrew on Android (and other issues)
Thanks, Shahar! On Fri, Sep 3, 2010 at 23:29, Shachar Shemesh shac...@shemesh.biz wrote: I'll try to summarize the information, though things are not simple by a long stretch. -- Dotan Cohen http://gibberish.co.il http://what-is-what.com ___ Linux-il mailing list Linux-il@cs.huji.ac.il http://mailman.cs.huji.ac.il/mailman/listinfo/linux-il
Re: Hebrew on Android (and other issues)
I have a Galaxy S, and as of Android 2.1, there's no Hebrew yet. I understand there is in 2.2, and an update should be on its way this month if the rumors can be believed. Aside from that, I have no real complaints, except it's been a strange transition from my old iphone. I'm getting used to it, though. sambo On Sep 3, 2010 9:25 AM, Dotan Cohen dotanco...@gmail.com wrote: I have heard that the Hebrew on Android devices is lacking. Orange does not have a Galaxy to test drive at the moment, so could any Android users let me know of any (all) problems with Android devices? Hebrew- and non-Hebrew related. Thanks. -- Dotan Cohen http://gibberish.co.il http://what-is-what.com ___ Linux-il mailing list Linux-il@cs.huji.ac.il http://mailman.cs.huji.ac.il/mailman/listinfo/linux-il ___ Linux-il mailing list Linux-il@cs.huji.ac.il http://mailman.cs.huji.ac.il/mailman/listinfo/linux-il
Re: Hebrew on Android (and other issues)
What Hebrew do you need? interface? fonts? keyboard? I know people with Hebrew fonts and keyboard on Android 2.1 (and non Hebrew UI), but maybe they payed the store to set it up for them. Evyatar Parker 2010/9/3 sammy ominsky s...@avoidant.org I have a Galaxy S, and as of Android 2.1, there's no Hebrew yet. I understand there is in 2.2, and an update should be on its way this month if the rumors can be believed. Aside from that, I have no real complaints, except it's been a strange transition from my old iphone. I'm getting used to it, though. sambo On Sep 3, 2010 9:25 AM, Dotan Cohen dotanco...@gmail.com wrote: I have heard that the Hebrew on Android devices is lacking. Orange does not have a Galaxy to test drive at the moment, so could any Android users let me know of any (all) problems with Android devices? Hebrew- and non-Hebrew related. Thanks. -- Dotan Cohen http://gibberish.co.il http://what-is-what.com ___ Linux-il mailing list Linux-il@cs.huji.ac.il http://mailman.cs.huji.ac.il/mailman/listinfo/linux-il ___ Linux-il mailing list Linux-il@cs.huji.ac.il http://mailman.cs.huji.ac.il/mailman/listinfo/linux-il ___ Linux-il mailing list Linux-il@cs.huji.ac.il http://mailman.cs.huji.ac.il/mailman/listinfo/linux-il
Re: Hebrew on Android (and other issues)
On Fri, Sep 3, 2010 at 17:27, Evyatar Parker evp55...@gmail.com wrote: What Hebrew do you need? interface? fonts? keyboard? I know people with Hebrew fonts and keyboard on Android 2.1 (and non Hebrew UI), but maybe they payed the store to set it up for them. Evyatar Parker Good question. I _need_ the ability to read and send SMS messages in Hebrew, and full read/write support for Hebrew in the web browser. I need Hebrew for my contacts names, file names, as well as the Calendar. I would prefer a Hebrew UI for the device, but I can live with the UI in English. -- Dotan Cohen http://gibberish.co.il http://what-is-what.com ___ Linux-il mailing list Linux-il@cs.huji.ac.il http://mailman.cs.huji.ac.il/mailman/listinfo/linux-il
Re: Hebrew on Android (and other issues)
On Fri, 3 Sep 2010 17:35:57 +0300 Dotan Cohen dotanco...@gmail.com wrote: On Fri, Sep 3, 2010 at 17:27, Evyatar Parker evp55...@gmail.com wrote: What Hebrew do you need? interface? fonts? keyboard? I know people with Hebrew fonts and keyboard on Android 2.1 (and non Hebrew UI), but maybe they payed the store to set it up for them. Evyatar Parker Good question. I _need_ the ability to read and send SMS messages in Hebrew, and full read/write support for Hebrew in the web browser. I need Hebrew for my contacts names, file names, as well as the Calendar. I would prefer a Hebrew UI for the device, but I can live with the UI in English. From what I know (just researched this yesterday as I'm debating regarding importing a new phone between blackberry, iphone and andoid, probably nexus one, any recommendations?). Anyway on point, as far as I can tell there is no official hebrew support on either android 2.1 nor 2.2. There is an unofficial hebrew fonts package, but you need to root your phone for that (and possibly void your warranty in the process). As for a keyboard, there is the softkeyboard package http://code.google.com/p/softkeyboard/ ___ Linux-il mailing list Linux-il@cs.huji.ac.il http://mailman.cs.huji.ac.il/mailman/listinfo/linux-il
Re: Hebrew on Android (and other issues)
Hi, I have Froyo on Nexus One I can write and read Hebrew, by a root based crack (not a big deal to do - and very common procedure) The issue I see which is most annoying is mixed Hebrew with English and Numbers It has the classic transpose problem, where the number is written in opposite direction So it looks like so תתקשר אלי 32132190 instead of תתקשר אלי 09123123 On Fri, Sep 3, 2010 at 5:35 PM, Dotan Cohen dotanco...@gmail.com wrote: On Fri, Sep 3, 2010 at 17:27, Evyatar Parker evp55...@gmail.com wrote: What Hebrew do you need? interface? fonts? keyboard? I know people with Hebrew fonts and keyboard on Android 2.1 (and non Hebrew UI), but maybe they payed the store to set it up for them. Evyatar Parker Good question. I _need_ the ability to read and send SMS messages in Hebrew, and full read/write support for Hebrew in the web browser. I need Hebrew for my contacts names, file names, as well as the Calendar. I would prefer a Hebrew UI for the device, but I can live with the UI in English. -- Dotan Cohen http://gibberish.co.il http://what-is-what.com ___ Linux-il mailing list Linux-il@cs.huji.ac.il http://mailman.cs.huji.ac.il/mailman/listinfo/linux-il ___ Linux-il mailing list Linux-il@cs.huji.ac.il http://mailman.cs.huji.ac.il/mailman/listinfo/linux-il
Re: Hebrew on Android (and other issues)
Hi, Here is something interesting: Cellcom sells the Motorola Milestone, which is Android 2.1 with full hebrew support. I don't know any people inside Motorola who did the hebrew (or perhaps it was done by a third party?), but maybe we can convince Motorola to donate the hebrew modifications back to the android public tree? If someone has a contact in Motorola which relates to Android development, please send his contact details to me off the list. I'll email this guy :) Thanks, Hetz 2010/9/3 Noam Rathaus no...@beyondsecurity.com Hi, I have Froyo on Nexus One I can write and read Hebrew, by a root based crack (not a big deal to do - and very common procedure) The issue I see which is most annoying is mixed Hebrew with English and Numbers It has the classic transpose problem, where the number is written in opposite direction So it looks like so תתקשר אלי 32132190 instead of תתקשר אלי 09123123 On Fri, Sep 3, 2010 at 5:35 PM, Dotan Cohen dotanco...@gmail.com wrote: On Fri, Sep 3, 2010 at 17:27, Evyatar Parker evp55...@gmail.com wrote: What Hebrew do you need? interface? fonts? keyboard? I know people with Hebrew fonts and keyboard on Android 2.1 (and non Hebrew UI), but maybe they payed the store to set it up for them. Evyatar Parker Good question. I _need_ the ability to read and send SMS messages in Hebrew, and full read/write support for Hebrew in the web browser. I need Hebrew for my contacts names, file names, as well as the Calendar. I would prefer a Hebrew UI for the device, but I can live with the UI in English. -- Dotan Cohen http://gibberish.co.il http://what-is-what.com ___ Linux-il mailing list Linux-il@cs.huji.ac.il http://mailman.cs.huji.ac.il/mailman/listinfo/linux-il ___ Linux-il mailing list Linux-il@cs.huji.ac.il http://mailman.cs.huji.ac.il/mailman/listinfo/linux-il -- my blog (hebrew): http://benhamo.org Skype: heunique MSN: hetz-b...@benhamo.org ___ Linux-il mailing list Linux-il@cs.huji.ac.il http://mailman.cs.huji.ac.il/mailman/listinfo/linux-il
Re: Hebrew on Android (and other issues)
Dotan Cohen wrote: I have heard that the Hebrew on Android devices is lacking. Orange does not have a Galaxy to test drive at the moment, so could any Android users let me know of any (all) problems with Android devices? Hebrew- and non-Hebrew related. Thanks. I'll try to summarize the information, though things are not simple by a long stretch. Vanilla Android 2.2 comes, built in, with Hebrew and Arabic fonts. These, however, arrive as separate files, so expect device manufacturers to pull them off. Aside from that, 2.2 is identical to all previous releases, which is another way of saying that Hebrew is somewhat supported, but sucks. Main bugs: * Appointment text in day view in Calendar is displayed the wrong way * Numbers in Hebrew context are displayed from right to left (makes it extremely difficult to receive SMS instructions for, say, an address to get to). * Scrolled lists with mixed English/Hebrew items have items disappearing when scrolled. Of these, I have not confirmed whether the first one is still in 2.2. The other two definitely are. Phones, and possibly other devices, sold in Israel get special Hebrew adaptations done to them. The two I've checked are the Samsung Galaxy and the HTC Magic. For the later, I was the one doing the i18n adaptations. Both did not suffer the full scale of the first two problems. Both did suffer the third one, to various degrees. Also, both had varying degrees of completeness to the work done. Also, many people do not run vanilla or device provided Android at all. Many run the Cyanogenmod[1] distribution (recently on slashdot[2]). I know for a fact that it incorporates a solution to at least some of the problems spelled above (the Calendar one at least used to incorporate a patch[3] sent in by me, that was never merged into Android proper), and thus might provide far better Hebrew support than vanilla Android. Shachar 1 - http://www.cyanogenmod.com/ 2 - http://linux.slashdot.org/story/10/09/01/0343231/Android-Fork-Brings-Froyo-To-12-Smartphones 3 - https://review.source.android.com/#change,12661 -- Shachar Shemesh Lingnu Open Source Consulting Ltd. http://www.lingnu.com ___ Linux-il mailing list Linux-il@cs.huji.ac.il http://mailman.cs.huji.ac.il/mailman/listinfo/linux-il
