Re: ps2 keyboard filter hook
On Fri, 15 Jun 2001, Dan Streetman wrote: >Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 17:03:38 -0400 (EDT) >From: Dan Streetman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: Jeff Garzik <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Cc: Linux Kernel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII >Subject: Re: ps2 keyboard filter hook > > >>Didn't we just conclude a discussion here on linux-kernel, which said >>that patches which simply add hooks allowing proprietary extensions are >>not accepted into the kernel? > >Yes (I assume you mean the whole 'sockreg' register/unregister thread(s)...;-) > >I never intended to get that patch in. In fact I would be shocked (and a bit >horrified) if it was accepted. > >But management doesn't listen to me when I say it will never get accepted so I >had to make a token effort of submitting it to prove it won't get accepted. > >And I did try hard to convince them to release the actual driver but it didn't >work. I find it very odd indeed with IBM's big voice of open source praise, yada yada, and what Lou has said in the past, that there would be any question at all of wether it would be open source or not. Isn't big blue behind open source? Or is it just for publicity? Makes me wonder now... Must be some real good rocket science in that interface that theres no way on earth someone else could come up with it for it to be important IP to protect. Makes me wonder what's hiding behind it... -- Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Open Source advocate Opinions and viewpoints expressed are solely my own. -- DISCLAIMER - These opoi^H^H "damn", ^H, [esc :q :qq !q "shoot!" :Q! "Whaddya mean, Not an editor command?" :wq! ^C^C^C !STOP ^bye ^quit :quit! !halt ... ^w^q :!w :wq! ^D :qq!! ^STOP [HALT! HALT!!! "Why's it doing this?" :stopit! :wwqq!! ^Z ^L ^ESC STOP :bye bye bye! "Hey, what's this red button d..." - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: ps2 keyboard filter hook
On Fri, 15 Jun 2001, Dan Streetman wrote: Date: Fri, 15 Jun 2001 17:03:38 -0400 (EDT) From: Dan Streetman [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Jeff Garzik [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: Linux Kernel [EMAIL PROTECTED] Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Subject: Re: ps2 keyboard filter hook Didn't we just conclude a discussion here on linux-kernel, which said that patches which simply add hooks allowing proprietary extensions are not accepted into the kernel? Yes (I assume you mean the whole 'sockreg' register/unregister thread(s)...;-) I never intended to get that patch in. In fact I would be shocked (and a bit horrified) if it was accepted. But management doesn't listen to me when I say it will never get accepted so I had to make a token effort of submitting it to prove it won't get accepted. And I did try hard to convince them to release the actual driver but it didn't work. I find it very odd indeed with IBM's big voice of open source praise, yada yada, and what Lou has said in the past, that there would be any question at all of wether it would be open source or not. Isn't big blue behind open source? Or is it just for publicity? Makes me wonder now... Must be some real good rocket science in that interface that theres no way on earth someone else could come up with it for it to be important IP to protect. Makes me wonder what's hiding behind it... -- Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Open Source advocate Opinions and viewpoints expressed are solely my own. -- DISCLAIMER - These opoi^H^H damn, ^H, [esc :q :qq !q shoot! :Q! Whaddya mean, Not an editor command? :wq! ^C^C^C !STOP ^bye ^quit :quit! !halt ... ^w^q :!w :wq! ^D :qq!! ^STOP [HALT! HALT!!! Why's it doing this? :stopit! :wwqq!! ^Z ^L ^ESC STOP :bye bye bye! Hey, what's this red button d... - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe linux-kernel in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: obsolete code must die
On Wed, 13 Jun 2001, Colonel wrote: >>I really think doing a clean up is worthwhile. Maybe while looking for stuff > >You left out all the old non-IDE CDROM drives. And also UP systems. I've got 2 SMP boxes here now. Why not remove support for any system with less than 2 processors? ;o) I'll just have to replace my 486 firewall with the dual 486 in the closet. ;o) ------ Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Open Source advocate Opinions and viewpoints expressed are solely my own. -- If Bill Gates had a dime for every time Windows crashed, he'd be rich! - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: obsolete code must die
On Wed, 13 Jun 2001, Daniel wrote: >i386, i486 >The Pentium processor has been around since 1995. Support for these older >processors should go so we can focus on optimizations for the pentium and >better processors. [SNIP] Boy, if this isn't a troll, I don't know what is. Obviously someone doesn't grok the kernel development processes very well. Newbie here? One needn't even *be* a kernel hacker to understand why all of the stuff stated is totally not going to happen, and there would be no benefit to doing so. ------ Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Open Source advocate Opinions and viewpoints expressed are solely my own. -- Foot and mouth disease is believed by experts to be the first virus that is unable to spread via Microsoft Outlook. - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: obsolete code must die
On Wed, 13 Jun 2001, Daniel wrote: i386, i486 The Pentium processor has been around since 1995. Support for these older processors should go so we can focus on optimizations for the pentium and better processors. [SNIP] Boy, if this isn't a troll, I don't know what is. Obviously someone doesn't grok the kernel development processes very well. Newbie here? One needn't even *be* a kernel hacker to understand why all of the stuff stated is totally not going to happen, and there would be no benefit to doing so. -- Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Open Source advocate Opinions and viewpoints expressed are solely my own. -- Foot and mouth disease is believed by experts to be the first virus that is unable to spread via Microsoft Outlook. - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe linux-kernel in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: obsolete code must die
On Wed, 13 Jun 2001, Colonel wrote: I really think doing a clean up is worthwhile. Maybe while looking for stuff You left out all the old non-IDE CDROM drives. And also UP systems. I've got 2 SMP boxes here now. Why not remove support for any system with less than 2 processors? ;o) I'll just have to replace my 486 firewall with the dual 486 in the closet. ;o) -- Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Open Source advocate Opinions and viewpoints expressed are solely my own. -- If Bill Gates had a dime for every time Windows crashed, he'd be rich! - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe linux-kernel in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: Break 2.4 VM in five easy steps
On Sat, 9 Jun 2001, Rik van Riel wrote: >> Why are half the people here trying to hide behind this diskspace >> is cheap argument? If we rely on that, then Linux sucks shit. > >Never mind them, I haven't seen any of them contribute >VM code, even ;) Nor have I, but I think you guys working on it will get it cleaned up eventually. What bugs me is people trying to pretend that it isn't important to fix, or that spending money to get newer hardware is acceptable solution. >OTOH, disk space _is_ cheap, so the other VM - performance >related - VM bugs do have a somewhat higher priority at the >moment. Yes, it is cheap. It isn't always an acceptable workaround though, so I'm glad you guys are working on it - even if we have to wait a bit. I have faith in the system. ;o) ------ Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Open Source advocate Opinions and viewpoints expressed are solely my own. -- - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: Break 2.4 VM in five easy steps
On Sat, 9 Jun 2001, Rik van Riel wrote: Why are half the people here trying to hide behind this diskspace is cheap argument? If we rely on that, then Linux sucks shit. Never mind them, I haven't seen any of them contribute VM code, even ;) Nor have I, but I think you guys working on it will get it cleaned up eventually. What bugs me is people trying to pretend that it isn't important to fix, or that spending money to get newer hardware is acceptable solution. OTOH, disk space _is_ cheap, so the other VM - performance related - VM bugs do have a somewhat higher priority at the moment. Yes, it is cheap. It isn't always an acceptable workaround though, so I'm glad you guys are working on it - even if we have to wait a bit. I have faith in the system. ;o) -- Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Open Source advocate Opinions and viewpoints expressed are solely my own. -- - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe linux-kernel in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: Break 2.4 VM in five easy steps
On 6 Jun 2001, Miles Lane wrote: >> Precicely. Saying 8x RAM doesn't change it either. Sometime >> next week I'm going to purposefully put a new 60Gb disk in on a >> separate controller as pure swap on top of 256Mb of RAM. My >> guess is after bootup, and login, I'll have 48Gb of stuff in >> swap "just in case". > >Mike and others, I am getting tired of your comments. Sheesh. And I'm tired of having people tell me, or tell others to buy a faster computer or more RAM to work around a real technical problem. If a dual 1Ghz system with 1Gb of RAM and 60GB of disk space broken across 3 U160 drives is not a modern fast workstation I don't know what is. My 300Mhz system however works on its own stuff, and doesn't need upgrading. >The various developers who actually work on the VM have already >acknowledged the issues and are exploring fixes, including at >least one patch that already exists. Precicely, which underscores what I'm saying: The problem is acknowledged, and being worked on by talented hackers knowing what they are doing - so why must people keep saying "get more disk space, it is cheap?" et al.? That is totally nonuseful advice in most cases. Many have pointed out already for example how impossible that would be in a 500 computer webserver farm. >It seems clear that the uproar from the people who are having >trouble with the new VM's handling of swap space have been >heard and folks are going to fix these problems. It may not >happen today or tomorrow, but soon. What the heck else do you >want? I agree with you. What I want, is when someone talks about this stuff or inquires about it, for people to stop telling them that their computer is out of date and they should upgrade it as that is bogus advice. "It worked fine yesterday, why should I upgrade" reigns supreme. >Making enflammatory remarks about the current situation does >nothing to help get the problems fixed, it just wastes our time >and bandwidth. It's not like there is someone forcing you to read it though. >So please, if you have new facts that you want to offer that >will help us characterize and understand these VM issues better >or discover new problems, feel free to share them. But if you >just want to rant, I, for one, would rather you didn't. Point noted, however that isn't going to stop anyone from speaking their personal opinion on things. Freedom of speech. -- Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Open Source advocate Opinions and viewpoints expressed are solely my own. -- - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: Break 2.4 VM in five easy steps
On 6 Jun 2001, Miles Lane wrote: Precicely. Saying 8x RAM doesn't change it either. Sometime next week I'm going to purposefully put a new 60Gb disk in on a separate controller as pure swap on top of 256Mb of RAM. My guess is after bootup, and login, I'll have 48Gb of stuff in swap just in case. Mike and others, I am getting tired of your comments. Sheesh. And I'm tired of having people tell me, or tell others to buy a faster computer or more RAM to work around a real technical problem. If a dual 1Ghz system with 1Gb of RAM and 60GB of disk space broken across 3 U160 drives is not a modern fast workstation I don't know what is. My 300Mhz system however works on its own stuff, and doesn't need upgrading. The various developers who actually work on the VM have already acknowledged the issues and are exploring fixes, including at least one patch that already exists. Precicely, which underscores what I'm saying: The problem is acknowledged, and being worked on by talented hackers knowing what they are doing - so why must people keep saying get more disk space, it is cheap? et al.? That is totally nonuseful advice in most cases. Many have pointed out already for example how impossible that would be in a 500 computer webserver farm. It seems clear that the uproar from the people who are having trouble with the new VM's handling of swap space have been heard and folks are going to fix these problems. It may not happen today or tomorrow, but soon. What the heck else do you want? I agree with you. What I want, is when someone talks about this stuff or inquires about it, for people to stop telling them that their computer is out of date and they should upgrade it as that is bogus advice. It worked fine yesterday, why should I upgrade reigns supreme. Making enflammatory remarks about the current situation does nothing to help get the problems fixed, it just wastes our time and bandwidth. It's not like there is someone forcing you to read it though. So please, if you have new facts that you want to offer that will help us characterize and understand these VM issues better or discover new problems, feel free to share them. But if you just want to rant, I, for one, would rather you didn't. Point noted, however that isn't going to stop anyone from speaking their personal opinion on things. Freedom of speech. -- Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Open Source advocate Opinions and viewpoints expressed are solely my own. -- - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe linux-kernel in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: missing sysrq
On Fri, 1 Jun 2001, Dieter Nützel wrote: >> > In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> you wrote: >> > > However, if I go to /proc/sys/kernel/sysrq does not exist. >> > >> > It is a compile time option, so the person who compiled your kernel >> > left it out. >> >> I compiled it, and the sysrq is definitely in the config. No doubt at >> all. I also use make mrproper and config again before dep and actual >> compile. Maybe it is just a quirk/oddball. >> >> D. Stimits, [EMAIL PROTECTED] > >Have you tried "echo 1 > /proc/sys/kernel/sysrq"? >You need both, compiled in and activation. If you *know* it is compiled into your kernel, and you *know* it is enabled via the above, and it still does not work, do the following: Run: showkey -s Then press LALT quickly followed by SYSRQ, and keep holding both down, and you should see: 0x38 0x54 You might see a bunch of extra 0x38's which is ok. If however when you press ALT-SYSRQ you see: 0x38 0x54 0xd4 and are still holding both keys down, then your keyboard is broken and incompatible with the kernel SYSRQ feature. A proper keyboard will only show "0x38 0x54". I have written a patch for SYSRQ to allow it to be used with broken keyboards that send the make+break code for the SYSRQ sequence simultaneously. If you need it, let me know and I'll send it to you. -- Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Open Source advocate Opinions and viewpoints expressed are solely my own. -- - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: missing sysrq
On Thu, 31 May 2001, D. Stimits wrote: >Date: Thu, 31 May 2001 17:48:34 -0600 >From: D. Stimits <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: unlisted-recipients:;;@timpanogas.com (no To-header on input) >Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii >Subject: Re: missing sysrq > >Bernd Eckenfels wrote: >> >> In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> you wrote: >> > However, if I go to /proc/sys/kernel/sysrq does not exist. >> >> It is a compile time option, so the person who compiled your kernel left it >> out. > >I compiled it, and the sysrq is definitely in the config. No doubt at >all. I also use make mrproper and config again before dep and actual >compile. Maybe it is just a quirk/oddball. What does this say: ksyms -a |grep -i sysrq -- Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Open Source advocate Opinions and viewpoints expressed are solely my own. -- Who knows what dangerous code lurks in the hearts of men? Only the Shadowman(TM) knows... Mike A. Harris <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: missing sysrq
On Thu, 31 May 2001, D. Stimits wrote: Date: Thu, 31 May 2001 17:48:34 -0600 From: D. Stimits [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: unlisted-recipients:;;@timpanogas.com (no To-header on input) Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Subject: Re: missing sysrq Bernd Eckenfels wrote: In article [EMAIL PROTECTED] you wrote: However, if I go to /proc/sys/kernel/sysrq does not exist. It is a compile time option, so the person who compiled your kernel left it out. I compiled it, and the sysrq is definitely in the config. No doubt at all. I also use make mrproper and config again before dep and actual compile. Maybe it is just a quirk/oddball. What does this say: ksyms -a |grep -i sysrq -- Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Open Source advocate Opinions and viewpoints expressed are solely my own. -- Who knows what dangerous code lurks in the hearts of men? Only the Shadowman(TM) knows... Mike A. Harris [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe linux-kernel in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: missing sysrq
On Fri, 1 Jun 2001, Dieter Nützel wrote: In article [EMAIL PROTECTED] you wrote: However, if I go to /proc/sys/kernel/sysrq does not exist. It is a compile time option, so the person who compiled your kernel left it out. I compiled it, and the sysrq is definitely in the config. No doubt at all. I also use make mrproper and config again before dep and actual compile. Maybe it is just a quirk/oddball. D. Stimits, [EMAIL PROTECTED] Have you tried echo 1 /proc/sys/kernel/sysrq? You need both, compiled in and activation. If you *know* it is compiled into your kernel, and you *know* it is enabled via the above, and it still does not work, do the following: Run: showkey -s Then press LALT quickly followed by SYSRQ, and keep holding both down, and you should see: 0x38 0x54 You might see a bunch of extra 0x38's which is ok. If however when you press ALT-SYSRQ you see: 0x38 0x54 0xd4 and are still holding both keys down, then your keyboard is broken and incompatible with the kernel SYSRQ feature. A proper keyboard will only show 0x38 0x54. I have written a patch for SYSRQ to allow it to be used with broken keyboards that send the make+break code for the SYSRQ sequence simultaneously. If you need it, let me know and I'll send it to you. -- Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Open Source advocate Opinions and viewpoints expressed are solely my own. -- - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe linux-kernel in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: Break 2.4 VM in five easy steps
On Wed, 6 Jun 2001, android wrote:
>associated with that mindset that made Microsoft such a [fill in the blank].
>As for the 2.4 VM problem, what are you doing with your machine that's
>making it use up so much memory? I have several processes running
>on mine all the time, including a slew in X, and I have yet to see
>significant swap activity.
Try _compiling_ XFree86. Watch the machine nosedive.
--
Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Open Source advocate
Opinions and viewpoints expressed are solely my own.
--
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Re: Break 2.4 VM in five easy steps
On Wed, 6 Jun 2001, Dr S.M. Huen wrote: >> For large memory boxes, this is ridiculous. Should I have 8GB of swap? >> > >Do I understand you correctly? >ECC grade SDRAM for your 8GB server costs £335 per GB as 512MB sticks even >at today's silly prices (Crucial). Ultra160 SCSI costs £8.93/GB as 73GB >drives. Linux is all about technical correctness, and doing the job properly. It isn't about "there is a bug in the kernel, but that is ok because a 8Gb swapfile only costs $2" Why are half the people here trying to hide behind this diskspace is cheap argument? If we rely on that, then Linux sucks shit. The problem IMHO is widely acknowledged by those who matter as an official BUG, and that is that. It is also acknowledged widely by those who can fix the problem that it will be fixed in time. So technically speaking - the kernel has a widely known bug/misfeature, which is acknowledged by core kernel developers as needing fixing, and that it will get fixed at some point. Saying it is a nonissue due to the cost of hardware resources is just plain Microsoft attitude and holds absolutely zero technical merit. It *IS* an issue, because it is making Linux suck, and is causing REAL WORLD PROBLEMS. The use 2x RAM is nothing more than a bandaid workaround, so don't claim that it is the proper fix due to big wallet size. I have 2.2 doing a software build that takes 40 minutes with 256Mb of RAM, and 1G of swap. The same build on 2.4 takes 60 minutes. That is 4x RAM for swap. Lowering the swap down to 2x RAM makes no difference in the numbers, down to 1x RAM the 2.4 build slows down horrendously, and droping the swap to 20Mb makes it die completely in 2.4. 2.4 is fine for a firewall, or certain other applications, but regardless of the amount of SWAP, I'll take the 40minute build using 2.2 over the 60minute build using 2.4 anyday. This is the real world. And no cost isn't an issue to me. Putting another 80Gb drive in this box for swap isn't going to help the work get done any faster. ------ Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Open Source advocate Opinions and viewpoints expressed are solely my own. -- - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: Break 2.4 VM in five easy steps
On Wed, 6 Jun 2001, Dr S.M. Huen wrote: For large memory boxes, this is ridiculous. Should I have 8GB of swap? Do I understand you correctly? ECC grade SDRAM for your 8GB server costs £335 per GB as 512MB sticks even at today's silly prices (Crucial). Ultra160 SCSI costs £8.93/GB as 73GB drives. Linux is all about technical correctness, and doing the job properly. It isn't about there is a bug in the kernel, but that is ok because a 8Gb swapfile only costs $2 Why are half the people here trying to hide behind this diskspace is cheap argument? If we rely on that, then Linux sucks shit. The problem IMHO is widely acknowledged by those who matter as an official BUG, and that is that. It is also acknowledged widely by those who can fix the problem that it will be fixed in time. So technically speaking - the kernel has a widely known bug/misfeature, which is acknowledged by core kernel developers as needing fixing, and that it will get fixed at some point. Saying it is a nonissue due to the cost of hardware resources is just plain Microsoft attitude and holds absolutely zero technical merit. It *IS* an issue, because it is making Linux suck, and is causing REAL WORLD PROBLEMS. The use 2x RAM is nothing more than a bandaid workaround, so don't claim that it is the proper fix due to big wallet size. I have 2.2 doing a software build that takes 40 minutes with 256Mb of RAM, and 1G of swap. The same build on 2.4 takes 60 minutes. That is 4x RAM for swap. Lowering the swap down to 2x RAM makes no difference in the numbers, down to 1x RAM the 2.4 build slows down horrendously, and droping the swap to 20Mb makes it die completely in 2.4. 2.4 is fine for a firewall, or certain other applications, but regardless of the amount of SWAP, I'll take the 40minute build using 2.2 over the 60minute build using 2.4 anyday. This is the real world. And no cost isn't an issue to me. Putting another 80Gb drive in this box for swap isn't going to help the work get done any faster. -- Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Open Source advocate Opinions and viewpoints expressed are solely my own. -- - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe linux-kernel in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: Break 2.4 VM in five easy steps
On Wed, 6 Jun 2001, android wrote: associated with that mindset that made Microsoft such a [fill in the blank]. As for the 2.4 VM problem, what are you doing with your machine that's making it use up so much memory? I have several processes running on mine all the time, including a slew in X, and I have yet to see significant swap activity. Try _compiling_ XFree86. Watch the machine nosedive. -- Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Open Source advocate Opinions and viewpoints expressed are solely my own. -- - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe linux-kernel in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: debugging xterm.
On Mon, 21 May 2001, Adam wrote: >I'm trying to debug xterm and it seems like it is just not my day (I >suppose the "Abandon All Hope, Ye Who Enter Here" in the README for xterm >is for a reason there after all :P ) > >I running gdb on xterm. I'm running it as root, the current execution is >at main.c:main() and gdb seems to get lost when calling getuid), any idea? >Is there something special about getuid() I'm missing? > >(gdb) next >1612uid_t ruid = getuid(); >2: screen->respond = 1448543468 >1: screen = (TScreen *) 0x4000ae60 >(gdb) next >1613gid_t rgid = getgid(); >2: screen->respond = Cannot access memory at address 0x4 >Disabling display 2 to avoid infinite recursion. >(gdb) > >it does not know where screen data structure is anymore.. This has nothing to do with the Linux kernel whatsoever. Please send your request to [EMAIL PROTECTED] for help. ------ Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Open Source advocate Opinions and viewpoints expressed are solely my own. -- - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: debugging xterm.
On Mon, 21 May 2001, Adam wrote: I'm trying to debug xterm and it seems like it is just not my day (I suppose the Abandon All Hope, Ye Who Enter Here in the README for xterm is for a reason there after all :P ) I running gdb on xterm. I'm running it as root, the current execution is at main.c:main() and gdb seems to get lost when calling getuid), any idea? Is there something special about getuid() I'm missing? (gdb) next 1612uid_t ruid = getuid(); 2: screen-respond = 1448543468 1: screen = (TScreen *) 0x4000ae60 (gdb) next 1613gid_t rgid = getgid(); 2: screen-respond = Cannot access memory at address 0x4 Disabling display 2 to avoid infinite recursion. (gdb) it does not know where screen data structure is anymore.. This has nothing to do with the Linux kernel whatsoever. Please send your request to [EMAIL PROTECTED] for help. -- Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Open Source advocate Opinions and viewpoints expressed are solely my own. -- - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe linux-kernel in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: Mail admin notice
On Sun, 20 May 2001, Shawn Starr wrote: >Date: Sun, 20 May 2001 03:31:55 -0400 (EDT) >From: Shawn Starr <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII >Subject: Mail admin notice > > >My emails may bounce between 3AM -> 8AM Est time, @Home is doing some >fiber upgrades and i dont have a second MX server (as I am the >domain/dns/mail etc). > >Please bear with bounces until then. You're saying that you consider it acceptable to bounce email to 5000 to 1 people, possibly thousands of messages? And that you knew it may occur in advance? I would think the responsible thing to do would be to unsubscribe from the mailing list temporarily until your problem is solved. Anything less is purely apathetic on your part. Signature poll: I'm planning on getting a 12 or 16 port autosensing 10/100 ethernet switch soon for home use, and am interested in hearing others recommendations on what to buy. Cost isn't as important as is functionality and quality. Any suggestions appreciated. - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: Mail admin notice
On Sun, 20 May 2001, Shawn Starr wrote: Date: Sun, 20 May 2001 03:31:55 -0400 (EDT) From: Shawn Starr [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Subject: Mail admin notice My emails may bounce between 3AM - 8AM Est time, @Home is doing some fiber upgrades and i dont have a second MX server (as I am the domain/dns/mail etc). Please bear with bounces until then. You're saying that you consider it acceptable to bounce email to 5000 to 1 people, possibly thousands of messages? And that you knew it may occur in advance? I would think the responsible thing to do would be to unsubscribe from the mailing list temporarily until your problem is solved. Anything less is purely apathetic on your part. Signature poll: I'm planning on getting a 12 or 16 port autosensing 10/100 ethernet switch soon for home use, and am interested in hearing others recommendations on what to buy. Cost isn't as important as is functionality and quality. Any suggestions appreciated. - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe linux-kernel in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: Not a typewriter
On Fri, 11 May 2001, Hacksaw wrote: >Well, I can't disagree. Unix's biggest turn off was the stupid command names. I agree partially with that, but as someone who's used DCL in VMS, I can say meaningful names are no better. People don't want to type SHOW DIRECTORY or CREATE /DIRECTORY /PERMISSIONS=blah blah.. and when given DCL, once people understand how to create logical names (the equiv of aliases in unix) they alias the above verbose garbage down to 2-4 letter cryptic looking names. I don't know anyone who has used VMS for more than 3 months who hasn't done the above. Problem is that everyone chooses their own cryptic shortcuts from everyone else. At least in UNIX, the short cryptic names are the same everywhere, and you can alias them to larger names if you like. Signature poll: I'm planning on getting a 12 or 16 port autosensing 10/100 ethernet switch soon for home use, and am interested in hearing others recommendations on what to buy. Cost isn't as important as is functionality and quality. Any suggestions appreciated. - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: Not a typewriter
On Fri, 11 May 2001 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: >>Heaven help us when tradition is more important than clarity. >> > >If clarity is the most important consideration, then other things should be >changed as well. For instance, the command we use to search for text strings in >files should be called "textsearch." That's a lot more clear than "grep." gnuregularexpressionparser? >why creat doesn't end in an "e;" and so forth. I tell the What is the reason for that? Also wondered why it is resolv.conf and not resolve.conf or resolver.conf... Were they afraid that "e" being the most widely used letter in the English language was going to war out thir xpnsiv kyboards if thy usd it all th tim? ;o) >I guess what I'm trying to say is that "Life With Unix" should be required >reading for anyone who goes near a Unix (or Linux) system. I agree. ;o) Signature poll: I'm planning on getting a 12 or 16 port autosensing 10/100 ethernet switch soon for home use, and am interested in hearing others recommendations on what to buy. Cost isn't as important as is functionality and quality. Any suggestions appreciated. - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: Not a typewriter
On Fri, 11 May 2001 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Heaven help us when tradition is more important than clarity. If clarity is the most important consideration, then other things should be changed as well. For instance, the command we use to search for text strings in files should be called textsearch. That's a lot more clear than grep. gnuregularexpressionparser? why creat doesn't end in an e; and so forth. I tell the What is the reason for that? Also wondered why it is resolv.conf and not resolve.conf or resolver.conf... Were they afraid that e being the most widely used letter in the English language was going to war out thir xpnsiv kyboards if thy usd it all th tim? ;o) I guess what I'm trying to say is that Life With Unix should be required reading for anyone who goes near a Unix (or Linux) system. I agree. ;o) Signature poll: I'm planning on getting a 12 or 16 port autosensing 10/100 ethernet switch soon for home use, and am interested in hearing others recommendations on what to buy. Cost isn't as important as is functionality and quality. Any suggestions appreciated. - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe linux-kernel in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: Not a typewriter
On Fri, 11 May 2001, Hacksaw wrote: Well, I can't disagree. Unix's biggest turn off was the stupid command names. I agree partially with that, but as someone who's used DCL in VMS, I can say meaningful names are no better. People don't want to type SHOW DIRECTORY or CREATE /DIRECTORY /PERMISSIONS=blah blah.. and when given DCL, once people understand how to create logical names (the equiv of aliases in unix) they alias the above verbose garbage down to 2-4 letter cryptic looking names. I don't know anyone who has used VMS for more than 3 months who hasn't done the above. Problem is that everyone chooses their own cryptic shortcuts from everyone else. At least in UNIX, the short cryptic names are the same everywhere, and you can alias them to larger names if you like. Signature poll: I'm planning on getting a 12 or 16 port autosensing 10/100 ethernet switch soon for home use, and am interested in hearing others recommendations on what to buy. Cost isn't as important as is functionality and quality. Any suggestions appreciated. - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe linux-kernel in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
[OT] Keith Owens your email address isn't working
Hi Keith, Whenever I post to linux-kernel with your name in the Cc or To, the mail bounces back 5 days later with: The original message was received at Sun, 6 May 2001 05:16:14 -0400 from mharris@localhost - The following addresses had permanent fatal errors - <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> - Transcript of session follows - <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>... Deferred: Connection refused by mail.ocs.com.au. Message could not be delivered for 5 days Message will be deleted from queue Just wanted to let you know so that you're not losing any important emails. Seems your machine is refusing mail for some reason. Hope this helps. Take care, TTYL Signature poll: I'm planning on getting a 12 or 16 port autosensing 10/100 ethernet switch soon for home use, and am interested in hearing others recommendations on what to buy. Cost isn't as important as is functionality and quality. Any suggestions appreciated. - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
[OT] Keith Owens your email address isn't working
Hi Keith, Whenever I post to linux-kernel with your name in the Cc or To, the mail bounces back 5 days later with: The original message was received at Sun, 6 May 2001 05:16:14 -0400 from mharris@localhost - The following addresses had permanent fatal errors - [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Transcript of session follows - [EMAIL PROTECTED]... Deferred: Connection refused by mail.ocs.com.au. Message could not be delivered for 5 days Message will be deleted from queue Just wanted to let you know so that you're not losing any important emails. Seems your machine is refusing mail for some reason. Hope this helps. Take care, TTYL Signature poll: I'm planning on getting a 12 or 16 port autosensing 10/100 ethernet switch soon for home use, and am interested in hearing others recommendations on what to buy. Cost isn't as important as is functionality and quality. Any suggestions appreciated. - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe linux-kernel in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: [patch] 2.4 add suffix for uname -r
On Sun, 6 May 2001, Keith Owens wrote: >>On Sun, 6 May 2001, Keith Owens wrote: >>>A frequent requirement is to rename vmlinuz-2.x.y to 2.x.y-old or >>>2.x.y.save to preserve a working kernel. >> >>I don't see how this patch is necessary when we have >>"EXTRAVERSION" available. Change EXTRAVERSION in your kernel >>builds and it is totally a non issue. No renaming of anything is >>necessary. > >You already have a working kernel which you want to rename to use as a >backup version. Why? Just use it as a backup version. No need to rename anything at all. I never rename a kernel, Sysmap, module dir or anything when trying out a new kernel. I use EXTRAVERSION instead - for its intended purpose - which was to eliminate these sort of problems. >Changing EXTRAVERSION and recompiling builds a new kernel and >adds uncertainty about whether the kernel still works - did you >change anything else before recompiling? How could it possibly add any uncertainity about anything? My kernel is 2.4.2-2 right now. If I build a new one, it will be 2.4.4-1asdf probably (asdf is my machine). If I then want to try a new kernel but am not sure if I want the old one still, the new kernel will be 2.4.4-2asdf. None of the kernels have files that conflict, and the names of them never change. I add a new stanza to lilo for the new kernel, run lilo, and can easily boot any of the kernels. >Look at all the install scripts that rename vmlinuz to >vmlinuz-old. Better yet, rewrite those broken scripts to work with todays kernel features. My install-kernel script works just fine for adding a new kernel to the system. By using new tools you avoid old problems. Signature poll: I'm planning on getting a 12 or 16 port autosensing 10/100 ethernet switch soon for home use, and am interested in hearing others recommendations on what to buy. Cost isn't as important as is functionality and quality. Any suggestions appreciated. - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: [patch] 2.4 add suffix for uname -r
On Sun, 6 May 2001, Keith Owens wrote: >Date: Sun, 06 May 2001 17:15:45 +1000 >From: Keith Owens <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii >Subject: [patch] 2.4 add suffix for uname -r > >A frequent requirement is to rename vmlinuz-2.x.y to 2.x.y-old or >2.x.y.save to preserve a working kernel. But renaming the image does >not change the value of uname -r so it still tries to use modules >2.x.y, which defeats the purpose of saving an working kernel. > >Normally I would say that this is a user space problem but it requires >finding every program that uses uname(2) and every script that uses >uname -r and changing them, not practical (modutils, alsa, pciutils, >/etc/rc.d, mkinitrd etc.). Instead this small patch to the kernel adds >the boot time option unamersfx (uname -r suffix). Rename a kernel >image from 2.x.y to 2.x.y.foo, rename /lib/modules/2.x.y to 2.x.y.foo >and boot with unamersfx=.foo to safely pick up the old kernel. > >Objects that "know" the value of uname -r that they were compiled with >will not work with unamersfx. Are there any? I don't see how this patch is necessary when we have "EXTRAVERSION" available. Change EXTRAVERSION in your kernel builds and it is totally a non issue. No renaming of anything is necessary. Signature poll: I'm planning on getting a 12 or 16 port autosensing 10/100 ethernet switch soon for home use, and am interested in hearing others recommendations on what to buy. Cost isn't as important as is functionality and quality. Any suggestions appreciated. - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: [patch] 2.4 add suffix for uname -r
On Sun, 6 May 2001, Keith Owens wrote: Date: Sun, 06 May 2001 17:15:45 +1000 From: Keith Owens [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Subject: [patch] 2.4 add suffix for uname -r A frequent requirement is to rename vmlinuz-2.x.y to 2.x.y-old or 2.x.y.save to preserve a working kernel. But renaming the image does not change the value of uname -r so it still tries to use modules 2.x.y, which defeats the purpose of saving an working kernel. Normally I would say that this is a user space problem but it requires finding every program that uses uname(2) and every script that uses uname -r and changing them, not practical (modutils, alsa, pciutils, /etc/rc.d, mkinitrd etc.). Instead this small patch to the kernel adds the boot time option unamersfx (uname -r suffix). Rename a kernel image from 2.x.y to 2.x.y.foo, rename /lib/modules/2.x.y to 2.x.y.foo and boot with unamersfx=.foo to safely pick up the old kernel. Objects that know the value of uname -r that they were compiled with will not work with unamersfx. Are there any? I don't see how this patch is necessary when we have EXTRAVERSION available. Change EXTRAVERSION in your kernel builds and it is totally a non issue. No renaming of anything is necessary. Signature poll: I'm planning on getting a 12 or 16 port autosensing 10/100 ethernet switch soon for home use, and am interested in hearing others recommendations on what to buy. Cost isn't as important as is functionality and quality. Any suggestions appreciated. - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe linux-kernel in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: [patch] 2.4 add suffix for uname -r
On Sun, 6 May 2001, Keith Owens wrote: On Sun, 6 May 2001, Keith Owens wrote: A frequent requirement is to rename vmlinuz-2.x.y to 2.x.y-old or 2.x.y.save to preserve a working kernel. I don't see how this patch is necessary when we have EXTRAVERSION available. Change EXTRAVERSION in your kernel builds and it is totally a non issue. No renaming of anything is necessary. You already have a working kernel which you want to rename to use as a backup version. Why? Just use it as a backup version. No need to rename anything at all. I never rename a kernel, Sysmap, module dir or anything when trying out a new kernel. I use EXTRAVERSION instead - for its intended purpose - which was to eliminate these sort of problems. Changing EXTRAVERSION and recompiling builds a new kernel and adds uncertainty about whether the kernel still works - did you change anything else before recompiling? How could it possibly add any uncertainity about anything? My kernel is 2.4.2-2 right now. If I build a new one, it will be 2.4.4-1asdf probably (asdf is my machine). If I then want to try a new kernel but am not sure if I want the old one still, the new kernel will be 2.4.4-2asdf. None of the kernels have files that conflict, and the names of them never change. I add a new stanza to lilo for the new kernel, run lilo, and can easily boot any of the kernels. Look at all the install scripts that rename vmlinuz to vmlinuz-old. Better yet, rewrite those broken scripts to work with todays kernel features. My install-kernel script works just fine for adding a new kernel to the system. By using new tools you avoid old problems. Signature poll: I'm planning on getting a 12 or 16 port autosensing 10/100 ethernet switch soon for home use, and am interested in hearing others recommendations on what to buy. Cost isn't as important as is functionality and quality. Any suggestions appreciated. - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe linux-kernel in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: 2.4.4 Sound corruption
On Sat, 28 Apr 2001, Lee Mitchell wrote: >Playing mp3's under 2.4.4 (SMP) results in bursts of noise overlayed on top >of actual music being played. >Works fine running 2.4.3 (SMP) I have the same problem using XMMS in both a UP system running 2.4.2-2 (RH kernel) as well as stock 2.4.4 both UP and SMP. It doesn't occur right away though. It takes a half hour maybe an hour, perhaps more. I dunno if it is tied to system activity or not. This occurs on a 300Mhz K6-III, and a dual 1Ghz Xeon Compaq Proliant ML530. It doesn't occur with enough frequency to be able to force it to reproduce. Signature poll: I'm planning on getting a 12 or 16 port autosensing 10/100 ethernet switch soon for home use, and am interested in hearing others recommendations on what to buy. Cost isn't as important as is functionality and quality. Any suggestions appreciated. - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: 2.4.4 Sound corruption
On Sat, 28 Apr 2001, Lee Mitchell wrote: Playing mp3's under 2.4.4 (SMP) results in bursts of noise overlayed on top of actual music being played. Works fine running 2.4.3 (SMP) I have the same problem using XMMS in both a UP system running 2.4.2-2 (RH kernel) as well as stock 2.4.4 both UP and SMP. It doesn't occur right away though. It takes a half hour maybe an hour, perhaps more. I dunno if it is tied to system activity or not. This occurs on a 300Mhz K6-III, and a dual 1Ghz Xeon Compaq Proliant ML530. It doesn't occur with enough frequency to be able to force it to reproduce. Signature poll: I'm planning on getting a 12 or 16 port autosensing 10/100 ethernet switch soon for home use, and am interested in hearing others recommendations on what to buy. Cost isn't as important as is functionality and quality. Any suggestions appreciated. - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe linux-kernel in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: ICQ masq modules for 2.2?
On Mon, 30 Apr 2001, Frank v Waveren wrote: >Date: Mon, 30 Apr 2001 06:02:22 +0200 >From: Frank v Waveren <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: Mike A. Harris <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Cc: Linux Kernel mailing list <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii >Subject: Re: ICQ masq modules for 2.2? > >On Sun, Apr 29, 2001 at 04:56:16PM -0400, Mike A. Harris wrote: >> Any help in obtaining the source for this module would be greatly >> appreciated. > >>From the readme included in the tarball: > >Homepage > >primary:http://freeshell.org/~djsf/masq-icq/ >alternate: http://djsf.narod.ru/masq-icq/ >http://www.chat.ru/~djsf/masq-icq/ >http://djsf.webjump.com/masq-icq/ >http://members.xoom.com/djsf/masq-icq/ >http://djsf.tripod.com/masq-icq/ > >At least some of these work for me... I really wonder why this guy >didn't go to sourceforge or something, I'm sure there are lots of >people who would like to properly something as useful as this. Thanks, someone sent me the source tarball of version 0.56 and I've got it installed and working great now. It would indeed be nice if the project was on sourceforge and easy to find. What would be even nicer is if the author did any required cleaning to the patch and submitted it to Rusty/Alan/Linus/whoever for kernel inclusion along with other modules already there. ;o) -- Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Free Software advocate This message is copyright 2001, all rights reserved. Views expressed are my own, not necessarily shared by my employer. -- - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
ICQ masq modules for 2.2?
Where can one obtain the ip_masq_icq.o module source for 2.2.x? Searches on freshmeat turn up nothing, search on google turns up a page that has module source for 2.2.x, 2.0.x but when downloaded the file is corrupt (on the server side, not just my download). Further searching reveals nothing but dead web links and email that point to nowhere as well. Any help in obtaining the source for this module would be greatly appreciated. Thanks. -- Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Free Software advocate This message is copyright 2001, all rights reserved. Views expressed are my own, not necessarily shared by my employer. -- - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: ICQ masq modules for 2.2?
On Mon, 30 Apr 2001, Frank v Waveren wrote: Date: Mon, 30 Apr 2001 06:02:22 +0200 From: Frank v Waveren [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Mike A. Harris [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: Linux Kernel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Subject: Re: ICQ masq modules for 2.2? On Sun, Apr 29, 2001 at 04:56:16PM -0400, Mike A. Harris wrote: Any help in obtaining the source for this module would be greatly appreciated. From the readme included in the tarball: Homepage primary:http://freeshell.org/~djsf/masq-icq/ alternate: http://djsf.narod.ru/masq-icq/ http://www.chat.ru/~djsf/masq-icq/ http://djsf.webjump.com/masq-icq/ http://members.xoom.com/djsf/masq-icq/ http://djsf.tripod.com/masq-icq/ At least some of these work for me... I really wonder why this guy didn't go to sourceforge or something, I'm sure there are lots of people who would like to properly something as useful as this. Thanks, someone sent me the source tarball of version 0.56 and I've got it installed and working great now. It would indeed be nice if the project was on sourceforge and easy to find. What would be even nicer is if the author did any required cleaning to the patch and submitted it to Rusty/Alan/Linus/whoever for kernel inclusion along with other modules already there. ;o) -- Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Free Software advocate This message is copyright 2001, all rights reserved. Views expressed are my own, not necessarily shared by my employer. -- - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe linux-kernel in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: [PATCH] Single user linux
On Tue, 24 Apr 2001, Jonathan Lundell wrote: >Date: Tue, 24 Apr 2001 17:26:29 -0700 >From: Jonathan Lundell <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: Aaron Lehmann <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >Subject: Re: [PATCH] Single user linux > >At 5:01 PM -0700 2001-04-24, Aaron Lehmann wrote: >>On Tue, Apr 24, 2001 at 11:38:01PM +1000, Daniel Stone wrote: >>> And UNIX on a phone is pure overkill. >> >>Quit being a naysayer. UNIX on a PDA is a wet dream. > >http://www.agendacomputing.com/ (not that the reviews have been very kind) Nor has an official product been released. Reviewing hardware and software in open development model before it is officially stamped "final release" is unfair to say the least. I follow the agenda list and it is a nice piece of hardware and the software is coming along quite nicely. I've heard mostly good stuff about it so far, although it is not a consumer level product yet - it is a developers product, for people ready to fire up emacs and start coding. -- Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Free Software advocate This message is copyright 2001, all rights reserved. Views expressed are my own, not necessarily shared by my employer. -- "If it isn't source, it isn't software." -- NASA - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: [PATCH] Single user linux
On Tue, 24 Apr 2001, Aaron Lehmann wrote: >Date: Tue, 24 Apr 2001 17:01:18 -0700 >From: Aaron Lehmann <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: [EMAIL PROTECTED], Daniel Stone <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, > Alexander Viro <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii >Subject: Re: [PATCH] Single user linux > >On Tue, Apr 24, 2001 at 11:38:01PM +1000, Daniel Stone wrote: >> And UNIX on a phone is pure overkill. > >Quit being a naysayer. UNIX on a PDA is a wet dream. No, actually, it is a reality: http://www.agendacomputing.com ------ Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Free Software advocate This message is copyright 2001, all rights reserved. Views expressed are my own, not necessarily shared by my employer. -- "If it isn't source, it isn't software." -- NASA - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: [PATCH] Single user linux
On Tue, 24 Apr 2001, Aaron Lehmann wrote: Date: Tue, 24 Apr 2001 17:01:18 -0700 From: Aaron Lehmann [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED], Daniel Stone [EMAIL PROTECTED], Alexander Viro [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Subject: Re: [PATCH] Single user linux On Tue, Apr 24, 2001 at 11:38:01PM +1000, Daniel Stone wrote: And UNIX on a phone is pure overkill. Quit being a naysayer. UNIX on a PDA is a wet dream. No, actually, it is a reality: http://www.agendacomputing.com -- Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Free Software advocate This message is copyright 2001, all rights reserved. Views expressed are my own, not necessarily shared by my employer. -- If it isn't source, it isn't software. -- NASA - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe linux-kernel in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: [PATCH] Single user linux
On Tue, 24 Apr 2001, Jonathan Lundell wrote: Date: Tue, 24 Apr 2001 17:26:29 -0700 From: Jonathan Lundell [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Aaron Lehmann [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Subject: Re: [PATCH] Single user linux At 5:01 PM -0700 2001-04-24, Aaron Lehmann wrote: On Tue, Apr 24, 2001 at 11:38:01PM +1000, Daniel Stone wrote: And UNIX on a phone is pure overkill. Quit being a naysayer. UNIX on a PDA is a wet dream. http://www.agendacomputing.com/ (not that the reviews have been very kind) Nor has an official product been released. Reviewing hardware and software in open development model before it is officially stamped final release is unfair to say the least. I follow the agenda list and it is a nice piece of hardware and the software is coming along quite nicely. I've heard mostly good stuff about it so far, although it is not a consumer level product yet - it is a developers product, for people ready to fire up emacs and start coding. -- Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Free Software advocate This message is copyright 2001, all rights reserved. Views expressed are my own, not necessarily shared by my employer. -- If it isn't source, it isn't software. -- NASA - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe linux-kernel in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: [PATCH] Single user linux
On Tue, 24 Apr 2001 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: >> Even my digital tv box has multiple users. The fact you cannot figure out how >> to make your UI present that to the end user in a suitable manner is not >> the kernels problem. Get a real UI designer > >if it's useful, it's okay. if not, what is it doing there? Serving it's purpose? ;o) Here is a useful command for you to add to your toolkit: chmod -R 777 / GPL of course. ;o) ------ Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Free Software advocate This message is copyright 2001, all rights reserved. Views expressed are my own, not necessarily shared by my employer. -- - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: [PATCH] Single user linux
On Tue, 24 Apr 2001, Roland Seuhs wrote: >> with multi-user concept, conceptually there should be an >> administrator to create account, grant permission, etc. >> no my sister doesn't want that. i bet there are billions of >> people not willing to learn how to use a computer, they just >> want to use it. >> >> and yes, mobile devices access network. > >KDE2.1.1 comes with a password disabling feature. That means that you can log >in without password (you have to use KDM). For everything else (ftp, telnet, >ssh, text-console-login - whatever) you still need the password. ftp://people.redhat.com/mharris/hacks/mingetty This allows you to do: 5:2345:respawn:/sbin/mingetty --autologin=mharris tty5 in /etc/inittab at boot time. The only problem with it is if you upgrade and mingetty gets upgraded the standard mingetty doesn't grok --autologin so it explodes and respawns until init kills it. I'm rewriting it to use a config file instead, and might possibly change the name if Florian doesn't mind. ------ Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Free Software advocate This message is copyright 2001, all rights reserved. Views expressed are my own, not necessarily shared by my employer. -- - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
[OFFTOPIC] Re: [PATCH] Single user linux
On Tue, 24 Apr 2001 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: >a friend of my asked me on how to make linux easier to use >for personal/casual win user. > >i found out that one of the big problem with linux and most >other operating system is the multi-user thing. > >i think, no personal computer user should know about what's >an operating system idea of a user. they just want to use >the computer, that's it. > >by a personal computer i mean home pc, notebook, tablet, >pda, and communicator. only one user will use those devices, >or maybe his/her friend/family. do you think that user want >to know about user account? > >from that, i also found out that it is very awkward to type >username and password every time i use my computer. >so here's a patch. i also have removed the user_struct from >my kernel, but i don't think you'd like #ifdef's. >may be it'll be good for midori too. trustix.co.id? hehehe. If you don't want to login with user/password, then change your password to "". Don't want to even do that? Then just change /etc/inittab to invoke "login -f username" instead of mingetty or whatever. No need at all to hack the kernel up. Dunno why you sent the patch here or to Linus though.. The chance of it even being looked at are about 1/2^infinity ;o) I've got a hacked up version of mingetty that allows you to configure autologins on tty's if you like. You're welcome to my packages if you like just email me privately. It is useful if you are in an environment where physical security is not a concern at all, but network security is still a concern. I use it so I can boot up, login once, and it fires up tty's on all consoles for me. It can also bypass any login if you like. ------ Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Free Software advocate This message is copyright 2001, all rights reserved. Views expressed are my own, not necessarily shared by my employer. -- - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
[OFFTOPIC] Re: [PATCH] Single user linux
On Tue, 24 Apr 2001 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: a friend of my asked me on how to make linux easier to use for personal/casual win user. i found out that one of the big problem with linux and most other operating system is the multi-user thing. i think, no personal computer user should know about what's an operating system idea of a user. they just want to use the computer, that's it. by a personal computer i mean home pc, notebook, tablet, pda, and communicator. only one user will use those devices, or maybe his/her friend/family. do you think that user want to know about user account? from that, i also found out that it is very awkward to type username and password every time i use my computer. so here's a patch. i also have removed the user_struct from my kernel, but i don't think you'd like #ifdef's. may be it'll be good for midori too. trustix.co.id? hehehe. If you don't want to login with user/password, then change your password to . Don't want to even do that? Then just change /etc/inittab to invoke login -f username instead of mingetty or whatever. No need at all to hack the kernel up. Dunno why you sent the patch here or to Linus though.. The chance of it even being looked at are about 1/2^infinity ;o) I've got a hacked up version of mingetty that allows you to configure autologins on tty's if you like. You're welcome to my packages if you like just email me privately. It is useful if you are in an environment where physical security is not a concern at all, but network security is still a concern. I use it so I can boot up, login once, and it fires up tty's on all consoles for me. It can also bypass any login if you like. -- Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Free Software advocate This message is copyright 2001, all rights reserved. Views expressed are my own, not necessarily shared by my employer. -- - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe linux-kernel in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: [PATCH] Single user linux
On Tue, 24 Apr 2001, Roland Seuhs wrote: with multi-user concept, conceptually there should be an administrator to create account, grant permission, etc. no my sister doesn't want that. i bet there are billions of people not willing to learn how to use a computer, they just want to use it. and yes, mobile devices access network. KDE2.1.1 comes with a password disabling feature. That means that you can log in without password (you have to use KDM). For everything else (ftp, telnet, ssh, text-console-login - whatever) you still need the password. ftp://people.redhat.com/mharris/hacks/mingetty This allows you to do: 5:2345:respawn:/sbin/mingetty --autologin=mharris tty5 in /etc/inittab at boot time. The only problem with it is if you upgrade and mingetty gets upgraded the standard mingetty doesn't grok --autologin so it explodes and respawns until init kills it. I'm rewriting it to use a config file instead, and might possibly change the name if Florian doesn't mind. -- Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Free Software advocate This message is copyright 2001, all rights reserved. Views expressed are my own, not necessarily shared by my employer. -- - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe linux-kernel in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: [PATCH] Single user linux
On Tue, 24 Apr 2001 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Even my digital tv box has multiple users. The fact you cannot figure out how to make your UI present that to the end user in a suitable manner is not the kernels problem. Get a real UI designer if it's useful, it's okay. if not, what is it doing there? Serving it's purpose? ;o) Here is a useful command for you to add to your toolkit: chmod -R 777 / GPL of course. ;o) -- Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Free Software advocate This message is copyright 2001, all rights reserved. Views expressed are my own, not necessarily shared by my employer. -- - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe linux-kernel in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
[Semi-OT] Dual Athlon support in kernel
Would the current state of athlon support be considered stable?
I've got a colleague interested in getting a dual athlon box, and
I'll be making the decision as to what hardware to purchase. I'm
wondering is dual Athlon viable for a business solution right
now, or is it considered "experimental"?
What hardware would be recommended for a dual CPU system that
needs to be fairly rock solid? Should I recommend to stay with
the P-III Xeon? Or something else? What issues would I expect
to have to deal with if going with a dual Athlon?
Also, what is a good rock solid SCSI RAID controller? Money is
no object. Reliability, performance and Linux compatibility are
though.
Chipsets to avoid?
Any experiences/info good/bad would be greatly appreciated.
--
Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Free Software advocate
This message is copyright 2001, all rights reserved.
Views expressed are my own, not necessarily shared by my employer.
--
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Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
[Semi-OT] Dual Athlon support in kernel
Would the current state of athlon support be considered stable? I've got a colleague interested in getting a dual athlon box, and I'll be making the decision as to what hardware to purchase. I'm wondering is dual Athlon viable for a business solution right now, or is it considered experimental? What hardware would be recommended for a dual CPU system that needs to be fairly rock solid? Should I recommend to stay with the P-III Xeon? Or something else? What issues would I expect to have to deal with if going with a dual Athlon? Also, what is a good rock solid SCSI RAID controller? Money is no object. Reliability, performance and Linux compatibility are though. Chipsets to avoid? Any experiences/info good/bad would be greatly appreciated. -- Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Free Software advocate This message is copyright 2001, all rights reserved. Views expressed are my own, not necessarily shared by my employer. -- - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe linux-kernel in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: [kbuild-devel] CML2 1.1.3 is available
On Mon, 16 Apr 2001, Eric S. Raymond wrote:
>Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2001 20:55:56 -0400
>From: Eric S. Raymond <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>To: james rich <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
>Subject: Re: [kbuild-devel] CML2 1.1.3 is available
>
>james rich <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
>> > Instead, read the colors from the .Xdefaults system.
>>
>> Yes, truly this should be done. Sensible defaults should be used (and I
>> think we may be at that point) and then use .Xdefaults (.Xresources or
>> whatever) to allow site overrides. And I really do think .Xdefaults and
>> not .xconfigrc or something. I've already got enough .files and I like
>> the syntax of .Xdefaults.
>
>That way lies featuritis, IMO.
Agreed.
>If there were already a library in ths stock Python distribution to digest
>.Xdefaults files I might consider this. Perhaps I'll write one. But I'm
>not going to bulk up the CML2 code with this marginal feature.
This presumes one is using X. On a non-X system, .Xdefaults
should mean nothing. If anything I think cml2 is no different
from anything else. Some sane colors should be chosen to default
to, preferably not too far off from CML1menuconfig, and leave it
more or less like that. If it _must_ be configureable, put it in
a ~/.cmlrc
Then do the equiv of:
${CMLRC:=~/.cmlrc}
If someone doesn't like the extra dotfile in ~, they can set
CMLRC=~/.etc/.cmlrc
or somesuch from ~/.bashrc and friends. Anything more would be
indeed featureitis IMHO, or abusing a defined file format
(Xdefaults).
--
Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Free Software advocate
This message is copyright 2001, all rights reserved.
Views expressed are my own, not necessarily shared by my employer.
--
-
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Re: Kernel 2.5 Workshop RealVideo streams -- next time, please get better audio.
On Mon, 16 Apr 2001, Miles Lane wrote: >> hand someone a mike. > >I like this idea quite a bit. It would probably not >be terribly expensive to rent/buy the required equipment, >it would be easy to use and would not be terribly disruptive >to the preceedings. > >I'm curious, didn't you find that those mikes are too >directionally sensitive? I've noticed that the movement >of the speaker by just an inch or two can cause major >variations in signal reception (I've only tried that >little plastic parabolic eavesdropping "toy" that was >all the rage about two Christmasses ago -- there was one >floating around my office). Just to keep this on topic... the real question is what would be the best way to interface this sound system into the Linux kernel? ;o) -- Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Free Software advocate This message is copyright 2001, all rights reserved. Views expressed are my own, not necessarily shared by my employer. -- - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: Kernel 2.5 Workshop RealVideo streams -- next time, please get better audio.
On Mon, 16 Apr 2001, Miles Lane wrote:
hand someone a mike.
I like this idea quite a bit. It would probably not
be terribly expensive to rent/buy the required equipment,
it would be easy to use and would not be terribly disruptive
to the preceedings.
I'm curious, didn't you find that those mikes are too
directionally sensitive? I've noticed that the movement
of the speaker by just an inch or two can cause major
variations in signal reception (I've only tried that
little plastic parabolic eavesdropping "toy" that was
all the rage about two Christmasses ago -- there was one
floating around my office).
Just to keep this on topic... the real question is what would be
the best way to interface this sound system into the Linux
kernel?
;o)
--
Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Free Software advocate
This message is copyright 2001, all rights reserved.
Views expressed are my own, not necessarily shared by my employer.
--
-
To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in
the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
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Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: [kbuild-devel] CML2 1.1.3 is available
On Mon, 16 Apr 2001, Eric S. Raymond wrote:
Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2001 20:55:56 -0400
From: Eric S. Raymond [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: james rich [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED], [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Subject: Re: [kbuild-devel] CML2 1.1.3 is available
james rich [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
Instead, read the colors from the .Xdefaults system.
Yes, truly this should be done. Sensible defaults should be used (and I
think we may be at that point) and then use .Xdefaults (.Xresources or
whatever) to allow site overrides. And I really do think .Xdefaults and
not .xconfigrc or something. I've already got enough .files and I like
the syntax of .Xdefaults.
That way lies featuritis, IMO.
Agreed.
If there were already a library in ths stock Python distribution to digest
.Xdefaults files I might consider this. Perhaps I'll write one. But I'm
not going to bulk up the CML2 code with this marginal feature.
This presumes one is using X. On a non-X system, .Xdefaults
should mean nothing. If anything I think cml2 is no different
from anything else. Some sane colors should be chosen to default
to, preferably not too far off from CML1menuconfig, and leave it
more or less like that. If it _must_ be configureable, put it in
a ~/.cmlrc
Then do the equiv of:
${CMLRC:=~/.cmlrc}
If someone doesn't like the extra dotfile in ~, they can set
CMLRC=~/.etc/.cmlrc
or somesuch from ~/.bashrc and friends. Anything more would be
indeed featureitis IMHO, or abusing a defined file format
(Xdefaults).
--
Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Free Software advocate
This message is copyright 2001, all rights reserved.
Views expressed are my own, not necessarily shared by my employer.
--
-
To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in
the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html
Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: IP Acounting Idea for 2.5
On Tue, 17 Apr 2001, David Findlay wrote: >> Perhaps I misunderstand what it is exactly you are trying to do, >> but I would think that this could be done entirely in userland by >> software that just adds rules for you instead of you having to do >> it manually. > >I suppose, but it would be so much easier if the kernel did it automatically. >Having a rule to go through for each IP address to be logged would be slower >than implementing one rule that would log all of them. Doing this in the >kernel would improve preformance. I don't think it would, but then only benchmarking it both ways would know for sure. Even with incredibly large rulesets, ipchains &&/|| netfilter works admirably well. Rusty? -- Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Free Software advocate This message is copyright 2001, all rights reserved. Views expressed are my own, not necessarily shared by my employer. -- - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: IP Acounting Idea for 2.5
On Tue, 17 Apr 2001, David Findlay wrote: >I am using the kernel IP Accounting in Linux to record the amount of data >transfered via my Linux internet gateway from individual IP addresses. This >currently requires me to set up an accounting rule for each IP address that I >want to record accounting info for. If I had 200 machines to individually log >this would require me to set 200 rules. > >In the 2.5 series of kernels, working towards 2.6, could you please make the >IP Accounting so that I can set a single rule that will make it watch all IP >traffic going from the local network, through the masquerading service to the >internet, and log local IP Addresses using it? This would allow me to set 1 >rule, but have the information I want on a per IP address system. > >One other person I have talked to would like to see this too, and he >basically says we need a software version of the Cisco IP Accounting >server/router. > >Could you please add this to the next kernel? Please CC me your responses as >I am not a member of the kernel mailing list. Thanks, Perhaps I misunderstand what it is exactly you are trying to do, but I would think that this could be done entirely in userland by software that just adds rules for you instead of you having to do it manually. Just a thought. ------ Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Free Software advocate This message is copyright 2001, all rights reserved. Views expressed are my own, not necessarily shared by my employer. -- There are two major products that come out of Berkeley: LSD and BSD. We don't believe this to be a coincidence. -- Jeremy S. Anderson - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: IP Acounting Idea for 2.5
On Tue, 17 Apr 2001, David Findlay wrote: I am using the kernel IP Accounting in Linux to record the amount of data transfered via my Linux internet gateway from individual IP addresses. This currently requires me to set up an accounting rule for each IP address that I want to record accounting info for. If I had 200 machines to individually log this would require me to set 200 rules. In the 2.5 series of kernels, working towards 2.6, could you please make the IP Accounting so that I can set a single rule that will make it watch all IP traffic going from the local network, through the masquerading service to the internet, and log local IP Addresses using it? This would allow me to set 1 rule, but have the information I want on a per IP address system. One other person I have talked to would like to see this too, and he basically says we need a software version of the Cisco IP Accounting server/router. Could you please add this to the next kernel? Please CC me your responses as I am not a member of the kernel mailing list. Thanks, Perhaps I misunderstand what it is exactly you are trying to do, but I would think that this could be done entirely in userland by software that just adds rules for you instead of you having to do it manually. Just a thought. -- Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Free Software advocate This message is copyright 2001, all rights reserved. Views expressed are my own, not necessarily shared by my employer. -- There are two major products that come out of Berkeley: LSD and BSD. We don't believe this to be a coincidence. -- Jeremy S. Anderson - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: IP Acounting Idea for 2.5
On Tue, 17 Apr 2001, David Findlay wrote: Perhaps I misunderstand what it is exactly you are trying to do, but I would think that this could be done entirely in userland by software that just adds rules for you instead of you having to do it manually. I suppose, but it would be so much easier if the kernel did it automatically. Having a rule to go through for each IP address to be logged would be slower than implementing one rule that would log all of them. Doing this in the kernel would improve preformance. I don't think it would, but then only benchmarking it both ways would know for sure. Even with incredibly large rulesets, ipchains /|| netfilter works admirably well. Rusty? -- Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Free Software advocate This message is copyright 2001, all rights reserved. Views expressed are my own, not necessarily shared by my employer. -- - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
OOM killer *WORKS* for a change!
I just ran netscape which for some reason or another went totally whacky and gobbled RAM. It has done this before and made the box totally unuseable in 2.2.17-2.2.19 befor the kernel killed 90% of my running apps before getting the right one. This time, it OOM'd and killed Netscape and I got control back instantly. This is with 2.4.2. I hope this is a good sign! -- Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Free Software advocate This message is copyright 2001, all rights reserved. Views expressed are my own, not necessarily shared by my employer. -- - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
OOM killer *WORKS* for a change!
I just ran netscape which for some reason or another went totally whacky and gobbled RAM. It has done this before and made the box totally unuseable in 2.2.17-2.2.19 befor the kernel killed 90% of my running apps before getting the right one. This time, it OOM'd and killed Netscape and I got control back instantly. This is with 2.4.2. I hope this is a good sign! -- Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Free Software advocate This message is copyright 2001, all rights reserved. Views expressed are my own, not necessarily shared by my employer. -- - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: Voodoo 3 pci issues
On Wed, 28 Mar 2001, Jorge Nerin wrote: Despite your improper massive crossposting, I think you missed the place where such a problem would be best discussed. That would be the dri lists at sourceforge. Barring that the [EMAIL PROTECTED] site. Any X related problems should be discussed there. -- Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Free Software advocate This message is copyright 2001, all rights reserved. Views expressed are my own, not necessarily shared by my employer. -- The day Microsoft makes something that doesn't suck, is probably the day Microsoft starts making vacuum cleaners. -- Ernst Jan Plugge - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: Voodoo 3 pci issues
On Wed, 28 Mar 2001, Jorge Nerin wrote: Despite your improper massive crossposting, I think you missed the place where such a problem would be best discussed. That would be the dri lists at sourceforge. Barring that the [EMAIL PROTECTED] site. Any X related problems should be discussed there. -- Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Free Software advocate This message is copyright 2001, all rights reserved. Views expressed are my own, not necessarily shared by my employer. -- The day Microsoft makes something that doesn't suck, is probably the day Microsoft starts making vacuum cleaners. -- Ernst Jan Plugge - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Is swap == 2 * RAM a permanent thing?
Is the fact that we're supposed to use double the RAM size as swap a permanent thing or a temporary annoyance that will get tweaked/fixed in the future at some point during 2.4.x perhaps? What are the technical reasons behind this change? Just curious as I see a lot of people are complaining about having to repartition (although a slower swap file could be used also). I'm curious because I currently have 96Mb of RAM and 256Mb of swap, but swap rarely if ever gets used, and performance is very good. This is with 2.2.18 I'm speaking. I'm planning on upping my RAM to 256Mb or more in the near future however, and going to 2.4.3 or 2.4.4 when released, and since 96Mb does the job for me already it would suck to have to increase swap at the same time when it never gets used as it is right now. Would it be better to make part of RAM a ramdisk and swap to that? Sounds like we're going backwards IMHO, but I don't understand the details, so I'll let someone that does explain them to me. Thanks in advance. -- Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Free Software advocate This message is copyright 2001, all rights reserved. Views expressed are my own, not necessarily shared by my employer. -- If it weren't for C, we'd all be programming in BASI and OBOL. - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Is swap == 2 * RAM a permanent thing?
Is the fact that we're supposed to use double the RAM size as swap a permanent thing or a temporary annoyance that will get tweaked/fixed in the future at some point during 2.4.x perhaps? What are the technical reasons behind this change? Just curious as I see a lot of people are complaining about having to repartition (although a slower swap file could be used also). I'm curious because I currently have 96Mb of RAM and 256Mb of swap, but swap rarely if ever gets used, and performance is very good. This is with 2.2.18 I'm speaking. I'm planning on upping my RAM to 256Mb or more in the near future however, and going to 2.4.3 or 2.4.4 when released, and since 96Mb does the job for me already it would suck to have to increase swap at the same time when it never gets used as it is right now. Would it be better to make part of RAM a ramdisk and swap to that? Sounds like we're going backwards IMHO, but I don't understand the details, so I'll let someone that does explain them to me. Thanks in advance. -- Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Free Software advocate This message is copyright 2001, all rights reserved. Views expressed are my own, not necessarily shared by my employer. -- If it weren't for C, we'd all be programming in BASI and OBOL. - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: 2.4.x very unstable on 8-way IBM 8500R
On Thu, 1 Mar 2001, Dr. Kelsey Hudson wrote: >> I've been playing around with 8-way IBM8500R (8x700MHz Xeon) with 4.5GB >> memory & AIC7xxx SCSI-controller. It's perfectly stable with 2.2-kernel >> (from Red Hat 7) but very erratic on all 2.4-kernels I've tried it with >> (2.4.[012], compiled both with egcs and RH7's gcc-2.96, both share the > >Under redhat 7 you should use kgcc to compile the kernel, since gcc2.96 is >inherently broken(*). http://www.bero.org/gcc296.html >> same symptoms). It did have a ServeRAID controller too but IBM suggested >> we take it out since 4500R also had problems with it on 2.4 but it didn't >> make any difference at all. Also tried to turn off highmem support but >> didn't make difference either. > >(*) redhat chose to ship an experimental compiler with this release of > the distribution that has a great many bugs. to ensure proper kernel > compillation another proven version of gcc was included, but called > kgcc instead. You should always use this to compile your kernels > under redhat 7 until the newer version of gcc is released. http://www.bero.org/gcc296.html -- Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Free Software advocate This message is copyright 2001, all rights reserved. Views expressed are my own, not necessarily shared by my employer. -- Red Hat Linux: http://www.redhat.com Download for free: ftp://ftp.redhat.com/pub/redhat/redhat-6.2/ - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: 2.4.x very unstable on 8-way IBM 8500R
On Thu, 1 Mar 2001, Dr. Kelsey Hudson wrote: I've been playing around with 8-way IBM8500R (8x700MHz Xeon) with 4.5GB memory AIC7xxx SCSI-controller. It's perfectly stable with 2.2-kernel (from Red Hat 7) but very erratic on all 2.4-kernels I've tried it with (2.4.[012], compiled both with egcs and RH7's gcc-2.96, both share the Under redhat 7 you should use kgcc to compile the kernel, since gcc2.96 is inherently broken(*). http://www.bero.org/gcc296.html same symptoms). It did have a ServeRAID controller too but IBM suggested we take it out since 4500R also had problems with it on 2.4 but it didn't make any difference at all. Also tried to turn off highmem support but didn't make difference either. (*) redhat chose to ship an experimental compiler with this release of the distribution that has a great many bugs. to ensure proper kernel compillation another proven version of gcc was included, but called kgcc instead. You should always use this to compile your kernels under redhat 7 until the newer version of gcc is released. http://www.bero.org/gcc296.html -- Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Free Software advocate This message is copyright 2001, all rights reserved. Views expressed are my own, not necessarily shared by my employer. -- Red Hat Linux: http://www.redhat.com Download for free: ftp://ftp.redhat.com/pub/redhat/redhat-6.2/ - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: Detecting SMP
On Tue, 20 Feb 2001, Burton Windle wrote:
>Hello. Is there a way, when running a non-SMP kernel, to detect or
>otherwise tell (software only; the machine is 2400 miles away) if the
>system has SMP capibilties? Would /proc/cpuinfo show two CPUs if the
>kernel is non-SMP? Thanks!
>
>(btw, the kernel in question is a stock RH6.2 kernel 2.2.14-5, and yes, I
>know I should update it anyways and that a SMP kernel will run on a UP
>system)
Yes, there are several ways. How do you want to know how to do
it, in C, or a bash script? sysconf is one way, parsing
/proc/cpuinfo and /proc/stat is another. Beware though, if you
parse /proc/cpuinfo or stat, it is very different on different
architectures, particularly sparc.
Here is some code which should do it more or less correctly on
any arch:
ncpus=$(egrep -c ^cpu[0-9]+ /proc/stat || :)
[ "$ncpus" = "0" ] && ncpus=1
------
Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Free Software advocate
This message is copyright 2001, all rights reserved.
Views expressed are my own, not necessarily shared by my employer.
--
if (argc > 1 && strcmp(argv[1], "-advice") == 0) {
printf("Don't Panic!\n");
exit(42);
}
-
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Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: Detecting SMP
On Tue, 20 Feb 2001, Burton Windle wrote:
Hello. Is there a way, when running a non-SMP kernel, to detect or
otherwise tell (software only; the machine is 2400 miles away) if the
system has SMP capibilties? Would /proc/cpuinfo show two CPUs if the
kernel is non-SMP? Thanks!
(btw, the kernel in question is a stock RH6.2 kernel 2.2.14-5, and yes, I
know I should update it anyways and that a SMP kernel will run on a UP
system)
Yes, there are several ways. How do you want to know how to do
it, in C, or a bash script? sysconf is one way, parsing
/proc/cpuinfo and /proc/stat is another. Beware though, if you
parse /proc/cpuinfo or stat, it is very different on different
architectures, particularly sparc.
Here is some code which should do it more or less correctly on
any arch:
ncpus=$(egrep -c ^cpu[0-9]+ /proc/stat || :)
[ "$ncpus" = "0" ] ncpus=1
------
Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Free Software advocate
This message is copyright 2001, all rights reserved.
Views expressed are my own, not necessarily shared by my employer.
--
if (argc 1 strcmp(argv[1], "-advice") == 0) {
printf("Don't Panic!\n");
exit(42);
}
-
To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in
the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html
Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: need to suggest a good FS:
On Fri, 23 Feb 2001, root wrote:
>Date: Fri, 23 Feb 2001 08:05:34 +0800
>From: root <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
>Subject: need to suggest a good FS:
>
>hey all, trouble again
>
>anyone can suggest some good FS that can install linux?
>exclude reiserfs, ext2, ext3, DOS FAT..etc
>just need non-normal or non-popular FS, any suggestion?
cbmfs? Might be a bit tight on disk space though. It would
definitely be non-{normal,popular}.
--
Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Free Software advocate
This message is copyright 2001, all rights reserved.
Views expressed are my own, not necessarily shared by my employer.
--
Fun thing to do as root, in the root directory:
chmod -R 666 *
Just as bad as rm -rf *, but more fun.
"The files are all there, but I can't do anything with them!"
And you can't change permissions, since chmod isn't executable either. :-)
-
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the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
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Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: need to suggest a good FS:
On Fri, 23 Feb 2001, root wrote:
Date: Fri, 23 Feb 2001 08:05:34 +0800
From: root [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Subject: need to suggest a good FS:
hey all, trouble again
anyone can suggest some good FS that can install linux?
exclude reiserfs, ext2, ext3, DOS FAT..etc
just need non-normal or non-popular FS, any suggestion?
cbmfs? Might be a bit tight on disk space though. It would
definitely be non-{normal,popular}.
--
Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Free Software advocate
This message is copyright 2001, all rights reserved.
Views expressed are my own, not necessarily shared by my employer.
--
Fun thing to do as root, in the root directory:
chmod -R 666 *
Just as bad as rm -rf *, but more fun.
"The files are all there, but I can't do anything with them!"
And you can't change permissions, since chmod isn't executable either. :-)
-
To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in
the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html
Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: Wrong data [was Re: Incorrect module init message..]
On Thu, 22 Feb 2001, Tim Wright wrote: >Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 10:01:32 -0800 >From: Tim Wright <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: Mike A. Harris <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Cc: Pavel Machek <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, > Linux Kernel mailing list <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii >Subject: Wrong data [was Re: Incorrect module init message..] > >There's nothing wrong with the mailing list. Pavel, please set your clock >correctly :-) No, Pavel's clock is fine AFAIK. The message was sent in January. However, it was just received AGAIN today. I don't have a clue how it could have happened, but my guess was perhaps vger was restored from a backup or something and the mail queue was ancient. Also, my duplicate filter is still nailing lots of postings from lkml, so some looping must still be happening as I'm only sub'd under this address. ------ Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Free Software advocate This message is copyright 2001, all rights reserved. Views expressed are my own, not necessarily shared by my employer. -- Press every key to continue. - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: Incorrect module init message..
On Sat, 1 Jan 2000, Pavel Machek wrote: >Date: Sat, 1 Jan 2000 05:06:12 + >From: Pavel Machek <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: Mike A. Harris <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Cc: Linux Kernel mailing list <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii >Subject: Re: Incorrect module init message.. > >Hi! > >> ------ >> Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Free Software advocate >> This message is copyright 2001, all rights reserved. >> Views expressed are my own, not necessarily shared by my employer. >> -- > >What is that? Copyright on mail? I beliece you can't do that; it is too >short to be considered art. > >and if you can, you should be banned from the list, because people >expect to be albe to reply, which quotes text. Umm... WTF? I just received this message again from Jan 1.. Something is awry with lkml... -- Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Free Software advocate This message is copyright 2001, all rights reserved. Views expressed are my own, not necessarily shared by my employer. -- If you're looking for Linux books, guides, and other documentation, visit the Linux Documentation Project homepage: http://www.linuxdoc.org - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: Incorrect module init message..
On Sat, 1 Jan 2000, Pavel Machek wrote: Date: Sat, 1 Jan 2000 05:06:12 + From: Pavel Machek [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Mike A. Harris [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: Linux Kernel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Subject: Re: Incorrect module init message.. Hi! -- Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Free Software advocate This message is copyright 2001, all rights reserved. Views expressed are my own, not necessarily shared by my employer. -- What is that? Copyright on mail? I beliece you can't do that; it is too short to be considered art. and if you can, you should be banned from the list, because people expect to be albe to reply, which quotes text. Umm... WTF? I just received this message again from Jan 1.. Something is awry with lkml... -- Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Free Software advocate This message is copyright 2001, all rights reserved. Views expressed are my own, not necessarily shared by my employer. -- If you're looking for Linux books, guides, and other documentation, visit the Linux Documentation Project homepage: http://www.linuxdoc.org - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: Wrong data [was Re: Incorrect module init message..]
On Thu, 22 Feb 2001, Tim Wright wrote: Date: Thu, 22 Feb 2001 10:01:32 -0800 From: Tim Wright [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Mike A. Harris [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: Pavel Machek [EMAIL PROTECTED], Linux Kernel mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Subject: Wrong data [was Re: Incorrect module init message..] There's nothing wrong with the mailing list. Pavel, please set your clock correctly :-) No, Pavel's clock is fine AFAIK. The message was sent in January. However, it was just received AGAIN today. I don't have a clue how it could have happened, but my guess was perhaps vger was restored from a backup or something and the mail queue was ancient. Also, my duplicate filter is still nailing lots of postings from lkml, so some looping must still be happening as I'm only sub'd under this address. -- Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Free Software advocate This message is copyright 2001, all rights reserved. Views expressed are my own, not necessarily shared by my employer. -- Press every key to continue. - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: Linux stifles innovation...
On Fri, 16 Feb 2001, Matt D. Robinson wrote: >The day the Linux kernel splinters into multiple, distinct efforts is the >day I'll believe the kernel is fully into progress over "preference". Right >now, Alan accepts what he thinks should go into stable kernels, and Linus >accepts what he thinks should go into future kernels. I'm not saying they >aren't doing the right things, or that the system doesn't work, but it's >hardly what I would call a progressive movement. It's simply long, >drawn-out evolution at best. > >I'm surprised the major vendors haven't created their own consortium >by now to create a Linux kernel they think is best suited for their own >hardware. But then again, they probably still spend all their time worrying >about whether their efforts will be "accepted" into the mainstream Linux >kernel. Now _that's_ what I consider to be stifling innovation and >progression. > >Kind of off-topic, but whatever ... Basically it boils down to this.. By continuing this thread here, I'm preaching to the choir, and I'd rather not waste my time on those with no clue of the open source movement. The other alterative is to stick up for open source, and debate you until I'm blue in the face - and you wont change your mind anyways, and considering you're the minority here.. who cares? Thread == dead. ------ Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Free Software advocate This message is copyright 2001, all rights reserved. Views expressed are my own, not necessarily shared by my employer. -- Red Hat Linux: http://www.redhat.com Download for free: ftp://ftp.redhat.com/pub/redhat/redhat-6.2/ - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: Linux stifles innovation...
On Fri, 16 Feb 2001, Dennis wrote: >The biggest thing that the linux community does to stifle innovation is to >bash commercial vendors trying to make a profit by whining endlessly about >"sourceless" distributions and recommending "open-source" solutions even >when they are wholly inferior. You're only hurting yourselves in the long >run. In that respect MS is correct, because those with the dollars to >innovate will stay away. Try telling that to IBM, Intel, Compaq, Hewlett Packard, Dell, SGI, and a handful of other _major_ computer companies that now realize the importance of open source. Seriously, get a copy of Eric S. Raymond's book, "The Cathedral and the Bazaar" (or view it online at http://www.opensource.org), and read through it. It is very well written and covers all aspects of what you are fearing - in a positive way. Linux is one of the most stable operating systems ever written. That's not just advocacy, that is fact. Drivers marked experimental are not just experimental - some are, but a lot are not, they just have not had anyone send in loud positive feedback, and so the maintainers left them that way. If you think the various crud commercial OS's out there are stable and have no experimental code in them, and that drivers do not crash or have bugs, you haven't been computing for long. At any rate, nobody has a gun to your head - go use something else that works for you. ------ Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Free Software advocate This message is copyright 2001, all rights reserved. Views expressed are my own, not necessarily shared by my employer. -- Press every key to continue. - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: Linux stifles innovation...
On Fri, 16 Feb 2001, Dennis wrote: The biggest thing that the linux community does to stifle innovation is to bash commercial vendors trying to make a profit by whining endlessly about "sourceless" distributions and recommending "open-source" solutions even when they are wholly inferior. You're only hurting yourselves in the long run. In that respect MS is correct, because those with the dollars to innovate will stay away. Try telling that to IBM, Intel, Compaq, Hewlett Packard, Dell, SGI, and a handful of other _major_ computer companies that now realize the importance of open source. Seriously, get a copy of Eric S. Raymond's book, "The Cathedral and the Bazaar" (or view it online at http://www.opensource.org), and read through it. It is very well written and covers all aspects of what you are fearing - in a positive way. Linux is one of the most stable operating systems ever written. That's not just advocacy, that is fact. Drivers marked experimental are not just experimental - some are, but a lot are not, they just have not had anyone send in loud positive feedback, and so the maintainers left them that way. If you think the various crud commercial OS's out there are stable and have no experimental code in them, and that drivers do not crash or have bugs, you haven't been computing for long. At any rate, nobody has a gun to your head - go use something else that works for you. ------ Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Free Software advocate This message is copyright 2001, all rights reserved. Views expressed are my own, not necessarily shared by my employer. -- Press every key to continue. - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: Linux stifles innovation...
On Fri, 16 Feb 2001, Matt D. Robinson wrote: The day the Linux kernel splinters into multiple, distinct efforts is the day I'll believe the kernel is fully into progress over "preference". Right now, Alan accepts what he thinks should go into stable kernels, and Linus accepts what he thinks should go into future kernels. I'm not saying they aren't doing the right things, or that the system doesn't work, but it's hardly what I would call a progressive movement. It's simply long, drawn-out evolution at best. I'm surprised the major vendors haven't created their own consortium by now to create a Linux kernel they think is best suited for their own hardware. But then again, they probably still spend all their time worrying about whether their efforts will be "accepted" into the mainstream Linux kernel. Now _that's_ what I consider to be stifling innovation and progression. Kind of off-topic, but whatever ... Basically it boils down to this.. By continuing this thread here, I'm preaching to the choir, and I'd rather not waste my time on those with no clue of the open source movement. The other alterative is to stick up for open source, and debate you until I'm blue in the face - and you wont change your mind anyways, and considering you're the minority here.. who cares? Thread == dead. ------ Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Free Software advocate This message is copyright 2001, all rights reserved. Views expressed are my own, not necessarily shared by my employer. -- Red Hat Linux: http://www.redhat.com Download for free: ftp://ftp.redhat.com/pub/redhat/redhat-6.2/ - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: [LK] Re: lkml subject line
On Tue, 13 Feb 2001, Timur Tabi wrote: >> Which is retarded. The subject line is for the subject. Other >> headers exist for letting one know where they came from. > >There's only one problem with this. It assumes that for every >mailing list you are on, you will have a folder into which all >such email is placed. No it does not. You are free to filter your mail however you wish. I put all the "caudium" lists into one folder for example. These lists unfortunately put the stupid [caudium-blah] in the subject, but I now can filter it out. If I want to look at just a specific list, I can use PINE's search feature. >I subscribe to about 35 mailing lists, many of which have low >traffic. I subscribe to 90+ lists, many of which are low traffic. >I don't want to create a separate folder for each list. Nor do I. >Because most of these mailing lists are on Yahoo Groups, I get >a nice prefix to each subject line that tells me the mailing >list. If that is important to you, and is the default for the list, cool. >In can then filter all of these messages into one folder. So >instead of having to scan 20 folders, I only need to scan one. You can do the same wether or not the subject contains the list name. It is very simple. >The point I'm trying to make is that there are perfectly valid >reasons to include some text on the subject line to indicate >the mailing list. I have yet to hear a single good reason. Any reasons I've heard any time in the last 7 years, have NOT been good reasons because the reasons given always have another way of doing the EXACT same thing, only without abusing the subject header. Give me a good reason, and I'll give you an alternate way of achieving the same thing - without messing up the subject. >People who feel this way may be in the majority, but then >again, people who use Linux are also in the majority. Does >that make them wrong or "retarded"? No. Read what I said again. I never said anyone was retarded at all. I said specifically: "Which is retarded" refering to the process of a list putting the name on the subject header. What I am trying to say is that there are better ways of doing the exact same things, without abusing the DEFINITIONS of a given header. To illustrate further, consider instead of using the subject header if mailing lists put the list name in the DATE header. Date: [linux-kernel] Jan 12, 2000 Pretty dumb eh? And annoying. And, you cant read the date in index mode because all you see is: 419 [linux-k Timur Tabi (3,617) Re: [LK] Re: lkml subject line Can't see the date because the dumb list puts the listname in the date field! No different for subject. Here is an example: N 69 Jan 29 David Hedbor(3,446) [caudium-commits] CVS: caudium/server So when I look at the index, to scan which messages might be interesting, by looking at the subject - which has the purpose of summarizing the content/context of the message, I see 60% bullshit, and 14 characters of subject. In order to get any useful meaning I must read every message just to see a useful part of the subject. Either that or use a 160 column video mode instead of 80. Why? Because someone sets a list to put the damn list name in the subject, because some user can't learn how to use an email filter properly. What is right: 1) not putting the thing in the subject from the list side 2) If an end user wants it in the subject, they can set up a mail filter to PUT it in the subject. :0 fwh * ^Sender:.*owner-linux-kernel | sed -e 's/^Subject: /Subject: [lkml]/' :0 A: lkml The above filter should add [lkml] to your subject line. So why try to force it on everyone? If the above procmail filter doesn't work (untested) let me know and I will MAKE it work. Windows users - tough luck - procmail is open source - hire someone to port it... -- Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Free Software advocate This message is copyright 2001, all rights reserved. Views expressed are my own, not necessarily shared by my employer. -- Windows 95(n) - 32-bit extensions and graphical shell for a 16-bit patch to an 8-bit operating system originally coded for a 4-bit microprocessor, written by a 2-bit company that can't stand 1 bit of competition. - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: PCI GART (?)
On Tue, 13 Feb 2001, Michèl Alexandre Salim wrote: >This might not be the proper place to ask - my >apologies - but since it pertains to the Sony >Picturebook (C1VE - Crusoe) that people have been >discussing on this list anyway, I hope people don't >mind too much :) > >I have RTFM but on the matter of enabling DRI for the >ATI Mobility video chipset, which on that notebook is >a PCI model, there is practically nil information. The >DRI website mentions using PCI GART, but there is no >option for that in the kernel. How do I enable this? > >Currently running the XFree 4.0.2 from RH 7.0.90 (7.1 >beta, Fisher) on top of my RH 7 + Ximian system and >when using aviplay it doesn't use any acceleration >features at all, consequently choppy display. The same >file plays much better in Windows. > >Xdpyinfo shows that Xvideo and Xrender are both >loaded, so I presume they *should* work. http://dri.sourceforge.net -- Mike A. Harris Shipping/mailing address: OS Systems Engineer 190 Pittsburgh Ave., Sault Ste. Marie, Red Hat Inc.Ontario, Canada, P6C 5B3 http://www.redhat.com Phone: (705)949-2136 "If it isn't source, it isn't software." -- NASA - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: lkml subject line
On Tue, 13 Feb 2001, Alan Cox wrote: >> >Is there a mail reader nowadays that doesn't let you do some sort of >> >filtering? >> >> He uses Elm, which as far as I know is obsolete, unmaintained and >> full of bugs and even has Y2K problems. That is the last I heard >> anyway. Alan Cox would likely know more, and has perhaps even >> fixed Elm. > >Elm has maintainers it has the bugs fixed, it just doesnt want to evolve >any further. Rumours of its death have been greatly exaggerated. Ok. Didn't know that it was maintained. I knew that you would set the record straight either way though. ;o) >> PINE is virtually everywhere, and is a good elm replacement, >> having been initially based on the elm code... (PINE==Pine Is Not >> Elm) > >I've played with both pine and mutt. mutt is by the better mail system IMHO, >but pine has an easier learning curve. I can't comment there much.. I've used PINE since about 1993 and fell in love with it after using PMDF in VMS (which sucks by comparison). PINE by default is simple to use for beginners, but if you go into setup and enable all the advanced stuff it is incredibly powerful. I tried mutt once but couldn't handle the non-intuitive UI. (intuitivity being in the eye of the beholder of course) ;o) I know many people who swear by mutt though, but I prefer the nicer UI of PINE. The only thing I hate about PINE is the restricted source code license that makes it impossible to contribute bugfixes effectively. ;o( TIA -- Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Free Software advocate This message is copyright 2001, all rights reserved. Views expressed are my own, not necessarily shared by my employer. -- If you're looking for Linux books, guides, and other documentation, visit the Linux Documentation Project homepage: http://www.linuxdoc.org - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: lkml subject line
On Tue, 13 Feb 2001, Sven Koch wrote:
>> That said, and while we're on the topic.. Does anyone have a
>> *PERFECT* recipe for procmail to REMOVE the stupid [Dummy] things
>> most GNU mailman lists and others prepend to the subject?
>
>I am using the following to sort the suse-security-list (for example, I do
>the same on all lists that tag something into the subject):
>
>:0 fhw
>* ^[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>| sed -e '/^Subject:/s/\[suse-security\] //'
>:0 A:
>SuSE-Security$MONTH
DAMN! I was _SO_ close! I'm no sed expert, but I have been
working the last hour or so on nailing this down and here is what
I had:
:0:
* ^Subject:.*testxpert
{
:0 fWh
* ^Subject:.*\[Xpert\]
| sed -e '/^Subject:/ s/\[Xpert\]//g' >> XPERT
}
Didn't work of course, but I got the sed line right by the looks
of it. Should ever we meet, I'm buying the beer good man!
--
Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Free Software advocate
This message is copyright 2001, all rights reserved.
Views expressed are my own, not necessarily shared by my employer.
--
Need general help or technical support with Red Hat Linux 7.0? Join the user
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Re: lkml subject line
On Mon, 12 Feb 2001, Matthew D. Pitts wrote: >Date: Mon, 12 Feb 2001 14:05:34 -0500 >From: Matthew D. Pitts <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: Mohammad A. Haque <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Mike Harrold <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Content-Type: text/plain; > charset="iso-8859-1" >Subject: Re: lkml subject line > >Pine, Mutt, there might be a few more. Sorry there... PINE *DOES* do filtering, and has for quite some time. Main menu ->Setup->Rules->Filtering Or just hit "T" in a message or index "F-> Take to Filter".... -- Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Free Software advocate This message is copyright 2001, all rights reserved. Views expressed are my own, not necessarily shared by my employer. -- Looking for Linux software? http://freshmeat.net http://www.rpmfind.net http://filewatcher.org http://www.coldstorage.org http://sourceforge.net - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: lkml subject line
On Mon, 12 Feb 2001, Mohammad A. Haque wrote:
>Is there a mail reader nowadays that doesn't let you do some sort of
>filtering?
He uses Elm, which as far as I know is obsolete, unmaintained and
full of bugs and even has Y2K problems. That is the last I heard
anyway. Alan Cox would likely know more, and has perhaps even
fixed Elm.
PINE is virtually everywhere, and is a good elm replacement,
having been initially based on the elm code... (PINE==Pine Is Not
Elm)
--
Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Free Software advocate
This message is copyright 2001, all rights reserved.
Views expressed are my own, not necessarily shared by my employer.
--
If at first you don't succeed, call it version 1.0
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Re: [LK] Re: lkml subject line
On Mon, 12 Feb 2001, Mike Harrold wrote: >> Those would all be your problems and I would suggest using a different account >> for mail then. > >Out of interest, how would that solve anything? So I use an ISP instead. >Then I have to download all my mail to home to read it. Talk about a >total waste of time. > >It's hard enough tracking my mail as it is, let alone having to have another >account just to handle a certain mailing list. 2 words: Your problem. Many have suggested solutions, but you're playing the "I don't care, I want it my way and I don't care what you say" game, of which nobody is going to budge on, especially for one single person who is being unreasonable. >> This discussion happens on every mailing list occasionally, and it is just a >> generally bad idea, period. > >I disagree, and while I may be in the minority on this list, I am certainly >not in the minority across the board, given that virtually every mailing list >I am subscribed to DOES prepend a tag to the subject line. Which is retarded. The subject line is for the subject. Other headers exist for letting one know where they came from. >> Especially for a list which is as often crossposted to as lk. > >This I can buy. But it is, IMHO, the only valid argument against doing so. Exactly IYHO. Nobody else - at least nobody that matters agrees with you. >> Can we now move on? > >Of course. Wouldn't want to interrupt our regular traffic for too long :) Why not. Might as well get it all out now, it has been at least 6 months since this topic came up. -- Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Free Software advocate This message is copyright 2001, all rights reserved. Views expressed are my own, not necessarily shared by my employer. -- Looking for Linux software? http://freshmeat.net http://www.rpmfind.net http://filewatcher.org http://www.coldstorage.org http://sourceforge.net - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: lkml subject line
On Mon, 12 Feb 2001, Mike Harrold wrote: >> Use procmail, that's what it's there for (and it won't affect your mail >> reader, as long as you're using something reasonably sensible). I filter >> on Sender. > >Maybe I don't *want* the LKML messages in a seperate folder. >Maybe I just want to identify them at a pinch in my inbox? >Maybe my employer doesn't allow me to install additional software anyway? Maybe you're just being unreasonable for the sake of trolling. Nobody is going to change this list to do [LKML], and this topic comes up at least once every 6 months. Matti and Dave run the list and it has been stated it WILL NOT HAPPEN. If you use procmail, you can filter lkml into a folder. If you want to have it in one folder, use the search feature of your mailreader to sort by header line (Sender) or else use procmail and formail to INSERT the [lkml] thing to the subject line yourself. procmail is installed on probably 99.9% of all machines in existance. If it isn't on yours and your employer will not install it, I'll be REALLY surprised. ------ Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Free Software advocate This message is copyright 2001, all rights reserved. Views expressed are my own, not necessarily shared by my employer. -- Looking for Linux software? http://freshmeat.net http://www.rpmfind.net http://filewatcher.org http://www.coldstorage.org http://sourceforge.net - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: lkml subject line
On Mon, 12 Feb 2001, Mike Harrold wrote: >> > There are advantages: distinguish personal messages from mailing list >> > messages, and distinguish between different mailing lists. And >> > disadvantages - maybe only one: sacrificing valuable Subject: line >> > space. >> >> The advantages can all be gained without that disadvantage by just learning >> to filter mail on other headers instead of the subject line. > >Assuming your mail reader can do that (and no, I can't change my mail >reader). You can use procmail to filter your mail VERY easily. Penalizing an entire list of 7000 people or more just because 3 people can't use a sane modern mail reader is just senseless. This filters linux-kernel into the folder LINUX-KERNEL cat >> ~/.procmailrc
Re: lkml subject line
On Mon, 12 Feb 2001, Mike Harrold wrote: There are advantages: distinguish personal messages from mailing list messages, and distinguish between different mailing lists. And disadvantages - maybe only one: sacrificing valuable Subject: line space. The advantages can all be gained without that disadvantage by just learning to filter mail on other headers instead of the subject line. Assuming your mail reader can do that (and no, I can't change my mail reader). You can use procmail to filter your mail VERY easily. Penalizing an entire list of 7000 people or more just because 3 people can't use a sane modern mail reader is just senseless. This filters linux-kernel into the folder LINUX-KERNEL cat ~/.procmailrc EOF :0: * ^X-Mailing-List:.*[EMAIL PROTECTED] * ^Sender:.*linux-kernel-owner@vger LINUX-KERNEL EOF That said, and while we're on the topic.. Does anyone have a *PERFECT* recipe for procmail to REMOVE the stupid [Dummy] things most GNU mailman lists and others prepend to the subject? [EMAIL PROTECTED] is one such list and I have given up on complaining to list maintainers of other lists to change this, and would rather fix it on my end once than complain to others. I asked on procmail-list and got some feedback but it didn't give me a useable filter.. Any help appreciated.. TTYL -- Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Free Software advocate This message is copyright 2001, all rights reserved. Views expressed are my own, not necessarily shared by my employer. -- If it weren't for C, we'd all be programming in BASI and OBOL. - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: lkml subject line
On Mon, 12 Feb 2001, Mike Harrold wrote: Use procmail, that's what it's there for (and it won't affect your mail reader, as long as you're using something reasonably sensible). I filter on Sender. Maybe I don't *want* the LKML messages in a seperate folder. Maybe I just want to identify them at a pinch in my inbox? Maybe my employer doesn't allow me to install additional software anyway? Maybe you're just being unreasonable for the sake of trolling. Nobody is going to change this list to do [LKML], and this topic comes up at least once every 6 months. Matti and Dave run the list and it has been stated it WILL NOT HAPPEN. If you use procmail, you can filter lkml into a folder. If you want to have it in one folder, use the search feature of your mailreader to sort by header line (Sender) or else use procmail and formail to INSERT the [lkml] thing to the subject line yourself. procmail is installed on probably 99.9% of all machines in existance. If it isn't on yours and your employer will not install it, I'll be REALLY surprised. -- Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Free Software advocate This message is copyright 2001, all rights reserved. Views expressed are my own, not necessarily shared by my employer. -- Looking for Linux software? http://freshmeat.net http://www.rpmfind.net http://filewatcher.org http://www.coldstorage.org http://sourceforge.net - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: [LK] Re: lkml subject line
On Mon, 12 Feb 2001, Mike Harrold wrote:
Those would all be your problems and I would suggest using a different account
for mail then.
Out of interest, how would that solve anything? So I use an ISP instead.
Then I have to download all my mail to home to read it. Talk about a
total waste of time.
It's hard enough tracking my mail as it is, let alone having to have another
account just to handle a certain mailing list.
2 words: Your problem. Many have suggested solutions, but
you're playing the "I don't care, I want it my way and I don't
care what you say" game, of which nobody is going to budge on,
especially for one single person who is being unreasonable.
This discussion happens on every mailing list occasionally, and it is just a
generally bad idea, period.
I disagree, and while I may be in the minority on this list, I am certainly
not in the minority across the board, given that virtually every mailing list
I am subscribed to DOES prepend a tag to the subject line.
Which is retarded. The subject line is for the subject. Other
headers exist for letting one know where they came from.
Especially for a list which is as often crossposted to as lk.
This I can buy. But it is, IMHO, the only valid argument against doing so.
Exactly IYHO. Nobody else - at least nobody that matters agrees
with you.
Can we now move on?
Of course. Wouldn't want to interrupt our regular traffic for too long :)
Why not. Might as well get it all out now, it has been at least
6 months since this topic came up.
--
Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Free Software advocate
This message is copyright 2001, all rights reserved.
Views expressed are my own, not necessarily shared by my employer.
--
Looking for Linux software? http://freshmeat.net http://www.rpmfind.net
http://filewatcher.org http://www.coldstorage.org http://sourceforge.net
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Re: lkml subject line
On Mon, 12 Feb 2001, Matthew D. Pitts wrote: Date: Mon, 12 Feb 2001 14:05:34 -0500 From: Matthew D. Pitts [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Mohammad A. Haque [EMAIL PROTECTED], Mike Harrold [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Subject: Re: lkml subject line Pine, Mutt, there might be a few more. Sorry there... PINE *DOES* do filtering, and has for quite some time. Main menu -Setup-Rules-Filtering Or just hit "T" in a message or index "F- Take to Filter" ------ Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Free Software advocate This message is copyright 2001, all rights reserved. Views expressed are my own, not necessarily shared by my employer. -- Looking for Linux software? http://freshmeat.net http://www.rpmfind.net http://filewatcher.org http://www.coldstorage.org http://sourceforge.net - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: lkml subject line
On Mon, 12 Feb 2001, Mohammad A. Haque wrote: Is there a mail reader nowadays that doesn't let you do some sort of filtering? He uses Elm, which as far as I know is obsolete, unmaintained and full of bugs and even has Y2K problems. That is the last I heard anyway. Alan Cox would likely know more, and has perhaps even fixed Elm. PINE is virtually everywhere, and is a good elm replacement, having been initially based on the elm code... (PINE==Pine Is Not Elm) -- Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Free Software advocate This message is copyright 2001, all rights reserved. Views expressed are my own, not necessarily shared by my employer. -- If at first you don't succeed, call it version 1.0 - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: lkml subject line
On Tue, 13 Feb 2001, Alan Cox wrote: Is there a mail reader nowadays that doesn't let you do some sort of filtering? He uses Elm, which as far as I know is obsolete, unmaintained and full of bugs and even has Y2K problems. That is the last I heard anyway. Alan Cox would likely know more, and has perhaps even fixed Elm. Elm has maintainers it has the bugs fixed, it just doesnt want to evolve any further. Rumours of its death have been greatly exaggerated. Ok. Didn't know that it was maintained. I knew that you would set the record straight either way though. ;o) PINE is virtually everywhere, and is a good elm replacement, having been initially based on the elm code... (PINE==Pine Is Not Elm) I've played with both pine and mutt. mutt is by the better mail system IMHO, but pine has an easier learning curve. I can't comment there much.. I've used PINE since about 1993 and fell in love with it after using PMDF in VMS (which sucks by comparison). PINE by default is simple to use for beginners, but if you go into setup and enable all the advanced stuff it is incredibly powerful. I tried mutt once but couldn't handle the non-intuitive UI. (intuitivity being in the eye of the beholder of course) ;o) I know many people who swear by mutt though, but I prefer the nicer UI of PINE. The only thing I hate about PINE is the restricted source code license that makes it impossible to contribute bugfixes effectively. ;o( TIA -- Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Free Software advocate This message is copyright 2001, all rights reserved. Views expressed are my own, not necessarily shared by my employer. -- If you're looking for Linux books, guides, and other documentation, visit the Linux Documentation Project homepage: http://www.linuxdoc.org - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: PCI GART (?)
On Tue, 13 Feb 2001, Michl Alexandre Salim wrote: This might not be the proper place to ask - my apologies - but since it pertains to the Sony Picturebook (C1VE - Crusoe) that people have been discussing on this list anyway, I hope people don't mind too much :) I have RTFM but on the matter of enabling DRI for the ATI Mobility video chipset, which on that notebook is a PCI model, there is practically nil information. The DRI website mentions using PCI GART, but there is no option for that in the kernel. How do I enable this? Currently running the XFree 4.0.2 from RH 7.0.90 (7.1 beta, Fisher) on top of my RH 7 + Ximian system and when using aviplay it doesn't use any acceleration features at all, consequently choppy display. The same file plays much better in Windows. Xdpyinfo shows that Xvideo and Xrender are both loaded, so I presume they *should* work. http://dri.sourceforge.net -- Mike A. Harris Shipping/mailing address: OS Systems Engineer 190 Pittsburgh Ave., Sault Ste. Marie, Red Hat Inc.Ontario, Canada, P6C 5B3 http://www.redhat.com Phone: (705)949-2136 "If it isn't source, it isn't software." -- NASA - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: [LK] Re: lkml subject line
On Tue, 13 Feb 2001, Timur Tabi wrote: Which is retarded. The subject line is for the subject. Other headers exist for letting one know where they came from. There's only one problem with this. It assumes that for every mailing list you are on, you will have a folder into which all such email is placed. No it does not. You are free to filter your mail however you wish. I put all the "caudium" lists into one folder for example. These lists unfortunately put the stupid [caudium-blah] in the subject, but I now can filter it out. If I want to look at just a specific list, I can use PINE's search feature. I subscribe to about 35 mailing lists, many of which have low traffic. I subscribe to 90+ lists, many of which are low traffic. I don't want to create a separate folder for each list. Nor do I. Because most of these mailing lists are on Yahoo Groups, I get a nice prefix to each subject line that tells me the mailing list. If that is important to you, and is the default for the list, cool. In can then filter all of these messages into one folder. So instead of having to scan 20 folders, I only need to scan one. You can do the same wether or not the subject contains the list name. It is very simple. The point I'm trying to make is that there are perfectly valid reasons to include some text on the subject line to indicate the mailing list. I have yet to hear a single good reason. Any reasons I've heard any time in the last 7 years, have NOT been good reasons because the reasons given always have another way of doing the EXACT same thing, only without abusing the subject header. Give me a good reason, and I'll give you an alternate way of achieving the same thing - without messing up the subject. People who feel this way may be in the majority, but then again, people who use Linux are also in the majority. Does that make them wrong or "retarded"? No. Read what I said again. I never said anyone was retarded at all. I said specifically: "Which is retarded" refering to the process of a list putting the name on the subject header. What I am trying to say is that there are better ways of doing the exact same things, without abusing the DEFINITIONS of a given header. To illustrate further, consider instead of using the subject header if mailing lists put the list name in the DATE header. Date: [linux-kernel] Jan 12, 2000 Pretty dumb eh? And annoying. And, you cant read the date in index mode because all you see is: 419 [linux-k Timur Tabi (3,617) Re: [LK] Re: lkml subject line Can't see the date because the dumb list puts the listname in the date field! No different for subject. Here is an example: N 69 Jan 29 David Hedbor(3,446) [caudium-commits] CVS: caudium/server So when I look at the index, to scan which messages might be interesting, by looking at the subject - which has the purpose of summarizing the content/context of the message, I see 60% bullshit, and 14 characters of subject. In order to get any useful meaning I must read every message just to see a useful part of the subject. Either that or use a 160 column video mode instead of 80. Why? Because someone sets a list to put the damn list name in the subject, because some user can't learn how to use an email filter properly. What is right: 1) not putting the thing in the subject from the list side 2) If an end user wants it in the subject, they can set up a mail filter to PUT it in the subject. :0 fwh * ^Sender:.*owner-linux-kernel | sed -e 's/^Subject: /Subject: [lkml]/' :0 A: lkml The above filter should add [lkml] to your subject line. So why try to force it on everyone? If the above procmail filter doesn't work (untested) let me know and I will MAKE it work. Windows users - tough luck - procmail is open source - hire someone to port it... ------ Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Free Software advocate This message is copyright 2001, all rights reserved. Views expressed are my own, not necessarily shared by my employer. -- Windows 95(n) - 32-bit extensions and graphical shell for a 16-bit patch to an 8-bit operating system originally coded for a 4-bit microprocessor, written by a 2-bit company that can't stand 1 bit of competition. - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Duplicate posts coming from reiserfs-list?
My duplicate folder contains numerous messages from linux-kernel cc'd to reiserfs-list. I am not on reiserfs-list to my knowledge, so it looks like there is another loop somewhere.. -- Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Free Software advocate This message is copyright 2001, all rights reserved. Views expressed are my own, not necessarily shared by my employer. -- So, if anybody wants to have free hardware sent to them, don't call me, but instead write your own operating system. It has worked every time for me. Linus Torvalds - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Duplicate posts coming from reiserfs-list?
My duplicate folder contains numerous messages from linux-kernel cc'd to reiserfs-list. I am not on reiserfs-list to my knowledge, so it looks like there is another loop somewhere.. -- Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Free Software advocate This message is copyright 2001, all rights reserved. Views expressed are my own, not necessarily shared by my employer. -- So, if anybody wants to have free hardware sent to them, don't call me, but instead write your own operating system. It has worked every time for me. Linus Torvalds - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: [ANNOUNCE] Animated framebuffer logo for 2.4.1
On Thu, 8 Feb 2001, Pavel Machek wrote: >> I've created a patch for kernel 2.4.1 that adds some fancy options for >> the framebuffer console driver concerning the boot logo. >> I've added logo animation and logo centering. >> People may find this not very useful but nice to look at. :-) > >Long time ago I joked that win2000 will have 30-minute film at the >bootup. [3.1 had picture, 95+ had static logo with moving line...] And >now it looks like _linux_ is getting that feature... > Pavel, >wondering when linux boot gets so long that mpeg2 player gets >integrated into kernel. ;o) I doubt strongly that that is technically possible. In fact I'm sure it is not. ------ Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Free Software advocate This message is copyright 2001, all rights reserved. Views expressed are my own, not necessarily shared by my employer. -- "Facts do not cease to exist because they are ignored." - Aldous Huxley - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: increasing the 512 process limit at run-time?
On Wed, 7 Feb 2001, Mr. James W. Laferriere wrote: >Date: Wed, 7 Feb 2001 04:43:19 -0800 (PST) >From: Mr. James W. Laferriere <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >To: Matt Bernstein <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII >Subject: Re: increasing the 512 process limit at run-time? > > > Hello Matt , At what uptime does one hit this limit ? >uptime > 4:40am up 444 days, 12:58, 1 user, load average: 0.00, 0.00, 0.00 >uname -a >Linux filesrv2 2.2.6 #1 SMP Thu Jul 1 20:33:30 PDT 1999 i686 unknown > > Not that that is anything spectacular , just looking for > rough idea of uptime before hitting the NR_TASKS limit . > Tia , JimL The NR_TASKS is the maximum number of simultaneous running processes in the system and has nothing at all to do whatsoever with the uptime. In 2.2.x NR_TASKS is set in stone during compile time. If you need more simultaneous tasks you must recompile with NR_TASKS set higher. You can set it as high as 4090 or so (read the docs). In 2.4.x it can be set via proc at runtime. Again, uptime means absolutely nothing. -- Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Free Software advocate This message is copyright 2001, all rights reserved. Views expressed are my own, not necessarily shared by my employer. -- If you're interested in computer security, and want to stay on top of the latest security exploits, and other information, visit: http://www.securityfocus.com - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: increasing the 512 process limit at run-time?
On Wed, 7 Feb 2001, Mr. James W. Laferriere wrote: Date: Wed, 7 Feb 2001 04:43:19 -0800 (PST) From: Mr. James W. Laferriere [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Matt Bernstein [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Subject: Re: increasing the 512 process limit at run-time? Hello Matt , At what uptime does one hit this limit ? uptime 4:40am up 444 days, 12:58, 1 user, load average: 0.00, 0.00, 0.00 uname -a Linux filesrv2 2.2.6 #1 SMP Thu Jul 1 20:33:30 PDT 1999 i686 unknown Not that that is anything spectacular , just looking for rough idea of uptime before hitting the NR_TASKS limit . Tia , JimL The NR_TASKS is the maximum number of simultaneous running processes in the system and has nothing at all to do whatsoever with the uptime. In 2.2.x NR_TASKS is set in stone during compile time. If you need more simultaneous tasks you must recompile with NR_TASKS set higher. You can set it as high as 4090 or so (read the docs). In 2.4.x it can be set via proc at runtime. Again, uptime means absolutely nothing. -- Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Free Software advocate This message is copyright 2001, all rights reserved. Views expressed are my own, not necessarily shared by my employer. -- If you're interested in computer security, and want to stay on top of the latest security exploits, and other information, visit: http://www.securityfocus.com - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
Re: [ANNOUNCE] Animated framebuffer logo for 2.4.1
On Thu, 8 Feb 2001, Pavel Machek wrote: I've created a patch for kernel 2.4.1 that adds some fancy options for the framebuffer console driver concerning the boot logo. I've added logo animation and logo centering. People may find this not very useful but nice to look at. :-) Long time ago I joked that win2000 will have 30-minute film at the bootup. [3.1 had picture, 95+ had static logo with moving line...] And now it looks like _linux_ is getting that feature... Pavel, wondering when linux boot gets so long that mpeg2 player gets integrated into kernel. ;o) I doubt strongly that that is technically possible. In fact I'm sure it is not. -- Mike A. Harris - Linux advocate - Free Software advocate This message is copyright 2001, all rights reserved. Views expressed are my own, not necessarily shared by my employer. -- "Facts do not cease to exist because they are ignored." - Aldous Huxley - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please read the FAQ at http://www.tux.org/lkml/
