Re: [Lynx-dev] Website shows blank page in Lynx browser

[Karen Lewellen]

Tim who?
Additionally, requirements that java script still work from the keyboard 
remain  a part of w3c rules.There are editions of Lynx that can submit 
from script links.  I realize  that can differ from Java scripting but 
still.

One  w3c resource I like is webaim.org
who details all the issues with Javascript especially void zero links.
Seriously though I wonder how many sites are simply a product of someone 
taking a tool adding stuff and stirring?

In that case  better web creation tools would help as well.
Kare



On Thu, 12 Apr 2018, Jude DaShiell wrote:

What's really unfortunate about all of this is that javascript can do useful 
tasks on websites in the house cleaning department and had it been restricted 
to that kind of work and not blocking accessibility for all browsers it would 
not have attracted the well earned controversy and lightning it has 
attracted.  The producers of websites are responsible for misusing 
javascript.  I don't know what Tim Burnersley's position on html5 is but it's 
been around for long enough for him to have developed one.


On Thu, 12 Apr 2018, David Woolley wrote:


 Date: Thu, 12 Apr 2018 04:44:34
 From: David Woolley 
 To: lynx-dev@nongnu.org
 Subject: Re: [Lynx-dev] Website shows blank page in Lynx browser

 On 12/04/18 02:27, Jude DaShiell wrote:
>   What would be really neat if it happened is if Tim Burnersley went and 
>   did

>   a class action suit on all javascript using websites requiring specific
>   performance where those sites had to remove permanently all html since
>   they had made his html inaccessible by using their

 Unfortunately The World Wide Web Consortium's (W3C) Web Content
 Accessibility Group, now considers reliance on ECMAScript as acceptable,
 and has done so, for probably half a decade.  In my view that is because
 it is made up of accessibility consultants and graphical browser
 developers.

 Also note that HTML5 is the product of a coup, by an industry consortium
 and is not controlled by W3C.  W3C wanted a semantically strong language,
 document mark-up language.  WHATWG wanted a language for running graphical
 applications on browsers, that was defined in such a way that even garbage
 produced consistent graphical results across browsers.

 I don't think that Lynx is anywhere close to HTML5 compliance, because it
 doesn't parse it in a way that would allow it to use the mandated error
 recovery.

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[Lynx-dev] reload problem

[iohann]

Quoth iohann: 'i go to https://en.wiktionary.org from my
bookmarks page; i search for a term, get a result ; return to my
bookmarks page and attempt to go to wikitonary again.
'A bright red banner shows at bottom of screen: "Alert!:
Reloading Document. Any form entries will be lost." And the page does
not reload/return/appear. Lynx simply remains on the bookmarks page.'
I just tried it and didn't have your experience.  I have had
wikipedia pages refuse to connect me in lynx occasionally; I never
figured out why.  Do you log lynx activity?

russell bell

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Re: [Lynx-dev] Website shows blank page in Lynx browser

[Karen Lewellen]

I would think web developers would use the  dev  editions...they are more 
current time wise.
Kyle I take it you are trying to do this in a mac terminal of some kind 
then?


Karen


On Thu, 12 Apr 2018, Kyle Bachan wrote:


Yes, I do have the latest version on mac. Dan do you know why I'm unable to
see anything on the website while Karen is?

On Thu, Apr 12, 2018 at 9:46 AM, dan d.  wrote:



No, both macports and homebrew provide the latest version as soon as it is
available, currently Lynx 2.8.8rel.2.

On Wed, 11 Apr 2018, Karen Lewellen wrote:


If I am not mistaken, the last edition for the mac is several versions
old.
  2.8.5 or something?
anyway let us know.



On Wed, 11 Apr 2018, Kyle Bachan wrote:


Brew is software that macs use to install programs. I will have to

take a

look at my version when I get to work tomorrow but that would explain

why

I'm not able to connect properly to the website. Once I have a properly
working Lynx browser, it should make it much easier for me to see what

the

site looks like and make the adjustments. But I will investigate

further

tomorrow. Thank you for your help so far.

On Wed, Apr 11, 2018 at 5:46 PM, Karen Lewellen <

klewel...@shellworld.net>

wrote:


Hi Kyle,
I have no idea what brew is.  What edition of Lynx are you using for
testing?
The latest dev edition is dated 21 March 2018..which would be best for
testing.
At the very least  use 2.8.8 which is the last  edition as well.
I should add something else since you are testing.  Make very certain

that

*all* other account related functions work  with this back door in,

placing

holds for example.
As a test during my discussion with tpl staff I went into the  the old
account area.  I also did a search and placed an item on hold.

However I

did not get the customary call informing me that the item was on hold

in

the system, meaning it canceled  instead of letting me get the item.
Additionally even low graphics browsers that support Javascript are

not

working  on your new account page.
For example in the Linux operating system, e-links which can be

compiled

to support java script, and links which  is likewise ocmpiled neither
produce the  back to old account option, nor allow you to log in at

all.

Keep in mind some mobile devices, windows phones for example, do not

work

well  with Java script.
TPL is a public site meaning regardless of browser used   library

patrons

should expect an open door.
If you found an edition of lynx that produced a blank page, then

someone

can use another lower graphics browser and find a comparative barrier.

Karen



On Wed, 11 Apr 2018, Kyle Bachan wrote:

Hi Karen,

Oh, I had no idea you were talking to TPL. I'm actually on their web

team

which is why I'm trying to debug this specific issue. So you're

saying

that
you get the JavaScript message then? Hmm... I installed lynx via brew
which
may be why there is a variation?




On Wed, Apr 11, 2018, 5:07 PM Karen Lewellen <

klewel...@shellworld.net>

wrote:

Hi Kyle,

I am presently in discussion with Toronto Library staff about this

issue.

please please please call them and tell them you are having trouble.
What I have shared is that since they are a service for the general
public, the account aspects of the site should not require Java
Script...couldbe a human rights code violation truth be told.
there is a back door in,
type the url like this.
www.torontopubliclibrary.ca/oldaccount.
  When I just checked your link, I did not get a blank page, but the
statement that JavaScript is required.
Again library staff *must* be told of the problem so they  at the

very

least add the old account link to the site homepage. Much as they

had the

old catalog  link there for years.
With your permission, may I share this post with the staff members

I am

communicating with presently?
cheers,
Karen



On Wed, 11 Apr 2018, Kyle Bachan wrote:

Hello!

I have a Lynx problem that you might be able to help with:

I have a customer who would like to view our website in the

text-based



Lynx


browser. At the very least, our website should display a message

saying

that "We're sorry, you need to enable Javascript to view this" etc.
However, this page appears to show blank in Lynx. The interesting

thing



is


that I do see the correct content appearing when connecting to the
localhost version of the browser which makes me think this might be


related


to a certificate or subdomain issue.

For reference, the website I am trying to access via Lynx is
https://account.torontopubliclibrary.ca/.

I've posted a stackoverflow question
<


https://stackoverflow.com/questions/49758314/website-shows-
blank-page-in-lynx-browser



as well which has some screenshots that might show you more

information.

Any help would be much appreciated. Thank you very much for your

time.


Best,
Kyle










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Re: [Lynx-dev] Cancel a goto request

[Mouse]

> I know control g will cancel many goto and/or link requests.  But
> when I get a "waiting for response" it does nothing and that can
> remain for a very long time.

> Is there or could there be a similar command to cancel a request in
> all contexts regardless of how the target is responding?

z maybe?  In my experience that usually does what it sounds to me as
though you want.  I don't know about "all contexts", but it works in
enough cases to be useful to me.

/~\ The ASCII Mouse
\ / Ribbon Campaign
 X  Against HTMLmo...@rodents-montreal.org
/ \ Email!   7D C8 61 52 5D E7 2D 39  4E F1 31 3E E8 B3 27 4B

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[Lynx-dev] reload problem

[iohann]

still no solution. i go to https://en.wiktionary.org from my bookmarks 
page; i search for a term, get a result ; return to my bookmarks page 
and attempt to go to wikitonary again.


A bright red banner shows at bottom of screen: "Alert!: Reloading 
Document. Any form entries will be lost." And the page does not 
reload/return/appear. Lynx simply remains on the bookmarks page.


running:
Lynx Version 2.8.9dev.8 (21 Dec 2015)
libwww-FM 2.14, SSL-MM 1.4.1, GNUTLS 3.4.9, ncurses 6.0.20160213(wide)
Built on linux-gnu.

Does anyone have an explanation/solution?

Thanks in advance.

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Re: [Lynx-dev] Cancel a goto request

[Thorsten Glaser]

dan d. dixit:

>I know control g will cancel many goto and/or link requests.  But when
>I get a "waiting for response" it does nothing and that can remain for
>a very long time.

You can hit “z” there, unless it’s in that weird state where only
http://www.mirbsd.org/htman/i386/man8/tcpdrop.htm on the connection
will help (search the mailing list archives for details).

>Is there or could there be a similar command to cancel a request in
>all contexts regardless of how the target is responding?

In most contecēs it’s ^G (Ctrl-G), just not for downloads and
DNS resolving.

bye,
//mirabilos
-- 
22:20⎜ The crazy that persists in his craziness becomes a master
22:21⎜ And the distance between the craziness and geniality is
only measured by the success 18:35⎜ "Psychotics are consistently
inconsistent. The essence of sanity is to be inconsistently inconsistent

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[Lynx-dev] Cancel a goto request

[russellbell]

Quoth dan d.; 'Is there or could there be a similar command to
cancel a request in all contexts regardless of how the target is
responding?
z

russell bell

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[Lynx-dev] Cancel a goto request

[dan d.]

Hello,

I know control g will cancel many goto and/or link requests.  But when I get a 
"waiting for response" it does nothing and that can remain for
a very long time.

Is there or could there be a similar command to cancel a request in all 
contexts regardless of how the target is responding?

Thanks.
-- 
XB

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Re: [Lynx-dev] Website shows blank page in Lynx browser

[Kyle Bachan]

Hi Larry,
Thank you for this--I was thinking it must be a config issue on my end.
Unfortunately though, this did not work for me but I have a feeling this
might be network or computer setup related. I'm going to try running this
when I get home on a different computer and see if there's a difference.
Kyle

On Thu, Apr 12, 2018 at 10:36 AM, Larry Hynes  wrote:

> Hi Kyle
>
> With a fresh default install of lynx from homebrew all I can see
> when accessing
>
> /usr/local/bin/lynx 'https://account.torontopubliclibrary.ca/'
>
> is
>
> ---
> Account : Toronto Public Library
> REFRESH(14400 sec): [1]https://account.torontopubliclibrary.ca/
> ---
>
> If I specify even the default lynx.cfg file, as follows
>
> /usr/local/bin/lynx -cfg /usr/local/Cellar/lynx/2.8.8rel.2_1/etc/lynx.cfg
> \
> 'https://account.torontopubliclibrary.ca/'
>
> then I see:
>
> ---
> Account : Toronto Public Library
> REFRESH(14400 sec): [1]https://account.torontopubliclibrary.ca/
>
> We're sorry, you need to enable JavaScript to use the new version of the
> library account.
> [2]Back to old account
> ---
>
> (You can also specify the path to the cfg file by setting the environment
> variable LYNX_CFG)
>
> This might help you.
>
> Kyle Bachan  wrote:
> > Yes, I do have the latest version on mac. Dan do you know why I'm unable
> to
> > see anything on the website while Karen is?
> >
> > On Thu, Apr 12, 2018 at 9:46 AM, dan d.  wrote:
> >
> > >
> > > No, both macports and homebrew provide the latest version as soon as
> it is
> > > available, currently Lynx 2.8.8rel.2.
> > >
> > > On Wed, 11 Apr 2018, Karen Lewellen wrote:
> > >
> > > > If I am not mistaken, the last edition for the mac is several
> versions
> > > > old.
> > > >   2.8.5 or something?
> > > > anyway let us know.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > On Wed, 11 Apr 2018, Kyle Bachan wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > Brew is software that macs use to install programs. I will have to
> > > take a
> > > > > look at my version when I get to work tomorrow but that would
> explain
> > > why
> > > > > I'm not able to connect properly to the website. Once I have a
> properly
> > > > > working Lynx browser, it should make it much easier for me to see
> what
> > > the
> > > > > site looks like and make the adjustments. But I will investigate
> > > further
> > > > > tomorrow. Thank you for your help so far.
> > > > >
> > > > > On Wed, Apr 11, 2018 at 5:46 PM, Karen Lewellen <
> > > klewel...@shellworld.net>
> > > > > wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > >> Hi Kyle,
> > > > >> I have no idea what brew is.  What edition of Lynx are you using
> for
> > > > >> testing?
> > > > >> The latest dev edition is dated 21 March 2018..which would be
> best for
> > > > >> testing.
> > > > >> At the very least  use 2.8.8 which is the last  edition as well.
> > > > >> I should add something else since you are testing.  Make very
> certain
> > > that
> > > > >> *all* other account related functions work  with this back door
> in,
> > > placing
> > > > >> holds for example.
> > > > >> As a test during my discussion with tpl staff I went into the
> the old
> > > > >> account area.  I also did a search and placed an item on hold.
> > > However I
> > > > >> did not get the customary call informing me that the item was on
> hold
> > > in
> > > > >> the system, meaning it canceled  instead of letting me get the
> item.
> > > > >> Additionally even low graphics browsers that support Javascript
> are
> > > not
> > > > >> working  on your new account page.
> > > > >> For example in the Linux operating system, e-links which can be
> > > compiled
> > > > >> to support java script, and links which  is likewise ocmpiled
> neither
> > > > >> produce the  back to old account option, nor allow you to log in
> at
> > > all.
> > > > >> Keep in mind some mobile devices, windows phones for example, do
> not
> > > work
> > > > >> well  with Java script.
> > > > >> TPL is a public site meaning regardless of browser used   library
> > > patrons
> > > > >> should expect an open door.
> > > > >> If you found an edition of lynx that produced a blank page, then
> > > someone
> > > > >> can use another lower graphics browser and find a comparative
> barrier.
> > > > >>
> > > > >> Karen
> > > > >>
> > > > >>
> > > > >>
> > > > >> On Wed, 11 Apr 2018, Kyle Bachan wrote:
> > > > >>
> > > > >> Hi Karen,
> > > > >>> Oh, I had no idea you were talking to TPL. I'm actually on their
> web
> > > team
> > > > >>> which is why I'm trying to debug this specific issue. So you're
> > > saying
> > > > >>> that
> > > > >>> you get the JavaScript message then? Hmm... I installed lynx via
> brew
> > > > >>> which
> > > > >>> may be why there is a variation?
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>> On Wed, Apr 11, 2018, 5:07 PM Karen Lewellen <
> > > klewel...@shellworld.net>
> > > > >>> wrote:
> > > > >>>
> > > > >>> Hi Kyle,
> > > >  I am presently in discussion with Toronto Library 

Re: [Lynx-dev] Website shows blank page in Lynx browser

[Thorsten Glaser]

David Woolley dixit:

> Also note that HTML5 is the product of a coup, by an industry
> consortium and is not controlled by W3C. W3C wanted a semantically
> strong language, document mark-up language. WHATWG wanted a language
> for running graphical applications on browsers, that was defined in
> such a way that even garbage produced consistent graphical results
> across browsers.

Wow!

Fun side fact: there are two “HTML5”, one by each group; one has
had a formal release, the other is “a living standard”, i.e. can
change on a whim; both are indistinguishable from each other.

I’ve had it had with them and just stick to XHTML/1.1 for my own
webpages. That’s more than sufficient.

bye,
//mirabilos
-- 
“It is inappropriate to require that a time represented as
 seconds since the Epoch precisely represent the number of
 seconds between the referenced time and the Epoch.”
-- IEEE Std 1003.1b-1993 (POSIX) Section B.2.2.2

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Re: [Lynx-dev] Website shows blank page in Lynx browser

[Larry Hynes]

Hi Kyle

With a fresh default install of lynx from homebrew all I can see
when accessing

/usr/local/bin/lynx 'https://account.torontopubliclibrary.ca/'

is

---
Account : Toronto Public Library
REFRESH(14400 sec): [1]https://account.torontopubliclibrary.ca/
---

If I specify even the default lynx.cfg file, as follows

/usr/local/bin/lynx -cfg /usr/local/Cellar/lynx/2.8.8rel.2_1/etc/lynx.cfg \
'https://account.torontopubliclibrary.ca/'

then I see:

---
Account : Toronto Public Library
REFRESH(14400 sec): [1]https://account.torontopubliclibrary.ca/

We're sorry, you need to enable JavaScript to use the new version of the 
library account.
[2]Back to old account
---

(You can also specify the path to the cfg file by setting the environment
variable LYNX_CFG)

This might help you.

Kyle Bachan  wrote:
> Yes, I do have the latest version on mac. Dan do you know why I'm unable to
> see anything on the website while Karen is?
> 
> On Thu, Apr 12, 2018 at 9:46 AM, dan d.  wrote:
> 
> >
> > No, both macports and homebrew provide the latest version as soon as it is
> > available, currently Lynx 2.8.8rel.2.
> >
> > On Wed, 11 Apr 2018, Karen Lewellen wrote:
> >
> > > If I am not mistaken, the last edition for the mac is several versions
> > > old.
> > >   2.8.5 or something?
> > > anyway let us know.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > On Wed, 11 Apr 2018, Kyle Bachan wrote:
> > >
> > > > Brew is software that macs use to install programs. I will have to
> > take a
> > > > look at my version when I get to work tomorrow but that would explain
> > why
> > > > I'm not able to connect properly to the website. Once I have a properly
> > > > working Lynx browser, it should make it much easier for me to see what
> > the
> > > > site looks like and make the adjustments. But I will investigate
> > further
> > > > tomorrow. Thank you for your help so far.
> > > >
> > > > On Wed, Apr 11, 2018 at 5:46 PM, Karen Lewellen <
> > klewel...@shellworld.net>
> > > > wrote:
> > > >
> > > >> Hi Kyle,
> > > >> I have no idea what brew is.  What edition of Lynx are you using for
> > > >> testing?
> > > >> The latest dev edition is dated 21 March 2018..which would be best for
> > > >> testing.
> > > >> At the very least  use 2.8.8 which is the last  edition as well.
> > > >> I should add something else since you are testing.  Make very certain
> > that
> > > >> *all* other account related functions work  with this back door in,
> > placing
> > > >> holds for example.
> > > >> As a test during my discussion with tpl staff I went into the  the old
> > > >> account area.  I also did a search and placed an item on hold.
> > However I
> > > >> did not get the customary call informing me that the item was on hold
> > in
> > > >> the system, meaning it canceled  instead of letting me get the item.
> > > >> Additionally even low graphics browsers that support Javascript are
> > not
> > > >> working  on your new account page.
> > > >> For example in the Linux operating system, e-links which can be
> > compiled
> > > >> to support java script, and links which  is likewise ocmpiled neither
> > > >> produce the  back to old account option, nor allow you to log in at
> > all.
> > > >> Keep in mind some mobile devices, windows phones for example, do not
> > work
> > > >> well  with Java script.
> > > >> TPL is a public site meaning regardless of browser used   library
> > patrons
> > > >> should expect an open door.
> > > >> If you found an edition of lynx that produced a blank page, then
> > someone
> > > >> can use another lower graphics browser and find a comparative barrier.
> > > >>
> > > >> Karen
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >> On Wed, 11 Apr 2018, Kyle Bachan wrote:
> > > >>
> > > >> Hi Karen,
> > > >>> Oh, I had no idea you were talking to TPL. I'm actually on their web
> > team
> > > >>> which is why I'm trying to debug this specific issue. So you're
> > saying
> > > >>> that
> > > >>> you get the JavaScript message then? Hmm... I installed lynx via brew
> > > >>> which
> > > >>> may be why there is a variation?
> > > >>>
> > > >>>
> > > >>>
> > > >>>
> > > >>> On Wed, Apr 11, 2018, 5:07 PM Karen Lewellen <
> > klewel...@shellworld.net>
> > > >>> wrote:
> > > >>>
> > > >>> Hi Kyle,
> > >  I am presently in discussion with Toronto Library staff about this
> > issue.
> > >  please please please call them and tell them you are having trouble.
> > >  What I have shared is that since they are a service for the general
> > >  public, the account aspects of the site should not require Java
> > >  Script...couldbe a human rights code violation truth be told.
> > >  there is a back door in,
> > >  type the url like this.
> > >  www.torontopubliclibrary.ca/oldaccount.
> > >    When I just checked your link, I did not get a blank page, but the
> > >  statement that JavaScript is required.
> > >  Again library staff *must* be told of the problem so they  at the
> > 

Re: [Lynx-dev] Website shows blank page in Lynx browser

[Kyle Bachan]

Yes, I do have the latest version on mac. Dan do you know why I'm unable to
see anything on the website while Karen is?

On Thu, Apr 12, 2018 at 9:46 AM, dan d.  wrote:

>
> No, both macports and homebrew provide the latest version as soon as it is
> available, currently Lynx 2.8.8rel.2.
>
> On Wed, 11 Apr 2018, Karen Lewellen wrote:
>
> > If I am not mistaken, the last edition for the mac is several versions
> > old.
> >   2.8.5 or something?
> > anyway let us know.
> >
> >
> >
> > On Wed, 11 Apr 2018, Kyle Bachan wrote:
> >
> > > Brew is software that macs use to install programs. I will have to
> take a
> > > look at my version when I get to work tomorrow but that would explain
> why
> > > I'm not able to connect properly to the website. Once I have a properly
> > > working Lynx browser, it should make it much easier for me to see what
> the
> > > site looks like and make the adjustments. But I will investigate
> further
> > > tomorrow. Thank you for your help so far.
> > >
> > > On Wed, Apr 11, 2018 at 5:46 PM, Karen Lewellen <
> klewel...@shellworld.net>
> > > wrote:
> > >
> > >> Hi Kyle,
> > >> I have no idea what brew is.  What edition of Lynx are you using for
> > >> testing?
> > >> The latest dev edition is dated 21 March 2018..which would be best for
> > >> testing.
> > >> At the very least  use 2.8.8 which is the last  edition as well.
> > >> I should add something else since you are testing.  Make very certain
> that
> > >> *all* other account related functions work  with this back door in,
> placing
> > >> holds for example.
> > >> As a test during my discussion with tpl staff I went into the  the old
> > >> account area.  I also did a search and placed an item on hold.
> However I
> > >> did not get the customary call informing me that the item was on hold
> in
> > >> the system, meaning it canceled  instead of letting me get the item.
> > >> Additionally even low graphics browsers that support Javascript are
> not
> > >> working  on your new account page.
> > >> For example in the Linux operating system, e-links which can be
> compiled
> > >> to support java script, and links which  is likewise ocmpiled neither
> > >> produce the  back to old account option, nor allow you to log in at
> all.
> > >> Keep in mind some mobile devices, windows phones for example, do not
> work
> > >> well  with Java script.
> > >> TPL is a public site meaning regardless of browser used   library
> patrons
> > >> should expect an open door.
> > >> If you found an edition of lynx that produced a blank page, then
> someone
> > >> can use another lower graphics browser and find a comparative barrier.
> > >>
> > >> Karen
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> On Wed, 11 Apr 2018, Kyle Bachan wrote:
> > >>
> > >> Hi Karen,
> > >>> Oh, I had no idea you were talking to TPL. I'm actually on their web
> team
> > >>> which is why I'm trying to debug this specific issue. So you're
> saying
> > >>> that
> > >>> you get the JavaScript message then? Hmm... I installed lynx via brew
> > >>> which
> > >>> may be why there is a variation?
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>> On Wed, Apr 11, 2018, 5:07 PM Karen Lewellen <
> klewel...@shellworld.net>
> > >>> wrote:
> > >>>
> > >>> Hi Kyle,
> >  I am presently in discussion with Toronto Library staff about this
> issue.
> >  please please please call them and tell them you are having trouble.
> >  What I have shared is that since they are a service for the general
> >  public, the account aspects of the site should not require Java
> >  Script...couldbe a human rights code violation truth be told.
> >  there is a back door in,
> >  type the url like this.
> >  www.torontopubliclibrary.ca/oldaccount.
> >    When I just checked your link, I did not get a blank page, but the
> >  statement that JavaScript is required.
> >  Again library staff *must* be told of the problem so they  at the
> very
> >  least add the old account link to the site homepage. Much as they
> had the
> >  old catalog  link there for years.
> >  With your permission, may I share this post with the staff members
> I am
> >  communicating with presently?
> >  cheers,
> >  Karen
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >  On Wed, 11 Apr 2018, Kyle Bachan wrote:
> > 
> >  Hello!
> > > I have a Lynx problem that you might be able to help with:
> > >
> > > I have a customer who would like to view our website in the
> text-based
> > >
> >  Lynx
> > 
> > > browser. At the very least, our website should display a message
> saying
> > > that "We're sorry, you need to enable Javascript to view this" etc.
> > > However, this page appears to show blank in Lynx. The interesting
> thing
> > >
> >  is
> > 
> > > that I do see the correct content appearing when connecting to the
> > > localhost version of the browser which makes me think this might be
> > >
> >  related
> > 
> 

Re: [Lynx-dev] Website shows blank page in Lynx browser

[dan d.]

No, both macports and homebrew provide the latest version as soon as it is 
available, currently Lynx 2.8.8rel.2.

On Wed, 11 Apr 2018, Karen Lewellen wrote:

> If I am not mistaken, the last edition for the mac is several versions
> old.
>   2.8.5 or something?
> anyway let us know.
>
>
>
> On Wed, 11 Apr 2018, Kyle Bachan wrote:
>
> > Brew is software that macs use to install programs. I will have to take a
> > look at my version when I get to work tomorrow but that would explain why
> > I'm not able to connect properly to the website. Once I have a properly
> > working Lynx browser, it should make it much easier for me to see what the
> > site looks like and make the adjustments. But I will investigate further
> > tomorrow. Thank you for your help so far.
> >
> > On Wed, Apr 11, 2018 at 5:46 PM, Karen Lewellen 
> > wrote:
> >
> >> Hi Kyle,
> >> I have no idea what brew is.  What edition of Lynx are you using for
> >> testing?
> >> The latest dev edition is dated 21 March 2018..which would be best for
> >> testing.
> >> At the very least  use 2.8.8 which is the last  edition as well.
> >> I should add something else since you are testing.  Make very certain that
> >> *all* other account related functions work  with this back door in, placing
> >> holds for example.
> >> As a test during my discussion with tpl staff I went into the  the old
> >> account area.  I also did a search and placed an item on hold.  However I
> >> did not get the customary call informing me that the item was on hold in
> >> the system, meaning it canceled  instead of letting me get the item.
> >> Additionally even low graphics browsers that support Javascript are not
> >> working  on your new account page.
> >> For example in the Linux operating system, e-links which can be compiled
> >> to support java script, and links which  is likewise ocmpiled neither
> >> produce the  back to old account option, nor allow you to log in at all.
> >> Keep in mind some mobile devices, windows phones for example, do not work
> >> well  with Java script.
> >> TPL is a public site meaning regardless of browser used   library patrons
> >> should expect an open door.
> >> If you found an edition of lynx that produced a blank page, then someone
> >> can use another lower graphics browser and find a comparative barrier.
> >>
> >> Karen
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> On Wed, 11 Apr 2018, Kyle Bachan wrote:
> >>
> >> Hi Karen,
> >>> Oh, I had no idea you were talking to TPL. I'm actually on their web team
> >>> which is why I'm trying to debug this specific issue. So you're saying
> >>> that
> >>> you get the JavaScript message then? Hmm... I installed lynx via brew
> >>> which
> >>> may be why there is a variation?
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> On Wed, Apr 11, 2018, 5:07 PM Karen Lewellen 
> >>> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> Hi Kyle,
>  I am presently in discussion with Toronto Library staff about this issue.
>  please please please call them and tell them you are having trouble.
>  What I have shared is that since they are a service for the general
>  public, the account aspects of the site should not require Java
>  Script...couldbe a human rights code violation truth be told.
>  there is a back door in,
>  type the url like this.
>  www.torontopubliclibrary.ca/oldaccount.
>    When I just checked your link, I did not get a blank page, but the
>  statement that JavaScript is required.
>  Again library staff *must* be told of the problem so they  at the very
>  least add the old account link to the site homepage. Much as they had the
>  old catalog  link there for years.
>  With your permission, may I share this post with the staff members I am
>  communicating with presently?
>  cheers,
>  Karen
> 
> 
> 
>  On Wed, 11 Apr 2018, Kyle Bachan wrote:
> 
>  Hello!
> > I have a Lynx problem that you might be able to help with:
> >
> > I have a customer who would like to view our website in the text-based
> >
>  Lynx
> 
> > browser. At the very least, our website should display a message saying
> > that "We're sorry, you need to enable Javascript to view this" etc.
> > However, this page appears to show blank in Lynx. The interesting thing
> >
>  is
> 
> > that I do see the correct content appearing when connecting to the
> > localhost version of the browser which makes me think this might be
> >
>  related
> 
> > to a certificate or subdomain issue.
> >
> > For reference, the website I am trying to access via Lynx is
> > https://account.torontopubliclibrary.ca/.
> >
> > I've posted a stackoverflow question
> > <
> >
>  https://stackoverflow.com/questions/49758314/website-shows-
>  blank-page-in-lynx-browser
> 
> >
> > as well which has some screenshots that might show you more information.
> > Any help would 

Re: [Lynx-dev] Website shows blank page in Lynx browser

[David Woolley]

On 12/04/18 13:14, Jude DaShiell wrote:
I don't know what Tim Burnersley's position on html5 is but it's been 
around for long enough for him to have developed one.


As I recall, the original papers on HTML says it was specifically not 
intended to be what HTML5 is intended to be be, mainly a presentational 
tool.  I think that the original concept was basically something that 
the average librarian could author directly, but it has become a 
marketing department tool.  Unfortunately I can't find the exact quote 
at the moment.  However, going for a lowest common denominator platform 
was certainly part of the concept, because CERN had lots of different 
operating systems.


Tim Berners-Lee seems to keep quiet on such things these days, but I'd 
also note that he has popular fame for creating something that he didn't 
want to create.


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Re: [Lynx-dev] Website shows blank page in Lynx browser

[Jude DaShiell]

Okay, I have a speech screen reader over here and do check spelling of 
names occassionally, his name slipped through my checks thanks.


On Thu, 12 Apr 2018, Halaasz Saandor wrote:


Date: Thu, 12 Apr 2018 00:52:23
From: Halaasz Saandor 
To: lynx-dev@nongnu.org
Subject: Re: [Lynx-dev] Website shows blank page in Lynx browser

2018/04/11 21:27 ... Jude DaShiell:

 What would be really neat if it happened is if Tim Burnersley went and did
 a class action suit


Burnersley? How about Berners-Lee?

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Re: [Lynx-dev] Website shows blank page in Lynx browser

[Jude DaShiell]

What's really unfortunate about all of this is that javascript can do 
useful tasks on websites in the house cleaning department and had it 
been restricted to that kind of work and not blocking accessibility for 
all browsers it would not have attracted the well earned controversy and 
lightning it has attracted.  The producers of websites are responsible 
for misusing javascript.  I don't know what Tim Burnersley's position on 
html5 is but it's been around for long enough for him to have developed 
one.


On Thu, 12 Apr 2018, David Woolley wrote:


Date: Thu, 12 Apr 2018 04:44:34
From: David Woolley 
To: lynx-dev@nongnu.org
Subject: Re: [Lynx-dev] Website shows blank page in Lynx browser

On 12/04/18 02:27, Jude DaShiell wrote:

 What would be really neat if it happened is if Tim Burnersley went and did
 a class action suit on all javascript using websites requiring specific
 performance where those sites had to remove permanently all html since
 they had made his html inaccessible by using their


Unfortunately The World Wide Web Consortium's (W3C) Web Content Accessibility 
Group, now considers reliance on ECMAScript as acceptable, and has done so, 
for probably half a decade.  In my view that is because it is made up of 
accessibility consultants and graphical browser developers.


Also note that HTML5 is the product of a coup, by an industry consortium and 
is not controlled by W3C.  W3C wanted a semantically strong language, 
document mark-up language.  WHATWG wanted a language for running graphical 
applications on browsers, that was defined in such a way that even garbage 
produced consistent graphical results across browsers.


I don't think that Lynx is anywhere close to HTML5 compliance, because it 
doesn't parse it in a way that would allow it to use the mandated error 
recovery.


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Re: [Lynx-dev] Website shows blank page in Lynx browser

[David Woolley]

On 12/04/18 02:27, Jude DaShiell wrote:
What would be really neat if it happened is if Tim Burnersley went and 
did a class action suit on all javascript using websites requiring 
specific performance where those sites had to remove permanently all 
html since they had made his html inaccessible by using their


Unfortunately The World Wide Web Consortium's (W3C) Web Content 
Accessibility Group, now considers reliance on ECMAScript as acceptable, 
and has done so, for probably half a decade.  In my view that is because 
it is made up of accessibility consultants and graphical browser developers.


Also note that HTML5 is the product of a coup, by an industry consortium 
and is not controlled by W3C.  W3C wanted a semantically strong 
language, document mark-up language.  WHATWG wanted a language for 
running graphical applications on browsers, that was defined in such a 
way that even garbage produced consistent graphical results across browsers.


I don't think that Lynx is anywhere close to HTML5 compliance, because 
it doesn't parse it in a way that would allow it to use the mandated 
error recovery.


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