Re: Wine

[Richard L. Hamilton]

> On May 1, 2023, at 17:30, James  wrote:
> 
> 
> 
>> On 2 May 2023, at 2:18 am, Richard L. Hamilton  wrote:
>> 
>> Sure, a disposable, isolated environment (esp. one meant for extreme uses, 
>> like a Kali Linux VM) is great for suspicious software...or for testing less 
>> than robust software with possibly maliciously crafted input. Certainly NOT 
>> the example I had in mind, although one might argue that XMP or EXIF (as 
>> applicable) library exploits might make my example risky depending on the 
>> files being processed.
>> 
>> But by that criteria, anything but (maybe) a binary file editor with no size 
>> or content restrictions beyond what the operating system allows could be 
>> vulnerable to maliciously crafted input files, which doesn't even count that 
>> it just might be possible to construct a file name that is an attack on the 
>> OS itself, given complications like UTF-16 normalization, etc.
>> 
>> So IMO the question isn't whether you're running a program (that works fine 
>> in its own environment) in yours with a VM vs some less isolating means, but 
>> whether you'd want to run the program (or run it on certain input) at all 
>> even if it was native, in a valuable environment. I don't know if for 
>> example Wine could be modified to incorporate (invisibly to what it ran) 
>> additional macOS security features like sandboxing, which would make 
>> something run under it not much more dangerous than a native app.
>> 
>> TL/DR: I wouldn't run something that I downloaded and didn't have some 
>> confidence in (recommendations from reputable sites, original download site, 
>> maybe even signed) regardless of whether it was native, in Wine, or in a VM, 
>> unless I was in the business of (properly and carefully) testing software 
>> that didn't even meet that minimum standard of trusted-ness.
>> 
>>> On May 1, 2023, at 09:47, Sean McLinden  wrote:
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Yeah, as long as you aren't analyzing malware. WannaCry in Wine could 
>>> encrypt the contents of the user's HOME directory.
>>> 
>>> - Original Message -
>>> From: "Richard L. Hamilton" 
>>> To: "Sean McLinden" 
>>> Cc: "Christoph Kukulies" , "macports-users list" 
>>> 
>>> Sent: Monday, May 1, 2023 7:44:22 AM
>>> Subject: Re: Wine
>>> 
>>> Sure, but for some things Wine is good enough and even better. Back in 
>>> Mojave (32-bit support) and earlier, one could use WineBottler to make a 
>>> Mac app using Wine that invoked a Windows program. I had that for 
>>> abc_tags.exe, which is more convenient than VLC for fixing batches of 
>>> mis-tagged AVI files. No need to fire up a full VM for that. And yes, I 
>>> have Parallels and VirtualBox and other virtualization products for other 
>>> platforms; nothing against full virtualization, but sometimes it's overkill.
>>> 
 On May 1, 2023, at 07:11, Sean McLinden  wrote:
 
 
 If you don't mind spending a few bucks, Parallels Desktop for Mac supports 
 a full-featured Windows 11 VM.
> 
> I've been vaugely following this thread, for the reasons you advocate why not 
> crossover office. Certainly they have been good to me over the years
> James


Costs more than Parallels, so I don't see the point. A free wine to run 
selected Windows apps known to work with it, sure. But a paid one at a fairly 
high price? Not me.

Re: Wine

[Richard L. Hamilton]

Sure, a disposable, isolated environment (esp. one meant for extreme uses, like 
a Kali Linux VM) is great for suspicious software...or for testing less than 
robust software with possibly maliciously crafted input. Certainly NOT the 
example I had in mind, although one might argue that XMP or EXIF (as 
applicable) library exploits might make my example risky depending on the files 
being processed.

But by that criteria, anything but (maybe) a binary file editor with no size or 
content restrictions beyond what the operating system allows could be 
vulnerable to maliciously crafted input files, which doesn't even count that it 
just might be possible to construct a file name that is an attack on the OS 
itself, given complications like UTF-16 normalization, etc.

So IMO the question isn't whether you're running a program (that works fine in 
its own environment) in yours with a VM vs some less isolating means, but 
whether you'd want to run the program (or run it on certain input) at all even 
if it was native, in a valuable environment. I don't know if for example Wine 
could be modified to incorporate (invisibly to what it ran) additional macOS 
security features like sandboxing, which would make something run under it not 
much more dangerous than a native app.

TL/DR: I wouldn't run something that I downloaded and didn't have some 
confidence in (recommendations from reputable sites, original download site, 
maybe even signed) regardless of whether it was native, in Wine, or in a VM, 
unless I was in the business of (properly and carefully) testing software that 
didn't even meet that minimum standard of trusted-ness.

> On May 1, 2023, at 09:47, Sean McLinden  wrote:
> 
> 
> Yeah, as long as you aren't analyzing malware. WannaCry in Wine could encrypt 
> the contents of the user's HOME directory.
> 
> - Original Message -
> From: "Richard L. Hamilton" 
> To: "Sean McLinden" 
> Cc: "Christoph Kukulies" , "macports-users list" 
> 
> Sent: Monday, May 1, 2023 7:44:22 AM
> Subject: Re: Wine
> 
> Sure, but for some things Wine is good enough and even better. Back in Mojave 
> (32-bit support) and earlier, one could use WineBottler to make a Mac app 
> using Wine that invoked a Windows program. I had that for abc_tags.exe, which 
> is more convenient than VLC for fixing batches of mis-tagged AVI files. No 
> need to fire up a full VM for that. And yes, I have Parallels and VirtualBox 
> and other virtualization products for other platforms; nothing against full 
> virtualization, but sometimes it's overkill.
> 
>> On May 1, 2023, at 07:11, Sean McLinden  wrote:
>> 
>> 
>> If you don't mind spending a few bucks, Parallels Desktop for Mac supports a 
>> full-featured Windows 11 VM.
>> 
>> Sean
>> 
>> 
>> - Original Message -
>> From: "Christoph Kukulies" 
>> To: macports-users@lists.macports.org
>> Sent: Sunday, April 30, 2023 4:45:03 AM
>> Subject: Wine
>> 
>> Does macports support Wine ?
>> 
>> —
>> Christoph
>> 
> 

Re: Wine

[André-John Mas]

I am a little confused here, since the latest Wine release on MacPorts 
indicates it os 4.0.4:

https://ports.macports.org/port/wine/

Latest CrossOver Wine is 7.7 and official WineHQ is 8.5.

is the latest version on MacPorts really that old, or am I misunderstanding 
something?

Thanks

Andre

> On Apr 30, 2023, at 14:39, Ken Cunningham  
> wrote:
> 
> You probably won't want to build it, though.
> 
> Dean uses MacPorts to build wine, and then makes the binaries available here:
> 
> https://github.com/Gcenx/macOS_Wine_builds/releases/
> 
> Homebrew just downloads and installs the premade binaries that are made by 
> Dean's MacPorts overlay.
> 
> These are considered the official Wine builds for MacOS.
> 
> Perhaps one day Dean will be able to integrate his updates into MacPorts main 
> repo, but Ryan has been building and maintaining Wine on MacPorts for many 
> years and has a parallel update in the works.
> 
> Unfortunately Ryan is also extremely busy with all his other MacPorts 
> efforts, and has not been able to finish his update to wine for some years 
> now, so may have to pass the gavel to Dean in the end.
> 
> Best,
> 
> ken
> 
> 
> 
>> On Apr 30, 2023, at 11:27 AM, contextnerror ​  
>> wrote:
>> 
>> Yes and no. You’ll want to use the version by Gcenx.
>> https://github.com/Gcenx/macports-wine
>> 
>>> On Apr 30, 2023, at 1:46 AM, Christoph Kukulies  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Data  point: 
>>> 
>>> $ sudo port install wine
>>> Password:
>>> wine is known to fail. Try to install anyway? [y/N]: y
>>> Error: wine cannot be installed for the configured build_arch 'x86_64' 
>>> because it only supports the arch(s) 'i386'.
>>> Error: Follow https://guide.macports.org/#project.tickets if you believe 
>>> there is a bug.
>>> Error: Processing of port wine failed
>>> $ 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
 Am 30.04.2023 um 10:45 schrieb Christoph Kukulies :
 
 Does macports support Wine ?
 
 —
 Christoph
 
>>> 
> 

Re: Wine

[Sriranga Veeraraghavan]

Along similar lines - CrossOver from CodeWeavers is the best Wine solution I 
found for Mac:

https://www.codeweavers.com/ 

Other possible options are running Win2K under Qemu (version 7.1 is available 
in macports) or running Win98 under DosBox-X (version 2022.08 is available in 
macports).  Qemu doesn't emulate a 3D GPU (afaik), so most games aren't 
playable.  But DosBox-X has Voodoo emulation, which allows games from the 90s 
to run fairly well.

> On May 1, 2023, at 04:11, Sean McLinden  wrote:
> 
> 
> If you don't mind spending a few bucks, Parallels Desktop for Mac supports a 
> full-featured Windows 11 VM.
> 
> Sean
> 
> 
> - Original Message -
> From: "Christoph Kukulies" 
> To: macports-users@lists.macports.org
> Sent: Sunday, April 30, 2023 4:45:03 AM
> Subject: Wine
> 
> Does macports support Wine ?
> 
> —
> Christoph

Re: Wine

[Sean McLinden]

Yeah, as long as you aren't analyzing malware. WannaCry in Wine could encrypt 
the contents of the user's HOME directory.

- Original Message -
From: "Richard L. Hamilton" 
To: "Sean McLinden" 
Cc: "Christoph Kukulies" , "macports-users list" 

Sent: Monday, May 1, 2023 7:44:22 AM
Subject: Re: Wine

Sure, but for some things Wine is good enough and even better. Back in Mojave 
(32-bit support) and earlier, one could use WineBottler to make a Mac app using 
Wine that invoked a Windows program. I had that for abc_tags.exe, which is more 
convenient than VLC for fixing batches of mis-tagged AVI files. No need to fire 
up a full VM for that. And yes, I have Parallels and VirtualBox and other 
virtualization products for other platforms; nothing against full 
virtualization, but sometimes it's overkill.

> On May 1, 2023, at 07:11, Sean McLinden  wrote:
> 
> 
> If you don't mind spending a few bucks, Parallels Desktop for Mac supports a 
> full-featured Windows 11 VM.
> 
> Sean
> 
> 
> - Original Message -
> From: "Christoph Kukulies" 
> To: macports-users@lists.macports.org
> Sent: Sunday, April 30, 2023 4:45:03 AM
> Subject: Wine
> 
> Does macports support Wine ?
> 
> —
> Christoph
>

Re: Wine

[Richard L. Hamilton]

Sure, but for some things Wine is good enough and even better. Back in Mojave 
(32-bit support) and earlier, one could use WineBottler to make a Mac app using 
Wine that invoked a Windows program. I had that for abc_tags.exe, which is more 
convenient than VLC for fixing batches of mis-tagged AVI files. No need to fire 
up a full VM for that. And yes, I have Parallels and VirtualBox and other 
virtualization products for other platforms; nothing against full 
virtualization, but sometimes it's overkill.

> On May 1, 2023, at 07:11, Sean McLinden  wrote:
> 
> 
> If you don't mind spending a few bucks, Parallels Desktop for Mac supports a 
> full-featured Windows 11 VM.
> 
> Sean
> 
> 
> - Original Message -
> From: "Christoph Kukulies" 
> To: macports-users@lists.macports.org
> Sent: Sunday, April 30, 2023 4:45:03 AM
> Subject: Wine
> 
> Does macports support Wine ?
> 
> —
> Christoph
> 

Re: Wine

[Sean McLinden]

If you don't mind spending a few bucks, Parallels Desktop for Mac supports a 
full-featured Windows 11 VM.

Sean


- Original Message -
From: "Christoph Kukulies" 
To: macports-users@lists.macports.org
Sent: Sunday, April 30, 2023 4:45:03 AM
Subject: Wine

Does macports support Wine ?

—
Christoph