A clarification regarding my email that I just sent and put it relates to Microsoft word, are there different versions of Microsoft Word for the Mac the version I am running is the version within offi

[Maurice Mines]

Hello everyone, here is some clarification regarding the email and I sent 
earlier to the list. I am using the version of Microsoft Word can change in 
office 365. Also just so that it’s clear I’m running old S 1012.0.2. Hopefully 
this clears things up. Hopefully my phone got all of this correctly so that 
someone can understand me as I am dictating it to my phone. 

maurice Mines  
Maurice mines.
Board member, National Federation of the blind deaf blind division.
Vice president National Federation a of the blind of California Bakersfield 
chapter.
Amateur radio call sign kd0iko.
Direct phone number,  661-241-3788 

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A question about Microsoft Word for the Mac, is it even remotely usable with voiceover?

[Maurice Mines]

Hello everyone, earlier today I had to attempt to read a document in word that 
was being typed by a Nother person, when I went to go attempt to read this 
document I could not get the video cursor to focus on the text that actually 
appears in the document is there a way to make this easier in other words can I 
get to the point that I can actually read the whole document instead of all the 
tool and menu bars any thoughts? just be a where I am dictating this to my 
phone. Hope everyone is well, and hope everyone can understand this message?

maurice Mines  
Maurice mines.
Board member, National Federation of the blind deaf blind division.
Vice president National Federation a of the blind of California Bakersfield 
chapter.
Amateur radio call sign kd0iko.
Direct phone number,  661-241-3788 

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Re: VO Jumping Out of Mail: Was - Improving music app experience

[Matthew Janusauskas]

I’m also having the same experience.


> On Feb 4, 2022, at 12:41 PM, 'Tim Kilburn' via MacVisionaries 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hi,
> 
> Mine is an M1 MBP with TouchBar as well.  And, no,I did not accidentally 
> touch the TouchBar either.  Curiouser ad curiouser.
> 
> Later…
> 
> 
> Tim Kilburn
> Jamf Certified Tech
> Apple Professional Learning Specialist
> Apple Teacher
> (with Swift Playgrounds Recognition)
> Fort McMurray, AB Canada
> 
>> On Feb 4, 2022, at 11:37, Brian Hansen > > wrote:
>> 
>> I’m running the latest MacOS, and it’s doing the same thing to me. I haven’t 
>> found a pattern to it as of yet, but it seems to be taking place when I 
>> delete a mail message after reading it.
>> 
>>> On Feb 4, 2022, at 12:31 PM, 'Tim Kilburn' via MacVisionaries 
>>> mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com>> 
>>> wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hi,
>>> 
>>> Well, VO just jumped out of the Mail app a few seconds ago.  I guarantee 
>>> that I did not touch the Trackpad.  My left hand wasn’t even on my MBP, and 
>>> I had just hit the return key to open a Mail message with my right middle 
>>> finger.  All other appendages weren’t even close to the Trackpad.  I also 
>>> did some testing yesterday and this morning, and even if I do touch the 
>>> Trackpad purposely with my thumb, it does not jump to the Finder like the 
>>> behaviour seems to do.
>>> 
>>> Oh well, if others can’t duplicate it, it’s just one of those things that 
>>> happens to some, but not others, and I’m the unlucky one this time :).
>>> 
>>> Later…
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Tim Kilburn
>>> Jamf Certified Tech
>>> Apple Professional Learning Specialist
>>> Apple Teacher
>>> (with Swift Playgrounds Recognition)
>>> Fort McMurray, AB Canada
>>> 
 On Feb 3, 2022, at 14:41, Anders Holmberg >>> > wrote:
 
 Hi!
 I don’t have that issue as I am using an external keyboard.
 Just because my hands are quite big I have to use an external one.
 /A
 
> 3 feb. 2022 kl. 21:05 skrev Les Kriegler  >:
> 
> I would agree with Brad‘s comments here. It is so easy to activate the 
> touchpad. I pay attention to it and it still happens on occasion.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On Feb 3, 2022, at 9:14 AM, 'Tim Kilburn' via MacVisionaries 
>> > > wrote:
>> 
>> Hi,
>> 
>> Correction to my shortcuts:
>> 
>> •cmd-left and cmd-right do the same as using just the left or right 
>> arrows.  The difference is that when you add the cmd key, the focus 
>> location within the Music window is not as picky.
>> • to fast-forward or rewind within a song, add the option key to the 
>> above.  That is, cmd-option-left or cmd-option-right.
>> 
>> Later…
>> 
>> 
>> Tim Kilburn
>> Jamf Certified Tech
>> Apple Professional Learning Specialist
>> Apple Teacher
>> (with Swift Playgrounds Recognition)
>> Fort McMurray, AB Canada
>> 
>>> On Feb 3, 2022, at 11:53, 'Tim Kilburn' via MacVisionaries 
>>> >> > wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hi,
>>> 
>>> When it comes to the Search field, I prefer keyboard shortcuts.  So, to 
>>> search for something, press cmd-f.  This will automatically take you to 
>>> the search field.  After entering your information, press return.  
>>> Often, VO will auto-jump over to the results.  If it doesn’t, try VO-j.
>>> 
>>> Some other hits for easier navigation and use:
>>> 
>>> • I change the view of my playlists to Song view as I find the columns 
>>> that are created easier to navigate in/through.
>>> • use VO-FN-left or VO-FN-right to quickly move to the first or last 
>>> item in the Music window.  Sometimes, you need to hit the command twice.
>>> • Use VO-cmd-t to quickly get to the sidebar table.
>>> 
>>> Know that there’s tons of keyboard shortcuts in the Music app.  Many of 
>>> these are not commonly found in menus.
>>> 
>>> • space will play/pause the currently selected title.
>>> • left/right arrow will do previous/next song.
>>> • cmd-up or cmd-down will turn up/down the volume.
>>> • press return to start playing when you’re focused on a song you wish 
>>> to play.
>>> • press cmd-right and hold to fast-forward within a song, cmd-left to 
>>> rewind within.
>>> 
>>> Note that the above commands do not require VO keys at all, they are 
>>> simply built-in Music media controls.  Also note that if you’ve moved 
>>> out of the music app, or if you’ve brought VO focus to certain parts of 
>>> the Music app screen, these commands may be unresponsive.  Just bring 
>>> focus close to somewhere where the play button is and they’ll start 
>>> working again.
>>> 
>>> HTH.
>>> 
>>> Later…
>>> 
>>> Tim Kilburn
>>> 

Re: Improving music app experience

['Kristeen Hughes' via MacVisionaries]

I also experience losing focus in the mail app. It does not happen with the 
frequency as in the music app, but it does occur. I am using the Apple Magic 
keyboard, so it has nothing to do with a trackpad. I am using a Mac mini with 
no mouse or any input method other than the external keyboard.

Kristeen


> On Feb 3, 2022, at 3:35 PM, 'Tim Kilburn' via MacVisionaries 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hi,
> 
> I’d normally think that it may possibly be my hand hitting the trackpad as 
> well, but the question is then, why does it only happen in Mail, but not when 
> I’m typing in TextEdit, Pages etc.  Again, it’s not all the time, just some 
> inconvenient times :).
> 
> Later…
> 
> 
> Tim Kilburn
> Jamf Certified Tech
> Apple Professional Learning Specialist
> Apple Teacher
> (with Swift Playgrounds Recognition)
> Fort McMurray, AB Canada
> 
>> On Feb 3, 2022, at 13:19, Herbie Allen > > wrote:
>> 
>> I have not experienced this issue either. I use an external keyboard. For 
>> that matter other than the music issues, I’ve not   experienced some of the 
>> others mentioned.
>> 
>>> On Feb 3, 2022, at 13:38, Brad Snyder >> > wrote:
>>> 
>>> I don’t experience my cursor “jumping” when typing in macOS Monterey.
>>> Could it be that your hand is inadvertently touching the TouchPad when you 
>>> are typing? 
>>> 
>>> - Brad -
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On Feb 3, 2022, at 13:03, 'Donna Goodin' via MacVisionaries 
>>> mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com>> 
>>> wrote:
>>> 
>>> The thing that bugs me about Focus in Monterrey is how the cursor jumps 
>>> around when I’m typing.  I’m always having to edit my emails because the 
>>> cursor jumps to a different place in the message.
>>> Cheers,
>>> Donna
>>> 
>>> 
 On Feb 3, 2022, at 11:56 AM, Anders Holmberg >>> > wrote:
 
 Hi!
 The focus in general has gone worse.
 I can be reading an email and all of a sudden be in safari.
 Regarding the music app I don’t know.
 I can navigate it just fine by interacting with the sidebar and the grid.
 The worst  thing in the music app is the search field.
 When I do a search I have to stop interacting a lot of times to get to the 
 result.
 And I can’t do another search without first closing the app and restart it.
 But its just me who don’t know how to handle it.
 Also VoiceOver is not made for braille users which just is not good.
 /A
 
> 3 feb. 2022 kl. 17:48 skrev 'Kristeen Hughes' via MacVisionaries 
>  >:
> 
> I would give anything if someone had a way to make the focus better with 
> VO. It used to work so well. The OS before Monterey sort of broke it and 
> Monterey did nothing to fix it at all. Does anyone have a way they’ve 
> come up with to work around it?
> 
> Kristeen
> 
> 
>> On Feb 3, 2022, at 11:32 AM, Traci Duncan > > wrote:
>> 
>> Hi all,
>> 
>> Does anyone have tips on making the music app experience better on the 
>> Mac? Frankly, I hate it! I find it a challenge to navigate. It often 
>> says not responding. Frequently voiceover seems to jump out of whatever 
>> focus I might be in.
>> 
>> I appreciate any advice. I will even consider a different app to manage 
>> my music.
>> 
>> Thank you,
>> Traci
>> 
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Re: Unable to setup family sharing with different apple id for purchases

['Tim Kilburn' via MacVisionaries]

Hi,

What do you mean regarding changing Apple ID?

For Family Sharing, know the following:

• the family organizer is the one for which the new purchases are charged to if 
Family Purchasing is enabled.
• when accessing purchases made by another family member in the App Store, for 
example, go to the Today view, double-tap My Account, double-tap Purchased, 
then double-tap the other person’s name.  Similarly, in the Books app, go to 
Reading Now, double-tap Account, then go to Family Purchases, and double-tap 
the name of the person to see their purchases and gain access to them.

Are you asking or hoping to do something different that I’m misunderstanding?

Later…


Tim Kilburn
Jamf Certified Tech
Apple Professional Learning Specialist
Apple Teacher
(with Swift Playgrounds Recognition)
Fort McMurray, AB Canada

> On Feb 4, 2022, at 14:38, 'Andrew Lamanche' via MacVisionaries 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hi,
> 
> I’m in this for ever irritating situation of having two apple IDs: one for 
> ICloud & one for App store, purchases, books etc.  I’m setting up family 
> sharing and naturally I’d like the members of the family to use purchases 
> I’ve got with a different AppleID.  I’ve followed Apple’s instructions but do 
> you think I can change this ID for purchases?  I’ve been going round in 
> circles for an hour and I’m sick of it.  Anybody has had a similar experience?
> 
> Andrew
> 
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Unable to setup family sharing with different apple id for purchases

['Andrew Lamanche' via MacVisionaries]

Hi,

I’m in this for ever irritating situation of having two apple IDs: one for 
ICloud & one for App store, purchases, books etc.  I’m setting up family 
sharing and naturally I’d like the members of the family to use purchases I’ve 
got with a different AppleID.  I’ve followed Apple’s instructions but do you 
think I can change this ID for purchases?  I’ve been going round in circles for 
an hour and I’m sick of it.  Anybody has had a similar experience?

Andrew

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Re: VO command to make any window expand to its largest size

['Tim Kilburn' via MacVisionaries]

Hi Jonathan,

I have used those drag & drop actions often, and, with VO, the windows do not 
need to be necessarily arranged like that anymore.  I do recall having to do 
that sort of thing years ago though.

Later…


Tim Kilburn
Jamf Certified Tech
Apple Professional Learning Specialist
Apple Teacher
(with Swift Playgrounds Recognition)
Fort McMurray, AB Canada

> On Feb 4, 2022, at 12:58, Jonathan Cohn  wrote:
> 
> For moving  windows the only reason I have thought makes sense, is if you are 
> able to get the drag and drop to work between windows. 
> 1. Move 1 window to the top half of the screen.
> 2. Move the other window to the bottom half of the screen.
> 3. Press the start drag operation.
> 4. move to other window and execute the end drag operation.
> 
> I never did test this out though, since I can almost always find alternatives 
> to drag and drop. VoiceOver also has commands for resizing and moving objects 
> within Windows I expect that this could be helpful with slide presentation 
> creation tools, but never use these tools.
> Jonathan
> 
> 
> On Fri, Feb 4, 2022 at 10:53 AM 'Tim Kilburn' via MacVisionaries 
> mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com>> 
> wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> I’d agree with you that it should only pertain to those VO users who are 
> partially sighted.  In the old days of not so reliable or robust scree 
> readers, you sometimes needed to rearrange windows like that because 
> overlapping windows had odd behaviour when trying to read.  This is no longer 
> the case with VO and the newer OS’s.
> 
> Later…
> 
> 
> Tim Kilburn
> Jamf Certified Tech
> Apple Professional Learning Specialist
> Apple Teacher
> (with Swift Playgrounds Recognition)
> Fort McMurray, AB Canada
> 
>> On Feb 3, 2022, at 23:54, Jürgen Fleger > > wrote:
>> 
>> Hi Tim,
>> very interesting. 
>> I always wondered why a VO user could want to move a window. Would you 
>> aggree this is only useful if you are partially sighted? Or is there 
>> anything I don't understand? 
>> Thanks and all the best
>> Jürgen 
>> .
>> 
>> Von meinem iPhone gesendet
>> 
>>> Am 03.02.2022 um 23:14 schrieb 'Tim Kilburn' via MacVisionaries 
>>> mailto:Macvisionaries@googlegroups.com>>:
>>> 
>>> Hi,
>>> 
>>> Further to my previous notes on this, see the following Apple article for 
>>> specific VO commands related to window manipulation:
>>> 
>>> https://support.apple.com/en-ca/guide/voiceover/mchlp2709/mac 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> In looking at these, I don’t believe there is a specific command within 
>>> VoiceOver itself for what you asked.
>>> 
>>> Later…
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Tim Kilburn
>>> Jamf Certified Tech
>>> Apple Professional Learning Specialist
>>> Apple Teacher
>>> (with Swift Playgrounds Recognition)
>>> Fort McMurray, AB Canada
>>> 
 On Feb 3, 2022, at 15:05, Tim Kilburn >>> > wrote:
 
 Hi,
 
 Cmd-ctrl-f will put the window into Full Screen.  Alternatively, in some 
 windows, you’ll find the Close, Minimize and Zoom buttons as the first 
 items on the screen.  Use VO-FN-left then VO-left to move to the Full 
 Screen, Zoom, Minimize and Close buttons.  Some windows do not have the 
 Zoom option, just the Full Screen.  Zoom normally expands/collapses the 
 window between its current size and as big as it would fit on the screen 
 while still having the menubar visible.  Full Screen visually takes away 
 the menu bar as well and uses the entire screen to display the window.  
 The same cmd-ctrl-f command will toggle it out of Full Screen mode.
 
 Not sure if this is what you’re looking for, but it may help.
 
 Later…
 
 
 Tim Kilburn
 Jamf Certified Tech
 Apple Professional Learning Specialist
 Apple Teacher
 (with Swift Playgrounds Recognition)
 Fort McMurray, AB Canada
 
> On Feb 3, 2022, at 14:57, Chuck Reichel  > wrote:
> 
> Hi List,
> I need to make some windows larger or zoomed to their biggest size.
> I know that VO tilde and VO shift tilde moves in small increments up or 
> down or left or right but I need to make the whole window grow to its 
> largest size to access certain menus in my pro tools plugin windows.
> What is the command to make any window expand to its largest size please?
> Thanks
> Chuck
> 
> 
> 
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> Visionaries list.
> 
> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or 
> if you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the 
> owners or moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
> 
> Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor.  You can reach mark 
> at:  mk...@ucla.edu  and your owner is Cara Quinn 

Re: VO command to make any window expand to its largest size

[Jonathan Cohn]

For moving  windows the only reason I have thought makes sense, is if you
are able to get the drag and drop to work between windows.
1. Move 1 window to the top half of the screen.
2. Move the other window to the bottom half of the screen.
3. Press the start drag operation.
4. move to other window and execute the end drag operation.

I never did test this out though, since I can almost always find
alternatives to drag and drop. VoiceOver also has commands for resizing and
moving objects within Windows I expect that this could be helpful with
slide presentation creation tools, but never use these tools.
Jonathan


On Fri, Feb 4, 2022 at 10:53 AM 'Tim Kilburn' via MacVisionaries <
macvisionaries@googlegroups.com> wrote:

> Hi,
>
> I’d agree with you that it should only pertain to those VO users who are
> partially sighted.  In the old days of not so reliable or robust scree
> readers, you sometimes needed to rearrange windows like that because
> overlapping windows had odd behaviour when trying to read.  This is no
> longer the case with VO and the newer OS’s.
>
> Later…
>
>
> Tim Kilburn
> Jamf Certified Tech
> Apple Professional Learning Specialist
> Apple Teacher
> (with Swift Playgrounds Recognition)
> Fort McMurray, AB Canada
>
> On Feb 3, 2022, at 23:54, Jürgen Fleger  wrote:
>
> Hi Tim,
> very interesting.
> I always wondered why a VO user could want to move a window. Would you
> aggree this is only useful if you are partially sighted? Or is there
> anything I don't understand?
> Thanks and all the best
> Jürgen
> .
>
> Von meinem iPhone gesendet
>
> Am 03.02.2022 um 23:14 schrieb 'Tim Kilburn' via MacVisionaries <
> Macvisionaries@googlegroups.com>:
>
> Hi,
>
> Further to my previous notes on this, see the following Apple article for
> specific VO commands related to window manipulation:
>
> https://support.apple.com/en-ca/guide/voiceover/mchlp2709/mac
>
> In looking at these, I don’t believe there is a specific command within
> VoiceOver itself for what you asked.
>
> Later…
>
>
> Tim Kilburn
> Jamf Certified Tech
> Apple Professional Learning Specialist
> Apple Teacher
> (with Swift Playgrounds Recognition)
> Fort McMurray, AB Canada
>
> On Feb 3, 2022, at 15:05, Tim Kilburn  wrote:
>
> Hi,
>
> Cmd-ctrl-f will put the window into Full Screen.  Alternatively, in some
> windows, you’ll find the Close, Minimize and Zoom buttons as the first
> items on the screen.  Use VO-FN-left then VO-left to move to the Full
> Screen, Zoom, Minimize and Close buttons.  Some windows do not have the
> Zoom option, just the Full Screen.  Zoom normally expands/collapses the
> window between its current size and as big as it would fit on the screen
> while still having the menubar visible.  Full Screen visually takes away
> the menu bar as well and uses the entire screen to display the window.  The
> same cmd-ctrl-f command will toggle it out of Full Screen mode.
>
> Not sure if this is what you’re looking for, but it may help.
>
> Later…
>
>
> Tim Kilburn
> Jamf Certified Tech
> Apple Professional Learning Specialist
> Apple Teacher
> (with Swift Playgrounds Recognition)
> Fort McMurray, AB Canada
>
> On Feb 3, 2022, at 14:57, Chuck Reichel 
> wrote:
>
> Hi List,
> I need to make some windows larger or zoomed to their biggest size.
> I know that VO tilde and VO shift tilde moves in small increments up or
> down or left or right but I need to make the whole window grow to its
> largest size to access certain menus in my pro tools plugin windows.
> What is the command to make any window expand to its largest size please?
> Thanks
> Chuck
>
>
>
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> Visionaries list.
>
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> owners or moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
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> Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor.  You can reach mark
> at:  mk...@ucla.edu and your owner is Cara Quinn - you can reach Cara at
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>
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> Visionaries list.
>
> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or
> if you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the
> owners or moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
>
> Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor. You can reach mark at:
>   

Re: VO command to make any window expand to its largest size

[Chuck Reichel]

Hi guys,
The reason for resizing the Plugin windows in  pro tools is to make  it easier 
to get to the presets that are hidden to VoiceOver for now.
I am using “move mouse” to get to the load menu to access the presets for now.
When my wife Robin resizes the plugin window it makes using move mouse more 
efficient getting to the non VO third party load area to click on.
Move mouse moves the actual mouse in “1 tenth  of an inch movements using the 
arrow keys.
Thats the need for the resizing of the windows until I get the third party to 
make their tool bar accessible  which  is coming.
HTh
Chuck



> On Feb 4, 2022, at 2:27 PM, Jessica Moss  wrote:
> 
> Ok, I may be a little late to the party on this one, but I’ve actually had 
> instances with some of the sites I’ve had to test requiring me to need to 
> zoom in and out, due to the size of the main window behaving as if it were a 
> mobile site instead of a desktop site.  So while I don’t know for a fact that 
> there is a command to completely maximize the size of the whole window, and 
> it took a lot of playing around at times with the zoom in/out feature to make 
> some of these sites behave the way I needed them to, this isn’t strictly for 
> low vision users.
> 
>> On Feb 4, 2022, at 10:53 AM, 'Tim Kilburn' via MacVisionaries 
>> mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com>> 
>> wrote:
>> 
>> Hi,
>> 
>> I’d agree with you that it should only pertain to those VO users who are 
>> partially sighted.  In the old days of not so reliable or robust scree 
>> readers, you sometimes needed to rearrange windows like that because 
>> overlapping windows had odd behaviour when trying to read.  This is no 
>> longer the case with VO and the newer OS’s.
>> 
>> Later…
>> 
>> 
>> Tim Kilburn
>> Jamf Certified Tech
>> Apple Professional Learning Specialist
>> Apple Teacher
>> (with Swift Playgrounds Recognition)
>> Fort McMurray, AB Canada
>> 
>>> On Feb 3, 2022, at 23:54, Jürgen Fleger >> > wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hi Tim,
>>> very interesting. 
>>> I always wondered why a VO user could want to move a window. Would you 
>>> aggree this is only useful if you are partially sighted? Or is there 
>>> anything I don't understand? 
>>> Thanks and all the best
>>> Jürgen 
>>> .
>>> 
>>> Von meinem iPhone gesendet
>>> 
 Am 03.02.2022 um 23:14 schrieb 'Tim Kilburn' via MacVisionaries 
 mailto:Macvisionaries@googlegroups.com>>:
 
 Hi,
 
 Further to my previous notes on this, see the following Apple article for 
 specific VO commands related to window manipulation:
 
 https://support.apple.com/en-ca/guide/voiceover/mchlp2709/mac 
 
 
 In looking at these, I don’t believe there is a specific command within 
 VoiceOver itself for what you asked.
 
 Later…
 
 
 Tim Kilburn
 Jamf Certified Tech
 Apple Professional Learning Specialist
 Apple Teacher
 (with Swift Playgrounds Recognition)
 Fort McMurray, AB Canada
 
> On Feb 3, 2022, at 15:05, Tim Kilburn  > wrote:
> 
> Hi,
> 
> Cmd-ctrl-f will put the window into Full Screen.  Alternatively, in some 
> windows, you’ll find the Close, Minimize and Zoom buttons as the first 
> items on the screen.  Use VO-FN-left then VO-left to move to the Full 
> Screen, Zoom, Minimize and Close buttons.  Some windows do not have the 
> Zoom option, just the Full Screen.  Zoom normally expands/collapses the 
> window between its current size and as big as it would fit on the screen 
> while still having the menubar visible.  Full Screen visually takes away 
> the menu bar as well and uses the entire screen to display the window.  
> The same cmd-ctrl-f command will toggle it out of Full Screen mode.
> 
> Not sure if this is what you’re looking for, but it may help.
> 
> Later…
> 
> 
> Tim Kilburn
> Jamf Certified Tech
> Apple Professional Learning Specialist
> Apple Teacher
> (with Swift Playgrounds Recognition)
> Fort McMurray, AB Canada
> 
>> On Feb 3, 2022, at 14:57, Chuck Reichel > > wrote:
>> 
>> Hi List,
>> I need to make some windows larger or zoomed to their biggest size.
>> I know that VO tilde and VO shift tilde moves in small increments up or 
>> down or left or right but I need to make the whole window grow to its 
>> largest size to access certain menus in my pro tools plugin windows.
>> What is the command to make any window expand to its largest size please?
>> Thanks
>> Chuck
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> -- 
>> The following information is important for all members of the Mac 
>> Visionaries list.
>> 
>> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or 
>> if you feel that a member's post is 

Re: VO command to make any window expand to its largest size

[Jessica Moss]

Ok, I may be a little late to the party on this one, but I’ve actually had 
instances with some of the sites I’ve had to test requiring me to need to zoom 
in and out, due to the size of the main window behaving as if it were a mobile 
site instead of a desktop site.  So while I don’t know for a fact that there is 
a command to completely maximize the size of the whole window, and it took a 
lot of playing around at times with the zoom in/out feature to make some of 
these sites behave the way I needed them to, this isn’t strictly for low vision 
users.

> On Feb 4, 2022, at 10:53 AM, 'Tim Kilburn' via MacVisionaries 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hi,
> 
> I’d agree with you that it should only pertain to those VO users who are 
> partially sighted.  In the old days of not so reliable or robust scree 
> readers, you sometimes needed to rearrange windows like that because 
> overlapping windows had odd behaviour when trying to read.  This is no longer 
> the case with VO and the newer OS’s.
> 
> Later…
> 
> 
> Tim Kilburn
> Jamf Certified Tech
> Apple Professional Learning Specialist
> Apple Teacher
> (with Swift Playgrounds Recognition)
> Fort McMurray, AB Canada
> 
>> On Feb 3, 2022, at 23:54, Jürgen Fleger > > wrote:
>> 
>> Hi Tim,
>> very interesting. 
>> I always wondered why a VO user could want to move a window. Would you 
>> aggree this is only useful if you are partially sighted? Or is there 
>> anything I don't understand? 
>> Thanks and all the best
>> Jürgen 
>> .
>> 
>> Von meinem iPhone gesendet
>> 
>>> Am 03.02.2022 um 23:14 schrieb 'Tim Kilburn' via MacVisionaries 
>>> mailto:Macvisionaries@googlegroups.com>>:
>>> 
>>> Hi,
>>> 
>>> Further to my previous notes on this, see the following Apple article for 
>>> specific VO commands related to window manipulation:
>>> 
>>> https://support.apple.com/en-ca/guide/voiceover/mchlp2709/mac 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> In looking at these, I don’t believe there is a specific command within 
>>> VoiceOver itself for what you asked.
>>> 
>>> Later…
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Tim Kilburn
>>> Jamf Certified Tech
>>> Apple Professional Learning Specialist
>>> Apple Teacher
>>> (with Swift Playgrounds Recognition)
>>> Fort McMurray, AB Canada
>>> 
 On Feb 3, 2022, at 15:05, Tim Kilburn >>> > wrote:
 
 Hi,
 
 Cmd-ctrl-f will put the window into Full Screen.  Alternatively, in some 
 windows, you’ll find the Close, Minimize and Zoom buttons as the first 
 items on the screen.  Use VO-FN-left then VO-left to move to the Full 
 Screen, Zoom, Minimize and Close buttons.  Some windows do not have the 
 Zoom option, just the Full Screen.  Zoom normally expands/collapses the 
 window between its current size and as big as it would fit on the screen 
 while still having the menubar visible.  Full Screen visually takes away 
 the menu bar as well and uses the entire screen to display the window.  
 The same cmd-ctrl-f command will toggle it out of Full Screen mode.
 
 Not sure if this is what you’re looking for, but it may help.
 
 Later…
 
 
 Tim Kilburn
 Jamf Certified Tech
 Apple Professional Learning Specialist
 Apple Teacher
 (with Swift Playgrounds Recognition)
 Fort McMurray, AB Canada
 
> On Feb 3, 2022, at 14:57, Chuck Reichel  > wrote:
> 
> Hi List,
> I need to make some windows larger or zoomed to their biggest size.
> I know that VO tilde and VO shift tilde moves in small increments up or 
> down or left or right but I need to make the whole window grow to its 
> largest size to access certain menus in my pro tools plugin windows.
> What is the command to make any window expand to its largest size please?
> Thanks
> Chuck
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> The following information is important for all members of the Mac 
> Visionaries list.
> 
> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or 
> if you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the 
> owners or moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
> 
> Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor.  You can reach mark 
> at:  mk...@ucla.edu  and your owner is Cara Quinn 
> - you can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com 
> 
> 
> The archives for this list can be searched at:
> http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/ 
> 
> --- 
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
> "MacVisionaries" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
> email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com 

Re: VO Jumping Out of Mail: Was - Improving music app experience

['Mervin Keck III' via MacVisionaries]

I may one day have a newer Mac without a Touch Bar. But as long as I have it I 
love using the Touch Bar. I will miss it when it is gone. I really don’t think 
that is causing any focus issues.
Merv


> On Feb 4, 2022, at 1:49 PM, Kliph  wrote:
> 
> I had this issue before the last beta cycle, but I can say, since 12.3 I 
> haven’t had this issue anymore.  BTW, I don’t use a trackpad or Touch Bar.
> 
> Follow my Podcast 
>  and 
> Youtube  Channels where 
> you will find a variety of great shows to listen to
> My Christian Show 
> ,
>  Sports Talk show 
> , 
> TechTalk show 
> .
> Also our MacOS12 
> , And 
> IOS15  
> play lists with great step by step tutorials
> You can always Follow us on Twitter  or 
> email us  with topic ideas that you 
> want to hear
> Follow the show you like, or the entire channel 
>   to 
> be entertained on demand!
> 
>> On Feb 4, 2022, at 12:37 PM, 'Mervin Keck III' via MacVisionaries 
>> mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com>> 
>> wrote:
>> 
>> This has started happening to me on my M1 MBP ever since MonteRay. I don’t 
>> even have the track pad enabled because I do not generally use it. I like 
>> the Touch Bar and use it often but have never made a practice of using the 
>> track pad. I also never had this focus issue before MonteRay.
>> I just didn’t bother chiming in because experience has taught me that 
>> opinions will vary on certain topics and I am not going to change anyone’s 
>> mind with my experience.
>> Merv
>> 
>> 
>>> On Feb 4, 2022, at 1:31 PM, 'Tim Kilburn' via MacVisionaries 
>>> mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com>> 
>>> wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hi,
>>> 
>>> Well, VO just jumped out of the Mail app a few seconds ago.  I guarantee 
>>> that I did not touch the Trackpad.  My left hand wasn’t even on my MBP, and 
>>> I had just hit the return key to open a Mail message with my right middle 
>>> finger.  All other appendages weren’t even close to the Trackpad.  I also 
>>> did some testing yesterday and this morning, and even if I do touch the 
>>> Trackpad purposely with my thumb, it does not jump to the Finder like the 
>>> behaviour seems to do.
>>> 
>>> Oh well, if others can’t duplicate it, it’s just one of those things that 
>>> happens to some, but not others, and I’m the unlucky one this time :).
>>> 
>>> Later…
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Tim Kilburn
>>> Jamf Certified Tech
>>> Apple Professional Learning Specialist
>>> Apple Teacher
>>> (with Swift Playgrounds Recognition)
>>> Fort McMurray, AB Canada
>>> 
 On Feb 3, 2022, at 14:41, Anders Holmberg >>> > wrote:
 
 Hi!
 I don’t have that issue as I am using an external keyboard.
 Just because my hands are quite big I have to use an external one.
 /A
 
> 3 feb. 2022 kl. 21:05 skrev Les Kriegler  >:
> 
> I would agree with Brad‘s comments here. It is so easy to activate the 
> touchpad. I pay attention to it and it still happens on occasion.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On Feb 3, 2022, at 9:14 AM, 'Tim Kilburn' via MacVisionaries 
>> > > wrote:
>> 
>> Hi,
>> 
>> Correction to my shortcuts:
>> 
>> •cmd-left and cmd-right do the same as using just the left or right 
>> arrows.  The difference is that when you add the cmd key, the focus 
>> location within the Music window is not as picky.
>> • to fast-forward or rewind within a song, add the option key to the 
>> above.  That is, cmd-option-left or cmd-option-right.
>> 
>> Later…
>> 
>> 
>> Tim Kilburn
>> Jamf Certified Tech
>> Apple Professional Learning Specialist
>> Apple Teacher
>> (with Swift Playgrounds Recognition)
>> Fort McMurray, AB Canada
>> 
>>> On Feb 3, 2022, at 11:53, 'Tim Kilburn' via MacVisionaries 
>>> >> > wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hi,
>>> 
>>> When it comes to the Search field, I prefer keyboard shortcuts.  So, to 
>>> search for something, press cmd-f.  This will automatically take you to 
>>> the search field.  After entering your information, press return.  
>>> Often, VO will auto-jump over to the results.  If it doesn’t, try VO-j.
>>> 
>>> Some other hits for easier 

Re: VO Jumping Out of Mail: Was - Improving music app experience

[Kliph]

I had this issue before the last beta cycle, but I can say, since 12.3 I 
haven’t had this issue anymore.  BTW, I don’t use a trackpad or Touch Bar.

Follow my Podcast 
 and 
Youtube  Channels where 
you will find a variety of great shows to listen to
My Christian Show 
,
 Sports Talk show 
, 
TechTalk show 
.
Also our MacOS12 
, And 
IOS15  
play lists with great step by step tutorials
You can always Follow us on Twitter  or email 
us  with topic ideas that you want to 
hear
Follow the show you like, or the entire channel 
  to 
be entertained on demand!

> On Feb 4, 2022, at 12:37 PM, 'Mervin Keck III' via MacVisionaries 
>  wrote:
> 
> This has started happening to me on my M1 MBP ever since MonteRay. I don’t 
> even have the track pad enabled because I do not generally use it. I like the 
> Touch Bar and use it often but have never made a practice of using the track 
> pad. I also never had this focus issue before MonteRay.
> I just didn’t bother chiming in because experience has taught me that 
> opinions will vary on certain topics and I am not going to change anyone’s 
> mind with my experience.
> Merv
> 
> 
>> On Feb 4, 2022, at 1:31 PM, 'Tim Kilburn' via MacVisionaries 
>> mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com>> 
>> wrote:
>> 
>> Hi,
>> 
>> Well, VO just jumped out of the Mail app a few seconds ago.  I guarantee 
>> that I did not touch the Trackpad.  My left hand wasn’t even on my MBP, and 
>> I had just hit the return key to open a Mail message with my right middle 
>> finger.  All other appendages weren’t even close to the Trackpad.  I also 
>> did some testing yesterday and this morning, and even if I do touch the 
>> Trackpad purposely with my thumb, it does not jump to the Finder like the 
>> behaviour seems to do.
>> 
>> Oh well, if others can’t duplicate it, it’s just one of those things that 
>> happens to some, but not others, and I’m the unlucky one this time :).
>> 
>> Later…
>> 
>> 
>> Tim Kilburn
>> Jamf Certified Tech
>> Apple Professional Learning Specialist
>> Apple Teacher
>> (with Swift Playgrounds Recognition)
>> Fort McMurray, AB Canada
>> 
>>> On Feb 3, 2022, at 14:41, Anders Holmberg >> > wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hi!
>>> I don’t have that issue as I am using an external keyboard.
>>> Just because my hands are quite big I have to use an external one.
>>> /A
>>> 
 3 feb. 2022 kl. 21:05 skrev Les Kriegler >>> >:
 
 I would agree with Brad‘s comments here. It is so easy to activate the 
 touchpad. I pay attention to it and it still happens on occasion.
 
 Sent from my iPhone
 
> On Feb 3, 2022, at 9:14 AM, 'Tim Kilburn' via MacVisionaries 
>  > wrote:
> 
> Hi,
> 
> Correction to my shortcuts:
> 
> •cmd-left and cmd-right do the same as using just the left or right 
> arrows.  The difference is that when you add the cmd key, the focus 
> location within the Music window is not as picky.
> • to fast-forward or rewind within a song, add the option key to the 
> above.  That is, cmd-option-left or cmd-option-right.
> 
> Later…
> 
> 
> Tim Kilburn
> Jamf Certified Tech
> Apple Professional Learning Specialist
> Apple Teacher
> (with Swift Playgrounds Recognition)
> Fort McMurray, AB Canada
> 
>> On Feb 3, 2022, at 11:53, 'Tim Kilburn' via MacVisionaries 
>> > > wrote:
>> 
>> Hi,
>> 
>> When it comes to the Search field, I prefer keyboard shortcuts.  So, to 
>> search for something, press cmd-f.  This will automatically take you to 
>> the search field.  After entering your information, press return.  
>> Often, VO will auto-jump over to the results.  If it doesn’t, try VO-j.
>> 
>> Some other hits for easier navigation and use:
>> 
>> • I change the view of my playlists to Song view as I find the columns 
>> that are created easier to navigate in/through.
>> • use VO-FN-left or VO-FN-right to quickly move to the first or last 
>> item in the Music window.  Sometimes, you need to hit the command twice.
>> • Use VO-cmd-t to quickly get to the sidebar table.
>> 
>> Know that there’s tons of keyboard 

Re: VO Jumping Out of Mail: Was - Improving music app experience

['Tim Kilburn' via MacVisionaries]

Hi,

Mine is an M1 MBP with TouchBar as well.  And, no,I did not accidentally touch 
the TouchBar either.  Curiouser ad curiouser.

Later…


Tim Kilburn
Jamf Certified Tech
Apple Professional Learning Specialist
Apple Teacher
(with Swift Playgrounds Recognition)
Fort McMurray, AB Canada

> On Feb 4, 2022, at 11:37, Brian Hansen  wrote:
> 
> I’m running the latest MacOS, and it’s doing the same thing to me. I haven’t 
> found a pattern to it as of yet, but it seems to be taking place when I 
> delete a mail message after reading it.
> 
>> On Feb 4, 2022, at 12:31 PM, 'Tim Kilburn' via MacVisionaries 
>> mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com>> 
>> wrote:
>> 
>> Hi,
>> 
>> Well, VO just jumped out of the Mail app a few seconds ago.  I guarantee 
>> that I did not touch the Trackpad.  My left hand wasn’t even on my MBP, and 
>> I had just hit the return key to open a Mail message with my right middle 
>> finger.  All other appendages weren’t even close to the Trackpad.  I also 
>> did some testing yesterday and this morning, and even if I do touch the 
>> Trackpad purposely with my thumb, it does not jump to the Finder like the 
>> behaviour seems to do.
>> 
>> Oh well, if others can’t duplicate it, it’s just one of those things that 
>> happens to some, but not others, and I’m the unlucky one this time :).
>> 
>> Later…
>> 
>> 
>> Tim Kilburn
>> Jamf Certified Tech
>> Apple Professional Learning Specialist
>> Apple Teacher
>> (with Swift Playgrounds Recognition)
>> Fort McMurray, AB Canada
>> 
>>> On Feb 3, 2022, at 14:41, Anders Holmberg >> > wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hi!
>>> I don’t have that issue as I am using an external keyboard.
>>> Just because my hands are quite big I have to use an external one.
>>> /A
>>> 
 3 feb. 2022 kl. 21:05 skrev Les Kriegler >>> >:
 
 I would agree with Brad‘s comments here. It is so easy to activate the 
 touchpad. I pay attention to it and it still happens on occasion.
 
 Sent from my iPhone
 
> On Feb 3, 2022, at 9:14 AM, 'Tim Kilburn' via MacVisionaries 
>  > wrote:
> 
> Hi,
> 
> Correction to my shortcuts:
> 
> •cmd-left and cmd-right do the same as using just the left or right 
> arrows.  The difference is that when you add the cmd key, the focus 
> location within the Music window is not as picky.
> • to fast-forward or rewind within a song, add the option key to the 
> above.  That is, cmd-option-left or cmd-option-right.
> 
> Later…
> 
> 
> Tim Kilburn
> Jamf Certified Tech
> Apple Professional Learning Specialist
> Apple Teacher
> (with Swift Playgrounds Recognition)
> Fort McMurray, AB Canada
> 
>> On Feb 3, 2022, at 11:53, 'Tim Kilburn' via MacVisionaries 
>> > > wrote:
>> 
>> Hi,
>> 
>> When it comes to the Search field, I prefer keyboard shortcuts.  So, to 
>> search for something, press cmd-f.  This will automatically take you to 
>> the search field.  After entering your information, press return.  
>> Often, VO will auto-jump over to the results.  If it doesn’t, try VO-j.
>> 
>> Some other hits for easier navigation and use:
>> 
>> • I change the view of my playlists to Song view as I find the columns 
>> that are created easier to navigate in/through.
>> • use VO-FN-left or VO-FN-right to quickly move to the first or last 
>> item in the Music window.  Sometimes, you need to hit the command twice.
>> • Use VO-cmd-t to quickly get to the sidebar table.
>> 
>> Know that there’s tons of keyboard shortcuts in the Music app.  Many of 
>> these are not commonly found in menus.
>> 
>> • space will play/pause the currently selected title.
>> • left/right arrow will do previous/next song.
>> • cmd-up or cmd-down will turn up/down the volume.
>> • press return to start playing when you’re focused on a song you wish 
>> to play.
>> • press cmd-right and hold to fast-forward within a song, cmd-left to 
>> rewind within.
>> 
>> Note that the above commands do not require VO keys at all, they are 
>> simply built-in Music media controls.  Also note that if you’ve moved 
>> out of the music app, or if you’ve brought VO focus to certain parts of 
>> the Music app screen, these commands may be unresponsive.  Just bring 
>> focus close to somewhere where the play button is and they’ll start 
>> working again.
>> 
>> HTH.
>> 
>> Later…
>> 
>> Tim Kilburn
>> Jamf Certified Tech
>> Apple Professional Learning Specialist
>> Apple Teacher
>> (with Swift Playgrounds Recognition)
>> Fort McMurray, AB Canada
>> 
>>> On Feb 3, 2022, at 11:05, Herbie Allen >> > wrote:
>>> 
>>> In regards to the  

Re: VO Jumping Out of Mail: Was - Improving music app experience

[Brian Hansen]

I’m running the latest MacOS, and it’s doing the same thing to me. I haven’t 
found a pattern to it as of yet, but it seems to be taking place when I delete 
a mail message after reading it.

> On Feb 4, 2022, at 12:31 PM, 'Tim Kilburn' via MacVisionaries 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hi,
> 
> Well, VO just jumped out of the Mail app a few seconds ago.  I guarantee that 
> I did not touch the Trackpad.  My left hand wasn’t even on my MBP, and I had 
> just hit the return key to open a Mail message with my right middle finger.  
> All other appendages weren’t even close to the Trackpad.  I also did some 
> testing yesterday and this morning, and even if I do touch the Trackpad 
> purposely with my thumb, it does not jump to the Finder like the behaviour 
> seems to do.
> 
> Oh well, if others can’t duplicate it, it’s just one of those things that 
> happens to some, but not others, and I’m the unlucky one this time :).
> 
> Later…
> 
> 
> Tim Kilburn
> Jamf Certified Tech
> Apple Professional Learning Specialist
> Apple Teacher
> (with Swift Playgrounds Recognition)
> Fort McMurray, AB Canada
> 
>> On Feb 3, 2022, at 14:41, Anders Holmberg > > wrote:
>> 
>> Hi!
>> I don’t have that issue as I am using an external keyboard.
>> Just because my hands are quite big I have to use an external one.
>> /A
>> 
>>> 3 feb. 2022 kl. 21:05 skrev Les Kriegler >> >:
>>> 
>>> I would agree with Brad‘s comments here. It is so easy to activate the 
>>> touchpad. I pay attention to it and it still happens on occasion.
>>> 
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>> 
 On Feb 3, 2022, at 9:14 AM, 'Tim Kilburn' via MacVisionaries 
 mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com>> 
 wrote:
 
 Hi,
 
 Correction to my shortcuts:
 
 •cmd-left and cmd-right do the same as using just the left or right 
 arrows.  The difference is that when you add the cmd key, the focus 
 location within the Music window is not as picky.
 • to fast-forward or rewind within a song, add the option key to the 
 above.  That is, cmd-option-left or cmd-option-right.
 
 Later…
 
 
 Tim Kilburn
 Jamf Certified Tech
 Apple Professional Learning Specialist
 Apple Teacher
 (with Swift Playgrounds Recognition)
 Fort McMurray, AB Canada
 
> On Feb 3, 2022, at 11:53, 'Tim Kilburn' via MacVisionaries 
>  > wrote:
> 
> Hi,
> 
> When it comes to the Search field, I prefer keyboard shortcuts.  So, to 
> search for something, press cmd-f.  This will automatically take you to 
> the search field.  After entering your information, press return.  Often, 
> VO will auto-jump over to the results.  If it doesn’t, try VO-j.
> 
> Some other hits for easier navigation and use:
> 
> • I change the view of my playlists to Song view as I find the columns 
> that are created easier to navigate in/through.
> • use VO-FN-left or VO-FN-right to quickly move to the first or last item 
> in the Music window.  Sometimes, you need to hit the command twice.
> • Use VO-cmd-t to quickly get to the sidebar table.
> 
> Know that there’s tons of keyboard shortcuts in the Music app.  Many of 
> these are not commonly found in menus.
> 
> • space will play/pause the currently selected title.
> • left/right arrow will do previous/next song.
> • cmd-up or cmd-down will turn up/down the volume.
> • press return to start playing when you’re focused on a song you wish to 
> play.
> • press cmd-right and hold to fast-forward within a song, cmd-left to 
> rewind within.
> 
> Note that the above commands do not require VO keys at all, they are 
> simply built-in Music media controls.  Also note that if you’ve moved out 
> of the music app, or if you’ve brought VO focus to certain parts of the 
> Music app screen, these commands may be unresponsive.  Just bring focus 
> close to somewhere where the play button is and they’ll start working 
> again.
> 
> HTH.
> 
> Later…
> 
> Tim Kilburn
> Jamf Certified Tech
> Apple Professional Learning Specialist
> Apple Teacher
> (with Swift Playgrounds Recognition)
> Fort McMurray, AB Canada
> 
>> On Feb 3, 2022, at 11:05, Herbie Allen > > wrote:
>> 
>> In regards to the  search, if you VO left back to the side bar and 
>> interact, you can find the search field again and VO space which should 
>> let you write.
>> 
>>> On Feb 3, 2022, at 11:56, Anders Holmberg >> > wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hi!
>>> The focus in general has gone worse.
>>> I can be reading an email and all of a sudden be in safari.
>>> Regarding the music app I don’t know.
>>> I can navigate it just fine by interacting with the sidebar and the 

Re: VO Jumping Out of Mail: Was - Improving music app experience

['Mervin Keck III' via MacVisionaries]

This has started happening to me on my M1 MBP ever since MonteRay. I don’t even 
have the track pad enabled because I do not generally use it. I like the Touch 
Bar and use it often but have never made a practice of using the track pad. I 
also never had this focus issue before MonteRay.
I just didn’t bother chiming in because experience has taught me that opinions 
will vary on certain topics and I am not going to change anyone’s mind with my 
experience.
Merv


> On Feb 4, 2022, at 1:31 PM, 'Tim Kilburn' via MacVisionaries 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hi,
> 
> Well, VO just jumped out of the Mail app a few seconds ago.  I guarantee that 
> I did not touch the Trackpad.  My left hand wasn’t even on my MBP, and I had 
> just hit the return key to open a Mail message with my right middle finger.  
> All other appendages weren’t even close to the Trackpad.  I also did some 
> testing yesterday and this morning, and even if I do touch the Trackpad 
> purposely with my thumb, it does not jump to the Finder like the behaviour 
> seems to do.
> 
> Oh well, if others can’t duplicate it, it’s just one of those things that 
> happens to some, but not others, and I’m the unlucky one this time :).
> 
> Later…
> 
> 
> Tim Kilburn
> Jamf Certified Tech
> Apple Professional Learning Specialist
> Apple Teacher
> (with Swift Playgrounds Recognition)
> Fort McMurray, AB Canada
> 
>> On Feb 3, 2022, at 14:41, Anders Holmberg > > wrote:
>> 
>> Hi!
>> I don’t have that issue as I am using an external keyboard.
>> Just because my hands are quite big I have to use an external one.
>> /A
>> 
>>> 3 feb. 2022 kl. 21:05 skrev Les Kriegler >> >:
>>> 
>>> I would agree with Brad‘s comments here. It is so easy to activate the 
>>> touchpad. I pay attention to it and it still happens on occasion.
>>> 
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>> 
 On Feb 3, 2022, at 9:14 AM, 'Tim Kilburn' via MacVisionaries 
 mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com>> 
 wrote:
 
 Hi,
 
 Correction to my shortcuts:
 
 •cmd-left and cmd-right do the same as using just the left or right 
 arrows.  The difference is that when you add the cmd key, the focus 
 location within the Music window is not as picky.
 • to fast-forward or rewind within a song, add the option key to the 
 above.  That is, cmd-option-left or cmd-option-right.
 
 Later…
 
 
 Tim Kilburn
 Jamf Certified Tech
 Apple Professional Learning Specialist
 Apple Teacher
 (with Swift Playgrounds Recognition)
 Fort McMurray, AB Canada
 
> On Feb 3, 2022, at 11:53, 'Tim Kilburn' via MacVisionaries 
>  > wrote:
> 
> Hi,
> 
> When it comes to the Search field, I prefer keyboard shortcuts.  So, to 
> search for something, press cmd-f.  This will automatically take you to 
> the search field.  After entering your information, press return.  Often, 
> VO will auto-jump over to the results.  If it doesn’t, try VO-j.
> 
> Some other hits for easier navigation and use:
> 
> • I change the view of my playlists to Song view as I find the columns 
> that are created easier to navigate in/through.
> • use VO-FN-left or VO-FN-right to quickly move to the first or last item 
> in the Music window.  Sometimes, you need to hit the command twice.
> • Use VO-cmd-t to quickly get to the sidebar table.
> 
> Know that there’s tons of keyboard shortcuts in the Music app.  Many of 
> these are not commonly found in menus.
> 
> • space will play/pause the currently selected title.
> • left/right arrow will do previous/next song.
> • cmd-up or cmd-down will turn up/down the volume.
> • press return to start playing when you’re focused on a song you wish to 
> play.
> • press cmd-right and hold to fast-forward within a song, cmd-left to 
> rewind within.
> 
> Note that the above commands do not require VO keys at all, they are 
> simply built-in Music media controls.  Also note that if you’ve moved out 
> of the music app, or if you’ve brought VO focus to certain parts of the 
> Music app screen, these commands may be unresponsive.  Just bring focus 
> close to somewhere where the play button is and they’ll start working 
> again.
> 
> HTH.
> 
> Later…
> 
> Tim Kilburn
> Jamf Certified Tech
> Apple Professional Learning Specialist
> Apple Teacher
> (with Swift Playgrounds Recognition)
> Fort McMurray, AB Canada
> 
>> On Feb 3, 2022, at 11:05, Herbie Allen > > wrote:
>> 
>> In regards to the  search, if you VO left back to the side bar and 
>> interact, you can find the search field again and VO space which should 
>> let you write.
>> 
>>> On Feb 3, 2022, at 11:56, Anders Holmberg >> 

VO Jumping Out of Mail: Was - Improving music app experience

['Tim Kilburn' via MacVisionaries]

Hi,

Well, VO just jumped out of the Mail app a few seconds ago.  I guarantee that I 
did not touch the Trackpad.  My left hand wasn’t even on my MBP, and I had just 
hit the return key to open a Mail message with my right middle finger.  All 
other appendages weren’t even close to the Trackpad.  I also did some testing 
yesterday and this morning, and even if I do touch the Trackpad purposely with 
my thumb, it does not jump to the Finder like the behaviour seems to do.

Oh well, if others can’t duplicate it, it’s just one of those things that 
happens to some, but not others, and I’m the unlucky one this time :).

Later…


Tim Kilburn
Jamf Certified Tech
Apple Professional Learning Specialist
Apple Teacher
(with Swift Playgrounds Recognition)
Fort McMurray, AB Canada

> On Feb 3, 2022, at 14:41, Anders Holmberg  wrote:
> 
> Hi!
> I don’t have that issue as I am using an external keyboard.
> Just because my hands are quite big I have to use an external one.
> /A
> 
>> 3 feb. 2022 kl. 21:05 skrev Les Kriegler > >:
>> 
>> I would agree with Brad‘s comments here. It is so easy to activate the 
>> touchpad. I pay attention to it and it still happens on occasion.
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>>> On Feb 3, 2022, at 9:14 AM, 'Tim Kilburn' via MacVisionaries 
>>> mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com>> 
>>> wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hi,
>>> 
>>> Correction to my shortcuts:
>>> 
>>> •cmd-left and cmd-right do the same as using just the left or right arrows. 
>>>  The difference is that when you add the cmd key, the focus location within 
>>> the Music window is not as picky.
>>> • to fast-forward or rewind within a song, add the option key to the above. 
>>>  That is, cmd-option-left or cmd-option-right.
>>> 
>>> Later…
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Tim Kilburn
>>> Jamf Certified Tech
>>> Apple Professional Learning Specialist
>>> Apple Teacher
>>> (with Swift Playgrounds Recognition)
>>> Fort McMurray, AB Canada
>>> 
 On Feb 3, 2022, at 11:53, 'Tim Kilburn' via MacVisionaries 
 mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com>> 
 wrote:
 
 Hi,
 
 When it comes to the Search field, I prefer keyboard shortcuts.  So, to 
 search for something, press cmd-f.  This will automatically take you to 
 the search field.  After entering your information, press return.  Often, 
 VO will auto-jump over to the results.  If it doesn’t, try VO-j.
 
 Some other hits for easier navigation and use:
 
 • I change the view of my playlists to Song view as I find the columns 
 that are created easier to navigate in/through.
 • use VO-FN-left or VO-FN-right to quickly move to the first or last item 
 in the Music window.  Sometimes, you need to hit the command twice.
 • Use VO-cmd-t to quickly get to the sidebar table.
 
 Know that there’s tons of keyboard shortcuts in the Music app.  Many of 
 these are not commonly found in menus.
 
 • space will play/pause the currently selected title.
 • left/right arrow will do previous/next song.
 • cmd-up or cmd-down will turn up/down the volume.
 • press return to start playing when you’re focused on a song you wish to 
 play.
 • press cmd-right and hold to fast-forward within a song, cmd-left to 
 rewind within.
 
 Note that the above commands do not require VO keys at all, they are 
 simply built-in Music media controls.  Also note that if you’ve moved out 
 of the music app, or if you’ve brought VO focus to certain parts of the 
 Music app screen, these commands may be unresponsive.  Just bring focus 
 close to somewhere where the play button is and they’ll start working 
 again.
 
 HTH.
 
 Later…
 
 Tim Kilburn
 Jamf Certified Tech
 Apple Professional Learning Specialist
 Apple Teacher
 (with Swift Playgrounds Recognition)
 Fort McMurray, AB Canada
 
> On Feb 3, 2022, at 11:05, Herbie Allen  > wrote:
> 
> In regards to the  search, if you VO left back to the side bar and 
> interact, you can find the search field again and VO space which should 
> let you write.
> 
>> On Feb 3, 2022, at 11:56, Anders Holmberg > > wrote:
>> 
>> Hi!
>> The focus in general has gone worse.
>> I can be reading an email and all of a sudden be in safari.
>> Regarding the music app I don’t know.
>> I can navigate it just fine by interacting with the sidebar and the grid.
>> The worst  thing in the music app is the search field.
>> When I do a search I have to stop interacting a lot of times to get to 
>> the result.
>> And I can’t do another search without first closing the app and restart 
>> it.
>> But its just me who don’t know how to handle it.
>> Also VoiceOver is not made for braille users which just is not good.
>> /A
>> 
>>> 3 feb. 2022 kl. 17:48 skrev 'Kristeen 

Re: Sharing Current Page?

[Phil Halton]

There is a “share “sub menu under the “file “menu in Safari. This is the 
equivalent of the iOS share sheet where you can share via email , Text messages 
, AirDrop, etc.
Sent from my IPhone


> On Feb 4, 2022, at 2:34 AM, Fazil M.  wrote:
> 
> 
> Actually, when I was thinking about sharing that webpage that I did, I did 
> the same way that you have described in your message — Command-l, and command 
> v.
> Thanks!
>  
> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com  On 
> Behalf Of Lorie McCloud
> Sent: Thursday, February 03, 2022 9:47 PM
> To: via MacVisionaries 
> Subject: Re: Sharing Current Page?
>  
> Are you saying that you press command-i within the email message or on the 
> web page you want to share? I would assume that you would have email open as 
> well as Safari if you were doing this. is that correct?
> 
> 
> On Feb 3, 2022, at 9:56 PM, Jonathan Cohn  wrote:
>  
> Hello,
> If you want to share via e-mail (at least for me) the keystroke is command-I 
> (eye)  will do this. 
> Note once mail is launched and you are in the message, there should be a 
> pop-up menu asking how you want to share. Choices might include 
> FUll web page
> PDF
> Link 
> Reader view 
>  
> For those sites where Safari has a reader view, it usually default to that.
> Also, there is a "share button" in the tool bar of most applications 
> including Safari and that there should also be a share sub-menu in the File 
> menu .
>  
> Best wishes,
> 
> Jonathan Cohn
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On Feb 3, 2022, at 21:07, Fazil M.  wrote:
>  
> Hi, Group.
> How can I share the current page that I am on in Safari?
> Thanks!
>  
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Re: VO command to make any window expand to its largest size

['Tim Kilburn' via MacVisionaries]

Hi,

I’d agree with you that it should only pertain to those VO users who are 
partially sighted.  In the old days of not so reliable or robust scree readers, 
you sometimes needed to rearrange windows like that because overlapping windows 
had odd behaviour when trying to read.  This is no longer the case with VO and 
the newer OS’s.

Later…


Tim Kilburn
Jamf Certified Tech
Apple Professional Learning Specialist
Apple Teacher
(with Swift Playgrounds Recognition)
Fort McMurray, AB Canada

> On Feb 3, 2022, at 23:54, Jürgen Fleger  wrote:
> 
> Hi Tim,
> very interesting. 
> I always wondered why a VO user could want to move a window. Would you aggree 
> this is only useful if you are partially sighted? Or is there anything I 
> don't understand? 
> Thanks and all the best
> Jürgen 
> .
> 
> Von meinem iPhone gesendet
> 
>> Am 03.02.2022 um 23:14 schrieb 'Tim Kilburn' via MacVisionaries 
>> mailto:Macvisionaries@googlegroups.com>>:
>> 
>> Hi,
>> 
>> Further to my previous notes on this, see the following Apple article for 
>> specific VO commands related to window manipulation:
>> 
>> https://support.apple.com/en-ca/guide/voiceover/mchlp2709/mac 
>> 
>> 
>> In looking at these, I don’t believe there is a specific command within 
>> VoiceOver itself for what you asked.
>> 
>> Later…
>> 
>> 
>> Tim Kilburn
>> Jamf Certified Tech
>> Apple Professional Learning Specialist
>> Apple Teacher
>> (with Swift Playgrounds Recognition)
>> Fort McMurray, AB Canada
>> 
>>> On Feb 3, 2022, at 15:05, Tim Kilburn >> > wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hi,
>>> 
>>> Cmd-ctrl-f will put the window into Full Screen.  Alternatively, in some 
>>> windows, you’ll find the Close, Minimize and Zoom buttons as the first 
>>> items on the screen.  Use VO-FN-left then VO-left to move to the Full 
>>> Screen, Zoom, Minimize and Close buttons.  Some windows do not have the 
>>> Zoom option, just the Full Screen.  Zoom normally expands/collapses the 
>>> window between its current size and as big as it would fit on the screen 
>>> while still having the menubar visible.  Full Screen visually takes away 
>>> the menu bar as well and uses the entire screen to display the window.  The 
>>> same cmd-ctrl-f command will toggle it out of Full Screen mode.
>>> 
>>> Not sure if this is what you’re looking for, but it may help.
>>> 
>>> Later…
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Tim Kilburn
>>> Jamf Certified Tech
>>> Apple Professional Learning Specialist
>>> Apple Teacher
>>> (with Swift Playgrounds Recognition)
>>> Fort McMurray, AB Canada
>>> 
 On Feb 3, 2022, at 14:57, Chuck Reichel >>> > wrote:
 
 Hi List,
 I need to make some windows larger or zoomed to their biggest size.
 I know that VO tilde and VO shift tilde moves in small increments up or 
 down or left or right but I need to make the whole window grow to its 
 largest size to access certain menus in my pro tools plugin windows.
 What is the command to make any window expand to its largest size please?
 Thanks
 Chuck
 
 
 
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>>> 
>> 
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Re: Why Is Mac Not Reading It? FW: ब्रेकिंग न्यूज़ समाचार, ताजा खबर | News, latest news, breaking news - BBC News हिंदी

['Tim Kilburn' via MacVisionaries]

Hi,

Press VO-cmd-shift-right or left until you hear VO announce “Voice”.  Then, 
continue holding down VO-cmd-shift and press the up or down, usually the up 
once, to hear VO announce “Automatically select based on language”.  That 
should do it.

Later…


Tim Kilburn
Jamf Certified Tech
Apple Professional Learning Specialist
Apple Teacher
(with Swift Playgrounds Recognition)
Fort McMurray, AB Canada

> On Feb 3, 2022, at 19:55, Fazil M.  wrote:
> 
> Ok, let me look at it.
> Thanks again.
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com  On 
> Behalf Of Lorie McCloud
> Sent: Thursday, February 03, 2022 6:34 PM
> To: via MacVisionaries 
> Subject: Re: Why Is Mac Not Reading It? FW: ब्रेकिंग न्यूज़ समाचार, ताजा खबर 
> | News, latest news, breaking news - BBC News हिंदी
> 
> my mac reads it. it must be a setting some place. maybe in vo utility.
> 
>> On Feb 3, 2022, at 8:05 PM, Fazil M.  wrote:
>> 
>> Hi, Group.
>> This is BBC Hindi website. iPhone is reading it in Hindi just fine, why is 
>> Mac not reading it?
>> I have added Hindi and Arabic in Voiceover Utility.
>> Thanks!
>> 
>> Subject: ब्रेकिंग न्यूज़ समाचार, ताजा खबर | News, latest news, breaking news 
>> - BBC News हिंदी
>> 
>> 
>> https://www.bbc.com/hindi
>> 
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
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