Re: [maemo-developers] Re: About Ubuntu installer import into Rosetta
ਸ਼ੁੱਕਰਵਾਰ 17 ਮਾਰਚ 2006 20:18 ਨੂੰ, Koen Kooi ਨੇ ਲਿਖਿਆ: > A S Alam wrote: > > ਸ਼ੁੱਕਰਵਾਰ 17 ਮਾਰਚ 2006 18:32 ਨੂੰ, Christian Perrier ਨੇ ਲਿਖਿਆ: > >>>I can only say that it's Punjabi translators decision which option > >>>should we get and, if possible a decision take from both sides. > >>> > >>>Amanpreet do you think that you would reach an agreement on this? > >> > >>Well, at least *I* now do agree that we should revert back to "pa" as > >>the main reason I had for using pa_PK vanishes. > >> > >>As a consequence, I hereby propose changing ALL pa_IN.po translation > >>files to pa.po, first in Debianand then do what's needed in Ubuntu > >>and Rosetta. > >> > >>This needs first me to change the D-I files. Then change all files in > >>repositories I have access toand finally report bugs to packages > >>that have a pa_IN file but where I don't have commit access to the > >>repository (actually, it seems to be there is none..:-))). > >> > >>Anyone disagreeing? > > > > No > > > > thanks > > > >>I would also take care of coordinating with Dennis Stampfer for d-i > >>status pages, and Davide Viti for the spellchecker. > > Could anyone explain how this is related to the maemo-developers list? > I m really sorry about this mistake, I acpect my mistake and assure that, this will not happen is future. regards -- A S Alam "Either find a way or make one" ___ maemo-developers mailing list maemo-developers@maemo.org https://maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-developers
[maemo-developers] Re: About Ubuntu installer import into Rosetta
ਸ਼ੁੱਕਰਵਾਰ 17 ਮਾਰਚ 2006 18:32 ਨੂੰ, Christian Perrier ਨੇ ਲਿਖਿਆ: > > I can only say that it's Punjabi translators decision which option > > should we get and, if possible a decision take from both sides. > > > > Amanpreet do you think that you would reach an agreement on this? > > Well, at least *I* now do agree that we should revert back to "pa" as > the main reason I had for using pa_PK vanishes. > > As a consequence, I hereby propose changing ALL pa_IN.po translation > files to pa.po, first in Debianand then do what's needed in Ubuntu > and Rosetta. > > This needs first me to change the D-I files. Then change all files in > repositories I have access toand finally report bugs to packages > that have a pa_IN file but where I don't have commit access to the > repository (actually, it seems to be there is none..:-))). > > Anyone disagreeing? No thanks > > I would also take care of coordinating with Dennis Stampfer for d-i > status pages, and Davide Viti for the spellchecker. -- A S Alam "Either find a way or make one" ___ maemo-developers mailing list maemo-developers@maemo.org https://maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-developers
[maemo-developers] Re: About Ubuntu installer import into Rosetta
ਸ਼ੁੱਕਰਵਾਰ 17 ਮਾਰਚ 2006 16:03 ਨੂੰ, Carlos Perelló Marín ਨੇ ਲਿਖਿਆ: > On Fri, 2006-03-17 at 15:34 +0530, A S Alam wrote: > [...] > > > > 3) Use [EMAIL PROTECTED] and [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > > > In both cases, the future Western Pnjabi translations will use "pnb" > > > (they'll need the locale for this...but anyway they will DO need a > > > locale) > > > > > > 1) is a bit complicated as it requires all projects to progressively > > > change. It is however more consistent in logn term with ISO 639-3 > > > > > > 2) is simpler but has the inconvenience of > > > possible political feelings hurted for PK people who could claim that > > > "pa" has been kinda "stolen" > > > > > > I don't favour 3) because the difference are actually not only in two > > > ways of writing the same language. > > > > but it is, Punjabi is SAME language but ONLY way to write is different. > > Then I think we should go for that option. That's what Serbian already > does. I don't know the political implications in this case, but Serbian > uses 'sr' as the locale for the main way to write it and [EMAIL PROTECTED] > for the > other. > that will nice and I agree for this! > I can only say that it's Punjabi translators decision which option > should we get and, if possible a decision take from both sides. > > Amanpreet do you think that you would reach an agreement on this? > Thing is that there is only ONE Team exist, which is for Eastern Punjabi (our Team), no other translator yet start work for Western Punjabi. so, I don't think there will be need any agreement. regards > Cheers. > > > > As you see both my proposals actually need changing things in D-I > > > anyway..:-) > > > > regards > > > > > An alternative proposal is not changing anything...with the > > > inconvenience of not being able to handle D-I/Ubuntu installer > > > translations easily in Rosetta (well, given that Rosetta is not free > > > software, that's actually not my main concern). -- A S Alam "Either find a way or make one" ___ maemo-developers mailing list maemo-developers@maemo.org https://maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-developers
[maemo-developers] Re: About Ubuntu installer import into Rosetta
ਸ਼ੁੱਕਰਵਾਰ 17 ਮਾਰਚ 2006 16:02 ਨੂੰ, Jordi Mallach ਨੇ ਲਿਖਿਆ: > On Fri, Mar 17, 2006 at 03:34:53PM +0530, A S Alam wrote: > > > 1) rename ALL current pa or pa_IN translations to "pan". This needs: > > > - create a pan_IN locale > > > - change the PO file name in all projects (either pa->pan or > > >pa_IN->pan) > > > - have users switch from pa_IN locale environments to pan_IN > > > > +1 > > > > > 2) keep pa for Eastern Punjabi. This means: > > > - rename D-I translations from pa_IN to pa > > > - slightly change the localechooser > > > > but this is most widely used in projects, it may be very difficult to > > change in all projects > > You mean "pa" is widely used in projects, right? As far as I can tell, I > only have "pa" translations installed in my sid box. > > > > I don't favour 3) because the difference are actually not only in two > > > ways of writing the same language. > > > > but it is, Punjabi is SAME language but ONLY way to write is different. > > We seem to have two views on this. Christian says there's big > divergences between Western and Easter Punjabi, but you say it's just > the script. > sorry, but that is true, I m from Eastern Punjabi (pa) and able to Understand what Western Punjabi person will SPEAK, but not able to Read and Reverse is True this is about Punjabi Language http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Punjabi_language this is People of Punjab (means speaker) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Punjabis > If that's true, we can just go with a charset modificator for western. > We need to be sure, though. > > If not necessary, I would try to avoid changing the current status quo > for Eastern Punjabi, ie, keep using "pa" unless there's a strong reason > not to. > I agree with this regards > Jordi -- A S Alam "Either find a way or make one" ___ maemo-developers mailing list maemo-developers@maemo.org https://maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-developers
[maemo-developers] Re: About Ubuntu installer import into Rosetta
ਸ਼ੁੱਕਰਵਾਰ 17 ਮਾਰਚ 2006 11:18 ਨੂੰ, Christian Perrier ਨੇ ਲਿਖਿਆ: > > > If I had to make a decision now wrt d-i, I would stick to "pa" for what > > > we have now, as it's what is widely spread at the moment. Is there any > > > known [EMAIL PROTECTED] translation group out there at the moment? > > > > no, Not at a single place, but our team > > (http://punlinux.sourceforge.net/) are under progess for planning of > > that. Yet Locale itself is not defined for "[EMAIL PROTECTED]" > > > > I forgot to mention about locale defined in glib, there is only > > Punjabi (Eastern) is defined as "pa", but Punjabi (Western) NO. > > > > so, we have time to work now:) > > Well, I'm not sure I follow you here, and properly understand your > point. > > Are you mentioning that the Punjabi team also plans working on Western > Punjabi translations at some moment? > > Anyway, it seems to me that the two choices we have are: > > 1) rename ALL current pa or pa_IN translations to "pan". This needs: > - create a pan_IN locale > - change the PO file name in all projects (either pa->pan or >pa_IN->pan) > - have users switch from pa_IN locale environments to pan_IN > +1 > 2) keep pa for Eastern Punjabi. This means: > - rename D-I translations from pa_IN to pa > - slightly change the localechooser > but this is most widely used in projects, it may be very difficult to change in all projects > 3) Use [EMAIL PROTECTED] and [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > In both cases, the future Western Pnjabi translations will use "pnb" > (they'll need the locale for this...but anyway they will DO need a > locale) > > 1) is a bit complicated as it requires all projects to progressively > change. It is however more consistent in logn term with ISO 639-3 > > 2) is simpler but has the inconvenience of > possible political feelings hurted for PK people who could claim that > "pa" has been kinda "stolen" > > I don't favour 3) because the difference are actually not only in two > ways of writing the same language. > but it is, Punjabi is SAME language but ONLY way to write is different. > As you see both my proposals actually need changing things in D-I > anyway..:-) regards > > An alternative proposal is not changing anything...with the > inconvenience of not being able to handle D-I/Ubuntu installer > translations easily in Rosetta (well, given that Rosetta is not free > software, that's actually not my main concern). -- A S Alam "Either find a way or make one" ___ maemo-developers mailing list maemo-developers@maemo.org https://maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-developers
[maemo-developers] Re: About Ubuntu installer import into Rosetta
ਵੀਰਵਾਰ 16 ਮਾਰਚ 2006 21:36 ਨੂੰ, Jordi Mallach ਨੇ ਲਿਖਿਆ: > Hi everyone, > > On Thu, Mar 16, 2006 at 04:48:46PM +0100, Christian Perrier wrote: > > We did choose pa_IN because Punjabi can either be written with the > > Gurmukhi script (Indic-style script, used in Punjab/India) or using an > > Perso-Arabic script, use in Pakistan. > > > > So, the difference is pretty much similar to the zh_CN/zh_TW > > difference: two different ways to *write* the same language. > > > > However, here, the difference is more subtle as Punjabi is also > > *spoken* differently in India and Pakistan. I remember Amanpreet > > explaining me that he actually cannot understand Punjabi spoken by > > people from Pakistan. > > > > So, the conclusion was using pa_IN for Punjabi (Gurmukhi) and leave > > pa_PK for Punjabi (Perso-Arabic). > > Ok, that makes is pretty complicated. > > We need to consider that projects seem to be using the simple "pa" > namespace already. GNOME and KDE use "pa" for its Punjabi translations, > and many are contributed by [EMAIL PROTECTED] (I guess that makes them > somehow offiically endorsed by RH/Fedora). > yes, I m Amanpreet Singh Alam working in Red Hat and translating most community projects for Punjabi (Gurmukhi, Eastern), and I don't think anything bad if I m working in Red Hat, but Important thing is that We have Punjabi translation available:) > By the looks of the script, it totally looks like the Indian variant. > msgid "Ellipses (Translucent)" > msgstr "ਅੰਡਾਕਾਰ (ਕਲਪਨਿਕ)" yes, only Indian Variant is active now and there is no singal for Western soon > > > Another way to make the difference (but it would involve writing the > > appropriate locales) would be using the names "Punjabi (Eastern)" and > > "Punjabi (Western)" and there, use the two different ISO 639-3 codes: > > > > pnb==Punjabi (Western) > > pan==Punjabi (Eastern) == the current pa_IN > I don't think so, because langs are same, but writing scripts are different, so I suppose like pa, [EMAIL PROTECTED] =pa_IN (Eastern Punjabi) [EMAIL PROTECTED] (parien)=Punjabi (Western) > Looks like a compromise to me, but this needs to be accepted, imo, > globally by all translation teams, or at least the major players, or > it'll be a mess. > yes, Now Also have to select something reasonable CODE. > If I had to make a decision now wrt d-i, I would stick to "pa" for what > we have now, as it's what is widely spread at the moment. Is there any > known [EMAIL PROTECTED] translation group out there at the moment? > no, Not at a single place, but our team (http://punlinux.sourceforge.net/) are under progess for planning of that. Yet Locale itself is not defined for "[EMAIL PROTECTED]" I forgot to mention about locale defined in glib, there is only Punjabi (Eastern) is defined as "pa", but Punjabi (Western) NO. so, we have time to work now:) thanks > > PS: no need to tell you, folks, that severe political consequences are > > involved here. > > Yeah, don't tell me about it. We live in Valencia, the land of the > blaveros ;) > > Jordi -- A S Alam "Either find a way or make one" ___ maemo-developers mailing list maemo-developers@maemo.org https://maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-developers
[maemo-developers] Re: About Ubuntu installer import into Rosetta
ਵੀਰਵਾਰ 16 ਮਾਰਚ 2006 21:35 ਨੂੰ, Carlos Perelló Marín ਨੇ ਲਿਖਿਆ: > On Thu, 2006-03-16 at 16:48 +0100, Christian Perrier wrote: > > CC'ing Amanpreet Singh Alam, the Punjabi translator. Amanpreet, this > > comes from a discussion between Ubuntu i18n people (Carlos, Jordi), > > Calin Watson as responsible for the Ubuntu installer...and very active > > member of the Debian installer team...and myself. > > > > > I seem to recall having a discussion with Christian and others about > > > why it was called pa_IN once before, and getting what seemed to me at > > > the time to be a reasonable answer, but I don't recall the details. > > > Christian, do you remember? > > > > Yes. > > > > We did choose pa_IN because Punjabi can either be written with the > > Gurmukhi script (Indic-style script, used in Punjab/India) or using an > > Perso-Arabic script, use in Pakistan. > > > > So, the difference is pretty much similar to the zh_CN/zh_TW > > difference: two different ways to *write* the same language. > > that is All for Eastern and Western Punjabi http://www.omniglot.com/writing/gurmuki.htm > > However, here, the difference is more subtle as Punjabi is also > > *spoken* differently in India and Pakistan. I remember Amanpreet > > explaining me that he actually cannot understand Punjabi spoken by > > people from Pakistan. > > > > So, the conclusion was using pa_IN for Punjabi (Gurmukhi) and leave > > pa_PK for Punjabi (Perso-Arabic). > > It's a really good argument. I wonder how is that current Ubuntu's > Punjabi team didn't say anything about it or the GNOME team (that seems > to be translated by Amanpreet Singh Alam... I'm confused) both teams > decided to use 'pa' directly... > ok, I want to clarify Current status for Punjabi Translation with "pa" locale (@all projects" Means Punjabi (Gurmukhi) pa_IN only. so till now my idea is same pa->pa_IN and if new team want to start work on [EMAIL PROTECTED] script, then they can use pa_PK (something like that) > Amanpreet, could you give us some input on this? we should be using > always the same language code and if the 'pa' one should not be used at > all, we should fix GNOME to follow that too... > if you think, that it will be more useful and reasonable for Future, then I have no objection, we (Punjabi Team) will help to start effort for changes. But still I believe that there will be no objection on using "pa". > > Another way to make the difference (but it would involve writing the > > appropriate locales) would be using the names "Punjabi (Eastern)" and > > "Punjabi (Western)" and there, use the two different ISO 639-3 codes: > > > > pnb==Punjabi (Western) > > pan==Punjabi (Eastern) == the current pa_IN > > If that possibility exists... I think we should go with it so people > don't start translating for pa_IN, pa_* and pa duplicating the efforts. > > > Given that the translation is not really used right now in D-I, we > > still have time to make our mindsas long as we write a locale for > > "pan_IN" as an exact copy of the current pa_IN > > > > PS: no need to tell you, folks, that severe political consequences are > > involved here. > > Yeah, I see the issue. But I'm confused that the same person is > translating to different language codes for the same language... > Amanpreet, am I missing something? > before starting my work on projects, "pa" was accpected to most projects (gnome is one for those) I just tried to make specfic to my region for new projects (like debian) with pa_IN, I welcome all your suggestion and promise to cooperative on issue > Cheers. regards -- A S Alam "Either find a way or make one" ___ maemo-developers mailing list maemo-developers@maemo.org https://maemo.org/mailman/listinfo/maemo-developers
