[Mailman-Users] Re: List Archives
At 11:17 PM 8/28/2022, Stephen J. Turnbull wrote: David Andrews writes: > I want to delete some lists, but would like to save the archives. > Pipermail saves by month, as I have it configured. Is there a way to > obtain an entire archive at once? Are there tools to convert the > MBOX format to something non-technical people can deal with easily? Exactly what is your use case? What do you mean by "obtain"? What do you mean by "non-technical people deal"? I suspect "obtain" means something you don't need to do, and "non-technical people deal" means "click to read". If so, the answer is basically "delete the list, don't delete the archive". That's easiest for the users since they just go to the same place. Best of all the site admin doesn't have to do much of anything besides delete the list configuration file, and possibly edit the MTA config.[1] Note that this can create backscatter (mail rejection notices to third parties0, but that's no different from any other non-existent address at your server. The only problem is if the archives are "members only", because deleting the list would also delete their credentials. Since in an important sense the membership database *is* the list, in that case, you don't want to delete the list, you want to disable delivery and access to the administrative interfaces. There are several ways to do those things, and some vary according to the MTA. They have subtly different consequences for what happens if somebody tries to post to the list or subscribe to it. The one you're most likely to care about is "the post disappears into a black hole and the member is distressed," but some of them can create backscatter in the case of spammers. Thanks everyone. This all sounds reasonable except it also identifies another problem we are having. There is no good search method in place. I installed search several years back, I can't remember what it was called off the top of my head. It broke something in cPanel, and their support basically said remove search or you get no support from us. So leaving archives in place long term, without a good search method doesn't make much sense. Also the organizations librarian wants the archives for historic and other reasons, so leaving them here won't satisfy that. Dave -- Mailman-Users mailing list -- mailman-users@python.org To unsubscribe send an email to mailman-users-le...@python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman3/lists/mailman-users.python.org/ Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 Searchable Archives: https://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users@python.org/ https://mail.python.org/archives/list/mailman-users@python.org/
[Mailman-Users] List Archives
David Andrews writes: > I want to delete some lists, but would like to save the archives. > Pipermail saves by month, as I have it configured. Is there a way to > obtain an entire archive at once? Are there tools to convert the > MBOX format to something non-technical people can deal with easily? Exactly what is your use case? What do you mean by "obtain"? What do you mean by "non-technical people deal"? I suspect "obtain" means something you don't need to do, and "non-technical people deal" means "click to read". If so, the answer is basically "delete the list, don't delete the archive". That's easiest for the users since they just go to the same place. Best of all the site admin doesn't have to do much of anything besides delete the list configuration file, and possibly edit the MTA config.[1] Note that this can create backscatter (mail rejection notices to third parties0, but that's no different from any other non-existent address at your server. The only problem is if the archives are "members only", because deleting the list would also delete their credentials. Since in an important sense the membership database *is* the list, in that case, you don't want to delete the list, you want to disable delivery and access to the administrative interfaces. There are several ways to do those things, and some vary according to the MTA. They have subtly different consequences for what happens if somebody tries to post to the list or subscribe to it. The one you're most likely to care about is "the post disappears into a black hole and the member is distressed," but some of them can create backscatter in the case of spammers. Footnotes: [1] In the usual configuration for Exim4, Exim checks for lists/$NAME/config.pck, and if it's there, routes mail for $NAME to Mailman. Nothing to do once you delete config.pck. Postfix OTOH usually needs you to run a script to update the aliases. -- Mailman-Users mailing list -- mailman-users@python.org To unsubscribe send an email to mailman-users-le...@python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman3/lists/mailman-users.python.org/ Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 Searchable Archives: https://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users@python.org/ https://mail.python.org/archives/list/mailman-users@python.org/
[Mailman-Users] Re: AOL list member not receiving list traffic
Less than a year ago, AOL started silently dumping dozens of emails on a list. We reduced the number of emails per connection and the problem ceased. Yes, AOL is obtuse, and once mail is accepted by AOL, only internal AOL logs are going to tell the story. You could send logs to list members individually and have them contact AOL. On 2022/08/27 01:36 AM, Jayson Smith wrote: Hi, Yesterday I received a report from an AOL user that she's not receiving traffic from one of my lists. The problem here is that my server logs show outgoing mail being accepted by AOL's incoming mail servers, and of course after that it's anyone's guess what happens to them. She says she's checked her junkmail folder and the messages aren't there. Does anyone have any thoughts on this? Is AOL known to silently discard mail they think is spam for some reason? I replied to her message from the same server and she did receive that reply, so they haven't outright blocked my IP or something. Even if I could contact someone who knows what they're doing at AOL, there are no error logs for me to show. Jayson -- Mailman-Users mailing list -- mailman-users@python.org To unsubscribe send an email to mailman-users-le...@python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman3/lists/mailman-users.python.org/ Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 Searchable Archives: https://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users@python.org/ https://mail.python.org/archives/list/mailman-users@python.org/ -- Mailman-Users mailing list -- mailman-users@python.org To unsubscribe send an email to mailman-users-le...@python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman3/lists/mailman-users.python.org/ Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 Searchable Archives: https://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users@python.org/ https://mail.python.org/archives/list/mailman-users@python.org/
[Mailman-Users] Re: List Archives
On 8/28/22 1:28 PM, David Andrews wrote: I manage a bunch of Mailman lists. We are on 2.1.38 cPanel, and I do have access to the command line. I want to delete some lists, but would like to save the archives. Pipermail saves by month, as I have it configured. Is there a way to obtain an entire archive at once? Are there tools to convert the MBOX format to something non-technical people can deal with easily? You can delete a list and retain the archive. If the pipermail archive is public, it will still be accessible. If it's private, it will be there, but won't be accessible because there's no list to authenticate against. I don't know if the cPanel list removal tool allows keeping the archive, but ``` /usr/local/cpanel/3rdparty/mailman/bin/rmlist LISTNAME ``` will remove the list and not the archives. In cPanel, the entire archive mbox for LISTNAME is at /usr/local/cpanel/3rdparty/mailman/archives/private/LISTNAME.mbox/LISTNAME.mbox. Mant MUAs, e.g. mutt, can deal with mbox files. -- Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, Californiabetter use your sense - B. Dylan -- Mailman-Users mailing list -- mailman-users@python.org To unsubscribe send an email to mailman-users-le...@python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman3/lists/mailman-users.python.org/ Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 Searchable Archives: https://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users@python.org/ https://mail.python.org/archives/list/mailman-users@python.org/
[Mailman-Users] List Archives
I manage a bunch of Mailman lists. We are on 2.1.38 cPanel, and I do have access to the command line. I want to delete some lists, but would like to save the archives. Pipermail saves by month, as I have it configured. Is there a way to obtain an entire archive at once? Are there tools to convert the MBOX format to something non-technical people can deal with easily? Thanks! Dave -- Mailman-Users mailing list -- mailman-users@python.org To unsubscribe send an email to mailman-users-le...@python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman3/lists/mailman-users.python.org/ Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 Searchable Archives: https://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users@python.org/ https://mail.python.org/archives/list/mailman-users@python.org/
[Mailman-Users] Re: AOL list member not receiving list traffic
On 08/28/22 16:22, Michael Reeder -- Hygeia MS wrote: > Oh bloody heck -- I see I had about 8 aol.com addresses bounce on > 8/13/22 -- so I likely have this problem too! > > I think I have have dkim and spf set up properly, but who knows. I > have seen the tutorals on this list (thanks). Also the munge > settings. I'll go look for SMTP_MAX_RCPTS and set it to 5. A few sites will test dkim and spf. Here is one: https://www.mail-tester.com/spf-dkim-check But it sounds like the problem is elsewhere. -- Jonathan Baron, Professor of Psychology, University of Pennsylvania Home page: https://www.sas.upenn.edu/~baron Founding Editor: Judgment and Decision Making (http://journal.sjdm.org) -- Mailman-Users mailing list -- mailman-users@python.org To unsubscribe send an email to mailman-users-le...@python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman3/lists/mailman-users.python.org/ Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 Searchable Archives: https://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users@python.org/ https://mail.python.org/archives/list/mailman-users@python.org/
[Mailman-Users] Re: AOL list member not receiving list traffic
Oh bloody heck -- I see I had about 8 aol.com addresses bounce on 8/13/22 -- so I likely have this problem too! I think I have have dkim and spf set up properly, but who knows. I have seen the tutorals on this list (thanks). Also the munge settings. I'll go look for SMTP_MAX_RCPTS and set it to 5. My yahoo.com members are receiving email just fine (lots of older people on my list). Gmail is no longer getting yellow boxes after Dream Host made an spf change for me. *Michael Reeder, LCPC * *Hygeia Counseling Services : Baltimore / Mt. Washington Village location* *410-871-TALK / michael(at)hygeiacounseling.com* On 8/27/2022 9:16 AM, Jon Baron wrote: On 08/27/22 08:38, Robert Heller wrote: At Sat, 27 Aug 2022 01:36:26 -0400 Jayson Smith wrote: Hi, Yesterday I received a report from an AOL user that she's not receiving traffic from one of my lists. The problem here is that my server logs show outgoing mail being accepted by AOL's incoming mail servers, and of course after that it's anyone's guess what happens to them. She says she's checked her junkmail folder and the messages aren't there. Does anyone have any thoughts on this? Is AOL known to silently discard mail they think is spam for some reason? I replied to her message from the same server and she did receive that reply, so they haven't outright blocked my IP or something. Even if I could contact someone who knows what they're doing at AOL, there are no error logs for me to show. AOL got absorbed into Yahoo, which in turn got absorbed into Verizon, which in turn split off Yahoo mail to a holding company. So, yeah, it is anyone's guess what is happening off in Yahoo-mail land. *Yahoo* is known to greylist mailling list posts, either because Yahoo thinks they are spam or simply because it is getting too many messages from a given source. If the latter, configuring mailman to send fewer messages at a time might help. Question: are there other people on your list with any of these addresses: @yahoo.com @verizon.net @aol.com @netscape.com FWIW, I have 99 yahoo.com members on my largest list (4300 total), 13 aol.com, and 3 verizon.net. I never have problems with these, not even gray listing (which is not terrible when it happens, since the post is eventually delivered). I do have SMTP_MAX_RCPTS set to 5, which may help. I also have dkim and spf set up properly. That said, my problems with all Microsoft addresses (outlook, hotmail, live, ssn) were so bad that finally I just abolished them from the list. But this was not a problem specific to Mailman. Jon -- Mailman-Users mailing list -- mailman-users@python.org To unsubscribe send an email to mailman-users-le...@python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman3/lists/mailman-users.python.org/ Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 Searchable Archives: https://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users@python.org/ https://mail.python.org/archives/list/mailman-users@python.org/
[Mailman-Users] Re: AT Blocking (was AOL list member not receiving list traffic)
I should mention that for the free att.net account I set up (managed by Yahoo) that as the end user I received *NO* notifications of any sort. List emails were not even sent to a Spam folder! *Michael Reeder, LCPC * *Hygeia Counseling Services : Baltimore / Mt. Washington Village location* *410-871-TALK / michael(at)hygeiacounseling.com* On 8/28/2022 4:08 PM, Michael Reeder -- Hygeia MS wrote: Dave Nathanson wrote: /"I'm having a similar struggle with sbcglobal.net & ATT.net addresses - They are rejecting our list mail with a reject notice"/ I can second this. I believe AT has been blocking for months or years, but with Dream Host rebuilding their discussion list servers in July, it gave AT a new opportunity to reblock us anew and a new opportunity for list administrators of GNU Mailman lists hosted at Dream Host to notice. I have 36 list users all blocked from AT managed accounts at the following domains: sbcglobal.net, att.net, flash.net, bellsouth.net, optonline.net, worldnet.att, and ameritech.net Almost all of these flow through email servers at the prodigy.net domain, but please notice that this also includes att.net domains managed for AT by Yahoo (no Prodigy servers involved). AT has ignored my (very polite) screams for months, and this week Dream Host support reported back that AT is no longer answering their inquiries. According to Dream Host, AT recently blocked 8 additional IP blocks (or just IP addresses?). For one of them, AT responded saying it was in error (and unblocking it) and saying something to the effect that they block any IP block sending too many email. For the other 7, crickets. I do observe that my IP block is on the UCEPROTECTL3 blacklist, although I don't know that AT is using it. UCEPROTECTL3 would, however, be happy to "express delist" my particular IP address as its doing nothing wrong for the low, low price of only $25 per month. Jerks! I have (temporarily?) fixed this by creating nine or so auto-forward email addresses that auto-forward to 5 AT accounts each. (Dream Host users: you can't just create one auto-forward address to send to everyone because Dream Host themselves limit email addresses to about 30 emails sent per hour. Also -- with Dream Host auto-forward only email addresses you won't see bounce traffic when AT starts blocking again.) What a mess. -- Michael *Michael Reeder, LCPC * *Hygeia Counseling Services : Baltimore / Mt. Washington Village location* *410-871-TALK / michael(at)hygeiacounseling.com* On 8/27/2022 4:09 PM, Dave Nathanson wrote: I'm having a similar struggle with sbcglobal.net & ATT.net addresses - They are rejecting our list mail with a reject notice, but let individual messages through. I have different outgoing server for mailman. My servers are hosted at Dreamhost, who generally has very helpful support, but in the past 3 weeks they are not able to convince sbcglobal & att to let our mail through because they banned our IP block. I did set Mailman to give me notice for each bounce notification so I could see what was going on, and when the bounce counters were incremented. That helped me be more aware. Immensely frustrating, as almost half of our list members have sbcglobal or ATT & are losing contact with our group. Best, Dave Nathanson Mac Medix On Aug 26, 2022, at 10:36 PM, Jayson Smith wrote: Hi, Yesterday I received a report from an AOL user that she's not receiving traffic from one of my lists. The problem here is that my server logs show outgoing mail being accepted by AOL's incoming mail servers, and of course after that it's anyone's guess what happens to them. She says she's checked her junkmail folder and the messages aren't there. Does anyone have any thoughts on this? Is AOL known to silently discard mail they think is spam for some reason? I replied to her message from the same server and she did receive that reply, so they haven't outright blocked my IP or something. Even if I could contact someone who knows what they're doing at AOL, there are no error logs for me to show. Jayson -- Mailman-Users mailing list --mailman-users@python.org To unsubscribe send an email tomailman-users-le...@python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman3/lists/mailman-users.python.org/ Mailman FAQ:http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Security Policy:http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 Searchable Archives:https://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users@python.org/ https://mail.python.org/archives/list/mailman-users@python.org/ -- Mailman-Users mailing list --mailman-users@python.org To unsubscribe send an email tomailman-users-le...@python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman3/lists/mailman-users.python.org/ Mailman FAQ:http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Security Policy:http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 Searchable Archives:https://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users@python.org/
[Mailman-Users] AT Blocking (was AOL list member not receiving list traffic)
Dave Nathanson wrote: /"I'm having a similar struggle with sbcglobal.net & ATT.net addresses - They are rejecting our list mail with a reject notice"/ I can second this. I believe AT has been blocking for months or years, but with Dream Host rebuilding their discussion list servers in July, it gave AT a new opportunity to reblock us anew and a new opportunity for list administrators of GNU Mailman lists hosted at Dream Host to notice. I have 36 list users all blocked from AT managed accounts at the following domains: sbcglobal.net, att.net, flash.net, bellsouth.net, optonline.net, worldnet.att, and ameritech.net Almost all of these flow through email servers at the prodigy.net domain, but please notice that this also includes att.net domains managed for AT by Yahoo (no Prodigy servers involved). AT has ignored my (very polite) screams for months, and this week Dream Host support reported back that AT is no longer answering their inquiries. According to Dream Host, AT recently blocked 8 additional IP blocks (or just IP addresses?). For one of them, AT responded saying it was in error (and unblocking it) and saying something to the effect that they block any IP block sending too many email. For the other 7, crickets. I do observe that my IP block is on the UCEPROTECTL3 blacklist, although I don't know that AT is using it. UCEPROTECTL3 would, however, be happy to "express delist" my particular IP address as its doing nothing wrong for the low, low price of only $25 per month. Jerks! I have (temporarily?) fixed this by creating nine or so auto-forward email addresses that auto-forward to 5 AT accounts each. (Dream Host users: you can't just create one auto-forward address to send to everyone because Dream Host themselves limit email addresses to about 30 emails sent per hour. Also -- with Dream Host auto-forward only email addresses you won't see bounce traffic when AT starts blocking again.) What a mess. -- Michael *Michael Reeder, LCPC * *Hygeia Counseling Services : Baltimore / Mt. Washington Village location* *410-871-TALK / michael(at)hygeiacounseling.com* On 8/27/2022 4:09 PM, Dave Nathanson wrote: I'm having a similar struggle with sbcglobal.net & ATT.net addresses - They are rejecting our list mail with a reject notice, but let individual messages through. I have different outgoing server for mailman. My servers are hosted at Dreamhost, who generally has very helpful support, but in the past 3 weeks they are not able to convince sbcglobal & att to let our mail through because they banned our IP block. I did set Mailman to give me notice for each bounce notification so I could see what was going on, and when the bounce counters were incremented. That helped me be more aware. Immensely frustrating, as almost half of our list members have sbcglobal or ATT & are losing contact with our group. Best, Dave Nathanson Mac Medix On Aug 26, 2022, at 10:36 PM, Jayson Smith wrote: Hi, Yesterday I received a report from an AOL user that she's not receiving traffic from one of my lists. The problem here is that my server logs show outgoing mail being accepted by AOL's incoming mail servers, and of course after that it's anyone's guess what happens to them. She says she's checked her junkmail folder and the messages aren't there. Does anyone have any thoughts on this? Is AOL known to silently discard mail they think is spam for some reason? I replied to her message from the same server and she did receive that reply, so they haven't outright blocked my IP or something. Even if I could contact someone who knows what they're doing at AOL, there are no error logs for me to show. Jayson -- Mailman-Users mailing list --mailman-users@python.org To unsubscribe send an email tomailman-users-le...@python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman3/lists/mailman-users.python.org/ Mailman FAQ:http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Security Policy:http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 Searchable Archives:https://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users@python.org/ https://mail.python.org/archives/list/mailman-users@python.org/ -- Mailman-Users mailing list --mailman-users@python.org To unsubscribe send an email tomailman-users-le...@python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman3/lists/mailman-users.python.org/ Mailman FAQ:http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Security Policy:http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 Searchable Archives:https://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users@python.org/ https://mail.python.org/archives/list/mailman-users@python.org/ -- Mailman-Users mailing list -- mailman-users@python.org To unsubscribe send an email to mailman-users-le...@python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman3/lists/mailman-users.python.org/ Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 Searchable Archives:
