Re: [Mailman-Users] msg marked as spam 554 5.7.1 [P4]
On Sun, Jan 5, 2020 at 7:21 PM Stephen J. Turnbull < turnbull.stephen...@u.tsukuba.ac.jp> wrote: > > I'd need to see that > message's full header to debug that fully, but it sounds like GCI is > generally not doing a great job here. > > > Ok - just for curiosity sake, here is full header. I've 'ed out names. But Bruce and Stephen are probably correct in that I need to contact GCI. I will also put out a request to subscribers of our list to ask that people don't mark these messages as spam. I have done this in the past probably to no avail.. what helps there is getting on email providers' feedback loops where I've been able to solve yahoo.com user problems. But I haven't found one with GCI. For clarity, I have my email address set as admin that is my own domain hosted on Hawkhost. It is POP3'd to gmail, so that's the first part of the header where gmail gets involved. The list is nome-annou...@nomekennelclub.com (the kennelclub just lets us use their domain), also on Hawkhost, who uses arandomserver.com as their DNS server, I believe. Alaskan.com is a GCI.net domain, as well as a few others. GCI is the one blocking these messages from the city to its subscribers. The city domain is nomealaska.org . Delivered-To: @gmail.com Received: by 2002:ac8:4912:0:0:0:0:0 with SMTP id e18csp19003587qtq; Fri, 3 Jan 2020 11:56:18 -0800 (PST) X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqwk2NggdPGoR1J3DEcdLZMVhDU2UAjEn8UBHjRZFns/bzyDwsAyaLWiml3ZpNgU9VgmRWhOKdATxXI= X-Received: by 2002:ac8:d86:: with SMTP id s6mr59784558qti.237.1578081378216; Fri, 03 Jan 2020 11:56:18 -0800 (PST) Authentication-Results: mx.google.com; spf=neutral (google.com: 198.252.100.64 is neither permitted nor denied by best guess record for domain of mailman-boun...@cloud.nomekennelclub.com.cloud.nomekennelclub.com) smtp.mailfrom= mailman-boun...@cloud.nomekennelclub.com.cloud.nomekennelclub.com Received-SPF: neutral (google.com: 198.252.100.64 is neither permitted nor denied by best guess record for domain of mailman-boun...@cloud.nomekennelclub.com.cloud.nomekennelclub.com) client-ip=198.252.100.64; Received: by 2002:ac8:7104:: with POP3 id z4mf28611506qto.6; Fri, 03 Jan 2020 11:56:18 -0800 (PST) X-Gmail-Fetch-Info: james@.com 1 mail..com 110 james@.com Return-Path: < mailman-boun...@cloud.nomekennelclub.com.cloud.nomekennelclub.com> Delivered-To: james@.com Received: from lax003.hawkhost.com by lax003.hawkhost.com with LMTP id eJ7WCJSYD15vFQAAva6gig (envelope-from < mailman-boun...@cloud.nomekennelclub.com.cloud.nomekennelclub.com>) for .com>; Fri, 03 Jan 2020 11:40:04 -0800 Return-path: < mailman-boun...@cloud.nomekennelclub.com.cloud.nomekennelclub.com> Envelope-to: james@.com Delivery-date: Fri, 03 Jan 2020 11:40:04 -0800 Received: from se001.arandomserver.com ([198.252.100.64]:48764) by lax003.hawkhost.com with esmtps (TLSv1.2:ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from < mailman-boun...@cloud.nomekennelclub.com.cloud.nomekennelclub.com>) id 1inSnj-0001sJ-TR for james@.com; Fri, 03 Jan 2020 11:40:04 -0800 Received: from cloud.nomekennelclub.com ([198.252.100.6]) by se001.arandomserver.com with esmtps (TLSv1.2:ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384:256) (Exim 4.89) (envelope-from < mailman-boun...@cloud.nomekennelclub.com.cloud.nomekennelclub.com>) id 1inSni-000Hqn-Aw for james@.com; Fri, 03 Jan 2020 14:40:03 -0500 Received: from [127.0.0.1] (port=35254 helo= cloud.nomekennelclub.com.cloud.nomekennelclub.com) by cloud.nomekennelclub.com with esmtp (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from < mailman-boun...@cloud.nomekennelclub.com.cloud.nomekennelclub.com>) id 1inSnh-000IHZ-Gi; Fri, 03 Jan 2020 19:40:01 + Received: from [127.0.0.1] (port=35252 helo= cloud.nomekennelclub.com.cloud.nomekennelclub.com) by cloud.nomekennelclub.com with esmtp (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from < nome-announce-boun...@nomekennelclub.com>) id 1inSng-000IHH-Fe for nome-announce-ow...@nomekennelclub.com; Fri, 03 Jan 2020 19:40:00 + Subject: Bounce action notification From: mail...@nomekennelclub.com To: nome-announce-ow...@nomekennelclub.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===7118919187349444018==" Message-ID: < mailman.423.1578080399.54331.nome-announce_nomekennelclub@nomekennelclub.com > Date: Fri, 03 Jan 2020 19:39:59 + Precedence: list X-BeenThere: nome-annou...@nomekennelclub.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: Trade and Community Announcements X-List-Administrivia: yes Errors-To: mailman-boun...@cloud.nomekennelclub.com.cloud.nomekennelclub.com Sender: Nome-announce < mailman-boun...@cloud.nomekennelclub.com.cloud.nomekennelclub.com> X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - cloud.nomekennelclub.com X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - .com X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [47 12] / [47 12] X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - cloud.nomekennelclub.com.cloud.nomekennelclub.com X-Get-Message-Sender-Via:
Re: [Mailman-Users] msg marked as spam 554 5.7.1 [P4]
Thanks for the update, Bruce!
Bruce Johnson writes:
> This was the actual bounce error from one of the offending messages:
>
> A message that you sent could not be delivered to one or more of its
> recipients. This is a permanent error. The following address(es) failed:
>
>
> [redacted]@alaskan.com
>
> host
> inbound.gci.net
> [69.168.106.130]
> SMTP error from remote mail server after end of data:
> 554 5.7.1 [P4] Message blocked due to spam content in the message.
Note to OP: This is different from the message mentioned by you ("550
illegal Unicode BOM in header" or similar). I'd need to see that
message's full header to debug that fully, but it sounds like GCI is
generally not doing a great job here.
> It’s being bounced by some spam rule on CGI.net; it’s a global one
> so it’s something in their configuration, since none of the other
> providers are bouncing it, it’s not really recognizable as spam.
Bruce, Looking at your "from" address, I wonder did your message mention
pharmaceuticals, conditions, or treatments by name? I know that for a
long time my personal filter had an enormous variety of spellings of
erectile dysfunction treatments. :-/ Nevertheless, I would say very
probably GCI is responsible. Recipient ISPs are very hard problems,
as such ISPs generally don't give anywhere near as many damns about
lost mail (which they invariably blame on senders and/or mailing
lists) as they do about any uptick in spam.
The list should start by opening an issue with GCI, if necessary by
mail to postmaster. If they give you "you're not a customer" BS,
report that to their users, too (see below). At the same time, I
would inform the sender of the mail that's systematically
misclassified and ask *them* to open an issue with GCI, and to inform
you of any response. Since they're a governmental body according to
the OP, they may have more pull than a mailing list with a "mere"
X,000 members. If they don't get a timely, responsive answer, or get
"not a customer", send a post to the list saying "GCI-based
subscribers *are provably* losing certain kinds of list mail on a
regular basis, and since it's an automated filter, *may* be losing
non-list mail as well. GCI is not cooperating in resolving the
problem." Cc: the help desk, or if necessary, postmaster@gci.
If that gets no action, the next step would be to suggest well-behaved
competitors to GCI. }:^} (If postmaster@ bounces, this is the first
step. ;-)
I agree with Jayson Smith that it's quite possible that GCI is not
running its own spam filters, but that's too bad for them.
postmaster@GCI is responsible for the health of its mail system by
definition, and that includes getting timely action from outsourced
service vendors.
I don't think there's much the list can do about this (short of
unsubscribing GCI addresses, which is not recommended unless required
by law or applicable regulation ;-), as both the sender and the
recipients' providers are effectively sovereign in this area, and the
message content is apparently innocuous.
Steve
--
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Re: [Mailman-Users] msg marked as spam 554 5.7.1 [P4]
Hi, I've seen this exact error before with various ISPs. I believe one of them is Centurytel. I assume what's happened is that several ISPs use a certain spam filtering service or app, and that filter is rejecting the messages for some unknown reason. If that's the case, the particular ISP in question probably won't have a clue what's going on. Hopefully they'll care enough to consult with the third-party filtering service. Jayson On 1/5/2020 5:23 PM, Bruce Johnson wrote: I was the off-list person... This was the actual bounce error from one of the offending messages: A message that you sent could not be delivered to one or more of its recipients. This is a permanent error. The following address(es) failed: [redacted]@alaskan.com host inbound.gci.net [69.168.106.130] SMTP error from remote mail server after end of data: 554 5.7.1 [P4] Message blocked due to spam content in the message. It’s being bounced by some spam rule on CGI.net; it’s a global one so it’s something in their configuration, since none of the other providers are bouncing it, it’s not really recognizable as spam. (or one user reported it as spam and they took the lazy way out and blocked all the emails from that list address…we have one user who routinely marks email from one list on our domain as ’spam’…then complains that he’s not getting emails from the list…sigh ) On Jan 5, 2020, at 11:48 AM, Jim Dory wrote: On Sun, Jan 5, 2020 at 12:56 AM Stephen J. Turnbull < turnbull.stephen...@u.tsukuba.ac.jp> wrote: Jim Dory writes: Sometimes I do get this: host mx1.arandomserver.com [198.252.100.64] SMTP error from remote mail server after end of data: 550 Headers contain illegal BOM on my personal email from the same sender (city), but not sure that is same issue. I don't understand. You say it's personal mail *from the city*, but you're getting the bounce message? That should not happen; the bounce message should go to the city. I don't think the city would see a bounce because the list accepted their message and a lot of subscribers would see it.. but it was rejected only by one or two other subscriber email providers. That is my understanding anyway, perhaps I'm wrong. I see the bounces as admin for the list. Isn't this proper behavior of the mailman software? It seems that people would complain (or ask about it) if they saw all the bounces caused by one of their messages and they never have. That's nothing. Don't hesitate. It's much more annoying to have to go back and forth if you send incomplete headers. Could it be that GCI needs to whitelist or something? Not enough information. It sounds like either or both the city and GCI have difficulty with email since it's that particular combination, but which one is whack I can't tell without a look at the delivery status notice (bounce message) for the mass bounces. This is often in your mail server's log as well. Steve, thanks very much for replying and looking at this. I realize now I didn't provide sufficient info and will in the future amend my ways. I'm going to contact GCI and see if I can get them to either whitelist or clean up a possible mis-configure in their system. Another kind gentlemen from this mailman list contacted me off-list with an offer to help - I sent him the complete header and reject message.. and he felt that there was nothing apparent to warrant an email provider to reject it. thanks, Jim -- Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/johnson%40pharmacy.arizona.edu -- Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Mailman-Users] msg marked as spam 554 5.7.1 [P4]
I was the off-list person... This was the actual bounce error from one of the offending messages: A message that you sent could not be delivered to one or more of its recipients. This is a permanent error. The following address(es) failed: [redacted]@alaskan.com host inbound.gci.net [69.168.106.130] SMTP error from remote mail server after end of data: 554 5.7.1 [P4] Message blocked due to spam content in the message. It’s being bounced by some spam rule on CGI.net; it’s a global one so it’s something in their configuration, since none of the other providers are bouncing it, it’s not really recognizable as spam. (or one user reported it as spam and they took the lazy way out and blocked all the emails from that list address…we have one user who routinely marks email from one list on our domain as ’spam’…then complains that he’s not getting emails from the list…sigh ) > On Jan 5, 2020, at 11:48 AM, Jim Dory wrote: > > On Sun, Jan 5, 2020 at 12:56 AM Stephen J. Turnbull < > turnbull.stephen...@u.tsukuba.ac.jp> wrote: > >> Jim Dory writes: >> >> >>> Sometimes I do get this: host mx1.arandomserver.com [198.252.100.64] >>>SMTP error from remote mail server after end of data: >>>550 Headers contain illegal BOM >>> on my personal email from the same sender (city), but not sure that is >> same >>> issue. >> >> I don't understand. You say it's personal mail *from the city*, but >> you're getting the bounce message? That should not happen; the bounce >> message should go to the city. >> >> >> > > I don't think the city would see a bounce because the list accepted their > message and a lot of subscribers would see it.. but it was rejected only by > one or two other subscriber email providers. That is my understanding > anyway, perhaps I'm wrong. I see the bounces as admin for the list. Isn't > this proper behavior of the mailman software? It seems that people would > complain (or ask about it) if they saw all the bounces caused by one of > their messages and they never have. > > > >> >> That's nothing. Don't hesitate. It's much more annoying to have to >> go back and forth if you send incomplete headers. >> >> >>> >>> Could it be that GCI needs to whitelist or something? >> >> Not enough information. It sounds like either or both the city and >> GCI have difficulty with email since it's that particular combination, >> but which one is whack I can't tell without a look at the delivery >> status notice (bounce message) for the mass bounces. This is often in >> your mail server's log as well. >> >> >> > Steve, thanks very much for replying and looking at this. I realize now I > didn't provide sufficient info and will in the future amend my ways. > > I'm going to contact GCI and see if I can get them to either whitelist or > clean up a possible mis-configure in their system. Another kind gentlemen > from this mailman list contacted me off-list with an offer to help - I sent > him the complete header and reject message.. and he felt that there was > nothing apparent to warrant an email provider to reject it. > > thanks, Jim > -- > Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org > https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users > Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 > Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 > Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ > Unsubscribe: > https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/johnson%40pharmacy.arizona.edu -- Bruce Johnson University of Arizona College of Pharmacy Information Technology Group Institutions do not have opinions, merely customs -- Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/archive%40jab.org
Re: [Mailman-Users] msg marked as spam 554 5.7.1 [P4]
On Sun, Jan 5, 2020 at 12:56 AM Stephen J. Turnbull < turnbull.stephen...@u.tsukuba.ac.jp> wrote: > Jim Dory writes: > > > > Sometimes I do get this: host mx1.arandomserver.com [198.252.100.64] > > SMTP error from remote mail server after end of data: > > 550 Headers contain illegal BOM > > on my personal email from the same sender (city), but not sure that is > same > > issue. > > I don't understand. You say it's personal mail *from the city*, but > you're getting the bounce message? That should not happen; the bounce > message should go to the city. > > > I don't think the city would see a bounce because the list accepted their message and a lot of subscribers would see it.. but it was rejected only by one or two other subscriber email providers. That is my understanding anyway, perhaps I'm wrong. I see the bounces as admin for the list. Isn't this proper behavior of the mailman software? It seems that people would complain (or ask about it) if they saw all the bounces caused by one of their messages and they never have. > > That's nothing. Don't hesitate. It's much more annoying to have to > go back and forth if you send incomplete headers. > > > > > > Could it be that GCI needs to whitelist or something? > > Not enough information. It sounds like either or both the city and > GCI have difficulty with email since it's that particular combination, > but which one is whack I can't tell without a look at the delivery > status notice (bounce message) for the mass bounces. This is often in > your mail server's log as well. > > > Steve, thanks very much for replying and looking at this. I realize now I didn't provide sufficient info and will in the future amend my ways. I'm going to contact GCI and see if I can get them to either whitelist or clean up a possible mis-configure in their system. Another kind gentlemen from this mailman list contacted me off-list with an offer to help - I sent him the complete header and reject message.. and he felt that there was nothing apparent to warrant an email provider to reject it. thanks, Jim -- Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/archive%40jab.org
[Mailman-Users] msg marked as spam 554 5.7.1 [P4]
Jim Dory writes: > I have one problem that when a particular user (the city) sends an > announcement, it tends to bounce hundreds of mainly one ISP's users.. that > ISP being Alaska's GCI.com . I assume you mean that the attempt to deliver to users at GCI bounce back to you? What we would like to see is the delivery service message from GCI which explains why the message is being refused. > Sometimes I do get this: host mx1.arandomserver.com [198.252.100.64] > SMTP error from remote mail server after end of data: > 550 Headers contain illegal BOM > on my personal email from the same sender (city), but not sure that is same > issue. I don't understand. You say it's personal mail *from the city*, but you're getting the bounce message? That should not happen; the bounce message should go to the city. > The city usually includes a link to the city codes on a public webpage - > perhaps that triggers GCI. Are you saying there's a link in the header? Those are common (eg, Mailman can be configured to put certain links in the header), and should not cause problems if correctly formed. Nothing in the content should cause any kind of bounce except a 552 "We don't like your mail for some reason" Administrative Denial (or perhaps another 55x response. > I could post one of the headers in total but it is probably about 3 pages > worth. That's nothing. Don't hesitate. It's much more annoying to have to go back and forth if you send incomplete headers. > Everything sort of looks ok to me except I notice this: > BODY: Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% [score: 0.] 0.0 > RCVD_IN_DNSWL_BLOCKED RBL: ADMINISTRATOR NOTICE: The query to DNSWL was > blocked. See http://wiki.apache.org/spamassassin/DnsBlocklists#dnsbl-block > for more information. [34.212.96.103 listed in list.dnswl.org] -0.0 > SPF_PASS SPF: sender matches SPF record 0.0 HTML_MESSAGE BODY: HTML > included in message The sentence about querying DNSWL is a bit weird, but I don't think it's a problem. That check was just skipped. The rest is perfectly normal and is not symptomatic of a problem. > The link in the messages is https://www.codepublishing.com/AK/Nome/ . That link is never going to cause a problem. > > I can post more of the header if need be. > > Could it be that GCI needs to whitelist or something? Not enough information. It sounds like either or both the city and GCI have difficulty with email since it's that particular combination, but which one is whack I can't tell without a look at the delivery status notice (bounce message) for the mass bounces. This is often in your mail server's log as well. Steve -- Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/archive%40jab.org
[Mailman-Users] msg marked as spam 554 5.7.1 [P4]
So I'm just a volunteer who doesn't understand much about email systems.. just rudimentary - and I am managing an email list for community announcements and trade, by subscription only. We have about 1500 subscribers. I have one problem that when a particular user (the city) sends an announcement, it tends to bounce hundreds of mainly one ISP's users.. that ISP being Alaska's GCI.com . Other users, say on hotmail, yahoo, etc.. don't get bounced. I manage the emails via gmail and lately I've been "locked out of gmail due to suspicious email activity" which is a pain in the rear. Also causes my host (Hawkhost) grief.. the overhead they dislike though they haven't complained lately. So I'm motivated to look into this a bit. Sometimes I do get this: host mx1.arandomserver.com [198.252.100.64] SMTP error from remote mail server after end of data: 550 Headers contain illegal BOM on my personal email from the same sender (city), but not sure that is same issue. The city usually includes a link to the city codes on a public webpage - perhaps that triggers GCI. I could post one of the headers in total but it is probably about 3 pages worth. Everything sort of looks ok to me except I notice this: BODY: Bayes spam probability is 0 to 1% [score: 0.] 0.0 RCVD_IN_DNSWL_BLOCKED RBL: ADMINISTRATOR NOTICE: The query to DNSWL was blocked. See http://wiki.apache.org/spamassassin/DnsBlocklists#dnsbl-block for more information. [34.212.96.103 listed in list.dnswl.org] -0.0 SPF_PASS SPF: sender matches SPF record 0.0 HTML_MESSAGE BODY: HTML included in message The link in the messages is https://www.codepublishing.com/AK/Nome/ . I can post more of the header if need be. Could it be that GCI needs to whitelist or something? thx, Jim -- Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/archive%40jab.org
