[MlMt] Fwd: Ver 1.14 (5937)

[Thomas Bartlett via mailmate]

P.S.  I now see that the sub-folders are under the “Mailing Lists” folder. A 
huge number of these are identified by a serial number for a single mail. Is 
that intended? Is that the MailMate Archive’s serial number? But many others 
are identified by a full name of the sender of by a short word or bunch of 
letters that seem to be irrelevant to the content. Is there some way to clean 
this up, to make it more useful for reference? Or do I misunderstand the 
purpose of this feature?

Forwarded message:

> From: Thomas Bartlett 
> To: MailMate Users 
> Subject: Ver 1.14 (5937)
> Date: Wed, 13 Sep 2023 22:57:19 -0700
>
> My hard drive had to be wiped and the OS reinstalled, so I installed MailMate 
> ver 1.14 (5937). The good news is that it can now connect with the two MS 
> account servers for @outlook.com and @hotmail.com messages, which the earlier 
> version could not do.  The perhaps dubious news is that the new version does 
> not sort incoming mail into a unique sub-folder named for the sender, as the 
> earlier version that I used did do. I like that feature. Is it not present in 
> the new version, or have I overlooked a way to install it?
>
> Thomas
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[MlMt] Ver 1.14 (5937)

[Thomas Bartlett via mailmate]

My hard drive had to be wiped and the OS reinstalled, so I installed MailMate 
ver 1.14 (5937). The good news is that it can now connect with the two MS 
account servers for @outlook.com and @hotmail.com messages, which the earlier 
version could not do.  The perhaps dubious news is that the new version does 
not sort incoming mail into a unique sub-folder named for the sender, as the 
earlier version that I used did do. I like that feature. Is it not present in 
the new version, or have I overlooked a way to install it?

Thomas
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Re: [MlMt] MailMate update denied

[Thomas Bartlett via mailmate]

When I click on the Upgrade button, it shows the notice captured in the 
attached screen save file, saying that my installed version is a release, that 
the latest proper version is 5673 but I have installed 5876. It offers an 
option to downgrade to 5673 which I once tried, but didn’t like, so I 
reinstalled 5876.

That’s been more or less ok for quite a while now (except that MM still doesn’t 
sync my mail on Outlook or Hotmail). However, since a day or so ago, MailMate 
has stopped showing newly sent file in the Sent folder. They appear in the All 
Messages folder, but not in Sent. How can that be fixed?

Thanks for help.

Thomas

On 19 May 2022, at 12:59, Tracy Valleau wrote:

>> 1.  Why is it think it has to update software that is already up to date.
>
> No idea. Perhaps there is an incremental update?
>
>> 2.  Why does it think it is a read-only filesystem when the system is too 
>> old to have a read-only filesystem (other than on an external drive, that 
>> this isn’t).
>  I cannot answer "why" - I just know that dozens of times I've seen "can't 
> update" errors to an existing app, which are solved by the technique I 
> suggested.
>
> Sorry it didn't work for you.
>
> T
>
>
>
> On 19 May 2022, at 12:49, David Ledger wrote:
>
>> On 19 May 2022, at 20:33, Tracy Valleau wrote:
>>
>>> Hold down the command key and drag MailMate to your desktop.
>>> Release all keys.
>>> Hold down the command key and drag MailMate to your Applications folder.
>>>
>>> That should fix it.
>>
>> Thanks, but this is an update that MailMate itself is trying to install, 
>> even though it knows it is up to date. It’s not a human initiated download. 
>> So
>> 1.  Why is it think it has to update software that is already up to date.
>> 2.  Why does it think it is a read-only filesystem when the system is too 
>> old to have a read-only filesystem (other than on an external drive, that 
>> this isn’t).
>>
>> David
>>
>>
>>> On 19 May 2022, at 12:22, David Ledger wrote:
>>>
 I am currently up to date with “Normal Releases” according to the Software 
 Update panel of Preferences, but whenever I start up MailMate (which is 
 rare because I keep it and the laptop running) I get a popup saying:
 v v v v
 MailMate is running on a read-only file system and can therefore not be 
 updated.

 If you downloaded MailMate from the internet then moving it out of the 
 Downloads folder should solve the problem.
 ^ ^ ^ ^

 The system is a Mid 2011 11” MacBook Air running High Sierra 10.13.6. The 
 filesystem is APFS with the base drive having one container “Container 
 disk1” that contains one Volume “Macintosh HD”. It has no read-only 
 volumes.

 Has anyone else seen this?

 David
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Re: [MlMt] MailMate needs to be updated warning

[Thomas Bartlett via mailmate]

I’ve got r5876 installed. Should I try to get r5885?

Thomas

On 11 Apr 2022, at 1:00, Benny Kjær Nielsen wrote:


On 9 Apr 2022, at 22:44, Benny Kjær Nielsen wrote:

In any case, I will likely replace `emate` soon with something that 
does not need `python` at all.


This has been done in r5885. Users of `emate` can write me directly if 
I've broken any functionality in the process.


--
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[MlMt] Send group mail individually

[Thomas Bartlett via mailmate]

Can MailMate be tweaked to automatically send the same message separately to 
each individual on a group email list?

Thanks for help.

Thomas
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[MlMt] Gmail All Mail folder

[Thomas Bartlett via mailmate]

I’ve setup my Gmail account in MailMate, but there is one important folder that 
shows in my account at the online website gmail.com, but I have not found it in 
the default setup under MailMate (nor in MS Outlook, nor Apple Mail, only in 
Thunderbird). That is the folder called All Mail. Is there some way I can tweak 
MailMate to show the contents of Gmail’s All Mail folder? There’s often stuff 
there that doesn’t show up in the Inbox.

Thank you,

Thomas
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[MlMt] Fwd: MailMate and Monterey

[Thomas Bartlett via mailmate]

> activated in both Correction: I was referring to Outlook and Hotmail, but 
> neglected to mention Hotmail.

Further correction: I find that my intention in that statement was mistaken. 
The Hotmail account does have OAuth2 checked, but Outlook account uses the 
app-specific password without activating OAuth2.

In Keychain Access, there is no separate entry relating to the Hotmail account, 
apparently because it also uses the outlook.com server.

Question: given that 1) Hotmail can now send and receive through the same 
server as Outlook by using OAuth2 without a password (apparently?), where as 2) 
Outlook can receive but not send using a password without OAuth2, therefore 3) 
might Outlook be able to send and receive, just like Hotmail, if I remove the 
password and activate OAuth2?  I think I tried that earlier but found it 
wanting, so I got the passwords, but I don’t remember for certain the sequence 
of my attempts to fix it.

TB



Forwarded message:
> From: Thomas Bartlett via mailmate 
> To: MailMate Users 
> Cc: Thomas Bartlett 
> Subject: Re: [MlMt] MailMate and Monterey
> Date: Fri, 26 Nov 2021 03:15:11 -0800
>
> Those are the IMAP and SMTP server addresses that I use with Outlook. Port 
> 993 with IMAP, Port 465 with SMTP. Require SSL activated in both IMAP and 
> SMTP, but OAuth2 not activated in either, while app-specific password used in 
> both.
>
> And I deleted the Keychain entry in the format you showed below. But I left 
> in place a Keychain entry that is identical with the format below except that 
> the word ‘refresh’ is not shown between ‘oath-‘ and ‘-token.’  Should that 
> also be removed?
>
> Thomas
>
>
> On 25 Nov 2021, at 9:13, Benny Kjær Nielsen wrote:
>
>>
>> I looked into making my test account (@outlook.com) work and this time it 
>> succeeded. I'm still unsure if it's officially supported by Microsoft, but 
>> these settings do work for me:
>>
>> IMAP: imap-mail.outlook.com
>> SMTP: smtp-mail.outlook.com
>>
>> Both with OAuth2 enabled.
>>
>> There might be an issue where MailMate fails to get a new so-called refresh 
>> token and I think that might play a part in why these things seem a bit 
>> unpredictable. Therefore, after configuring the above, try deleting items in 
>> “Keychain Access” with the following name:
>>
>> com.freron.MailMate.Outlook.oauth-refresh-token
>>
>> That should trigger a new round of OAuth2 authorization which might work 
>> better for you.
>>
>> -- 
>> Benny
>
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Re: [MlMt] MailMate and Monterey

[Thomas Bartlett via mailmate]

> com.freron.MailMate.Outlook.oauth-refresh-token

I see that I also have similar entries in Keychain Access for Google (2 dated 
to July and Aug 2020, apparently for my 2 Google accounts) and Office365 (1 
dated to Sep 2021), alongside other entries in the same format that lack the 
word ‘refresh.’

TB

On 25 Nov 2021, at 9:13, Benny Kjær Nielsen wrote:

>
> IMAP: imap-mail.outlook.com
> SMTP: smtp-mail.outlook.com
>
> Both with OAuth2 enabled.
>
> There might be an issue where MailMate fails to get a new so-called refresh 
> token and I think that might play a part in why these things seem a bit 
> unpredictable. Therefore, after configuring the above, try deleting items in 
> “Keychain Access” with the following name:
>
> com.freron.MailMate.Outlook.oauth-refresh-token
>
> That should trigger a new round of OAuth2 authorization which might work 
> better for you.
>
> -- 
> Benny

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Re: [MlMt] MailMate and Monterey

[Thomas Bartlett via mailmate]

Those are the IMAP and SMTP server addresses that I use with Outlook. Port 993 
with IMAP, Port 465 with SMTP. Require SSL activated in both IMAP and SMTP, but 
OAuth2 not activated in either, while app-specific password used in both.

And I deleted the Keychain entry in the format you showed below. But I left in 
place a Keychain entry that is identical with the format below except that the 
word ‘refresh’ is not shown between ‘oath-‘ and ‘-token.’  Should that also be 
removed?

Thomas


On 25 Nov 2021, at 9:13, Benny Kjær Nielsen wrote:

>
> I looked into making my test account (@outlook.com) work and this time it 
> succeeded. I'm still unsure if it's officially supported by Microsoft, but 
> these settings do work for me:
>
> IMAP: imap-mail.outlook.com
> SMTP: smtp-mail.outlook.com
>
> Both with OAuth2 enabled.
>
> There might be an issue where MailMate fails to get a new so-called refresh 
> token and I think that might play a part in why these things seem a bit 
> unpredictable. Therefore, after configuring the above, try deleting items in 
> “Keychain Access” with the following name:
>
> com.freron.MailMate.Outlook.oauth-refresh-token
>
> That should trigger a new round of OAuth2 authorization which might work 
> better for you.
>
> -- 
> Benny

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Re: [MlMt] MailMate and Monterey

[Thomas Bartlett via mailmate]

Thank you. I have now downloaded 5850 and it’s running well.

What seems to have made the difference in being able to download mail from the 
Outlook and Hotmail servers is app-specific passwords that I got (from where I 
don’t remember) and inserted into the IMAP and SMTP password lines of the 
settings for both accounts. I have been leaving OAuth2 unchecked, because 
downloading occurs well without it and I think I’ve had some problems when I 
did check it. With Hotmail I can send and receive; with Outlook only receive, 
which is probably the more important of the two actions, since I have mail 
newsletters sent to that address.

I have Thunderbird on my computer but haven’t done much with it yet. Since you 
mention it, when time permits maybe I’ll give it a look and see if I can learn 
anything that might enhance my use of MailMate as well.

Thomas

On 25 Nov 2021, at 10:37, Benny Kjær Nielsen wrote:

> On 23 Nov 2021, at 3:03, Thomas Bartlett via mailmate wrote:
>
>>> To get the latest test release (and you should for Monterey): Hold down ⌥ 
>>> when clicking “Check Now” in the Software Update preferences pane.
>>
>> I tried that after r5844 was installed and nothing happened. The window just 
>> closed. I suppose that means I’m fully up to date.
>
> Please try this again. It should offer you r5850 now.
>
>> I have Office365 on my MacBook PRO with Monterey OS, running in “New 
>> Outlook” mode. It definitely does connect to Outlook.com mail and 
>> Hotmail.com mail. Of course, it’s to be expected that a Microsoft mail 
>> client would connect effectively with the Microsoft mail servers.
>
> Their own email clients talk “native” Exchange and not IMAP. The same goes 
> for Apple Mail and a few other email clients. The primary test is: If it 
> works in Thunderbird then it should also be possible to make it work in 
> MailMate. (Well, there's a kind of an exception to that rule for Yahoo for 
> which Thunderbird has gotten special treatment somehow.)
>
>> My (perhaps excessively suspicious) hypothesis might be that Microsoft is 
>> deliberately making it difficult or impossible for other mail clients to do 
>> the same, but then what do I know about it?
>
> Well, I can tell you that Apple also supports some kind of OAuth2-like system 
> for Apple Mail which is completely off limits for third party email clients 
> (which then has to rely on the user creating application specific passwords). 
> In that sense, Microsoft
>
> -- 
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Re: [MlMt] MailMate and Monterey

[Thomas Bartlett via mailmate]

Hello Benny,

Please see my responses in black font below.

On 22 Nov 2021, at 6:46, Benny Kjær Nielsen wrote:

> On 22 Nov 2021, at 15:08, t.bartlett--- via mailmate wrote:
>
>
>> I run Monterey 12.0.1. I don’t have MacOS 12.1, but should I update to 12.1 
>> for better compatibility with MailMate?
>
> No, there’s no need for that.
>
>>  I looked at the About MailMate window. It said I had 5835 installed. Then I 
>> looked at the Updates window. It said I should downgrade to 5637.
>
> The r5835 is one of many test releases and MailMate offered you the latest 
> public release (which is pretty old now and not very good with Monterey). I'm 
> working on making a new public release, but there's still a lot to do.
>
I now have r5844 (not 5848, if that makes any difference), version 1.14. So I 
guess I’m pretty much fully up to date now.  I d

> To get the latest test release (and you should for Monterey): Hold down ⌥ 
> when clicking “Check Now” in the Software Update preferences pane.

I tried that after r5844 was installed and nothing happened. The window just 
closed. I suppose that means I’m fully up to date.
>
>> So I did that. Big mistake apparently. Then that did not recognize my 
>> license anymore. Maybe it was out of date. So I paid $49.95 to Freron. And 
>> on top of that, I agreed to be a Patron.
>
> Let me know if you regret this and I'll provide refunds. (You can write me 
> off list if you like.)
>
> If not, thanks for the support!!

I’m glad to support the MailMate project, even though right now I’m evidently 
now getting full effective use of it. I trust that with your conscientious 
efforts my problems will at some time be solved.
>
>> On another subject: Will MailMate ever be able to connect to outlook.com and 
>> hotmail.com servers?  I have legacy accounts there that receive mail but 
>> MailMate hasn’t been able to download that for a year or two now.
>
> My own test account for outlook.com also doesn't work at the moment. It did 
> work in the past and I'm a bit unsure what changed. Making OAuth2 work for it 
> involved some guessing since I cannot find any official documentation from 
> Microsoft on how that's supposed to work.

OAuth2 is something that I don’t understand, so I’ll let you work that out.
>
> It's possible that it still works with an application specific keyword since 
> outlook.com is not the same thing as Office365 (which does work and does 
> definitely not allow application specific passwords). Another data point: I'm 
> pretty sure OAuth2 does not work for outlook.com accounts in Thunderbird.
>
I have Office365 on my MacBook PRO with Monterey OS, running in “New Outlook” 
mode. It definitely does connect to Outlook.com mail and Hotmail.com mail. Of 
course, it’s to be expected that a Microsoft mail client would connect 
effectively with the Microsoft mail servers. My (perhaps excessively 
suspicious) hypothesis might be that Microsoft is deliberately making it 
difficult or impossible for other mail clients to do the same, but then what do 
I know about it?

> I'll look into it eventually, but I cannot guarantee that I can make it work 
> again.

I understand. That’s why I also keep Apple Mail and Outlook mail clients on my 
MacBook.  I have Thunderbird on my computer but hardly ever use it. When I 
opened it a moment ago, a small window popped up with Chinese text, asking my 
responses to some questions. I read Chinese but I don’t remember ever 
connecting with any Chinese site that would produce this.

Thank you,

Thomas

>
> -- 
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[MlMt] Fwd: MailMate and Monterey

[Thomas Bartlett via mailmate]

I’ve now been able to download and install MailMate v1.14 (5844), so 
the worst of the problem stated below is now fixed.


Still hoping that MM can at some point connect to those 2 Microsoft mail 
servers. What’s the problem?



Forwarded message:


From: t.bartl...@me.com
To: MailMate Users 
Subject: Re: [MlMt] MailMate and Monterey
Date: Mon, 22 Nov 2021 06:08:04 -0800

I run Monterey 12.0.1. I don’t have MacOS 12.1, but should I update 
to 12.1 for better compatibility with MailMate?




 I looked at the About MailMate window. It said I had 5835 installed. 
Then I looked at the Updates window. It said I should downgrade to 
5637. So I did that. Big mistake apparently. Then that did not 
recognize my license anymore. Maybe it was out of date. So I paid 
$49.95 to Freron. And on top of that, I agreed to be a Patron.




 Then I downloaded a new copy of 5835. (Still haven’t found 5848.) 
But I can’t install this 5835. I moved all the old MailMate filed to 
Trash and tried to open 5835, but it still comes up as 5637.




 What do I need to do?



 On another subject: Will MailMate ever be able to connect to 
outlook.com and hotmail.com servers?  I have legacy accounts there 
that receive mail but MailMate hasn’t been able to download that for 
a year or two now.






 On 11/21/21, 11:07 AM, "mailmate"  
wrote:


 On 19 Nov 2021, at 17:47, Jolin Warren wrote:



I’m about to migrate to a new computer, so will be going through a 
forced upgrade from Mojave (10.14) to Monterey (12.0). I see that 
r5848 was posted today. Is this what I should use, and does it work 
ok with Monterey? Or should I be using the MailMateBigSur.tbz archive 
(which I think is a release from August)?




 Based on current feedback, I would recommend r5848. (Hopefully this 
also means I'm getting closer to making an actual public release, but 
there are a lot of “minor” issues which still need my attention.)




 --

 Benny

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Re: [MlMt] Benny updated the test build changelog

[Thomas Bartlett via mailmate]

Thank you. Found it.

On 7 Oct 2021, at 14:45, Thomas Grundberg wrote:


2021-10-07 kl 23:40 skrev t.bartlett--- via mailmate:


How can I find the MailMate archive to download r5834?


Try [this link](https://updates.mailmate-app.com/archives/?C=M;O=D), 
previously mentioned on the list.

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Re: [MlMt] Benny updated the test build changelog

[Thomas Bartlett via mailmate]

I have 5798 installed on Big Sur 11.6. The Check for Update button tells 
me to downgrade to 5673, but when I click to do that, it says I can’t 
do that. Weird!!


My main grief is that MailMate no longer connects to my two Microsoft 
accounts on Outlook.com and Hotmail.com. Can that be fixed?


Thanks.

TB

On 7 Oct 2021, at 9:30, Benny Kjær Nielsen wrote:


On 5 Oct 2021, at 21:25, Pete Resnick via mailmate wrote:


On 5 Oct 2021, at 13:37, Sam Birch wrote:

Looks like all the recent test builds are detailed in the test build 
release notes now:


https://updates.mailmate-app.com/test_release_notes

Hope this is of interest.


This is correct. The build system is a bit smarter now and release 
notes are generated when needed for the homepage.


Reading through, it's pretty clear why he hasn't done a Test Build 
release in the clients; interesting stuff, but definitely cutting 
edge and bugs still being worked on.


This is also correct, but I do believe the latest test release is 
reasonably stable. For now, it's available on the test-release branch 
(available when holding down ⌥ when clicking “Check Now” in the 
Software Update preferences pane) for Monterey users since I assume 
they are less surprised by potentially buggy software :) I'm hoping to 
extend that to earlier macOS releases fairly soon.


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Re: [MlMt] Why did I not try MailMate sooner?

[Thomas Bartlett via mailmate]

I too like MailMate, but what issues do you mean about Apple Mail? 

Thomas 

Sent from my iPhone

> On Sep 3, 2020, at 10:29 AM, Antonio Leding  wrote:
> 
> Well, after  a few days of using MM, I find my workflow already improving 
> significantly — so much so that I am somewhat peeved that I held on to Apple 
> Mail for so long especially with their serious issues of late.
> 
> That’s all..just wanted to send a positive note out there to the MM community 
> and primarily to Benny for building and maintaining what is clearly one of 
> the best Mac apps out there.
> 
> — Tony —
> 
> 
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[MlMt] Account greyed out and "(unavailable)" ?

[Thomas Bartlett via mailmate]

My Outlook mail is greyed out in the subfolders of MailMate’s Inbox, 
with a notation “unavailable.”  But in my Apple Mail and MS Outlook 
clients the Outlook mail accounts are fully active and receiving up to 
the minute.  What’s happening in MailMate?


Thomas
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Re: [MlMt] Can I view account password?

[Thomas Bartlett via mailmate]

Good idea. I might try that, but at this point I’m having trouble even getting 
to my Hotmail account online. When I type hotmail.com <http://hotmail.com/> on 
the address line, it converts that to outlook.live.com 
<http://outlook.live.com/> and takes me to my Outlook mail site online. The two 
are separate.  Microsoft has said that Hotmail became Outlook, but that’s 
simply a lie. Hotmail was replaced by a new and separate email service called 
outlook.com <http://outlook.com/>. I have, indeed, occasionally found myself 
staring at the Hotmail account online but I’m damned if I know how I got there 
or how to repeat whatever got me there.  Anyway, I’ll keep your thought in mind 
if that happens again. I think Microsoft is playing tricks with Hotmail. 

Thomas

> On Aug 30, 2020, at 8:31 PM, Randall Gellens  
> wrote:
> 
> The Spark login for Hotmail doesn’t allow any “reset password” feature. So I 
> may need to reset it in some other client where I can configure a new 
> password in 1Password, which will keep a record of it, then use that to login 
> to Hotmail in Spark.
> 
> Normally, password resets are done at the mail provider using a web browser, 
> not in an email client. Can you go to hotmail.com and reset your password 
> there?
> 
> --Randall
> 
> On 30 Aug 2020, at 14:24, Thomas Bartlett via mailmate wrote:
> 
> Thanks for the thoughts. See my interlinear responses below. 
> 
> 
>> On Aug 30, 2020, at 9:41 AM, Sam Hathaway > <mailto:list.mailm...@munkynet.org>> wrote:
>> 
>> On 30 Aug 2020, at 4:55, Thomas Bartlett via mailmate wrote:
>> 
>>> "com.apple.Exchange.oath-refresh-token."
>> 
>> Thomas,
>> 
>> You mean, “oauth-refresh-token”, right?
> 
> Yes. You’re right. 
> 
>> 
>> If your account is using OAuth, your mail client won’t store the account 
>> password.
>> 
>> The keychain items that MailMate stores for my GMail account (which uses 
>> OAuth) are:
>> 
>> com.freron.MailMate.Google.oauth-token
>> com.freron.MailMate.Google.oauth-refresh-token
>> 
>> Neither of these contain my GMail password.
>> 
>> By contrast, for my FastMail account (which uses application passwords), 
>> MailMate stores these items in the keychain:
>> 
>> imap.fastmail.com <http://imap.fastmail.com/>
>> smtp.fastmail.com
> 
> MailMate shows the server addresses for all seven of my email accounts. 
>> 
>> These both contain the FastMail application password for my account.
> 
> MailMate only shows the password for my Yahoo account, not for the two 
> Gmails, the iCloud.com <http://icloud.com/>, the Outlook, the Hotmail, my 
> employer’s Exchange account. 
>> 
>> Basically, if your provider uses OAuth, you’re SOL any you’ll probably have 
>> to reset your password.
>> -sam
>> 
>> P.S.: Why do you have so many email clients?! XD
> 
> Thanks for the explanation about OAuth, which I didn’t know but answers a 
> long-standing question in my mind. Is four email clients really very many to 
> have installed?  Anyway, I sort of drifted into trying out new ones, not 
> being fully satisfied with any of them. And I sometimes find that one or 
> another behaves eccentrically so drop it and go to another one.  I used MS 
> Outlook on my PC for about 15 years and liked its Address Book very much. 
> Then I moved to Mac OS platform and took up Mail, which I found inferior.  
> Then someone recommended MailMate, which does some things much better than 
> Mail, but is sometimes complex beyond my level of expertise, as in the 
> present case about passwords. Then someone recommended Spark, which is fine 
> when working right, but it can be devilishly recalcitrant to configure.  And, 
> when I got Office 365 for Mac, it came with an improved MS Outlook, which has 
> the advantage of working more seamlessly with the Microsoft Outlook mail and 
> Hotmail. I have a 1TB solid state drive which is less than half full, so 
> reduplication of downloaded mail isn’t a problem (yet).  Yes, it’s sometimes 
> tedious to keep all of my accounts functioning properly in all four clients.  
> But right now, except for Hotmail in Spark, everything else is behaving as 
> expected. The Spark login for Hotmail doesn’t allow any “reset password” 
> feature. So I may need to reset it in some other client where I can configure 
> a new password in 1Password, which will keep a record of it, then use that to 
> login to Hotmail in Spark.  
> 
> Thomas
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
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Re: [MlMt] Can I view account password?

[Thomas Bartlett via mailmate]

Thanks for the thoughts. See my interlinear responses below. 


> On Aug 30, 2020, at 9:41 AM, Sam Hathaway  wrote:
> 
> On 30 Aug 2020, at 4:55, Thomas Bartlett via mailmate wrote:
> 
>> "com.apple.Exchange.oath-refresh-token."
> 
> Thomas,
> 
> You mean, “oauth-refresh-token”, right?

Yes. You’re right. 

> 
> If your account is using OAuth, your mail client won’t store the account 
> password.
> 
> The keychain items that MailMate stores for my GMail account (which uses 
> OAuth) are:
> 
> com.freron.MailMate.Google.oauth-token
> com.freron.MailMate.Google.oauth-refresh-token
> 
> Neither of these contain my GMail password.
> 
> By contrast, for my FastMail account (which uses application passwords), 
> MailMate stores these items in the keychain:
> 
> imap.fastmail.com
> smtp.fastmail.com

MailMate shows the server addresses for all seven of my email accounts. 
> 
> These both contain the FastMail application password for my account.

MailMate only shows the password for my Yahoo account, not for the two Gmails, 
the iCloud.com <http://icloud.com/>, the Outlook, the Hotmail, my employer’s 
Exchange account. 
> 
> Basically, if your provider uses OAuth, you’re SOL any you’ll probably have 
> to reset your password.
> -sam
> 
> P.S.: Why do you have so many email clients?! XD

Thanks for the explanation about OAuth, which I didn’t know but answers a 
long-standing question in my mind. Is four email clients really very many to 
have installed?  Anyway, I sort of drifted into trying out new ones, not being 
fully satisfied with any of them. And I sometimes find that one or another 
behaves eccentrically so drop it and go to another one.  I used MS Outlook on 
my PC for about 15 years and liked its Address Book very much. Then I moved to 
Mac OS platform and took up Mail, which I found inferior.  Then someone 
recommended MailMate, which does some things much better than Mail, but is 
sometimes complex beyond my level of expertise, as in the present case about 
passwords. Then someone recommended Spark, which is fine when working right, 
but it can be devilishly recalcitrant to configure.  And, when I got Office 365 
for Mac, it came with an improved MS Outlook, which has the advantage of 
working more seamlessly with the Microsoft Outlook mail and Hotmail. I have a 
1TB solid state drive which is less than half full, so reduplication of 
downloaded mail isn’t a problem (yet).  Yes, it’s sometimes tedious to keep all 
of my accounts functioning properly in all four clients.  But right now, except 
for Hotmail in Spark, everything else is behaving as expected. The Spark login 
for Hotmail doesn’t allow any “reset password” feature. So I may need to reset 
it in some other client where I can configure a new password in 1Password, 
which will keep a record of it, then use that to login to Hotmail in Spark.  

Thomas






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Re: [MlMt] Can I view account password?

[Thomas Bartlett via mailmate]

Continuing from my incomplete message inadvertently sent:  

So, if this is not what you meant, then I am not sure where to look for that. 

Thank you,

Thomas

> On Aug 30, 2020, at 1:55 AM, Thomas Bartlett via mailmate 
>  wrote:
> 
> Thank you.  I found a login keychain file labelled 
> "com.apple.Exchange.oath-refresh-token."  Opening it, I opted to view the 
> password. It was a ten digit string consisting of mostly random alpha-numeric 
> and punctuation symbols. Looks plausible.  So I tried inserting it in the 
> Skype login both on MacBook and on iPhone Spark app, but to no avail.  I’m 
> getting extremely frustrated trying to do it this way. I think there must be 
> some other factor that’s getting in the way.  Has Skype simply dropped 
> accessing Hotmail? 
> 
> Thanks for your tip. In the past I’ve been too unfamiliar with using the 
> keychain files. But maybe it’s not too late to learn some of it.
> 
> Thomas
> 
> 
> 
>> On Aug 30, 2020, at 12:18 AM, Thomas Eckhold  wrote:
>> 
>> Passwords should be stored in the keychain of MAC OS not in MM itself. Did 
>> you take a look there? Search for the name of the provider not MM. 
>> 
>> Kind regards
>> Thomas
>> 
>> Von meinem iPhone gesendet
>> 
>>> Am 30.08.2020 um 08:17 schrieb Thomas Bartlett via mailmate 
>>> :
>>> 
>>> I use four email clients in my MacBook Pro: MailMate, Apple Mail, MS 
>>> Outlook, and Spark.  In the first three I have a Hotmail account that 
>>> functions properly. In Spark, it used to run properly but is now saying I 
>>> need to login again. But I don’t have a record of the password and the 
>>> Spark process apparently does not allow for resetting a lost password.
>>> 
>>> So I though I’d try copying the Hotmail password from one of the three 
>>> other clients in which the Hotmail account is functioning properly. In MS 
>>> Outlook, for my six email accounts, the two Gmail accounts do not show a 
>>> password, but in settings for the other four non-Gmail accounts, three show 
>>> the current password, but the Hotmail settings show no password; the box is 
>>> simply blank, although the account is functioning.
>>> 
>>> So, in MailMate, is there some way I can view and copy the current password 
>>> of an active and functioning account, so that I can copy it to the Spark 
>>> login?
>>> 
>>> Thanks in advance to anyone who troubles to contribute to solving this not 
>>> very sophisticated problem.
>>> 
>>> Thomas
>>> ___
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>> 
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Re: [MlMt] Can I view account password?

[Thomas Bartlett via mailmate]

In the applications folder is a sub-folder called Utilities. In that sub-folder 
is an app called Keychain Access. When that app is opened, it shows on the dock 
an icon shaped like keys on a circular “chain.”  At the top of the left side 
column is the word “Keychains,” below which are five options:  Directory 
Services, login, iCloud, System, System Roots. After looking at them all, I 
opted for “login,” which is uniquely written in bold font; this displays a long 
list of keychain files. That is what I accessed.  Yes, there is another file, 
com.apple.Exchange.oauth-token with the same time stamp as the one mentioned in 
my earlier message, which shows an extremely long string of alphanumeric code.  
When I select each of these two files, the file name is displayed in bold font 
in a header strip at the top of the window; the next line in the header says: 
“Kind: application password;” the third line says “Account:” following which is 
the username of my Hotmail account followed by @ and then an alphanumeric 
string which must be 60 digits long. The first file that I opened, reported in 
my earlier message shows a header that is essentially identical, except that 
the extremely long alphanumeric string is completely different.

So, if this is not what you meant,



> On Aug 30, 2020, at 1:55 AM, Thomas Bartlett via mailmate 
>  wrote:
> 
> Thank you.  I found a login keychain file labelled 
> "com.apple.Exchange.oath-refresh-token."  Opening it, I opted to view the 
> password. It was a ten digit string consisting of mostly random alpha-numeric 
> and punctuation symbols. Looks plausible.  So I tried inserting it in the 
> Skype login both on MacBook and on iPhone Spark app, but to no avail.  I’m 
> getting extremely frustrated trying to do it this way. I think there must be 
> some other factor that’s getting in the way.  Has Skype simply dropped 
> accessing Hotmail? 
> 
> Thanks for your tip. In the past I’ve been too unfamiliar with using the 
> keychain files. But maybe it’s not too late to learn some of it.
> 
> Thomas
> 
> 
> 
>> On Aug 30, 2020, at 12:18 AM, Thomas Eckhold  wrote:
>> 
>> Passwords should be stored in the keychain of MAC OS not in MM itself. Did 
>> you take a look there? Search for the name of the provider not MM. 
>> 
>> Kind regards
>> Thomas
>> 
>> Von meinem iPhone gesendet
>> 
>>> Am 30.08.2020 um 08:17 schrieb Thomas Bartlett via mailmate 
>>> :
>>> 
>>> I use four email clients in my MacBook Pro: MailMate, Apple Mail, MS 
>>> Outlook, and Spark.  In the first three I have a Hotmail account that 
>>> functions properly. In Spark, it used to run properly but is now saying I 
>>> need to login again. But I don’t have a record of the password and the 
>>> Spark process apparently does not allow for resetting a lost password.
>>> 
>>> So I though I’d try copying the Hotmail password from one of the three 
>>> other clients in which the Hotmail account is functioning properly. In MS 
>>> Outlook, for my six email accounts, the two Gmail accounts do not show a 
>>> password, but in settings for the other four non-Gmail accounts, three show 
>>> the current password, but the Hotmail settings show no password; the box is 
>>> simply blank, although the account is functioning.
>>> 
>>> So, in MailMate, is there some way I can view and copy the current password 
>>> of an active and functioning account, so that I can copy it to the Spark 
>>> login?
>>> 
>>> Thanks in advance to anyone who troubles to contribute to solving this not 
>>> very sophisticated problem.
>>> 
>>> Thomas
>>> ___
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>>> mailmate@lists.freron.com
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>> 
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Re: [MlMt] Can I view account password?

[Thomas Bartlett via mailmate]

Thank you.  I found a login keychain file labelled 
"com.apple.Exchange.oath-refresh-token."  Opening it, I opted to view the 
password. It was a ten digit string consisting of mostly random alpha-numeric 
and punctuation symbols. Looks plausible.  So I tried inserting it in the Skype 
login both on MacBook and on iPhone Spark app, but to no avail.  I’m getting 
extremely frustrated trying to do it this way. I think there must be some other 
factor that’s getting in the way.  Has Skype simply dropped accessing Hotmail? 

Thanks for your tip. In the past I’ve been too unfamiliar with using the 
keychain files. But maybe it’s not too late to learn some of it.

Thomas



> On Aug 30, 2020, at 12:18 AM, Thomas Eckhold  wrote:
> 
> Passwords should be stored in the keychain of MAC OS not in MM itself. Did 
> you take a look there? Search for the name of the provider not MM. 
> 
> Kind regards
> Thomas
> 
> Von meinem iPhone gesendet
> 
>> Am 30.08.2020 um 08:17 schrieb Thomas Bartlett via mailmate 
>> :
>> 
>> I use four email clients in my MacBook Pro: MailMate, Apple Mail, MS 
>> Outlook, and Spark.  In the first three I have a Hotmail account that 
>> functions properly. In Spark, it used to run properly but is now saying I 
>> need to login again. But I don’t have a record of the password and the Spark 
>> process apparently does not allow for resetting a lost password.
>> 
>> So I though I’d try copying the Hotmail password from one of the three other 
>> clients in which the Hotmail account is functioning properly. In MS Outlook, 
>> for my six email accounts, the two Gmail accounts do not show a password, 
>> but in settings for the other four non-Gmail accounts, three show the 
>> current password, but the Hotmail settings show no password; the box is 
>> simply blank, although the account is functioning.
>> 
>> So, in MailMate, is there some way I can view and copy the current password 
>> of an active and functioning account, so that I can copy it to the Spark 
>> login?
>> 
>> Thanks in advance to anyone who troubles to contribute to solving this not 
>> very sophisticated problem.
>> 
>> Thomas
>> ___
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[MlMt] Can I view account password?

[Thomas Bartlett via mailmate]

I use four email clients in my MacBook Pro: MailMate, Apple Mail, MS 
Outlook, and Spark.  In the first three I have a Hotmail account that 
functions properly. In Spark, it used to run properly but is now saying 
I need to login again. But I don’t have a record of the password and 
the Spark process apparently does not allow for resetting a lost 
password.


So I though I’d try copying the Hotmail password from one of the three 
other clients in which the Hotmail account is functioning properly. In 
MS Outlook, for my six email accounts, the two Gmail accounts do not 
show a password, but in settings for the other four non-Gmail accounts, 
three show the current password, but the Hotmail settings show no 
password; the box is simply blank, although the account is functioning.


So, in MailMate, is there some way I can view and copy the current 
password of an active and functioning account, so that I can copy it to 
the Spark login?


Thanks in advance to anyone who troubles to contribute to solving this 
not very sophisticated problem.


Thomas
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[MlMt] Yahoo problem in MailMate

[Thomas Bartlett via mailmate]

I have a new Yahoo mail account.  It is running well on Apple Mail and I can 
access it in a browser. I infer that it is an IMAP account. I have set it up in 
MailMate as prescribed but MailMate keeps asking for a password.  I tried 
entering the login password that is effective in Mail and online but Mail Mate 
rejected it; I tried entering an app specific password from Apple (don't know 
why that would be wanted, but it was suggested in the error message) but it was 
rejected.  I'm using settings that I found on internet but they may be out of 
date, or not specific for MailMate, as follows:

imap.mail.yahoo.com  port 993, SSL enabled with 
login password entered
smtp.mail.yahoo.com  port 465 SSL enabled with 
login password entered

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[MlMt] MailMate can't connect to Yahoo account

[Thomas Bartlett via mailmate]

I have a new Yahoo mail account.  It is running well on Apple Mail and I can 
access it in a browser. I infer that it is an IMAP account. I have set it up in 
MailMate as prescribed but MailMate keeps asking for a password.  I tried 
entering the login password that is effective in Mail and online but Mail Mate 
rejected it; I tried entering an app specific password from Apple (don't know 
why that would be wanted, but it was suggested in the error message) but it was 
rejected.  I'm using settings that I found on internet but they may be out of 
date, or not specific for MailMate, as follows:

imap.mail.yahoo.com  port 993, SSL enabled with 
login password entered
smtp.mail.yahoo.com  port 465 SSL enabled with 
login password entered

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Re: [MlMt] ProtonMail or other IMAP server?

[Thomas Bartlett via mailmate]

The message below appeared in my Inbox with an annotation above it in a 
yellow bar (not reproduced here), with the wording: “Unable to locate 
the command (gpg) needed to work with an OpenPGP message. Please verify 
that you have installed the “gpg” command as required by 
MailMate.”


I have no idea what to do about this. Can someone please advise a 
solution?


Thank you,

TB

On 27 Jun 2020, at 17:14, Steve wrote:

I use them with Mailmate - they're not the cheapest but the service is 
good, you are paying for an element of privacy/security features, and 
their customer support has been pleasant for me :)



Sent from ProtonMail mobile



\ Original Message 
On 28 Jun 2020, 6:47 am, Kimi Wei < kimiwe...@gmail.com> wrote:





Hi there,

Tried to onboard with MailMate a couple of years but couldn’t 
understand how to do it. I’m trying again.


Is ProtonMail good to use with MM as an IMAP server or are there 
other good alternatives? Good meaning not too costly and a pleasant 
and responsive service team.


TIA
Kimi

Kimi Wei \| The Wei LLC
k...@thewei.com @kimiwei
[facebook.com/thekimiwei][facebook.com_thekimiwei]
862-203-8814


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[facebook.com_thekimiwei]: http://facebook.com/thekimiwei




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[MlMt] MM failed to download msg sent from iPhone through MS Exchange server

[Thomas Bartlett via mailmate]

I sent an email from my iPhone through my employer’s MS-Exchange 
server. A copy of that email has appeared in the Sent folder of Apple 
Mail on MacBook, but the email has not appeared at all in MailMater, 
although MM has received various other emails received and and sent 
through that same MS-Exchange server.


Is there some setting I can tweak, or some other way to induce MM to 
receive that email from the online Exchange server, which shows the 
email in its Sent folder?


Thank you.

Thomas
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[MlMt] Rotated attached pictures

[Thomas Bartlett via mailmate]

New Year’s Greetings, Benny:

My MailMate 1.13.1 (5671) is running well on my MacBook with Catalina OS 
10.15.2.  One problem:  attached photos appear at a 90 degree left 
rotation, although in Apple Mail the same emails with same pictures 
appear straight up.


Is there a simple solution that I could reach by some tweaking?

Thank you, and best wishes,

Thomas

On 6 Jan 2020, at 4:31, Benny Kjær Nielsen wrote:


On 5 Jan 2020, at 20:19, Randy Bush wrote:


up to date mojave on a maxed out 2018 13
up to date mailmate

it gets into a state where all message bodies are shown as a single
little box, �


That does sound very strange and is new to me. If MailMate couldn't 
find the cached email on disk then you should have gotten a message 
about this. This could, e.g., happen if the folder used for the 
“Custom Location” feature in the General preferences pane was 
somehow lost/removed.


More likely, the emails do exist, but displaying them somehow fails, 
that is, MailMate somehow fails to generate the HTML to be displayed. 
If you reply to one of these emails, does the content then appear in 
the textview?


In any case, you might get some useful error messages if you launch 
MailMate from a Terminal window like this:


/Applications/MailMate.app/Contents/MacOS/MailMate

You can send me the output using “Help ▸ Send Feedback” within 
MailMate (if that still works).


--
Benny




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