[libreoffice-marketing] Slogans

2010-12-30 Thread Tom Davies
Hi :)

Is there somewhere to see a list of proposed slogan's?  I prefer evolution to 
revolution becuase people are talking about Cloud apps as being THE 
revolution and that is scaring a lot of people.

LibreOffice looks like the older versions of MicroSquish Office and a lot of 
people have grumbled about the all new ribbon-bar at the top of the last 2 
releases of MicroSquish Office.  Personally i had no trouble with the 
ribbon-bar 
but many people hate it.

We have a window of opportunity to 'sell' LibreOffice as being the only 
evolutionary Office suite because everyone else forces people into 
revolutionary 
things that they don't want and are scared of or hate.

I also liked freedom never tasted so suite.

Regards from
Tom :)





From: Michael Wheatland mich...@wheatland.com.au
To: marketing@libreoffice.org
Sent: Thu, 30 December, 2010 5:31:28
Subject: Re: [libreoffice-marketing] LibreOffice Slogan

I have also been considering the slogan. The concept that I was
thinking of was to reflect the transition from OpenOffice.org to
LibreOffice into the slogan.

At this point in time I might suggest:

LibreOffice, the document evolution

This would reflect the culture change that LibreOffice has come to represent.
...Later, as LibreOffice becomes mature and new features and interface
is introduced:

LibreOffice, the document revolution

The implication of this is a 'new way' to create documents. I don't
think LibreOffice is a revolution yet, but there are ideas out there,
such as the citrus interface which would warrant such a statement.

Just my 2c

Michael Wheatland

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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] LibO DVD fulfillment web-page

2010-12-30 Thread Benjamin Horst
Thanks, Charles.

On Dec 29, 2010, at 10:24 AM, Charles-H. Schulz wrote:
 That is all true.
 But that does not mean that using an url as libreoffcedvd is
 automatically OK. Maybe we should have paid more attention
 discussing that?
 
 That's a valid point. But as far as I know, we don't have a policy on
 URLs that include the term libreoffice yet. Until we do, we cannot
 say that Dave is or is not following our policy!
 
 Once a fair policy is developed and agreed upon, I'm sure he and
 other project participants will be happy to follow it. Have you heard
 any discussion about this topic elsewhere that I may have missed?
 
 No indeed. So what I can say is that we have no trademark policy that
 is being formalized now; I would as a caution advise against using
 LibreOffice and the Document Foundation as trademarks for the moment.
 On the other hand I commit myself to discuss an upcoming and acceptable
 trademark policy asap and to speed up things.

We can take a look at the example of the Drupal community for one successful 
policy. The Drupal trademark cannot be used by for-profit companies or in 
their domains, but it is permitted for non-profits and in the domain names of 
non-profits. I think this has worked well for them, and could provide a good 
model for LibreOffice as well.

I am looking forward to this conversation and developing a good policy for the 
trademarks going forward. Thanks for your input so far.

-Ben

Benjamin Horst
bho...@mac.com
646-464-2314 (Eastern)
www.solidoffice.com


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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] LibO DVD fulfillment web-page

2010-12-30 Thread Italo Vignoli

On 12/30/2010 03:35 PM, Benjamin Horst wrote:


We can take a look at the example of the Drupal community for one successful policy. The 
Drupal trademark cannot be used by for-profit companies or in their domains, 
but it is permitted for non-profits and in the domain names of non-profits. I think this 
has worked well for them, and could provide a good model for LibreOffice as well.


I will be working at a draft trademark policy based on Ubuntu, Drupal 
and WikiMedia trademark policies. I will share it as soon as it will be 
polished enough to be considered a working draft. Please point me to 
other trademark policies if they are worth looking at.


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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] LibO DVD fulfillment web-page

2010-12-30 Thread Benjamin Horst

On Dec 30, 2010, at 9:45 AM, Italo Vignoli wrote:
 On 12/30/2010 03:35 PM, Benjamin Horst wrote:
 
 We can take a look at the example of the Drupal community for one successful 
 policy. The Drupal trademark cannot be used by for-profit companies or in 
 their domains, but it is permitted for non-profits and in the domain names 
 of non-profits. I think this has worked well for them, and could provide a 
 good model for LibreOffice as well.
 
 I will be working at a draft trademark policy based on Ubuntu, Drupal and 
 WikiMedia trademark policies. I will share it as soon as it will be polished 
 enough to be considered a working draft. Please point me to other trademark 
 policies if they are worth looking at.

Just thinking of other major open source projects, the following come to mind:

Linux
Firefox
Eclipse
KDE
GNOME

Firefox should definitely be on our list, while the others may also help.

Thanks!

-Ben

Benjamin Horst
bho...@mac.com
646-464-2314 (Eastern)
www.solidoffice.com


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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] LibO DVD fulfillment web-page

2010-12-30 Thread Andrea Pescetti
Benjamin Horst wrote:
 We can take a look at the example of the Drupal community for one
 successful policy. The Drupal trademark cannot be used by for-profit
 companies or in their domains, but it is permitted for non-profits and
 in the domain names of non-profits. I think this has worked well for
 them, and could provide a good model for LibreOffice as well.

It's a good idea, but this policy will require significant adaptations
to be useful for LibreOffice: for example, Drupal is not sold on DVDs,
and does not share code with similar projects bearing its name (to make
it clear: I can envisage someone wanting to build and distribute/sell
something called LibreOffice Professional Edition consisting of
LibreOffice + extras; this would be done in Drupal in a different way,
with installation profiles not containing the Drupal name).

The Drupal policy is very complex anyway: http://drupal.com/trademark
And moreover, handling requests is quite a burden for Dries Buytaert
(the trademark holder), at about 100/year (89 in 11 months):
http://buytaert.net/drupal-trademark-policy-update-after-11-months

So it's good to have a policy but you have to spend a lot of resources
either to create a suitable one (you can use Drupal's as a starting
point, but it really needs to be adapted and discussed) or to handle
requests.

Regards,
  Andrea.


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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] LibO DVD fulfillment web-page

2010-12-30 Thread Sophie Gautier

Hi all,
On 30/12/2010 18:10, Andrea Pescetti wrote:

Benjamin Horst wrote:

We can take a look at the example of the Drupal community for one
successful policy. The Drupal trademark cannot be used by for-profit
companies or in their domains, but it is permitted for non-profits and
in the domain names of non-profits. I think this has worked well for
them, and could provide a good model for LibreOffice as well.


It's a good idea, but this policy will require significant adaptations
to be useful for LibreOffice: for example, Drupal is not sold on DVDs,
and does not share code with similar projects bearing its name (to make
it clear: I can envisage someone wanting to build and distribute/sell
something called LibreOffice Professional Edition consisting of
LibreOffice + extras; this would be done in Drupal in a different way,
with installation profiles not containing the Drupal name).

The Drupal policy is very complex anyway: http://drupal.com/trademark
And moreover, handling requests is quite a burden for Dries Buytaert
(the trademark holder), at about 100/year (89 in 11 months):
http://buytaert.net/drupal-trademark-policy-update-after-11-months

So it's good to have a policy but you have to spend a lot of resources
either to create a suitable one (you can use Drupal's as a starting
point, but it really needs to be adapted and discussed) or to handle
requests.


Fully agreed, and that should also be discussed with our packagers. Some 
of us have already spent hours, months if not years on this for OOo, 
André, Bernhard, René, Caolán, Cor, to name only some of them. So please 
make sure they are also in the discussion, their inputs will be really 
invaluable.


Kind regards
Sophie

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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] LibO DVD fulfillment web-page

2010-12-30 Thread Italo Vignoli

On 12/30/2010 04:53 PM, Sophie Gautier wrote:


Fully agreed, and that should also be discussed with our packagers. Some
of us have already spent hours, months if not years on this for OOo,
André, Bernhard, René, Caolán, Cor, to name only some of them. So please
make sure they are also in the discussion, their inputs will be really
invaluable.


I will share the draft as quickly as I can, and in any case it is going 
to be a basis for discussion.


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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] LibO DVD fulfillment web-page

2010-12-30 Thread Sophie Gautier

Hi Italo,
On 30/12/2010 19:07, Italo Vignoli wrote:

On 12/30/2010 04:53 PM, Sophie Gautier wrote:


Fully agreed, and that should also be discussed with our packagers. Some
of us have already spent hours, months if not years on this for OOo,
André, Bernhard, René, Caolán, Cor, to name only some of them. So please
make sure they are also in the discussion, their inputs will be really
invaluable.


I will share the draft as quickly as I can, and in any case it is going
to be a basis for discussion.

Thanks Italo for your work on this, I've no doubt that you will be 
considerate of them :)


Kind regards
Sophie

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[libreoffice-marketing] Re: Slogans

2010-12-30 Thread Marc Paré

Le 2010-12-30 05:41, Tom Davies a écrit :

Hi :)

Is there somewhere to see a list of proposed slogan's?  I prefer evolution to
revolution becuase people are talking about Cloud apps as being THE
revolution and that is scaring a lot of people.


Are you talking about this page? 
http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Marketing/Slogan   This is the only 
one that I know.




LibreOffice looks like the older versions of MicroSquish Office and a lot of
people have grumbled about the all new ribbon-bar at the top of the last 2
releases of MicroSquish Office.  Personally i had no trouble with the ribbon-bar
but many people hate it.

We have a window of opportunity to 'sell' LibreOffice as being the only
evolutionary Office suite because everyone else forces people into revolutionary
things that they don't want and are scared of or hate.

I also liked freedom never tasted so suite.

Regards from
Tom :)


Cheers

Marc


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[libreoffice-marketing] Re: LibreOffice Slogan

2010-12-30 Thread Marc Paré

Le 2010-12-29 09:11, Italo Vignoli a écrit :

I apologize for being so late with my position on this topic, but I
really could not devote enough time to TDF before Xmas.

I have just gone through the list again and several times, and I have
one clear winner in the following:

LibreOffice... Freedom never tasted so suite

In addition, I find that there are two slogans that would fit other
tasks such as presentations or technical documents:

The calamus. The ballpoint. Libreoffice.

LibreOffice. Do what you want

I would avoid as much as possible translations in local languages,
because you always lose something. I would prefer local slogans (but I
must confess that I hate slogans in general, and I do not see why we
must have a slogan, but I am just one of many).

My only concern with my preferred choice is that it is a very subtle
slogan, and it might be misunderstood by many (I have read an email that
has puzzled me quite a lot).

I think it would be wise to make a check within our community, but also
with our friends and relatives who are able to provide a good feedback
(they must at least understand good English and free software).

Ciao, Italo



It was agree earlier (see threads on slogans) that the choice of slogan 
at this time was temporary. I believe the reason for this was that LibO 
would eventually have a mission statement and that a more permanent 
slogan would be worked on after this. I may have misunderstood.


I would prefer to do a second round of slogan suggestions after we have 
worked out the LibreOffice mission statement, core values etc.


Marc



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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Re: LibreOffice Slogan

2010-12-30 Thread Italo Vignoli

On 12/30/2010 06:06 PM, Marc Paré wrote:


It was agree earlier (see threads on slogans) that the choice of slogan
at this time was temporary. I believe the reason for this was that LibO
would eventually have a mission statement and that a more permanent
slogan would be worked on after this. I may have misunderstood.


No, you are right, but I wanted to share my take of the list of 
proposals. On the other hand, the marketplace for office suites is so 
fluid that I think we will have to revise the positioning quite often 
in order to catch with the situation.


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[libreoffice-marketing] Re: LibreOffice Slogan

2010-12-30 Thread Marc Paré

Le 2010-12-30 12:22, Italo Vignoli a écrit :

On 12/30/2010 06:06 PM, Marc Paré wrote:


It was agree earlier (see threads on slogans) that the choice of slogan
at this time was temporary. I believe the reason for this was that LibO
would eventually have a mission statement and that a more permanent
slogan would be worked on after this. I may have misunderstood.


No, you are right, but I wanted to share my take of the list of
proposals. On the other hand, the marketplace for office suites is so
fluid that I think we will have to revise the positioning quite often
in order to catch with the situation.



I agree. A slogan ages quite quickly and should be revised when it no 
longer has appeal. I am sure the membership will chime in when the 
slogan will sound out-dated.


Cheers

Marc


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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Slogans

2010-12-30 Thread Sophie Gautier

Hi Tom,
On 30/12/2010 13:41, Tom Davies wrote:

Hi :)

Is there somewhere to see a list of proposed slogan's?  I prefer evolution to
revolution becuase people are talking about Cloud apps as being THE
revolution and that is scaring a lot of people.


Enter the revolution was the web banner we used for the first OOo 
websites. Maybe the German team has still examples of those banners 
somewhere on their cvs repo. So that might be confusing for some long 
time users if we use the same type of slogan.


Kind regards
Sophie

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[libreoffice-marketing] Re: Slogans

2010-12-30 Thread Marc Paré

Le 2010-12-30 12:48, Sophie Gautier a écrit :

Hi Tom,
On 30/12/2010 13:41, Tom Davies wrote:

Hi :)

Is there somewhere to see a list of proposed slogan's? I prefer
evolution to
revolution becuase people are talking about Cloud apps as being THE
revolution and that is scaring a lot of people.


Enter the revolution was the web banner we used for the first OOo
websites. Maybe the German team has still examples of those banners
somewhere on their cvs repo. So that might be confusing for some long
time users if we use the same type of slogan.

Kind regards
Sophie



I do not think it is wise to use any slogans that were on any OOo list. 
Doing this will link us to OOo and only strengthen the argument that we 
are a fork (subordinate) of the OOo distro. We will have to work hard 
later on the rid people of this idea. We really do not want to help OOo 
out by doing this to ourselves.


I would prefer a slogan that sets us apart from OOo. OOo can follow us 
and be in a subordinate role if they wish. We will, of course, have the 
best distro of the two.


Cheers

Marc


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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] Re: Slogans

2010-12-30 Thread Tom Davies
Hi :)

Yes, thanks, exactly what i was looking for.  There are a lot of great choices 
in there.  

http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Marketing/Slogan

I particularly liked short ones that had Liberat  The word Libre is not 
used in English but many people might recognise Liberte and it's easier to 
find out the meaning.  Connecting Libre with Liberte early on is smart.

OpenSource ties us down to a small niche market.  Outside that market we 
might 
as well use the term Freeware because people really don't know the difference.  
Err, until they do understand but by then they have entered that small niche.  
Within the small niche market people tend to recognise the term Libre anyway 
so really it is just saying the same thing twice.

My fav's, roughly in the order i like them ...

34 LibreOffice... Freedom never tasted so suite
58 LibreOffice... the evolution in office
70 LibreOffice... Suite up!
11 Liberate Your Life  but tweaked to  Liberate Your Office?
01 LibreOffice, a suite deal. 
14 LibreOffice: your documents, you're in control!  from a StarTrek babe
27 It's your release.
31 LibreOffice... Freedom to express, power to inspire
32 LibreOffice... Freedom to inspire, power to express
46 LibreOffice... Powerful, creative, open 
51 LibreOffice... Unleash Your Creativity 
57 LibreOffice... the evolution in office suite 
60 LibreOffice... Innovation arrived at the office
61 LibreOffice... the evolution in documents

I also liked 
12 LibreOffice. Do what you want. / LibreOffice. Fais ce que tu veux., 
LibreOffice. Realises ce que tu veux. / LibreOffice. Mach was du willst. / 
LibreOffice. Haz lo que quieras. / LibreOffice. Fai quello che vuoi. -- 
David Nelson.  


Native speakers would derive associations from the words that pass me by 
completely.  The English one is the crucial line in a fairly famous, upbeat and 
very sexy pop-song from around the 80s?  Perhaps we could get permission to 
play 
a sample?

Regards from
Tom :)






From: Marc Paré m...@marcpare.com
To: marketing@libreoffice.org
Sent: Thu, 30 December, 2010 17:02:21
Subject: [libreoffice-marketing] Re: Slogans

Le 2010-12-30 05:41, Tom Davies a écrit :
 Hi :)

 Is there somewhere to see a list of proposed slogan's?  I prefer evolution 
to
 revolution becuase people are talking about Cloud apps as being THE
 revolution and that is scaring a lot of people.

Are you talking about this page? 
http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Marketing/Slogan   This is the only 
one that I know.


 LibreOffice looks like the older versions of MicroSquish Office and a lot of
 people have grumbled about the all new ribbon-bar at the top of the last 2
 releases of MicroSquish Office.  Personally i had no trouble with the 
ribbon-bar
 but many people hate it.

 We have a window of opportunity to 'sell' LibreOffice as being the only
 evolutionary Office suite because everyone else forces people into 
revolutionary
 things that they don't want and are scared of or hate.

 I also liked freedom never tasted so suite.

 Regards from
 Tom :)

Cheers

Marc


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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] LibO DVD fulfillment web-page

2010-12-30 Thread drew
On Wed, 2010-12-29 at 10:22 +0100, Stefan Weigel wrote:
 Since he removed his offer, there is no need for further discussion.

Hi Stefan,

Thanks for taking such good care here.

Perhaps this would be a good point, for David's benefit, if you could
tell him a bit about the LibreOfficeBox project, how it functions and
it's relationship with the broader LibreOffice community.

This would help Dave and all of us I believe.

Thanks much,

Drew


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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] LibO DVD fulfillment web-page

2010-12-30 Thread drew
On Tue, 2010-12-28 at 16:35 -0600, Dave Johnson wrote:
 I am NOT selling the software just a professionally made DVD with a Windows 
 and Macintosh binary. Probably OpenOffice.org 3.3.0
 

Hi Dave,

Sorry for being so delinquent in getting involved in your ideas here - I
have read along.

I was curious about your plans, for example. There will be need, I
suppose, for discs to use for swag at Linux fests and the like, have you
considered at all how you might be able to help in this regard.

I know that is a bit forward, but as the first fest in the US is now
less then 60 days away I need to start making concrete plans for what is
possible and what is not.

Thanks much,

Drew



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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] LibO DVD fulfillment web-page

2010-12-30 Thread drew

On Thu, 2010-12-30 at 18:16 -0600, Dave Johnson wrote:
 I can provide as little as 25 DVD's or a couple hundred. I cannot provide any 
 free DVD's but I can at cost. The more the less per unit cost. I can have 
 them ready in 7 - 10 biz days.

Ok - would you want to discuss this on list then or a phone call
perhaps?

thanks

Drew


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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] LibO DVD fulfillment web-page

2010-12-30 Thread Dave Johnson
I will be able to take a phone call Friday in the afternoon. Either number is 
good. I am in the central time zone. Or we can just email. Your preference.

Dave Johnson, USNFR
davefilms...@gmail.com
6195496830
http://www.davefilms.us
(619) 335-5314
(619) 335-5314Dave Johnson DUNS number: 826989779

Please do not send me Microsoft Office/Apple iWork documents. Send 
OpenDocument instead! http://fsf.org/campaigns/opendocument/; 

On Dec 30, 2010, at 6:21 PM, drew wrote:

 
 On Thu, 2010-12-30 at 18:16 -0600, Dave Johnson wrote:
 I can provide as little as 25 DVD's or a couple hundred. I cannot provide 
 any free DVD's but I can at cost. The more the less per unit cost. I can 
 have them ready in 7 - 10 biz days.
 
 Ok - would you want to discuss this on list then or a phone call
 perhaps?
 
 thanks
 
 Drew
 
 
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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] LibO DVD fulfillment web-page

2010-12-30 Thread Dave Johnson
That sounds good to me. Still need official art for the cover of the DVD.
Dave Johnson, USNFR
davefilms...@gmail.com
6195496830
http://www.davefilms.us
(619) 335-5314
(619) 335-5314Dave Johnson DUNS number: 826989779

Please do not send me Microsoft Office/Apple iWork documents. Send 
OpenDocument instead! http://fsf.org/campaigns/opendocument/; 

On Dec 30, 2010, at 6:23 PM, drew wrote:

 On Thu, 2010-12-30 at 19:21 -0500, drew wrote:
 On Thu, 2010-12-30 at 18:16 -0600, Dave Johnson wrote:
 I can provide as little as 25 DVD's or a couple hundred. I cannot provide 
 any free DVD's but I can at cost. The more the less per unit cost. I can 
 have them ready in 7 - 10 biz days.
 
 Ok - would you want to discuss this on list then or a phone call
 perhaps?
 
 
 sorry for following my own post.
 
 @Benjamin - If Dave and I chat on phone I would really prefer if we
 could get you on the line at the same time, hopefully we could find a
 time good for all of us.
 
 Thanks
 
 Drew
 
 
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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] LibO DVD fulfillment web-page

2010-12-30 Thread drew
On Thu, 2010-12-30 at 18:28 -0600, Dave Johnson wrote:
 Still need official art for the cover of the DVD.

Precisely - we would need to start on this yesterday.

There is art we can either re-use or use as a starting point from the
LibreOfficeBox project.

Thanks

Drew




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Re: [libreoffice-marketing] LibO DVD fulfillment web-page

2010-12-30 Thread Stefan Weigel
Hi Drew, David, *

Am 31.12.2010 01:06, schrieb drew:

 Perhaps this would be a good point, for David's benefit, if you could
 tell him a bit about the LibreOfficeBox project, how it functions and
 it's relationship with the broader LibreOffice community.

I am hardly involved in the LibreOfficeBox project. So, I may not be
the right one to tell about it. However, here is what I beleive to
know about it:

It´s idea evolved from the PrOOoBox, a CD/DVD distribution project,
driven by members of the germanophone OOo subproject.

http://www.prooo-box.org/

There were CDs or DVDs or memory sticks, optionally packed in a nice
box and bundled with a brochure/manual.

Look: //www.ooodev.org/fanartikel.html

The disks contained the installers (for different or all platforms),
language packs, source code, lots of documentation, art work,
templates and so on. The discs have a website-like user interface.
You can see a mirror of this interface in the web:

http://live.prooo-box.org/de/

Have a look at the LibreOfficeBox Homepage
http://www.libreofficebox.org/ which pretty much represents the user
interface of the upcoming LibreOfficeBox DVDs.

You can download an early developer snapshot of the
LibreOfficeBox-ISO here:
http://torrent.projects.ooodev.org:6969/index.html?search=DVD

Stefan

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