Re: [libreoffice-marketing] The Edition Matter
@Cor: Good proposal; I think There are few catches though: Not sure how far TDF is willing to go. Business/Organizations are not prohibited using use LibreOffice 'rolling'. While a distinction between Home/Private & Business/Organizations might suggesting otherwise. Visa versa is rolling release not always adequate for Home/Private. I think. The might consider LTS. So they story get it for free with some risk of running into something (and contribute by reporting it), and/or accept 'issues' as is. Where the mission isn't being fully stable. Or opt for LTS as more of a save harbor for a small license fee. With also they alternative to keep waiting for say they .5 release or even .7 or .8 (and manually upgrade) From security perspective preferably LTS of course. So using sticking with older unsupported version not advised. With with the rolling release they 'free beer' topic being of the table too. Or kind of public tester, or paying to getting more stable. Thinking about it bit longer: the distinction between Home/Private & Business/Organizations should be made. Where pages for Home users are suggesting rolling primarily (with they option to use LTS) Where they narrative at Business/Organization is primary LTS with rolling as alternative. How it's presented is up to communication department. Story must be such that Home Users feel confident enough using LibreOffice Rolling, whereas it's scary enough for Business/Organizations. And the business pages must also promoting advantages of LTS (incremental updates); distribution templates or whatever used in enterprise setting. Also special topic for Educational institutions to get LibreOffice LTS for free similar to they competition; but that's up to eco-system partners. Somewhat off-topic here: has LibreOffice/ Collabora Online (in combination with a partner) an actual competitor against Office 365 Personal with 1TB subscription. Quite of number off people seeing it as a nice deal especially at Black Friday. Even replacing Dropbox and such. Couldn't find competitive product at Nextcloud providers. It must be possible. There is also cloud storage not connected to Amazon/Google/Microsoft. Something like Stack[1] combined with NextCloud. [1] https://www.transip.nl/stack/ (apparently only Dutch services only; not able to find the same product at www.transip.eu) And even that 'promoted' preferably at LibreOffice.org. Instead of jump through all kinds of hoops searching for a host. Jumping from LibreOffice to Nextcloud to hosting provider etc. Exclusive for LibreOffice. Instead of competition being around too. At Nextcloud Collabora and OnlyOffice are equally placed. Not saying the partner should only host LibreOffice Online.. but at least the 'special page' dedicated to LibreOffice only product with storage. They TransIP stack site makes pretty clear why to use them instead of they major players. Lots of people want something out of the box; not a do it yourself product. It fits the open source mentality but not the mass market, IMHO Regards, Telesto Op 24-10-2020 om 14:27 schreef Cor Nouws: Hi, Telesto wrote on 24/10/2020 10:49: ... And to make 'LTS' bit more attractive.. drop the whole stable/still edition at TDF. People using LibreOffice should be on 'rolling'. If they dislike that they can dig in they archive reprository to find some older version. Also, users don't have to upgrade. But TDF doesn't need to have serve barely supported 'still'. Which being a kind of LTS light. So or they contribute by being in the 'rolling' - permanent improving/regressing testing version. Or opt for the more reliable, older and paid LTS. That's an interesting thought. And apart from what label to chose, one could extend that. For example to show a clear distinction/direction on the website. Simply say what it is. E.g.: --- | LibreOffice Download | | Home/Private | Business/Organization | V|V --- --- | LibreOffice Home/Private | Download | (part of Current page) --- --- | LibreOffice Business/Organization | Download | V || TDF Ecosystem partners provide || various products and services || Please find them here, get the best || out of LibreOffice and support the || development of our and we hope || also your product >>> | | | You can also chose to | download unsupported version here >>> | --- etc. Cheers, Cor -- To unsubscribe e-mail to: marketing+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? https://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: https://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/marketing/ Privacy Policy:
Re: [libreoffice-marketing] The Edition Matter
Hi Telesto, Thanks for engaging and sparking discussion here. There is much that is interesting but this: On 24/10/2020 09:49, Telesto wrote: > And I assume there are some difference between CIB <-> Collabora (except > the name), but I'm surely not knowing what that should be. I mean it, I really > don't know! Between LibreOffice and Powered Editions I can get it. > But even that - LibreOffice by partners being more mature (or older) > editions - not that obvious. > Is CIB better compared to Collabora? Or visa versa? Is there no > difference, but why two versions? I'm still confused here> As a user I would > think, did I buy the right one. [Looking at it regular > user perspective; as they Editions being sold in app stores to general > public too] is a brilliant description of the fundamental problems of sub-brand differentiation. If there is a shared commodity enterprise brand: LibreOffice Enterprise powered by DidYouGetThisFar ? vs. LibreOffice Enterprise powered by EllipsizedAgesAgo we create confusion, we don't allow strong vendor brands, and we inevitably create just another FLOSS commodity: LibreOffice Enterprise for which the price tends to zero. I think any ingredient brand has to go in the other direction eg. "Foo Office powered by LibreOffice technology" So Foo can be known, and differentiate from Baa - that's my 2 cents. As for the other comments in the thread about avoiding tags that make users think something is missing if they're deploying LibreOffice en-masse outside eg. a personal use setting. Surely this is entirely the point. TDF's purpose is not per-se to build a valuable product brand. The purpose of the proposed tag is moral suasion: to encourage the vast number of people who use the software without contributing to contribute either financially or directly themselves. This is not a message aimed at people who read this list =) And of course, anyone competent can drop a file somewhere that changes the splash / about or whatever if they're annoyed as now. At least that was what I thought the idea of the marketing plan is/was. There are of course other ways of achieving similar goals. The tags I've seen sequentially suggested were: 'unsupported' -> 'home' -> 'personal' -> 'community' -> '' ATB, Michael. -- michael.me...@collabora.com <><, GM Collabora Productivity Hangout: mejme...@gmail.com, Skype: mmeeks (M) +44 7795 666 147 - timezone usually UK / Europe -- To unsubscribe e-mail to: marketing+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? https://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: https://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/marketing/ Privacy Policy: https://www.documentfoundation.org/privacy
Re: [libreoffice-marketing] The Edition Matter
[Editted version of the one I posted on the Board mailing list by accident; thanks for reminders :-] Official Edition is really confusing. Which suggests there is also a Unofficial edition. A copycat fork? Or are those LTS releases powered by clones, trying to make a profit from TDF LibreOffice I also find it hard to differentiate between 'branch' and 'edition' LibreOffice by TDF build base ond they 'latest' branch. While LTS being somewhat more 'conventional'. Whereas Edition being mostly about variants of the same thing. So Standard and Professional Edition. Both look the same, but Professional has more features. OK, there are some marketing stunts, where same stuff gets sold with different labels (thinking about fertilizers) with different prices. But that's they exception and feels like deception. Sometimes I tend to 'drop' the explicit mentioning of 'Edition'. Does it really need explicit 'Edition' to be called edition when materially an edition? So the website/wiki etc LibreOffice is promoted as Latest supplied/ made available by TDF. LibreOffice simply called LibreOffice. Prominently being presented as based on a 'rolling' release model/framework which might be more unstable, with a 'fixed' snapshot schedule. So we tag it 7.0.2 for differentiation purposes (bug tracking/communication). But snapshot 'of rolling' Without explicitly guaranteeing 7.0.3 to be better compared to 7.0.2. It often is, but not all they time. Take current 7.0.2 bit a of a calculation disaster compared to 7.0.1 So would advocate a more or less Debian Development model. Rolling model with Cycles (smaller incremental) large major updates. Where LibreOffice LTS powered by being framed a still/stable editions for more 'conventional usage' Note also they distinction by 'powered' and 'supplied' or 'made available' which more passive, compared to powered. TDF simply builds the 'latest' branch, doesn't do much development by itself. And to make 'LTS' bit more attractive.. drop the whole stable/still edition at TDF. People using LibreOffice should be on 'rolling'. If they dislike that they can dig in they archive reprository to find some older version. Also, users don't have to upgrade. But TDF doesn't need to have serve barely supported 'still'. Which being a kind of LTS light. Where as the still branch never had a proper reputation (at least in my world). I mostly pick fresh (or even master). Replace that with a 'LTS story' powered by.. It cheap enough to be bought by regular users. So or they contribute by being in the 'rolling' - permanent improving/regressing testing version. Or opt for the more reliable, older and paid LTS. And we could put a note how to dig up they last release in a cycle. However not to be communicated actively as 'stable'. LibreOffice Rolling (made available by TDF) and LibreOffice LTS powered by XX With same additional text in about box they Rolling release about LTS And communication about they rolling release cycle concept Maybe is made available or distributed by TDF better compared to supplied. As it points out TDF not being directly responsible for the code itself, or at least that there is something more to it. What I personally conceive is a mess if of course 'powered by'. There are two or more LTS versions :-( And I assume there are some difference between CIB <-> Collabora (except the name), but I'm surely not knowing what that should be. I mean it, I really don't know! Between LibreOffice and Powered Editions I can get it. But even that - LibreOffice by partners being more mature (or older) editions - not that obvious. Is CIB better compared to Collabora? Or visa versa? Is there no difference, but why two versions? I'm still confused here. As a user I would think, did I buy the right one. [Looking at it regular user perspective; as they Editions being sold in app stores to general public too] Regards, Telesto Some other editions I made up in a brainstorming session (some are awful) LibreOffice Regular Edition by TDF LibreOffice Common Edition LibreOffice Fresh Edition LibreOffice Feature-rich Edition LibreOffice Innovation Edition LibreOffice Innovative Edition LibreOffice Novel Edition LibreOffice State of the Art Edition LibreOffice Progress Edition LibreOffice Progressive Edition LibreOffice Advancement Edition LibreOffice Latest Edition [problem older editions 'show' latests.. which isn't the case] LibreOffice Active Edition LibreOffice Modern Edition LibreOffice Snapshot edition LibreOffice Rolling Edition LibreOffice Advancing Op 23-10-2020 om 18:43 schreef Simon Phipps: It certainly (correctly) indicates there are unofficial editions in circulation. I see that as a helpful differentiator. I would not jump to the conclusion they are untrustworthy; however, the use of a validated "Libreoffice technology" signifier as Italo has proposed would fix that if it were a problem for other editions to confirm they too are approved by TDF. The
Re: [libreoffice-marketing] The Edition Matter
Hi, Telesto wrote on 24/10/2020 10:49: > ... > And to make 'LTS' bit more attractive.. drop the whole stable/still > edition at TDF. > People using LibreOffice should be on 'rolling'. If they dislike that > they can dig in they archive reprository to find some older version. > Also, users don't have to upgrade. But TDF doesn't need to have serve > barely supported 'still'. Which being a kind of LTS light. > > So or they contribute by being in the 'rolling' - permanent > improving/regressing testing version. Or opt for the more reliable, > older and paid LTS. That's an interesting thought. And apart from what label to chose, one could extend that. For example to show a clear distinction/direction on the website. Simply say what it is. E.g.: --- | LibreOffice Download | | Home/Private | Business/Organization | V|V --- --- | LibreOffice Home/Private | Download | (part of Current page) --- --- | LibreOffice Business/Organization | Download | V || TDF Ecosystem partners provide || various products and services || Please find them here, get the best || out of LibreOffice and support the || development of our and we hope || also your product >>> | | | You can also chose to | download unsupported version here >>> | --- etc. Cheers, Cor -- Cor Nouws GPD key ID: 0xB13480A6 - 591A 30A7 36A0 CE3C 3D28 A038 E49D 7365 B134 80A6 - vrijwilliger https://nl.libreoffice.org - volunteer https://www.libreoffice.org - Member Board The Document Foundation - marketing @CollaboraOffice - ceo www.nouenoff.nl - initiator www.mijncloudoffice.nl -- To unsubscribe e-mail to: marketing+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? https://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: https://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/marketing/ Privacy Policy: https://www.documentfoundation.org/privacy
