Re: [MBZ] 240D Glow Plugs not Glowing Update

2016-10-04 Thread Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes
I won't even LOOK at it.

On Tue, Oct 4, 2016 at 10:47 AM, Dan Penoff via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> Don’t touch it.  They degrade from heating and cooling over time, and
> become really brittle.  Nearly every one I’ve ever replaced has been
> cracked in the center.
>
> Dan
>
>
> > On Oct 4, 2016, at 10:45 AM, Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> >
> > I haven't needed one in at least 7 years and I drive my 1983 300TD daily.
> >
>
>
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Re: [MBZ] 240D Glow Plugs not Glowing Update

2016-10-04 Thread Curt Raymond via Mercedes
I've only had to replace one once, the time the feed line to the relay on my 
(formerly Dwight's) '78 240D somehow laid on the exhaust pipe where the 
insulation melted causing a short. That car absolutely would not start without 
glowplugs. 
My '83 240D would complain but would eventually start...
-Curt

  From: Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes <mercedes@okiebenz.com>
 To: Mercedes Discussion List <mercedes@okiebenz.com> 
Cc: Andrew Strasfogel <astrasfo...@gmail.com>
 Sent: Tuesday, October 4, 2016 10:45 AM
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] 240D Glow Plugs not Glowing Update
   
I haven't needed one in at least 7 years and I drive my 1983 300TD daily.

On Tue, Oct 4, 2016 at 9:24 AM, WILTON via Mercedes <mercedes@okiebenz.com>
wrote:

> 'Bout 15 years ago, I needed one of those fuses; went to local VW
> stealership and got 2.  Installed one and put the spare in an envelope in
> glove compartment of the 81 300D for possible use later.  2 or 3 years
> later, I was  cleaning out the glove compartment when selling the car;
> opened the envelope and found that  the fuse had disintegrated into very
> little melted "beads."
> Lesson:  Don't store the spare where it gets hot.
>
> W
>
> - Original Message - From: "Dan Penoff via Mercedes" <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com>
> To: "Mercedes List" <mercedes@okiebenz.com>
> Cc: "Dan Penoff" <d...@penoff.com>
> Sent: Monday, October 03, 2016 7:14 PM
> Subject: Re: [MBZ] 240D Glow Plugs not Glowing Update
>
>
> That is the “strip” fuse, John.  Just as described in previous posts.
>> Replace it and you should be good to go - buy a couple of spares to have
>> around, too.
>>
>> Dan
>>
>>
>>
>> On Oct 3, 2016, at 7:12 PM, John Ingram via Mercedes <
>>> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> Hello Everyone,
>>> I went out to the car and searched for the fuse and finally found it
>>> inside the cover on top of the relay.  I hope it is the right fuse because
>>> it was blown and came out in two pieces.  It is just a steel band and looks
>>> like the fuses in the on-line websites.  The only lettering I can find
>>> looks to say 80A and is followed by a P with a circle around it. Is this
>>> possible?
>>> This car is a very late 83 240D, one of the last ones sent.  Over the
>>> years I have had to use the VIN number in order to get the right part.  I
>>> think MBZ was using the parts they had left when they made this car. Some
>>> parts were clearly from earlier years, others may have been last minute
>>> changes.
>>> I think I’ll look for a fuse first (80A?), It might fix it.
>>> Thank you all again for your help!
>>> John Ingram
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ___
>>> http://www.okiebenz.com
>>>
>>> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>>>
>>> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
>>> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>>>
>>>
>>
>> ___
>> http://www.okiebenz.com
>>
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>>
>> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
>> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>>
>>
>>
>
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Re: [MBZ] 240D Glow Plugs not Glowing Update

2016-10-04 Thread Dan Penoff via Mercedes
Don’t touch it.  They degrade from heating and cooling over time, and become 
really brittle.  Nearly every one I’ve ever replaced has been cracked in the 
center.

Dan


> On Oct 4, 2016, at 10:45 AM, Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes 
>  wrote:
> 
> I haven't needed one in at least 7 years and I drive my 1983 300TD daily.
> 


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Re: [MBZ] 240D Glow Plugs not Glowing Update

2016-10-04 Thread Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes
I haven't needed one in at least 7 years and I drive my 1983 300TD daily.

On Tue, Oct 4, 2016 at 9:24 AM, WILTON via Mercedes <mercedes@okiebenz.com>
wrote:

> 'Bout 15 years ago, I needed one of those fuses; went to local VW
> stealership and got 2.  Installed one and put the spare in an envelope in
> glove compartment of the 81 300D for possible use later.  2 or 3 years
> later, I was  cleaning out the glove compartment when selling the car;
> opened the envelope and found that  the fuse had disintegrated into very
> little melted "beads."
> Lesson:  Don't store the spare where it gets hot.
>
> W
>
> - Original Message - From: "Dan Penoff via Mercedes" <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com>
> To: "Mercedes List" <mercedes@okiebenz.com>
> Cc: "Dan Penoff" <d...@penoff.com>
> Sent: Monday, October 03, 2016 7:14 PM
> Subject: Re: [MBZ] 240D Glow Plugs not Glowing Update
>
>
> That is the “strip” fuse, John.  Just as described in previous posts.
>> Replace it and you should be good to go - buy a couple of spares to have
>> around, too.
>>
>> Dan
>>
>>
>>
>> On Oct 3, 2016, at 7:12 PM, John Ingram via Mercedes <
>>> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> Hello Everyone,
>>> I went out to the car and searched for the fuse and finally found it
>>> inside the cover on top of the relay.  I hope it is the right fuse because
>>> it was blown and came out in two pieces.  It is just a steel band and looks
>>> like the fuses in the on-line websites.  The only lettering I can find
>>> looks to say 80A and is followed by a P with a circle around it. Is this
>>> possible?
>>> This car is a very late 83 240D, one of the last ones sent.  Over the
>>> years I have had to use the VIN number in order to get the right part.  I
>>> think MBZ was using the parts they had left when they made this car. Some
>>> parts were clearly from earlier years, others may have been last minute
>>> changes.
>>> I think I’ll look for a fuse first (80A?), It might fix it.
>>> Thank you all again for your help!
>>> John Ingram
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ___
>>> http://www.okiebenz.com
>>>
>>> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>>>
>>> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
>>> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>>>
>>>
>>
>> ___
>> http://www.okiebenz.com
>>
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>>
>> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
>> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>>
>>
>>
>
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>
>
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Re: [MBZ] 240D Glow Plugs not Glowing Update

2016-10-04 Thread WILTON via Mercedes
'Bout 15 years ago, I needed one of those fuses; went to local VW 
stealership and got 2.  Installed one and put the spare in an envelope in 
glove compartment of the 81 300D for possible use later.  2 or 3 years 
later, I was  cleaning out the glove compartment when selling the car; 
opened the envelope and found that  the fuse had disintegrated into very 
little melted "beads."

Lesson:  Don't store the spare where it gets hot.

W

- Original Message - 
From: "Dan Penoff via Mercedes" <mercedes@okiebenz.com>

To: "Mercedes List" <mercedes@okiebenz.com>
Cc: "Dan Penoff" <d...@penoff.com>
Sent: Monday, October 03, 2016 7:14 PM
Subject: Re: [MBZ] 240D Glow Plugs not Glowing Update


That is the “strip” fuse, John.  Just as described in previous posts. 
Replace it and you should be good to go - buy a couple of spares to have 
around, too.


Dan



On Oct 3, 2016, at 7:12 PM, John Ingram via Mercedes 
<mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:


Hello Everyone,
I went out to the car and searched for the fuse and finally found it 
inside the cover on top of the relay.  I hope it is the right fuse 
because it was blown and came out in two pieces.  It is just a steel band 
and looks like the fuses in the on-line websites.  The only lettering I 
can find looks to say 80A and is followed by a P with a circle around it. 
Is this possible?
This car is a very late 83 240D, one of the last ones sent.  Over the 
years I have had to use the VIN number in order to get the right part.  I 
think MBZ was using the parts they had left when they made this car. Some 
parts were clearly from earlier years, others may have been last minute 
changes.

I think I’ll look for a fuse first (80A?), It might fix it.
Thank you all again for your help!
John Ingram



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Re: [MBZ] 240D Glow Plugs not Glowing Update

2016-10-04 Thread fmiser via Mercedes
> Curley wrote:
> 
> Since the fuse blew, you could still have a grounded GP.

Yup.  Or just a "worn" fuse.  I have never overloaded one of those
fuses - but I've replace a lot of failed ones.

> Without a meter that has a range of 0-20 or 0-50 ohms or a finer
> scale, or a digital that can read in 10th of an ohm, it is very
> difficult to discriminate between a shorted GP and a good GP.

I'll repeat what I've written before about the best method I've
found for testing glow plugs.

I attached 12 AWG wire leads to an old automotive dash style
ammeter that reads -30 0 +30 Amps.

To use it, I pop the top off of the glow relay and unplug the
connector for the glow plugs. There is a contact for each glow plug
in this connector.  I clip one meter lead to the fused side of the
big, screw-in fuse and then touch each glowplug contact, one at a
time. The socket has pin numbers molded into it, and these numbers
correspond to the cylinder number.

This method tests the supply 12V, the wire, and the plug. When
cold, a good plug draws about 20A (Well, on my meter it point
to the mark for 20 amps. I have not calibrated or tested the
accuracy of that meter...) It will drop back to about 15A
after 8-10 seconds.

Once the one wire is connected to the fuse, DO NOT LET THE
OTHER WIRE TOUCH CHASSIS GROUND!!!  Or the big fuse will blow
and possibly so will your ammeter. :)

If the plug is bad, the current will usually be less.  If it is
shorted it will be much more.

If the wire or connectors are in poor shape, the current will
be less.

If the supply voltage is low, the current will be less.

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Re: [MBZ] 240D Glow Plugs not Glowing Update

2016-10-03 Thread David Bruckmann via Mercedes
According to the EPC, an 80-amp fuse is correct for 240Ds with FG numbers after 
149279


On Monday, 03 Oct 2016, Curley McLain wrote:
>
>The 80 amp fuse is intended for running 6 glow plugs.  It is the WRONG 
>fuse.  The correct fuse looks the same but will be 50 amp.  This was in 
>my post yesterday.  Another post yesterday told you the fuse was in the 
>top of the relay, under the relay cover, and exactly how to take the 
>cover off.


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Re: [MBZ] 240D Glow Plugs not Glowing Update

2016-10-03 Thread Floyd Thursby via Mercedes

Curley is The Last Word

--FT


On 10/3/16 8:33 PM, Curley McLain via Mercedes wrote:
The 80 amp fuse is intended for running 6 glow plugs.  It is the WRONG 
fuse.  The correct fuse looks the same but will be 50 amp.  This was 
in my post yesterday.  Another post yesterday told you the fuse was in 
the top of the relay, under the relay cover, and exactly how to take 
the cover off.


Since the fuse blew, you could still have a grounded GP.  If so, the 
next fuse will blow also.  Each fuse will blow until you locate and 
correct the problem.  It is also possible that one of the wires to the 
GP is shorted to the block.  This is a common problem in the OM60x 
engines, and less common on the iron head engines like yours.  I'd 
guess you have a shorted out GP.  The test procedure is in my post 
from last night.  Without a meter that has a range of 0-20 or 0-50 
ohms or a finer scale, or a digital that can read in 10th of an ohm, 
it is very difficult to discriminate between a shorted GP and a good GP.


At any rate, before you stick in another fuse, test the ohm readings 
at GP wire harness that plugs into the GP relay.  Read the ohms 
between each of the 4 sockets with liners in them and a good ground.  
A good GP will read 1.4 ohms + or - 0.5 ohm.  A grounded plug will 
read 0 or the same reading you get when you hold the two meter probes 
together.  (depending on the meter, this may not be 0)





John Ingram via Mercedes 
October 3, 2016 at 6:12 PM
Hello Everyone,
I went out to the car and searched for the fuse and finally found it 
inside the cover on top of the relay. I hope it is the right fuse 
because it was blown and came out in two pieces. It is just a steel 
band and looks like the fuses in the on-line websites. The only 
lettering I can find looks to say 80A and is followed by a P with a 
circle around it. Is this possible?
This car is a very late 83 240D, one of the last ones sent. Over the 
years I have had to use the VIN number in order to get the right 
part. I think MBZ was using the parts they had left when they made 
this car. Some parts were clearly from earlier years, others may have 
been last minute changes.

I think I’ll look for a fuse first (80A?), It might fix it.
Thank you all again for your help!
John Ingram



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--
--FT


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Re: [MBZ] 240D Glow Plugs not Glowing Update

2016-10-03 Thread Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes
Buy and keep a couple in the glove box.

On Mon, Oct 3, 2016 at 8:33 PM, Curley McLain via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> The 80 amp fuse is intended for running 6 glow plugs.  It is the WRONG
> fuse.  The correct fuse looks the same but will be 50 amp.  This was in my
> post yesterday.  Another post yesterday told you the fuse was in the top of
> the relay, under the relay cover, and exactly how to take the cover off.
>
> Since the fuse blew, you could still have a grounded GP.  If so, the next
> fuse will blow also.  Each fuse will blow until you locate and correct the
> problem.  It is also possible that one of the wires to the GP is shorted to
> the block.  This is a common problem in the OM60x engines, and less common
> on the iron head engines like yours.  I'd guess you have a shorted out GP.
> The test procedure is in my post from last night.  Without a meter that has
> a range of 0-20 or 0-50 ohms or a finer scale, or a digital that can read
> in 10th of an ohm, it is very difficult to discriminate between a shorted
> GP and a good GP.
>
> At any rate, before you stick in another fuse, test the ohm readings at GP
> wire harness that plugs into the GP relay.  Read the ohms between each of
> the 4 sockets with liners in them and a good ground.  A good GP will read
> 1.4 ohms + or - 0.5 ohm.  A grounded plug will read 0 or the same reading
> you get when you hold the two meter probes together.  (depending on the
> meter, this may not be 0)
>
>
>
> John Ingram via Mercedes 
>> October 3, 2016 at 6:12 PM
>>
>> Hello Everyone,
>> I went out to the car and searched for the fuse and finally found it
>> inside the cover on top of the relay. I hope it is the right fuse because
>> it was blown and came out in two pieces. It is just a steel band and looks
>> like the fuses in the on-line websites. The only lettering I can find looks
>> to say 80A and is followed by a P with a circle around it. Is this possible?
>> This car is a very late 83 240D, one of the last ones sent. Over the
>> years I have had to use the VIN number in order to get the right part. I
>> think MBZ was using the parts they had left when they made this car. Some
>> parts were clearly from earlier years, others may have been last minute
>> changes.
>> I think I’ll look for a fuse first (80A?), It might fix it.
>> Thank you all again for your help!
>> John Ingram
>>
>>
>>
>> ___
>> http://www.okiebenz.com
>>
>> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>>
>> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
>> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>>
>>
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>
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>
>
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Re: [MBZ] 240D Glow Plugs not Glowing Update

2016-10-03 Thread Curley McLain via Mercedes
The 80 amp fuse is intended for running 6 glow plugs.  It is the WRONG 
fuse.  The correct fuse looks the same but will be 50 amp.  This was in 
my post yesterday.  Another post yesterday told you the fuse was in the 
top of the relay, under the relay cover, and exactly how to take the 
cover off.


Since the fuse blew, you could still have a grounded GP.  If so, the 
next fuse will blow also.  Each fuse will blow until you locate and 
correct the problem.  It is also possible that one of the wires to the 
GP is shorted to the block.  This is a common problem in the OM60x 
engines, and less common on the iron head engines like yours.  I'd guess 
you have a shorted out GP.  The test procedure is in my post from last 
night.  Without a meter that has a range of 0-20 or 0-50 ohms or a finer 
scale, or a digital that can read in 10th of an ohm, it is very 
difficult to discriminate between a shorted GP and a good GP.


At any rate, before you stick in another fuse, test the ohm readings at 
GP wire harness that plugs into the GP relay.  Read the ohms between 
each of the 4 sockets with liners in them and a good ground.  A good GP 
will read 1.4 ohms + or - 0.5 ohm.  A grounded plug will read 0 or the 
same reading you get when you hold the two meter probes together.  
(depending on the meter, this may not be 0)





John Ingram via Mercedes 
October 3, 2016 at 6:12 PM
Hello Everyone,
I went out to the car and searched for the fuse and finally found it 
inside the cover on top of the relay. I hope it is the right fuse 
because it was blown and came out in two pieces. It is just a steel 
band and looks like the fuses in the on-line websites. The only 
lettering I can find looks to say 80A and is followed by a P with a 
circle around it. Is this possible?
This car is a very late 83 240D, one of the last ones sent. Over the 
years I have had to use the VIN number in order to get the right part. 
I think MBZ was using the parts they had left when they made this car. 
Some parts were clearly from earlier years, others may have been last 
minute changes.

I think I’ll look for a fuse first (80A?), It might fix it.
Thank you all again for your help!
John Ingram



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Re: [MBZ] 240D Glow Plugs not Glowing Update

2016-10-03 Thread Floyd Thursby via Mercedes
80A.  That's what I meant. I think.  Whatever it is you can get them at 
the stealer, they are (or used to be) pretty cheap.  Keep a few in the 
glove box along with a screwdriver for any field repairs.


--FT


On 10/3/16 7:14 PM, Dan Penoff via Mercedes wrote:

That is the “strip” fuse, John.  Just as described in previous posts.  Replace 
it and you should be good to go - buy a couple of spares to have around, too.

Dan




On Oct 3, 2016, at 7:12 PM, John Ingram via Mercedes  
wrote:

Hello Everyone,
I went out to the car and searched for the fuse and finally found it inside the 
cover on top of the relay.  I hope it is the right fuse because it was blown 
and came out in two pieces.  It is just a steel band and looks like the fuses 
in the on-line websites.  The only lettering I can find looks to say 80A and is 
followed by a P with a circle around it. Is this possible?
This car is a very late 83 240D, one of the last ones sent.  Over the years I 
have had to use the VIN number in order to get the right part.  I think MBZ was 
using the parts they had left when they made this car. Some parts were clearly 
from earlier years, others may have been last minute changes.
I think I’ll look for a fuse first (80A?), It might fix it.
Thank you all again for your help!
John Ingram



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--
--FT


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Re: [MBZ] 240D Glow Plugs not Glowing Update

2016-10-03 Thread Dan Penoff via Mercedes
That is the “strip” fuse, John.  Just as described in previous posts.  Replace 
it and you should be good to go - buy a couple of spares to have around, too.

Dan



> On Oct 3, 2016, at 7:12 PM, John Ingram via Mercedes  
> wrote:
> 
> Hello Everyone,
> I went out to the car and searched for the fuse and finally found it inside 
> the cover on top of the relay.  I hope it is the right fuse because it was 
> blown and came out in two pieces.  It is just a steel band and looks like the 
> fuses in the on-line websites.  The only lettering I can find looks to say 
> 80A and is followed by a P with a circle around it. Is this possible? 
> This car is a very late 83 240D, one of the last ones sent.  Over the years I 
> have had to use the VIN number in order to get the right part.  I think MBZ 
> was using the parts they had left when they made this car. Some parts were 
> clearly from earlier years, others may have been last minute changes. 
> I think I’ll look for a fuse first (80A?), It might fix it.  
> Thank you all again for your help!
> John Ingram
> 
> 
> 
> ___
> http://www.okiebenz.com
> 
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[MBZ] 240D Glow Plugs not Glowing Update

2016-10-03 Thread John Ingram via Mercedes
Hello Everyone,
I went out to the car and searched for the fuse and finally found it inside the 
cover on top of the relay.  I hope it is the right fuse because it was blown 
and came out in two pieces.  It is just a steel band and looks like the fuses 
in the on-line websites.  The only lettering I can find looks to say 80A and is 
followed by a P with a circle around it. Is this possible? 
This car is a very late 83 240D, one of the last ones sent.  Over the years I 
have had to use the VIN number in order to get the right part.  I think MBZ was 
using the parts they had left when they made this car. Some parts were clearly 
from earlier years, others may have been last minute changes. 
I think I’ll look for a fuse first (80A?), It might fix it.  
Thank you all again for your help!
John Ingram


 
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