Re: [MBZ] Fwd: 1992 Mercedes Benz 300D Turbo Diesel
Hey! I have a great engine in my 91 300D! Make me a offer? Comes with a Sun Valley rebuilt Auto Trans and a 91 300D attached. ;-) LarryT On 02/10/2019 9:32 PM, G Mann via Mercedes wrote: Sorry if I rained on the parade. What would raise a caution flag for me is that it ran poorly and present owner changed filters [don't know how many times at this point]. To my experience, that indicates the previous owner was not running clean fuel, which also tells me he was not doing the acid check or removal. Thus, hidden damage. OTOH, if the rest of the car is nice, and you had a spare engine and fuel tank Bobs yer Unkle..for the right buy in price... On Sun, Feb 10, 2019 at 12:43 PM Bob Rentfro via Mercedes < mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote: Sounds like, that if you were looking for a car to drive a 80 mile commute for the next three year, you’d pass on this. I suppose the fact that it hadn’t sold by now should tell me something. Thanks, Grant. Bob R Sent from my iPhone On Feb 10, 2019, at 11:46 AM, G Mann via Mercedes wrote: Bob, I'll take a shot at your very good question "Can I diagnose if there is damage". Answer #1: If it has had unfiltered and unheated WVO used in sufficient quantity, the damage will be apparent, if you look for it. It is "hidden damage" because it will be internal to engine and fuel system, but that damage will show up as hard starts, poor idle, poor acceleration, and low power under load. [All subjective calls for someone looking at a "new" car, so a challenge.] Answer #2: Scenario 2 is the car was used by Previous Owner who knew how to manage a WVO system, only ran filtered and de-acidified WVO, The car is equipped with a separate dedicated WVO tank AND a WVO heating system that ensures 180 F oil delivered to the IP. Inspection of the car and looking for all those WVO system components in working order, will answer some concerns, interrogation of the Previous owner as to if he used it correctly, will answer others, maybe. Answer #3: IP and injector damage has happened, along with precup and valve carbon buildup, the only question is, can you live with it until you can afford to replace the IP and injectors, pull the head and remove carbon, repair the damage done to rings, cylinder walls, and piston skirts, and other rotating parts in the engine which are the result of incomplete combustion of WVO and high carbon accumulation on those parts and in the oil system. I have a friend of several years who runs a company that rebuilds Diesel Injection Pumps. His experience with WVO engines and pumps is such that he now turns away work on a WVO IP, simply because the internal damage is so high the pumps invariably, on tear down inspection, fall into the "Beyond Economic Repair" box. Owners routinely refuse to spend the bucks for a new pump or a new rebuilt pump PLUS a core charge because their WVO pump is junk. Clearances on mechanical injection pumps is very tight, WVO with acid not removed destroys those clearances, at the most critical places to make and hold pressure. This loss of clearance alters engine timing, which loses performance, starting, idle... etc etc.. <---> I have a depth of experience in these issues and the WVO / BioDiesel world. In 2007 I designed, built, and certified a BioDiesel refinery with design capacity of 20mm gallons per month. Pretty much danced all the steps in the WVO world over the past 20 yrs in one capacity or another. Hope this helps, Grant... On Sun, Feb 10, 2019 at 9:58 AM Bob Rentfro via Mercedes < mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote: I appreciate Curley, GMann and Curt’s explanation on this but I was just curious what someone like me could inspect on a vehicle like that to see if waste oil has done bad things. Is it an acute or a chronic thing? Bob R Sent from my iPad On Feb 10, 2019, at 9:31 AM, Bob Rentfro wrote: As is my luck, this is in Vegas so I can’t simply go give it a look. Plus, I’m not even sure what to look at/check out to see if the waste oil usage has done some irreparable damage. The current owner says he doesn’t know how often the PO used the waste oil and he has not sent me a pic of the setup that is in the car. Ugh Bob R Sent from my iPad On Feb 10, 2019, at 8:11 AM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes < mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote: Biod won't hurt anything, it's basically diesel. Veggie oil is what you need to worry about. Most veggie "conversions" are "I'm winging it". Curt Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android On Sat, Feb 9, 2019 at 9:04 PM, Dwight Giles via Mercedes< mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote: Well if it has been run on bio it might mean run away. That said my 2.5t ON 602 was best car I had in 55 years of driving. Maybe it is just the viton lines as Kevin said. Also find out what % BioD was run. Waste veg or commercial BioD? Could be a good buy. Dwight Giles Jr. Wickford RI On Feb 9, 2019 8:50 PM, "Bob Rentfro via Mercedes" < mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote: W
Re: [MBZ] Fwd: 1992 Mercedes Benz 300D Turbo Diesel
124 fuel tanks are easy to come by cheap. Car-part.com is the source. 300E/E320 vergassers are plentiful. I have spare good compete engines. G Mann via Mercedes wrote on 2/10/19 8:32 PM: Sorry if I rained on the parade. What would raise a caution flag for me is that it ran poorly and present owner changed filters [don't know how many times at this point]. To my experience, that indicates the previous owner was not running clean fuel, which also tells me he was not doing the acid check or removal. Thus, hidden damage. OTOH, if the rest of the car is nice, and you had a spare engine and fuel tank Bobs yer Unkle..for the right buy in price... ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Fwd: 1992 Mercedes Benz 300D Turbo Diesel
Sorry if I rained on the parade. What would raise a caution flag for me is that it ran poorly and present owner changed filters [don't know how many times at this point]. To my experience, that indicates the previous owner was not running clean fuel, which also tells me he was not doing the acid check or removal. Thus, hidden damage. OTOH, if the rest of the car is nice, and you had a spare engine and fuel tank Bobs yer Unkle..for the right buy in price... On Sun, Feb 10, 2019 at 12:43 PM Bob Rentfro via Mercedes < mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote: > Sounds like, that if you were looking for a car to drive a 80 mile commute > for the next three year, you’d pass on this. > > I suppose the fact that it hadn’t sold by now should tell me something. > > Thanks, Grant. > > Bob R > > Sent from my iPhone > > > On Feb 10, 2019, at 11:46 AM, G Mann via Mercedes > wrote: > > > > Bob, > > I'll take a shot at your very good question "Can I diagnose if there is > > damage". > > > > Answer #1: If it has had unfiltered and unheated WVO used in sufficient > > quantity, the damage will be apparent, if you look for it. It is "hidden > > damage" because it will be internal to engine and fuel system, but that > > damage will show up as hard starts, poor idle, poor acceleration, and low > > power under load. [All subjective calls for someone looking at a "new" > car, > > so a challenge.] > > > > Answer #2: Scenario 2 is the car was used by Previous Owner who knew how > to > > manage a WVO system, only ran filtered and de-acidified WVO, The car is > > equipped with a separate dedicated WVO tank AND a WVO heating system that > > ensures 180 F oil delivered to the IP. > > Inspection of the car and looking for all those WVO system components in > > working order, will answer some concerns, interrogation of the Previous > > owner as to if he used it correctly, will answer others, maybe. > > > > Answer #3: IP and injector damage has happened, along with precup and > valve > > carbon buildup, the only question is, can you live with it until you can > > afford to replace the IP and injectors, pull the head and remove carbon, > > repair the damage done to rings, cylinder walls, and piston skirts, and > > other rotating parts in the engine which are the result of incomplete > > combustion of WVO and high carbon accumulation on those parts and in the > > oil system. > > > > I have a friend of several years who runs a company that rebuilds Diesel > > Injection Pumps. His experience with WVO engines and pumps is such that > he > > now turns away work on a WVO IP, simply because the internal damage is so > > high the pumps invariably, on tear down inspection, fall into the "Beyond > > Economic Repair" box. > > Owners routinely refuse to spend the bucks for a new pump or a new > rebuilt > > pump PLUS a core charge because their WVO pump is junk. > > > > Clearances on mechanical injection pumps is very tight, WVO with acid not > > removed destroys those clearances, at the most critical places to make > and > > hold pressure. This loss of clearance alters engine timing, which loses > > performance, starting, idle... etc etc.. > > <---> > > I have a depth of experience in these issues and the WVO / BioDiesel > > world. In 2007 I designed, built, and certified a BioDiesel refinery with > > design capacity of 20mm gallons per month. Pretty much danced all the > steps > > in the WVO world over the past 20 yrs in one capacity or another. > > > > Hope this helps, > > Grant... > > > > > > On Sun, Feb 10, 2019 at 9:58 AM Bob Rentfro via Mercedes < > > mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote: > > > >> I appreciate Curley, GMann and Curt’s explanation on this but I was just > >> curious what someone like me could inspect on a vehicle like that to > see if > >> waste oil has done bad things. > >> Is it an acute or a chronic thing? > >> > >> Bob R > >> > >> Sent from my iPad > >> > >>> On Feb 10, 2019, at 9:31 AM, Bob Rentfro wrote: > >>> > >>> As is my luck, this is in Vegas so I can’t simply go give it a look. > >> Plus, I’m not even sure what to look at/check out to see if the waste > oil > >> usage has done some irreparable damage. The current owner says he > doesn’t > >> know how often the PO used the waste oil and he has not sent me a pic of > >> the setup that is in the car. Ugh > >>> > >>> Bob R > >>> > >>> Sent from my iPad > >>> > On Feb 10, 2019, at 8:11 AM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes < > >> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote: > > Biod won't hurt anything, it's basically diesel. Veggie oil is what > you > >> need to worry about. Most veggie "conversions" are "I'm winging it". > > Curt > > Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android > > On Sat, Feb 9, 2019 at 9:04 PM, Dwight Giles via Mercedes< > >> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote: Well if it has been run on bio it might > >> mean run away. That said my 2.5t > ON 602 was best car I had in 55 years of driving. Maybe it is just the > viton lines a
Re: [MBZ] Fwd: 1992 Mercedes Benz 300D Turbo Diesel
Sounds like, that if you were looking for a car to drive a 80 mile commute for the next three year, you’d pass on this. I suppose the fact that it hadn’t sold by now should tell me something. Thanks, Grant. Bob R Sent from my iPhone > On Feb 10, 2019, at 11:46 AM, G Mann via Mercedes > wrote: > > Bob, > I'll take a shot at your very good question "Can I diagnose if there is > damage". > > Answer #1: If it has had unfiltered and unheated WVO used in sufficient > quantity, the damage will be apparent, if you look for it. It is "hidden > damage" because it will be internal to engine and fuel system, but that > damage will show up as hard starts, poor idle, poor acceleration, and low > power under load. [All subjective calls for someone looking at a "new" car, > so a challenge.] > > Answer #2: Scenario 2 is the car was used by Previous Owner who knew how to > manage a WVO system, only ran filtered and de-acidified WVO, The car is > equipped with a separate dedicated WVO tank AND a WVO heating system that > ensures 180 F oil delivered to the IP. > Inspection of the car and looking for all those WVO system components in > working order, will answer some concerns, interrogation of the Previous > owner as to if he used it correctly, will answer others, maybe. > > Answer #3: IP and injector damage has happened, along with precup and valve > carbon buildup, the only question is, can you live with it until you can > afford to replace the IP and injectors, pull the head and remove carbon, > repair the damage done to rings, cylinder walls, and piston skirts, and > other rotating parts in the engine which are the result of incomplete > combustion of WVO and high carbon accumulation on those parts and in the > oil system. > > I have a friend of several years who runs a company that rebuilds Diesel > Injection Pumps. His experience with WVO engines and pumps is such that he > now turns away work on a WVO IP, simply because the internal damage is so > high the pumps invariably, on tear down inspection, fall into the "Beyond > Economic Repair" box. > Owners routinely refuse to spend the bucks for a new pump or a new rebuilt > pump PLUS a core charge because their WVO pump is junk. > > Clearances on mechanical injection pumps is very tight, WVO with acid not > removed destroys those clearances, at the most critical places to make and > hold pressure. This loss of clearance alters engine timing, which loses > performance, starting, idle... etc etc.. > <---> > I have a depth of experience in these issues and the WVO / BioDiesel > world. In 2007 I designed, built, and certified a BioDiesel refinery with > design capacity of 20mm gallons per month. Pretty much danced all the steps > in the WVO world over the past 20 yrs in one capacity or another. > > Hope this helps, > Grant... > > > On Sun, Feb 10, 2019 at 9:58 AM Bob Rentfro via Mercedes < > mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote: > >> I appreciate Curley, GMann and Curt’s explanation on this but I was just >> curious what someone like me could inspect on a vehicle like that to see if >> waste oil has done bad things. >> Is it an acute or a chronic thing? >> >> Bob R >> >> Sent from my iPad >> >>> On Feb 10, 2019, at 9:31 AM, Bob Rentfro wrote: >>> >>> As is my luck, this is in Vegas so I can’t simply go give it a look. >> Plus, I’m not even sure what to look at/check out to see if the waste oil >> usage has done some irreparable damage. The current owner says he doesn’t >> know how often the PO used the waste oil and he has not sent me a pic of >> the setup that is in the car. Ugh >>> >>> Bob R >>> >>> Sent from my iPad >>> On Feb 10, 2019, at 8:11 AM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes < >> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote: Biod won't hurt anything, it's basically diesel. Veggie oil is what you >> need to worry about. Most veggie "conversions" are "I'm winging it". Curt Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android On Sat, Feb 9, 2019 at 9:04 PM, Dwight Giles via Mercedes< >> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote: Well if it has been run on bio it might >> mean run away. That said my 2.5t ON 602 was best car I had in 55 years of driving. Maybe it is just the viton lines as Kevin said. Also find out what % BioD was run. Waste veg >> or commercial BioD? Could be a good buy. Dwight Giles Jr. Wickford RI On Feb 9, 2019 8:50 PM, "Bob Rentfro via Mercedes" < >> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote: What do you reckon “biodiesel converted” means? Waste veg kit installed? Dude hasn’t answered text yet. Bob R Sent from my iPad > > 1992 Mercedes Benz 300D Turbo Diesel > > https://lasvegas.craigslist.org/cto/6813367350.html > > Please go to the preferences page if you don't want to receive email-a-friend messages in the future. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com >>
Re: [MBZ] Fwd: 1992 Mercedes Benz 300D Turbo Diesel
Bob, I'll take a shot at your very good question "Can I diagnose if there is damage". Answer #1: If it has had unfiltered and unheated WVO used in sufficient quantity, the damage will be apparent, if you look for it. It is "hidden damage" because it will be internal to engine and fuel system, but that damage will show up as hard starts, poor idle, poor acceleration, and low power under load. [All subjective calls for someone looking at a "new" car, so a challenge.] Answer #2: Scenario 2 is the car was used by Previous Owner who knew how to manage a WVO system, only ran filtered and de-acidified WVO, The car is equipped with a separate dedicated WVO tank AND a WVO heating system that ensures 180 F oil delivered to the IP. Inspection of the car and looking for all those WVO system components in working order, will answer some concerns, interrogation of the Previous owner as to if he used it correctly, will answer others, maybe. Answer #3: IP and injector damage has happened, along with precup and valve carbon buildup, the only question is, can you live with it until you can afford to replace the IP and injectors, pull the head and remove carbon, repair the damage done to rings, cylinder walls, and piston skirts, and other rotating parts in the engine which are the result of incomplete combustion of WVO and high carbon accumulation on those parts and in the oil system. I have a friend of several years who runs a company that rebuilds Diesel Injection Pumps. His experience with WVO engines and pumps is such that he now turns away work on a WVO IP, simply because the internal damage is so high the pumps invariably, on tear down inspection, fall into the "Beyond Economic Repair" box. Owners routinely refuse to spend the bucks for a new pump or a new rebuilt pump PLUS a core charge because their WVO pump is junk. Clearances on mechanical injection pumps is very tight, WVO with acid not removed destroys those clearances, at the most critical places to make and hold pressure. This loss of clearance alters engine timing, which loses performance, starting, idle... etc etc.. <---> I have a depth of experience in these issues and the WVO / BioDiesel world. In 2007 I designed, built, and certified a BioDiesel refinery with design capacity of 20mm gallons per month. Pretty much danced all the steps in the WVO world over the past 20 yrs in one capacity or another. Hope this helps, Grant... On Sun, Feb 10, 2019 at 9:58 AM Bob Rentfro via Mercedes < mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote: > I appreciate Curley, GMann and Curt’s explanation on this but I was just > curious what someone like me could inspect on a vehicle like that to see if > waste oil has done bad things. > Is it an acute or a chronic thing? > > Bob R > > Sent from my iPad > > > On Feb 10, 2019, at 9:31 AM, Bob Rentfro wrote: > > > > As is my luck, this is in Vegas so I can’t simply go give it a look. > Plus, I’m not even sure what to look at/check out to see if the waste oil > usage has done some irreparable damage. The current owner says he doesn’t > know how often the PO used the waste oil and he has not sent me a pic of > the setup that is in the car. Ugh > > > > Bob R > > > > Sent from my iPad > > > >> On Feb 10, 2019, at 8:11 AM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes < > mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote: > >> > >> Biod won't hurt anything, it's basically diesel. Veggie oil is what you > need to worry about. Most veggie "conversions" are "I'm winging it". > >> > >> Curt > >> > >> Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android > >> > >> On Sat, Feb 9, 2019 at 9:04 PM, Dwight Giles via Mercedes< > mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote: Well if it has been run on bio it might > mean run away. That said my 2.5t > >> ON 602 was best car I had in 55 years of driving. Maybe it is just the > >> viton lines as Kevin said. Also find out what % BioD was run. Waste veg > or > >> commercial BioD? Could be a good buy. > >> > >> Dwight Giles Jr. > >> Wickford RI > >> > >> On Feb 9, 2019 8:50 PM, "Bob Rentfro via Mercedes" < > mercedes@okiebenz.com> > >> wrote: > >> > >> What do you reckon “biodiesel converted” means? Waste veg kit installed? > >> > >> Dude hasn’t answered text yet. > >> > >> Bob R > >> > >> Sent from my iPad > >> > >> > >>> > >>> 1992 Mercedes Benz 300D Turbo Diesel > >>> > >>> https://lasvegas.craigslist.org/cto/6813367350.html > >>> > >>> Please go to the preferences page if you don't want to receive > >> email-a-friend messages in the future. > >> ___ > >> http://www.okiebenz.com > >> > >> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ > >> > >> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: > >> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com > >> ___ > >> http://www.okiebenz.com > >> > >> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ > >> > >> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: > >> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okieb
Re: [MBZ] Fwd: 1992 Mercedes Benz 300D Turbo Diesel
This time last year all diesels around here were froze up because of an unexpected cold snap and improperly winterized fuel. Guys were hauling PowerService in from down south by the case... Both our cars were sick from it until I could get sufficient PS into them to fix things. I got a couple free tanks of fuel in compensation from a local station. Curt Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android On Sun, Feb 10, 2019 at 12:28 PM, Peter Frederick via Mercedes wrote: I've heard about a few -- typically waste oil will greatly enhance the growth of "algae" in the tank, resulting in black crap clogging the screen and filters very quickly -- ran through a few on the "new" 300D because the PO was using a mixture of WVO, diesel, and bio-diesel. The real problem is that unlike diesel of bio-diesel, WVO both contains phosphates and is a lipid, prone to varnish formation. The combination, with high heat, results in sticking injectors, crapped up pre-chambers, deposits on intake valves, and crap on the piston crowns along with sticking plungers in the IP and I believe excessive wear on the plunger/sleeve sets due to the lack of lubricity of the WVO. Can be fixed more or less with lubricity additives, but the better plan is to use bio-diesel instead (methy or ethyl esters of fatty acids and not lipids). Bio will eat rubber overflow hoses and pressure valve holder rubber seals, but you can use Viton tubing and seals to fix that, and it's only a problem with more than 50% bio. Can't use that around here in the winter anyway, as bio freezes solid around 28F in pure form, and we have enough trouble with low volume stations not winterizing diesel anyway, I've been stuck several times with waxed up fuel over the years. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Fwd: 1992 Mercedes Benz 300D Turbo Diesel
Cold start will usually tell you all you need to know. If it fires right up and idles good it's probably fine. Curt Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android On Sun, Feb 10, 2019 at 11:58 AM, Bob Rentfro wrote: I appreciate Curley, GMann and Curt’s explanation on this but I was just curious what someone like me could inspect on a vehicle like that to see if waste oil has done bad things. Is it an acute or a chronic thing? Bob R Sent from my iPad > On Feb 10, 2019, at 9:31 AM, Bob Rentfro wrote: > > As is my luck, this is in Vegas so I can’t simply go give it a look. Plus, > I’m not even sure what to look at/check out to see if the waste oil usage has > done some irreparable damage. The current owner says he doesn’t know how > often the PO used the waste oil and he has not sent me a pic of the setup > that is in the car. Ugh > > Bob R > > Sent from my iPad > >> On Feb 10, 2019, at 8:11 AM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes >> wrote: >> >> Biod won't hurt anything, it's basically diesel. Veggie oil is what you need >> to worry about. Most veggie "conversions" are "I'm winging it". >> >> Curt >> >> Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android >> >> On Sat, Feb 9, 2019 at 9:04 PM, Dwight Giles via >> Mercedes wrote: Well if it has been run on bio it >> might mean run away. That said my 2.5t >> ON 602 was best car I had in 55 years of driving. Maybe it is just the >> viton lines as Kevin said. Also find out what % BioD was run. Waste veg or >> commercial BioD? Could be a good buy. >> >> Dwight Giles Jr. >> Wickford RI >> >> On Feb 9, 2019 8:50 PM, "Bob Rentfro via Mercedes" >> wrote: >> >> What do you reckon “biodiesel converted” means? Waste veg kit installed? >> >> Dude hasn’t answered text yet. >> >> Bob R >> >> Sent from my iPad >> >> >>> >>> 1992 Mercedes Benz 300D Turbo Diesel >>> >>> https://lasvegas.craigslist.org/cto/6813367350.html >>> >>> Please go to the preferences page if you don't want to receive >> email-a-friend messages in the future. >> ___ >> http://www.okiebenz.com >> >> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ >> >> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: >> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com >> ___ >> http://www.okiebenz.com >> >> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ >> >> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: >> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com >> >> >> ___ >> http://www.okiebenz.com >> >> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ >> >> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: >> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com >> ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Fwd: 1992 Mercedes Benz 300D Turbo Diesel
I've heard about a few -- typically waste oil will greatly enhance the growth of "algae" in the tank, resulting in black crap clogging the screen and filters very quickly -- ran through a few on the "new" 300D because the PO was using a mixture of WVO, diesel, and bio-diesel. The real problem is that unlike diesel of bio-diesel, WVO both contains phosphates and is a lipid, prone to varnish formation. The combination, with high heat, results in sticking injectors, crapped up pre-chambers, deposits on intake valves, and crap on the piston crowns along with sticking plungers in the IP and I believe excessive wear on the plunger/sleeve sets due to the lack of lubricity of the WVO. Can be fixed more or less with lubricity additives, but the better plan is to use bio-diesel instead (methy or ethyl esters of fatty acids and not lipids). Bio will eat rubber overflow hoses and pressure valve holder rubber seals, but you can use Viton tubing and seals to fix that, and it's only a problem with more than 50% bio. Can't use that around here in the winter anyway, as bio freezes solid around 28F in pure form, and we have enough trouble with low volume stations not winterizing diesel anyway, I've been stuck several times with waxed up fuel over the years. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Fwd: 1992 Mercedes Benz 300D Turbo Diesel
I appreciate Curley, GMann and Curt’s explanation on this but I was just curious what someone like me could inspect on a vehicle like that to see if waste oil has done bad things. Is it an acute or a chronic thing? Bob R Sent from my iPad > On Feb 10, 2019, at 9:31 AM, Bob Rentfro wrote: > > As is my luck, this is in Vegas so I can’t simply go give it a look. Plus, > I’m not even sure what to look at/check out to see if the waste oil usage has > done some irreparable damage. The current owner says he doesn’t know how > often the PO used the waste oil and he has not sent me a pic of the setup > that is in the car. Ugh > > Bob R > > Sent from my iPad > >> On Feb 10, 2019, at 8:11 AM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes >> wrote: >> >> Biod won't hurt anything, it's basically diesel. Veggie oil is what you need >> to worry about. Most veggie "conversions" are "I'm winging it". >> >> Curt >> >> Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android >> >> On Sat, Feb 9, 2019 at 9:04 PM, Dwight Giles via >> Mercedes wrote: Well if it has been run on bio it >> might mean run away. That said my 2.5t >> ON 602 was best car I had in 55 years of driving. Maybe it is just the >> viton lines as Kevin said. Also find out what % BioD was run. Waste veg or >> commercial BioD? Could be a good buy. >> >> Dwight Giles Jr. >> Wickford RI >> >> On Feb 9, 2019 8:50 PM, "Bob Rentfro via Mercedes" >> wrote: >> >> What do you reckon “biodiesel converted” means? Waste veg kit installed? >> >> Dude hasn’t answered text yet. >> >> Bob R >> >> Sent from my iPad >> >> >>> >>> 1992 Mercedes Benz 300D Turbo Diesel >>> >>> https://lasvegas.craigslist.org/cto/6813367350.html >>> >>> Please go to the preferences page if you don't want to receive >> email-a-friend messages in the future. >> ___ >> http://www.okiebenz.com >> >> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ >> >> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: >> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com >> ___ >> http://www.okiebenz.com >> >> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ >> >> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: >> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com >> >> >> ___ >> http://www.okiebenz.com >> >> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ >> >> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: >> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com >> ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Fwd: 1992 Mercedes Benz 300D Turbo Diesel
As is my luck, this is in Vegas so I can’t simply go give it a look. Plus, I’m not even sure what to look at/check out to see if the waste oil usage has done some irreparable damage. The current owner says he doesn’t know how often the PO used the waste oil and he has not sent me a pic of the setup that is in the car. Ugh Bob R Sent from my iPad > On Feb 10, 2019, at 8:11 AM, Curt Raymond via Mercedes > wrote: > > Biod won't hurt anything, it's basically diesel. Veggie oil is what you need > to worry about. Most veggie "conversions" are "I'm winging it". > > Curt > > Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android > > On Sat, Feb 9, 2019 at 9:04 PM, Dwight Giles via > Mercedes wrote: Well if it has been run on bio it > might mean run away. That said my 2.5t > ON 602 was best car I had in 55 years of driving. Maybe it is just the > viton lines as Kevin said. Also find out what % BioD was run. Waste veg or > commercial BioD? Could be a good buy. > > Dwight Giles Jr. > Wickford RI > > On Feb 9, 2019 8:50 PM, "Bob Rentfro via Mercedes" > wrote: > > What do you reckon “biodiesel converted” means? Waste veg kit installed? > > Dude hasn’t answered text yet. > > Bob R > > Sent from my iPad > > >> >> 1992 Mercedes Benz 300D Turbo Diesel >> >> https://lasvegas.craigslist.org/cto/6813367350.html >> >> Please go to the preferences page if you don't want to receive > email-a-friend messages in the future. > ___ > http://www.okiebenz.com > > To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ > > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: > http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com > ___ > http://www.okiebenz.com > > To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ > > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: > http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com > > > ___ > http://www.okiebenz.com > > To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ > > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: > http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com > ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Fwd: 1992 Mercedes Benz 300D Turbo Diesel
Biod won't hurt anything, it's basically diesel. Veggie oil is what you need to worry about. Most veggie "conversions" are "I'm winging it". Curt Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android On Sat, Feb 9, 2019 at 9:04 PM, Dwight Giles via Mercedes wrote: Well if it has been run on bio it might mean run away. That said my 2.5t ON 602 was best car I had in 55 years of driving. Maybe it is just the viton lines as Kevin said. Also find out what % BioD was run. Waste veg or commercial BioD? Could be a good buy. Dwight Giles Jr. Wickford RI On Feb 9, 2019 8:50 PM, "Bob Rentfro via Mercedes" wrote: What do you reckon “biodiesel converted” means? Waste veg kit installed? Dude hasn’t answered text yet. Bob R Sent from my iPad > > 1992 Mercedes Benz 300D Turbo Diesel > > https://lasvegas.craigslist.org/cto/6813367350.html > > Please go to the preferences page if you don't want to receive email-a-friend messages in the future. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Fwd: 1992 Mercedes Benz 300D Turbo Diesel
ok, What Herr Mann says is true. But from a practical standpoint, I think there is evidence the VO or WVO was only run enough to plug the filters. Therefore, I am not afraid of this car or this engine. Based on my experience resurrecting one mutilated 124 300D. Herr Mann also frequents parts of the country where clean rust free examples of 123s, 124s and 126s are relatively plentiful. In some other parts of the country, a clean rust free example is hard to come by, so we are willing to make compromises. But do print out Herr Mann's email and take it along to have the seller read. Use that to negotiate a better price. As I said, it is all true. G Mann via Mercedes wrote on 2/9/19 10:05 PM: Run Run... Run... In the alternate fuel world, there is a lot of confusion between running "waste veg oil" which is contaminated used cooking oil, and Schedule 52 Bio Diesel. Waste Veg Oil is NOT Bio Diesel. WVO [as it's called] has multiple sins that does damage to the injection pump and injectors, as well as valves and pistons. To run on WVO, the WVO MUST be cleaned, ALL water removed, and contaminate particles from cooking removed, PLUS, cooking inserts acids into the WVO which do extreme harm to engine and IP internals. Further, to successfully run CLEANED WVO, it must be pre-heated to 180 F and engine start and shutdown MUST be done on clean pump diesel. Engine must be brought to operating temperature BEFORE WVO is switched to the IP. Then, pre-shutdown, you must switch back to pump diesel and run long enough to purge ALL WVO from fuel pump, lines, IP, and injectors [rule of thumb here is 8 miles of running]. True Certified BioDiesel which meets Schedule 52 requirements requires no modification to fuel system, engine, or proceedure of operation. The only major consideration is that Schedule 52 BioDiesel has a higher gell point than Schedule 54 pump diesel, So, if you operate in cold climate, you may want to not run BioDiesel in temps below gell point. If the car has had WVO used, expect accelerated wear on the IP, Injectors, and massive carbon on valves and combustion chambers. His stated problem with fuel filters tells me, "Problems are already there." Hope this helps... ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Fwd: 1992 Mercedes Benz 300D Turbo Diesel
Run Run... Run... In the alternate fuel world, there is a lot of confusion between running "waste veg oil" which is contaminated used cooking oil, and Schedule 52 Bio Diesel. Waste Veg Oil is NOT Bio Diesel. WVO [as it's called] has multiple sins that does damage to the injection pump and injectors, as well as valves and pistons. To run on WVO, the WVO MUST be cleaned, ALL water removed, and contaminate particles from cooking removed, PLUS, cooking inserts acids into the WVO which do extreme harm to engine and IP internals. Further, to successfully run CLEANED WVO, it must be pre-heated to 180 F and engine start and shutdown MUST be done on clean pump diesel. Engine must be brought to operating temperature BEFORE WVO is switched to the IP. Then, pre-shutdown, you must switch back to pump diesel and run long enough to purge ALL WVO from fuel pump, lines, IP, and injectors [rule of thumb here is 8 miles of running]. True Certified BioDiesel which meets Schedule 52 requirements requires no modification to fuel system, engine, or proceedure of operation. The only major consideration is that Schedule 52 BioDiesel has a higher gell point than Schedule 54 pump diesel, So, if you operate in cold climate, you may want to not run BioDiesel in temps below gell point. If the car has had WVO used, expect accelerated wear on the IP, Injectors, and massive carbon on valves and combustion chambers. His stated problem with fuel filters tells me, "Problems are already there." Hope this helps... On Sat, Feb 9, 2019 at 8:30 PM Bob Rentfro via Mercedes < mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote: > So the guy says the PO ran waste oil in it and when dude bought it it ran > rough. He said he changed out all fuel filters and fuel lines and it runs > well now. > > I asked him if he knows how long the PO actually used waste oil. > > Pursue or run away? > > Bob R > > Sent from my iPhone > > > On Feb 9, 2019, at 7:04 PM, Dwight Giles wrote: > > > > Well if it has been run on bio it might mean run away. That said my > 2.5t ON 602 was best car I had in 55 years of driving. Maybe it is just the > viton lines as Kevin said. Also find out what % BioD was run. Waste veg or > commercial BioD? Could be a good buy. > > > > Dwight Giles Jr. > > Wickford RI > > > > On Feb 9, 2019 8:50 PM, "Bob Rentfro via Mercedes" < > mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote: > > What do you reckon “biodiesel converted” means? Waste veg kit installed? > > > > Dude hasn’t answered text yet. > > > > Bob R > > > > Sent from my iPad > > > > > > > > > > 1992 Mercedes Benz 300D Turbo Diesel > > > > > > https://lasvegas.craigslist.org/cto/6813367350.html > > > > > > Please go to the preferences page if you don't want to receive > email-a-friend messages in the future. > > ___ > > http://www.okiebenz.com > > > > To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ > > > > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: > > http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com > > > > > ___ > http://www.okiebenz.com > > To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ > > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: > http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com > > ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Fwd: 1992 Mercedes Benz 300D Turbo Diesel
On Sat, 9 Feb 2019 20:30:00 -0700 Bob Rentfro via Mercedes wrote: > So the guy says the PO ran waste oil in it and when dude bought it it > ran rough. He said he changed out all fuel filters and fuel lines and > it runs well now. > > I asked him if he knows how long the PO actually used waste oil. > > Pursue or run away? Run away. Craig ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Fwd: 1992 Mercedes Benz 300D Turbo Diesel
If it really has only 90k to 100k verified by records, my GUESS is that you'd be ok. Likely the moron only ran enough sludge (VO or WVO) through it to plug the filters. If the sludge sat in the tank a long time, you may need to take out the tank and clean it or replace it with a gasser tank. If the guy had it longer and had actually changed the filters before, he would not have dumped it because the filters plugged. I would guess the original or first and second owners had it until maybe 5-10k miles ago, (or less) then the moron bought it and tried running unfiltered WVO in it, then dumped the car and the current flipper got it. I doubt any serious damage has been done to the IP or engine. If I bought it, here's what I'd do: I'd put 2 main filters, 3 prefilters and tools, blue gloves, + shop rags in the trunk. I'd not put more than a half tank of diesel in it for 3-4 "fills". If the filters don't plug by then perhaps the tank is ok. Go to 3/4/ fills, then to full tanks. Otherwise, if the filters plug frequently, buy a gasser tank, and swap out the tanks. My experience: documented somewhere in the archives: FL POS (124 300D) had sat for years with veg oil in the tank. It gelled, (polymerized) and the water did no good either. no changes were made in the fuel system. Just dump vo or wvo in the tank. At some time the VO ate the DV orings in the IP. It leaked grease, but the car sat long enough the grease polymerized and sealed the DVs again. I put Diesel in and it ran, but I ended up taking the tank out, pressure washing the inside of it the best I could; dried it out as well as I could, then put it back in. that process took 2-3 days. that is why I suggested you just buy a gasser tank. I think it could make you a great car, IF the mileage is true, and even if it is 300k, it could still make you a good car. Bob Rentfro via Mercedes wrote on 2/9/19 9:30 PM: So the guy says the PO ran waste oil in it and when dude bought it it ran rough. He said he changed out all fuel filters and fuel lines and it runs well now. I asked him if he knows how long the PO actually used waste oil. Pursue or run away? Bob R Sent from my iPhone On Feb 9, 2019, at 7:04 PM, Dwight Giles wrote: Well if it has been run on bio it might mean run away. That said my 2.5t ON 602 was best car I had in 55 years of driving. Maybe it is just the viton lines as Kevin said. Also find out what % BioD was run. Waste veg or commercial BioD? Could be a good buy. Dwight Giles Jr. Wickford RI On Feb 9, 2019 8:50 PM, "Bob Rentfro via Mercedes" wrote: What do you reckon “biodiesel converted” means? Waste veg kit installed? Dude hasn’t answered text yet. Bob R Sent from my iPad 1992 Mercedes Benz 300D Turbo Diesel https://lasvegas.craigslist.org/cto/6813367350.html Please go to the preferences page if you don't want to receive email-a-friend messages in the future. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Fwd: 1992 Mercedes Benz 300D Turbo Diesel
On Sat, 9 Feb 2019 19:49:29 -0700 Bob Rentfro via Mercedes wrote: > So I’m texting with the guy and he said PO installed and used waste > oil. I’m asking for pics. > > Is that a deal breaker? I would consider it such. Craig ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Fwd: 1992 Mercedes Benz 300D Turbo Diesel
So the guy says the PO ran waste oil in it and when dude bought it it ran rough. He said he changed out all fuel filters and fuel lines and it runs well now. I asked him if he knows how long the PO actually used waste oil. Pursue or run away? Bob R Sent from my iPhone > On Feb 9, 2019, at 7:04 PM, Dwight Giles wrote: > > Well if it has been run on bio it might mean run away. That said my 2.5t ON > 602 was best car I had in 55 years of driving. Maybe it is just the viton > lines as Kevin said. Also find out what % BioD was run. Waste veg or > commercial BioD? Could be a good buy. > > Dwight Giles Jr. > Wickford RI > > On Feb 9, 2019 8:50 PM, "Bob Rentfro via Mercedes" > wrote: > What do you reckon “biodiesel converted” means? Waste veg kit installed? > > Dude hasn’t answered text yet. > > Bob R > > Sent from my iPad > > > > > > 1992 Mercedes Benz 300D Turbo Diesel > > > > https://lasvegas.craigslist.org/cto/6813367350.html > > > > Please go to the preferences page if you don't want to receive > > email-a-friend messages in the future. > ___ > http://www.okiebenz.com > > To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ > > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: > http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com > > ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Fwd: 1992 Mercedes Benz 300D Turbo Diesel
So I’m texting with the guy and he said PO installed and used waste oil. I’m asking for pics. Is that a deal breaker? BobR Sent from my iPhone > On Feb 9, 2019, at 7:04 PM, Dwight Giles wrote: > > Well if it has been run on bio it might mean run away. That said my 2.5t ON > 602 was best car I had in 55 years of driving. Maybe it is just the viton > lines as Kevin said. Also find out what % BioD was run. Waste veg or > commercial BioD? Could be a good buy. > > Dwight Giles Jr. > Wickford RI > > On Feb 9, 2019 8:50 PM, "Bob Rentfro via Mercedes" > wrote: > What do you reckon “biodiesel converted” means? Waste veg kit installed? > > Dude hasn’t answered text yet. > > Bob R > > Sent from my iPad > > > > > > 1992 Mercedes Benz 300D Turbo Diesel > > > > https://lasvegas.craigslist.org/cto/6813367350.html > > > > Please go to the preferences page if you don't want to receive > > email-a-friend messages in the future. > ___ > http://www.okiebenz.com > > To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ > > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: > http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com > > ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Fwd: 1992 Mercedes Benz 300D Turbo Diesel
Well if it has been run on bio it might mean run away. That said my 2.5t ON 602 was best car I had in 55 years of driving. Maybe it is just the viton lines as Kevin said. Also find out what % BioD was run. Waste veg or commercial BioD? Could be a good buy. Dwight Giles Jr. Wickford RI On Feb 9, 2019 8:50 PM, "Bob Rentfro via Mercedes" wrote: What do you reckon “biodiesel converted” means? Waste veg kit installed? Dude hasn’t answered text yet. Bob R Sent from my iPad > > 1992 Mercedes Benz 300D Turbo Diesel > > https://lasvegas.craigslist.org/cto/6813367350.html > > Please go to the preferences page if you don't want to receive email-a-friend messages in the future. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Fwd: 1992 Mercedes Benz 300D Turbo Diesel
Viton fuel lines and injection return lines that won’t deteriorate when running biodiesel? Sent from my iPhone > On Feb 9, 2019, at 5:49 PM, Bob Rentfro via Mercedes > wrote: > > What do you reckon “biodiesel converted” means? Waste veg kit installed? > > Dude hasn’t answered text yet. > > Bob R > > Sent from my iPad > > >> >> 1992 Mercedes Benz 300D Turbo Diesel >> >> https://lasvegas.craigslist.org/cto/6813367350.html >> >> Please go to the preferences page if you don't want to receive >> email-a-friend messages in the future. > ___ > http://www.okiebenz.com > > To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ > > To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: > http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com > ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
[MBZ] Fwd: 1992 Mercedes Benz 300D Turbo Diesel
What do you reckon “biodiesel converted” means? Waste veg kit installed? Dude hasn’t answered text yet. Bob R Sent from my iPad > > 1992 Mercedes Benz 300D Turbo Diesel > > https://lasvegas.craigslist.org/cto/6813367350.html > > Please go to the preferences page if you don't want to receive email-a-friend > messages in the future. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
