Re: [MBZ] Normally Aspirated Diesel at High Altitude/NO ADA?
In a message dated 6/19/2005 2:02:54 P.M. US Mountain Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I have an NA 300D (Euro 1984) engine in my ex-240D. It goes fairly well here in Los Alamos, New Mexico, but it doesn't have an ADA. Craig, it will either have an ADA (pressure chamber) or a manual screw adjustment in place of the ADA. Only 74 and earlier diesels (the ones with butterfly plates in the inlets) did not have ADAs, to my knowledge Look again, please, and tell us what's on the top of your IP at the rear. Jim Friesen Phoenix AZ 79 300SD, 261 K miles 98 ML 320, 136 K miles
Re: [MBZ] Normally Aspirated Diesel at High Altitude/NO ADA?
John Ervine wrote: Royce Engler wrote: Terminology check...is ADA the same as ALDA? Sorta. ADA = Atmosphärendruckabhängiger Volllastanschlag Which roughly means atmospheric pressure compensation. ALDA = Atmosphärische Ladedruckanpassung Which roughly means atmospheric pressure and charge-air compensation. In simpler terms, an ADA provides fuel enrichment on non-turbo cars, while an ALDA provides fuel enrichment on turbo cars. NOT quite. The ADA reduces fuel as atmospheric pressure goes down. The purpose is to prevent smoking and still maintain maximum power possible at higher altitudes. It does NOT enrich anything, it reduces fuel as air pressure drops but keeping the fuel level at the maximum value that the available air can completely burn. An ALDA also reduces fuel as air pressure drops, BUT since the turbo raises air pressure and the way it's calibrated, the most usual ALDA action is to enrich fuel. Theoretically the ADA could do the same thing, BUT it and the pump are constructed and calibrated so that maximum fuel output is at about sea level and it does nothing but reduce fuel output as pressure drops. Marshall -- Marshall Booth (who doesn't respond to unsigned questions) der Dieseling Doktor [EMAIL PROTECTED] '87 300TD 181Kmi,'87 190D 2.5 199Kmi, '84 190D 2.2 227Kmi, '85 190D 2.0 159Kmi, '87 190D 2.5 turbo 234kmi Diesel Technical Advisor MBCA, member GWSection http://www.dhc.net/~pmhack/mercedes/mbooth1.htm
Re: [MBZ] Normally Aspirated Diesel at High Altitude/NO ADA?
On Sun, 19 Jun 2005 19:50:41 EDT [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In a message dated 6/19/2005 2:02:54 P.M. US Mountain Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I have an NA 300D (Euro 1984) engine in my ex-240D. It goes fairly well here in Los Alamos, New Mexico, but it doesn't have an ADA. Craig, it will either have an ADA (pressure chamber) or a manual screw adjustment in place of the ADA. Only 74 and earlier diesels (the ones with butterfly plates in the inlets) did not have ADAs, to my knowledge Look again, please, and tell us what's on the top of your IP at the rear. Since several people have commented, I've attached a picture to this email (I did, however, reduce its size before attaching it). I took this an other pictures when I had the pump out for checking by the Bosch service center in Albuquerque and the injectors out for rebuilding. The cylinderical object at the top with the tube fitting is the vacuum shutoff. The bolt at the rear top is the idle speed adjustment. Craig
Re: [MBZ] Normally Aspirated Diesel at High Altitude/NO ADA?
Since several people have commented, I've attached a picture to this email (I did, however, reduce its size before attaching it). I took this an other pictures when I had the pump out for checking by the Bosch service center in Albuquerque and the injectors out for rebuilding. The cylinderical object at the top with the tube fitting is the vacuum shutoff. The bolt at the rear top is the idle speed adjustment. Well, I did attach a picture, but the list now has a 40 kB limit, so Kaleb has to approve the sending of the picture. Craig
Re: [MBZ] Normally Aspirated Diesel at High Altitude/NO ADA?
It has always had that limit. Craig McCluskey wrote: Since several people have commented, I've attached a picture to this email (I did, however, reduce its size before attaching it). I took this an other pictures when I had the pump out for checking by the Bosch service center in Albuquerque and the injectors out for rebuilding. The cylinderical object at the top with the tube fitting is the vacuum shutoff. The bolt at the rear top is the idle speed adjustment. Well, I did attach a picture, but the list now has a 40 kB limit, so Kaleb has to approve the sending of the picture. Craig ___ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] For new parts see www.buymbparts.com For repairs see www.oldworldauto.com To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net -- Kaleb C. Striplin/Claremore, OK 89 560SEL, 87 300SDL, 87 300SDL, 85 380SE, 85 300D, 81 300TD, 81 240D, 81 240D, 76 240D, 76 300D, 74 240D, 69 250 Okie Benz Auto parts-email for used parts
Re: [MBZ] Normally Aspirated Diesel at High Altitude/NO ADA?
On Mon, 20 Jun 2005 08:28:51 -0500 Kaleb C. Striplin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: after they are approved then they go thru, but they are initially held. So are you going to approve my 48 kB message? Craig
Re: [MBZ] Normally Aspirated Diesel at High Altitude/NO ADA?
If I get it, I have not seen anything on it as far as I know. Craig McCluskey wrote: On Mon, 20 Jun 2005 08:28:51 -0500 Kaleb C. Striplin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: after they are approved then they go thru, but they are initially held. So are you going to approve my 48 kB message? Craig ___ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] For new parts see www.buymbparts.com For repairs see www.oldworldauto.com To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net -- Kaleb C. Striplin/Claremore, OK 89 560SEL, 87 300SDL, 87 300SDL, 85 380SE, 85 300D, 81 300TD, 81 240D, 81 240D, 76 240D, 76 300D, 74 240D, 69 250 Okie Benz Auto parts-email for used parts
Re: [MBZ] Normally Aspirated Diesel at High Altitude/NO ADA?
On Sun, 19 Jun 2005 19:50:41 EDT [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In a message dated 6/19/2005 2:02:54 P.M. US Mountain Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I have an NA 300D (Euro 1984) engine in my ex-240D. It goes fairly well here in Los Alamos, New Mexico, but it doesn't have an ADA. Craig, it will either have an ADA (pressure chamber) or a manual screw adjustment in place of the ADA. Only 74 and earlier diesels (the ones with butterfly plates in the inlets) did not have ADAs, to my knowledge Look again, please, and tell us what's on the top of your IP at the rear. Since several people have commented, I've attached a picture to this email (I did, however, reduce its size before attaching it). I took this an other pictures when I had the pump out for checking by the Bosch service center in Albuquerque and the injectors out for rebuilding. The cylinderical object at the top with the tube fitting is the vacuum shutoff. The bolt at the rear top is the idle speed adjustment. Craig attachment: Euro.injection.pump.jpg
Re: [MBZ] Normally Aspirated Diesel at High Altitude/NO ADA?
In a message dated 6/20/2005 6:56:50 A.M. US Mountain Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: The cylinderical object at the top with the tube fitting is the vacuum shutoff. The bolt at the rear top is the idle speed adjustment. Craig, Finally got the picture, very clear by the way, and the vacuum shutoff is right where the ADA should be. I have seen several Euro engines but never one like this. Don, is yours like this too? Jim Friesen Phoenix AZ 79 300SD, 261 K miles 98 ML 320, 136 K miles
Re: [MBZ] Normally Aspirated Diesel at High Altitude/NO ADA?
My euro m617 has the same pump. There is no ada. The euro 240d also has the same pump, just minus one cylinder. Mathieu Cama 240D 3.0 euro conversion running WVO www.oldworldauto.com In a message dated 6/20/2005 6:56:50 A.M. US Mountain Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: The cylinderical object at the top with the tube fitting is the vacuum shutoff. The bolt at the rear top is the idle speed adjustment. Craig, Finally got the picture, very clear by the way, and the vacuum shutoff is right where the ADA should be. I have seen several Euro engines but never one like this. Don, is yours like this too? Jim Friesen Phoenix AZ 79 300SD, 261 K miles 98 ML 320, 136 K miles ___ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] For new parts see www.buymbparts.com For repairs see www.oldworldauto.com To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net
Re: [MBZ] Normally Aspirated Diesel at High Altitude/NO ADA?
Believe that's the RSF governor detailed in the 123 manual, .../engine/615/07-010.pdf. It's section B, beginning p. 6 of 15. joe
[MBZ] Normally Aspirated Diesel at High Altitude
Hi, all- My wife and I are moving to Las Vegas, New Mexico in the next month or so. We drove up there last week in our 1980 300CD, and whereas the Benz does OK here in Phoenix, it was pretty gutless at the higher altitude. Is there anything that can be done with a normally aspirated 300CD to regain some of the performance at higher altitudes (besides adding a turbo?) -- Lee Einer Dos Manos Jewelry http://www.dosmanosjewelry.com
Re: [MBZ] Normally Aspirated Diesel at High Altitude
On my carbureted motorcycle, I'd adjust the fuel/air mixture ratio by turning the screw. Can that be done on a 300CD? Tim 1982 300TD Moby On 6/18/05, Lee Einer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi, all- My wife and I are moving to Las Vegas, New Mexico in the next month or so. We drove up there last week in our 1980 300CD, and whereas the Benz does OK here in Phoenix, it was pretty gutless at the higher altitude. Is there anything that can be done with a normally aspirated 300CD to regain some of the performance at higher altitudes (besides adding a turbo?) -- Lee Einer Dos Manos Jewelry http://www.dosmanosjewelry.com ___ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] For new parts see www.buymbparts.com For repairs see www.oldworldauto.com To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net
RE: [MBZ] Normally Aspirated Diesel at High Altitude
Sell it to someone who lives in the flatlands GRINNING, DUCKING, RUNNING Royce Engler 1985 300TD Turbo 265K -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Lee Einer Sent: Saturday, June 18, 2005 7:19 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [MBZ] Normally Aspirated Diesel at High Altitude Hi, all- My wife and I are moving to Las Vegas, New Mexico in the next month or so. We drove up there last week in our 1980 300CD, and whereas the Benz does OK here in Phoenix, it was pretty gutless at the higher altitude. Is there anything that can be done with a normally aspirated 300CD to regain some of the performance at higher altitudes (besides adding a turbo?) -- Lee Einer Dos Manos Jewelry http://www.dosmanosjewelry.com ___ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] For new parts see www.buymbparts.com For repairs see www.oldworldauto.com To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net
Re: [MBZ] Normally Aspirated Diesel at High Altitude
Lee Einer wrote: Hi, all- My wife and I are moving to Las Vegas, New Mexico in the next month or so. We drove up there last week in our 1980 300CD, and whereas the Benz does OK here in Phoenix, it was pretty gutless at the higher altitude. Is there anything that can be done with a normally aspirated 300CD to regain some of the performance at higher altitudes (besides adding a turbo?) Sell the car and get one with a turbo! Marshall -- Marshall Booth (who doesn't respond to unsigned questions) der Dieseling Doktor [EMAIL PROTECTED] '87 300TD 181Kmi,'87 190D 2.5 199Kmi, '84 190D 2.2 227Kmi, '85 190D 2.0 159Kmi, '87 190D 2.5 turbo 234kmi Diesel Technical Advisor MBCA, member GWSection http://www.dhc.net/~pmhack/mercedes/mbooth1.htm
Re: [MBZ] Normally Aspirated Diesel at High Altitude
In a message dated 6/18/2005 9:45:31 PM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Sell it to someone who lives in the flatlands GRINNING, DUCKING, RUNNING Royce Engler 1985 300TD Turbo 265K no, give it to a flatlander, like me. Thank you, Jay 95 MB E300D 91K The new baby 83 MB 300D 241K The silver coffin 99 Mercury Sable wagon 24 valve 72K Cannondale SR500 Allentown,Pa.
Re: [MBZ] Normally Aspirated Diesel at High Altitude
In a message dated 6/18/2005 5:15:28 P.M. US Mountain Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Hi, all- My wife and I are moving to Las Vegas, New Mexico in the next month or so. We drove up there last week in our 1980 300CD, and whereas the Benz does OK here in Phoenix, it was pretty gutless at the higher altitude. Is there anything that can be done with a normally aspirated 300CD to regain some of the performance at higher altitudes (besides adding a turbo?) Lee, I would definitely try adjusting the ADA, the pressure compensating device on the rear top of the injection pump. Especially if the car did not smoke too much at altitude. The turbo injection pumps go leaner as they age, I don't see why the NA pumps would not do the same. Adjusting the ALDA/ADA compensates for wear in the pump, and brings back the IP calibrations towards the original settings Most ADAs don't have a seal on the adjusting screw so it is easy to do. Loosen the lock nut and turn the screw gently 1 turn CCW. Do not force the screw! This because your ADA will only have two turns or less available before it shears off the screw. Watch for much improved off idle acceleration. Even at lower elevations. A 0.050 shim under the ADA would be equal to two turns CCW on the screw. I will give you a shim if you send me a SASE. Let the list know how you come out. Jim Friesen Phoenix AZ 79 300SD, 261 K miles 98 ML 320, 136 K miles
Re: [MBZ] Normally Aspirated Diesel at High Altitude
Thanks, Jim- I backed the adjusting screw on the altitude adjusting box a full turn and took it for a test drive. It seems to have picked up a little bit of accelleration even down here at sea level. It will be a few weeks before I can check it out in LV. If needed, I can back it out another turn at that time. One question, though- when backing off the adjusting screw, how will I know how much is too much? Should I be watching for smoking under accelleration? Lee [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In a message dated 6/18/2005 5:15:28 P.M. US Mountain Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Hi, all- My wife and I are moving to Las Vegas, New Mexico in the next month or so. We drove up there last week in our 1980 300CD, and whereas the Benz does OK here in Phoenix, it was pretty gutless at the higher altitude. Is there anything that can be done with a normally aspirated 300CD to regain some of the performance at higher altitudes (besides adding a turbo?) Lee, I would definitely try adjusting the ADA, the pressure compensating device on the rear top of the injection pump. Especially if the car did not smoke too much at altitude. The turbo injection pumps go leaner as they age, I don't see why the NA pumps would not do the same. Adjusting the ALDA/ADA compensates for wear in the pump, and brings back the IP calibrations towards the original settings Most ADAs don't have a seal on the adjusting screw so it is easy to do. Loosen the lock nut and turn the screw gently 1 turn CCW. Do not force the screw! This because your ADA will only have two turns or less available before it shears off the screw. Watch for much improved off idle acceleration. Even at lower elevations. A 0.050 shim under the ADA would be equal to two turns CCW on the screw. I will give you a shim if you send me a SASE. Let the list know how you come out. Jim Friesen Phoenix AZ 79 300SD, 261 K miles 98 ML 320, 136 K miles ___ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] For new parts see www.buymbparts.com For repairs see www.oldworldauto.com To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net -- Lee Einer Dos Manos Jewelry http://www.dosmanosjewelry.com
