[MBZ] OT - 3 Way Switch Wiring
Yeah, I know how to wire a three way switch, but I have added a wrinkle... I have a three way switch arrangement for the lighting in my kitchen. There are switches at either end of the kitchen, either of which will turn on or off the lighting. A typical three way switch arrangement with two travelers, etc. This works just fine right now. Here's the wrinkle: I am adding some task lighting, for which I ran the romex from the primary three way switch to the lighting. I added a second single pole, single throw switch to the box. I tapped off the AC feed to the three way switch for the power to the task lighting switch. When the three way switch is turned on, the task lighting will turn on as well, if its switch is on, as it will turn off when the three way switch goes off. When the kitchen lighting is off, the task lighting will not turn on and as one would expect, there is no power at the input to the task lighting switch. While I haven't put pencil to paper and drawn this out yet, I am thinking that I am getting a back feed through the new circuit that is preventing it from working correctly. This doesn't make total sense to me, unless I am not at the box where the primary feed for the three way circuit is. Either this or the primary circuit is dropping to zero when it is on (potential to ground) because there is now a load on it, effectively cutting off power to the new lighting circuit. I am wondering if I will need to put a diode in series to prevent this from happening. Anyone want to wrap their mind around this one? Dan ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] OT - 3 Way Switch Wiring
I have no idea what the heck you are talking about. Speaking of which though, in my bedroom we have a double switch on the wall with a ceiling fan with light attached. One switch turns on the fan the other switch turns on the light. All the sudden the light no longer turns on but the fan still does. I thought maybe it was the light assembly so I swapped from another room still not working, one from bedroom worked in the other room. So I hope maybe I can figure this out without having to pay an electrician to come out. I know zero about home electrical stuff. Sent from my iPhone On Aug 4, 2012, at 10:47 AM, Dan Penoff lwb...@yahoo.com wrote: Yeah, I know how to wire a three way switch, but I have added a wrinkle... I have a three way switch arrangement for the lighting in my kitchen. There are switches at either end of the kitchen, either of which will turn on or off the lighting. A typical three way switch arrangement with two travelers, etc. This works just fine right now. Here's the wrinkle: I am adding some task lighting, for which I ran the romex from the primary three way switch to the lighting. I added a second single pole, single throw switch to the box. I tapped off the AC feed to the three way switch for the power to the task lighting switch. When the three way switch is turned on, the task lighting will turn on as well, if its switch is on, as it will turn off when the three way switch goes off. When the kitchen lighting is off, the task lighting will not turn on and as one would expect, there is no power at the input to the task lighting switch. While I haven't put pencil to paper and drawn this out yet, I am thinking that I am getting a back feed through the new circuit that is preventing it from working correctly. This doesn't make total sense to me, unless I am not at the box where the primary feed for the three way circuit is. Either this or the primary circuit is dropping to zero when it is on (potential to ground) because there is now a load on it, effectively cutting off power to the new lighting circuit. I am wondering if I will need to put a diode in series to prevent this from happening. Anyone want to wrap their mind around this one? Dan ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] OT - 3 Way Switch Wiring
Diodes are not used in normal electrical wiring. It sounds like you have not identified the real power source from the panel. Typical 3 way: 3way 3way ---POWER SOURCE HOT-X X-LIGHT Y--Y Z---Z It is possible that the light wiring hanging off the 3 way is in the same box as the power source 3 way. In that case, you would have a 14/3 type wire just going to the remote 3 way and a couple of extra wire nuts. On Sat, Aug 4, 2012 at 9:47 AM, Dan Penoff lwb...@yahoo.com wrote: Yeah, I know how to wire a three way switch, but I have added a wrinkle... I have a three way switch arrangement for the lighting in my kitchen. There are switches at either end of the kitchen, either of which will turn on or off the lighting. A typical three way switch arrangement with two travelers, etc. This works just fine right now. Here's the wrinkle: I am adding some task lighting, for which I ran the romex from the primary three way switch to the lighting. I added a second single pole, single throw switch to the box. I tapped off the AC feed to the three way switch for the power to the task lighting switch. When the three way switch is turned on, the task lighting will turn on as well, if its switch is on, as it will turn off when the three way switch goes off. When the kitchen lighting is off, the task lighting will not turn on and as one would expect, there is no power at the input to the task lighting switch. While I haven't put pencil to paper and drawn this out yet, I am thinking that I am getting a back feed through the new circuit that is preventing it from working correctly. This doesn't make total sense to me, unless I am not at the box where the primary feed for the three way circuit is. Either this or the primary circuit is dropping to zero when it is on (potential to ground) because there is now a load on it, effectively cutting off power to the new lighting circuit. I am wondering if I will need to put a diode in series to prevent this from happening. Anyone want to wrap their mind around this one? Dan ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] OT - 3 Way Switch Wiring
IT could be the light switch in the ceiling fan if it was not part of the assembly, or the wall switch. Fans have vibrations that could have worked lose a poor connection. On Sat, Aug 4, 2012 at 9:55 AM, Kaleb C. Striplin ka...@striplin.netwrote: I have no idea what the heck you are talking about. Speaking of which though, in my bedroom we have a double switch on the wall with a ceiling fan with light attached. One switch turns on the fan the other switch turns on the light. All the sudden the light no longer turns on but the fan still does. I thought maybe it was the light assembly so I swapped from another room still not working, one from bedroom worked in the other room. So I hope maybe I can figure this out without having to pay an electrician to come out. I know zero about home electrical stuff. Sent from my iPhone On Aug 4, 2012, at 10:47 AM, Dan Penoff lwb...@yahoo.com wrote: Yeah, I know how to wire a three way switch, but I have added a wrinkle... I have a three way switch arrangement for the lighting in my kitchen. There are switches at either end of the kitchen, either of which will turn on or off the lighting. A typical three way switch arrangement with two travelers, etc. This works just fine right now. Here's the wrinkle: I am adding some task lighting, for which I ran the romex from the primary three way switch to the lighting. I added a second single pole, single throw switch to the box. I tapped off the AC feed to the three way switch for the power to the task lighting switch. When the three way switch is turned on, the task lighting will turn on as well, if its switch is on, as it will turn off when the three way switch goes off. When the kitchen lighting is off, the task lighting will not turn on and as one would expect, there is no power at the input to the task lighting switch. While I haven't put pencil to paper and drawn this out yet, I am thinking that I am getting a back feed through the new circuit that is preventing it from working correctly. This doesn't make total sense to me, unless I am not at the box where the primary feed for the three way circuit is. Either this or the primary circuit is dropping to zero when it is on (potential to ground) because there is now a load on it, effectively cutting off power to the new lighting circuit. I am wondering if I will need to put a diode in series to prevent this from happening. Anyone want to wrap their mind around this one? Dan ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] OT - 3 Way Switch Wiring
The whole light assembly that contains the switches for the light and fan speed removes from the main fan and is connected with a plug in wiring harness. I have thought it would almost have to be something with the wire going into the fan. I just don't know how to check if it's getting power or not. I would not think it would be the wall switch but who knows Sent from my iPhone On Aug 4, 2012, at 10:57 AM, Brian Toscano brian.tosc...@gmail.com wrote: IT could be the light switch in the ceiling fan if it was not part of the assembly, or the wall switch. Fans have vibrations that could have worked lose a poor connection. On Sat, Aug 4, 2012 at 9:55 AM, Kaleb C. Striplin ka...@striplin.netwrote: I have no idea what the heck you are talking about. Speaking of which though, in my bedroom we have a double switch on the wall with a ceiling fan with light attached. One switch turns on the fan the other switch turns on the light. All the sudden the light no longer turns on but the fan still does. I thought maybe it was the light assembly so I swapped from another room still not working, one from bedroom worked in the other room. So I hope maybe I can figure this out without having to pay an electrician to come out. I know zero about home electrical stuff. Sent from my iPhone On Aug 4, 2012, at 10:47 AM, Dan Penoff lwb...@yahoo.com wrote: Yeah, I know how to wire a three way switch, but I have added a wrinkle... I have a three way switch arrangement for the lighting in my kitchen. There are switches at either end of the kitchen, either of which will turn on or off the lighting. A typical three way switch arrangement with two travelers, etc. This works just fine right now. Here's the wrinkle: I am adding some task lighting, for which I ran the romex from the primary three way switch to the lighting. I added a second single pole, single throw switch to the box. I tapped off the AC feed to the three way switch for the power to the task lighting switch. When the three way switch is turned on, the task lighting will turn on as well, if its switch is on, as it will turn off when the three way switch goes off. When the kitchen lighting is off, the task lighting will not turn on and as one would expect, there is no power at the input to the task lighting switch. While I haven't put pencil to paper and drawn this out yet, I am thinking that I am getting a back feed through the new circuit that is preventing it from working correctly. This doesn't make total sense to me, unless I am not at the box where the primary feed for the three way circuit is. Either this or the primary circuit is dropping to zero when it is on (potential to ground) because there is now a load on it, effectively cutting off power to the new lighting circuit. I am wondering if I will need to put a diode in series to prevent this from happening. Anyone want to wrap their mind around this one? Dan ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] OT - 3 Way Switch Wiring
On Sat, 4 Aug 2012 11:47:53 -0400 Dan Penoff lwb...@yahoo.com wrote: When the three way switch is turned on, the task lighting will turn on as well, if its switch is on, as it will turn off when the three way switch goes off. When the kitchen lighting is off, the task lighting will not turn on and as one would expect, there is no power at the input to the task lighting switch. Either you have tapped into the output of the three-way switch arrangement and not the power input, or the power input goes to the light and the three-way switches are switching the neutral connection and not the hot. The way it should be: SW1SW2 /0--0\ L 00/ \0--0 Power 0--0 Light InputLoad N 00 ^ You want to Not here ^ tap in here Craig ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] OT - 3 Way Switch Wiring
If one of you whacked the switch with a vacuum cleaner or an elbow then it is possible that the switch broke. You will just need to put a test light on the output of the wall switch and see if you still get power. If that works, move on up to the ceiling fan. The test light switch, connect to one screw on the switch (at a time) and also the white wire (neutral/ground) - remove the nut. One switch screw should always light the test light. The other would make the test light go on and off as you flip the switch. If you have some kind of high tech electronic dimmer, it is possible that a power surge killed it. On Sat, Aug 4, 2012 at 10:04 AM, Kaleb C. Striplin ka...@striplin.netwrote: The whole light assembly that contains the switches for the light and fan speed removes from the main fan and is connected with a plug in wiring harness. I have thought it would almost have to be something with the wire going into the fan. I just don't know how to check if it's getting power or not. I would not think it would be the wall switch but who knows Sent from my iPhone On Aug 4, 2012, at 10:57 AM, Brian Toscano brian.tosc...@gmail.com wrote: IT could be the light switch in the ceiling fan if it was not part of the assembly, or the wall switch. Fans have vibrations that could have worked lose a poor connection. On Sat, Aug 4, 2012 at 9:55 AM, Kaleb C. Striplin ka...@striplin.net wrote: I have no idea what the heck you are talking about. Speaking of which though, in my bedroom we have a double switch on the wall with a ceiling fan with light attached. One switch turns on the fan the other switch turns on the light. All the sudden the light no longer turns on but the fan still does. I thought maybe it was the light assembly so I swapped from another room still not working, one from bedroom worked in the other room. So I hope maybe I can figure this out without having to pay an electrician to come out. I know zero about home electrical stuff. Sent from my iPhone On Aug 4, 2012, at 10:47 AM, Dan Penoff lwb...@yahoo.com wrote: Yeah, I know how to wire a three way switch, but I have added a wrinkle... I have a three way switch arrangement for the lighting in my kitchen. There are switches at either end of the kitchen, either of which will turn on or off the lighting. A typical three way switch arrangement with two travelers, etc. This works just fine right now. Here's the wrinkle: I am adding some task lighting, for which I ran the romex from the primary three way switch to the lighting. I added a second single pole, single throw switch to the box. I tapped off the AC feed to the three way switch for the power to the task lighting switch. When the three way switch is turned on, the task lighting will turn on as well, if its switch is on, as it will turn off when the three way switch goes off. When the kitchen lighting is off, the task lighting will not turn on and as one would expect, there is no power at the input to the task lighting switch. While I haven't put pencil to paper and drawn this out yet, I am thinking that I am getting a back feed through the new circuit that is preventing it from working correctly. This doesn't make total sense to me, unless I am not at the box where the primary feed for the three way circuit is. Either this or the primary circuit is dropping to zero when it is on (potential to ground) because there is now a load on it, effectively cutting off power to the new lighting circuit. I am wondering if I will need to put a diode in series to prevent this from happening. Anyone want to wrap their mind around this one? Dan ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new
Re: [MBZ] OT - 3 Way Switch Wiring
Hm, if you tapped off the black (hot) wire at the three-way switch I would think the task lighting should work independently (which is what I would want...) Dan Penoff lwb...@yahoo.com writes: Yeah, I know how to wire a three way switch, but I have added a wrinkle... I have a three way switch arrangement for the lighting in my kitchen. There are switches at either end of the kitchen, either of which will turn on or off the lighting. A typical three way switch arrangement with two travelers, etc. This works just fine right now. Here's the wrinkle: I am adding some task lighting, for which I ran the romex from the primary three way switch to the lighting. I added a second single pole, single throw switch to the box. I tapped off the AC feed to the three way switch for the power to the task lighting switch. When the three way switch is turned on, the task lighting will turn on as well, if its switch is on, as it will turn off when the three way switch goes off. When the kitchen lighting is off, the task lighting will not turn on and as one would expect, there is no power at the input to the task lighting switch. While I haven't put pencil to paper and drawn this out yet, I am thinking that I am getting a back feed through the new circuit that is preventing it from working correctly. This doesn't make total sense to me, unless I am not at the box where the primary feed for the three way circuit is. Either this or the primary circuit is dropping to zero when it is on (potential to ground) because there is now a load on it, effectively cutting off power to the new lighting circuit. I am wondering if I will need to put a diode in series to prevent this from happening. Anyone want to wrap their mind around this one? Dan ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- 1983 300D 1979 300SD ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] OT - 3 Way Switch Wiring
It would, but with the help of my trusty Fluke and some time I was able to determine that I am on the load side of the circuit, not the supply side. Fortunately, there is a receptacle close by that I think I can snake some timed to and get an unswitched supply from. Darn it. Thanks to all for the info and suggestions! Dan On Aug 4, 2012, at 1:29 PM, Allan Streib str...@cs.indiana.edu wrote: Hm, if you tapped off the black (hot) wire at the three-way switch I would think the task lighting should work independently (which is what I would want...) Dan Penoff lwb...@yahoo.com writes: Yeah, I know how to wire a three way switch, but I have added a wrinkle... I have a three way switch arrangement for the lighting in my kitchen. There are switches at either end of the kitchen, either of which will turn on or off the lighting. A typical three way switch arrangement with two travelers, etc. This works just fine right now. Here's the wrinkle: I am adding some task lighting, for which I ran the romex from the primary three way switch to the lighting. I added a second single pole, single throw switch to the box. I tapped off the AC feed to the three way switch for the power to the task lighting switch. When the three way switch is turned on, the task lighting will turn on as well, if its switch is on, as it will turn off when the three way switch goes off. When the kitchen lighting is off, the task lighting will not turn on and as one would expect, there is no power at the input to the task lighting switch. While I haven't put pencil to paper and drawn this out yet, I am thinking that I am getting a back feed through the new circuit that is preventing it from working correctly. This doesn't make total sense to me, unless I am not at the box where the primary feed for the three way circuit is. Either this or the primary circuit is dropping to zero when it is on (potential to ground) because there is now a load on it, effectively cutting off power to the new lighting circuit. I am wondering if I will need to put a diode in series to prevent this from happening. Anyone want to wrap their mind around this one? Dan ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com -- 1983 300D 1979 300SD ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] OT - 3 Way Switch Wiring
Does power enter the system at the original kitchen light or at the 3W switch that you call primary? Wilton - Original Message - From: Dan Penoff lwb...@yahoo.com To: Mercedes List mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Saturday, August 04, 2012 11:47 AM Subject: [MBZ] OT - 3 Way Switch Wiring Yeah, I know how to wire a three way switch, but I have added a wrinkle... I have a three way switch arrangement for the lighting in my kitchen. There are switches at either end of the kitchen, either of which will turn on or off the lighting. A typical three way switch arrangement with two travelers, etc. This works just fine right now. Here's the wrinkle: I am adding some task lighting, for which I ran the romex from the primary three way switch to the lighting. I added a second single pole, single throw switch to the box. I tapped off the AC feed to the three way switch for the power to the task lighting switch. When the three way switch is turned on, the task lighting will turn on as well, if its switch is on, as it will turn off when the three way switch goes off. When the kitchen lighting is off, the task lighting will not turn on and as one would expect, there is no power at the input to the task lighting switch. While I haven't put pencil to paper and drawn this out yet, I am thinking that I am getting a back feed through the new circuit that is preventing it from working correctly. This doesn't make total sense to me, unless I am not at the box where the primary feed for the three way circuit is. Either this or the primary circuit is dropping to zero when it is on (potential to ground) because there is now a load on it, effectively cutting off power to the new lighting circuit. I am wondering if I will need to put a diode in series to prevent this from happening. Anyone want to wrap their mind around this one? Dan ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] OT - 3 Way Switch Wiring
The 3 way is switching the neutral as well as power. You need to put additional lighting in parallel with the existing light with the new switch in series with the new light. -Dave Walton On Aug 4, 2012, at 11:47 AM, Dan Penoff lwb...@yahoo.com wrote: Yeah, I know how to wire a three way switch, but I have added a wrinkle... I have a three way switch arrangement for the lighting in my kitchen. There are switches at either end of the kitchen, either of which will turn on or off the lighting. A typical three way switch arrangement with two travelers, etc. This works just fine right now. Here's the wrinkle: I am adding some task lighting, for which I ran the romex from the primary three way switch to the lighting. I added a second single pole, single throw switch to the box. I tapped off the AC feed to the three way switch for the power to the task lighting switch. When the three way switch is turned on, the task lighting will turn on as well, if its switch is on, as it will turn off when the three way switch goes off. When the kitchen lighting is off, the task lighting will not turn on and as one would expect, there is no power at the input to the task lighting switch. While I haven't put pencil to paper and drawn this out yet, I am thinking that I am getting a back feed through the new circuit that is preventing it from working correctly. This doesn't make total sense to me, unless I am not at the box where the primary feed for the three way circuit is. Either this or the primary circuit is dropping to zero when it is on (potential to ground) because there is now a load on it, effectively cutting off power to the new lighting circuit. I am wondering if I will need to put a diode in series to prevent this from happening. Anyone want to wrap their mind around this one? Dan ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] OT - 3 Way Switch Wiring
Yep. Wilton - Original Message - From: Dave Walton walton.d...@gmail.com To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Saturday, August 04, 2012 3:25 PM Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT - 3 Way Switch Wiring The 3 way is switching the neutral as well as power. You need to put additional lighting in parallel with the existing light with the new switch in series with the new light. -Dave Walton On Aug 4, 2012, at 11:47 AM, Dan Penoff lwb...@yahoo.com wrote: Yeah, I know how to wire a three way switch, but I have added a wrinkle... I have a three way switch arrangement for the lighting in my kitchen. There are switches at either end of the kitchen, either of which will turn on or off the lighting. A typical three way switch arrangement with two travelers, etc. This works just fine right now. Here's the wrinkle: I am adding some task lighting, for which I ran the romex from the primary three way switch to the lighting. I added a second single pole, single throw switch to the box. I tapped off the AC feed to the three way switch for the power to the task lighting switch. When the three way switch is turned on, the task lighting will turn on as well, if its switch is on, as it will turn off when the three way switch goes off. When the kitchen lighting is off, the task lighting will not turn on and as one would expect, there is no power at the input to the task lighting switch. While I haven't put pencil to paper and drawn this out yet, I am thinking that I am getting a back feed through the new circuit that is preventing it from working correctly. This doesn't make total sense to me, unless I am not at the box where the primary feed for the three way circuit is. Either this or the primary circuit is dropping to zero when it is on (potential to ground) because there is now a load on it, effectively cutting off power to the new lighting circuit. I am wondering if I will need to put a diode in series to prevent this from happening. Anyone want to wrap their mind around this one? Dan ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] OT - 3 Way Switch Wiring
On Sat, 4 Aug 2012 15:27:02 -0400 WILTON wilt...@nc.rr.com wrote: Yep. Wilton - Original Message - From: Dave Walton walton.d...@gmail.com To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Saturday, August 04, 2012 3:25 PM Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT - 3 Way Switch Wiring The 3 way is switching the neutral as well as power. You need to put additional lighting in parallel with the existing light with the new switch in series with the new light. Actually, Nope. (Sorry, Wilton.) The neutral must be unswitched if you have only single-pole, double-throw (SPDT) switches. See the ASCII-art schematic of my earlier mail. What Dave describes is apparently what Dan already has. He can only turn on his task lighting when the main lighting is on. He wants to be able to turn on the task lighting when the main lighting is off. Craig ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] OT - 3 Way Switch Wiring
Yes, I know - neutral should NOT be switched. Hot side only should be switched. That's the way it works in the several houses I've wired, anyway. Wilton - Original Message - From: Craig diese...@pisquared.net To: mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Saturday, August 04, 2012 4:07 PM Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT - 3 Way Switch Wiring On Sat, 4 Aug 2012 15:27:02 -0400 WILTON wilt...@nc.rr.com wrote: Yep. Wilton - Original Message - From: Dave Walton walton.d...@gmail.com To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Saturday, August 04, 2012 3:25 PM Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT - 3 Way Switch Wiring The 3 way is switching the neutral as well as power. You need to put additional lighting in parallel with the existing light with the new switch in series with the new light. Actually, Nope. (Sorry, Wilton.) The neutral must be unswitched if you have only single-pole, double-throw (SPDT) switches. See the ASCII-art schematic of my earlier mail. What Dave describes is apparently what Dan already has. He can only turn on his task lighting when the main lighting is on. He wants to be able to turn on the task lighting when the main lighting is off. Craig ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] OT - 3 Way Switch Wiring
I don't even know how you would switch neutral unless you had some crazy 2 or 3 pole 3-way switches. Definitely not something you can buy at Home Depot. On Sat, Aug 4, 2012 at 2:18 PM, WILTON wilt...@nc.rr.com wrote: Yes, I know - neutral should NOT be switched. Hot side only should be switched. That's the way it works in the several houses I've wired, anyway. Wilton - Original Message - From: Craig diese...@pisquared.net To: mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Saturday, August 04, 2012 4:07 PM Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT - 3 Way Switch Wiring On Sat, 4 Aug 2012 15:27:02 -0400 WILTON wilt...@nc.rr.com wrote: Yep. Wilton - Original Message - From: Dave Walton walton.d...@gmail.com To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Saturday, August 04, 2012 3:25 PM Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT - 3 Way Switch Wiring The 3 way is switching the neutral as well as power. You need to put additional lighting in parallel with the existing light with the new switch in series with the new light. Actually, Nope. (Sorry, Wilton.) The neutral must be unswitched if you have only single-pole, double-throw (SPDT) switches. See the ASCII-art schematic of my earlier mail. What Dave describes is apparently what Dan already has. He can only turn on his task lighting when the main lighting is on. He wants to be able to turn on the task lighting when the main lighting is off. Craig __**_ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/**archive/http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/**mailman/listinfo/mercedes_**okiebenz.comhttp://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com __**_ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/**archive/http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/**mailman/listinfo/mercedes_**okiebenz.comhttp://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] OT - 3 Way Switch Wiring
Neutral can be switched VERY easily by attaching 2-pole switch into neutral side of circuit; light, appliance, etc., may still seem to work normally, but it's DANGEROUS - power is still sitting there in the appliance ready to BITE (hurt/kill, etc.) somebody even when power is OFF. 'Don't mean to imply that that's what's in Dan's case at all; this is merely a simple, very easy and a very typical way that neutral is often and erroneously switched, usually by somebody who doesn't know what the hell he's doing. This often occurs with lamp switches. Wilton - Original Message - From: Brian Toscano brian.tosc...@gmail.com To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Saturday, August 04, 2012 4:29 PM Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT - 3 Way Switch Wiring I don't even know how you would switch neutral unless you had some crazy 2 or 3 pole 3-way switches. Definitely not something you can buy at Home Depot. On Sat, Aug 4, 2012 at 2:18 PM, WILTON wilt...@nc.rr.com wrote: Yes, I know - neutral should NOT be switched. Hot side only should be switched. That's the way it works in the several houses I've wired, anyway. Wilton - Original Message - From: Craig diese...@pisquared.net To: mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Saturday, August 04, 2012 4:07 PM Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT - 3 Way Switch Wiring On Sat, 4 Aug 2012 15:27:02 -0400 WILTON wilt...@nc.rr.com wrote: Yep. Wilton - Original Message - From: Dave Walton walton.d...@gmail.com To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Saturday, August 04, 2012 3:25 PM Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT - 3 Way Switch Wiring The 3 way is switching the neutral as well as power. You need to put additional lighting in parallel with the existing light with the new switch in series with the new light. Actually, Nope. (Sorry, Wilton.) The neutral must be unswitched if you have only single-pole, double-throw (SPDT) switches. See the ASCII-art schematic of my earlier mail. What Dave describes is apparently what Dan already has. He can only turn on his task lighting when the main lighting is on. He wants to be able to turn on the task lighting when the main lighting is off. Craig __**_ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/**archive/http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/**mailman/listinfo/mercedes_**okiebenz.comhttp://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com __**_ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/**archive/http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/**mailman/listinfo/mercedes_**okiebenz.comhttp://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] OT - 3 Way Switch Wiring
Yes, in an incorrect installation. In a correct installation is not switched. I was thinking someone might be suggesting that both were switched. On Sat, Aug 4, 2012 at 3:35 PM, WILTON wilt...@nc.rr.com wrote: Neutral can be switched VERY easily by attaching 2-pole switch into neutral side of circuit; light, appliance, etc., may still seem to work normally, but it's DANGEROUS - power is still sitting there in the appliance ready to BITE (hurt/kill, etc.) somebody even when power is OFF. 'Don't mean to imply that that's what's in Dan's case at all; this is merely a simple, very easy and a very typical way that neutral is often and erroneously switched, usually by somebody who doesn't know what the hell he's doing. This often occurs with lamp switches. Wilton - Original Message - From: Brian Toscano brian.tosc...@gmail.com To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Saturday, August 04, 2012 4:29 PM Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT - 3 Way Switch Wiring I don't even know how you would switch neutral unless you had some crazy 2 or 3 pole 3-way switches. Definitely not something you can buy at Home Depot. On Sat, Aug 4, 2012 at 2:18 PM, WILTON wilt...@nc.rr.com wrote: Yes, I know - neutral should NOT be switched. Hot side only should be switched. That's the way it works in the several houses I've wired, anyway. Wilton - Original Message - From: Craig diese...@pisquared.net To: mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Saturday, August 04, 2012 4:07 PM Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT - 3 Way Switch Wiring On Sat, 4 Aug 2012 15:27:02 -0400 WILTON wilt...@nc.rr.com wrote: Yep. Wilton - Original Message - From: Dave Walton walton.d...@gmail.com To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Saturday, August 04, 2012 3:25 PM Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT - 3 Way Switch Wiring The 3 way is switching the neutral as well as power. You need to put additional lighting in parallel with the existing light with the new switch in series with the new light. Actually, Nope. (Sorry, Wilton.) The neutral must be unswitched if you have only single-pole, double-throw (SPDT) switches. See the ASCII-art schematic of my earlier mail. What Dave describes is apparently what Dan already has. He can only turn on his task lighting when the main lighting is on. He wants to be able to turn on the task lighting when the main lighting is off. Craig ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/http://www.okiebenz.com/**archive/ http://www.okiebenz.**com/archive/ http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.comhttp://mail.okiebenz.com/**mailman/listinfo/mercedes_**okiebenz.com http://mail.**okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/**mercedes_okiebenz.comhttp://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/http://www.okiebenz.com/**archive/ http://www.okiebenz.**com/archive/ http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.comhttp://mail.okiebenz.com/**mailman/listinfo/mercedes_**okiebenz.com http://mail.**okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/**mercedes_okiebenz.comhttp://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com __**_ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/**archive/http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/**mailman/listinfo/mercedes_**okiebenz.comhttp://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com __**_ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/**archive/http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/**mailman/listinfo/mercedes_**okiebenz.comhttp://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] OT - 3 Way Switch Wiring
'Course, I MEANT power is still sitting there in the appliance ready to BITE somebody even when SWITCH is OFF. Wilton - Original Message - From: Brian Toscano brian.tosc...@gmail.com To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Saturday, August 04, 2012 5:43 PM Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT - 3 Way Switch Wiring Yes, in an incorrect installation. In a correct installation is not switched. I was thinking someone might be suggesting that both were switched. On Sat, Aug 4, 2012 at 3:35 PM, WILTON wilt...@nc.rr.com wrote: Neutral can be switched VERY easily by attaching 2-pole switch into neutral side of circuit; light, appliance, etc., may still seem to work normally, but it's DANGEROUS - power is still sitting there in the appliance ready to BITE (hurt/kill, etc.) somebody even when power is OFF. 'Don't mean to imply that that's what's in Dan's case at all; this is merely a simple, very easy and a very typical way that neutral is often and erroneously switched, usually by somebody who doesn't know what the hell he's doing. This often occurs with lamp switches. Wilton - Original Message - From: Brian Toscano brian.tosc...@gmail.com To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Saturday, August 04, 2012 4:29 PM Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT - 3 Way Switch Wiring I don't even know how you would switch neutral unless you had some crazy 2 or 3 pole 3-way switches. Definitely not something you can buy at Home Depot. On Sat, Aug 4, 2012 at 2:18 PM, WILTON wilt...@nc.rr.com wrote: Yes, I know - neutral should NOT be switched. Hot side only should be switched. That's the way it works in the several houses I've wired, anyway. Wilton - Original Message - From: Craig diese...@pisquared.net To: mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Saturday, August 04, 2012 4:07 PM Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT - 3 Way Switch Wiring On Sat, 4 Aug 2012 15:27:02 -0400 WILTON wilt...@nc.rr.com wrote: Yep. Wilton - Original Message - From: Dave Walton walton.d...@gmail.com To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Saturday, August 04, 2012 3:25 PM Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT - 3 Way Switch Wiring The 3 way is switching the neutral as well as power. You need to put additional lighting in parallel with the existing light with the new switch in series with the new light. Actually, Nope. (Sorry, Wilton.) The neutral must be unswitched if you have only single-pole, double-throw (SPDT) switches. See the ASCII-art schematic of my earlier mail. What Dave describes is apparently what Dan already has. He can only turn on his task lighting when the main lighting is on. He wants to be able to turn on the task lighting when the main lighting is off. Craig ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/http://www.okiebenz.com/**archive/ http://www.okiebenz.**com/archive/ http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.comhttp://mail.okiebenz.com/**mailman/listinfo/mercedes_**okiebenz.com http://mail.**okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/**mercedes_okiebenz.comhttp://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/http://www.okiebenz.com/**archive/ http://www.okiebenz.**com/archive/ http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.comhttp://mail.okiebenz.com/**mailman/listinfo/mercedes_**okiebenz.com http://mail.**okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/**mercedes_okiebenz.comhttp://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com __**_ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/**archive/http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/**mailman/listinfo/mercedes_**okiebenz.comhttp://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com __**_ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/**archive/http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/**mailman/listinfo/mercedes_**okiebenz.comhttp://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo
Re: [MBZ] OT - 3 Way Switch Wiring
Everything was installed to code. The issue was that the supply side of the circuit was at the other switch, not the one I had roughed in my new light switch at. To add insult to injury, there was an internal jumper in the switch that connected the supply (black) terminal of the three way section to the black (gold) terminal of the secondary switch. Needless to say, I pulled that bad boy out Just to clarify, this is in a single gang deep box, so I put a new switch in it that has two sections - a single pole section for my new lights, and a three way section for the existing three way circuit. My original plan was to simply jumper the supply from the three way switch to the single pole side and use that to power up the new lights. With the internal jumper it would have been down for me, but since the black lead in this case was not the supply, it wouldn't work Again, thanks to those who offered help. I knew I could figure it out, I was just looking for some additional brains to make it faster. Dan On Aug 4, 2012, at 6:00 PM, WILTON wrote: 'Course, I MEANT power is still sitting there in the appliance ready to BITE somebody even when SWITCH is OFF. Wilton - Original Message - From: Brian Toscano brian.tosc...@gmail.com To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Saturday, August 04, 2012 5:43 PM Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT - 3 Way Switch Wiring Yes, in an incorrect installation. In a correct installation is not switched. I was thinking someone might be suggesting that both were switched. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
[MBZ] OT - 3 Way Switch Wiring
BTW, when I was 12 (1946), I helped neighbor build and wire (cloth-covered romex ; 'think it was still only 2 conductors) a small garage and shop building. When time came to install receptacles and switches, though, neighbor would not let me help. 'Got his 19-year-old son to help, instead. While they worked, I watched, and could tell that they didn't know ANYTHING about what they were doing; I could not help but make suggestions, such as, black wire is hot, neutral is white, black goes on dark-colored screw on the receptacle, etc. (I had helped an electrician install some receptacle circuits in my home, and I had been reading Popular Mechanics in the library at school.) When they began to wire the first switch, they couldn't figure out how to do it, and began to hook both black (hot) and white (neutral) to the switch. I adamantly began to tell them that they were creating a direct short - that a fuse would blow the instant they threw the switch. I tried to tell them that the switch goes on only the black (hot) wire - 'either completes or breaks the circuit on the hot (black) side, and that the white wire doesn't connect to the switch at all - merely goes through the box without any break. They insisted, though, and proceeded to connect black and white to the switch, while telling me (against my protests) that I didn't know what I was talking about. As they finished connecting the black and white to the switch, I asked again, Do you have a fuse handy? 'Cause you're gonna need one if you throw that switch. They finally paused briefly to find a fuse. I said, Don't put the fuse away, you're gonna need it the instant you throw that switch. Shonuff, neighbor threw switch, we heard a POP, and son went immediately to replace fuse. Son left and neighbor let me do rest of the wiring, switch and receptacle, etc., installations. Wilton - Original Message - From: WILTON wilt...@nc.rr.com To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Saturday, August 04, 2012 5:35 PM Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT - 3 Way Switch Wiring Neutral can be switched VERY easily by attaching 2-pole switch into neutral side of circuit; light, appliance, etc., may still seem to work normally, but it's DANGEROUS - power is still sitting there in the appliance ready to BITE (hurt/kill, etc.) somebody even when power is OFF. 'Don't mean to imply that that's what's in Dan's case at all; this is merely a simple, very easy and a very typical way that neutral is often and erroneously switched, usually by somebody who doesn't know what the hell he's doing. This often occurs with lamp switches. Wilton - Original Message - From: Brian Toscano brian.tosc...@gmail.com To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Saturday, August 04, 2012 4:29 PM Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT - 3 Way Switch Wiring I don't even know how you would switch neutral unless you had some crazy 2 or 3 pole 3-way switches. Definitely not something you can buy at Home Depot. On Sat, Aug 4, 2012 at 2:18 PM, WILTON wilt...@nc.rr.com wrote: Yes, I know - neutral should NOT be switched. Hot side only should be switched. That's the way it works in the several houses I've wired, anyway. Wilton - Original Message - From: Craig diese...@pisquared.net To: mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Saturday, August 04, 2012 4:07 PM Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT - 3 Way Switch Wiring On Sat, 4 Aug 2012 15:27:02 -0400 WILTON wilt...@nc.rr.com wrote: Yep. Wilton - Original Message - From: Dave Walton walton.d...@gmail.com To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Saturday, August 04, 2012 3:25 PM Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT - 3 Way Switch Wiring The 3 way is switching the neutral as well as power. You need to put additional lighting in parallel with the existing light with the new switch in series with the new light. Actually, Nope. (Sorry, Wilton.) The neutral must be unswitched if you have only single-pole, double-throw (SPDT) switches. See the ASCII-art schematic of my earlier mail. What Dave describes is apparently what Dan already has. He can only turn on his task lighting when the main lighting is on. He wants to be able to turn on the task lighting when the main lighting is off. Craig __**_ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/**archive/http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/**mailman/listinfo/mercedes_**okiebenz.comhttp://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com __**_ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/**archive/http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/**mailman/listinfo/mercedes_
Re: [MBZ] OT - 3 Way Switch Wiring
On Sat, 4 Aug 2012 19:40:17 -0400 WILTON wilt...@nc.rr.com wrote: Son left and neighbor let me do rest of the wiring, switch and receptacle, etc., installations. Attaboy! Craig ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] OT - 3 Way Switch Wiring
BTW, again, the building is still in use. 'Doubt there's been any changes to the wiring since I did it in '46. Wilton - Original Message - From: WILTON wilt...@nc.rr.com To: mercedes list mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Saturday, August 04, 2012 7:40 PM Subject: [MBZ] OT - 3 Way Switch Wiring BTW, when I was 12 (1946), I helped neighbor build and wire (cloth-covered romex ; 'think it was still only 2 conductors) a small garage and shop building. When time came to install receptacles and switches, though, neighbor would not let me help. 'Got his 19-year-old son to help, instead. While they worked, I watched, and could tell that they didn't know ANYTHING about what they were doing; I could not help but make suggestions, such as, black wire is hot, neutral is white, black goes on dark-colored screw on the receptacle, etc. (I had helped an electrician install some receptacle circuits in my home, and I had been reading Popular Mechanics in the library at school.) When they began to wire the first switch, they couldn't figure out how to do it, and began to hook both black (hot) and white (neutral) to the switch. I adamantly began to tell them that they were creating a direct short - that a fuse would blow the instant they threw the switch. I tried to tell them that the switch goes on only the black (hot) wire - 'either completes or breaks the circuit on the hot (black) side, and that the white wire doesn't connect to the switch at all - merely goes through the box without any break. They insisted, though, and proceeded to connect black and white to the switch, while telling me (against my protests) that I didn't know what I was talking about. As they finished connecting the black and white to the switch, I asked again, Do you have a fuse handy? 'Cause you're gonna need one if you throw that switch. They finally paused briefly to find a fuse. I said, Don't put the fuse away, you're gonna need it the instant you throw that switch. Shonuff, neighbor threw switch, we heard a POP, and son went immediately to replace fuse. Son left and neighbor let me do rest of the wiring, switch and receptacle, etc., installations. Wilton - Original Message - From: WILTON wilt...@nc.rr.com To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Saturday, August 04, 2012 5:35 PM Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT - 3 Way Switch Wiring Neutral can be switched VERY easily by attaching 2-pole switch into neutral side of circuit; light, appliance, etc., may still seem to work normally, but it's DANGEROUS - power is still sitting there in the appliance ready to BITE (hurt/kill, etc.) somebody even when power is OFF. 'Don't mean to imply that that's what's in Dan's case at all; this is merely a simple, very easy and a very typical way that neutral is often and erroneously switched, usually by somebody who doesn't know what the hell he's doing. This often occurs with lamp switches. Wilton - Original Message - From: Brian Toscano brian.tosc...@gmail.com To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Saturday, August 04, 2012 4:29 PM Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT - 3 Way Switch Wiring I don't even know how you would switch neutral unless you had some crazy 2 or 3 pole 3-way switches. Definitely not something you can buy at Home Depot. On Sat, Aug 4, 2012 at 2:18 PM, WILTON wilt...@nc.rr.com wrote: Yes, I know - neutral should NOT be switched. Hot side only should be switched. That's the way it works in the several houses I've wired, anyway. Wilton - Original Message - From: Craig diese...@pisquared.net To: mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Saturday, August 04, 2012 4:07 PM Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT - 3 Way Switch Wiring On Sat, 4 Aug 2012 15:27:02 -0400 WILTON wilt...@nc.rr.com wrote: Yep. Wilton - Original Message - From: Dave Walton walton.d...@gmail.com To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Saturday, August 04, 2012 3:25 PM Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT - 3 Way Switch Wiring The 3 way is switching the neutral as well as power. You need to put additional lighting in parallel with the existing light with the new switch in series with the new light. Actually, Nope. (Sorry, Wilton.) The neutral must be unswitched if you have only single-pole, double-throw (SPDT) switches. See the ASCII-art schematic of my earlier mail. What Dave describes is apparently what Dan already has. He can only turn on his task lighting when the main lighting is on. He wants to be able to turn on the task lighting when the main lighting is off. Craig __**_ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/**archive/http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/**mailman/listinfo/mercedes_**okiebenz.comhttp://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] OT - 3 Way Switch Wiring
Dan Penoff wrote: I am wondering if I will need to put a diode in series to prevent this from happening. A diode only works like that for DC, not AC. --Philip ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] OT - 3 Way Switch Wiring
Dave Walton wrote: The 3 way is switching the neutral as well as power. I hope not. The neutral should never be switch. -- Philip ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
