Re: [MBZ] brake fluid capacity
Thanks All, I asked a simple question and received a textbook of information from you, really great. I am now versed in the bleeding job I will do. I think that I will do the gravity bleed because of the age of the system to determine if the lines are in good condition. I am a little confused concerning the DOT4 brake fluid recommended. I am under the belief that DOT4 is a silicone and if mixed with DOT3 will cause sludge and geling having the effect of ruining the whole system. Or is the Mercedes or Valvoline synthetic DOT 4 fluid compatible with the existing fluid in the system? I am relying on your expertise in this matter if you can, please clear this up to me. Anthony On 12/3/05, Marshall Booth [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Anthony Galioto wrote: I am going to bleed out the brake fluid on my 1983 240D. I will replace all the fluid in the system as it is still original equipment. Can anyone tell me how much fluid I should buy for this job? I am going to buy DOT 3, is that the correct type? What is the best brand to get? Thanks in advance. DOT-4 is what Mercedes recommends now for ALL cars. A qt bottle of the Valvoline synthetic DOT 4 fluid is less than $5 and is at least the equal of any brake fluid I've ever used. You'll have some left over when you're done! http://www.partsamerica.com/product_images/img/vlv/057.jpg Marshall -- Marshall Booth (who doesn't respond to unsigned questions) der Dieseling Doktor [EMAIL PROTECTED] '87 300TD 182Kmi, '84 190D 2.2 229Kmi, '85 190D 2.0 161Kmi, '87 190D 2.5 turbo 237kmi ___ For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net
Re: [MBZ] brake fluid capacity
Anthony, DOT4 is not silicone. Personally, I prefer the Mercedes DOT4 Brake Fluid and have used it regularly. I have a SpeediBleed. IMHO, a good investment. Eliminates it being a two person job or using gravity. Cuts down on time significantly. I would urge you to replace the brake lines also. According to your original message, it's been 23 years since the fluid has been flushed. The interior lining of brake lines deteriorates over time and eventually does not allow reverse flow of the fluid once you release the pedal Always a pleasure Take care, Chuck Phoenix AZ 1980 300SD w/345,000 On Dec 4, 2005, at 10:05 AM, Anthony Galioto wrote: Thanks All, I asked a simple question and received a textbook of information from you, really great. I am now versed in the bleeding job I will do. I think that I will do the gravity bleed because of the age of the system to determine if the lines are in good condition. I am a little confused concerning the DOT4 brake fluid recommended. I am under the belief that DOT4 is a silicone and if mixed with DOT3 will cause sludge and geling having the effect of ruining the whole system. Or is the Mercedes or Valvoline synthetic DOT 4 fluid compatible with the existing fluid in the system? I am relying on your expertise in this matter if you can, please clear this up to me. Anthony
Re: [MBZ] brake fluid capacity
Anthony Galioto wrote: Thanks All, I asked a simple question and received a textbook of information from you, really great. I am now versed in the bleeding job I will do. I think that I will do the gravity bleed because of the age of the system to determine if the lines are in good condition. I am a little confused concerning the DOT4 brake fluid recommended. I am under the belief that DOT4 is a silicone and if mixed with DOT3 will cause sludge and geling having the effect of ruining the whole system. Or is the Mercedes or Valvoline synthetic DOT 4 fluid compatible with the existing fluid in the system? I am relying on your expertise in this matter if you can, please clear this up to me. Anthony DOT 5 is silicone. DOT 4 is rather like DOT 3 but DOT 4 is less hygroscopic and has a higher boiling point. They CAN be mixed (but the mix will be less desirable than DOT 4 alone) and are entirely compatible. Mercedes forbids the use of DOT 5 brake fluid and it is NOT compatible with DOT 3/4. Marshall -- Marshall Booth (who doesn't respond to unsigned questions) der Dieseling Doktor [EMAIL PROTECTED] '87 300TD 182Kmi, '84 190D 2.2 229Kmi, '85 190D 2.0 161Kmi, '87 190D 2.5 turbo 237kmi
Re: [MBZ] brake fluid capacity
Marshall Booth wrote: DOT 5 is silicone. DOT 4 is rather like DOT 3 but DOT 4 is less hygroscopic and has a higher boiling point. They CAN be mixed (but the mix will be less desirable than DOT 4 alone) and are entirely compatible. Mercedes forbids the use of DOT 5 brake fluid and it is NOT compatible with DOT 3/4. Marshall If you choose to go with DOT 3 fluid, plan to change it at least EVERY year, not every 2-3 years (as you can with DOT-4). Marshall -- Marshall Booth (who doesn't respond to unsigned questions) der Dieseling Doktor [EMAIL PROTECTED] '87 300TD 182Kmi, '84 190D 2.2 229Kmi, '85 190D 2.0 161Kmi, '87 190D 2.5 turbo 237kmi
[MBZ] brake fluid capacity
I am going to bleed out the brake fluid on my 1983 240D. I will replace all the fluid in the system as it is still original equipment. Can anyone tell me how much fluid I should buy for this job? I am going to buy DOT 3, is that the correct type? What is the best brand to get? Thanks in advance. Anthony, 1983 240 D 63000mi
Re: [MBZ] brake fluid capacity
Rich got it all. One little hint: I open the farthest bleed nipple and let the stuff drain till the reservoir is just empty. Use a lenght of clear tubing on the nipple like Rich describes. Fill the res. with new fluid and let it drain more, keeping the res. full. Drain until the fluid color changes at the bleeder. Go to the other three wheels and drain there until clear fluid. This way you will not introduce air in the system and gravity does the work for you. Takes a little time, maybe 1 hr. On 12/3/05, Rich Thomas [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Since you will be bleeding the system (right?) you will have some waste. The stuff is cheap enough to get a couple of the big (like a liter or so, $3 maybe) bottles and just use what you need, cap off the bottle, and it will keep. I don't think there is a big difference in brands, get the store-branded version DOT3. You might want to then change/bleed again in a couple of weeks, after some of the old gunk is cleaned out by the fresh fluid. For bleeding, you can go hi-tek with a pressure bleeder http://www.bmw-m.net/TechProc/bleeder.htm or just do the brake pump thing (watch so it doesn't spurt out all over the place on the rebound). At the brake end use a short length of clear tubing that fits over the brake nipple (the soft 1/4 or 3/8 or so?), and an old plastic soda bottle with the tubing stuck down in it, a wire to hang it from something close to the wheel. You can buy a little kit thing for a few bucks that is a hi-tek version of the soda bottle, has the tubing and a little reservoir and it all fits together. You can also use a Mity-Vac to suck the old fluid out from the brake end, that is a bit less messy. You might want to hit the nipples with some PB or Liquid Wrench to loosen them up a bit before you start -- they tend to be all rusted up and hard to loosen. Use a hex socket or something to get them going, so you lessen the chance of rounding them off. You can use the $2 oil sucker to get the old stuff out of the reservoir, or a turkey baster (Yummmyummm, the gravy tastes like brake fluid Dad!). Wear nitrile gloves, keep the fluid off your self and the car's paint. Push the petal enough so that you don't loose you're breaks Report back on your success. --R Anthony Galioto wrote: I am going to bleed out the brake fluid on my 1983 240D. I will replace all the fluid in the system as it is still original equipment. Can anyone tell me how much fluid I should buy for this job? I am going to buy DOT 3, is that the correct type? What is the best brand to get? Thanks in advance. Anthony, 1983 240 D 63000mi ___ For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net ___ For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net -- Hans Neureiter, Houston, TX '82 300SD, '95 E300D
Re: [MBZ] brake fluid capacity
Another reason to follow Hans' advice is the probability of damaging the master cylinder if you pump the brakes to bleed them. When the MC piston enters unfamiliar territory (because normally the pedal doesn't go anywhere NEAR the floor) the seals are often damaged. This scenario has arisen MANY times over the years on this list. So, follow Hans' advice and gravity bleed, or if you MUST pump the pedal, avoid depressing the pedal very far, and certainly no further than you normally would when driving. D. At 4:22 PM + 12/3/05, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Message: 18 Date: Sat, 3 Dec 2005 10:22:25 -0600 From: Hans Neureiter [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] brake fluid capacity To: Mercedes mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Rich got it all. One little hint: I open the farthest bleed nipple and let the stuff drain till the reservoir is just empty. Use a lenght of clear tubing on the nipple like Rich describes. Fill the res. with new fluid and let it drain more, keeping the res. full. Drain until the fluid color changes at the bleeder. Go to the other three wheels and drain there until clear fluid. This way you will not introduce air in the system and gravity does the work for you. Takes a little time, maybe 1 hr.
Re: [MBZ] brake fluid capacity
Hans Neureiter wrote: One rule I discoverd is that if gravity will not bleed it, the brake hoses need to be replaced. And/or you have anti-lock brakes.
Re: [MBZ] brake fluid capacity
On Sat, 3 Dec 2005 10:21:49 -0500 Anthony Galioto [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I am going to bleed out the brake fluid on my 1983 240D. I will replace all the fluid in the system as it is still original equipment. After 22 years?! It's amazing your calipers haven't frozen from rust. Can anyone tell me how much fluid I should buy for this job? I've found that two 3/4 liter cans are sufficient. I am going to buy DOT 3, is that the correct type? No. You want DOT 4. From Rusty's website, http://catalog.eautopartscatalog.com/buymb/quote.jsp?clientid=buymbpartscookieid=1OC0VY1V11OC0VY5XQbaseurl=http://www.buymbparts.com/partner=buymbyear=1982product=N3110-36898application=000257789 You don't want the 5 liter container; that's too much for just one car and you'll be hard pressed to keep the excess dry for very long if you live in a humid part of the country. What is the best brand to get? Rusty's website sells ATE SL (see link above). I have a can of it sitting in my garage. You can call him at (800) 741-5252 for other choices. In previous discussions about brake fluid, ATE Super Blue and Valvoline Synpower have been recommended. Some even buy blue fluid one time and amber the next. That way you can see the color change when the new fluid is coming out the hose attached to the bleeder screw. Also, you do not want to use the two-person, up-down-up-down method. Dan Penoff commented in 2002: The only problem with the pump hold approach is possible master cylinder damage. What happens is the master cylinder, just like the real cylinder in your engine, gets a ridge in the bore from wear. When you do the pump hold the piston can travel all the way to the end of the cylinder, passing over this ridge. When this happens the cups (seals) on the piston go over the ridge and get damaged, preventing the piston from sealing properly in the bore. Result? New master cylinder. So use a pressure bleeder (or gravity as someone else has suggested, but only if you don't have anti-lock brakes). I bought one from Falco Tools for about $40 in 2002, but their website is no longer functional. Also mentioned in 2002 was: You can get them [EziBleed] for around $40 from the maker at: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Also note: A point of interest - before you use a power bleeder of ANY sort make sure the little black caps on top of the level switches are good. If they're cracked or split they'll either leak or pop off when you pressurize the system. A good warning since brake fluid attacks paint very quickly. Craig
