Re: [Mesa-dev] Requiring a full author name when contributing to mesa?

[Mark Janes]

Ian Romanick  writes:

> On 12/11/19 2:27 PM, Timothy Arceri wrote:
>> Hi,
>> 
>> So it seems lately we have been increasingly merging patches with made
>> up names, or single names etc [1]. The latest submitted patch has the
>> name Icecream95. This seems wrong to me from a point of keeping up the
>> integrity of the project. I'm not a legal expert but it doesn't seem
>> ideal to be amassing commits with these type of author tags from that
>> point of view either.
>> 
>> Is it just me or do others agree we should at least require a proper
>> name on the commits (as fake as that may be also)? Seems like a low bar
>> to me.
>
> First we don't allow single Unicode characters or emojis, and now you
> want to require realistic looking names.  Where does it end, Tim?!?
> WHERE DOES IT END???
>
> 藍
>
> But seriously... I definitely agree with the sentiment.  It seems really
> lame to have a bunch of commits from clearly nonsense names.  Who are
> these randos?

Perhaps they are graphics developers working at corporations where
management is not enthusiastic about contributions to mesa?

Or, agents seeking to damage mesa by submitting vulnerable or
IP-entangled code?

The kernel does not allow anonymous contributions, to ensure all
contributions are compatible with the GPL.

> Where's the accountability?
>
> As far as any possible legal aspects go, since we don't require (as far
> as I'm aware) submitters to sign any sort of certificate of origin, I
> don't know that Icecream95 is any better or worse than Ralphio Grant (a
> realistic looking name that I just made up) or Ian Romanck.
>
> It seems to me that this is a social problem, so it likely has a social
> solution.  If we don't want people to be anonymous cowards with clearly
> phony names, we should try to make the alternatives of being involved in
> the community and using a real name more attractive.  We should do our
> best to encourage people to "do the right thing."
>
> I don't think it's very realistic for us to try to compel people to do
> so, and I don't think there's much value in it... especially if it
> drives away people making technically competent contributions.
>
>> [1]
>> https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/mesa/mesa/merge_requests/3050#note_361924
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Re: [Mesa-dev] Requiring a full author name when contributing to mesa?

[Ian Romanick]

On 12/11/19 2:27 PM, Timothy Arceri wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> So it seems lately we have been increasingly merging patches with made
> up names, or single names etc [1]. The latest submitted patch has the
> name Icecream95. This seems wrong to me from a point of keeping up the
> integrity of the project. I'm not a legal expert but it doesn't seem
> ideal to be amassing commits with these type of author tags from that
> point of view either.
> 
> Is it just me or do others agree we should at least require a proper
> name on the commits (as fake as that may be also)? Seems like a low bar
> to me.

First we don't allow single Unicode characters or emojis, and now you
want to require realistic looking names.  Where does it end, Tim?!?
WHERE DOES IT END???

藍

But seriously... I definitely agree with the sentiment.  It seems really
lame to have a bunch of commits from clearly nonsense names.  Who are
these randos?  Where's the accountability?

As far as any possible legal aspects go, since we don't require (as far
as I'm aware) submitters to sign any sort of certificate of origin, I
don't know that Icecream95 is any better or worse than Ralphio Grant (a
realistic looking name that I just made up) or Ian Romanck.

It seems to me that this is a social problem, so it likely has a social
solution.  If we don't want people to be anonymous cowards with clearly
phony names, we should try to make the alternatives of being involved in
the community and using a real name more attractive.  We should do our
best to encourage people to "do the right thing."

I don't think it's very realistic for us to try to compel people to do
so, and I don't think there's much value in it... especially if it
drives away people making technically competent contributions.

> [1]
> https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/mesa/mesa/merge_requests/3050#note_361924
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Re: [Mesa-dev] Requiring a full author name when contributing to mesa?

[Marek Olšák]

On Wed, Dec 11, 2019 at 7:47 PM Eric Engestrom  wrote:

> On 2019-12-11 at 23:46, Timothy Arceri  wrote:
> > On 12/12/19 10:38 am, Eric Engestrom wrote:
> > > On 2019-12-11 at 23:09, Eric Anholt  wrote:
> > >> On Wed, Dec 11, 2019 at 2:35 PM Timothy Arceri 
> wrote:
> > >>>
> > >>> Hi,
> > >>>
> > >>> So it seems lately we have been increasingly merging patches with
> made
> > >>> up names, or single names etc [1]. The latest submitted patch has the
> > >>> name Icecream95. This seems wrong to me from a point of keeping up
> the
> > >>> integrity of the project. I'm not a legal expert but it doesn't seem
> > >>> ideal to be amassing commits with these type of author tags from that
> > >>> point of view either.
> > >>>
> > >>> Is it just me or do others agree we should at least require a proper
> > >>> name on the commits (as fake as that may be also)? Seems like a low
> bar
> > >>> to me.
> > >>
> > >> I'm of the opinion that in fact all names are made up,
> > >
> > > Whole heartedly agreed.
> > >
> > > Remember that many different cultures exist, and they have different
> customs
> > > around names. As an example, a teacher of mine had a single name, but
> the school
> > > required two separate "first name" and "last name" fields so he wrote
> his name twice,
> > > which appeared on every form we got from the school, yet everyone knew
> he didn't
> > > have what we called a "last name"/"family name".
> > > Another example is people from Asia who often assume a made up
> Western-sounding
> > > pseudonym to use when communicating with Western people, and those
> often don't
> > > look like real names to us.
> > >
> > > What looks like a real name to you?
> > > How would you even start to define such a rule?
> >
> > As per my reply to Eric Anholt I'm most concerned about the look of the
> > project. IMO contributions with names like Icecream95 or an atom symbol
> > just look unprofessional, opensource gets a hard enough time about its
> > professionalism as it is without encouraging this. A little common sense
> > can go a long way here.
>
> If you want to ask someone to provide a real name if you think they didn't
> I definitely agree,
> and if you want to document that we want real names I'm also ok with that,
> but all I'm saying is that you can't *require* it because there's no
> reliable way
> to enforce that.
>

The question is about whether we require real names. If people lie, that's
on them.

Marek
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Re: [Mesa-dev] Requiring a full author name when contributing to mesa?

[Eric Engestrom]

On 2019-12-11 at 23:46, Timothy Arceri  wrote:
> On 12/12/19 10:38 am, Eric Engestrom wrote:
> > On 2019-12-11 at 23:09, Eric Anholt  wrote:
> >> On Wed, Dec 11, 2019 at 2:35 PM Timothy Arceri  
> >> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> Hi,
> >>>
> >>> So it seems lately we have been increasingly merging patches with made
> >>> up names, or single names etc [1]. The latest submitted patch has the
> >>> name Icecream95. This seems wrong to me from a point of keeping up the
> >>> integrity of the project. I'm not a legal expert but it doesn't seem
> >>> ideal to be amassing commits with these type of author tags from that
> >>> point of view either.
> >>>
> >>> Is it just me or do others agree we should at least require a proper
> >>> name on the commits (as fake as that may be also)? Seems like a low bar
> >>> to me.
> >>
> >> I'm of the opinion that in fact all names are made up,
> > 
> > Whole heartedly agreed.
> > 
> > Remember that many different cultures exist, and they have different customs
> > around names. As an example, a teacher of mine had a single name, but the 
> > school
> > required two separate "first name" and "last name" fields so he wrote his 
> > name twice,
> > which appeared on every form we got from the school, yet everyone knew he 
> > didn't
> > have what we called a "last name"/"family name".
> > Another example is people from Asia who often assume a made up 
> > Western-sounding
> > pseudonym to use when communicating with Western people, and those often 
> > don't
> > look like real names to us.
> > 
> > What looks like a real name to you?
> > How would you even start to define such a rule?
> 
> As per my reply to Eric Anholt I'm most concerned about the look of the 
> project. IMO contributions with names like Icecream95 or an atom symbol 
> just look unprofessional, opensource gets a hard enough time about its 
> professionalism as it is without encouraging this. A little common sense 
> can go a long way here.

If you want to ask someone to provide a real name if you think they didn't I 
definitely agree,
and if you want to document that we want real names I'm also ok with that,
but all I'm saying is that you can't *require* it because there's no reliable 
way
to enforce that.

> 
> > 
> >> and we don't
> >> want to be getting into the business of requiring legal names for
> >> committing.  If legal names were what you were getting at: have you
> >> checked the legal names of your fellow contributors match what they're
> >> contributing under?
> >>
> >> I don't know what legal risk you might be thinking of, that seems like
> >> spreading fear for no reason to me.
>
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Re: [Mesa-dev] Requiring a full author name when contributing to mesa?

[Timothy Arceri]

On 12/12/19 10:38 am, Eric Engestrom wrote:

On 2019-12-11 at 23:09, Eric Anholt  wrote:

On Wed, Dec 11, 2019 at 2:35 PM Timothy Arceri  wrote:


Hi,

So it seems lately we have been increasingly merging patches with made
up names, or single names etc [1]. The latest submitted patch has the
name Icecream95. This seems wrong to me from a point of keeping up the
integrity of the project. I'm not a legal expert but it doesn't seem
ideal to be amassing commits with these type of author tags from that
point of view either.

Is it just me or do others agree we should at least require a proper
name on the commits (as fake as that may be also)? Seems like a low bar
to me.


I'm of the opinion that in fact all names are made up,


Whole heartedly agreed.

Remember that many different cultures exist, and they have different customs
around names. As an example, a teacher of mine had a single name, but the school
required two separate "first name" and "last name" fields so he wrote his name 
twice,
which appeared on every form we got from the school, yet everyone knew he didn't
have what we called a "last name"/"family name".
Another example is people from Asia who often assume a made up Western-sounding
pseudonym to use when communicating with Western people, and those often don't
look like real names to us.

What looks like a real name to you?
How would you even start to define such a rule?


As per my reply to Eric Anholt I'm most concerned about the look of the 
project. IMO contributions with names like Icecream95 or an atom symbol 
just look unprofessional, opensource gets a hard enough time about its 
professionalism as it is without encouraging this. A little common sense 
can go a long way here.





and we don't
want to be getting into the business of requiring legal names for
committing.  If legal names were what you were getting at: have you
checked the legal names of your fellow contributors match what they're
contributing under?

I don't know what legal risk you might be thinking of, that seems like
spreading fear for no reason to me.

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Re: [Mesa-dev] Requiring a full author name when contributing to mesa?

[Eric Engestrom]

On 2019-12-11 at 23:09, Eric Anholt  wrote:
> On Wed, Dec 11, 2019 at 2:35 PM Timothy Arceri  wrote:
> >
> > Hi,
> >
> > So it seems lately we have been increasingly merging patches with made
> > up names, or single names etc [1]. The latest submitted patch has the
> > name Icecream95. This seems wrong to me from a point of keeping up the
> > integrity of the project. I'm not a legal expert but it doesn't seem
> > ideal to be amassing commits with these type of author tags from that
> > point of view either.
> >
> > Is it just me or do others agree we should at least require a proper
> > name on the commits (as fake as that may be also)? Seems like a low bar
> > to me.
> 
> I'm of the opinion that in fact all names are made up,

Whole heartedly agreed.

Remember that many different cultures exist, and they have different customs
around names. As an example, a teacher of mine had a single name, but the school
required two separate "first name" and "last name" fields so he wrote his name 
twice,
which appeared on every form we got from the school, yet everyone knew he didn't
have what we called a "last name"/"family name".
Another example is people from Asia who often assume a made up Western-sounding
pseudonym to use when communicating with Western people, and those often don't
look like real names to us.

What looks like a real name to you?
How would you even start to define such a rule?

> and we don't
> want to be getting into the business of requiring legal names for
> committing.  If legal names were what you were getting at: have you
> checked the legal names of your fellow contributors match what they're
> contributing under?
> 
> I don't know what legal risk you might be thinking of, that seems like
> spreading fear for no reason to me.
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Re: [Mesa-dev] Requiring a full author name when contributing to mesa?

[Timothy Arceri]

On 12/12/19 10:09 am, Eric Anholt wrote:

On Wed, Dec 11, 2019 at 2:35 PM Timothy Arceri  wrote:


Hi,

So it seems lately we have been increasingly merging patches with made
up names, or single names etc [1]. The latest submitted patch has the
name Icecream95. This seems wrong to me from a point of keeping up the
integrity of the project. I'm not a legal expert but it doesn't seem
ideal to be amassing commits with these type of author tags from that
point of view either.

Is it just me or do others agree we should at least require a proper
name on the commits (as fake as that may be also)? Seems like a low bar
to me.


I'm of the opinion that in fact all names are made up, and we don't
want to be getting into the business of requiring legal names for
committing.  If legal names were what you were getting at: have you
checked the legal names of your fellow contributors match what they're
contributing under?


My question was: "do others agree we should at least require a proper 
name on the commits (as fake as that may be also)?"




I don't know what legal risk you might be thinking of, that seems like
spreading fear for no reason to me.


If the implications aren't obvious I'm not going to bother arguing 
further, as I'm not a legal expert. I'm more concerned about the look of 
the project. IMO contributions with names like Icecream95 just look 
unprofessional.

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Re: [Mesa-dev] Requiring a full author name when contributing to mesa?

[Eric Anholt]

On Wed, Dec 11, 2019 at 2:35 PM Timothy Arceri  wrote:
>
> Hi,
>
> So it seems lately we have been increasingly merging patches with made
> up names, or single names etc [1]. The latest submitted patch has the
> name Icecream95. This seems wrong to me from a point of keeping up the
> integrity of the project. I'm not a legal expert but it doesn't seem
> ideal to be amassing commits with these type of author tags from that
> point of view either.
>
> Is it just me or do others agree we should at least require a proper
> name on the commits (as fake as that may be also)? Seems like a low bar
> to me.

I'm of the opinion that in fact all names are made up, and we don't
want to be getting into the business of requiring legal names for
committing.  If legal names were what you were getting at: have you
checked the legal names of your fellow contributors match what they're
contributing under?

I don't know what legal risk you might be thinking of, that seems like
spreading fear for no reason to me.
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[Mesa-dev] Requiring a full author name when contributing to mesa?

[Timothy Arceri]

Hi,

So it seems lately we have been increasingly merging patches with made 
up names, or single names etc [1]. The latest submitted patch has the 
name Icecream95. This seems wrong to me from a point of keeping up the 
integrity of the project. I'm not a legal expert but it doesn't seem 
ideal to be amassing commits with these type of author tags from that 
point of view either.


Is it just me or do others agree we should at least require a proper 
name on the commits (as fake as that may be also)? Seems like a low bar 
to me.



[1] https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/mesa/mesa/merge_requests/3050#note_361924
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Re: [Mesa-dev] Is it time to stop using the mailing list for patch review?

[Dylan Baker]

Quoting Nathan Kidd (2019-12-11 06:41:12)
> On 2019-12-10 7:10 p.m., Jason Ekstrand wrote:
> > Quoting Zebediah Figura (2019-12-10 10:58:45)
> > > On 12/10/19 12:21 PM, Matt Turner wrote:
> > > > On Mon, Dec 9, 2019 at 6:07 PM Dylan Baker  wrote:
> > > > > I think its time we discussed whether we're going to continue to do 
> > > > > patch review
> > > > > on the mailing list, or if it it should all go through gitlab. I 
> > > > > think we should
> > > > > stop using the mailing list, here are some reasons:
> > > > >
> > > > > 1) Most development is happening on gitlab at this point, patches on 
> > > > > the mailing
> > > > >    list are often overlooked
> > > > > 2) The mailing list bypasses CI which potentially breaks the build
> > > >
> > > > What concrete change would you propose?
> > >
> > > Removing mention of the mailing list from documentation would be nice.
> > > Also, currently the README implies that the mailing list is not only
> > > acceptable but preferred: "Note that Mesa uses email mailing-lists for
> > > patches submission, review and discussions."
> > 
> > I think updating README type docs is sufficient and I think it's
> > probably time we did that.  
> 
> As a recent drive-by patch submitter, updating the web page and other
> docs to say "use GitLab" would have been sufficient for me.  As they are
> now it wasn't clear which way is preferred, so I defaulted to using
> mesa-dev@ only to find that the dev focus seems to be in gitlab.fd.o and
> if it wasn't for Roland watching the mailing list my patch seemed likely
> to get missed.
> 
> I also went through the work of subscribing to mesa-stable@ to nominate
> there, but again it feels like I missed the de-facto channel for
> suggesting a stable backport patch.   Hint hint [1]. :)

Gahh, mesa-stable is a mailing list I *do* want to complete purge, MRs for
backports, "cc" or "fixes" in the commit message otherwise. I'll update the docs
to mention that.

Dylan


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Re: [Mesa-dev] Is it time to stop using the mailing list for patch review?

[Marek Olšák]

On Wed, Dec 11, 2019 at 12:02 PM Brian Paul  wrote:

> On 12/09/2019 04:07 PM, Dylan Baker wrote:
> > Hi everyone,
> >
> > I think its time we discussed whether we're going to continue to do
> patch review
> > on the mailing list, or if it it should all go through gitlab. I think
> we should
> > stop using the mailing list, here are some reasons:
> >
> > 1) Most development is happening on gitlab at this point, patches on the
> mailing
> > list are often overlooked
> > 2) The mailing list bypasses CI which potentially breaks the build
> > 3) Probably more reasons I'm forgetting.
>
>
> I've had little time for Mesa work the past 18 months.  But I'd say:
>
> 1. I don't think the mesa-dev list should be shut down nor purged from
> the documentation.
>
> 2. I think the complete workflow for submitting patches via gitlab MRs
> should be documented on the Mesa site.  Being a gitlab newbie I wasted a
> lot of time a few months ago trying to figure out the details.  Mesa's
> "Submitting Patches" page is kind of a mess.  It would be great if
> someone could work on that.
>

Yeah, the "Submitting Patches" page is useless, because it doesn't say the
things that you need to know, and it says the things that you mostly do NOT
need to know.

The steps for creating a MR are:
1*) Click "fork" in the Meso repo to create a private repo where you'll
push branches for MRs.
2) git push your branch into your private repo
3) The "git push" command printed a link to create a MR for that branch.
Open it.
4*) Add labels, then click "Allow commits from members who can merge to the
target branch" and click Submit.

Merging a branch:
1*) Check that all CI pipelines have succeeded.
2) Rebase your local branch and force-push to your private branch.
3) Wait ~10 seconds.
4) Push that branch to master (git push origin HEAD:master). Gitlab will
automatically mark the MR as "Merged".

* these are the only steps when you need to use the web UI.

Marek
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Re: [Mesa-dev] Is it time to stop using the mailing list for patch review?

[Rob Clark]

On Wed, Dec 11, 2019 at 9:58 AM Brian Paul  wrote:
>
> On 12/11/2019 10:42 AM, Jason Ekstrand wrote:
> > On Wed, Dec 11, 2019 at 11:33 AM Michel Dänzer  > > wrote:
> >
> > On 2019-12-11 5:47 p.m., Brian Paul wrote:
> >  >
> >  > I've had little time for Mesa work the past 18 months.
> >
> > That makes me sad, I hope you'll have more time again in the future.
>
> Between family life and VMware work, there's little left over.  I'll be
> lurking if nothing else.
>
>
> >  > 1. I don't think the mesa-dev list should be shut down nor purged
> > from
> >  > the documentation.
> >
> > Yeah, I don't think anybody seriously suggested the list should be shut
> > down, just that GitLab is now preferred for patch submission & review.
> >
> >
> >  > Someone mentioned hardly reading the mailing list anymore.  I still
> >  > haven't gotten into the habit of monitoring the MRs page...
> >
> > Instead of monitoring a web page, I recommend setting up notifications
> > via the bell icon on https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/mesa/mesa
> > 
> > 
> > [0]. If
> > you select "Custom", you can select in detail which events you want to
> > get notification e-mails for. Check "New merge request" to get an e-mail
> > for each new MR created. Then you can either enable notifications for
> > other MR events here as well, or enable all notifications for MRs you're
> > interested in using the "Notifications" switch in the right hand panel
> > on each MR's page.
>
> Thanks for the tip!  That's the kind of thing that would be useful to
> document.
>
>
> > You can also subscribe to specific labels which is what I've done.  That
> > way I get e-mails about anything going on in NIR or our Vulkan driver
> > but don't have to see every nouveau MR.
>
> Are labels put on MRs automatically or does the person submitting have
> to do that manually?
>

unfortunately it is manual.. and it is slightly worse in that you need
to have developer permissions in gitlab to add labels..

(some bot that automatically added labels based on some path regex
rules would be super spiffy)

BR,
-R
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Re: [Mesa-dev] Is it time to stop using the mailing list for patch review?

[Brian Paul]

On 12/11/2019 10:42 AM, Jason Ekstrand wrote:
On Wed, Dec 11, 2019 at 11:33 AM Michel Dänzer > wrote:


On 2019-12-11 5:47 p.m., Brian Paul wrote:
 >
 > I've had little time for Mesa work the past 18 months.

That makes me sad, I hope you'll have more time again in the future.


Between family life and VMware work, there's little left over.  I'll be 
lurking if nothing else.




 > 1. I don't think the mesa-dev list should be shut down nor purged
from
 > the documentation.

Yeah, I don't think anybody seriously suggested the list should be shut
down, just that GitLab is now preferred for patch submission & review.


 > Someone mentioned hardly reading the mailing list anymore.  I still
 > haven't gotten into the habit of monitoring the MRs page...

Instead of monitoring a web page, I recommend setting up notifications
via the bell icon on https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/mesa/mesa


[0]. If
you select "Custom", you can select in detail which events you want to
get notification e-mails for. Check "New merge request" to get an e-mail
for each new MR created. Then you can either enable notifications for
other MR events here as well, or enable all notifications for MRs you're
interested in using the "Notifications" switch in the right hand panel
on each MR's page.


Thanks for the tip!  That's the kind of thing that would be useful to 
document.



You can also subscribe to specific labels which is what I've done.  That 
way I get e-mails about anything going on in NIR or our Vulkan driver 
but don't have to see every nouveau MR.


Are labels put on MRs automatically or does the person submitting have 
to do that manually?


-Brian
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Re: [Mesa-dev] Is it time to stop using the mailing list for patch review?

[Jason Ekstrand]

On Wed, Dec 11, 2019 at 11:33 AM Michel Dänzer  wrote:

> On 2019-12-11 5:47 p.m., Brian Paul wrote:
> >
> > I've had little time for Mesa work the past 18 months.
>
> That makes me sad, I hope you'll have more time again in the future.
>
>
> > 1. I don't think the mesa-dev list should be shut down nor purged from
> > the documentation.
>
> Yeah, I don't think anybody seriously suggested the list should be shut
> down, just that GitLab is now preferred for patch submission & review.
>
>
> > Someone mentioned hardly reading the mailing list anymore.  I still
> > haven't gotten into the habit of monitoring the MRs page...
>
> Instead of monitoring a web page, I recommend setting up notifications
> via the bell icon on https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/mesa/mesa [0]. If
> you select "Custom", you can select in detail which events you want to
> get notification e-mails for. Check "New merge request" to get an e-mail
> for each new MR created. Then you can either enable notifications for
> other MR events here as well, or enable all notifications for MRs you're
> interested in using the "Notifications" switch in the right hand panel
> on each MR's page.
>

You can also subscribe to specific labels which is what I've done.  That
way I get e-mails about anything going on in NIR or our Vulkan driver but
don't have to see every nouveau MR.
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Re: [Mesa-dev] Is it time to stop using the mailing list for patch review?

[Michel Dänzer]

On 2019-12-11 5:47 p.m., Brian Paul wrote:
> 
> I've had little time for Mesa work the past 18 months.

That makes me sad, I hope you'll have more time again in the future.


> 1. I don't think the mesa-dev list should be shut down nor purged from
> the documentation.

Yeah, I don't think anybody seriously suggested the list should be shut
down, just that GitLab is now preferred for patch submission & review.


> Someone mentioned hardly reading the mailing list anymore.  I still
> haven't gotten into the habit of monitoring the MRs page...

Instead of monitoring a web page, I recommend setting up notifications
via the bell icon on https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/mesa/mesa [0]. If
you select "Custom", you can select in detail which events you want to
get notification e-mails for. Check "New merge request" to get an e-mail
for each new MR created. Then you can either enable notifications for
other MR events here as well, or enable all notifications for MRs you're
interested in using the "Notifications" switch in the right hand panel
on each MR's page.

GitLab notification e-mails contain X-Gitlab-* headers for easy filtering.


[0] Or for the whole Mesa group, if you prefer.


-- 
Earthling Michel Dänzer   |   https://redhat.com
Libre software enthusiast | Mesa and X developer
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Re: [Mesa-dev] Is it time to stop using the mailing list for patch review?

[Brian Paul]

On 12/09/2019 04:07 PM, Dylan Baker wrote:

Hi everyone,

I think its time we discussed whether we're going to continue to do patch review
on the mailing list, or if it it should all go through gitlab. I think we should
stop using the mailing list, here are some reasons:

1) Most development is happening on gitlab at this point, patches on the mailing
list are often overlooked
2) The mailing list bypasses CI which potentially breaks the build
3) Probably more reasons I'm forgetting.



I've had little time for Mesa work the past 18 months.  But I'd say:

1. I don't think the mesa-dev list should be shut down nor purged from 
the documentation.


2. I think the complete workflow for submitting patches via gitlab MRs 
should be documented on the Mesa site.  Being a gitlab newbie I wasted a 
lot of time a few months ago trying to figure out the details.  Mesa's 
"Submitting Patches" page is kind of a mess.  It would be great if 
someone could work on that.


Someone mentioned hardly reading the mailing list anymore.  I still 
haven't gotten into the habit of monitoring the MRs page...


-Brian
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Re: [Mesa-dev] Is it time to stop using the mailing list for patch review?

[Nathan Kidd]

On 2019-12-10 7:10 p.m., Jason Ekstrand wrote:
> Quoting Zebediah Figura (2019-12-10 10:58:45)
> > On 12/10/19 12:21 PM, Matt Turner wrote:
> > > On Mon, Dec 9, 2019 at 6:07 PM Dylan Baker  wrote:
> > > > I think its time we discussed whether we're going to continue to do 
> > > > patch review
> > > > on the mailing list, or if it it should all go through gitlab. I think 
> > > > we should
> > > > stop using the mailing list, here are some reasons:
> > > >
> > > > 1) Most development is happening on gitlab at this point, patches on 
> > > > the mailing
> > > >    list are often overlooked
> > > > 2) The mailing list bypasses CI which potentially breaks the build
> > >
> > > What concrete change would you propose?
> >
> > Removing mention of the mailing list from documentation would be nice.
> > Also, currently the README implies that the mailing list is not only
> > acceptable but preferred: "Note that Mesa uses email mailing-lists for
> > patches submission, review and discussions."
> 
> I think updating README type docs is sufficient and I think it's
> probably time we did that.  

As a recent drive-by patch submitter, updating the web page and other
docs to say "use GitLab" would have been sufficient for me.  As they are
now it wasn't clear which way is preferred, so I defaulted to using
mesa-dev@ only to find that the dev focus seems to be in gitlab.fd.o and
if it wasn't for Roland watching the mailing list my patch seemed likely
to get missed.

I also went through the work of subscribing to mesa-stable@ to nominate
there, but again it feels like I missed the de-facto channel for
suggesting a stable backport patch.   Hint hint [1]. :)

GitLab would have been preferred all round.

-Nathan

[1] llvmpipe: Check thread creation errors
9a80b7fd8f282d4b448f826ff88c8770c079fb72

Prevents a SEGV in situations where thread creation is restricted
(cgroups, ulimit -u, /proc/sys/kernel/threads-max, etc.)
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Re: [Mesa-dev] Querying Vulkan driver Options

[Lionel Landwerlin]

On 11/12/2019 09:28, Jean Hertel wrote:

From: Lionel Landwerlin 

- In case the options are different (which is quite likely), how do we query 
the available options?

For OpenGL we have glXGetScreenDriver/glXGetDriverConfig

For EGL we have eglGetDisplayDriverName/eglGetDisplayDriverConfig [2]

What about Vulkan? How can we query such options?

I guess you'll have to add an extension to provide the same feature.

Do we have any documentation or high level steps on writing a Vulkan extension?
>From mesa side, providing a Merge Request with the necessary changes is enough?



Here are a few examples of adding a Vulkan extension to the specification :

https://github.com/KhronosGroup/Vulkan-Docs/pull/966

https://github.com/KhronosGroup/Vulkan-Docs/pull/1001

https://github.com/KhronosGroup/Vulkan-Docs/pull/87/


You can open a Mesa MR in parallel to the extension PR and once the 
extension is in public release of the Vulkan spec, the Mesa MR can be 
merged.



Thanks,


-Lionel




Kind regards,
Jean Hertel
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