[meteorite-list] WARNING: New twist on eBay spoof (scam)
As I have not seen this posted yet, I will send this warning along. It appears as if you are getting a message from an eBay member re: an auction #6436472319. The sender wants a reply and the message form looks quite real. In fact, it is an ebay message reply template. It may state that they bid on one of your auctions and is a request for shipping rates, it may be an inquiry about a non-delivered auction, or many other variations. If you click to tell the person that it isn't your auction, you will get a sign in screen requesting your ID and sign in password. THIS IS NOT FROM EBAY. If you go to the actual auction number you will get a warning message from the owner of that auction number who states that his auction number was stolen, etc. and to beware of a very clever scam. If you have done these things, best to change your password (and report it to [EMAIL PROTECTED]). -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.375 / Virus Database: 268.1.2/274 - Release Date: 3/3/2006 __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Largest Crater in the Sahara Desert and LDG
Hi, Everybody, Tektites again, oh, boy! The chief reason we don't call LDG tektites is that workers in the field don't, a question of nomenclature, but whether it should be changed is another matter. LDG was described as early as 1850 by Fresnel. There is a history of about 100 publications up to almost a decade ago characterizing them as fulgurites or a precipitate from a silica-rich sea (silly notion often applied to tektites; tektites have no OH ions, silly, silly). Let's put some numbers on this pig. First, LDG is very glassy, with a silicon dioxide content above 98%, greatly exceeding the usual tektite high glassy content, even that of moldavites (up to 85%). It's a glass as pure as many human-made glasses. And some people have suggested that this factor alone excludes it as a tektite. Water Content: LDG 0.055% to 0.166% Water Content: Moldavite 0.010% to 0.011% (Similar in high silica content, but less variable) Water Content: Muong Nong 0.009% to 0.030% (Newer, wetter tektite, but a lot drier than LDG) Water Content: Bediasite 0.011% to 0.030% (Same age roughly, but much, much drier than LDG) Water Content: Rio Cuarto Impact Glass 0.115% to 0.129% (LDG is wetter than an obviously wet impact glass.) Water Content: Nuclear Bomb glasses, as low as 0.007% (This rules out those nasty Aliens who built the pyramids and went on to star in the STARGATE movie...) So, LDG is not anywhere near dry enough to qualify as a tektite when compared with other similarly aged tektites (bediasites) or indeed any tektites at all. Fluorine/Boron Ratio: Crustal rocks have 5 or 10 times more fluorine than boron. Tektites should have a ratio of 1.0, indicating that they were heated to temperatures high enough to drive off most of the fluorine and leave the two halogens at identical levels (however low the absolute amount), and indeed tektites have values that float around 1.0 (like 0.8 to 1.2). The tested LDG F/B ratio is 1.0. Yes, these bad puppies got really, really hot. They contain baddeleyite derived from zircon (temperatures well above 1800 C). On this measure, they could be perfect tektites, but why so wet, pritheee, why so wet? LDG shows a positive excess of Cesium in its series of rare earth elements, just like the Nubia Sandstone, which is why that has always been suspected as the source rock. Some folk have pointed to the very nice match in the platinum group elements in LDG to that of chondrites as an indicator of the impactor. The dark inclusions in LDG show higher concentrations of Fe, Ni, Cr, Ir, Co than the source rock, just like a meteorite. Or it could just be an odd rock component on the surface. The variations are quite small and based on hugely vague generalizations of what meteorite composition is. And... The whole question of finding traces of impactor in tektites in one of those still nastily disputed points. Usually, the statement of impactor traces means elemental or isotopic excesses when compared to what we think is the source rock, but that means you are making a circular assumption, which is just substituting one controversy for another. Why doesn't this help? It does nothing to settle the matter of whether the tektite is derived from the source rock (terrestrial) or a unique impactor. How do you distinguish between extra-terrestrial enrichment of the source rock and an extra-terrestrial impactor of unknown (unique and with high silica content) origin? If there are craters, there are ALWAYS impactors, but that isn't the issue. As far as actual unaltered remnants of an impactor, the supposed iron spherules (melted but semi-intact) that are reputed to be found in a very few tektites, there is only one, yes, just one such result in the many, many tens of thousands of tektites destructively examined. That is, in itself, a very suspicious result. For all practical purposes, there are no direct traces of impactor in tektites. Even the most ardent impactists do not claim it. Even the compositional argument is really feeble; most impact theorists dismiss the compositional biases. (Sorry, Norm.) Nor would there be. If you accept the notion that impact has caused the desiccation of tektites by dissociation of H2-0 and the loss of (nearly) all H ions, you have temperatures in excess of 34,000 C., probably up to (Jay Melosh says) 50,000 C. Tell me again how that iron spherule survived? There would be no surviving meteoritic grains or iron spherules at those temperatures! And indeed, there are no meteoritic grains in either tektites or LDG, while impact glasses are rife with them. Lastly, the strewn field. The experts say that no tektite is found in situ. I find many different estimates of the size of the strewn field, ranging from 50x80 km to 150x50 km in the literature. As for well-defined, well... What is presently exposed can be defined, but that is not a definition of the strewn field. Does anybody believe that
[meteorite-list] Los Angeles meteorite??
List, Can't get the link but check out item# 6610535940. What's up with that? Even the description of the discovery is similar to Bob Verish's account. Best wishes, Charlie __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Los Angeles meteorite??
for me its a fake, from the photo its similar to metal... Matteo --- Charlie Devine [EMAIL PROTECTED] ha scritto: List, Can't get the link but check out item# 6610535940. What's up with that? Even the description of the discovery is similar to Bob Verish's account. Best wishes, Charlie __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list M come Meteorite - Matteo Chinellato Via Triestina 126/A - 30030 - TESSERA, VENEZIA, ITALY Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sale Site: http://www.mcomemeteorite.it Collection Site: http://www.mcomemeteorite.info MSN Messanger: spacerocks at hotmail.com EBAY.COM:http://members.ebay.com/aboutme/mcomemeteorite/ ___ Yahoo! Mail: gratis 1GB per i messaggi e allegati da 10MB http://mail.yahoo.it __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] WARNING: New twist on eBay spoof (scam)
Hi Ron and all, Some of the new ebay spoofs are designed so you can't even forward the spoof to ebay. There have been a couple where I couldn't forward it to them. I did try to tell them about the spoof but there damn automated software won't acknowledge your complaint. So beware! --AL Mitterling Mitterling Meteorites R. N. Hartman wrote: As I have not seen this posted yet, I will send this warning along. It appears as if you are getting a message from an eBay member re: an auction #6436472319. The sender wants a reply and the message form looks quite real. In fact, it is an ebay message reply template. It may state that they bid on one of your auctions and is a request for shipping rates, it may be an inquiry about a non-delivered auction, or many other variations. If you click to tell the person that it isn't your auction, you will get a sign in screen requesting your ID and sign in password. THIS IS NOT FROM EBAY. If you go to the actual auction number you will get a warning message from the owner of that auction number who states that his auction number was stolen, etc. and to beware of a very clever scam. If you have done these things, best to change your password (and report it to [EMAIL PROTECTED]). __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] WARNING: New twist on eBay spoof (scam)
Hi All, I have also received such spams and usually forward any ebay spam to ebay. But... I wonder what they really do about them. The more I send to ebay, the more I seem to receive spams! Of course I don't say that ebay are the spamers themselves, of course not, but what do they do against spamers? What does it change to take time and forwards spams to them? Anyway, the best about messages supposed to be sent by potential ebay buyers, is to go on my ebay and have a look on the account whether messages have been sent, and not to reply directly from the message received in the mailbox... Just my 2 cents, Cheers, Frederic Beroud http://www.meteoriteshow.com IMCA member # 2491 (http://www.imca.cc/) - Original Message - From: almitt [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: R. N. Hartman [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Saturday, March 04, 2006 2:20 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] WARNING: New twist on eBay spoof (scam) Hi Ron and all, Some of the new ebay spoofs are designed so you can't even forward the spoof to ebay. There have been a couple where I couldn't forward it to them. I did try to tell them about the spoof but there damn automated software won't acknowledge your complaint. So beware! --AL Mitterling Mitterling Meteorites R. N. Hartman wrote: As I have not seen this posted yet, I will send this warning along. It appears as if you are getting a message from an eBay member re: an auction #6436472319. The sender wants a reply and the message form looks quite real. In fact, it is an ebay message reply template. It may state that they bid on one of your auctions and is a request for shipping rates, it may be an inquiry about a non-delivered auction, or many other variations. If you click to tell the person that it isn't your auction, you will get a sign in screen requesting your ID and sign in password. THIS IS NOT FROM EBAY. If you go to the actual auction number you will get a warning message from the owner of that auction number who states that his auction number was stolen, etc. and to beware of a very clever scam. If you have done these things, best to change your password (and report it to [EMAIL PROTECTED]). __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Los Angeles meteorite??
answer from the seller: These were found 40 years ago on a family vacation in the mojave desert--- 20 years early than the two Bob Verish had found. Just like he had done we put them in the back yard and left them there it wasnt until a few month ago that we cut a piece off one of them and realized it just may be from the same meteorite in the Mojave Desert as the 2 he had found. 20 years prior there was a lot more than 2 small pieces. And I have also already contacted the founder of the other two pieces as well Matteo --- Charlie Devine [EMAIL PROTECTED] ha scritto: List, Can't get the link but check out item# 6610535940. What's up with that? Even the description of the discovery is similar to Bob Verish's account. Best wishes, Charlie __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list M come Meteorite - Matteo Chinellato Via Triestina 126/A - 30030 - TESSERA, VENEZIA, ITALY Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sale Site: http://www.mcomemeteorite.it Collection Site: http://www.mcomemeteorite.info MSN Messanger: spacerocks at hotmail.com EBAY.COM:http://members.ebay.com/aboutme/mcomemeteorite/ ___ Yahoo! Messenger with Voice: chiama da PC a telefono a tariffe esclusive http://it.messenger.yahoo.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Los Angeles meteorite??
The item was removed by the seller (no longer for sale...) Cheers, Frederic Beroud http://www.meteoriteshow.com IMCA member # 2491 (http://www.imca.cc/) - Original Message - From: M come Meteorite Meteorites [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Charlie Devine [EMAIL PROTECTED]; meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Saturday, March 04, 2006 4:41 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Los Angeles meteorite?? answer from the seller: These were found 40 years ago on a family vacation in the mojave desert--- 20 years early than the two Bob Verish had found. Just like he had done we put them in the back yard and left them there it wasnt until a few month ago that we cut a piece off one of them and realized it just may be from the same meteorite in the Mojave Desert as the 2 he had found. 20 years prior there was a lot more than 2 small pieces. And I have also already contacted the founder of the other two pieces as well Matteo --- Charlie Devine [EMAIL PROTECTED] ha scritto: List, Can't get the link but check out item# 6610535940. What's up with that? Even the description of the discovery is similar to Bob Verish's account. Best wishes, Charlie __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list M come Meteorite - Matteo Chinellato Via Triestina 126/A - 30030 - TESSERA, VENEZIA, ITALY Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sale Site: http://www.mcomemeteorite.it Collection Site: http://www.mcomemeteorite.info MSN Messanger: spacerocks at hotmail.com EBAY.COM:http://members.ebay.com/aboutme/mcomemeteorite/ ___ Yahoo! Messenger with Voice: chiama da PC a telefono a tariffe esclusive http://it.messenger.yahoo.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Largest Crater in the Sahara Desert and LDG
This is actually a more general point: there are lots and lots of impact craters but very few tektite producing ones; why? Sterling K. Webb Why not very high velocity comet impacts, at a near vertical angle. Maximum cometary velocities would be about 10 times more than average asteroidal impacts. Near vertical would reduce the atmospheric column that the explosion has to punch thru to the minimum. Looked at from this point of view, perhaps only 1 in 100 crater producing impacts would qualify, which might explain why there are many large craters, but few tektite strewn fields. Mike Fowler Chicago __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] The Origin of Chondrules and Chondrites
Hi list, I´m considering to buy: The Origin of Chondrules and Chondrites by Derek Sears, Cambridge University Press Cambridge 2004 ISBN 0-521-83603-4 any recommendation? just curious Stefan __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Ad
Hello List, I have just listed a beautiful, museum quality 494 gram Park Forest meteorite on eBay. Please have a look at this stone, it was picked up less than eight hours after the fall, hit a home on Oak Street, and is just as beautiful and fresh as they come. It is worth your time to at least have a look at this gorgeous stone. Thanks. Jack Schrader http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemitem=6610792445 _ Is your PC infected? Get a FREE online computer virus scan from McAfee® Security. http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963 __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] canyon diablo for trade
Hello list.I have a little over a kilo of CANYON DIABLO for trade.Some of the pictures of some of the pieces are on my website.Others PICS are for tEr asking.Let me know what you have.PLEASE,NOTHING SMALL!All these pieces are highly sculpted.I know there are alot out there,these are all individuals,no slices. steve arnold,chicago Steve R.Arnold, Chicago, IL, 60120 Illinois Meteorites,Ltd! website url http://stormbringer60120.tripod.com __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] The Origin of Chondrules and Chondrites - Part 1 of 3
Guten Abend Stefan, Hello List, I'm considering to buy: The Origin of Chondrules and Chondrites by Derek Sears, any recommendation? Book Review: MAPS 40-4, 2005 April, pp. 655-656: The origin of chondrules and chondrites, by Derek Sears. Cambridge University Press, 2004, 209 pp. $110.00, hardcover (ISBN 0-521-83603-4). Few would disagree with Derek Sears' claim that chondrites are the most studied rocks in the solar system and the least understood. To help remedy this, Sears has written a monograph, which is profusely illustrated with black-and--white images, diagrams, and sketches, that reviews the properties and proposed origins of chondrules and chondrites. He carefully guides the reader through the wealth of chemical and isotopic data on chondrules and chondrites, provides an excellent account of the theories of chondrule origins, and offers a coherent, though very controversial, model for their origin. The first two chapters provide a historical overview of chondrite research and classification and a concise guide to the asteroids, their role as meteorite parent bodies, and the effects of impacts in forming regolith and impact melts. This is followed by a brief review of the chemical and oxygen isotopic compositions of the various groups of chondrites and their ages. Sears then identifies what he considers to be the most important questions about chondrites: how did the chondrules form and how were Fe,Ni metal and silicate fractionated from one another? The last half of the book focuses on the chemical, physical, and isotopic properties of chondrules that bear on these two questions and the various mechanisms that have been proposed to form chondrules. To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] The Origin of Chondrules and Chondrites - Part 2 of 3
Book Review: MAPS 40-4, 2005 April, pp. 655-656 The origin of chondrules and chondrites, by Derek Sears. Cambridge University Press, 2004, 209 pp. $110.00, hardcover (ISBN 0-521-83603-4). Chondrites are the end products of nebular processes that operated in the protoplanetary disk and geological processes that operated on asteroids. Disentangling the effects of these two kinds of processes has been a continuing challenge for chondrite researchers for the last 50 years. Sears infers that chondrules did not form in the solar nebula and argues that impact processing on asteroids was much more important. He includes a brief review of Ca-Al-rich inclusions and the possible role of nebular condensation in their formation, but concludes that Ca-Al-rich inclusions are evaporative residues and byproducts of chondrule formation. In the final chapter, he outlines his preferred origin for chondrules and chondrites: within a few million years after the formation of the oldest solar system solids, massive impacts on the larger, volatile-rich, carbonaceous asteroids produced plumes of melt droplets, gas, dust, and fragments. These plumes enveloped the asteroids, gradually depositing chondrules and Fe,Ni metal grains that had been aerodynamically sorted by size and density. Interestingly, he suggests that most North American researchers favor nebular mechanisms for chondrule formation, whereas most European and Japanese researchers favor all impact origin. However, recent models proposed specifically for CB chondrites by workers in North America resemble Sears' concept. Sears traces the birth and evolution of diverse rnodels for chondrule origins and includes references to 800 papers on chondrules and chondrites published between 1772 and 2003. His historical approach ensures that this book will be a valuable reference in many libraries. Where else can you discover who first compared the composition of the Sun's surface with that of the chondrites (the famous American astronomer, H.N. Russell in the Astrophysical Journal in 1929) or who first published quantitative models for heating asteroids of diverse sizes with 26Al (J.M. and M.A. Herndon in a Meteoritics paper in 1977)? To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] The Origin of Chondrules and Chondrites - Part 3 of 3
Book Review: MAPS 40-4, 2005 April, pp. 655-656 The origin of chondrules and chondrites, by Derek Sears. Cambridge University Press, 2004, 209 pp. $110.00, hardcover (ISBN 0-521-83603-4). To test impact and nebular models for the origin of chondrules and relate the spectral properties of asteroid surfaces to those of meteorites, Sears argues that we must bring back asteroid samples for study in laboratories. The only way to disentangle what happened in the nebula from what happened on asteroids is to visit actual outcrops on asteroids, do geological fieldwork, and return samples. The Japanese space agency's Hayabusa spacecraft will attempt these tasks in the fall of 2005 when it visits the S-type asteroid, Itokawa. To condense chondrite research into a relatively small book that focuses on chondrule origins and metal- silicate fractionation, Sears was forced to omit detailed accounts of several important topics about chondrites. For example, if you want an up-to-date, detailed review of presolar grains, Ca-Al-rich inclusions, organic matter, or early solar system chronology, you should read the chapters by Zinner, MacPherson, Gilmour, and McKeegan and Davis in the Treatise on Geochemistry, (2003). Researchers who need detailed accounts of the minerals present in chondritic components and their compositions should go to the extraordinary 398 page compendium by Brearley and Jones published by the Mineralogical Society of America in 1998, which includes about 1000 references. But the only book that will give you a concise account of the properties and proposed origins of chondrules and chondrites is this monograph. You may not be convinced that Sears has identified the correct model for chondrule formation, but you will learn much about chondrules and chondrites. E.R.D. Scott Hawai'i Institute of Geophysics and Planetology University of Hawai'i at Manoa Honolulu, Hawai'l, 96822, USA To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] updated collection page.
Hello everyone, I have made some additions to my collection and Geoff Notkin has add ed them to my website. If any of you care to look the link is at the bottom of this e-mail. Thanks Mike Miller // E-Bay flattoprocks Website // www.meteoritefinder.com Mike Miller 230 Greenway Dr.. Kingman AZ 86401 __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Largest Crater in the Sahara Desert and LDG
Sterling W. writes: Crustal rocks have 5 or 10 times more fluorine than boron. Tektites should have a ratio of 1.0, indicating that they were heated to temperatures high enough to drive off most of the fluorine and leave the two halogens at identical levels (however low the absolute amount), and indeed tektites have values that float around 1.0 (like 0.8 to 1.2). The tested LDG F/B ratio is 1.0. Norm, Sterling, Mark, Tracy, list, I'm still on the fence about Libyan Desert Glass and how it fits into the puzzle and I wanted to thank Norm for the motivation to reconsider some of it based on the additional support that that LDG may have actually been tossed a significant (lateral?) distance to its resting point. Norm, my thoughts on the difference in the mechanism of formation here are basically along the lines pursued by Wasson, that Muong Nongs (and probably LDG's) result from a different conceptual and physical event: that while they may be clearly or partially impacted and have received a portion of their formation from that, that importantaly also: a major source of the energy that led to their formation was being broiled by an overhead explosion perhaps of a manyfold-Tunguska type, or by the same clould of incredible enery flux that formed some of the true-to-form tektites. This is why I am on the fence - because I feel more comfortable with that scenario to fall back upon. Just want to hold on to a concept, of what tektite means to me as Norm originally asked. While Norm argued to liberalize the definition to include LDG's, I'm playing the conservative interpretation here like Sterling is also joining to do. I don't disagree, just ask for one positive indication in my preferred set of rules. Norm might just be right if we play by his rules and accept that LDG's were chucked a good distance and thus call them tektites based on that criterion. At minimumn LDGs are more important now as we glean more information from them and maybe an additional piece of the endless puzzle. I am really not quite sure why Sterling mentions the F and B assays would tend to identical levels in tektites, and I while it may be my turn to split hairs, I think this is an interesting research point, but presented inside out. Yes, Fluorine is generally more volatile and probably preferentially driven off, though we should verify this is true for the source matrix solubility before being 100% convinced. The major problem I have here is that there is nothing magic about having them with the same concentration level as you imply, I think this is just a coincidence on what has been looked at so far, possibly related to the temperatures and residence times (determined by physical constraints) in the liquid state of formation too, yes, of course, but that is as far as I would go. That is why I think it is too great a leap of faith to discuss why they would be perfect tektites based on these measurements. Putting this [F]:[B] further under the microscope, it is also of academic interest to compare this to the source rock - but I would never flip that around to discuss why [F] and [B] should be identical or at a particular ratio without knowing the initial values in the source rock, since I cannot fathom any mechanism that would insist that tektites should have these levels identical, and the range you quote and attribute some special meaning to, anyway for tektites floating goes below 1.0 anyway, and as a matter of fact the tektites could easily have much lower values for this ratio than you quote, has Dr. Koerbel and colleagues ever fired up their special Boron sensitive electrode to check these numbers for moldavites lately? Basically, Sterling is making a big assumption by saying that the source rocks of the sandstone are in the range of 5 - 10 for a [F]:[B] ratio, and I think frankly that is a poke in the dark or leap of faith at minimum. I would much rather see someone actually go measure the [F] and [B] numbers for relatively unaltered sandstone near the excitingly discussed crater just to check that the ratios didn't happen to start out at values much closer to equal ... there is significant variation on the earth. The bottom line in my view is that the interpretation of the Fluorine and Boron concentration numbers and ratios is meaningful for an apples to apples comparison when the situation of the crater is not known if and only if we had tektites (or some other glass type) formed from the LDG event then we could measure (at least Dr. Koerbel and his colleagues could) and compare the tendencies with the series (e.g.,LDG, hypothetical button, hypothetical splashform,etc.) which I consider the more appropriate interpretation of this. Not take it out of context and generalize for the whole planet and say they should be perfect tektites. So there are not enough numbers put on this pig, in my opinion, and wish my disagreement on that split
Re: [meteorite-list] WARNING: New twist on eBay spoof (scam)
Dear Ron, List; I have experience this exact same spoof problem with ebay a few times last fall. What seems to work for me with ebay issues/spoofs is to only answer the emails in your message box on the secure my ebay page. I have not tried the ebay tool bar security option that they tout as the good security program. Never answer anyone who hasn't bid your auctions if they ask for your checking account, passwords, personal info. Be assured that ebay and paypal will call you if they need to contact you over some need to update your information. Most spoofs tend to try that ploy. Hope this helps, Dave F. almitt wrote: Hi Ron and all, Some of the new ebay spoofs are designed so you can't even forward the spoof to ebay. There have been a couple where I couldn't forward it to them. I did try to tell them about the spoof but there damn automated software won't acknowledge your complaint. So beware! --AL Mitterling Mitterling Meteorites R. N. Hartman wrote: As I have not seen this posted yet, I will send this warning along. It appears as if you are getting a message from an eBay member re: an auction #6436472319. The sender wants a reply and the message form looks quite real. In fact, it is an ebay message reply template. It may state that they bid on one of your auctions and is a request for shipping rates, it may be an inquiry about a non-delivered auction, or many other variations. If you click to tell the person that it isn't your auction, you will get a sign in screen requesting your ID and sign in password. THIS IS NOT FROM EBAY. If you go to the actual auction number you will get a warning message from the owner of that auction number who states that his auction number was stolen, etc. and to beware of a very clever scam. If you have done these things, best to change your password (and report it to [EMAIL PROTECTED]). __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Re: Ad Ebay auctions
Hi All I have several find Ebay auctions ending in an hour. Several are still at the opening bid of 92 cents. Highlights include; Axtell http://cgi.ebay.com/Axtell-CV3-0-0-274-g-fragment-Meteorite_W0QQitemZ6609290955 Gilgoin http://cgi.ebay.com/Gilgoin-H5-1-47-g-Meteorite_W0QQitemZ6609291017 Juvinas http://cgi.ebay.com/Juvinas-Eucrite-Fall-0-027-g-Meteorite_W0QQitemZ6609291133 Kumerina Rarely offered IIC class iron http://cgi.ebay.com/Kumerina-Iron-IIC-0-205-g-Meteorite_W0QQitemZ6609291214 Marion 1847 fall from Iowa http://cgi.ebay.com/Marion-L6-Iowa-Fell-1847-0-65-g-Meteorite_W0QQitemZ6609291252 Pony Creek rarely offered H4 from TX http://cgi.ebay.com/Pony-Creek-H4-Texas-1-02-g-Meteorite_W0QQitemZ6609291331 Steinbach Rare German anom iron http://cgi.ebay.com/Steinbach-Iron-IVA-anom-0-059-g-Meteorite_W0QQitemZ6609291426 Lots of other goodies as well. Thanks for looking. Mike -- Mike Jensen Jensen Meteorites 16730 E Ada PL Aurora, CO 80017-3137 303-337-4361 IMCA 4264 website: www.jensenmeteorites.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Ad- Arizona meteorites available
Any of you Arizona collectors looking for large slices of Buck Mountain Wash or Palo Verde Mine please let me know, I have a few of each. Thanks, Rob Wesel http://www.nakhladogmeteorites.com -- We are the music makers... and we are the dreamers of the dreams. Willy Wonka, 1971 __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] updated collection page.
Great Site Mike, Jerry - Original Message - From: Mike / flattoprocks [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Saturday, March 04, 2006 5:02 PM Subject: [meteorite-list] updated collection page. Hello everyone, I have made some additions to my collection and Geoff Notkin has add ed them to my website. If any of you care to look the link is at the bottom of this e-mail. Thanks Mike Miller // E-Bay flattoprocks Website // www.meteoritefinder.com Mike Miller 230 Greenway Dr.. Kingman AZ 86401 __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Ad- Meteorites
Hello, Please take a moment to have a look at my current auctions on eBay. If you have $9000 to spend, Theres a nice one to add to your collection. See em here : http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZmaccers531QQhtZ-1 Thanks Bob Evans __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] OT: 1859 aurora in HI
Our librarian is searching for information relating to an aurora that supposedly was visible from the Hawaiian islands (all right, the Sandwich Islands) in 1859. She has searched all the available local records, newspapers, genealogies and accounts, but has come up blank. Something like an aurora should have been pretty spectacular to be seen in Hawaii; does anyone have other resources she might check? Thanks! Tracy Latimer __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] updated collection page.
Awesome collection Dave - Original Message - From: Mike / flattoprocks [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Saturday, March 04, 2006 5:02 PM Subject: [meteorite-list] updated collection page. Hello everyone, I have made some additions to my collection and Geoff Notkin has add ed them to my website. If any of you care to look the link is at the bottom of this e-mail. Thanks Mike Miller // E-Bay flattoprocks Website // www.meteoritefinder.com Mike Miller 230 Greenway Dr.. Kingman AZ 86401 __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] OT: 1859 aurora in HI
Tracy: Unless there are other islands of the same name, the Sandwich Islands with which I am familiar are just north of Antarctica in the South Atlantic. It would not be unusual for them to get an Aurora but it would be an Aurora Australis and not Borealis. I don't pay great attention to the Southern Lights but I'm sure there are some sources on the internet which monitor them. It would be unusual for Hawaii to get the Aurora although I have never heard of it prior to your mention of it. I'll do some checking myself, as you have peaked my interest. I monitor solar activity daily as an amateur radio operator, because solar flux and sun spots determine the MUF(maximum usable frequency) for worldwide radio communications, and part of those charts include aurora. George __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Largest Crater in the Sahara Desert and LDG
Hi, Doug, I am really not quite sure why Sterling mentions the F and B assays would tend to identical levels in tektites... Both fluorine and boron, become volatile if you heat them up enough. Fluorine's a gas but it forms strong bonds and boron's much less volatile. The point is that at any given high temperature, you drive off more fluorine than boron. The virtue of it is that the scale of the temperatures involved is a long scale. It allows F/B ratios to function as a kind of thermometer for very high temperature events, a scale that covers tens of thousands of degrees! ALL terrestrial rocks have a F/B ratio greater than 5.0 (often 20 or 30). but all impact glasses, even the weakest dirtiest just barely melted impact glasses have a F/B ratio less than 5.0 -- the result of a few thousand degrees of heating. I cannot fathom any mechanism that would insist that tektites should have these levels identical... I don't know the values for the Nubia Sandstone, but the range of sandstones is fluorine 180 to 450 ppm and boron about 10 to 85 ppm. The figures for LDG is fluorine 7 ppm and boron 7 ppm, so you see how the ratios shift as the content drops. As the temperature rises (microsecond by microsecond), the fluorine content drops much faster than the boron content. At some very high temperature (variable for each source rock), both fluorine and boron levels become the same, but at a higher level than in the final product. After that point, both are driven out of the melt plasma at the same rate, their petty chemical differences totally overwhelmed by the energy available. So, fluorine goes faster until that point is reached, after then, they drop together. If the Nubia was 300 ppm fluorine and 30 ppm boron, at some point, they might get to 20 and 20, then 19 and 19, 18 and 18, until it's over... Typical values for a indochinite are like 10 and 10. Ditto for bediasites. Moldavites 30 and 30. Ivorites 25 and 25. At 7 and 7, the LDG was either formed from very low boron content rock or, as I said, these puppies got really really hot. As an example, the rock at the Darwin crater has fluorine content of 389-769 ppm and boron content of 19-35 ppm, ratios of 11.5 to 20.5. The Darwin impact glass has fluorine content of 15-32 ppm and boron content of 9-13 ppm, ratios of 1.2 to 3.6. You can see how much of each element was lost, about 68% of the boron but about 96% of the fluorine! The ratios indicate a forming temperature that was very hot in some spots (20,000 degrees?) and much cooler in other places in the same event (5000 degrees?). Darwin crater is small (smaller than the Arizona Meteor Crater). The ratios of Darwin glasses are about the same as Muong Nong tektites (but they are much wetter than Muong's). While impact glasses range up to nearly 5.0, Muong Nong's never get up to 4.0, and normal tektites never get above 1.5 and sometimes have F/B ratios less than 1.0 (indicating fantastic temps), like 0.4 which probably corresponds to 40 or 50 thousand degrees, or maybe 80,000 in some rock. SUMMARY: F/B ratios are a thermometer for measuring very high temperatures of formation. Even hot lava has F/B ratios of 10.0 or more, so you can see that this thermometer is ideally suited for very energetic impact events. It looks like LDG had a very hot forming event, so the high water content is a real puzzle. Of course, we all want to find a way to save our theories from popping like soap bubbles on reality's sharp corners, so here's one try... Geologically, in the era of the impact and until the end of the Miocene, this area was lacrustine. (My geologist-like talk courtesy of Ingrid's Rockin' Dictionary at Uof AZ website; normally I'm limited to English...) Means it was mostly under shallow swamp and lake water. We know that submerged tektites slowly increase in water content if they have millions of years to do it in... Microtektites in the ocean hydrate away completely. Tektite fragments have high water content than whole tektites. So water can be absorbed by tektites. Would 10 to 20 million years of glug-glug time in boggy swamps wet up the LDG from 0.010% to 0.100% or more? No problemo, to quote the redoubtable Awr-nauld. Hey! I'm liking my new theory! I'm particularly tickled by the notion of standing in the Lybian Desert dune field at nigh noon and 58 degrees C in one of the driest spots on Earth, holding a chunk of LDG, and saying, See, it's water content is high because it spent millions of years right here, UNDERWATER. It's here, where these deserts are now, that the Great Swamps gave rise to the True Apes. Yes, the first apes (as opposed to monkey-like lemuroids, and such like) hung out (literally) in the trees above these swamps, starting 32-34 million years ago. The Swamp of the Lybian Desert, and the nasty things that hunted in it, is what drove super-great-grand-daddy and mommy up into the trees in the first place, and made brachiators of us
Re: [meteorite-list] OT: 1859 aurora in HI
Hi, From the Wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sandwich_Islands The Sandwich Islands was the name given to Hawaii by Captain James Cook on his discovery of the islands on January 18, 1778. The name was made in honour of one of his sponsors, John Montagu, 4th Earl of Sandwich, who was at the time the First Lord of the Admiralty and Cook's superior officer. During the late 19th century, the name fell into disuse. The Sandwich Islands should not be confused with the South Sandwich Islands, an uninhabited British dependency in the southern Atlantic Ocean. Sterling K. Webb -- - Original Message - From: ks1u [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: tracy latimer [EMAIL PROTECTED]; meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Saturday, March 04, 2006 7:10 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] OT: 1859 aurora in HI Tracy: Unless there are other islands of the same name, the Sandwich Islands with which I am familiar are just north of Antarctica in the South Atlantic. It would not be unusual for them to get an Aurora but it would be an Aurora Australis and not Borealis. I don't pay great attention to the Southern Lights but I'm sure there are some sources on the internet which monitor them. It would be unusual for Hawaii to get the Aurora although I have never heard of it prior to your mention of it. I'll do some checking myself, as you have peaked my interest. I monitor solar activity daily as an amateur radio operator, because solar flux and sun spots determine the MUF(maximum usable frequency) for worldwide radio communications, and part of those charts include aurora. George __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
