Re: [meteorite-list] Unbelievably late package
Kangaroos are a bit faster! ;-) Jeff - Original Message - From: Stefan Brandes To: Meteorite-list Sent: Tuesday, September 19, 2006 2:02 AM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Unbelievably late package One year seven and a half months for the package to cross the US. Who can beat that? I got one of my packages from a well known US-dealer ;) after three months, with inside notice: This package was opened by the AUSTRALIAN customs. Around the world and still not unbelievably late. They do have fast carrier pigeons there ;) Greetings from AUSTRIA Stefan __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Meteorite Hammers (AD)
Hi All, About 7 years ago I stumbled upon a page in the web site of Walter Branch. The page was a listing of all meteorites reported to have struck something when they fell to earth - some man made object, animal, or even a human being (such as the case of Sylacauga). I immediately found myself entranced by these very special meteorites and began collecting as many of these extraordinary falls as possible. I had already been collecting meteorites for many years, but this new realm had an entrancing effect on me like none other before, with the possible exception of the obsession I developed to collect and offer every non-Antarctic SNC when there were only 6 of them known at the time (though only 4 had ever been available when I started). I read more and more, found other lists, began collecting photos, and, of course, buying at least a collection specimen of everything I could lay my hands on. In fact, I was so amazed at how difficult it was to find these precious rarities after the first dozen or so, I began in earnest to buy all the material I could find of the most rare varieties rarely seen (and I DON'T mean rarely seen as the term is used in eBay ads!) It has taken me well over 5 years to accumulate the stock I have built up and I have spent the last several months putting together a web site that not only lists each of the falls I offer in this rare category, but in most instances shows a photo or two of the building, car, roof, barn, mailbox, etc. actually struck by the meteorite. These are the car bashers, mailbox crunchers, house smashers, animal killers and human maulers. This is the real rogues gallery of the meteorite world. You are all invited to drop in and take a look see. I kept waiting and waiting to open this site because I always have one or two things on the way - but with over 30 falls represented, I decided I would use my 60th birthday as an excuse to launch this puppy. I am indebted to numerous people including, but not limited to, Walter Branch, Martin Horejsi, Bob Walker, Robert Haag, Edwin Thompson, Al Lang, and the list goes on on. I hope you enjoy what you see. Many of the photos took many, many hours of research - and some of those were the easier ones to find. There are links to dozens of videos of the Peekskill fireball, a photo of oh, well, just go there for yourselves. Check it all out at: http://www.michaelbloodmeteorites.com/Hammers.html This site will be obsessively kept up to date in terms of stock availability. I know I haven't always done this in my regular catalog, but this page will be updated with each and every sale and all new material as it comes in on a daily basis. Can you tell I am excited about it? Best wishes, Michael PS: If you have or know of any applicable material not on my site that is available for mere money, please let me know. I will give anyone a nice finder's fee for any material I end up purchasing as a result of a lead given to me. __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
AW: Re: [meteorite-list] Unbelievably late package - my story
Hi Walter, and Martin, not was it me. It happened to Bernhard Rems from Austria. Well meanwhile he seems to have been stolen in person too, as I wait since one and a half year for a payment from him for a meteorite, sigh. Well, perhaps I have also to explain, what usually happens with German customs, for the dealers and collectors not being afraid to send meteorites here. In general there is no problem to receive meteorites here and the German customs has no special interest in meteorite at all, nor do they estimate them to have a special value. Like in all others countries too, one has to pay custom taxes (and VAT, if the goods are not exempted from that tax) for all imported goods. For them a meteorite is a good. Normally they judge the stones, because they are looking so unimpressive of being of minor value below the duty tax-free allowance (which is here around 40$) and they forward it without any problem. But if you have bad luck, they suspect the stone to be perhaps of value. And here the only interesting parameter for defining the value for them is simply that, what you paid for. If no receipt comes with the meteorite, you can show them a printout of the ebay-auction, the paypal-receipt or simply the e-mail, where your counterpart asked his price. Theoretical debates, whether a meteorite has no trade value and no value inherent other then a collector's value, doesn't help. If one is not willing to pay the taxes, it can happen, that they assume, that you refuse to accept the parcel and it will be sent back to the sender. Therefore here in Germany it's not different from most other countries. The rates of the import tax, depends on the good, so I can't give exact values (German tax system is placed in a ranking of 104 countries on rank 104, as it's the most complicated on Earth. 220 main tax laws, seventy thousand subsequent regulations), but it's somewhere between 0 to 17%. (Here there is room for haggling) Additional VAT is 7% or 16%. Cheers! Martin A. -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Im Auftrag von Martin Horejsi Gesendet: Dienstag, 19. September 2006 04:20 An: Walter Branch Cc: Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Betreff: Re: Re: [meteorite-list] Unbelievably late package - my story Hi Walter, Not this Martin. But I seem to remember the tale as well. I hope I won't have a story to add here, but I might have one in the works. I mailed a meteorite to San Diego about a month ago and, you guessed it, we're still waiting. Cheers, Martin On 9/18/06, Walter Branch [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi Bernd, (sometimes it is good people do not know much about meteorites You are right. This is how I judge whether to dismiss these stories that make it to the list. Sort of like Hollywood vs. reality. Who was it that had their apartment broken into and items where stolen, except the meteorites? Was it you, Martin? -Walter Branch - - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Monday, September 18, 2006 1:57 PM Subject: [meteorite-list] Unbelievably late package - my story On Wednesday, October 01, 2003, Mike Farmer sent out my NWA 1909 (AEUC) and my NWA 1943 (AHOW) specimens. The package did make it safely across the Big Pond but on October 21, 2003, I wrote to Mike that the German customs authorities were withholding the specimens and I was battling with them over my comment that there was no commercial value involved and their idiotic response that everything had a value. By November 10, 2003, the package had got lost somewhere between Tucson and my home town here in Germany after the customs idiots had agreed they would send it to us via mail. It never arrived. Lots of telephone calls but to no avail although I had the photo copy from the customs dudes with all the details (sender, contents, etc.). More calls and the information that the package was probably on its way back to Tucson. The customs dudes said that if it didn't show up here or in Tucson sooner or later, the sender would have to start a tracer. Wednesday, December 17, 2003, Mike wrote that the meteorites had just arrived back to him and that the customs idiot had removed the packaging so that the meteorites (worth $600!) were loose in the box which was smashed - fortunately the meteorites were fine, not damaged. The customs people were not the culprits this time. That honor goes to the German mail company. There must have been a potential thief who opened Christmas mail that looked promising (precious metals, jewelry, money, etc.). Meteorites were just worthless and meaningless stuff so he chucked them back into the torn package (sometimes it is good people do not know much about meteorites :-) My meteorites were shipped again, and, unbelievable but nonetheless true: Tuesday, Dec. 30,
Re: [meteorite-list] Meteorite Hammers (AD)
Good Morning Michael and list, you should be excited about this site! Nicely put together! Great information! Must have kept you up many nights! ;-) Thank you for sharing, Moni From: Michael L Blood [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Meteorite List Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Meteorite Hammers (AD) Date: Tue, 19 Sep 2006 02:09:15 -0700 Hi All, About 7 years ago I stumbled upon a page in the web site of Walter Branch. The page was a listing of all meteorites reported to have struck something when they fell to earth - some man made object, animal, or even a human being (such as the case of Sylacauga). I immediately found myself entranced by these very special meteorites and began collecting as many of these extraordinary falls as possible. I had already been collecting meteorites for many years, but this new realm had an entrancing effect on me like none other before, with the possible exception of the obsession I developed to collect and offer every non-Antarctic SNC when there were only 6 of them known at the time (though only 4 had ever been available when I started). I read more and more, found other lists, began collecting photos, and, of course, buying at least a collection specimen of everything I could lay my hands on. In fact, I was so amazed at how difficult it was to find these precious rarities after the first dozen or so, I began in earnest to buy all the material I could find of the most rare varieties rarely seen (and I DON'T mean rarely seen as the term is used in eBay ads!) It has taken me well over 5 years to accumulate the stock I have built up and I have spent the last several months putting together a web site that not only lists each of the falls I offer in this rare category, but in most instances shows a photo or two of the building, car, roof, barn, mailbox, etc. actually struck by the meteorite. These are the car bashers, mailbox crunchers, house smashers, animal killers and human maulers. This is the real rogues gallery of the meteorite world. You are all invited to drop in and take a look see. I kept waiting and waiting to open this site because I always have one or two things on the way - but with over 30 falls represented, I decided I would use my 60th birthday as an excuse to launch this puppy. I am indebted to numerous people including, but not limited to, Walter Branch, Martin Horejsi, Bob Walker, Robert Haag, Edwin Thompson, Al Lang, and the list goes on on. I hope you enjoy what you see. Many of the photos took many, many hours of research - and some of those were the easier ones to find. There are links to dozens of videos of the Peekskill fireball, a photo of oh, well, just go there for yourselves. Check it all out at: http://www.michaelbloodmeteorites.com/Hammers.html This site will be obsessively kept up to date in terms of stock availability. I know I haven't always done this in my regular catalog, but this page will be updated with each and every sale and all new material as it comes in on a daily basis. Can you tell I am excited about it? Best wishes, Michael PS: If you have or know of any applicable material not on my site that is available for mere money, please let me know. I will give anyone a nice finder's fee for any material I end up purchasing as a result of a lead given to me. __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Meteorite Hammers
Hello Michael, nice page, very well documented. You can add 2 recent falls to these : - Alby-sur-Cheran (France) which fell into the roof of a building : I've some content to send you - Moss (Norway) which touched the roof of a building Regards, Pierre-Marie PELE ___ Découvrez un nouveau moyen de poser toutes vos questions quelque soit le sujet ! Yahoo! Questions/Réponses pour partager vos connaissances, vos opinions et vos expériences. http://fr.answers.yahoo.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Unbelievably late package - my story
Walter Sorry to hear that I was at Denver on 9/11, and had to ship 5 boxes with stones (up to 20kg each) back to Argentina. I was afraid that they will be lost, but fortunately all arrived safe, even more, they were some of the faster shipments I had. They took about 3 weeks for a surface shipment. Normally takes 1.5 monthes to a record of 5 monthes to arrive. This record one arrived 2 monthes after I made a claim, so it seems it was delayed in some of the post offices and when the claim arrived to that office the box was found and sent. Eduardo -Original Message- From: Walter Branch [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Date: Mon, 18 Sep 2006 18:08:16 -0400 Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Unbelievably late package - my story Hello Everyone, Not long after the 9/11 attacks here in America, I sent two large irons to Norway and Philedelphia. They never made it. What was I thinking? I was trying to send two large chunks of iron across America and across the Atlantic Ocean. I can only imagine the anxieties the packages must have produced when the x-ray machines were sounding off like crazy. -Walter Branch __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
AW: [meteorite-list] Unbelievably late package - my story
Ok I have a story from Europe. A customer in Italy bought a slice of Uruacu via e bay, three weeks later he asked if his slice is already shipped, it was of course. So I have send a second slice to the costumer. 10 days later I got an e mail , that both slices arrived the same day in the post pox of the costumer. One package with a sticker Royal Post ,so the package made a small trip to Great Britain, why not? Great Britain is also an interesting place. Andi -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Im Auftrag von Eduardo. Gesendet: Dienstag, 19. September 2006 13:28 An: Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Betreff: Re: [meteorite-list] Unbelievably late package - my story Walter Sorry to hear that I was at Denver on 9/11, and had to ship 5 boxes with stones (up to 20kg each) back to Argentina. I was afraid that they will be lost, but fortunately all arrived safe, even more, they were some of the faster shipments I had. They took about 3 weeks for a surface shipment. Normally takes 1.5 monthes to a record of 5 monthes to arrive. This record one arrived 2 monthes after I made a claim, so it seems it was delayed in some of the post offices and when the claim arrived to that office the box was found and sent. Eduardo -Original Message- From: Walter Branch [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Date: Mon, 18 Sep 2006 18:08:16 -0400 Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Unbelievably late package - my story Hello Everyone, Not long after the 9/11 attacks here in America, I sent two large irons to Norway and Philedelphia. They never made it. What was I thinking? I was trying to send two large chunks of iron across America and across the Atlantic Ocean. I can only imagine the anxieties the packages must have produced when the x-ray machines were sounding off like crazy. -Walter Branch __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] AD New Meteoritica website
Hi All, Just a small message to indicate that I completely changed my Web site. You will find more information and more photos. Please look and all the comments are welcome. Best wishes, Philippe http://www.meteoritica.com/ PS: I have also some auctions ending tonight on eBay http:// stores.ebay.com/Meteoritica __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Unbelievably late package - my story
Dear Andreas Gren list, and what does all these stories teach us? Meteorites NEVER prefer the straight way. Matthias - Original Message - From: Andreas Gren [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Tuesday, September 19, 2006 2:07 PM Subject: AW: [meteorite-list] Unbelievably late package - my story Ok I have a story from Europe. A customer in Italy bought a slice of Uruacu via e bay, three weeks later he asked if his slice is already shipped, it was of course. So I have send a second slice to the costumer. 10 days later I got an e mail , that both slices arrived the same day in the post pox of the costumer. One package with a sticker Royal Post ,so the package made a small trip to Great Britain, why not? Great Britain is also an interesting place. Andi -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Im Auftrag von Eduardo. Gesendet: Dienstag, 19. September 2006 13:28 An: Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Betreff: Re: [meteorite-list] Unbelievably late package - my story Walter Sorry to hear that I was at Denver on 9/11, and had to ship 5 boxes with stones (up to 20kg each) back to Argentina. I was afraid that they will be lost, but fortunately all arrived safe, even more, they were some of the faster shipments I had. They took about 3 weeks for a surface shipment. Normally takes 1.5 monthes to a record of 5 monthes to arrive. This record one arrived 2 monthes after I made a claim, so it seems it was delayed in some of the post offices and when the claim arrived to that office the box was found and sent. Eduardo -Original Message- From: Walter Branch [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Date: Mon, 18 Sep 2006 18:08:16 -0400 Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Unbelievably late package - my story Hello Everyone, Not long after the 9/11 attacks here in America, I sent two large irons to Norway and Philedelphia. They never made it. What was I thinking? I was trying to send two large chunks of iron across America and across the Atlantic Ocean. I can only imagine the anxieties the packages must have produced when the x-ray machines were sounding off like crazy. -Walter Branch __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Meteorite Hammers (AD)
VERY well done and a nice collection. Michael L Blood wrote: Hi All, About 7 years ago I stumbled upon a page in the web site of Walter Branch. The page was a listing of all meteorites reported to have struck something when they fell to earth - some man made object, animal, or even a human being (such as the case of Sylacauga). I immediately found myself entranced by these very special meteorites and began collecting as many of these extraordinary falls as possible. I had already been collecting meteorites for many years, but this new realm had an entrancing effect on me like none other before, with the possible exception of the obsession I developed to collect and offer every non-Antarctic SNC when there were only 6 of them known at the time (though only 4 had ever been available when I started). I read more and more, found other lists, began collecting photos, and, of course, buying at least a collection specimen of everything I could lay my hands on. In fact, I was so amazed at how difficult it was to find these precious rarities after the first dozen or so, I began in earnest to buy all the material I could find of the most rare varieties rarely seen (and I DON'T mean rarely seen as the term is used in eBay ads!) It has taken me well over 5 years to accumulate the stock I have built up and I have spent the last several months putting together a web site that not only lists each of the falls I offer in this rare category, but in most instances shows a photo or two of the building, car, roof, barn, mailbox, etc. actually struck by the meteorite. These are the car bashers, mailbox crunchers, house smashers, animal killers and human maulers. This is the real rogues gallery of the meteorite world. You are all invited to drop in and take a look see. I kept waiting and waiting to open this site because I always have one or two things on the way - but with over 30 falls represented, I decided I would use my 60th birthday as an excuse to launch this puppy. I am indebted to numerous people including, but not limited to, Walter Branch, Martin Horejsi, Bob Walker, Robert Haag, Edwin Thompson, Al Lang, and the list goes on on. I hope you enjoy what you see. Many of the photos took many, many hours of research - and some of those were the easier ones to find. There are links to dozens of videos of the Peekskill fireball, a photo of oh, well, just go there for yourselves. Check it all out at: http://www.michaelbloodmeteorites.com/Hammers.html This site will be obsessively kept up to date in terms of stock availability. I know I haven't always done this in my regular catalog, but this page will be updated with each and every sale and all new material as it comes in on a daily basis. Can you tell I am excited about it? Best wishes, Michael PS: If you have or know of any applicable material not on my site that is available for mere money, please let me know. I will give anyone a nice finder's fee for any material I end up purchasing as a result of a lead given to me. __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Meteorite Hammers (AD)
Very nice site. One more from Finland; Haverö Type ureilite, achondrite (AURE) Total mass A 1.544 kg single mass Time of fall At 15.45 local time 2 August 1971. Location Haverö, Nauvo Coordinates 60° 14' 44N 22° 03' 43E A singe stone fell throught roof of equipment shelter of Noorback house in a small Haverö island. This meteorite was recovered about five minutes after fall. * Oja H., Tulipalloja taivaalla, 208 pages, (Astronomical Association Ursa 1978) http://somerikko.net/old/geo/met/mhaver_e.htm There was also a fishing-boat in the shelter, and the meteorite was found finally from the boat, if I remember. best, pekka s Michael L Blood wrote: __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Unbelievably late package - is UPS better?
Hi all - I am greatly enjoying everyone's tales of woe with government mail services - sharing the burden of a frustration does make it lighter - sometimes there really is nothing one can do but laugh. But I am wondering, is UPS better? good hunting, Ed --- Martin Horejsi [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi Walter, Not this Martin. But I seem to remember the tale as well. I hope I won't have a story to add here, but I might have one in the works. I mailed a meteorite to San Diego about a month ago and, you guessed it, we're still waiting. Cheers, Martin On 9/18/06, Walter Branch [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi Bernd, (sometimes it is good people do not know much about meteorites You are right. This is how I judge whether to dismiss these stories that make it to the list. Sort of like Hollywood vs. reality. Who was it that had their apartment broken into and items where stolen, except the meteorites? Was it you, Martin? -Walter Branch - - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Monday, September 18, 2006 1:57 PM Subject: [meteorite-list] Unbelievably late package - my story On Wednesday, October 01, 2003, Mike Farmer sent out my NWA 1909 (AEUC) and my NWA 1943 (AHOW) specimens. The package did make it safely across the Big Pond but on October 21, 2003, I wrote to Mike that the German customs authorities were withholding the specimens and I was battling with them over my comment that there was no commercial value involved and their idiotic response that everything had a value. By November 10, 2003, the package had got lost somewhere between Tucson and my home town here in Germany after the customs idiots had agreed they would send it to us via mail. It never arrived. Lots of telephone calls but to no avail although I had the photo copy from the customs dudes with all the details (sender, contents, etc.). More calls and the information that the package was probably on its way back to Tucson. The customs dudes said that if it didn't show up here or in Tucson sooner or later, the sender would have to start a tracer. Wednesday, December 17, 2003, Mike wrote that the meteorites had just arrived back to him and that the customs idiot had removed the packaging so that the meteorites (worth $600!) were loose in the box which was smashed - fortunately the meteorites were fine, not damaged. The customs people were not the culprits this time. That honor goes to the German mail company. There must have been a potential thief who opened Christmas mail that looked promising (precious metals, jewelry, money, etc.). Meteorites were just worthless and meaningless stuff so he chucked them back into the torn package (sometimes it is good people do not know much about meteorites :-) My meteorites were shipped again, and, unbelievable but nonetheless true: Tuesday, Dec. 30, 2003, NWA 1909 and NWA 1943 finally arrived (again) after this transaltantic odyssey which lasted only three months! Cheers, Bernd __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] 2003 EL61, IN PERSON
Hi Sterling, list - but core-forming planetesimals all the way out in Kuiper Belt?! Yes, cometissimals - about 75 meters or so, which themselves can then accrete chaotically over time, with the heavy elements always gravitationally precipitating towards the center - the lighter volatiles always on the outside - and you have delivery to the surfaces of larger bodies - Given the problems this presents us for dealing with cometary impactors, it would be real nice to get some good spectra of 2003 EL61 right now, but as always, this kind of study recieves a low priority from the failed nuclear physicists who control the telescopes and observing budgets - by the way, the 64 fragments of SW3 should be in the Earth's vicinity in 2022, though I don't have any dead on forecasts yet - as a matter of fact, I wonder where they are, and how this is being handled, so if anyone hears anything, please pass it on - good hunting, Ed --- Sterling K. Webb [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi, Here we've been wasting time talking about who found 2003 EL61 with not one word about the strangest planet in the solar system (dwarf or not) itself! This is an utterly fascinating place! First of all, there's its shape... Is it round? No, Is it irregular? No. Is it squished? Well, sort of. Its dimensions are 1960 km one way, 1518 km the other, and 996 km through the axis of rotation. Hmm, can you picture that? Neither can I. So, here's a picture of the shape of 2003 EL61: http://hepwww.physics.yale.edu/quest/sedna/2003_el61.html Now, if you spin something fast enough (and EL61 spins in under 4 hours per dizzy) and it's stretchy, you end up with a shape like a squashed ball, or an oblate spheroid (or ellipsoid). The Earth is so slightly squashed that it looks round, but Jupiter appears squashed to the human eye. But 2003 EL61 is not a squashed ball, round and flattened. No, it's much longer one way across than the other way across. If it were made of ice or any substance that would move, even very slowly, when force is applied to it, it couldn't maintain this shape; it would even out over time. Likewise, if it was a giant pile of rubble, it would adjust to the forces and be round and flattened. And, there is an upper size limit to a rubble-loid, where the energy needed to create rubble is so great it scatters everything, so no rubble nor planet is left. Whatever 2003 EL61 is made of, it has to be stiff enough to hold this shape as it whirls around every 3.9154 hours. That creates a huge amount of force. 2003 EL61 is almost as big as Pluto, the long way. If it was just round (Why can't you be like all the OTHER planets?), it would be 1500 kilometers across, bigger than Ceres, bigger than Charon. It has to be VERY stiff. We can calculate just how stiff it has to be to hold on its elliptical midriff bulge while spinning, figure out its modulus of rigidity and then look to see what materials are that stiff. The answer is ROCK, rock of a high density. The estimates run from a density of 2.6 to 3.4 gm/cm^3. For comparison, our Moon has a density of about 3.3 gm/cm^3. Forget the iceball notion. There can't be more than a smidge of volatiles in its composition (like the Earth). The actual value is likely to be the highest or a higher density, otherwise the planet would be right on the borderline of being able to hold together and any of the ordinary moderately big impacts you expect every billion years or so would have shattered it. The currently favored explanation for the rapid rotation is a giant impact. Likewise, the existence of two moons circling 2003 EL61 is attributed to a giant impact, like our Moon, like Pluto and Charon; it's the moon-maker of choice these days... But, the force of an impact great enough to spin 2003 EL 61 up to this speed is great enough to melt a rock body, and if it had melted, the spin would have evened it out to a round but flattened ball. Even if it hadn't melted, the rock would have been soft enough to creep into a uniform oblate spheroid. The problem is, even though we can figure out how stiff 2003 EL61 has to be to hold onto its odd shape, that doesn't explain how it got that shape in the first place... There are two ways out of this dilemma: 1.) Since resolution is poor at this distance, it could be that 2003 EL61 is a body that has been roughly chipped away by multiple impacts into its present odd tri-axial shape, just as Vesta seems to have been partially shaped by impacts (the south pole crater). Is 2003 EL 61 a Super Vesta? But a chipped shape formed by multiple impacts into a form so very extreme, with a ratio 4:3:2 for its axes, and a chipped shape that size, 1000 to 2000 km, would likely be shattered by multiple impacts strong enough to give it this extreme shape, if it were only a rockball.
Re: [meteorite-list] Unbelievably late package - is UPS better?
--- E.P. Grondine [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: But I am wondering, is UPS better? Not particularly. A few years ago I bought a share of one of Michael Cottingham's Moroccan investments. He sent a package of, I think it was, about 5K of material UPS. I was home the evening when they supposedly left it by my front door...but it wasn't my front doorand left. It was never found, and took over a year to get a refund. FedEx is better, but even they have problems occasionally, particularly with damaged packages. Don __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] AD - SUPER AUCTIONS ENDING - OUTSTANDING MATERIAL!
Dear List Members, I loaded some very special auctions this week, all started at just 99 cents and they are due to end in a few hours regardless of value. You will find several items that are worth well over $500.00 with no reserve and yes, I started these out at just 99 cents also. I do this twice a year, once for the Tucson Show and once while I am away for the Denver Show. This represents a great opportunity to pick up a larger planetary specimen at unheard of prices or some other rarity. Be sure to check out all of the auctions as there are some great bargains to be had this week. To see all of the too numerous to list outstanding auctions, click on this link: http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZraremeteorites PLANETARY: .228 gram part slice of Dhofar 911 Lunar Meteorite started at just 99 cents: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemitem=140027779875 .160 gram part slice of NWA 032 Lunar Mare Basalt started at just 99 cents: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemitem=140027786603 .154 gram crusted part slice of NWA 482 Lunar meteorite started at just 99 cents: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemitem=140027787453 NWA 482 Lunar Pendant started at just 99 cents: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemitem=140027789046 .056g fragment of NWA 998 NAKHLITE Martian meteorite started at just 99 cents: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemitem=140027794187 .214 gram part slice of NWA 1195 Martian meteorite started at just 99 cents: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemitem=140027794835 10mg fragment of NWA 2737 Chassignite Martian meteorite started at just 99 cents: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemitem=140027799857 Nearly 1/2 gram part slice of NWA 3160 Lunar meteorite started at just 99 cents: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemitem=140027806502 Large Specimen of NWA 3163 Granulitic Lunar meteorite started at just 99 cents: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemitem=140027807208 OTHER: NEW ORLEANS - Large 1.46 gram fragment, the last piece I will ever sell on ebay! I am totally out because the rest of my inventory has been recently spoken for. This is it. http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemitem=140027784309 Awesome chunk of NWA 1877 OD, check it out: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemitem=140027797148 ACAPULCOITE: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemitem=140027800601 ANGRITE Complete Slice: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemitem=140027801145 BRACHINITE, WOW! http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemitem=140027804031 BRACHINITE THIN-SECTION, Calibrated started at just 99 cents, Gigantic Surface Area: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemitem=140027804586 THE MOST FEATURE-RICH SIKHOTE ALIN I HAVE EVER SEEN! Over 1,800 different ebay users have already viewed this piece according to the counter and it is only bid up to $33.00. Don't let this world-class specimen get away! http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemitem=140027814299 Check out this 95% Crusted and ORIENTED Unclassified NWA Stone: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemitem=140027817472 ...and way too many other items to list still at the opening bid of just 99 cents can be found at this link: http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZraremeteorites Thank you for looking and if you are bidding, good luck. Best Regards, Adam Hupe The Hupe Collection Team LunarRock IMCA 2185 [EMAIL PROTECTED] __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Meteorite Hammers (AD)
Hi Mike, Very nice site. Good work! Sonny -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Tue, 19 Sep 2006 2:09 AM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Meteorite Hammers (AD) Hi All, About 7 years ago I stumbled upon a page in the web site of Walter Branch. The page was a listing of all meteorites reported to have struck something when they fell to earth - some man made object, animal, or even a human being (such as the case of Sylacauga). I immediately found myself entranced by these very special meteorites and began collecting as many of these extraordinary falls as possible. I had already been collecting meteorites for many years, but this new realm had an entrancing effect on me like none other before, with the possible exception of the obsession I developed to collect and offer every non-Antarctic SNC when there were only 6 of them known at the time (though only 4 had ever been available when I started). I read more and more, found other lists, began collecting photos, and, of course, buying at least a collection specimen of everything I could lay my hands on. In fact, I was so amazed at how difficult it was to find these precious rarities after the first dozen or so, I began in earnest to buy all the material I could find of the most rare varieties rarely seen (and I DON'T mean rarely seen as the term is used in eBay ads!) It has taken me well over 5 years to accumulate the stock I have built up and I have spent the last several months putting together a web site that not only lists each of the falls I offer in this rare category, but in most instances shows a photo or two of the building, car, roof, barn, mailbox, etc. actually struck by the meteorite. These are the car bashers, mailbox crunchers, house smashers, animal killers and human maulers. This is the real rogues gallery of the meteorite world. You are all invited to drop in and take a look see. I kept waiting and waiting to open this site because I always have one or two things on the way - but with over 30 falls represented, I decided I would use my 60th birthday as an excuse to launch this puppy. I am indebted to numerous people including, but not limited to, Walter Branch, Martin Horejsi, Bob Walker, Robert Haag, Edwin Thompson, Al Lang, and the list goes on on. I hope you enjoy what you see. Many of the photos took many, many hours of research - and some of those were the easier ones to find. There are links to dozens of videos of the Peekskill fireball, a photo of oh, well, just go there for yourselves. Check it all out at: http://www.michaelbloodmeteorites.com/Hammers.html This site will be obsessively kept up to date in terms of stock availability. I know I haven't always done this in my regular catalog, but this page will be updated with each and every sale and all new material as it comes in on a daily basis. Can you tell I am excited about it? Best wishes, Michael PS: If you have or know of any applicable material not on my site that is available for mere money, please let me know. I will give anyone a nice finder's fee for any material I end up purchasing as a result of a lead given to me. __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list Check out the new AOL. Most comprehensive set of free safety and security tools, free access to millions of high-quality videos from across the web, free AOL Mail and more. __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] AD New Meteoritica website
Hi Philippe, What a great web page! I like the pictures of the meteorites and the hunting story. Makes you want to go hunt the Sahara desert. Sonny -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Tue, 19 Sep 2006 5:49 AM Subject: [meteorite-list] AD New Meteoritica website Hi All, Just a small message to indicate that I completely changed my Web site. You will find more information and more photos. Please look and all the comments are welcome. Best wishes, Philippe http://www.meteoritica.com/ PS: I have also some auctions ending tonight on eBay http://stores.ebay.com/Meteoritica __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list Check out the new AOL. Most comprehensive set of free safety and security tools, free access to millions of high-quality videos from across the web, free AOL Mail and more. __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Russia To Launch Craft To Mars, Phobos in 2009
http://en.rian.ru/russia/20060919/54054760.html Russia to launch craft to Mars, Phobos in 2009 - scientist RIA Novosti September 19, 2006 MOSCOW (RIA Novosti) - Russia will launch a spacecraft to Phobos, the larger of Mars' two moons, in 2009, which will return to Earth with a sample of its soil, a project developer said Tuesday. Dr. Efraim Akim, of the M.V. Keldysh Institute of Applied Mechanics, said the craft will be launched from a platform deployed in an intermediary near-earth orbit. He said there will be no need to use heavy carrier rockets, which make such launches very expensive. The launch window for the voyage to Phobos is October 2009, and the journey will take 10-11 months. The spacecraft will begin its return journey to earth in 2011, which will take another 10-11 months. Phobos is a highly non-spherical moon, orbiting Mars at a distance of less than 6,000 kilometers (3728 miles), and traveling at a speed faster than the rotation of Mars itself. According to Russian Academy of Sciences member Mikhail Marov, Phobos became a satellite of Mars millions of years ago, so studying material from the asteroid will give scientists information on the origins of the Solar System and of the Earth. Neither NASA nor the European Space Agency (ESA) are planning flights to Phobos, Marov said. This is a niche that foreign space agencies have left us, not only because it is an exceptionally difficult task, but also because we have already invested work in this area of planetary research. The landing will be a complicated operation due to the moon's small size and high orbital speed. The spacecraft will use new materials, allowing for a substantial reduction in weight compared to its predecessors, and high-precision Earth-based control systems will be employed for the project. Russian Academy of Sciences President Yury Osipov called the project a unique chance for Russia to return to planetary research. __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] AD Plainview - Benguerir
Dear listoids, A few days ago i put a 722 grams Benguerir up for auction. See picture here: http://www.heavenlybodies.nl/mercurius/images3/benguerir-1z.jpg And a 970 grams Plainview with Nininger number. See pictures here: http://www.heavenlybodies.nl/mercurius/images2/plainvfrontz.jpg http://www.heavenlybodies.nl/mercurius/images2/plainvbackz.jpg Unfortunatly the one who made an offer backed out so for the last time here they are again,(against the rules of the metlist i know) Make me an offer for about U.S.D 3500 for the both and we'll let them go. Greets, Jan __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Unbelievably late package - my story
I did not order many meteorites from e.g. the United States lately, but whenever I did in the more remote past within the last two years or so, delivery was very very very slow - most probably due to German customs, as others have already stated here. It is even likely to happen to be a slow delivery, when you order from a Non-EU country here in Europe like our neighbour (!) Switzerland. Customs almost always seems to be the culprit, and you can´t do a lot about that. When it finally arrives after weeks, you are the lucky one, the one to take a deep breath, as all the time before when you were waiting day after day, you always had to take into consideration the possibility of loss, as customs won´t usually tell you that they have it in their custody... And then my other advice: NEVER EVER send cash money, not even in tight envelopes! There sometimes are and were big delays in delivery from Non-EU countries, as I just wrote, but as far as I recall I never really lost a meteorite in the mail in all those many years as a collector --- but (..and here is a different my story..) once upon a time, many years ago, a three-digit-amount of US-cash was simply lost in a thick light-tight (!) registered (!), well-labelled letter which never ever arrived. This was sent to a well-known oldtime US dealer who did not at all accept credit cards (...won´t tell the name, the oldtime collectors amongst us who know me will probably know who I mean :-)), but well accepted this way to make a transfer on the basis of a divided risk. We came to a gentleman agreement thereafter, so this was settled with no problems, as I was a good customer of him, but then again what can be learnt from this: NEVER EVER send cash money - even not with seemingly se cure means like light-tight envelopes, registration or parcels or something like that. Well, my 2 cts on this. Best wishes from Berlin/Germany Alex __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Unbelievably late package - is UPS better?
Hi Don, list - Thanks for the information. I have regularly been experiencing late delieveries with international mailings of my book Man and Impact in the Americas when shipping via USPS, so this information is quite important for me. It's frustrating, but then what are the alternatives? good hunting, Ed --- Don Edwards [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- E.P. Grondine [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: But I am wondering, is UPS better? Not particularly. A few years ago I bought a share of one of Michael Cottingham's Moroccan investments. He sent a package of, I think it was, about 5K of material UPS. I was home the evening when they supposedly left it by my front door...but it wasn't my front doorand left. It was never found, and took over a year to get a refund. FedEx is better, but even they have problems occasionally, particularly with damaged packages. Don __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Mobile Meteorite Command Center
Dear List, A number of List members expressed an interest in meeting up in Mojave Desert for the third annual Team LunarRock Mojave hunt last year but it was cancelled due to logistics problems. I have been dreaming for over five years now about setting up remote capabilities that would allow a group of hunters to spend months in the field. I explored all kinds of ideas including a toy-hauler, fifth-wheel or a trailer behind a class-A motorhome but each one had issues. I finally decided to go with a straight trailer and a one ton dually truck. I decided on this configuration for several reasons. There are many areas that you cannot access with a class A or C motorhome. Several dry lake beds are hard to get on and off of without four wheel drive. I could not imagine launching quad runners from a toy-hauler on some of these lakebeds, it would simply get stuck. I felt it would be far easier to launch from the back of a truck and leave the trailer at some hopefully nearby camping area where it can act as a base. I still need to have a custom rack built for the truck so that two Honda FourTraxs can be hauled and launched sideways from the truck bed. They are simply too big to haul a pair in one truck bed without this modification. This would also leave the bottom of the truck bed open for storing two Kona mountain bikes for those lake beds that do not allow motor vehicle traffic. I finally stepped up and acquired what I think will be the ultimate Mobile Meteorite Command Center (MMCC). It is a Custom 28 foot Zepplin travel trailer with an 18 foot slide out bar/lounge (Strategy gathering area) and a crews' quarters bunkhouse in the back. It will be equipped with broadband satellite communications, FM communications and GPS telemetry gathering capabilities not to mention remote imaging capabilities from a survey drone (good for spotting white BLM trucks and competitors remotely with 60fps and ~10 mile down link capabilities). In reality, the drone will be neat for getting arial shots and looking at conditions ahead. No, it will not be used to try to spot meteorites from the air, not a very practical idea. Team LunarRock sponsored custom MMCC: http://themeteoritesite.com/MMCC-1.jpg http://themeteoritesite.com/MMCC-2.jpg http://themeteoritesite.com/MMCC-3.jpg Wet bar and lounge for celebrating finds and strategy gathering: http://themeteoritesite.com/WetBarLounge.jpg Find showcase: http://themeteoritesite.com/Showcase.jpg I am hoping to have the MMCC field-ready in a couple of months. We are gathering equipment for field experiments on meteorites which should prove to be pretty interesting. Two well-known scientists will be joining us for part of the Mojave tour so it should prove to be pretty interesting this year. Although we will have magnetic canes and metal detectors, we will be exploring alternate ways of locating meteorites including a meteorite sniffing dog one searcher will have hopefully trained by then. Maybe the dog could be trained to find achondrites. One method which I will keep secret until it is field tested and proven is looking very promising becuase metal and attraction to a magnet are not part of the formula. I do not have firm dates set yet and I am way over budget but hope to get an idea in the upcoming weeks. Several List members have been on previous Mojave hunts with Team LunarRock and a few have made their first finds ever including myself. I will post updates and answer questions as the project progresses. We hope to have more than the 9 hunters that showed up for the 2004 hunt for 2006. I will post locations throughout the tour so that if anybody is interested they can meet up with us in the field for however long their itinerary will allow. Happy Hunting, Adam __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Metal Detector Questions
Dear List, We are looking to see if the list would be interested in a QA feature in Meteorite-Times on Metal Detectors. We have a great source, John Tomlinson. We asked John if he would be willing to answer questions from list members to be posted in Meteorite-Times. John has agreed but we need to know from you if this would be worthwhile or not. John has a question for you... Which metal detector have you found the most meteorites with? Thank you, Paul and Jim ** Paul Harris [EMAIL PROTECTED] Jim Tobin [EMAIL PROTECTED] The Meteorite Exchange, Inc. http://www.meteorite.com Meteorite-Times Magazine http://www.meteorite-times.com PO Box 7000-455, Redondo Beach, CA 90277 USA *** __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Metal Detector Questions
Which metal detector have you found the most meteorites with? A 180 degree PLUS hemispherically directional ground-balanced twin-lidded, canvass-capped, water-cooled Jacob's membrane detection system made back in the 60's, powered by a platypus, bananas, sandwiches and a thick head? Seriously it sounds like a great addition! Best to John and thanks to Paul and Jim... Kind wishes, Doug (occasionally the neuronics looses its threshold from overexposure to radiation, reflected heat and meteorite prices) __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] NASA Rover Opportunity Takes First Peek Into Victoria Crater
MEDIA RELATIONS OFFICE JET PROPULSION LABORATORY CALIFORNIA INSTITUTE OF TECHNOLOGY NATIONAL AERONAUTICS AND SPACE ADMINISTRATION PASADENA, CALIF. 91109 TELEPHONE (818) 354-5011 http://www.jpl.nasa.gov Guy Webster 818-354-6278 Jet Propulsion Laboratory, Pasadena, Calif. Image Advisory: 2006-111September 19, 2006 NASA Rover Opportunity Takes First Peek Into Victoria Crater On Monday, NASA's Mars rover Opportunity got to within about 160 feet of the rim of the half-mile-wide Victoria Crater, the rover's destination since late 2004. The new position gave Opportunity a glimpse of the crater's opposite wall. That view from the navigation camera on the rover is available online at http://www.nasa.gov/mission_pages/mer/images/20060919.html . Opportunity has been heading toward Victoria for more than 20 months, with no guarantee it would ever get there, so we are elated to see this view, said Justin Maki of NASA's Jet Propulsion Laboratory, Pasadena, Calif., an imaging scientist on the rover team. However, we still have another two or three short drives before Opportunity is really right at the rim, looking down into the crater. Once Opportunity reaches the rim, the rover's panoramic camera will begin the task of creating a high-definition color mosaic. That mosaic of images will provide scientists not only with a beautiful view of the crater, but will also provide geologic details of the crater walls. The width of Victoria crater is the equivalent of eight football fields placed end to end. That makes it about five times wider than Endurance Crater, which Opportunity spent six months examining in 2004, and about 40 times wider than Eagle Crater, where Opportunity first landed. The great lure of Victoria is the expectation that a thick stack of geological layers will be exposed in the crater walls, potentially several times the thickness that was previously studied at Endurance and, therefore, potentially preserving several times the historical record. Opportunity and its twin, Spirit, are robotic geologists with instruments for examining rocks to learn about the ancient environmental conditions that existed at the times the rocks were formed. Opportunity has already found exposed rock layers that were formed in flowing surface water and other layers formed as windblown sand. Analyzing the layers at Victoria could extend the story further back in time. JPL, a division of the California Institute of Technology, manages the Mars Exploration Rover mission for the NASA Science Mission Directorate, Washington. For additional images and information about the mission, visit www.nasa.gov/mission_pages/mer . -end- __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Ground-Piercing Radar on NASA Mars Orbiter Ready for Work
MEDIA RELATIONS OFFICE JET PROPULSION LABORATORY CALIFORNIA INSTITUTE OF TECHNOLOGY NATIONAL AERONAUTICS AND SPACE ADMINISTRATION PASADENA, CALIF. 91109 TELEPHONE (818) 354-5011 http://www.jpl.nasa.gov Guy Webster 818-354-6278 Jet Propulsion Laboratory, Pasadena, Calif. Dwayne Brown/Erica Hupp 202-358-1726/1237 NASA Headquarters, Washington News Release: 2006-109 September 19, 2006 Ground-Piercing Radar on NASA Mars Orbiter Ready for Work NASA's Mars Reconnaissance Orbiter has extended the long- armed antenna of its radar, preparing the instrument to begin probing for underground layers of Mars. The orbiter's Shallow Subsurface Radar, provided by the Italian Space Agency, will search to depths of about one kilometer (six-tenths of a mile) to find and map layers of ice, rock and, if present, liquid water. The radar's antenna had remained safely folded and tucked away throughout the flight to Mars from Aug. 12, 2005, to March 10, 2006, and while the orbiter used the friction of dipping into the top of Mars' atmosphere 426 times in the past six months to shrink the size of its orbit. Latches on the restraints were popped open on Sept. 16, and the spring-loaded twin arms of the antenna unfolded themselves. Subsequent information from the spacecraft indicates that each arm properly extended to its 5 meter (16.4 feet) length. The deployment of the antenna has succeeded. It went exactly as planned, said Dr. Enrico Flamini, the Italian Space Agency's program manager for the Shallow Subsurface Radar. Now the excitement builds about what the radar will find hiding beneath the surface of Mars. A radar-team engineer at NASA's Jet Propulsion Laboratory, Pasadena, Calif., Ali Safaeinili, said, Motion sensors on Mars Reconnaisance Orbiter gave us good evidence that the antenna had deployed successfully. The amount of antenna vibrations as the arms unfolded was within the range anticipated. The radar received its first radio echo from the Martian surface during a test on Sept.18, providing a preliminary indication that the entire instrument is working properly. Researchers will use the instrument for more test observations at the end of this month. Communication with all spacecraft at Mars will be intermittent during most of October while that planet is behind the sun from Earth's perspective. The two-year-long main science phase of the Mars Reconnaissance Orbiter mission will begin in November. We will use the Shallow Radar to map buried channels, to study the internal structure of ice caps and to see boundaries between layers of different materials, said Dr. Roberto Seu of the University of Rome La Sapienza, leader of the instrument's science team. The data will provide our first detailed look just under the Martian surface, where ices might reside that would be accessible for future explorers. The radar instrument on the Mars Reconnaissance Orbiter will complement a similar instrument that went into use last year on the European Space Agency's Mars Express orbiter, the Mars Advanced Radar for Subsurface and Ionospheric Sounding. The two instruments use different radar frequencies. The one on Mars Reconnaissance Orbiter can discriminate between thinner layers, but cannot penetrate as deep underground, compared with the one on Mars Express. Both result from Italian and American partnership in using radar for planetary probes. Alcatel Alenia Spazio-Italia, in Rome, is the Italian Space Agency's prime contractor for the instrument. Astro Aerospace, of Carpineria, Calif., a business unit of Los Angeles-based Northrop Grumman Corp., developed the antenna as a subcontractor to Alcatel Alenia. Further information about the Shallow Subsurface Radar is online at www.sharad.org . For more detailed information about the Mars Reconnaissance Orbiter, see www.nasa.gov/mission_pages/MRO/main . The mission is managed by JPL, a division of the California Institute of Technology, Pasadena, for the NASA Science Mission Directorate, Washington. Lockheed Martin Space Systems, Denver, is the prime contractor and built the orbiter. -end- __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Ad- New Argentinian Find
The hunters in Patagonia have been busy this year. First an iron (See Mike Farmers website) then a stone. I have some great slices of the new Patagonian find provisionally calledCerro Mesa L6 - possible fall http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemih=002item=120033936613 the Lamesa (b) meteorite known as the Bookend http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemih=002item=120033936568 and the definitive booklet on the Odessa Meteorite Crater http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemih=002item=120031806242 -mt __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Scientists Discover New Ring and Other Features at Saturn
MEDIA RELATIONS OFFICE JET PROPULSION LABORATORY CALIFORNIA INSTITUTE OF TECHNOLOGY NATIONAL AERONAUTICS AND SPACE ADMINISTRATION PASADENA, CALIF. 91109 TELEPHONE (818) 354-5011 http://www.jpl.nasa.gov Carolina Martinez 818-354-9382 Jet Propulsion Laboratory, Pasadena, Calif. Preston Dyches 720-974-5859 Cassini Imaging Central Laboratory for Operations Space Science Institute, Boulder, Colo. News Release: 2006-110 September 19, 2006 Scientists Discover New Ring and Other Features at Saturn Saturn sports a new ring in an image taken by NASA's Cassini spacecraft on Sunday, Sept. 17, during a one-of-a-kind observation. Other spectacular sights captured by Cassini's cameras include wispy fingers of icy material stretching out tens of thousands of kilometers from the active moon, Enceladus, and a cameo color appearance by planet Earth. The images were obtained during the longest solar occultation of Cassini's four-year mission. During a solar occultation, the sun passes directly behind Saturn, and Cassini lies in the shadow of Saturn while the rings are brilliantly backlit. Usually, an occultation lasts only about an hour, but this time it was a 12-hour marathon. Sunday's occultation allowed Cassini to map the presence of microscopic particles that are not normally visible across the ring system. As a result, Cassini saw the entire inner Saturnian system in a new light. The new ring is a tenuous feature, visible outside the brighter main rings of Saturn and inside the G and E rings, and coincides with the orbits of Saturn's moons Janus and Epimetheus. Scientists expected that meteoroid impacts on Janus and Epimetheus might kick particles off the moons' surfaces and inject them into Saturn orbit, but they were surprised that a well-defined ring structure exists at this location. Saturn's extensive, diffuse E ring, the outermost ring, had previously been imaged one small section at a time. The 12-hour marathon enabled scientists to see the entire structure in one view. The moon Enceladus is seen sweeping through the E ring, extending wispy, fingerlike projections into the ring. These very likely consist of tiny ice particles being ejected from Enceladus' south polar geysers, and entering the E-ring. Both the new ring and the unexpected structures in the E ring should provide us with important insights into how moons can both release small particles and sculpt their local environments, said Matt Hedman, a research associate working with team member Joseph Burns, an expert in diffuse rings, at Cornell University in Ithaca, N.Y. In the latest observations, scientists once again see the bright ghost-like spokes -- transient, dusty, radial structures -- streaking across the middle of Saturn's main rings. Capping off the new batch of observations, Cassini cast its powerful eyes in our direction and captured Earth, a pale blue orb, and a faint suggestion of our moon. Not since NASA's Voyager 1 spacecraft saw Earth as a pale blue dot from beyond the orbit of Neptune has Earth been imaged in color from the outer solar system. Nothing has greater power to alter our perspective of ourselves and our place in the cosmos than these images of Earth we collect from faraway places like Saturn, said Carolyn Porco, Cassini imaging team leader at the Space Science Institute, Boulder, Colo. Porco was one of the Voyager imaging scientists involved in taking the Voyager `Pale Blue Dot' image. In the end, the ever-widening view of our own little planet against the immensity of space is perhaps the greatest legacy of all our interplanetary travels. In the coming weeks, several science teams will analyze data collected by Cassini's other instruments during this rare occultation event. The data will help scientists better understand the relationship between the rings and moons, and will give mission planners a clearer picture of ring hazards to avoid during future ring crossings. Images of the new ring, the E-ring, Enceladus and Earth are available at: http://www.nasa.gov/cassini , http://saturn.jpl.nasa.gov and http://ciclops.org . The Cassini-Huygens mission is a cooperative project of NASA, the European Space Agency and the Italian Space Agency. The Jet Propulsion Laboratory, a division of the California Institute of Technology in Pasadena, manages the Cassini- Huygens mission for NASA's Science Mission Directorate, Washington. The Cassini orbiter and its two onboard cameras were designed, developed and assembled at JPL. The imaging team is based at the Space Science Institute, Boulder, Colo. -end- __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Ad: Camel Donga's
Check these little gems out. I paid full retail for them, so the price is barely over what I paid, but how often do you see these little guys anymore? Michael Farmer Tomorrow, Tambo Quemado's, and Millbillillie's should be up. http://www.meteoriteguy.com/catalog/cameldonga.htm __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Unbelievably late package
Here is our silly story: One delivery of membrane boxes from the factory in Europe to us in the U.S. by FedEx consisted of 19 parcels ( about 3 cu. ft. ea.). They all arrived at customs in Memphis, Tennessee. But then18 came to us in Califonia and one was delivered to an attorney in the Bahamas (opposite direction). FedEx contacted the attorney who refused to give it up! Took about 9 months for FedEx to actually refund the value and shipping costs for a very obvious error that was even on their tracking screen! Ron Hartman - Original Message - From: Sterling K. Webb [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Monday, September 18, 2006 6:13 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Unbelievably late package - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Monday, September 18, 2006 6:45 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Unbelievably late package Another one sent to Texas came back with the notice Customs Declaration is missing. We have always known that Texas is different but when did it become independent?;-) Anne M. Black --- Hi, Anne, List As any Texan would be happy to tell you, March 2, 1836! The Texas Declaration of Independence was produced, literally, overnight. Its urgency was paramount, because while it was being prepared, the Alamo in San Antonio was under seige by Santa Anna's Army of Mexico. Immediately upon the assemblage of the Convention of 1836 on March 1, a committee of five of its delegates were appointed to draft the document. The committee, consisting of George C. Childress, Edward Conrad, James Gaines, Bailey Hardeman, and Collin McKinney, prepared the declaration in record time. It was briefly reviewed, then adopted by the delegates of the convention the following day. The document parallels somewhat that of the United States, signed almost sixty years earlier. It contains statements on the function and responsibility of government, followed by a list of grievances. Finally, it concludes by declaring Texas a free and independent republic. Full text at: http://www.lsjunction.com/docs/tdoi.htm Sterling K. Webb -- __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.405 / Virus Database: 268.12.4/449 - Release Date: 9/15/2006 __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Metal Detector Questions
Hi Paul and list, first I have a silly question. Who is John Tomlinson and why would he know a lot about detectors? Then to answer the question, I have found more than a thousand meteorites and 99 percent have been found with a Fisher Gold Bug 2. I have found a couple with the old Gold Bug. Then in more recent times I have three with a Pulse star 2 pro. My opinion is that if John has a lot of knowledge about detectors in general it would be great to have an artical in Meteorite times. If it were brand specific...well it would be much less interesting. On 9/19/06, Paul Harris [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Dear List, We are looking to see if the list would be interested in a QA feature in Meteorite-Times on Metal Detectors. We have a great source, John Tomlinson. We asked John if he would be willing to answer questions from list members to be posted in Meteorite-Times. John has agreed but we need to know from you if this would be worthwhile or not. John has a question for you... Which metal detector have you found the most meteorites with? Thank you, Paul and Jim ** Paul Harris [EMAIL PROTECTED] Jim Tobin [EMAIL PROTECTED] The Meteorite Exchange, Inc. http://www.meteorite.com Meteorite-Times Magazine http://www.meteorite-times.com PO Box 7000-455, Redondo Beach, CA 90277 USA *** __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list -- Mike Miller Po Box 314 Gerber Ca 96035 www.meteoritefinder.com 530-385-1281 __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Metal Detector Questions
Hi Mike, Good question! John's a really nice person and has been answering questions on some of the forums. The following link will introduce you to how he has acquired his detector knowledge. http://www.johnsmetaldetectors.com/about.htm I didn't post John's link before because this post wasn't about selling. John likes helping others with their questions. From time to time we get metal detector questions on the list and this could be a good way to build up a FAQ section on Meteorite-Times that everyone can refer back to whenever needed. We've already gotten some enthusiastic thumbs up from list members. Thank you! Paul At 05:34 PM 9/19/2006, you wrote: Hi Paul and list, first I have a silly question. Who is John Tomlinson and why would he know a lot about detectors? Then to answer the question, I have found more than a thousand meteorites and 99 percent have been found with a Fisher Gold Bug 2. I have found a couple with the old Gold Bug. Then in more recent times I have three with a Pulse star 2 pro. My opinion is that if John has a lot of knowledge about detectors in general it would be great to have an artical in Meteorite times. If it were brand specific...well it would be much less interesting. On 9/19/06, Paul Harris [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Dear List, We are looking to see if the list would be interested in a QA feature in Meteorite-Times on Metal Detectors. We have a great source, John Tomlinson. We asked John if he would be willing to answer questions from list members to be posted in Meteorite-Times. John has agreed but we need to know from you if this would be worthwhile or not. John has a question for you... Which metal detector have you found the most meteorites with? Thank you, Paul and Jim ** Paul Harris [EMAIL PROTECTED] Jim Tobin [EMAIL PROTECTED] The Meteorite Exchange, Inc. http://www.meteorite.com Meteorite-Times Magazine http://www.meteorite-times.com PO Box 7000-455, Redondo Beach, CA 90277 USA *** __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list -- Mike Miller Po Box 314 Gerber Ca 96035 www.meteoritefinder.com 530-385-1281 __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Metal Detector Questions
Dear List, Mike, Paul; I bite, who is John Tomlinson.and why should he know a lot about detectors for meteorites if we have not heard of his name in meteorite circles.. Mike Miller would be a great topic leader on meteorite hunting with a detector. inquiring minds, Dave F. Mike Miller wrote: Hi Paul and list, first I have a silly question. Who is John Tomlinson and why would he know a lot about detectors? Then to answer the question, I have found more than a thousand meteorites and 99 percent have been found with a Fisher Gold Bug 2. I have found a couple with the old Gold Bug. Then in more recent times I have three with a Pulse star 2 pro. My opinion is that if John has a lot of knowledge about detectors in general it would be great to have an artical in Meteorite times. If it were brand specific...well it would be much less interesting. On 9/19/06, Paul Harris [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Dear List, We are looking to see if the list would be interested in a QA feature in Meteorite-Times on Metal Detectors. We have a great source, John Tomlinson. We asked John if he would be willing to answer questions from list members to be posted in Meteorite-Times. John has agreed but we need to know from you if this would be worthwhile or not. John has a question for you... Which metal detector have you found the most meteorites with? Thank you, Paul and Jim ** Paul Harris [EMAIL PROTECTED] Jim Tobin [EMAIL PROTECTED] The Meteorite Exchange, Inc. http://www.meteorite.com Meteorite-Times Magazine http://www.meteorite-times.com PO Box 7000-455, Redondo Beach, CA 90277 USA *** __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] 2003 EL61, IN PERSON
Hi, E.P., List, Yes, cometesimals - about 75 meters or so, which themselves can then accrete chaotically over time, Yes, but nobody thinks cometesimals contain enough iron-nickel to form a differentiated body. They may, but nobody believes it... When I expressed a doubt about accreting big bodies out in the Kuiper Belt to a professional, he said, What else could it be? Good question. ...over time... The problem is elbow room and simple geometry. How much elbow room do you have? Accretion occurs because things bump into each other, because the space is crowded, like a NY cocktail party. Clearly, the Earth accreted. If it sucked up every rock from 0.80 AU out to 1.30 AU, it was drawing on a zone with an area of about 0.80 square AU's. (The area of a circle 1.3 AU in diameter minus the area of a circle 0.8 AU in diameter = the Accretion Zone.) Yes, it was a volume, because it had thickness, but it was a flat disc. It was crowded. Rocks kept meeting rocks. It happened in a hurry -- blam, Blam, BLAM, all done. 10 million years? 30? 50? Opinions vary, but quick, all agree. Out in the Kuiper Belt, very narrowly defined as from 38 AU out to 48 AU, there's 1583 square AU's! That's almost 2000 times more room! Your odds of bumping into something are 2000 times smaller. Imagine you're in a ballroom with 3999 other people, all 4000 of you milling around in constant motion and blindfolded so you can't look where you're going: bump, Bump, BUMP. Now, imagine that you're in the SAME ballroom with one other person (just the two of you). What are the chances of you two (blindfolded and with ear plugs) colliding? Well, since your odds of meeting up are 2000 times smaller, it's going to take 2000 times as long for it to happen. Hey, no problemo! If the Earth accretes in a snappy 10 million years, then objects in the Kuiper Belt will accrete in only... scribble, scribble... 20 Billion Years! No, wait! Does that sound wrong to you? You see the problem... Well, the theoretical dynamicists must have an answer, something we haven't thought of, right? They do indeed have solutions. What are they? Simple, just put 100 times more mass in the Kuiper Belt (or 200 times more or 500 times more) and it speeds things up to where bodies can accrete there in ONLY a billion years or less! Or more... Wow, the Kuiper Belt must be MASSIVE! Oh, no, they reply, the whole thing has less than 0.10 Earth masses for all objects big and small. All that mass is gone... I smell a problem. It took the inner solar system, where things accrete in a flash, 600 million years to clean up the leftovers (the Late Bombardment, you remember; it was a big hit). The same process in the Kuiper Belt? With 100 times the mass, it will take 20 times as long (6 billion years). The leftovers should still be there. If not, where'd the mass go? There are lots of mass-wasting theories. I didn't invent that silly term; that's what they're called. Not to go on too long, the answer is: it got swept under the rug. There are numerous complicated and unlikely scenarios. Julio Fernandez and school push a theory in which Neptune, pumped up by a resonance with Saturn, spirals outward (while the other giants spiral inward), with Neptune pushing the KB in front of it, compressing it and making fast accretion happen, until Neptune finally stops with the KB on its doorstep, where Neptune can then spend billions of years perturbing the rest of the mass away, and leaving little total mass for the Kuiper Belt. Of course, they could just be WRONG about the mass-poor Kuiper Belt. Look a sharp, economical test of Kuiper Belt theory described in: http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v442/n7103/full/442640a.html The data had already been collected by NASA. (The full article is at: http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v442/n7103/full/nature04941.html) They found perhaps 1000 times more mass than theory allows. So maybe the mass is still there? One prediction of theory is that the Kuiper Belt has a sharply cut-off outer edge, and that past that edge, there are no more TNO's all the way out to the Oort Cloud, a great deserted and empty zone, with a sign at 42 AU or 48 AU that says: Now leaving the Solar System. No Gas Stations for 20,000 AU. In other words, there's nothing out there TO find. This, of course, is where all the bolts come loose and the wheels fall off! This is exactly where we are finding things. First called the Scattered Disc (on the assumption that Neptune tossed'em out there) and then the Extended Scattered Disk, or the Distant Detached Disc, we now have a slew of large interesting objects that Neptune could never have had anything to do with. Finding Sedna was kind of a last straw. Brown, who discovered it says, Sedna shouldn't be there. There's no way to put Sedna where it is. It never comes close enough to be affected by the sun, but it never goes far enough away from the sun to be
Re: [meteorite-list] Metal Detector Questions
Hi List,Paul, and Jim, I think that is a great idea! Seems that a QA on metal detectors would be very interesting. I just followed the link on John Tomlinson, and it sounds like his is pretty knowledgeable on the subject. My Question is this. Aren't there are so many among us that have an abundance of experience actually finding thousands of meteorites with a metal detector? Of course Mike Miller is one but what about John Blennert, John Gwilliams, and Jim Kriegh to name a few. On the technical side what about Bill Southern or Marvin Kilgore. I'm pretty sure Whites Gold Master 2,3,4 and the V-sat as well as the Fisher Gold Bug, and Gold Bug 2 have been the most popular hunting meteorites within the last 10 years. Ruben __ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] 2003 EL61, IN PERSON
On Tue, 19 Sep 2006 21:06:38 -0500, you wrote: All these high inclination objects have also provided a big boost to the Sun's Companion Star theories we all remember so well, like Nemesis. It still has its backers, and they're all elated. Of course, what they don't tell you is that you don't need a brown dwarf star to perturb disc objects in inclination; all you need is an Earth mass object at 1200 AU. The Outer Outer System is waiting to be discovered... I think. Speaking of Nemisis... Here's a solar system with one: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/14910347/ Distorted solar system discovered Researchers find brown dwarf with companion planet By Jeanna Bryner Staff Writer Space.com Updated: 4:35 p.m. ET Sept 19, 2006 Discovered just 11 years ago, a class of oddball failed stars continues to baffle as well as enlighten astronomers. Now researchers have spotted for the first time one of these failed stars, called a brown dwarf, with a companion planet both orbiting a Sun-like star. This is the first brown dwarf that has been directly imaged in an extrasolar planetary system, lead researcher Kevin Luhman of Penn State University told SPACE.com. The finding, detailed in the current issue of The Astrophysical Journal, sheds light on these mysterious objects that blur the lines between a planet and a star. Brown dwarfs are too small to trigger the fusion of hydrogen that keeps stars like our sun shining for billions of years. Instead, with masses up to 75 times that of Jupiter, brown dwarfs slowly cool and fizzle out over tens of millions of years. Located within the constellation Pisces, the newly spotted object is called HD 3651 B. It is 50 times the mass of Jupiter and thus considered a T brown dwarf the coolest of the two brown-dwarf categories. This slow smoldering releases infrared light, which was detected by NASA's Spitzer Space Telescope. One reason the dwarf stayed out of view until now, Lunham said, is its lengthy distance from its planet partner, which the researchers spotted using the Doppler method. This technique measures the wobbles of a star caused by the gravitational tug of an orbiting object that otherwise can't be detected. However, the method is limited: Whereas the planet orbits at a snug 0.3 astronomical units (AU) from the Sun-like star called HD 3651, the brown dwarf resides at a distance of 500 AU. One AU is the distance between the Sun and Earth. Luhman said due to the brown dwarf's prolonged orbit time of more than a thousand years and its miniscule gravitational effect on the star, Doppler was unable to pick up the object. The discovery helps to clear up a quandary. When astronomers discovered the system's Saturn-sized planet in 2003, they didn't know the cause of its elongated, elliptical orbit. Now they suspect the tug from the brown dwarf's gravity could be partly responsible for stretching the planet's orbit. Other planets with elliptical orbits found around other stars with Doppler observations may also have previously unseen, distant brown dwarf companions that are perturbing their orbits, Luhman said. __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] AD - Ebay auctions started - the most incredible offering in history of mankind
Well, guys and gals, after a summer of goofing off, it is time to get back to work. I just got back from the Denver show on Sunday and had a great time. Such a great time that with the exception of photos from my climbing adventures with Blaine, I took no photos at the show. Sorry about that, I will do better in Tucson, I promise. I threw together a few auctions today of some extraordinary items under seller name catchafallingstar.com : .044 gram ultra-thin slice of NWA 482 with a nice edge of fusion crust: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemitem=200029147013 Double oriented Sikhote-alin: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemitem=200028821117 How about a Sikhote-alin with a nice big crater crater: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemitem=200029093775 Oum Dreyga (Amgala) half stone with a polished face (this is my birthday meteorite so bid very, very high) http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemitem=200028848341 There are more wild-shapped Sikhote-alin and NWA 869 Meteorite Jewelry etc. but I won't bore you with more direct links. Just do a search on my username or click on view sellers other items from one of the above auctions. Thanks for looking and an even bigger thanks for those of you who decide to bid. Have a nice day.. Jim Strope 421 Fourth Street Glen Dale, WV 26038 http://www.catchafallingstar.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] List problems
Hello, Am I the only one not getting any posts from the list again? Can any of you guys let me know if this is a Comcast issue ? or is it more widespread ? Thanks Bob __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] 2003 EL61, IN PERSON
Sterling: And you wonder why some of us are concerned with the dynamical definitions for planets. Most of us do not understand the models and even the dynamicists cannot come to agreement. Oh, something to remember, when things bump into each other early on, things stick thanks to there being a lot of stuff in similar orbits. Once that is gone, impact velocities go up and things break up instead of accreate. If memory serves me (not very well these days), things should be moving slower relative to each other so easier to stick. I will have to check on that. Larry Quoting Sterling K. Webb [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Hi, E.P., List, Yes, cometesimals - about 75 meters or so, which themselves can then accrete chaotically over time, Yes, but nobody thinks cometesimals contain enough iron-nickel to form a differentiated body. They may, but nobody believes it... When I expressed a doubt about accreting big bodies out in the Kuiper Belt to a professional, he said, What else could it be? Good question. ...over time... The problem is elbow room and simple geometry. How much elbow room do you have? Accretion occurs because things bump into each other, because the space is crowded, like a NY cocktail party. Clearly, the Earth accreted. If it sucked up every rock from 0.80 AU out to 1.30 AU, it was drawing on a zone with an area of about 0.80 square AU's. (The area of a circle 1.3 AU in diameter minus the area of a circle 0.8 AU in diameter = the Accretion Zone.) Yes, it was a volume, because it had thickness, but it was a flat disc. It was crowded. Rocks kept meeting rocks. It happened in a hurry -- blam, Blam, BLAM, all done. 10 million years? 30? 50? Opinions vary, but quick, all agree. Out in the Kuiper Belt, very narrowly defined as from 38 AU out to 48 AU, there's 1583 square AU's! That's almost 2000 times more room! Your odds of bumping into something are 2000 times smaller. Imagine you're in a ballroom with 3999 other people, all 4000 of you milling around in constant motion and blindfolded so you can't look where you're going: bump, Bump, BUMP. Now, imagine that you're in the SAME ballroom with one other person (just the two of you). What are the chances of you two (blindfolded and with ear plugs) colliding? Well, since your odds of meeting up are 2000 times smaller, it's going to take 2000 times as long for it to happen. Hey, no problemo! If the Earth accretes in a snappy 10 million years, then objects in the Kuiper Belt will accrete in only... scribble, scribble... 20 Billion Years! No, wait! Does that sound wrong to you? You see the problem... Well, the theoretical dynamicists must have an answer, something we haven't thought of, right? They do indeed have solutions. What are they? Simple, just put 100 times more mass in the Kuiper Belt (or 200 times more or 500 times more) and it speeds things up to where bodies can accrete there in ONLY a billion years or less! Or more... Wow, the Kuiper Belt must be MASSIVE! Oh, no, they reply, the whole thing has less than 0.10 Earth masses for all objects big and small. All that mass is gone... I smell a problem. It took the inner solar system, where things accrete in a flash, 600 million years to clean up the leftovers (the Late Bombardment, you remember; it was a big hit). The same process in the Kuiper Belt? With 100 times the mass, it will take 20 times as long (6 billion years). The leftovers should still be there. If not, where'd the mass go? There are lots of mass-wasting theories. I didn't invent that silly term; that's what they're called. Not to go on too long, the answer is: it got swept under the rug. There are numerous complicated and unlikely scenarios. Julio Fernandez and school push a theory in which Neptune, pumped up by a resonance with Saturn, spirals outward (while the other giants spiral inward), with Neptune pushing the KB in front of it, compressing it and making fast accretion happen, until Neptune finally stops with the KB on its doorstep, where Neptune can then spend billions of years perturbing the rest of the mass away, and leaving little total mass for the Kuiper Belt. Of course, they could just be WRONG about the mass-poor Kuiper Belt. Look a sharp, economical test of Kuiper Belt theory described in: http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v442/n7103/full/442640a.html The data had already been collected by NASA. (The full article is at: http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v442/n7103/full/nature04941.html) They found perhaps 1000 times more mass than theory allows. So maybe the mass is still there? One prediction of theory is that the Kuiper Belt has a sharply cut-off outer edge, and that past that edge, there are no more TNO's all the way out to the Oort Cloud, a great deserted and empty zone, with a sign at 42 AU or 48 AU
Re: [meteorite-list] Unbelievably late package
Seems like it wouldn't be too hard to put together a dual purpose trip to the Bahamas...a free vacation courtesy of a business trip to teach some baseball bat manners to a sleazy attorney. Best, JKG At 05:02 PM 9/19/2006, R. N. Hartman wrote: Here is our silly story: One delivery of membrane boxes from the factory in Europe to us in the U.S. by FedEx consisted of 19 parcels ( about 3 cu. ft. ea.). They all arrived at customs in Memphis, Tennessee. But then18 came to us in Califonia and one was delivered to an attorney in the Bahamas (opposite direction). FedEx contacted the attorney who refused to give it up! Took about 9 months for FedEx to actually refund the value and shipping costs for a very obvious error that was even on their tracking screen! Ron Hartman - Original Message - From: Sterling K. Webb [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Monday, September 18, 2006 6:13 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Unbelievably late package - Original Message - From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Monday, September 18, 2006 6:45 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Unbelievably late package Another one sent to Texas came back with the notice Customs Declaration is missing. We have always known that Texas is different but when did it become independent?;-) Anne M. Black --- Hi, Anne, List As any Texan would be happy to tell you, March 2, 1836! The Texas Declaration of Independence was produced, literally, overnight. Its urgency was paramount, because while it was being prepared, the Alamo in San Antonio was under seige by Santa Anna's Army of Mexico. Immediately upon the assemblage of the Convention of 1836 on March 1, a committee of five of its delegates were appointed to draft the document. The committee, consisting of George C. Childress, Edward Conrad, James Gaines, Bailey Hardeman, and Collin McKinney, prepared the declaration in record time. It was briefly reviewed, then adopted by the delegates of the convention the following day. The document parallels somewhat that of the United States, signed almost sixty years earlier. It contains statements on the function and responsibility of government, followed by a list of grievances. Finally, it concludes by declaring Texas a free and independent republic. Full text at: http://www.lsjunction.com/docs/tdoi.htm Sterling K. Webb -- __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.1.405 / Virus Database: 268.12.4/449 - Release Date: 9/15/2006 __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
