[meteorite-list] Meteorite Picture of the Day
Today's Meteorite Picture of the Day: Mifflin Contributed by: Dave Gheesling http://www.tucsonmeteorites.com/mpodmain.asp __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Fake Norway rock
Well one of the parachutists seems to think someone at NASA did debunk it, since they posted a thank you for the help thanking NASA. I guess they are making that up too:) Michael Farmer Phil Metzger, who has in the past extensively modelled falling debris at Shuttle launches, has used his models to analyze the video. He concludes that while a (large) meteorite at distance cannot be fully excluded, the footage is also consistent with a small rock (pebble size: ~3.3 cm) falling out of the parachute: http://tinyurl.com/qglu7vp I agree with Chris: while a meteorite is still a distinct possibility and has therefore not been 100% debunked, the falling pebble from parachute explanation now seems the most likely one. - Marco Dr Marco (183294) Langbroek astero...@langbroek.org http://www.marcolangbroek.nl http://asteroids.marcolangbroek.nl - __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Fake Norway rock
What I find interesting are the comments made on such things at trajectory of the object. As the camera is falling, it is not falling vertically. It is falling at a rate of about 1000 ft per second and gliding too. Because the camera was mounted on the helmet, it's view is whatever way the guy was facing. So, if you take an object, like a baseball and hang it from a string 30 feet in the air and then step back 40' and take a picture of it while standing on a 10 foot ladder, it's going to look small. Then if you take the ladder move it 10 feet closer to the ball and lower the ball from 30 feet to 25 feet and then climb the ladder but take the picture at 3/4 the height of the first picture, you will see the ball is bigger and the angle will be different making it look like it is moving on some arc or curve (in a composite of the two pictures), when all it did was drop vertically. You keep doing that and pretty soon you and the ball will meet and the ball will look bigger than it actually is. So the ball, with a perfectly vertical decent, will not appear to have a vertical decent. One can actually just draw this out with a pencil and paper without the need for a camera! Jim -- Jim Wooddell jim.woodd...@suddenlink.net http://pages.suddenlink.net/chondrule/ __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Fake Norway rock
Correction *falling at a rate of about 1000'/min... On 4/10/2014 4:38 AM, Jim Wooddell wrote: What I find interesting are the comments made on such things at trajectory of the object. As the camera is falling, it is not falling vertically. It is falling at a rate of about 1000 ft per second and gliding too. Because the camera was mounted on the helmet, it's view is whatever way the guy was facing. So, if you take an object, like a baseball and hang it from a string 30 feet in the air and then step back 40' and take a picture of it while standing on a 10 foot ladder, it's going to look small. Then if you take the ladder move it 10 feet closer to the ball and lower the ball from 30 feet to 25 feet and then climb the ladder but take the picture at 3/4 the height of the first picture, you will see the ball is bigger and the angle will be different making it look like it is moving on some arc or curve (in a composite of the two pictures), when all it did was drop vertically. You keep doing that and pretty soon you and the ball will meet and the ball will look bigger than it actually is. So the ball, with a perfectly vertical decent, will not appear to have a vertical decent. One can actually just draw this out with a pencil and paper without the need for a camera! Jim -- Jim Wooddell jim.woodd...@suddenlink.net http://pages.suddenlink.net/chondrule/ __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Fake Norway rock
One other comment on the matter. Debunk is almost always pejorative, implying that the thing being debunked was fraudulent, or complete rubbish. We debunk astrology. We debunk pseudoscientific claims. But there's nothing to suggest that the original claim was anything other than honest and reasonable- a video that accidentally captured something that might reasonably be interpreted as a falling meteorite. Even if some piece of evidence actually disproved that hypothesis, we should simply say that it was disproved, not debunked. Chris *** Chris L Peterson Cloudbait Observatory http://www.cloudbait.com On 4/10/2014 3:03 AM, Marco Langbroek wrote: Phil Metzger, who has in the past extensively modelled falling debris at Shuttle launches, has used his models to analyze the video. He concludes that while a (large) meteorite at distance cannot be fully excluded, the footage is also consistent with a small rock (pebble size: ~3.3 cm) falling out of the parachute: http://tinyurl.com/qglu7vp I agree with Chris: while a meteorite is still a distinct possibility and has therefore not been 100% debunked, the falling pebble from parachute explanation now seems the most likely one. - Marco __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] meteorites from Earth Aw: Scientists Reconstruct Ancient, Massive Impact
The question is: Which achondrites have creation ages of 3.23 billion to 3.47 billion years ? Perhaps we have material from this event among our collections. Some material might still be flying in the solar system, even 3 billion years later. Regards, Thomas Kurtz Weil der Stadt, Germany Gesendet: Donnerstag, 10. April 2014 um 01:05 Uhr Von: Ron Baalke baa...@zagami.jpl.nasa.gov An: Meteorite Mailing List meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Betreff: [meteorite-list] Scientists Reconstruct Ancient, Massive Impact http://news.agu.org/press-release/scientists-reconstruct-ancient-impact-that-dwarfs-dinosaur-extinction-blast/ Scientists reconstruct ancient impact that dwarfs dinosaur-extinction blast American Geophysical Union Press Release 9 April 2014 WASHINGTON, D.C. - Picture this: A massive asteroid almost as wide as Rhode Island and about three to five times larger than the rock thought to have wiped out the dinosaurs slams into Earth. The collision punches a crater into the planet's crust that's nearly 500 kilometers (about 300 miles) across: greater than the distance from Washington, D.C. to New York City, and up to two and a half times larger in diameter than the hole formed by the dinosaur-killing asteroid. Seismic waves bigger than any recorded earthquakes shake the planet for about half an hour at any one location - about six times longer than the huge earthquake that struck Japan three years ago. The impact also sets off tsunamis many times deeper than the one that followed the Japanese quake. Although scientists had previously hypothesized enormous ancient impacts, much greater than the one that may have eliminated the dinosaurs 65 million years ago, now a new study reveals the power and scale of a cataclysmic event some 3.26 billion years ago which is thought to have created geological features found in a South African region known as the Barberton greenstone belt. The research has been accepted for publication in Geochemistry, Geophysics, Geosystems, a journal of the American Geophysical Union. The huge impactor - between 37 and 58 kilometers (23 to 36 miles) wide - collided with the planet at 20 kilometers per second (12 miles per second). The jolt, bigger than a 10.8 magnitude earthquake, propelled seismic waves hundreds of kilometers through the Earth, breaking rocks and setting off other large earthquakes. Tsunamis thousands of meters deep - far bigger than recent tsunamis generated by earthquakes - swept across the oceans that covered most of the Earth at that time. We knew it was big, but we didn't know how big, Donald Lowe, a geologist at Stanford University and a co-author of the study, said of the asteroid. [Graphic] A graphical representation of the size of the asteroid thought to have killed the dinosaurs, and the crater it created, compared to an asteroid thought to have hit the Earth 3.26 billion years ago and the size of the crater it may have generated. A new study reveals the power and scale of the event some 3.26 billion years ago which scientists think created geological features found in a South African region known as the Barberton greenstone belt. Credit: American Geophysical Union Lowe, who discovered telltale rock formations in the Barberton greenstone a decade ago, thought their structure smacked of an asteroid impact. The new research models for the first time how big the asteroid was and the effect it had on the planet, including the possible initiation of a more modern plate tectonic system that is seen in the region, according to Lowe. The study marks the first time scientists have mapped in this way an impact that occurred more than 3 billion years ago, Lowe added, and is likely one of the first times anyone has modeled any impact that occurred during this period of the Earth's evolution. The impact would have been catastrophic to the surface environment. The smaller, dino-killing asteroid crash is estimated to have released more than a billion times more energy than the bombs that destroyed Hiroshima and Nagasaki. The more ancient hit now coming to light would have released much more energy, experts said. The sky would have become red hot, the atmosphere would have been filled with dust and the tops of oceans would have boiled, the researchers said. The impact sent vaporized rock into the atmosphere, which encircled the globe and condensed into liquid droplets before solidifying and falling to the surface, according to the researchers. The impact may have been one of dozens of huge asteroids that scientists think hit the Earth during the tail end of the Late Heavy Bombardment period, a major period of impacts that occurred early in the Earth's history - around 3 billion to 4 billion years ago. Many of the sites where these asteroids landed were destroyed by erosion, movement of the Earth's crust and other forces
Re: [meteorite-list] meteorites from Earth Aw: Scientists Reconstruct Ancient, Massive Impact
Interesting thought Thomaswhat does NWA 5400 date at...that sits on the Terrestrial fractionation line? Any further work been done on that or it's pairings? Graham On Thu, Apr 10, 2014 at 3:15 PM, Thomas Kurtz thomas.ku...@gmx.de wrote: The question is: Which achondrites have creation ages of 3.23 billion to 3.47 billion years ? Perhaps we have material from this event among our collections. Some material might still be flying in the solar system, even 3 billion years later. Regards, Thomas Kurtz Weil der Stadt, Germany Gesendet: Donnerstag, 10. April 2014 um 01:05 Uhr Von: Ron Baalke baa...@zagami.jpl.nasa.gov An: Meteorite Mailing List meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Betreff: [meteorite-list] Scientists Reconstruct Ancient, Massive Impact http://news.agu.org/press-release/scientists-reconstruct-ancient-impact-that-dwarfs-dinosaur-extinction-blast/ Scientists reconstruct ancient impact that dwarfs dinosaur-extinction blast American Geophysical Union Press Release 9 April 2014 WASHINGTON, D.C. - Picture this: A massive asteroid almost as wide as Rhode Island and about three to five times larger than the rock thought to have wiped out the dinosaurs slams into Earth. The collision punches a crater into the planet's crust that's nearly 500 kilometers (about 300 miles) across: greater than the distance from Washington, D.C. to New York City, and up to two and a half times larger in diameter than the hole formed by the dinosaur-killing asteroid. Seismic waves bigger than any recorded earthquakes shake the planet for about half an hour at any one location - about six times longer than the huge earthquake that struck Japan three years ago. The impact also sets off tsunamis many times deeper than the one that followed the Japanese quake. Although scientists had previously hypothesized enormous ancient impacts, much greater than the one that may have eliminated the dinosaurs 65 million years ago, now a new study reveals the power and scale of a cataclysmic event some 3.26 billion years ago which is thought to have created geological features found in a South African region known as the Barberton greenstone belt. The research has been accepted for publication in Geochemistry, Geophysics, Geosystems, a journal of the American Geophysical Union. The huge impactor - between 37 and 58 kilometers (23 to 36 miles) wide - collided with the planet at 20 kilometers per second (12 miles per second). The jolt, bigger than a 10.8 magnitude earthquake, propelled seismic waves hundreds of kilometers through the Earth, breaking rocks and setting off other large earthquakes. Tsunamis thousands of meters deep - far bigger than recent tsunamis generated by earthquakes - swept across the oceans that covered most of the Earth at that time. We knew it was big, but we didn't know how big, Donald Lowe, a geologist at Stanford University and a co-author of the study, said of the asteroid. [Graphic] A graphical representation of the size of the asteroid thought to have killed the dinosaurs, and the crater it created, compared to an asteroid thought to have hit the Earth 3.26 billion years ago and the size of the crater it may have generated. A new study reveals the power and scale of the event some 3.26 billion years ago which scientists think created geological features found in a South African region known as the Barberton greenstone belt. Credit: American Geophysical Union Lowe, who discovered telltale rock formations in the Barberton greenstone a decade ago, thought their structure smacked of an asteroid impact. The new research models for the first time how big the asteroid was and the effect it had on the planet, including the possible initiation of a more modern plate tectonic system that is seen in the region, according to Lowe. The study marks the first time scientists have mapped in this way an impact that occurred more than 3 billion years ago, Lowe added, and is likely one of the first times anyone has modeled any impact that occurred during this period of the Earth's evolution. The impact would have been catastrophic to the surface environment. The smaller, dino-killing asteroid crash is estimated to have released more than a billion times more energy than the bombs that destroyed Hiroshima and Nagasaki. The more ancient hit now coming to light would have released much more energy, experts said. The sky would have become red hot, the atmosphere would have been filled with dust and the tops of oceans would have boiled, the researchers said. The impact sent vaporized rock into the atmosphere, which encircled the globe and condensed into liquid droplets before solidifying and falling to the surface, according to the researchers. The impact may have been one of dozens of huge asteroids that scientists think hit the Earth during the tail end of the Late Heavy Bombardment period, a major period of impacts that occurred early in
[meteorite-list] Construction to Begin on OSIRIS-REx Spacecraft Set to Visit Asteroid in 2018
April 10, 2014 Construction to Begin on NASA Spacecraft Set to Visit Asteroid in 2018 NASA's team that will conduct the first U.S. mission to collect samples from an asteroid has been given the go-ahead to begin building the spacecraft, flight instruments and ground system, and launch support facilities. This determination was made Wednesday after a successful Mission Critical Design Review (CDR) for NASA's Origins Spectral Interpretation Resource Identification Security Regolith Explorer (OSIRIS-REx). The CDR was held at Lockheed Martin Space Systems Company in Littleton, Colo., April 1-9. An independent review board, comprised of experts from NASA and several external organizations, met to review the system design. This is the final step for a NASA mission to go from paper to product, said Gordon Johnston, OSIRIS-REx program executive at NASA Headquarters, Washington, DC. This confirms that the final design is ready to start the build-up towards launch. OSIRIS-REx is scheduled to launch in the fall of 2016, rendezvous with the asteroid Bennu in 2018 and return a sample of it to Earth in 2023. The spacecraft carries five instruments that will remotely evaluate the surface of Bennu. After more than a year of asteroid reconnaissance, the spacecraft will collect samples of at least 2 ounces (60 grams) and return them to Earth for scientists to study. Successfully passing mission CDR is a major accomplishment, but the hard part is still in front of us -- building, integrating and testing the flight system in support of a tight planetary launch window, said Mike Donnelly, OSIRIS-REx project manager at NASA's Goddard Space Flight Center in Greenbelt, Md. Key mission objectives focus on finding answers to basic questions about the composition of the very early solar system and the source of organic materials and water that made life possible on Earth. The mission will also aid NASAs asteroid initiative and support the agency's efforts to understand the population of potentially hazardous near-Earth objects and characterize those suitable for future asteroid exploration missions. The initiative brings together the best of NASA's science, technology and human exploration efforts to achieve President Obama's goal of sending humans to an asteroid by 2025. The OSIRIS-REx team has consistently demonstrated its ability to present a comprehensive mission design that meets all requirements within the resources provided by NASA, said Dante Lauretta, principal investigator from the University of Arizona, Tucson. Mission CDR was no exception. This is a great team. I know we will build a flight and ground system that is up to the challenges of this ambitious mission. In January, NASA invited people around the world to submit their names to be etched on a microchip aboard the spacecraft. After submitting their name, participants are able to download and print a certificate documenting their participation in the OSIRIS-REx mission. The campaign is open until September 30, 2014. Goddard Space Flight Center will provide overall mission management, systems engineering, and safety and mission assurance for OSIRIS-REx. Lockheed Martin Space Systems in Denver will build the spacecraft. OSIRIS-REx is the third mission in the agency's New Frontiers Program. NASA's Marshall Space Flight Center in Huntsville, Ala., manages New Frontiers for the agency's Science Mission Directorate in Washington. The University of Arizona leads OSIRIS-REx and provides the camera system and science processing and operations center. For more information about the OSIRIS-REx mission, visit: http://www.nasa.gov/osiris-rex and http://asteroidmission.org To participate in Messages to Bennu, go to: http://planetary.org/bennu -end- Dwayne Brown Headquarters, Washington 202-358-1726 dwayne.c.br...@nasa.gov Nancy Neal Jones Goddard Space Flight Center, Greenbelt, Md. 301-286-0039 nancy.n.jo...@nasa.gov __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Fake Norway Rock
What amazes me about this media stunt is the lack of skepticism from people who should know better. When I saw the video, my first thought was: this is as phony as a three-dollar bill. Anybody with even a lick of common sense should have instantly known this was totally bogus. No bolide, no sonic boom, no smoke trail, no electophonic sound, no recovered meteorite, nothing. There's nothing right about this. Just a video where a small rock pops out of a parachute right after its deployed. Who in their right mind would conclude that it was a meteoroid in dark flight? (Besides the dummy astronomer and physicist.) Even now people are still saying: well there's a reasonable chance it could be real. Yeah right! About the same chance as me winning 10 Olympic gold medals, winning the lottery 10 times in a row, getting elected to the US Senate after being knighted by the Queen of England and then marrying Scarlett Johansson. Get Real, Phil Whitmer Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] AD: ebay Auctions ending
Hello List, Less than one day left for some auctions on ebay: - NWA 7397 SNC - 4.84 g: http://www.ebay.com/itm/191127908820 - NWA 7397 SNC - 0.53g: http://my.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?MyeBay The other auctions and store items here: http://stores.ebay.com/svassiliev?_trksid=p2047675.l2563 Thanks for your time! Sergey __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Fake Norway rock
All I have to say is if you collect meteorite wrongs, if someone can find the pebble that was in the video, you will have a cool meteorite wrong to add to your collection. Shawn Alan IMCA 1633 ebay store http://www.ebay.com/sch/imca1633nyc/m.html Meteoritefalls.com __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Fake Norway Rock
Then you need to tune up your analysis skills. And your knowledge of meteoritics. The video was not falsified, and is hardly phony. What it shows is plausibly explained by the meteorite hypothesis. Many, perhaps most meteorite falls are not preceded by a significant fireball, and even fewer by acoustics of any sort. I don't hear many people saying there's a reasonable chance this could be a meteorite. I didn't even hear much of that early on. Only that nothing obviously excludes this from being a meteorite. That's a distinction well worth remembering. If this had been trivially rejected from the beginning, no analysis would have been performed, and that would be unfortunate. And that's getting real. Chris *** Chris L Peterson Cloudbait Observatory http://www.cloudbait.com On 4/10/2014 11:49 AM, Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum wrote: What amazes me about this media stunt is the lack of skepticism from people who should know better. When I saw the video, my first thought was: this is as phony as a three-dollar bill. Anybody with even a lick of common sense should have instantly known this was totally bogus. No bolide, no sonic boom, no smoke trail, no electophonic sound, no recovered meteorite, nothing. There's nothing right about this. Just a video where a small rock pops out of a parachute right after its deployed. Who in their right mind would conclude that it was a meteoroid in dark flight? (Besides the dummy astronomer and physicist.) Even now people are still saying: well there's a reasonable chance it could be real. Yeah right! About the same chance as me winning 10 Olympic gold medals, winning the lottery 10 times in a row, getting elected to the US Senate after being knighted by the Queen of England and then marrying Scarlett Johansson. Get Real, Phil Whitmer __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Fake Norway Rock
There was nothing ridiculous about it. There still isn't. The Fox News deer video has been debunked (and that's the correct word), however, since the deer were externally illuminated (contrary to the report), and the so-called UFOs can be seen to be nothing more than internal reflections in the optics from the eyes of the deer. No such solid refutation has been produced for the Norway video. In fact, I haven't seen any refutation at all, only evidence for a much more likely scenario. Chris *** Chris L Peterson Cloudbait Observatory http://www.cloudbait.com On 4/10/2014 12:34 PM, Michael Farmer wrote: If it had been made public from day one before they built websites and made videos and spent nearly 2 years building the hype for max news publicity and promotion it would hAve been more believable. I find this entire thing ridiculous. I saw a video of some lights shining down of deer the other day, news was viral, I doubt it was aliens but hasn't been disproven either:) It seems to me that some people are invested in this story and will never admit that it is just a pebble from the chute packing. Michael Farmer __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Fake Norway Rock
Chris, You need to install and tune up a bullshit detector. You seem awfully gullible. Plausibly explained by the meteorite hypothesis? Maybe to a moron. Phil Whitmer Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum Then you need to tune up your analysis skills. And your knowledge of meteoritics. The video was not falsified, and is hardly phony. What it shows is plausibly explained by the meteorite hypothesis. Many, perhaps most meteorite falls are not preceded by a significant fireball, and even fewer by acoustics of any sort. I don't hear many people saying there's a reasonable chance this could be a meteorite. I didn't even hear much of that early on. Only that nothing obviously excludes this from being a meteorite. That's a distinction well worth remembering. If this had been trivially rejected from the beginning, no analysis would have been performed, and that would be unfortunate. And that's getting real. Chris __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Fake Norway Rock
And sometimes it's hard to admit you were duped. Instead of taking an indefensible position, just admit you were hornswoggled into believing some ridiculous hype. A lot of seemingly intelligent people bought into this dumb story. Phil Whitmer Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Fake Norway Rock
Piper, Sorry, I call 'em like I see 'em. Really, you're offended by the word moron? I also think political correctness is moronic. Phil Whitmer Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum - Phil, At 20:41 10-4-2014, you wrote: Maybe to a moron. There is no excuse for language like this on the list. Everyone has a right to his own opinion, including those that are at variance with your own. If you can't stay civil, then stay away. If Art blows the whistle on you, then you deserve it. Piper __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Fake Norway Rock
Hi everyone. I've been a lurker here for some time. By way of introduction, I'm an astronomer with an interest in geology and meteorites. I have met a few of you in person and purchased meteorites for my small collection from some of you. I've also done some hunting here in southern New Mexico. I should probably just keep my keyboard shut, because when I start typing, trouble often follows. :-) But I have been reading this discussion about the Norway video from the beginning, and I feel compelled to support what Chris has said. As Chris said, there was nothing inherent in the video to make it appear to be a hoax. This is what made it interesting and what made it stand out from the hoaxes you see on Youtube. It was far too easy to simply dismiss it without investigating the circumstances and the people involved. Those who did dismiss it should not feel vindicated by the result, for they contributed nothing to it. In fact, the dismissals seen here of the video without first looking into its details were just as wrong as accepting everything on Youtube to be true. If you don't do the work before you come to a conclusion, then it matters not if you are being naive or cynical. If the truth is what you are interested in, there is only one way to know it; you have to do the hard work and investigation *before* coming to a conclusion. Now that others have done that work, and the true nature of the object has likely been exposed, it is not fair for some to claim that they knew all along it was a fake and to suggest that the people who made an effort to understand the video were somehow duped. That's just plain backwards. Greg -- Greg Crinklaw Astronomical Software Developer Cloudcroft, New Mexico skyhound.com __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Fake Norway Rock
Hi David, I stand by my conclusion. Anyone who looks at a video showing a pebble popping out of a parachute, then concludes it was a meteoroid in dark flight has been duped. Not necessarily by the video makers, but by their own lack of critical thinking, or their wishful desire for it to be real when it's obviously not. Or just by all the hype and groupthink. This kerfuffle has been debunked by one of the guys who was actually there. If anyone wants to believe that there is a chance it's real, it's no skin off my nose, people believe dumber stuff. It's a simple matter of considering the evidence, then drawing your own conclusion. The best evidence clearly supports the rock-in-the-chute theory by orders of magnitude over the meteoroid-in-dark-flight theory. Common sense. Anyone thinking clearly would have to go with this conclusion: http://norskmeteornettverk.no/wordpress/?p=1497 Phil Whitmer Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum --- Please Phil I think Chris' comment about plausibly explained by the meteorite hypothesis does not imply that he was being duped; quite the contrary. From: meteorite-list-boun...@meteoritecentral.com [meteorite-list-boun...@meteoritecentral.com] on behalf of Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum [dori...@embarqmail.com] Sent: Thursday, April 10, 2014 12:19 PM To: Meteorite list Subject: [meteorite-list] Fake Norway Rock And sometimes it's hard to admit you were duped. Instead of taking an indefensible position, just admit you were hornswoggled into believing some ridiculous hype. A lot of seemingly intelligent people bought into this dumb story. Phil Whitmer Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] New Canadian Meteorite
There is one more overlooked obvious answer I didn't cover in my treatise on Government agencies -- Worldnewsdailyreport.com where this article appeared is apparently a fusion of The National Enquirer and The Onion.com-- both known for stories on Bigfoot Alien hybrid babies, crop circles,Elvis reincarnate, Planet X and such. Whomever wrote the article knew a lot about the personalities involved and took the time to locate a good photo. It is funny, now. Elton On Thursday, April 10, 2014 2:09 AM, MEM mstrema...@yahoo.com wrote: I saw the photo, read the description and then the researcher's comments-- saw that NASA was involved and well and I couldn't help thinking of a moose turd variety meteorwrong. The fact that this photo isn't an actual photo of the find suggests that this isn't a hoax so much as a fireball observer pretending to be an expert in meteorites. It was recovered by physicians??? do tell. How and Why were they given fireball data that no one else was given? and who the heck were they? Wasn't there a case in recent memory where a NASA expert misidentified a meteorite er a piece of asphalt er a meteorite then laid claim to all the glory himself?(Rhetorical) NASA Meteoroid office does not disclose fireball data to the public against their charter but instead grabs whomever is not busy and heads off to do their own search. It takes 3-6 months to get a Freedom of Information Act (FOIA) accknowledged little alone answered. So here is yet another example of our tax money going to support elitist agencies and individuals excluding the public at large. Many may think NASA personnel must be all knowing experts on everything and, in their niche fields they are close to that. Outside their field, they probably know less about meteorite recovery than most novices on this list. I think I'll wait for the final final answer on the microbes. IF there were real live microbes then they would be in a level 4 containment. Well maybe not as there isn't much cross fertilization between the CDC and NASA. However there is a protocol and facility in place. That said, if we hear of zombies crossing the US Canadian Border I hope our current Administration doesn't just wave them through thinking they are more dead voters than we already have. Elton On Wednesday, April 9, 2014 10:40 AM, Gaetan Cormier shatterc...@gmail.com wrote: Well I was maybe excited for nothing.. this is probably a hoax. The photo they used to show the meteorite is also found in an article about antartic meteorites dated back in 2013: http://www.artsci.utoronto.ca/main/newsitems/ray-jayawardhana-antarctica Oh well Gaetan Cormier GC Meteorites: http://gcmeteorites.blogspot.com Member of the Impact Field Studies Group http://web.eps.utk.edu/~faculty/ifsg.htm 2014-04-09 10:11 GMT-04:00 Gaetan Cormier shatterc...@gmail.com: The fiereball that occured on the evening of March 18th @ 10:24pm over Ontario has produced meteorites as some was found with a surprise in it! http://worldnewsdailyreport.com/canada-extraterrestrial-lifeforms-discovered-in-meteorite-debris/ Gaetan Cormier GC Meteorites: http://gcmeteorites.blogspot.com Member of the Impact Field Studies Group http://web.eps.utk.edu/~faculty/ifsg.htm __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Fake Norway Rock
Agree a 1000% Sent from my iPhone On Apr 10, 2014, at 10:49 AM, Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum dori...@embarqmail.com wrote: What amazes me about this media stunt is the lack of skepticism from people who should know better. When I saw the video, my first thought was: this is as phony as a three-dollar bill. Anybody with even a lick of common sense should have instantly known this was totally bogus. No bolide, no sonic boom, no smoke trail, no electophonic sound, no recovered meteorite, nothing. There's nothing right about this. Just a video where a small rock pops out of a parachute right after its deployed. Who in their right mind would conclude that it was a meteoroid in dark flight? (Besides the dummy astronomer and physicist.) Even now people are still saying: well there's a reasonable chance it could be real. Yeah right! About the same chance as me winning 10 Olympic gold medals, winning the lottery 10 times in a row, getting elected to the US Senate after being knighted by the Queen of England and then marrying Scarlett Johansson. Get Real, Phil Whitmer Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] New Canadian Meteorite
I saw the photo, read the description and then the researcher's comments-- saw that NASA was involved and well and I couldn't help thinking of a moose turd variety meteorwrong. The fact that this photo isn't an actual photo of the find suggests that this isn't a hoax so much as a fireball observer pretending to be an expert in meteorites. It was recovered by physicians??? do tell. How and Why were they given fireball data that no one else was given? and who the heck were they? Wasn't there a case in recent memory where a NASA expert misidentified a meteorite er a piece of asphalt er a meteorite then laid claim to all the glory himself?(Rhetorical) NASA Meteoroid office does not disclose fireball data to the public against their charter but instead grabs whomever is not busy and heads off to do their own search. It takes 3-6 months to get a Freedom of Information Act (FOIA) accknowledged little alone answered. So here is yet another example of our tax money going to support elitist agencies and individuals excluding the public at large. Many may think NASA personnel must be all knowing experts on everything and, in their niche fields they are close to that. Outside their field, they probably know less about meteorite recovery than most novices on this list. I think I'll wait for the final final answer on the microbes. IF there were real live microbes then they would be in a level 4 containment. Well maybe not as there isn't much cross fertilization between the CDC and NASA. However there is a protocol and facility in place. That said, if we hear of zombies crossing the US Canadian Border I hope our current Administration doesn't just wave them through thinking they are more dead voters than we already have. Elton On Wednesday, April 9, 2014 10:40 AM, Gaetan Cormier shatterc...@gmail.com wrote: Well I was maybe excited for nothing.. this is probably a hoax. The photo they used to show the meteorite is also found in an article about antartic meteorites dated back in 2013: http://www.artsci.utoronto.ca/main/newsitems/ray-jayawardhana-antarctica Oh well Gaetan Cormier GC Meteorites: http://gcmeteorites.blogspot.com Member of the Impact Field Studies Group http://web.eps.utk.edu/~faculty/ifsg.htm 2014-04-09 10:11 GMT-04:00 Gaetan Cormier shatterc...@gmail.com: The fiereball that occured on the evening of March 18th @ 10:24pm over Ontario has produced meteorites as some was found with a surprise in it! http://worldnewsdailyreport.com/canada-extraterrestrial-lifeforms-discovered-in-meteorite-debris/ Gaetan Cormier GC Meteorites: http://gcmeteorites.blogspot.com Member of the Impact Field Studies Group http://web.eps.utk.edu/~faculty/ifsg.htm __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Fake Norway Rock
If it had been made public from day one before they built websites and made videos and spent nearly 2 years building the hype for max news publicity and promotion it would hAve been more believable. I find this entire thing ridiculous. I saw a video of some lights shining down of deer the other day, news was viral, I doubt it was aliens but hasn't been disproven either:) It seems to me that some people are invested in this story and will never admit that it is just a pebble from the chute packing. Michael Farmer Sent from my iPhone On Apr 10, 2014, at 11:27 AM, Chris Peterson c...@alumni.caltech.edu wrote: Then you need to tune up your analysis skills. And your knowledge of meteoritics. The video was not falsified, and is hardly phony. What it shows is plausibly explained by the meteorite hypothesis. Many, perhaps most meteorite falls are not preceded by a significant fireball, and even fewer by acoustics of any sort. I don't hear many people saying there's a reasonable chance this could be a meteorite. I didn't even hear much of that early on. Only that nothing obviously excludes this from being a meteorite. That's a distinction well worth remembering. If this had been trivially rejected from the beginning, no analysis would have been performed, and that would be unfortunate. And that's getting real. Chris *** Chris L Peterson Cloudbait Observatory http://www.cloudbait.com On 4/10/2014 11:49 AM, Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum wrote: What amazes me about this media stunt is the lack of skepticism from people who should know better. When I saw the video, my first thought was: this is as phony as a three-dollar bill. Anybody with even a lick of common sense should have instantly known this was totally bogus. No bolide, no sonic boom, no smoke trail, no electophonic sound, no recovered meteorite, nothing. There's nothing right about this. Just a video where a small rock pops out of a parachute right after its deployed. Who in their right mind would conclude that it was a meteoroid in dark flight? (Besides the dummy astronomer and physicist.) Even now people are still saying: well there's a reasonable chance it could be real. Yeah right! About the same chance as me winning 10 Olympic gold medals, winning the lottery 10 times in a row, getting elected to the US Senate after being knighted by the Queen of England and then marrying Scarlett Johansson. Get Real, Phil Whitmer __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Shamans and meteorites Anthony Bourdain
At least these look to be genuine campos? But so is all the spit. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-iwlkEXIJ8o Paul G __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Shamans and meteorites Anthony Bourdain
Hello Listers Well I am always surrounded by meteorites everyday so my negative energy should be gone :) I wonder what will happen if no day I am away from them for long periods of time, I might get sick and have meteorite withdrawal symptoms LOL :) I wont let that happen :) Shawn Alan IMCA 1633 ebay store http://www.ebay.com/sch/imca1633nyc/m.html Meteoritefalls.com __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Fake Norway rock
Can you imagine what that meteorite would be worth if all this was real! It would certainly go down in the history books. BTW, how come NASA has to debunk it? When did they become WASA??? Jim On 4/10/2014 11:17 AM, Shawn Alan wrote: All I have to say is if you collect meteorite wrongs, if someone can find the pebble that was in the video, you will have a cool meteorite wrong to add to your collection. Shawn Alan IMCA 1633 ebay store http://www.ebay.com/sch/imca1633nyc/m.html Meteoritefalls.com __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list - No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2014.0.4355 / Virus Database: 3882/7327 - Release Date: 04/10/14 -- Jim Wooddell jim.woodd...@suddenlink.net http://pages.suddenlink.net/chondrule/ __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Fake Norway Rock
On 4/10/2014 2:15 PM, Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum wrote: I stand by my conclusion. Anyone who looks at a video showing a pebble popping out of a parachute, then concludes it was a meteoroid in dark flight has been duped. Nobody has made such a conclusion, at least not posted to this forum. For that matter, if you listen carefully, none of the scientists or parachutists involved with the original investigation made such a conclusion either. We all knew it was highly unlikely right from the start. You surely are't alone in that. There seems to be a cultural divide at work here. People love absolutes, but there are few if any absolutes in the real world. Recognizing the possibility exists, however vanishingly small, that this was a meteorite, is how a scientist is trained to report things. That's all Chris was doing. It is an important part of being intellectually honest. The chance may be one in a billion, but that's not the same as zero. The evidence does not yet completely rule out that this rock was a meteorite. Please consider that stating this fact is not the same thing as believing that the rock was a meteorite after all, nor even that there is more than the tiniest chance that it is. Greg -- Greg Crinklaw Astronomical Software Developer Cloudcroft, New Mexico skyhound.com __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Fake Norway Rock
How am I gullible? From the very beginning I said this was probably not a meteorite. That's still what I say, but now I'm even more confident, given that people familiar with skydiving have provided a reasonable scenario for how a rock could be packed with a parachute. I still accept the possibility of a meteorite for the simple reason that nobody familiar with videography, meteoritics, or the physics of bodies falling in the atmosphere has provided any evidence against that hypothesis. Here's the reality: at this point, we have no certain answer. We have at least three hypotheses: (1) a meteorite in dark flight; (2) a rock accidentally packed with a parachute; (3) a deliberate hoax. While some people might like #3, I see nothing in the demeanor of any of those involved to suggest any such thing, and certainly their ready willingness to accept a prosaic solution argues against a hoax. That leaves #1 and #2. The physical evidence is equally good for either. So the best we can do is ask which is more probable, and that is #2 by a large margin. So a reasonable person will accept that as being the likely explanation. But sometimes, the most likely explanation turns out to be wrong. So only a fool would entirely dismiss #1 given the evidence currently available. I can't help but notice that the people on this list who are trained, professional scientists are the ones who understand this critical distinction between possible and probable; who understand the difference between disproving an theory and simply finding a much better one. Frankly, I think we're the ones with the best tuned BS filters. Chris *** Chris L Peterson Cloudbait Observatory http://www.cloudbait.com On 4/10/2014 12:41 PM, Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum wrote: Chris, You need to install and tune up a bullshit detector. You seem awfully gullible. Plausibly explained by the meteorite hypothesis? Maybe to a moron. Phil Whitmer __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Met Bulletin Update - Blackhawk Mountain, NWA 8341 (EL6), Antarctic Lunar
Hi Bulletin Watchers, There are 3 new approvals. First, congrats to Michael Mulgrew for his find Blackhawk Mountain (H4). There is also an EL6 from NWA and a new lunar from the Antarctic. Link - http://www.lpi.usra.edu/meteor/metbull.php?sea=sfor=namesants=falls=valids=stype=containslrec=50map=gebrowse=country=Allsrt=namecateg=Allmblist=Allrect=phot=snew=2pnt=Normal%20tabledr=page=0 Best regards and happy huntings, MikeG -- - Web - http://www.galactic-stone.com Facebook - http://www.facebook.com/galacticstone Twitter - http://twitter.com/galacticstone Pinterest - http://pinterest.com/galacticstone - __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Met Bulletin Update - Blackhawk Mountain, NWA 8341 (EL6), Antarctic Lunar
Thanks, Mike! For those interested, I have a web page highlighting the thousand+ man-miles put in hunting a most unique geologic feature for that find: http://mikestang.com/blackhawk.htm Anyone in Iran had a look on the Saidmarreh landslide? http://geology.com/landslides/saidmarreh-landslide.shtml :) Michael in so. Cal. On Thu, Apr 10, 2014 at 8:11 PM, Galactic Stone Ironworks meteoritem...@gmail.com wrote: Hi Bulletin Watchers, There are 3 new approvals. First, congrats to Michael Mulgrew for his find Blackhawk Mountain (H4). There is also an EL6 from NWA and a new lunar from the Antarctic. Link - http://www.lpi.usra.edu/meteor/metbull.php?sea=sfor=namesants=falls=valids=stype=containslrec=50map=gebrowse=country=Allsrt=namecateg=Allmblist=Allrect=phot=snew=2pnt=Normal%20tabledr=page=0 Best regards and happy huntings, MikeG -- - Web - http://www.galactic-stone.com Facebook - http://www.facebook.com/galacticstone Twitter - http://twitter.com/galacticstone Pinterest - http://pinterest.com/galacticstone - __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Fake Norway Rock
A quick question about this; sorry if this has been discussed before. I looked at many videos and a few closeups of the rock. I failed to see a fusion crust. Wouldn't there be a fresh one if it had just entered the atmosphere ? Granted, there may be several explanations for this but I was just wondering. Andre __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
