[meteorite-list] Gravitational Waves or Just Space Dust?
Yet another rush for publicity before you get debunked: http://www.theguardian.com/science/2014/jun/04/gravitational-wave-discovery-dust-big-bang-inflation Gravitational waves turn to dust after claims of flawed analysis Astronomers who thought they had detected echoes of the big bang may have only seen the effects of space dust It was hailed as one of the most important scientific discoveries of the century, the birth of a new era in physics and a shoo-in for a Nobel prize. The claim from Harvard University that it had discovered gravitational waves - and thereby evidence for the theory of cosmic inflation and the existence of a multiverse - caused a worldwide sensation in March. But the celebrations are now looking decidedly premature. Rather than securing a trip to Stockholm to receive a Nobel medal, the Harvard team may have detected nothing more than space dust. Writing in the journal Nature on Wednesday, Paul Steinhardt, director of the Centre for Theoretical Physics at Princeton University, argues that the Harvard team made an unfortunate blunder in its calculations. Serious flaws in the analysis have been revealed that transform the sure detection into no detection, he writes. Cosmologists working on Harvard's Bicep2 (Background Imaging of Cosmic Extragalactic Polarization) telescope at the south pole unveiled their surprise discovery at a press conference at Harvard, before they had published their results in a peer-reviewed journal. The purpose of independent vetting by peer reviewers is to catch flawed studies before they become part of the scientific literature. Phil Whitmer Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://three.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Fake Norway Rock
What amazes me about this media stunt is the lack of skepticism from people who should know better. When I saw the video, my first thought was: this is as phony as a three-dollar bill. Anybody with even a lick of common sense should have instantly known this was totally bogus. No bolide, no sonic boom, no smoke trail, no electophonic sound, no recovered meteorite, nothing. There's nothing right about this. Just a video where a small rock pops out of a parachute right after its deployed. Who in their right mind would conclude that it was a meteoroid in dark flight? (Besides the dummy astronomer and physicist.) Even now people are still saying: well there's a reasonable chance it could be real. Yeah right! About the same chance as me winning 10 Olympic gold medals, winning the lottery 10 times in a row, getting elected to the US Senate after being knighted by the Queen of England and then marrying Scarlett Johansson. Get Real, Phil Whitmer Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Fake Norway Rock
Chris, You need to install and tune up a bullshit detector. You seem awfully gullible. Plausibly explained by the meteorite hypothesis? Maybe to a moron. Phil Whitmer Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum Then you need to tune up your analysis skills. And your knowledge of meteoritics. The video was not falsified, and is hardly phony. What it shows is plausibly explained by the meteorite hypothesis. Many, perhaps most meteorite falls are not preceded by a significant fireball, and even fewer by acoustics of any sort. I don't hear many people saying there's a reasonable chance this could be a meteorite. I didn't even hear much of that early on. Only that nothing obviously excludes this from being a meteorite. That's a distinction well worth remembering. If this had been trivially rejected from the beginning, no analysis would have been performed, and that would be unfortunate. And that's getting real. Chris __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Fake Norway Rock
And sometimes it's hard to admit you were duped. Instead of taking an indefensible position, just admit you were hornswoggled into believing some ridiculous hype. A lot of seemingly intelligent people bought into this dumb story. Phil Whitmer Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Fake Norway Rock
Piper, Sorry, I call 'em like I see 'em. Really, you're offended by the word moron? I also think political correctness is moronic. Phil Whitmer Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum - Phil, At 20:41 10-4-2014, you wrote: Maybe to a moron. There is no excuse for language like this on the list. Everyone has a right to his own opinion, including those that are at variance with your own. If you can't stay civil, then stay away. If Art blows the whistle on you, then you deserve it. Piper __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Fake Norway Rock
Hi David, I stand by my conclusion. Anyone who looks at a video showing a pebble popping out of a parachute, then concludes it was a meteoroid in dark flight has been duped. Not necessarily by the video makers, but by their own lack of critical thinking, or their wishful desire for it to be real when it's obviously not. Or just by all the hype and groupthink. This kerfuffle has been debunked by one of the guys who was actually there. If anyone wants to believe that there is a chance it's real, it's no skin off my nose, people believe dumber stuff. It's a simple matter of considering the evidence, then drawing your own conclusion. The best evidence clearly supports the rock-in-the-chute theory by orders of magnitude over the meteoroid-in-dark-flight theory. Common sense. Anyone thinking clearly would have to go with this conclusion: http://norskmeteornettverk.no/wordpress/?p=1497 Phil Whitmer Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum --- Please Phil I think Chris' comment about plausibly explained by the meteorite hypothesis does not imply that he was being duped; quite the contrary. From: meteorite-list-boun...@meteoritecentral.com [meteorite-list-boun...@meteoritecentral.com] on behalf of Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum [dori...@embarqmail.com] Sent: Thursday, April 10, 2014 12:19 PM To: Meteorite list Subject: [meteorite-list] Fake Norway Rock And sometimes it's hard to admit you were duped. Instead of taking an indefensible position, just admit you were hornswoggled into believing some ridiculous hype. A lot of seemingly intelligent people bought into this dumb story. Phil Whitmer Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] 5,000+ Year Old Egyptian Iron Meteorite Beads
An interesting discovery: http://www.csmonitor.com/Science/2013/0820/Out-of-this-world-Ancient-Egyptians-wore-meteorite-jewelry Phil Whitmer Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Carl Agee and Black Beauty CNN Article
Interesting write-up: http://www.cnn.com/2013/11/20/tech/innovation/mars-meteorite/ Phil Whitmer Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Possible Tektite
Someone brought this into the museum for an ID. It looks sort of like a tektite. It doesn't really look like any slag glass that I've seen. No find location was given. Any tektite experts have an opinion? http://i185.photobucket.com/albums/x177/cyphor79/June2011/2013-10-27008_zps03ffc3d1.jpg http://i185.photobucket.com/albums/x177/cyphor79/June2011/2013-10-27007_zps7cb05a26.jpg http://i185.photobucket.com/albums/x177/cyphor79/June2011/2013-10-27006_zps750db031.jpg http://i185.photobucket.com/albums/x177/cyphor79/June2011/2013-10-27005_zps5cded8cd.jpg http://i185.photobucket.com/albums/x177/cyphor79/June2011/2013-10-27004_zps07aa10ea.jpg http://i185.photobucket.com/albums/x177/cyphor79/June2011/2013-10-27002_zps10c0ab1c.jpg http://i185.photobucket.com/albums/x177/cyphor79/June2011/2013-10-27001_zpsa797a7da.jpg Phil Whitmer Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Possible Tektite Is Cryptocrystalline Quartz
Thanks everyone for the input. Cryptocrystalline quartz it is! Phil Whitmer Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] OT NASA websites taken down for Government shutdown
Adam: This country was founded on hard work all right. The hard work of SLAVES! That and the Genocide of Native Americans. Phil Whitmer Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum Bernie Madoff was very popular when he was telling fibs that people liked to hear and look what happened to his investors. Hitler had the people behind him at one time and look what happened. This is not about who wins. We all lose in this case. There is nobody at the helm. You could say that the socialists lost congress. This does not mean a win for the American people. We all lose when candidates lie to the citizens they are suppose serve. Obama promised that individuals would save an average of $2,500.00/year on their health insurance and many bought into this pure B.S. I do not call a $6,000.00+/year increase a win for anybody! Green Energy, What? It sounded good to prospective voters at the time. Promise kids candy and carnival rides instead of broccoli, which is good for you, and you will get their vote! Tell people what they want to hear and you can garner a lot of support until reality sets in. This country was founded on hard work, not lies! In the end, these massive increases in cost will be passed onto collectors if they can spare anything after being fleeced out of every last dime in taxes. Adam __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Indianapolis Meteor
Lots of reports are coming in. A big green fireball spotted just after 7:00 am moving west to east. No reports of sonic booms yet. My cousin saw it. https://www.facebook.com/WSBTNews?ref=streamhc_location=stream https://www.facebook.com/?ref=tn_tnmn#!/TomSkilling Phil Whitmer Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] *AD* A Nice Odessa and Gibeon For Sale, Reduced Prices!
I lowered the prices on the Gibeon and Odessa I have on eBay. Thanks! http://www.ebay.com/itm/331030261358?ssPageName=STRK:MESELX:IT_trksid=p3984.m1555.l2649 http://www.ebay.com/itm/331030259937?ssPageName=STRK:MESELX:IT_trksid=p3984.m1555.l2649 Phil Whitmer Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Alcohol + water + NaOH
Francesco: Do you mean sodium nitrate (NaNO3)? While we're on the topic, which solution of nitric acid works best for making nitol? The purest I can find seems to be 67.2%. What would be the ratio of alcohol added to make nitol? Phil Whitmer Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum Hello, I have a roughly cutted Muonionalusta slice to make beatiful. I will grind, polishing and etching it ... and after for prevent rust and stabilize it I'm planning to use the method alcohol + water + NaOH . But I have few question: Ethanol at 96% works fine? I have to use distilled water or normal water? For 100ml of solution I have to use 70ml of ethanol and 30ml of water, is this proportion correct? How many grams (or spoons) of NaOh I have to use? How many days I have to leave the slice in the solution? 7-10 days? In this period I have to change the solution or the first potion works fine for all these days? And after? What I have to do? I have to wash it with ethanol and after dry up in oven, 80°C? After could I also put some rust prevent varnish? Any other tip are welcomed!!! Thanks a lot!!! Francesco! __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] New Molecular Species Found In Sutter's Mill Meteorite
Abstract here: http://www.pnas.org/gca?allch=submit=Gogca=pnas%3B1309113110v1 Phil Whitmer Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] *AD* A Nice Odessa and Gibeon For Sale
I have a nice big Gibeon and an Odessa for sale on eBay. http://www.ebay.com/itm/331020799158?ssPageName=STRK:MESELX:IT_trksid=p3984.m1555.l2649 http://www.ebay.com/itm/331020789004?ssPageName=STRK:MESELX:IT_trksid=p3984.m1555.l2649 Thanks, Phil Whitmer Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Alabama Fire Ball and Sonic Boom
They're saying it disintegrated over Woodstock AL. http://www.accuweather.com/en/weather-news/fireball-dazzles-concertgoers/17623136 Phil Whitmer Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Test
test __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Campo Del Cielo With Tail AD
I have an unusual Campo with a tail on eBay. It looks oriented but has no flow lines on the bottom. http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemitem=281146159278 Thanks, Phil Whitmer Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Ugandan sues U.S. over meteorite
So you're saying a half-million a gram is too much for Mbale? All sales of Mbale are hereby suspendedyada yada yada! Phil Whitmer Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum - Original Message - From: Galactic Stone Ironworks meteoritem...@gmail.com To: Tom Randall tommy2...@hvc.rr.com Cc: Meteorite list meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Thursday, April 18, 2013 4:38 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Ugandan sues U.S. over meteorite Billions or trillions of dollars for a chunk of Mbale? Somebody is smoking something. Best regards, MikeG -- - Web - http://www.galactic-stone.com Facebook - http://www.facebook.com/galacticstone Twitter - http://twitter.com/GalacticStone Pinterest - http://pinterest.com/galacticstone RSS - http://www.galactic-stone.com/rss/126516 - On 4/18/13, Tom Randall tommy2...@hvc.rr.com wrote: http://bit.ly/12qrXT9 Regards! Tom __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] AD: Nice 1050 Gram Las Palmas New Campo With Hole
A beautiful iron! http://www.ebay.com/itm/310644043367?ssPageName=STRK:MESELX:IT_trksid=p3984.m1555.l2649 Thanks, Phil Whitmer Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Chelyabinsk - Not Hammers
I can't hammer home the importance of hammering out an agreement on this hammer issue. We don't need to fight hammer and tongs over it every time it comes up! It's true that when a hammerstone comes under the hammer, it usually brings more money. And hammerheads will lie about if it hit something. But must we really yammer on endlessly about what actually constitutes a hammer? It makes you want to go to the bar and get really hammered. Phil Whitmer Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum - Original Message - From: Michael Blood mlbl...@cox.net To: Met. Peter Scherff petersche...@rcn.com; Met. Anne Black impact...@aol.com; delle...@aon.at; Meteorite List meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Saturday, March 30, 2013 4:11 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Chelyabinsk - Not Hammers Goethe: Politician, writer, philosopher - NOT a meteoriticist. On 3/30/13 1:02 PM, Met. Peter Scherff petersche...@rcn.com wrote: Hi, According to world renowned meteoriticist, Goethe You must be Anvil or Hammer. Therefore all meteorites are hammer stones. Thank you Goethe for finally clearing up this long standing dilemma. I know that I will be able to sleep better tonight now that this has been settled. Thanks, Peter -Original Message- From: meteorite-list-boun...@meteoritecentral.com [mailto:meteorite-list-boun...@meteoritecentral.com] On Behalf Of Michael Blood Sent: Saturday, March 30, 2013 3:46 PM To: Met. Anne Black; delle...@aon.at; Meteorite List Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Chelyabinsk - Not Hammers Hi Anne, However..the topic was hammer stones. He stated ALL meteorites are hammer stones. That was the statement - Not that all meteorites are meteorites. Michael On 3/30/13 12:28 PM, Met. Anne Black impact...@aol.com wrote: It is Reality Michael! If they had not struck Earth, they would be Meteors not Meteorites. Anne M. Black www.IMPACTIKA.com impact...@aol.com -Original Message- From: Michael Blood mlbl...@cox.net To: dellenit delle...@aon.at; Meteorite List meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Sat, Mar 30, 2013 1:18 pm Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Chelyabinsk - Hammers for sure. It is interesting to see someone so totally Convinced their perspective constitutes reality. Michael On 3/30/13 11:51 AM, delle...@aon.at delle...@aon.at wrote: so what, every meteorite is a hammer stone ! it struck planet earth d.u. __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Chelyabinsk at White House today
And of course, the name of the Great Star was Wormwood: 1. ...and the stars in the sky fell to earth, as late figs drop from a fig tree by a strong wind. (Revelation 6:13) 2. ...and a great star, blazing like a torch, fell from the sky... (Revelation 8:10) 3. From the sky huge hailstones of about a hundred pounds each fell upon men. (Revelation 16:21) 4. ...and something like a huge mountain, all ablaze, was thrown into the sea. (Revelation 8:8) 5. The fifth angel sounded his trumpet, and I saw a star that had fallen from the sky to the earth. (Revelation 9:1) 6. ...the stars will fall from the sky, and the heavenly bodies will be shaken. (Matthew 24:29) 7. ...the Lord hurled large hailstones down on them from the sky... (Joshua 10:11) 8. His tail swept a third of the stars out of the sky and flung them to earth. (Revelation 12:4) 9. Then a mighty angel picked up a boulder the size of a large millstone and threw it into the sea... (Revelation 18:21) 10. ...the stars will fall from the sky, and the heavenly bodies will be shaken. (Mark 13:25) 11. While you were watching, a rock was cut out, but not by human hands. It struck the statue on its feet of iron and clay and smashed them. (Daniel 2:34) 12. Then the LORD rained upon Sodom and upon Gomorrah brimstone and fire from the LORD out of heaven... (Genesis 19:24) Phil Whitmer Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum - Original Message - From: Martin Altmann altm...@meteorite-martin.de To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Tuesday, March 26, 2013 9:25 AM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Chelyabinsk at White House today They are mentioned in the bible: Acts 19,35: (Paul in Ephesus) And when the town clerk had quieted the crowd, he said, Men of Ephesus, who is there who does not know that the city of the Ephesians is temple keeper of the great Artemis, and of the sacred stone that fell from the sky? Amen Martin -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: meteorite-list-boun...@meteoritecentral.com [mailto:meteorite-list-boun...@meteoritecentral.com] Im Auftrag von Michael Farmer Yeah, sort of like congress is not a fan of science and education. Half of them don't believe in meteorites because it doesn't mention them in the bible. Michael Farmer Sent from my iPhone O __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] A Bunch of Irregular Stones I Found (+How I Think They May Have Originated)
Dude: Your rambling verbosity is revealing your ignorance. It's a piece of slag, OK? Move on, you're boring the crap out of me. Phil Whitmer Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum - Original Message - From: Peter Richards pedricha...@gmail.com To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Saturday, March 23, 2013 1:23 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] A Bunch of Irregular Stones I Found (+How I Think They May Have Originated) Mike G (Galactic Stone Ironworks) said: I've had dozens of people get pissy or go ballistic when told their slag is not a meteorite. Some people just don't want to hear bad news and they shoot the messenger I am saying, Mike, apparently, attitudes like yours are those that predominate. The result I think is to discourage what Graham Ensor says is desired. ie. new blood, and facilitate the maintenance of an old boys club, as they say. For what its worth, I think the cultural problems I've alleged exist are rather pervasive throughout the scientific, academics communities, as well as society at large, so it's not only here. Such and attitude is seemingly so prevalent, and domineering, that even when I raise some valid points about precision in language, and a failure to verbalize the ingenious workings of the brain, rather than back something up with one's experience, and past accomplishments, or social position many people continue to prove me right. If you are going to accuse something of being slag or clinkers, I would think it might be common courtesy to, also, explain why your brain had deduced this. Likewise, what are the features most uncharacteristic of meteorites that would lead one to believe the chance is small that they could be, or that it is not worth exploring? would be another appropriate topic, according to my opinion. John (Pict at Pict.co.uk) said: However if you required a qualitative exposition of the reasoning, would it not have been a better strategy to politely ask for it, rather than be such a boor? My entire point is that the language was an attempt to disqualify any asking for exposition of reasoning. I think it's rather clear that the language I was lamenting the use of suggested this. That is my opinion. Again, not many have explained why my take was daft there, but there have been some me toos, harumphs etc. to the effect that it was, indeed. Again, I don't see the rationale. These are admittedly strange objects. I haven't maintained they are definitely meteorites, yet I have maintained that they should be given a fair take. Easter egg syndrome, as Adam Hupe has written, consists in believing meteorites are found easily, which I haven't maintained. I said I believe that if a community wanted to be actually scientific, and not only apparently so, they would not base their judgements on things like that was too easy, or the chances are too low, alone! Finally, what I have learned is to make an attempt to be more to-the-point while asking anything in a forum, and to verbalize my thought processes. So, you have 1. the folded back, apparently peeled layer, which might have been heat modified. It is thick, maybe around 1mm, which I've read is unusually large for a fusion crust, but is seemingly within the bounds of reason. 2. The cliff-like sides on another of the objects. 3. A frothy smooth surface on another side. 4. (something I had forgotten about, yesterday, until after these exchanges) What appear to be surfaces which have perhaps uncannily corresponding surfaces, and shapes at large. That is to say the overall dimensions are similar, and specific surfaces have features which are mirrored almost as a casting and a mould, although, of course, these are much more imperfect than that description. What I can say about this is that it's not pseudo-science. It may not provide absolute proof, but it is a method derived from logic, ie. if these were meteorites they would, before ablating, have been of one piece, and therefore it is likely that some of the features remain from the irregular fracturing, which could be compared, in a metaphorical sense, to a fingerprint. Here is a set in which I attempt to depict what I have observed while considering the aforementioned possibility (note: all my photos in this photostream depict nothing more than stones, my hand holding them, and ordinary objects in the background, fyi): http://www.flickr.com/photos/67498324@N08/8582349428/in/photostream (showing surfaces with corresponding features separated) http://www.flickr.com/photos/67498324@N08/8581248239/in/photostream/ (showing those masses aligned as they theoretically would have been before fracturing) Basically, what I am looking for is described by an old cliche, and, in my defence, it would have been closed-minded of me not to consider, and make an attempt to explain, why closed-mindedness seems to be at work. Peter Richards __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] A Bunch of Irregular Stones I Found
- Original Message - From: Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum dori...@embarqmail.com To: Peter Richards pedricha...@gmail.com Sent: Saturday, March 23, 2013 1:54 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] A Bunch of Irregular Stones I Found (+How I Think They May Have Originated) Peter, You obviously don't know the first thing about meteorites. You haven't done enough homework to post on this List. Please stop wasting people's time with your slag and bad attitude. Phil Whitmer Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum - Original Message - From: Peter Richards pedricha...@gmail.com To: Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum dori...@embarqmail.com Sent: Saturday, March 23, 2013 1:48 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] A Bunch of Irregular Stones I Found (+How I Think They May Have Originated) Thanks for your opinion Phil, and thank you for further proving my point, which is that people with short attention spans shouldn't be acting like their snap-judgements represent ultimate truth. Peter On Sat, Mar 23, 2013 at 12:43 PM, Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum dori...@embarqmail.com wrote: Dude: Your rambling verbosity is revealing your ignorance. It's a piece of slag, OK? Move on, you're boring the crap out of me. Phil Whitmer Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum - Original Message - From: Peter Richards pedricha...@gmail.com To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Saturday, March 23, 2013 1:23 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] A Bunch of Irregular Stones I Found (+How I Think They May Have Originated) __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] A Bunch of Irregular Stones I Found (+How I Think They May Have Originated)
Meteoritical Delusional Disorder - Original Message - From: bill kies parkforest...@hotmail.com To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Saturday, March 23, 2013 4:18 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] A Bunch of Irregular Stones I Found (+How I Think They May Have Originated) Another case of meteorite psychosis. Date: Sat, 23 Mar 2013 14:47:09 -0500 From: pedricha...@gmail.com To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] A Bunch of Irregular Stones I Found (+How I Think They May Have Originated) Frank, I thought I had read of a scenario which seemed plausible wherein a fusions crust, in the process of flaking off, in a chunk as is known to happen, if I am not mistaken, separated partially, was blown back, yet didn't fully separate before everything cooled off. I would be interested to see a picture of slag in which the surface has been modified by mechanical means similarly as to what is seen in the object I've shared, sooner, or later, if it takes a while. Peter Richards P.S. Graham, regarding your most recent post: You may have been courteous, but you clearly weren't especially courteous, since you failed to make the effort of explaining, in any depth, as if I may be a person of some intelligence, how you reached your conclusion. That would have been helpful. So it doesn't make a lot of sense to be calling yourself courteous, from my perspective. Telling me to research meteorwrongs, slag, and clinkers, does not explain what it is I will see when I search for these words that will help me see the light, although you claim to have noticed something specifically leading you to that conclusion. You don't have to do this, but I wouldn't claim to have contributed much, if I didn't. Also, you definitely weren't slagged off, considering I criticized a process specifically, and not a person, or decision, generally. __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] A Bunch of Irregular Stones I Found (+How I Think They May Have Originated)
The delusion is when some dumb newbie finds a worthless chunk of slag and thinks it's a meteorite. When some of the most knowledgeable meteorite people in the Solar System tell him it's not, he still clings to his stupid belief. Phil Whitmer - Original Message - From: Peter Richards pedricha...@gmail.com To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Saturday, March 23, 2013 4:54 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] A Bunch of Irregular Stones I Found (+How I Think They May Have Originated) Re: Bill Kies: meteorite psychosis, Phil Witmer: meteoritical delusional disorder. Look at how ridiculous this is. Make a comment with substance, please, Bill or Phil. A delusion is a false belief. What is the delusion, exactly? That expertise is not necessarily what experts claim it to be? Has it not been revealed how shallow this expertise is, in many cases, by the very fact that arguments with no more substantation than that based on one's expertise itself are being made? That's a self fulfilling prophecy: You're an expert because your expertise has demonstrated it. You have expertise because you're an expert. Just because you've found a meteorite, many, studied them, or gotten a degree in the profession, it does not mean you can not act fraudulently. As I've stated before, it's something so obvious that stating it is bordering on the absurd, but there it is. Peter Richards __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Possible Meteorwrong
I was sent these pictures of a possible meteorite find in southern Indiana.It's hard to tell from the blurry pictures, but it looks like iron oxide. A geologist told them it was a meteorite because it attracts a magnet and has chondrule like formations. I was told it had flakes of metal but I couldn't see them in the photos. Any ideas? There's another guy in southern Indiana who believes he found another piece of Harrison County, an L6 that fell in 1859. Wouldn't that be pretty much eroded away by now, even if it was shocked like NWA 869? Phil Whitmer Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum http://i1183.photobucket.com/albums/x466/joshuatree/August2011/IMG_7772_zps0513c6f7.jpg http://i1183.photobucket.com/albums/x466/joshuatree/August2011/IMG_7773_zpscc998a29.jpg http://i1183.photobucket.com/albums/x466/joshuatree/August2011/0306131740_zpsf7a483e5.jpg http://i1183.photobucket.com/albums/x466/joshuatree/August2011/0306131658a_zps18bf6b36.jpg __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Possible Meteorwrong
Dave, That's good to know. I figured a meteorite would weather faster than that in Indiana's wet climate with cold winters. Phil Whitmer Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum - Original Message - From: Dave Myers To: Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum Sent: Saturday, March 16, 2013 1:47 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Possible Meteorwrong Hi Phil, it was confirmed by Ted Bunch that my two stones found in Butler county ohio are meteorites, L-6, W-3,S-2 and he said they fell thousands of years ago. So they do not weather away as fast as people think. He said to do an exact age would cost to much. This Indiana stone does look like it could be a meteorite. The out side surface of this stone does not look like my two stones though. The out side of mine is weathered yellow brown and weathered about a quarter inch deep into the larger stones surface. dave From: Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum dori...@embarqmail.com To: meteorite list meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Saturday, March 16, 2013 12:38 PM Subject: [meteorite-list] Possible Meteorwrong I was sent these pictures of a possible meteorite find in southern Indiana.It's hard to tell from the blurry pictures, but it looks like iron oxide. A geologist told them it was a meteorite because it attracts a magnet and has chondrule like formations. I was told it had flakes of metal but I couldn't see them in the photos. Any ideas? There's another guy in southern Indiana who believes he found another piece of Harrison County, an L6 that fell in 1859. Wouldn't that be pretty much eroded away by now, even if it was shocked like NWA 869? Phil Whitmer Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum http://i1183.photobucket.com/albums/x466/joshuatree/August2011/IMG_7772_zps0513c6f7.jpg http://i1183.photobucket.com/albums/x466/joshuatree/August2011/IMG_7773_zpscc998a29.jpg http://i1183.photobucket.com/albums/x466/joshuatree/August2011/0306131740_zpsf7a483e5.jpg http://i1183.photobucket.com/albums/x466/joshuatree/August2011/0306131658a_zps18bf6b36.jpg __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com/ Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Possible Meteorwrong
Elton, I told him about the 20% donation and lab fees to have it classified. The rock weighs about 2.5 lbs. It's already passed some preliminary testing at a geology lab. Hopefully it's Indiana's 13th meteorite. Phil Whitmer Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum - Original Message - From: MEM To: Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum Sent: Saturday, March 16, 2013 12:50 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Possible Meteorwrong LOOKS LIKE ONE ENOUGH FOR a LAB to look at Elton From: Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum dori...@embarqmail.com To: meteorite list meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Saturday, March 16, 2013 12:38 PM Subject: [meteorite-list] Possible Meteorwrong I was sent these pictures of a possible meteorite find in southern Indiana.It's hard to tell from the blurry pictures, but it looks like iron oxide. A geologist told them it was a meteorite because it attracts a magnet and has chondrule like formations. I was told it had flakes of metal but I couldn't see them in the photos. Any ideas? There's another guy in southern Indiana who believes he found another piece of Harrison County, an L6 that fell in 1859. Wouldn't that be pretty much eroded away by now, even if it was shocked like NWA 869? Phil Whitmer Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum http://i1183.photobucket.com/albums/x466/joshuatree/August2011/IMG_7772_zps0513c6f7.jpg http://i1183.photobucket.com/albums/x466/joshuatree/August2011/IMG_7773_zpscc998a29.jpg http://i1183.photobucket.com/albums/x466/joshuatree/August2011/0306131740_zpsf7a483e5.jpg http://i1183.photobucket.com/albums/x466/joshuatree/August2011/0306131658a_zps18bf6b36.jpg __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Astrobiologists Find Ancient Fossils in FireballFragments
Too dumb to even discuss! Phil Whitmer Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum - Original Message - From: Mike Groetz mpg4...@gmail.com To: Meteorite List meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Tuesday, March 12, 2013 8:17 AM Subject: [meteorite-list] Astrobiologists Find Ancient Fossils in FireballFragments http://www.technologyreview.com/view/512381/astrobiologists-find-ancient-fossils-in-fireball-fragments/ __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Astrobiologists Find Ancient Fossils in FireballFragments
Does this mean you're still selling those Martian irons containing blood vessels and red corpuscles? Phil Whitmer Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum - Original Message - From: Galactic Stone Ironworks meteoritem...@gmail.com To: Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum dori...@embarqmail.com Cc: Mike Groetz mpg4...@gmail.com; Meteorite List meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Tuesday, March 12, 2013 10:59 AM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Astrobiologists Find Ancient Fossils in FireballFragments All ancient life-bearing meteorites, diatom-bearing meteorites, red-rain particles, and panspermia chondrites are hereby suspended until further notice -- - Web - http://www.galactic-stone.com Facebook - http://www.facebook.com/galacticstone Twitter - http://twitter.com/GalacticStone Pinterest - http://pinterest.com/galacticstone RSS - http://www.galactic-stone.com/rss/126516 - On 3/12/13, Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum dori...@embarqmail.com wrote: Too dumb to even discuss! Phil Whitmer Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum - Original Message - From: Mike Groetz mpg4...@gmail.com To: Meteorite List meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Tuesday, March 12, 2013 8:17 AM Subject: [meteorite-list] Astrobiologists Find Ancient Fossils in FireballFragments http://www.technologyreview.com/view/512381/astrobiologists-find-ancient-fossils-in-fireball-fragments/ __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Astrobiologists Find Ancient Fossils inFireballFragments
Hello Count, All that stuff has been debunked long ago, no need to beat dead horses. That is unless some new evidence has been discovered. If you have new evidence, I'd love to hear it. Seriously, you think the work of Chandra Wickramasinghe is worthy of discussion? Please proceed. Phil Whitmer Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum - Original Message - From: Count Deiro countde...@earthlink.net To: Galactic Stone Ironworks meteoritem...@gmail.com; Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum dori...@embarqmail.com Cc: Mike Groetz mpg4...@gmail.com; Meteorite List meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Tuesday, March 12, 2013 12:32 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Astrobiologists Find Ancient Fossils inFireballFragments Hi List, Meteorite Mike has said .. are hereby suspended... and Phil wrote ..too dumb to discuss.. Darn. I was hoping to sell my Nakhla, Murchison and Allende specimens, to mention just a few. Wait till all those guys and gals, with the three letters after their names, engaged in writing and publishing papers supporting the presence of fossilized nano-bacteria, biomorphs and elements that postulate pansermia, find out that their work is too dumb to discuss! Regards, Count Deiro IMCA 3536 -Original Message- From: Galactic Stone Ironworks meteoritem...@gmail.com Sent: Mar 12, 2013 7:59 AM To: Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum dori...@embarqmail.com Cc: Mike Groetz mpg4...@gmail.com, Meteorite List meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Astrobiologists Find Ancient Fossils in FireballFragments All ancient life-bearing meteorites, diatom-bearing meteorites, red-rain particles, and panspermia chondrites are hereby suspended until further notice -- - Web - http://www.galactic-stone.com Facebook - http://www.facebook.com/galacticstone Twitter - http://twitter.com/GalacticStone Pinterest - http://pinterest.com/galacticstone RSS - http://www.galactic-stone.com/rss/126516 - On 3/12/13, Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum dori...@embarqmail.com wrote: Too dumb to even discuss! Phil Whitmer Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum - Original Message - From: Mike Groetz mpg4...@gmail.com To: Meteorite List meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Tuesday, March 12, 2013 8:17 AM Subject: [meteorite-list] Astrobiologists Find Ancient Fossils in FireballFragments http://www.technologyreview.com/view/512381/astrobiologists-find-ancient-fossils-in-fireball-fragments/ __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Astrobiologists Find Ancient Fossils inFireballFragments
Really!? I didn't think anybody believed McKay's thoroughly debunked theory any more. http://www.space.com/18414-mars-meteorite-life-arctic-rocks-qanda.html Phil Whitmer - Original Message - From: Count Deiro countde...@earthlink.net To: Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum dori...@embarqmail.com; Galactic Stone Ironworks meteoritem...@gmail.com Cc: Mike Groetz mpg4...@gmail.com; Meteorite List meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Tuesday, March 12, 2013 2:50 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Astrobiologists Find Ancient Fossils inFireballFragments Hi Phil, I haven't read Wickramasinge. I do hold stock in panspermic theory. In particular, the findings of water, amino acids, etc. in the meteorites I mentioned. The NASA/JPL paper New Evidence of Life Forms in Martian Meteorites descibing and illustrating what seven of their best have concluded are life forms in Nakhla and AH84001 was particularly convincing to me. That SUV sized lab that we spent a few hundred million to put on Mars, was sent there for the admitted purpose of solving our disagreement for us. You may have watched and listened to the first report of Curiosity's findings today streamed on the web. The Nasa team was about to pee their pants having the opportunity to confirm that in the first drilling of a rock on Mars, they have proven an environment existed that would have beeen amiable to life. It will get better Regards, Guido -Original Message- From: Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum dori...@embarqmail.com Sent: Mar 12, 2013 9:42 AM To: Count Deiro countde...@earthlink.net, Galactic Stone Ironworks meteoritem...@gmail.com Cc: Mike Groetz mpg4...@gmail.com, Meteorite List meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Astrobiologists Find Ancient Fossils inFireballFragments Hello Count, All that stuff has been debunked long ago, no need to beat dead horses. That is unless some new evidence has been discovered. If you have new evidence, I'd love to hear it. Seriously, you think the work of Chandra Wickramasinghe is worthy of discussion? Please proceed. Phil Whitmer Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum - Original Message - From: Count Deiro countde...@earthlink.net To: Galactic Stone Ironworks meteoritem...@gmail.com; Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum dori...@embarqmail.com Cc: Mike Groetz mpg4...@gmail.com; Meteorite List meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Tuesday, March 12, 2013 12:32 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Astrobiologists Find Ancient Fossils inFireballFragments Hi List, Meteorite Mike has said .. are hereby suspended... and Phil wrote ..too dumb to discuss.. Darn. I was hoping to sell my Nakhla, Murchison and Allende specimens, to mention just a few. Wait till all those guys and gals, with the three letters after their names, engaged in writing and publishing papers supporting the presence of fossilized nano-bacteria, biomorphs and elements that postulate pansermia, find out that their work is too dumb to discuss! Regards, Count Deiro IMCA 3536 -Original Message- From: Galactic Stone Ironworks meteoritem...@gmail.com Sent: Mar 12, 2013 7:59 AM To: Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum dori...@embarqmail.com Cc: Mike Groetz mpg4...@gmail.com, Meteorite List meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Astrobiologists Find Ancient Fossils in FireballFragments All ancient life-bearing meteorites, diatom-bearing meteorites, red-rain particles, and panspermia chondrites are hereby suspended until further notice -- - Web - http://www.galactic-stone.com Facebook - http://www.facebook.com/galacticstone Twitter - http://twitter.com/GalacticStone Pinterest - http://pinterest.com/galacticstone RSS - http://www.galactic-stone.com/rss/126516 - On 3/12/13, Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum dori...@embarqmail.com wrote: Too dumb to even discuss! Phil Whitmer Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum - Original Message - From: Mike Groetz mpg4...@gmail.com To: Meteorite List meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Tuesday, March 12, 2013 8:17 AM Subject: [meteorite-list] Astrobiologists Find Ancient Fossils in FireballFragments http://www.technologyreview.com/view/512381/astrobiologists-find-ancient-fossils-in-fireball-fragments/ __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] No, Diatoms Have Not Been Found in a Meteorite...
Pat, Yes it's troubling they were studying a meteorwrong. What's more troubling is they found the same species of freshwater diatoms living in the rice paddies as they found in their meteorwrong! This is how David McKay (RIP) et. al. were proven wrong about the Martian pseudo-fossils. Phil Whitmer Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum - Original Message - From: Pat Brown scientificlifest...@hotmail.com To: Ron Baalke baa...@zagami.jpl.nasa.gov; Met List meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Tuesday, March 12, 2013 4:17 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] No, Diatoms Have Not Been Found in a Meteorite... Hi All, According to the Meteoritical Bulletin, there is no classified meteorite that aligns with the claims in the paper by Wickramasinghe et. al. My limited understanding (I am an engineer and only an amateur meteoriticist and member of the Meteoritical Society) is that the scientific world does not consider a rock to be a meteorite until it is classified and published in the Meteoritical Society bulletin. If this is true, then this has not been demonstrated to even be a meteorite. It is also troubling that: In total, Jamie Wallis at Cardiff University and a few buddies received 628 stone fragments collected from rice fields in the region. However, they were able to clearly identify only three as possible meteorites. Show me the classification! Best Regards, Pat Brown From: baa...@zagami.jpl.nasa.gov To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Date: Tue, 12 Mar 2013 12:41:21 -0700 Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] No, Diatoms Have Not Been Found in a Meteorite... http://www.slate.com/blogs/bad_astronomy/2013/01/15/life_in_a_meteorite_claims_by_n_c_wickramasinghe_of_diatoms_in_a_meteorite.html No, Diatoms Have Not Been Found in a Meteorite By Phil Plait Bad Astronomy [UPDATE (Mar. 12, 2013): The authors of this very shaky life in a meteorite paper described below published another paper recently, causing a minor media frenzy. In it they try to show the samples are meteorites, but the evidence they present is in many ways even worse than the outrageous claims they made in the first paper! I have written a take-down of that paper as well http://www.slate.com/blogs/bad_astronomy/2013/03/11/meteorite_life_claims_of_fossils_in_a_meteorite_are_still_wrong.html; but you should read this one here first.] If there's a story practically guaranteed to go viral, it's about evidence of life in space. And if you have pictures, why, that's going to spread like, well, like a virus. So the moment I heard that a paper had been published saying that diatoms - a type of algae, microscopic plant life, that have hard outer shells made of silica and come in a variety of shapes and forms - had been found in a meteorite, I knew I'd get flooded with emails and tweets and Facebook messages because LIFE IN SPACE! And so I did. People are really curious about this! But then I read the actual paper, and guess what? Let me be delicate: It'™s wrong. Really, really wrong. Way, way, way ridiculously oh-holy-wow-how-could-anyone-publish-this wrong. [deep breath] OK, let's dive in, shall we? That's the JoC The paper http://journalofcosmology.com/JOC21/Polonnaruwa.pdf was published online on a site called The Journal of Cosmology http://journalofcosmology.com/. I'll get back to that august publication in just a moment. The lead author is N. C. Wickramasinghe, and as soon as I saw his name alarm bells exploded in my head. Wickramasinghe is a proponent of the idea of panspermia: the notion that life originated in space and was brought to Earth via meteorites. It's an interesting idea and not without some merits. However, Wickramasinghe is fervent proponent of it. Like, really fervent. So much so that he attributes everything to life in space. He's said that the flu comes from space. He's said SARS comes from space . He's claimed living cells found in the stratosphere come from space. (There is no evidence at all they do, and it's far more likely they are terrestrial.) He's said a weird red rain in India was from space (when it's been shown that it isn't. The list goes on and on. Wickramasinghe jumps on everything, with little or no evidence, and says it's from outer space, so I think there's a case to be made for a bias on his part. Now, you might accuse me of using an ad hominem, an argument that cast aspersions on the person making the claim, and not attacking the claim itself. I'll get to the claim in a moment, but sometimes an ad hominem is warranted! If Sylvia Brown claims she can predict someone's future, you would be right to doubt her based on her past, since she has continually failed in every attempt to do so. If Jenny McCarthy claimed botox cures autism, again, you might be forgiven for doubting it based on her previous anti-vaccine and other false claims. You still need to examine the claims on their own merits, of course, but: Fool me once, shame on you; fool me twice, shame
[meteorite-list] Meteorite Black Market (Weather Channel)
An article from the Weather Channel entitled: Meteor Fragments Hot on the Black Market. http://www.weather.com/news/meteor-cleanup-20130218 Phil Whitmer Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Meteorite Black Market (CBC News)
Here's a quote from this CBC News article: While taking and selling material from meteorites is highly illegal, the New York Times reports that a flourishing global market exists online, with fragments widely available to anyone in the world. The name of the article is: Russian meteor fragments cause 'gold rush' on black market http://www.cbc.ca/news/yourcommunity/2013/02/russian-meteor-fragments-cause-gold-rush-on-black-market.html Phil Whitmer Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Meteorite Black Market
From the Boston Globe: Writing at the website of the excellent BBC Radio program The Naked Scientists, Audrey Tempelsman looks at the global trade in meteorites, and finds a shadowy, globe-spanning gray market. Many meteorite resellers, Tempelsman writes, close their eyes to the legal aspects of the merchandise. As Ralph Harvey, a geologist at Case Western Reserve University, tells Tempelsman,The skill level that some collectors have to get stones out of Africa rivals that of drug dealers. The black market for meteorites http://www.bostonglobe.com/ideas/2012/06/09/the-black-market-for-meteorites/poFPgK5REldREpXFylFH6I/story.html From the BigThink Blog: The Meteorite Black Market http://bigthink.com/ideafeed/the-meteorite-black-market We have at our disposal a very limited number of [meteorite and asteroid] specimens to study and exhibit, said Dr. Mario Di Martino, who led an exhibition team to investigate the Gebel Kamil meteorite site in Egypt in 2009. Before his team's investigation could begin, however, the meteorites were found by someone else and later sold privately in France. He and other members of the Gebel Kamil crater discovery team, he added, don't have the money to buy them on the flourishing black market. Some meteorite adventurers, however, turn to experts for analysis which cause some, including Carl B. Agee, director of the Institute of Meteoritics at the University of New Mexico, to argue the ambition of the private sector is once again aiding sluggish public research. - From the China Daily and Daily Astronomy: Scientists see red over black-market meteorite sales A black market in meteorites By William J. Broad (New York Times) http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/cndy/2011-04/17/content_12338995.htm Contains the infamous quote: It's a black market, said Ralph P. Harvey, a geologist who directs the United States search for meteorites in Antarctica. It's as organized as any drug trade and just as illegal. --- From KSL radio: Meteorites Can Totally Make You Rich http://www.ksl.com/?nid=895sid=20208234 Looking for a place where wealth literally falls out of the sky? Head to Rescue, California, where you can find meteorites which go for around $1,000 per gram. According toThe Los Angeles Times' Diana Marcum,there's a different type of California gold rush going on, the result of a meteorite leaving the Coloma-Lotus Valley of California littered with meteor fragments fetching thousands of dollars on the meteor black market. There are many more articles that repeat and rehash the statements of Ralph Harvey and the articles of William Broad. - Phil Whitmer Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] JASON, be carefull what you say about my meteorites on the Meteorite List, I am warning you...
Hi John, Anyone offended by the the tone and language on the Meteorite List must be living extremely sheltered lives! I'm guessing none of them have ever been on Facebook or anywhere out in the real world if they find the Met List too offensive. Seriously, if you would pass up all the great information on the Met List because you're not protected from the occasional outburst that may possibly offend your dainty politically correct sensibilities, you have other far greater issues. Phil Whitmer Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum - Original Message - From: John Teague volg...@icx.net To: Jorge M. Gonçalves galeriaco...@gmail.com; Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Thursday, February 28, 2013 1:34 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] JASON, be carefull what you say about my meteorites on the Meteorite List, I am warning you... To whom it may concern: This is an example of the reason that I NO LONGER suggest this list to my customers at shows! I have a sheet that I give interested customers which lists this list along with others related to the meteorite, mineral, and fossil hobby. I have had too many folks that related to me later that they were offended by the tone and/or language on the Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com list that I felt that I had to remover it from my suggestions for information. Just my thoughts ... rant on, Guys, RANT ON! John Teague Volunteer Gems -Original Message- From: Jorge M. Gonçalves galeriaco...@gmail.com Sent: Feb 28, 2013 12:51 PM To: Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] JASON, be carefull what you say about my meteorites on the Meteorite List, I am warning you... Jason, I was asked by the owner of the METEORITE LIST not to write any offensive language or insult any one publicly on this list but apparently you don't respect that policy. All I said is that my Russian meteorite specimens on Ebay come with a card of authenticity from the Russian seller. Before you start accusing me of anything please ask someone to interpret the card for you. The name of the seller and his respective residence is on that card and to me that is all the written proof I need. Jorge 2013/2/28 jason utas jasonu...@gmail.com Jorge, 1) I am not selling any material from this fall, nor do I plan to. 2) So much of the material you're selling in your ebay account is so painfully misrepresented that I fear no threat from you. You're either woefully ignorant, or a cheat. Either way, you have no grounds to be threatening anyone who points this out. Written proof is worth as much as the person who's writing it, which apparently means nothing in your case. Jason On Thu, Feb 28, 2013 at 6:18 AM, Jorge M. Gonçalves galeriaco...@gmail.com wrote: You've got some nerve to come on the Meteorite List and start exalting your specimens from Russia and condemning my own. Pardon my language expression, but who the fuck do you think you are??? As far as I'm concerned I'm the only one showing written proof from the seller, as far as I know all the other pieces don't come with any written proof showing any authenticity. __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] two fireballs
BAM! Phil Whitmer Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum - Original Message - From: Jodie Reynolds spacero...@spaceballoon.org To: Steve Dunklee steve.dunk...@yahoo.com Cc: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Monday, February 25, 2013 11:01 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] two fireballs Hello Steve, I have more than 70 patents in the space in nineteen countries. I'm the Chief Technology Officer for a company that designs and sells digital video surveillance equipment -- I sell close to 30,000 systems a year. My masters degrees are in mathematics and electrical engineering with an emphasis on optical physics, and I've been in the digital video space inventing compression algorithms for more than two dozen years. So, yeah, let's go ahead and investigate my snow job, shall we? Most cheap dash cameras being imported now are 1080p/30. 1080p/20 is a favored option to maximize SD card usage. They differ from ATSC in that they don't generally support 1080p/60. For Example: http://www.amazon.com/1080P-Dashboard-Camera-Accident-Vision/dp/B0099KGDQ2 http://www.rakuten.com/prod/new-real-hd-1080p-h264-5m-car-dashboard-camera-recorder-accident-dvr/225640553.html?listingId=174887992 http://www.espow.com/product_info.php?products_id=50672currency=USDgsc=googleshoppinggclid=CMfrtJmH07UCFYKDQgodMSoAAQ http://www.ebay.com/itm/Full-Car-DVR-HD-1080P-Cam-Recorder-Camcorder-Vehicle-Dashboard-Camera-F900LHD-/251182177426?pt=US_Surveillance_Digital_Video_Recorders_Cardshash=item3a7b9fdc92 http://www.ebay.com/itm/Car-DVR-HD-1080P-Cam-Recorder-Camcorder-Vehicle-Dashboard-Camera-Hot-Sale-/330840799556?pt=US_Surveillance_Digital_Video_Recorders_Cardshash=item4d07a5f944 http://www.ebay.com/itm/GPS-FULL-HD-1080P-Car-Camera-DVR-GPS-Logger-Vehicle-Black-Box-Video-Recorder-/320741840995?pt=US_Surveillance_Digital_Video_Recorders_Cardshash=item4aadb41863 No dash cameras have been produced for public consumption at sub-D1 in at least five years. Mobile DVRs will often offer CIF for multiple channel recording however (a limitation of the NTSC or PAL scan converter). 640x280 is a non-existent format, as that would be 0.4375, not ending on a byte boundary. You're thinking of 240 lines. And it wouldn't be 640 (square pixels), it would be 704. Or perhaps you're thinking of SIF in a 525 line domain, which would be 352x240, or CIF in the 625 line domain (352x288). The container format was, in fact, MP4. The codec used for compression was AVC. AVC is aka MPEG4 AVC (Advanced Video Codec), which is also known as h.264 **see below. The original submitted video was 1080p. Youtube has offered 1080p since 2009. http://youtube-global.blogspot.com/2009/11/1080p-hd-comes-to-youtube.html We can see the offered streams from youtube as/per: http://www.spaceballoon.org/available-streams.jpg There is no such video container or codec as pmg that I'm aware of - Would you provide the FOURCC for that? My stills are in PNG (Portable Network Graphics) as I noted originally. __MPG__ is the Motion Pictures expert Group [of which I've been a member off-and-on as well as on several working groups over the years), and MPEG1, MPEG2, MPEG4, MPEG AVC (aka h.264, aka MPEG7 aka MPEG4 Layer 7, etc.) are all possible with additional qualifications of things such as differing levels of motion prediction, different transport layers, and different containers. Now, would you like to say anything else incredibly stupid, or would you like to apologize for attacking me in your blind ignorance and we can just let it go? **Format : MPEG-4 Format profile : Base Media / Version 2 Codec ID : mp42 File size: 348 MiB Duration : 10mn 1s Overall bit rate mode: Variable Overall bit rate : 4 860 Kbps Encoded date : UTC 2013-02-14 04:06:40 Tagged date : UTC 2013-02-14 04:06:40 gsst : 0 gstd : 601210 gssd : BADC23F61HH1361841351562120 gshh : r1---sn-p5qlsn7z.c.youtube.com Video ID : 1 Format : AVC Format/Info : Advanced Video Codec Format profile : High@L4.0 Format settings, CABAC : Yes Format settings, ReFrames: 1 frame Format settings, GOP : M=1, N=40 Codec ID : avc1 Codec ID/Info: Advanced Video Coding Duration : 10mn 1s Bit rate : 4 714 Kbps Maximum bit rate : 9 011 Kbps Width: 1 920 pixels
[meteorite-list] NYT article on Chebarkul meteorite
A quote from the article: While trade in material from meteorites is largely illegal, there is a flourishing global market, with fragments widely available for sale on the Internet, usually at modest prices. http://www.nytimes.com/2013/02/19/world/europe/russian-scientists-say-they-found-meteorite-fragments.html?_r=0 Phil Whitmer Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Ebay Oddities
Here we have a rare titanium and iron meteorite that sold for $17,000 from a seller with 0 feedback. He still has 0 so I'm guessing this was never paid for. http://www.ebay.com/itm/Meteorite-/271124212080?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0hash=item3f20432970nma=truesi=ZH8m%252Bkm5Esx404BM0Tf9k%252Bb1h80%253Dorig_cvip=truert=nc_trksid=p2047675.l2557 A newly listed alleged Chebarkul meteorite: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Part-of-russian-meteorite-2013-february-Chelyabinsk-/330876101785?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0hash=item4d09c0a499 This one was allegedly found in Lake Chebarkul, looks kind of big for 0,213g. The picture can be found at Russian Radio and other websites. I think it's a picture of one of the first pieces found. http://www.ebay.com/itm/Chelyabinsk-meteorite-0-213g-Stone-and-chondrite-VERY-RARE-/321075620093?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0hash=item4ac19928fd Another from the same seller. The picture was taken from the Mirror News. http://www.ebay.com/itm/Chelyabinsk-meteorite-0-31g-Stone-and-chondrite-VERY-RARE-/321075663851?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0hash=item4ac199d3eb Another newly listed one: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Russian-meteorite-From-Chelyabinsk-/261172603622?pt=UK_Collectables_RocksFossils_Minerals_EHhash=item3ccf19aae6 If you type in Chelyabinsk meteorite and hit completed auctions, you can see numerous items sold as Chebarkul. Too many to list here! Phil Whitmer __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Russia mega meteor and asteroid 2012DA14 related, yes I think so...
Ok, you've gone off the deep end and will now be officially considered goofy. Your remarks on Carancas are just dumb. Phil Whitmer Joshua Tree Earth Space Museum - Original Message - From: Bjorn Sorheim astro...@online.no To: meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Saturday, February 16, 2013 5:24 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Russia mega meteor and asteroid 2012DA14 related, yes I think so... Thanks for your general positive comment on this discussion. I would agree with you on the .'more and more skeptical' about some output of so called scientific knowlegde over the years. Say any scientist or budding scientist have a model on some kind of aspect of nature. The model can be quite ok according to exact knowledge and observation about this part of nature. However, if you wrongly enter the wrong numbers (because of lack of good observations or other misconceptions or sloppy or rushed work) the good quality model won't help you, you end up with hopeless results. Be aware of this situation. And this situation happen all the time in science, an incredible unfounded input of bad numbers. Particulary in astronomy, I would say, where so much is hidden in the darkness of space and unrepeatable fleeting observations. Take the case Chicxulub for instance. All of this hopeless numbers swirling about about size, energy, entry angle, mass etc. Did it ever happen? Just 65 mill. years since it happened and where the hell is its crater rim?? Should have been higher than Himalaya! Where is it?? Who observed this anyway :) Assumptions, upon assumptions. Yet you hear dinosaur-killer all over the popular scientific press, Discovery, National Geographic channel, etc, etc. Serious geologist says the reason the dinosaurs perished was outpouring of kilometers thick lava sheets expanding several times the size of my country. Polluted the atmosphere. They have found that dinosaurs died out over hundred thousands of years, not in an instant as the impact theory will have it. Super-volcano at the Deccan traps. No asteroid needed. Yet astronomers pour out their staggering Chicxulub numbers an an increasing rate. Easy to lie with numbers... Take also the case of Carancas, Peru, Sept 15., 2007. Every known celestial mechanican, geologist, astronomer, meteoriticist denied the explosion at Carancas, Peru was a meteorite to the press. This was going on for weeks. The sick hords of people was just sick, a meteorite fall does not make you sick, they said. This was an metan explosion, military detonation at the border, whatever, but not a meteorite, the 'experts' said, actually the real experts. Meteorites does not produce a 13 m crater! The combined scientific elite denied this case. The Peruvian press still kept on reporting about the meteorite. They were all put to shame when the Bureau of Mines (or similar name) in Lima, released their scientific study of the fragments from the crater. It was soon in Meteoritical Bulletin thereafter. Going against all science establishments in the developed world. This disgraceful story was hardly commented afterwards by anyone. So science can really go astray, and they often behave like a flock of volwes or a flock of sheep. So be alert and aware... Bjørn Sørheim Chris I am a scientist myself, in agronomy. And I have learned to be more and more skeptical about the common/obvious knowledge over the years... You might be right... but be careful about your high level of certainty... Said with all respect to you but also Bjorn who seems to have a point, if you take into account what he said about a split before... Anyway lets enjoy your different arguments Michael B. __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] artistic meteorite rebirth
Yeah, like when Rauschenburg erased a De Kooning drawing! Those silly postmodernists. Phil Whitmer - Original Message - From: h...@meteorhall.com To: Doug Ross d...@dougross.net Cc: Meteorite List List meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Sent: Saturday, February 09, 2013 12:35 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] artistic meteorite rebirth By golly, next we shall take the Crown Jewels and melt them down, then cast the mess into a poor replica of the Crown Jewels...destruction is such fun art! Fred Thought you all might find this conceptual art project interesting: http://vimeo.com/46536435 Seems like a shame to me that she chose a naturally beautiful specimen with which to do this. If it was a rusty hunk of shrapnel to begin with, somehow I wouldn't feel so bad. But I did get a chuckle out of seeing her marvel over fresh saw marks. BTW, I'm in the market for a large Campo for myselfbut not the one in the video, please! Contact me off list with any offers. Doug Ross d...@dougross.net __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Apollo Moon Rocks On eBay
I don't get it. They sent a SWAT team into a Denny's to bum rush this little old lady for attemping to sell a moon rock weighing a few grains, http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/10/24/joann-davis-nasa-sting_n_1028156.html when this guy is allowed to openly advertise and attempt to sell a rock brought back by the Apollo 11 mission? http://www.ebay.com/itm/Meteorite-/190783042224?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0hash=item2c6b8e32b0 Maybe because it's a total fake? A meteorite picked up on the moon by Apollo 11 astronauts, really? Either way, fraudulent misrepresentation, or attempted public sale of Apollo moon rocks, wouldn't this be against the law? Phil Whitmer __ Visit the Archives at http://www.meteorite-list-archives.com Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
