Re: [meteorite-list] Tata-Foumzgit-Tanzrou Martian Fall. (Why no lunar falls? and freshest lunar?)
But is was more than a decade later that Viking got evidence that made them realize what they hadwould the investigations have been different if they had known...or am I completely wrong with that? Graham On Mon, Jan 16, 2012 at 2:04 AM, Gary Fujihara fuj...@mac.com wrote: Indeed Zagami had an even shorter terrestrial age when first recovered and analyzed in laboratories around the world than the new Martian shergottite. What was missing were the suite of analytical technology today that can provide far greater insight into the meteorite that were not available in 1962, particularly in short-lived radionuclides. gary On Jan 15, 2012, at 3:27 PM, Rob Wesel wrote: Zagami has and even shorter terrestrial age and has been in ample supply for study for the last 50 years. Rob Wesel -- Nakhla Dog Meteorites www.nakhladogmeteorites.com www.facebook.com/Nakhla.Dog.Meteorites www.facebook.com/Rob.Wesel -- We are the music makers... and we are the dreamers of the dreams. Willy Wonka, 1971 -- From: Galactic Stone Ironworks meteoritem...@gmail.com Sent: Sunday, January 15, 2012 11:43 AM To: Shawn Alan photoph...@yahoo.com Cc: Meteorite Central meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Tata-Foumzgit-Tanzrou Martian Fall. (Why no lunar falls? and freshest lunar?) Hi Shawn and List, It is true that science has access to dozens(!) of Martian meteorites, but all of them have been sitting on Earth for thousands of years and they have experienced alteration and oxidation during that long wait for discovery. This is the first Martian (or any planetary) that has a terrestrial age measured in months. That is exciting. It is so pristine and fresh, that scientists should be very keen to research it. Due to it's lack of oxidation and alteration, it is the next best thing to sample recovery mission. Imagine how much it would cost to bring back a sizeable sample from Mars. Mother Nature just saved science billions of dollars. :) Best regards, MikeG -- * Galactic Stone Ironworks - Meteorites Amber (Michael Gilmer) Website - http://www.galactic-stone.com Facebook - http://tinyurl.com/42h79my News Feed - http://www.galactic-stone.com/rss/126516 Twitter - http://twitter.com/galacticstone *** On 1/14/12, Shawn Alan photoph...@yahoo.com wrote: MikeG Listers MikeG you said I probably should have clarified - the 21st century. So basically the last ~12 years. It's hard to find a fall (pun intended) in the last 12 years that is more important (overall) than this Martian. In terms of scientific value, Tagish Lake is probably high on the list of the most important in the 21st century. I would have to agree on Tagish Lake its very important and I would say more important then TATA in regards of scientists have no clue which parent body it came from, and the presolar grains it has and the large amount of nanodiamonds found within the meteorite. With the TATA meteorite, this makes about 79 classified meteorite from Mars. In ratio to parent body, thats alot of meteorite from one location in space considered science has no clue where Tagish Lakes parent body is. So in repect to science, TATA is just another Mars meteorite, another one to add to the growing list of Martianites :) On the other hand, ALMAHATA SITTA is by far the most signficate fall in the last 12 years Shawn Alan IMCA 1633 eBay Store http://www.ebay.com/sch/ph0t0phl0w/m.html? [meteorite-list] Tata-Foumzgit Martian Fall. The most significant fall of this century? Galactic Stone Ironworks meteoritemike at gmail.com Thu Jan 12 21:23:07 EST 2012 * Previous message: [meteorite-list] Tata-Foumzgit Martian Fall. The most significant fall of this century? * Next message: [meteorite-list] Tata-Foumzgit Martian Fall. The most significant fall of this century? * Messages sorted by: [ date ] [ thread ] [ subject ] [ author ] Hi Count and List, I probably should have clarified - the 21st century. So basically the last ~12 years. It's hard to find a fall (pun intended) in the last 12 years that is more important (overall) than this Martian. In terms of scientific value, Tagish Lake is probably high on the list of the most important in the 21st century. If NonCom approves it as a fall and if a lot of good research comes out of this meteorite, then it's surely one of the most interesting falls of the 50 years. Let's all cross our fingers and hope that MetSoc approves this as a named fall and that they approve it quickly once they have the data required to do so. :) Best regards, MikeG -- * Galactic Stone Ironworks - Meteorites Amber
Re: [meteorite-list] Tata-Foumzgit-Tanzrou Martian Fall. (Why no lunar falls? and freshest lunar?)
Hi Graham and List, Very good point. Up until the time when we could sample the Martian atmosphere, Martian meteorites were only a theory. And even after the Viking data was compared to some of the meteorites on hand, the Martian-origin theory still had some opposition, mainly from scientists who could not model a scenario in which ejected Martian material would be delivered to Earth. The low terrestrial age of Tata-Tanzrou combined with the superior technology available today, makes this new fall an incredibly rare opportunity to study very fresh Martian material. Not to mention the fact that we know much much more about Martian geochemistry now than we did back in 1962. The Martian falls that came before this new one still stand tall as meteorites of the highest significance, but Tata-Tanzrou may be poised to join them based on what it may possibly reveal. Think about it - the cores of those larger unbroken stones are nearly pristine! :) Best regards, MikeG -- * Galactic Stone Ironworks - Meteorites Amber (Michael Gilmer) Website - http://www.galactic-stone.com Facebook - http://tinyurl.com/42h79my News Feed - http://www.galactic-stone.com/rss/126516 Twitter - http://twitter.com/galacticstone *** On 1/16/12, Graham Ensor graham.en...@gmail.com wrote: But is was more than a decade later that Viking got evidence that made them realize what they hadwould the investigations have been different if they had known...or am I completely wrong with that? Graham On Mon, Jan 16, 2012 at 2:04 AM, Gary Fujihara fuj...@mac.com wrote: Indeed Zagami had an even shorter terrestrial age when first recovered and analyzed in laboratories around the world than the new Martian shergottite. What was missing were the suite of analytical technology today that can provide far greater insight into the meteorite that were not available in 1962, particularly in short-lived radionuclides. gary On Jan 15, 2012, at 3:27 PM, Rob Wesel wrote: Zagami has and even shorter terrestrial age and has been in ample supply for study for the last 50 years. Rob Wesel -- Nakhla Dog Meteorites www.nakhladogmeteorites.com www.facebook.com/Nakhla.Dog.Meteorites www.facebook.com/Rob.Wesel -- We are the music makers... and we are the dreamers of the dreams. Willy Wonka, 1971 -- From: Galactic Stone Ironworks meteoritem...@gmail.com Sent: Sunday, January 15, 2012 11:43 AM To: Shawn Alan photoph...@yahoo.com Cc: Meteorite Central meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Tata-Foumzgit-Tanzrou Martian Fall. (Why no lunar falls? and freshest lunar?) Hi Shawn and List, It is true that science has access to dozens(!) of Martian meteorites, but all of them have been sitting on Earth for thousands of years and they have experienced alteration and oxidation during that long wait for discovery. This is the first Martian (or any planetary) that has a terrestrial age measured in months. That is exciting. It is so pristine and fresh, that scientists should be very keen to research it. Due to it's lack of oxidation and alteration, it is the next best thing to sample recovery mission. Imagine how much it would cost to bring back a sizeable sample from Mars. Mother Nature just saved science billions of dollars. :) Best regards, MikeG -- * Galactic Stone Ironworks - Meteorites Amber (Michael Gilmer) Website - http://www.galactic-stone.com Facebook - http://tinyurl.com/42h79my News Feed - http://www.galactic-stone.com/rss/126516 Twitter - http://twitter.com/galacticstone *** On 1/14/12, Shawn Alan photoph...@yahoo.com wrote: MikeG Listers MikeG you said I probably should have clarified - the 21st century. So basically the last ~12 years. It's hard to find a fall (pun intended) in the last 12 years that is more important (overall) than this Martian. In terms of scientific value, Tagish Lake is probably high on the list of the most important in the 21st century. I would have to agree on Tagish Lake its very important and I would say more important then TATA in regards of scientists have no clue which parent body it came from, and the presolar grains it has and the large amount of nanodiamonds found within the meteorite. With the TATA meteorite, this makes about 79 classified meteorite from Mars. In ratio to parent body, thats alot of meteorite from one location in space considered science has no clue where Tagish Lakes parent body is. So in repect to science, TATA is just another Mars meteorite, another one to add to the growing list of Martianites :) On the other hand, ALMAHATA SITTA is by far the most signficate fall in the last 12 years
Re: [meteorite-list] Tata-Foumzgit-Tanzrou Martian Fall. (Why no lunar falls? and freshest lunar?)
...except that it is unlikely that the primary target of a sample return mission to Mars would be basalt! That is not to say that this isn't an exciting event. But it does not accomplish what a sample return mission would, nor does it make such a mission less important. Jeff On 1/15/2012 2:43 PM, Galactic Stone Ironworks wrote: Hi Shawn and List, It is true that science has access to dozens(!) of Martian meteorites, but all of them have been sitting on Earth for thousands of years and they have experienced alteration and oxidation during that long wait for discovery. This is the first Martian (or any planetary) that has a terrestrial age measured in months. That is exciting. It is so pristine and fresh, that scientists should be very keen to research it. Due to it's lack of oxidation and alteration, it is the next best thing to sample recovery mission. Imagine how much it would cost to bring back a sizeable sample from Mars. Mother Nature just saved science billions of dollars. :) Best regards, MikeG __ HAPPY HOLIDAYS!! Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Tata-Foumzgit-Tanzrou Martian Fall. (Why no lunar falls? and freshest lunar?)
It still seems strange to me that we have not found any sedimentary meteorites from Mars.what are the main thoughts on why? There are many very fragile meteorites so I cannot imagine it is because they would not surviveor are we just not identifying them? Graham On Sun, Jan 15, 2012 at 8:42 PM, Jeff Grossman jngross...@gmail.com wrote: ...except that it is unlikely that the primary target of a sample return mission to Mars would be basalt! That is not to say that this isn't an exciting event. But it does not accomplish what a sample return mission would, nor does it make such a mission less important. Jeff On 1/15/2012 2:43 PM, Galactic Stone Ironworks wrote: Hi Shawn and List, It is true that science has access to dozens(!) of Martian meteorites, but all of them have been sitting on Earth for thousands of years and they have experienced alteration and oxidation during that long wait for discovery. This is the first Martian (or any planetary) that has a terrestrial age measured in months. That is exciting. It is so pristine and fresh, that scientists should be very keen to research it. Due to it's lack of oxidation and alteration, it is the next best thing to sample recovery mission. Imagine how much it would cost to bring back a sizeable sample from Mars. Mother Nature just saved science billions of dollars. :) Best regards, MikeG __ HAPPY HOLIDAYS!! Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ HAPPY HOLIDAYS!! Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Tata-Foumzgit-Tanzrou Martian Fall. (Why no lunar falls? and freshest lunar?)
Hi Jeff and List, I didn't mean to demean the value of an actual sample return mission. I think most of us would love to see a sample return mission for Mars or any other planetary body. Perhaps a Martian sample return mission would be one of the precursors to an eventual colony on Mars. A self-sufficient colony on another world is a dream I would love to see come true in my lifetime, but unless I live well past 100, I doubt I'll see it. Back to the new Mars meteorite, I wish a scientist would explain why a fresh sample like this is valuable for research. In other words, how much detrimental effect does oxidation and weathering have on specimens used for research purposes? Does it waste valuable instrument time trying to sort out the effects of weathering from native properties present in the sample? Best regards, MikeG -- * Galactic Stone Ironworks - Meteorites Amber (Michael Gilmer) Website - http://www.galactic-stone.com Facebook - http://tinyurl.com/42h79my News Feed - http://www.galactic-stone.com/rss/126516 Twitter - http://twitter.com/galacticstone *** On 1/15/12, Jeff Grossman jngross...@gmail.com wrote: ...except that it is unlikely that the primary target of a sample return mission to Mars would be basalt! That is not to say that this isn't an exciting event. But it does not accomplish what a sample return mission would, nor does it make such a mission less important. Jeff On 1/15/2012 2:43 PM, Galactic Stone Ironworks wrote: Hi Shawn and List, It is true that science has access to dozens(!) of Martian meteorites, but all of them have been sitting on Earth for thousands of years and they have experienced alteration and oxidation during that long wait for discovery. This is the first Martian (or any planetary) that has a terrestrial age measured in months. That is exciting. It is so pristine and fresh, that scientists should be very keen to research it. Due to it's lack of oxidation and alteration, it is the next best thing to sample recovery mission. Imagine how much it would cost to bring back a sizeable sample from Mars. Mother Nature just saved science billions of dollars. :) Best regards, MikeG __ HAPPY HOLIDAYS!! Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ HAPPY HOLIDAYS!! Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Tata-Foumzgit-Tanzrou Martian Fall. (Why no lunar falls? and freshest lunar?)
Zagami has and even shorter terrestrial age and has been in ample supply for study for the last 50 years. Rob Wesel -- Nakhla Dog Meteorites www.nakhladogmeteorites.com www.facebook.com/Nakhla.Dog.Meteorites www.facebook.com/Rob.Wesel -- We are the music makers... and we are the dreamers of the dreams. Willy Wonka, 1971 -- From: Galactic Stone Ironworks meteoritem...@gmail.com Sent: Sunday, January 15, 2012 11:43 AM To: Shawn Alan photoph...@yahoo.com Cc: Meteorite Central meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Tata-Foumzgit-Tanzrou Martian Fall. (Why no lunar falls? and freshest lunar?) Hi Shawn and List, It is true that science has access to dozens(!) of Martian meteorites, but all of them have been sitting on Earth for thousands of years and they have experienced alteration and oxidation during that long wait for discovery. This is the first Martian (or any planetary) that has a terrestrial age measured in months. That is exciting. It is so pristine and fresh, that scientists should be very keen to research it. Due to it's lack of oxidation and alteration, it is the next best thing to sample recovery mission. Imagine how much it would cost to bring back a sizeable sample from Mars. Mother Nature just saved science billions of dollars. :) Best regards, MikeG -- * Galactic Stone Ironworks - Meteorites Amber (Michael Gilmer) Website - http://www.galactic-stone.com Facebook - http://tinyurl.com/42h79my News Feed - http://www.galactic-stone.com/rss/126516 Twitter - http://twitter.com/galacticstone *** On 1/14/12, Shawn Alan photoph...@yahoo.com wrote: MikeG Listers MikeG you said I probably should have clarified - the 21st century. So basically the last ~12 years. It's hard to find a fall (pun intended) in the last 12 years that is more important (overall) than this Martian. In terms of scientific value, Tagish Lake is probably high on the list of the most important in the 21st century. I would have to agree on Tagish Lake its very important and I would say more important then TATA in regards of scientists have no clue which parent body it came from, and the presolar grains it has and the large amount of nanodiamonds found within the meteorite. With the TATA meteorite, this makes about 79 classified meteorite from Mars. In ratio to parent body, thats alot of meteorite from one location in space considered science has no clue where Tagish Lakes parent body is. So in repect to science, TATA is just another Mars meteorite, another one to add to the growing list of Martianites :) On the other hand, ALMAHATA SITTA is by far the most signficate fall in the last 12 years Shawn Alan IMCA 1633 eBay Store http://www.ebay.com/sch/ph0t0phl0w/m.html? [meteorite-list] Tata-Foumzgit Martian Fall. The most significant fall of this century? Galactic Stone Ironworks meteoritemike at gmail.com Thu Jan 12 21:23:07 EST 2012 * Previous message: [meteorite-list] Tata-Foumzgit Martian Fall. The most significant fall of this century? * Next message: [meteorite-list] Tata-Foumzgit Martian Fall. The most significant fall of this century? * Messages sorted by: [ date ] [ thread ] [ subject ] [ author ] Hi Count and List, I probably should have clarified - the 21st century. So basically the last ~12 years. It's hard to find a fall (pun intended) in the last 12 years that is more important (overall) than this Martian. In terms of scientific value, Tagish Lake is probably high on the list of the most important in the 21st century. If NonCom approves it as a fall and if a lot of good research comes out of this meteorite, then it's surely one of the most interesting falls of the 50 years. Let's all cross our fingers and hope that MetSoc approves this as a named fall and that they approve it quickly once they have the data required to do so. :) Best regards, MikeG -- * Galactic Stone Ironworks - Meteorites Amber (Michael Gilmer) Website - http://www.galactic-stone.com Facebook - http://tinyurl.com/42h79my News Feed - http://www.galactic-stone.com/rss/126516 Twitter - http://twitter.com/galacticstone *** On 1/12/12, Count Deiro countdeiro at earthlink.net wrote: I only know that there are papers published making the argument that certain SNC's and Alan Hills 84001 show evidence of fossilized life forms. There are other scientists who dispute this. Nakhla has the more compelling artifacts and is used more often to prove the hypothesis. Regards, Count Deiro IMCA 3536 -Original Message- From: dorifry dorifry at embarqmail.com Sent: Jan 12, 2012 2:15 PM To: Count Deiro
Re: [meteorite-list] Tata-Foumzgit-Tanzrou Martian Fall. (Why no lunar falls? and freshest lunar?)
Indeed Zagami had an even shorter terrestrial age when first recovered and analyzed in laboratories around the world than the new Martian shergottite. What was missing were the suite of analytical technology today that can provide far greater insight into the meteorite that were not available in 1962, particularly in short-lived radionuclides. gary On Jan 15, 2012, at 3:27 PM, Rob Wesel wrote: Zagami has and even shorter terrestrial age and has been in ample supply for study for the last 50 years. Rob Wesel -- Nakhla Dog Meteorites www.nakhladogmeteorites.com www.facebook.com/Nakhla.Dog.Meteorites www.facebook.com/Rob.Wesel -- We are the music makers... and we are the dreamers of the dreams. Willy Wonka, 1971 -- From: Galactic Stone Ironworks meteoritem...@gmail.com Sent: Sunday, January 15, 2012 11:43 AM To: Shawn Alan photoph...@yahoo.com Cc: Meteorite Central meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Tata-Foumzgit-Tanzrou Martian Fall. (Why no lunar falls? and freshest lunar?) Hi Shawn and List, It is true that science has access to dozens(!) of Martian meteorites, but all of them have been sitting on Earth for thousands of years and they have experienced alteration and oxidation during that long wait for discovery. This is the first Martian (or any planetary) that has a terrestrial age measured in months. That is exciting. It is so pristine and fresh, that scientists should be very keen to research it. Due to it's lack of oxidation and alteration, it is the next best thing to sample recovery mission. Imagine how much it would cost to bring back a sizeable sample from Mars. Mother Nature just saved science billions of dollars. :) Best regards, MikeG -- * Galactic Stone Ironworks - Meteorites Amber (Michael Gilmer) Website - http://www.galactic-stone.com Facebook - http://tinyurl.com/42h79my News Feed - http://www.galactic-stone.com/rss/126516 Twitter - http://twitter.com/galacticstone *** On 1/14/12, Shawn Alan photoph...@yahoo.com wrote: MikeG Listers MikeG you said I probably should have clarified - the 21st century. So basically the last ~12 years. It's hard to find a fall (pun intended) in the last 12 years that is more important (overall) than this Martian. In terms of scientific value, Tagish Lake is probably high on the list of the most important in the 21st century. I would have to agree on Tagish Lake its very important and I would say more important then TATA in regards of scientists have no clue which parent body it came from, and the presolar grains it has and the large amount of nanodiamonds found within the meteorite. With the TATA meteorite, this makes about 79 classified meteorite from Mars. In ratio to parent body, thats alot of meteorite from one location in space considered science has no clue where Tagish Lakes parent body is. So in repect to science, TATA is just another Mars meteorite, another one to add to the growing list of Martianites :) On the other hand, ALMAHATA SITTA is by far the most signficate fall in the last 12 years Shawn Alan IMCA 1633 eBay Store http://www.ebay.com/sch/ph0t0phl0w/m.html? [meteorite-list] Tata-Foumzgit Martian Fall. The most significant fall of this century? Galactic Stone Ironworks meteoritemike at gmail.com Thu Jan 12 21:23:07 EST 2012 * Previous message: [meteorite-list] Tata-Foumzgit Martian Fall. The most significant fall of this century? * Next message: [meteorite-list] Tata-Foumzgit Martian Fall. The most significant fall of this century? * Messages sorted by: [ date ] [ thread ] [ subject ] [ author ] Hi Count and List, I probably should have clarified - the 21st century. So basically the last ~12 years. It's hard to find a fall (pun intended) in the last 12 years that is more important (overall) than this Martian. In terms of scientific value, Tagish Lake is probably high on the list of the most important in the 21st century. If NonCom approves it as a fall and if a lot of good research comes out of this meteorite, then it's surely one of the most interesting falls of the 50 years. Let's all cross our fingers and hope that MetSoc approves this as a named fall and that they approve it quickly once they have the data required to do so. :) Best regards, MikeG -- * Galactic Stone Ironworks - Meteorites Amber (Michael Gilmer) Website - http://www.galactic-stone.com Facebook - http://tinyurl.com/42h79my News Feed - http://www.galactic-stone.com/rss/126516 Twitter - http://twitter.com/galacticstone
Re: [meteorite-list] Tata-Foumzgit-Tanzrou Martian Fall. (Why no lunar falls? and freshest lunar?)
Graham, I'm sure you saw this article about the Stone-6 experiments but, as a reminder. It does say that sedimentary rocks would survive and that sedimentary rocks developed a white or no crust at all. see link; http://www.spacedaily.com/reports/Stone_6_Artificial_Meteorite_Shows_Martian_Impactors_Could_Carry_Traces_Of_Life_999.html Carl Meteoritemax -- Cheers Graham Ensor graham.en...@gmail.com wrote: It still seems strange to me that we have not found any sedimentary meteorites from Mars.what are the main thoughts on why? There are many very fragile meteorites so I cannot imagine it is because they would not surviveor are we just not identifying them? Graham On Sun, Jan 15, 2012 at 8:42 PM, Jeff Grossman jngross...@gmail.com wrote: ...except that it is unlikely that the primary target of a sample return mission to Mars would be basalt! That is not to say that this isn't an exciting event. But it does not accomplish what a sample return mission would, nor does it make such a mission less important. Jeff On 1/15/2012 2:43 PM, Galactic Stone Ironworks wrote: Hi Shawn and List, It is true that science has access to dozens(!) of Martian meteorites, but all of them have been sitting on Earth for thousands of years and they have experienced alteration and oxidation during that long wait for discovery. This is the first Martian (or any planetary) that has a terrestrial age measured in months. That is exciting. It is so pristine and fresh, that scientists should be very keen to research it. Due to it's lack of oxidation and alteration, it is the next best thing to sample recovery mission. Imagine how much it would cost to bring back a sizeable sample from Mars. Mother Nature just saved science billions of dollars. :) Best regards, MikeG __ HAPPY HOLIDAYS!! Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ HAPPY HOLIDAYS!! Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ HAPPY HOLIDAYS!! Visit the Archives at http://www.meteoritecentral.com/mailing-list-archives.html Meteorite-list mailing list Meteorite-list@meteoritecentral.com http://six.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
