Re: bsd cloud
Jiri B [ji...@devio.us] wrote: On Tue, Nov 27, 2012 at 04:13:47PM -0200, Friedrich Locke wrote: So what would a BSD cloud be different in the context of cloud (not openbsd features) ? You can of course try to port KVM to OpenBSD, hehe. OpenBSD supports Sun's LDom hypervisor hardware out-of-the-box. Even the host mode is now fully or almost fully supported, so OpenBSD can be used as a host and a guest. It is still under active development in -current. Nobody else aside from Solaris comes with a complete, easy to use, out of the box implementation. Sparc64 with LDom is a very interesting choice if running on i386/amd64 is not a requirement.
bsd cloud
Hi folks, i have seen, some minutes ago, a message about cloud with BSD! I have seen announcements on cloud computing every where. What is the difference between a BSD cloud and a linux cloud ? A windows cloud and a linux cloud ? Isn't all that the new buzz word in the market ? So what would a BSD cloud be different in the context of cloud (not openbsd features) ? So in essence what is it really cloud we have not doing since networks have been in the game ? Don't take this as an offense, i just cannot understand all this frenesy about clouds ... thanks in advance.
Re: bsd cloud
On Tue, Nov 27, 2012 at 04:13:47PM -0200, Friedrich Locke wrote: Hi folks, i have seen, some minutes ago, a message about cloud with BSD! I have seen announcements on cloud computing every where. What is the difference between a BSD cloud and a linux cloud ? A windows cloud and a linux cloud ? Isn't all that the new buzz word in the market ? So what would a BSD cloud be different in the context of cloud (not openbsd features) ? The cloud computing of Amazon EC2, Rackspace, GoGrid, etc merely describes a VPS farm where images can be installed, managed, and migrated from a web service the vendor provides. Fundamentally, nothing exotic of the OS is required beyond the typical Xen/VMWare/KVM support and related disk and network drivers. Also, the vendors may install packages which communicate with their cloud controller, and in those cases it's rare that non-Linux systems will be supported. It really depends on the services provided by the vendor's web application, and the storage infrastructure (i.e. the possibly specialized disk drivers). So in essence what is it really cloud we have not doing since networks have been in the game ? Don't take this as an offense, i just cannot understand all this frenesy about clouds ... It's just a marketing term. Also, cloud vendors very intentionally hide the ball from people. Why? Cloud compute time is typically measued in hours that your VM is provisioned in the farm--i.e. the image running inside a VM instance, whether or not your image is halted. If you price out one month of cloud compute time (i.e. 24 hours * 30 days) and factor in your bandwidth usage, for moderate and heavy utilization a co-located or leased server will be cheaper, often times significantly. For low-end usage a dedicated VPS instance will be comparable or cheaper. Vendors don't want people comparing prices between cloud computing and regular leasing or VPS hosting. Cloud computing really only makes sense 1) for very low utilization; 2) for very high utilization, where you need to provision many images dynamically throughout the day, week, or month; 3) when you value the redundancy and failsafe provided by being able to snapshot and migrate instances in the cloud--i.e. across the vendor's VPS farm. I co-locate my own servers, and maintain some cloud images on Rackspace as a failsafe. I'm only charged a nominal fee for storage of the images, until I provision a server instance from one of the backup images, which ideally should happen rarely, and only for short periods of time.
Re: bsd cloud
On Tue, Nov 27, 2012 at 04:13:47PM -0200, Friedrich Locke wrote: Hi folks, i have seen, some minutes ago, a message about cloud with BSD! I have seen announcements on cloud computing every where. What is the difference between a BSD cloud and a linux cloud ? A windows cloud and a linux cloud ? Isn't all that the new buzz word in the market ? So what would a BSD cloud be different in the context of cloud (not openbsd features) ? So in essence what is it really cloud we have not doing since networks have been in the game ? Don't take this as an offense, i just cannot understand all this frenesy about clouds ... As now qemu has direct support for glusterfs (a distributed filesystem) and glusterfs daemon[1] should run on any Unix-like OS you can have OpenBSD-based cloud too :D For glusterfs is that you won't be able to mount it on OpenBSD as other posix filesystem as there's neither support nor FUSE-like workaround. You can of course try to port KVM to OpenBSD, hehe. jirib [1] http://community.gluster.org/q/does-glusterfs-support-freebsd/
Re: bsd cloud
That would be great! KVM on openbsd. The joyent folks did it with illumos/opensolaris based smartos. I would think a port to OpenBSD would be possible. Sent from my Android phone using TouchDown (www.nitrodesk.com) -Original Message- From: Jiri B [ji...@devio.us] Received: Tuesday, 27 Nov 2012, 2:20pm To: Friedrich Locke [friedrich.lo...@gmail.com] CC: openbsd-misc [misc@openbsd.org] Subject: Re: bsd cloud On Tue, Nov 27, 2012 at 04:13:47PM -0200, Friedrich Locke wrote: Hi folks, i have seen, some minutes ago, a message about cloud with BSD! I have seen announcements on cloud computing every where. What is the difference between a BSD cloud and a linux cloud ? A windows cloud and a linux cloud ? Isn't all that the new buzz word in the market ? So what would a BSD cloud be different in the context of cloud (not openbsd features) ? So in essence what is it really cloud we have not doing since networks have been in the game ? Don't take this as an offense, i just cannot understand all this frenesy about clouds ... As now qemu has direct support for glusterfs (a distributed filesystem) and glusterfs daemon[1] should run on any Unix-like OS you can have OpenBSD-based cloud too :D For glusterfs is that you won't be able to mount it on OpenBSD as other posix filesystem as there's neither support nor FUSE-like workaround. You can of course try to port KVM to OpenBSD, hehe. jirib [1] http://community.gluster.org/q/does-glusterfs-support-freebsd/
Re: bsd cloud
i have seen, some minutes ago, a message about cloud with BSD! I have seen announcements on cloud computing every where. What is the difference between a BSD cloud and a linux cloud ? A windows cloud and a linux cloud ? Isn't all that the new buzz word in the market ? It's bullshit marketing blah-blah if the cloud cannot be automated, i.e. it must be possible to provision new RAM and CPU resources with an API. In fact, it's all about APIs ... the OS defines the APIs available to access those RAM and CPU resources (most significant difference would be Windows vs Unix). It's all about abstraction of the infrastructure, and automation. As a user, I don't care if my API calls manage virtual machines or force an intern to timely do everything manually on bare metal for me, using jolts of electricity. That's also what makes it potentially interesting -- just not from a security point of view. In case of virtualization, the guest OS (possibly OpenBSD) can never be any more secure than the host OS (usually Linux), and the whole setup is more risky overall due to added complexity and additional attack vectors. On the plus side, the things one can build with an infrastructure that can be 100% automated are quite cool, at the very least in terms of auto-repair (covering most types of failures) and the hyped auto-scaling. So what would a BSD cloud be different in the context of cloud (not openbsd features) ? Different long- and short-term maintenance, I would say (in my experience with OpenBSD, better + cheaper than Linux). And, with OpenBSD as the guest, I would also expect significant benefit wrt security: due to its nature in general, and lack of unnecessary complexity in particular. From a dogmatic point of view, however, OpenBSD in the cloud is not desired (due to the security issues wrt virtualization). IOW, I'd also be very much interested in a proper compute cloud offering OpenBSD instances, ideally with an EC2-compatible API ... it would be an improvement. So in essence what is it really cloud we have not doing since networks have been in the game ? Don't take this as an offense, i just cannot understand all this frenesy about clouds ... Automation. 42. Many people seem to mix up cloud computing with plain virtual servers, grid computing, clustering, whatever ... but those are just possible components, and what it boils down to is abstraction and automation -- at least from an engineering point of view. Moritz
