Re: [Mpls] Racism and the MPS
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Anyone who reads the papers knows that Denny's, particularly in the period referred to by Mr. Mann, was one of the most notoriously racist service companies in American history. You must be kidding with that statement. ...most notorious racist service companies in American history. I guess anything I say would take this way off the Mpls course we're suppose to stay on, butit begs me toquestion your knowledge of American history. Eric Mitchell Maple GroveDo You Yahoo!? LAUNCH - Your Yahoo! Music Experience
[Mpls] Racism and the MPS
Mr. Robson uses a not so sly method of putting words in my mouth, then attacking me for something I didn't say. What I said in the text of my post is what I meant to say. The subtext that Mr. Robson talks about is the product of his own imagination and ignorance. -Doug Mann, King Field In a message dated 5/16/2002 7:35:19 PM Central Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I'm sure a smart guy like Mr. Mann, who has a long history of chastising the MPS on the basis of ability grouping and other complaints, knows what he is doing when he draws an analogy between Denny's, a service company with one of the most notoriously racist histories in American corporate annals, with the people who work within the Minneapolis Public Schools. It is a not so sly way of saying that the MPS is racist and that if it stopped its racist behavior then matters would improve. If that wasn't a subtext of what Mr. Mann intended to say then his communication skills are on the fritz. My experience with MPS personnel, black, white and whatever, is that, if anything, they are less racist than the population and society at large. Yes, I'm a white male with a white male child, but I can only tell you what I know and experience. Rather than Mr. Mann's passive-aggressive inference, I'd like to ask the list straight out how they feel the MPS does in matters of race--and I'm not talking about test scores. Britt Robson Lyndale ___ Minneapolis Issues Forum - A Civil City Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Unsubscribe, Digest option, and more: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
Re: [Mpls] Racism and the MPS
When I read Doug Mann's restaurant and race post, I didn't get the same reaction as Britt Robson. I didn't see any subtext or any attempt by Doug to charge the Minneapolis schools with overt racism. What I did get from his example is a useful lesson in understanding how we Americans deal with and fumble with bias, hate, and discrimination. The lesson is: You can't change attitudes in the short term. But you can change behavior and if you take that as a victory, it may lead to long term change in attitudes. If we can adjust our expectations to implement policies that change behavior and don't try to lay down policies that change attitudes, we may make some progress. Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar. David Wilson Loring Park ___ Minneapolis Issues Forum - A Civil City Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Unsubscribe, Digest option, and more: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
Re: [Mpls] Racism and the MPS
David Wilson wrote: When I read Doug Mann's restaurant and race post, I didn't get the same reaction as Britt Robson. I didn't see any subtext or any attempt by Doug to charge the Minneapolis schools with overt racism. I also didn't see any secondary messages in Mr. Mann's post. And, although I strongly disagree with his position on ability grouping, I would like to take this opportunity to endorse his candidacy for the MPS school board (which of course doesn't mean that I won't be running myself). Mr. Mann knows the research on his issues and is passionately supportive of the right of students to be guaranteed a quality education. The school board definitely needs more knowledgeable and passionate advocates for quality education, whoever they may be. Michael Atherton Prospect Park ___ Minneapolis Issues Forum - A Civil City Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Unsubscribe, Digest option, and more: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
Re: [Mpls] Racism and the MPS
Judging from the responses of Mr. Wilson and Mr. Mann, and the yawning silence from the rest of the list, it is apparent that others don't share my view that in a recent post Mr. Mann was not so subtlely inferring that the MPS has been practicing racist behavior toward its students. Fair enough. But when I go back and reread Mr. Mann's comments, I can't help but think he was drawing an anology between the situation where he worked at Denny's in the 1980s and the current situation within the public schools--otherwise, what was the point of his long and detailed post? Anyone who reads the papers knows that Denny's, particularly in the period referred to by Mr. Mann, was one of the most notoriously racist service companies in American history. Even if they didn't know this, Mr. Mann's post goes into some detail about this, referring to one colleague who thought of black customers as "niggers" and referring to another one of his worker colleagues who quit rather than wait on black people, and apparently tried to get Mr. Mann fired because he wanted to institute a policy where all people are treated equally. The ultimate lesson Mr. Mann learned from his experience at Denny's was that black people would tip as well as white people if they were afforded the same level of service. He goes on to say, "I advocate a similar approach to improving classroom climate, reducing class and racial antagonisms, and reducing the suspension rate gap between black and white students within the Minneapolis Public Schools." So, how am I off base by supposing Mr. Mann believes blacks and whites are not treated equally within the MPS--that, in other words, whether through malicious prejudice or simple ignorance, the MPS is indulging in racist behavior toward its students? If that is not what he is saying, then what is he saying? I guess I should add that I am aware that Mr. Mann was once involved in an NAACP lawsuit alleging that the State was allowing a racially discriminatory situation to remain within the MPS. But even if that were not the case, I think I would draw the same conclusions from what he posted. Finally, I do not want to turn this into a personal spat and I understand that parts of my last post were needlessly inflammatory. In that spirit I want to repeat a question from my last post that was less personal and hopefully more substantative: To what degree do you feel that the problems of student behavior at MPS are grounded in racism? To what extent do you feel that Superintendent Johnson and the MPS board are trying to remedy the problem? Britt Robson Lyndale
Re: [Mpls] Racism and the MPS
In a message dated 5/17/02 8:58:30 PM Central Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Judging from the responses of Mr. Wilson and Mr. Mann, and the yawning silence from the rest of the list, it is apparent that others don't share my view that in a recent post Mr. Mann was not so subtlely inferring that the MPS has been practicing racist behavior toward its students. Based on the public statements Mr. Mann has made on numerous occassions over several years (until at least January 2000) before the Board of Ed in taped, broadcast and televised meetings, I think it is safe to say that Mr. Mann believes that MPS is a racist organization. Mr. Mann said many times that he believed that the community schools move was an intentional strategy to re-segregate schools and that the community schools system of student assignment should be ended. I don't know Mr. Mann personally, so I don't know if he continues to hold those views, but he certainly did on the many occassions that he spoke before the school board while I served on it. Ann Berget (Former BOE member 1992-1999) Kingfield-in-the-Eighth
RE: [Mpls] Racism and the MPS
Please, list members, to focus on MPS institutional racism (or lack thereof), not Doug Mann personally. David Brauer List manager ___ Minneapolis Issues Forum - A Civil City Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subscribe, Unsubscribe, Digest option, and more: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
