RE: Electric Car Shuttle System, Buses, et al.
Russell Peterson says, in part: >I guess I just wanted to see if anybody else had some "out of the box" ideas regarding our bus and transit possibilities. > Ok, a few thoughts: It's tough to talk transit options absent fossil fuel inputs. In general, it requires about three units of fossil fuel input to get one unit of electricity in conventional, stand alone applications. There's talk of local electricity shortages in the not too distant future. How about a combined cycle, relatively small-scale power production facility in downtown Minneapolis; one that uses waste heat for expanded district space conditioning (heating/air conditioning) for planned riverfront development projects (i.e. commercial office/retail, hotels and residential developments), while supplying electricity for local businesses, electric buss/trolley, light-rail or commuter rail transit. The certificate of need process for such a power facility would require five years minimum, plus a couple years construction time. Combine that with a downtown casino built in combination with a multi-purpose stadium-- the stadium to be funded in whole or in part with Minneapolis' portion of casino profits over about a three-ten year time frame in exchange for an equity position in the professional sports teams involved (there is talk of $100 million a year from a proposed casino's profits going to state coffers... what's the local government cut on such a revenue stream- it should be significant? Who adds value to such a business endeavor in terms of local municipal services, etc.?) The casino would be privately financed- no TIF funding. Gambling tax revenues would bolster the City general fund indefinitely, while allowing offsets or no-growth in property taxes/sales tax levels, etc. The state's portion of such gambling tax revenue funds could be allocated to improve transit options, toward k-12 education, health care, etc. Expanded transit options (i.e. North Star line to St. Cloud via Anoka, Elk River, Monticello, etc.) could radiate outward from the central Minneapolis casino/stadium district, drawing visitors, consumers and workers to and from the downtown area without use of automobiles. Reverse commutes would allow downtown residents to get to jobs and leisure activities in the suburbs/outlying cities without reliance on automobiles. In ten years time we could see commuter rail/LRT/expanded diesel or electric bus options available to link Minneapolis with Minnetonka, St. Paul, Apple Valley/Eagan, Blaine, Forest Lake and elsewhere. In twenty years we could commute to the Mayo in Rochester, the Twin Ports of Duluth/Superior, Mankato, Madison and Chicago-- without use of automobiles, on new or improved rail options. Let the private sector bid to build, own and operate the transit systems. Watch higher-density, affordable housing and commercial development grow along transit routes- people value time and convenience. With a deregulated electric market, investors and independent power producers would bid to supply power to operate such transit options-- trains where riders could sit at desks and plug in their laptops (or rent them) while enroute to Duluth or Rochester for example. Independent power producers could supply electricity with traditional fossil-fueled technology, wind or biomass conversion technologies. It's the new millennium... what do you want to see in ten, twenty years? Lets be sure our elected leaders are on board. Michael Hohmann, Principal Michael A. Hohmann and Co. (MAHCO) 4100 Ewing Ave. So. Minneapolis, MN 55410-1021 612-922-1490 http://www2.visi.com/mahco ~Market research, financial analysis, business plans and writing~ > -Original Message- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Russell Wayne Peterson > Sent: Monday, January 01, 2001 7:52 PM > To: Multiple recipients of list > Subject: RE: Electric Car Shuttle System, Buses, et al. > > > How about gondolas from the airport to downtown and from downtown to St. > Paul. Good now, that I've got your attention ;-) > > The system that Jack cited, taxicabs, relies on a driver and > fossil fuels in > order to work. I don't think those things are needed to necessarily > envision a different system. As far as the "rider ship definitions," I > don't think we have our targets defined very well, otherwise we'd have > figured this out a long time ago and wouldn't have such an > unfriendly system > in place. > > I'd still like to see smaller buses that were electric instead of diesel > powered, some smaller shuttles running more frequently and some > sensitivity > to cross town and neighborhood destinations. And some amenities as I'd > mentioned before like coffee, books, or wireless internet access > on the bus. > And I still like that lotto idea, ever
RE: Electric Car Shuttle System, Buses, et al.
How about gondolas from the airport to downtown and from downtown to St. Paul. Good now, that I've got your attention ;-) The system that Jack cited, taxicabs, relies on a driver and fossil fuels in order to work. I don't think those things are needed to necessarily envision a different system. As far as the "rider ship definitions," I don't think we have our targets defined very well, otherwise we'd have figured this out a long time ago and wouldn't have such an unfriendly system in place. I'd still like to see smaller buses that were electric instead of diesel powered, some smaller shuttles running more frequently and some sensitivity to cross town and neighborhood destinations. And some amenities as I'd mentioned before like coffee, books, or wireless internet access on the bus. And I still like that lotto idea, everybody puts their ticket into a lottery and at the end of the year one is pulled worth a million dollars - I bet you'd see rider ship go up and you'd spend less on building roads. I bet that kind of incentive might even blow the rider ship definitions out of the water. I guess I just wanted to see if anybody else had some "out of the box" ideas regarding our bus and transit possibilities. That's what I'll be looking for in my candidates for 2001! Hope you are all well in the new year. Russ Peterson Ward 9 Standish R U S S E L L P E T E R S O N D E S I G N "You can only fly if you stretch your wings." Russell W. Peterson, RA, CID Founder 3857 23rd Avenue South Minneapolis, MN 55407 612-724-2331 [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Electric Car Shuttle System
Us "caraholics" sometimes have other reasons, particularly female caroholics. For example, in the good weather, I'm out in my car late at night. The busses are running at greater intervals at that hour and waiting for a bus in many places in this city--or any city or small town or even totally rural areas--are not safe places for women to wait for a bus. i.e. Lake and Chicago, Lake and 4th Av., Lake and Bloomington, anywhere on Nicollet Mall now that they've torn down the Times Cafe, 103rd and 3rd Av. Those places are not all that safe for men either. I received commendations when I drove because men called in to say that my being there (at Hennepin and Lagoon, for example) saved them from a mugging or worse. I gave free rides to young girls who were being harassed by ghouls in cars looking for a female to abuse. Men and women both have been pulled off bicycles by gang bangers who take pride in the fact that they always have a bicycle, but have never bougfht one. My foster kid was harassed by a passenger who got off the bus behind her just to continue harassing her because he didn't like how she looked. Being a caraholic has a lot to do with trying to stay safe in a hostile world. WMarks, Central John Akre wrote: > I would like to add a third kind of person who uses transit (there are > also probably many other types of people who use transit). I choose to > use transit and don't own a car (but I could afford one if I chose) > because of global warming and the environmental impact of automobiles. I > know that I'm not the only one like this, and I also think this type of > transit-using people will be growing in number as folks realize how > dangerous the overreliance on car transport is to life on earth. > Caraholics always say they need their cars because they need to make all > these side trips, and I do feel pity for them. But if you don't drive > you find that you schedule and arrange things differently (call it > linear living), so you don't have to be running back and forth so much. > People around the world really are coming to their senses and giving up > cars. This will catch on in Minneapolis, the city will change, and if > someone needs to go just a few blocks a pedicab, a streetcar, a scooter, > a pogo stick or a nice pair of walking shoes will be so much more > convenient and planet-friendly than an electric car shuttle system. > > Here's to 2001! > John Akre > Sheridan Neighborhood > www.sheridanneighborhood.org > > PS: Basing a transportation system on the presumption of traction > between rubber tires and asphalt roads just seems silly in a place with > winter days like this one. I'm looking forward to rail transport in > Minneapolis. > > > > > Date: Wed, 27 Dec 2000 23:15:13 -0800 > > From: "Carol Becker" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > Subject: Re: Electric Car Shuttle System > > Message-ID: <000d01c0709d$ec776d40$[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > > Part of the answer lies in why people ride transit. There are two kinds of > > people who ride transit: people who have no other transit option (mainly the > > poor, disabled, and elderly) and those who are going to work. In the Twin > > Cities, 32% of riders have no other transit option and 81% of people are > > going to work. Also, 75% of persons riding transit are doing so during the > > rush hour. > > > > For the people going to work (the majority of riders), they usually are not > > making multiple stops. They are going from work to home or home to work. > > If they need to make multiple stops, they usually drive (70% of folksing > > taking transit have access to a car) or they use pool cars provided by their > > employer. > > > > Carol Becker > > Longfellow
Re: Electric Car Shuttle System
I would like to add a third kind of person who uses transit (there are also probably many other types of people who use transit). I choose to use transit and don't own a car (but I could afford one if I chose) because of global warming and the environmental impact of automobiles. I know that I'm not the only one like this, and I also think this type of transit-using people will be growing in number as folks realize how dangerous the overreliance on car transport is to life on earth. Caraholics always say they need their cars because they need to make all these side trips, and I do feel pity for them. But if you don't drive you find that you schedule and arrange things differently (call it linear living), so you don't have to be running back and forth so much. People around the world really are coming to their senses and giving up cars. This will catch on in Minneapolis, the city will change, and if someone needs to go just a few blocks a pedicab, a streetcar, a scooter, a pogo stick or a nice pair of walking shoes will be so much more convenient and planet-friendly than an electric car shuttle system. Here's to 2001! John Akre Sheridan Neighborhood www.sheridanneighborhood.org PS: Basing a transportation system on the presumption of traction between rubber tires and asphalt roads just seems silly in a place with winter days like this one. I'm looking forward to rail transport in Minneapolis. > > Date: Wed, 27 Dec 2000 23:15:13 -0800 > From: "Carol Becker" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Subject: Re: Electric Car Shuttle System > Message-ID: <000d01c0709d$ec776d40$[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > Part of the answer lies in why people ride transit. There are two kinds of > people who ride transit: people who have no other transit option (mainly the > poor, disabled, and elderly) and those who are going to work. In the Twin > Cities, 32% of riders have no other transit option and 81% of people are > going to work. Also, 75% of persons riding transit are doing so during the > rush hour. > > For the people going to work (the majority of riders), they usually are not > making multiple stops. They are going from work to home or home to work. > If they need to make multiple stops, they usually drive (70% of folksing > taking transit have access to a car) or they use pool cars provided by their > employer. > > Carol Becker > Longfellow
Re: Electric Car Shuttle System
Part of the answer lies in why people ride transit. There are two kinds of people who ride transit: people who have no other transit option (mainly the poor, disabled, and elderly) and those who are going to work. In the Twin Cities, 32% of riders have no other transit option and 81% of people are going to work. Also, 75% of persons riding transit are doing so during the rush hour. For the people going to work (the majority of riders), they usually are not making multiple stops. They are going from work to home or home to work. If they need to make multiple stops, they usually drive (70% of folksing taking transit have access to a car) or they use pool cars provided by their employer. Carol Becker Longfellow - Original Message - From: Russell Wayne Peterson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: Multiple recipients of list <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Wednesday, December 27, 2000 7:09 AM Subject: Electric Car Shuttle System > I read the article RT forwarded about how in California people are taking > the rail into the city to a point and then getting a car they've parked > there to drive in the rest of the way. I've always wondered how an > LRTsystem works where many people need to go to meetings at different sites. > Our bus system really doesn't serve that very well and neither will LRT. I > know that PRT would serve it, but since we haven't gone down that venue > quite let, I've kind of put that aside in my thinking. > > Perhaps we need a system of cars that are available for people to move > across town once they are at work: kind of a park and ride in reverse. You > could take a bus or lrt to your work place and then once you get to work, > let's assume downtown for now, you would have a place with rental electric > cars that you could drive and shuttle yourself around to meetings if need > be. We could use a card coded system to log miles and who uses the cars. > It might get complicated, but could be worthwhile. Does anybody know of > such a system in the world? Or does anybody have any thoughts on this kind > of system working with LRT and a better bus system? > > Russ Peterson > Ward 9 > Standish > > R U S S E L L P E T E R S O N D E S I G N > "You can only fly if you stretch your wings." > > Russell W. Peterson, RA, CID > Founder > > 3857 23rd Avenue South > Minneapolis, MN 55407 > > 612-724-2331 > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > -Original Message- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Steve Sumner (home) > Sent: Tuesday, December 26, 2000 12:01 PM > To: Multiple recipients of list > Subject: Mr. Wellstone needs an k-12 education > > > I've support publicly the referendum, and wrote an article that was > published in the local newspaper stating such. > The referendum brings that school budget under more local control, but the > next step in this is to remove the same amount from the state funding. > Regarding the numbers... > Two things need to happen here : > 1. Separate the ELL and Special Ed student numbers from overall test score > numbers. This would be a more fair representation of comparison numbers. > 2. The school administration needs to be serious about addressing the real > issues that the standards report points out, instead of looking for excuses. > > There are real problems in the Minneapolis school system, and they won't get > solved with excuses. Some of the issues aren't seen as much in other school > districts. The cities generally face these issues more than the subs. The > school system needs to address itself to how to deal with these issues > instead of looking for excuses. > Steve Sumner > Ward 1 > >
Re: Electric Car Shuttle System
Methinks we already have the system envisioned below - they are called taxicabs. > >Perhaps we need a system of cars that are available for people to move >across town once they are at work: > Does anybody know of such a system in the world? >-Original Message- snip Jack Ferman Minneapolis, MN [EMAIL PROTECTED]
