Re: A straightforward transition plan (was: Re: V6 still not supported)

[Masataka Ohta]

Pascal Thubert (pthubert) wrote:

Hi,


Solutions must first avoid broadcast as much as possible, because
there's also the cost of it.


Though I'm not saying all the broadcast must be repeated,
if you think moderate broadcast is costly, just say,
CATENET.

I remember old days when entire network of CERN with
thousands of hosts was managed to be a single Ethernet
several years after we learned dividing network by
routers can prevent various problems caused by broadcast.

It was, at least partly, because operating multi-protocol
routers is painful. Unlike most sites at that time, non
IP protocols such as DECnet was popular at CERN.

As IPv4 became dominant, problems went away.


Then you want zerotrust, ND is so easy to
attack from inside and even outside. This is RFC 8928.


As many people are saying zerotrust relying on PKI, which
blindly trust CAs as TPPs (trusted third parties), which
are confirmed-to-be-untrustworthy third parties by
Diginotar, zerotrust is not very meaningful beyond
marketing hype.

Anyway, relying on link broadcast implies that the link
is trusted to some extent, which is not ND specific.


Ethernet is enterprise networks is largely virtualized. We cannot
offer fast and reliable broadcast services on a worldwide overlay.


Unlike CERN in the past, today, I can see no point to have large
Ethernet, though some operators may be hyped to deploy expensive
service of telco for nothing.


Add to that the desire by the device to own more and more addresses.


What? How can it happen with IPv4?


You want a contract between that the host and the network that the
host owns an address and is reachable at that address. Like any
contract, that must be a negotiation. ND is not like that. RFC 8505
is exactly that.


Ignoring poor IPv6, I'm afraid it a property of not ARP but DHCP.


It may be more constructive to work for proxy ARP suitable for
Wifi, which may be enforced by Wifi alliance. An RFC may be
published if Wifi industry request IETF to do so.


This is effectively done already for ND.


I agree with you but my point is that it is more constructive for ARP.


I guess the design can be easily retrofitted to ARP. ND is really
designed exactly as ARP. The differences were for the show, the real
steps that should have been made were not. But now with RFC 8505 we
have a modern solution. The problem is no more on the standard side,
it is adoption. People will not move if it does not hurt enough. And
they can bear a lot.


But, for adoption, some formal document, not necessarily a (standard
track) rfc, is necessary.

Masataka Ohta

Re: starlink downlink/internet access

[Mike Hammett]

"they have just recently within the past 12 months started putting it into more 
widespread use" 


That's a pretty good definition of new. 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 

- Original Message -

From: "Eric Kuhnke"  
To: "nanog@nanog.org list"  
Sent: Friday, January 13, 2023 2:06:57 PM 
Subject: Re: starlink downlink/internet access 



AS14593 is not new, they joined the SIX 3+ years ago, from an outside-of-spacex 
view they have just recently within the past 12 months started putting it into 
more widespread use. 





On Wed, Jan 11, 2023 at 11:10 AM Mike Hammett < na...@ics-il.net > wrote: 





Here's their new stuff: 

https://bgp.he.net/AS14593 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 



From: "Eric Dugas via NANOG" < nanog@nanog.org > 
To: "Tom Beecher" < beec...@beecher.cc > 
Cc: nanog@nanog.org 
Sent: Wednesday, January 11, 2023 10:23:15 AM 
Subject: Re: starlink downlink/internet access 



Starlink has nothing to do with Google Fiber. It used to use Google Cloud for 
routing (BYOIP) in the early days but I am sure this has changed. 

Eric 


On Wed, Jan 11, 2023 at 9:51 AM Tom Beecher < beec...@beecher.cc > wrote: 



I can say with certainty at least one downlink location is not using Google 
Fiber, as I am sitting about 1/2 mile from it , and have firsthand knowledge of 
all glass in the ground around here. 


On Wed, Jan 11, 2023 at 12:14 AM Dave Taht < dave.t...@gmail.com > wrote: 


I maintain an email list for issues specific to starlink here: 
https://lists.bufferbloat.net which has multiple experts on it. There 
are also quite a few folk on twitter covering what's going on there. 

The latest information I had was that they'd started off hooked up to 
google's stuff but have been building out their own network wherever 
they can. 


On Tue, Jan 10, 2023 at 8:50 PM Ong Beng Hui < on...@ispworkshop.com > wrote: 
> 
> Hi folks, 
> 
> Anyone know/advise if Starlink internet downlink is in US Google fiber ? 
> I thought I saw a message before that Starlink was using Google fiber. 
> 
> I was referring to the actual internet transit, not the Satellite 
> downlink station. 
> 
> Please advise. 
> 


-- 
This song goes out to all the folk that thought Stadia would work: 
https://www.linkedin.com/posts/dtaht_the-mushroom-song-activity-698135607352320-FXtz
 
Dave Täht CEO, TekLibre, LLC 

[NANOG-announce] NANOG Committee Nominations are Open!

[Valerie Wittkop]

Dear NANOG Community,



Nominations
 are
now open for six NANOG Committees! We are looking for volunteers to serve
on the Program Committee, Diversity Equity and Inclusion Committee,
Education Committee, Elections Committee, Mentorship Committee, and
Scholarship Committee.



Specific committee charters and member responsibilities are linked here
 and
appointments are  2-year terms, except if appointed to complete a
mid-appointment term.



Committee nominations will close at 9:00pm EST on Tuesday, 14 February,
2023. The NANOG Board of Directors will make appointments within the week.
Emails detailing the selection results will be sent to candidates shortly
thereafter, and a full announcement will be sent during the following week.



Volunteer participation by members on NANOG committees is part of the
essential fabric of the NANOG organization. Committee members have
developed new programs, brought new ideas and new methods into practice,
and helped to evolve the NANOG organization.



Please consider running for a NANOG committee if you are passionate about
NANOG and can commit to participating! If you know someone that you believe
would be interested, please nominate them. The nomination form is linked
from the 2023 Committee Nominations webpage
 and
accepts either self or 3rd party nominations. Board members are available
to discuss the opportunities, so do not hesitate to reach out to them if
you are interested and want to learn more.



As always, you can reach us through our website contact form here
, or by email to either
nanog-supp...@nanog.org or member-supp...@nanog.org



Cheers,


*Valerie Wittkop*
Program directorvwitt...@nanog.org | +1 734-730-0225 <+15038199432>
(mobile) | www.nanog.org
NANOG | 305 E. Eisenhower Pkwy, Suite 100 | Ann Arbor, MI 48108, USA
ASN 19230
___
NANOG-announce mailing list
NANOG-announce@nanog.org
https://mailman.nanog.org/mailman/listinfo/nanog-announce

NANOG Committee Nominations are Open!

[Valerie Wittkop]

Dear NANOG Community,



Nominations
 are
now open for six NANOG Committees! We are looking for volunteers to serve
on the Program Committee, Diversity Equity and Inclusion Committee,
Education Committee, Elections Committee, Mentorship Committee, and
Scholarship Committee.



Specific committee charters and member responsibilities are linked here
 and
appointments are  2-year terms, except if appointed to complete a
mid-appointment term.



Committee nominations will close at 9:00pm EST on Tuesday, 14 February,
2023. The NANOG Board of Directors will make appointments within the week.
Emails detailing the selection results will be sent to candidates shortly
thereafter, and a full announcement will be sent during the following week.



Volunteer participation by members on NANOG committees is part of the
essential fabric of the NANOG organization. Committee members have
developed new programs, brought new ideas and new methods into practice,
and helped to evolve the NANOG organization.



Please consider running for a NANOG committee if you are passionate about
NANOG and can commit to participating! If you know someone that you believe
would be interested, please nominate them. The nomination form is linked
from the 2023 Committee Nominations webpage
 and
accepts either self or 3rd party nominations. Board members are available
to discuss the opportunities, so do not hesitate to reach out to them if
you are interested and want to learn more.



As always, you can reach us through our website contact form here
, or by email to either
nanog-supp...@nanog.org or member-supp...@nanog.org



Cheers,


*Valerie Wittkop*
Program directorvwitt...@nanog.org | +1 734-730-0225 <+15038199432>
(mobile) | www.nanog.org
NANOG | 305 E. Eisenhower Pkwy, Suite 100 | Ann Arbor, MI 48108, USA
ASN 19230

Re: starlink downlink/internet access

[Eric Kuhnke]

AS14593 is not new, they joined the SIX 3+ years ago, from an
outside-of-spacex view they have just recently within the past 12 months
started putting it into more widespread use.



On Wed, Jan 11, 2023 at 11:10 AM Mike Hammett  wrote:

> Here's their new stuff:
>
> https://bgp.he.net/AS14593
>
>
>
> -
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Midwest Internet Exchange 
> 
> 
> 
> The Brothers WISP 
> 
> 
> --
> *From: *"Eric Dugas via NANOG" 
> *To: *"Tom Beecher" 
> *Cc: *nanog@nanog.org
> *Sent: *Wednesday, January 11, 2023 10:23:15 AM
> *Subject: *Re: starlink downlink/internet access
>
> Starlink has nothing to do with Google Fiber. It used to use Google Cloud
> for routing (BYOIP) in the early days but I am sure this has changed.
>
> Eric
>
> On Wed, Jan 11, 2023 at 9:51 AM Tom Beecher  wrote:
>
>> I can say with certainty at least one downlink location is not using
>> Google Fiber, as I am sitting about 1/2 mile from it , and have firsthand
>> knowledge of all glass in the ground around here.
>>
>> On Wed, Jan 11, 2023 at 12:14 AM Dave Taht  wrote:
>>
>>> I maintain an email list for issues specific to starlink here:
>>> https://lists.bufferbloat.net which has multiple experts on it. There
>>> are also quite a few folk on twitter covering what's going on there.
>>>
>>> The latest information I had was that they'd started off hooked up to
>>> google's stuff but have been building out their own network wherever
>>> they can.
>>>
>>>
>>> On Tue, Jan 10, 2023 at 8:50 PM Ong Beng Hui 
>>> wrote:
>>> >
>>> > Hi folks,
>>> >
>>> > Anyone know/advise if Starlink internet downlink is in US Google fiber
>>> ?
>>> > I thought I saw a message before that Starlink was using Google fiber.
>>> >
>>> > I was referring to the actual internet transit, not the Satellite
>>> > downlink station.
>>> >
>>> > Please advise.
>>> >
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> This song goes out to all the folk that thought Stadia would work:
>>>
>>> https://www.linkedin.com/posts/dtaht_the-mushroom-song-activity-698135607352320-FXtz
>>> Dave Täht CEO, TekLibre, LLC
>>>
>>
>

Weekly Global IPv4 Routing Table Report

[Routing Table Analysis Role Account]

This is an automated weekly mailing describing the state of the Global
IPv4 Routing Table as seen from APNIC's router in Japan.

The posting is sent to APOPS, NANOG, AfNOG, SANOG, PacNOG, SAFNOG
TZNOG, MENOG, BJNOG, SDNOG, CMNOG, LACNOG and the RIPE Routing WG.

Daily listings are sent to bgp-st...@lists.apnic.net.

For historical data, please see https://thyme.apnic.net.

If you have any comments please contact Philip Smith .

IPv4 Routing Table Report   04:00 +10GMT Sat 14 Jan, 2023

  BGP Table (Global) as seen in Japan.

Report Website: https://thyme.apnic.net
Detailed Analysis:  https://thyme.apnic.net/current/

Analysis Summary


BGP routing table entries examined:  919061
Prefixes after maximum aggregation (per Origin AS):  347675
Deaggregation factor:  2.64
Unique aggregates announced (without unneeded subnets):  445061
Total ASes present in the Internet Routing Table: 74077
Prefixes per ASN: 12.41
Origin-only ASes present in the Internet Routing Table:   63583
Origin ASes announcing only one prefix:   26147
Transit ASes present in the Internet Routing Table:   10494
Transit-only ASes present in the Internet Routing Table:429
Average AS path length visible in the Internet Routing Table:   4.2
Max AS path length visible:  55
Max AS path prepend of ASN (265020)  50
Prefixes from unregistered ASNs in the Routing Table:   994
Number of instances of unregistered ASNs:  1003
Number of 32-bit ASNs allocated by the RIRs:  41044
Number of 32-bit ASNs visible in the Routing Table:   34030
Prefixes from 32-bit ASNs in the Routing Table:  166103
Number of bogon 32-bit ASNs visible in the Routing Table:28
Special use prefixes present in the Routing Table:1
Prefixes being announced from unallocated address space:506
Number of addresses announced to Internet:   3064089600
Equivalent to 182 /8s, 162 /16s and 76 /24s
Percentage of available address space announced:   82.8
Percentage of allocated address space announced:   82.8
Percentage of available address space allocated:  100.0
Percentage of address space in use by end-sites:   99.6
Total number of prefixes smaller than registry allocations:  312162

APNIC Region Analysis Summary
-

Prefixes being announced by APNIC Region ASes:   240102
Total APNIC prefixes after maximum aggregation:   68700
APNIC Deaggregation factor:3.49
Prefixes being announced from the APNIC address blocks:  235168
Unique aggregates announced from the APNIC address blocks:97635
APNIC Region origin ASes present in the Internet Routing Table:   13228
APNIC Prefixes per ASN:   17.78
APNIC Region origin ASes announcing only one prefix:   3846
APNIC Region transit ASes present in the Internet Routing Table:   1771
Average APNIC Region AS path length visible:4.5
Max APNIC Region AS path length visible: 27
Number of APNIC region 32-bit ASNs visible in the Routing Table:   8486
Number of APNIC addresses announced to Internet:  773797504
Equivalent to 46 /8s, 31 /16s and 54 /24s
APNIC AS Blocks4608-4864, 7467-7722, 9216-10239, 17408-18431
(pre-ERX allocations)  23552-24575, 37888-38911, 45056-46079, 55296-56319,
   58368-59391, 63488-64098, 64297-64395, 131072-151865
APNIC Address Blocks 1/8,  14/8,  27/8,  36/8,  39/8,  42/8,  43/8,
49/8,  58/8,  59/8,  60/8,  61/8, 101/8, 103/8,
   106/8, 110/8, 111/8, 112/8, 113/8, 114/8, 115/8,
   116/8, 117/8, 118/8, 119/8, 120/8, 121/8, 122/8,
   123/8, 124/8, 125/8, 126/8, 133/8, 150/8, 153/8,
   163/8, 171/8, 175/8, 180/8, 182/8, 183/8, 202/8,
   203/8, 210/8, 211/8, 218/8, 219/8, 220/8, 221/8,
   222/8, 223/8,

ARIN Region Analysis Summary


Prefixes being announced by ARIN Region ASes:267585
Total ARIN prefixes after maximum aggregation:   121726
ARIN Deaggregation factor: 2.20
Prefixes being announced from the ARIN address blocks:   269035
Unique aggregates announced from the ARIN address blocks:129786
ARIN Region origin ASes present in the Internet Routing Table:19078
ARIN Prefixes per ASN:

Re: Ticketmaster contact

[Mike Lyon]

They are always a pain in the ass to reach.

What i ended up doing was spamming any technical and C-level execs i could find 
on LinkedIN and finally found one that was able to help. That was years ago 
though so i dont have a contact there anymore.

Wish you luck!

-Mike

> On Jan 13, 2023, at 05:46, Alex Buie  wrote:
> 
> Hi NANOG,
> 
> We're an ISP providing residential and business fixed internet
> services, and all of our ranges are blocked from accessing
> ticketmaster with the attached "Pardon the interruption, you are
> superhuman or a bot" message and have been for some time; customer
> complaint velocity has increased especially as of late so it's been a
> priority to try and get this working. We've done extensive checking to
> ensure there is no bot activity or scalping transiting our network, we
> aren't using cgNAT - each IP is a specific customer end installation
> (home/office), and we have rPKI set up.
> 
> Is there anyone from Ticketmaster on list who'd be willing to contact
> me for a conversation to see if we can resolve this for our mutual
> customers? Or could anyone provide me with a decent technical contact
> if they might have one? I would be eternally grateful. I have tried
> "fan support" numerous times, which provided helpful (/s) suggestions
> like "try purchasing tickets over LTE", or "use a different internet
> connection, like at a coffee shop", or "contact your ISP" (myself?
> lol), depending on the day. Also tried their "Global Monitoring
> Support" organization by phone and by email with little success.
> 
> ARIN contacts bounce back as a 550 5.7.133
> RESOLVER.RST.SenderNotAuthenticatedForGroup, looks like o365
> configured to not accept external messages.
> 
> If you've successfully managed to work this out with them, have any
> tips, or recognize what WAF/engine they're using from the page layout
> with UUID at the bottom to help me identify who else I might try
> contacting to see about getting recategorized, I would really
> appreciate hearing from you.
> 
> Thanks a bunch!
> 
> 
> Alex Buie
> Senior Cloud Operations Engineer
> 
> 450 Century Pkwy # 100 Allen, TX 75013
> D: 469-884-0225 | www.cytracom.com

Ticketmaster contact

[Alex Buie]

Hi NANOG,

We're an ISP providing residential and business fixed internet
services, and all of our ranges are blocked from accessing
ticketmaster with the attached "Pardon the interruption, you are
superhuman or a bot" message and have been for some time; customer
complaint velocity has increased especially as of late so it's been a
priority to try and get this working. We've done extensive checking to
ensure there is no bot activity or scalping transiting our network, we
aren't using cgNAT - each IP is a specific customer end installation
(home/office), and we have rPKI set up.

Is there anyone from Ticketmaster on list who'd be willing to contact
me for a conversation to see if we can resolve this for our mutual
customers? Or could anyone provide me with a decent technical contact
if they might have one? I would be eternally grateful. I have tried
"fan support" numerous times, which provided helpful (/s) suggestions
like "try purchasing tickets over LTE", or "use a different internet
connection, like at a coffee shop", or "contact your ISP" (myself?
lol), depending on the day. Also tried their "Global Monitoring
Support" organization by phone and by email with little success.

ARIN contacts bounce back as a 550 5.7.133
RESOLVER.RST.SenderNotAuthenticatedForGroup, looks like o365
configured to not accept external messages.

If you've successfully managed to work this out with them, have any
tips, or recognize what WAF/engine they're using from the page layout
with UUID at the bottom to help me identify who else I might try
contacting to see about getting recategorized, I would really
appreciate hearing from you.

Thanks a bunch!


Alex Buie
Senior Cloud Operations Engineer

450 Century Pkwy # 100 Allen, TX 75013
D: 469-884-0225 | www.cytracom.com

AS3257 / AS4436 / GTT Contact re route hijack

[Adam Blackington]

Can someone from GTT contact me off-list about this?  GTT is not an
upstream carrier for me  and the NOC doesn't seem to understand the
issue

Thank for your help. :)

Adam

On Thu, Jan 12, 2023 at 8:47 AM GTT NOC  wrote:

> Hello Team,
>
> As part of our ongoing improvements to enhance security measures for our
> customers, we no longer accept Request tickets via email. We request you to
> please log into our EtherVision  portal to
> open your ticket, it will then be picked up accordingly by our engineers.
> You can view a quick tutorial  on our Ethervision portal here
> .
>
>
>
> EtherVision  also allows
> you to check the status of existing tickets as well as access our Service
> Assurance contact information.
>
>
> If you do not have an EtherVision  login, 
> please contact
> your GTT account administrator or submit a request through our website
> .
>
>
>
> Thanks & Regards,
>
> Danish Aga
>
> Service Desk Analyst
>
> Client Portal: https://ethervision.gtt.net/
>
> GTT NOC: n...@gtt.net
>
> [image: image]
>
> --
> *From:* LionLink NOC 
> *Sent:* 12 January 2023 07:02
> *To:* GTT NOC 
> *Subject:* Route Hijack - 23.29.58.0/24
>
> *NOTE:* This is an external message. Please use caution when replying,
> opening attachments or clicking on any links in this e-mail.
> Hello GTT NOC,
>
> I am unsure why, but it appears you are advertising a netblock that I am
> assigned (199.116.84.0/24).  Can you please stop advertising my netbook
> ?
>
>
>
> [image: Screen Shot 2023-01-12 at 1.50.35 AM.png]
> [image: Screen Shot 2023-01-12 at 1.51.07 AM.png]
>
>
> *NOTICE: This e-mail is only intended for the person(s) to whom it is
> addressed and may contain confidential information. Unless stated to the
> contrary, any opinions or comments are personal to the writer and do not
> represent the official view of GTT Communications Inc or any of its
> affiliates. If you have received this e-mail in error, please notify us
> immediately by reply e-mail and then delete this message from your system.
> Please do not copy it or use it for any purposes, or disclose its contents
> to any other person. All quotes, offers, proposals and any other
> information in the body of this email is subject to, and limited by, the
> terms and conditions, signed service agreement and/or statement of work*
>

Very Best Regards,

Adam


*Adam Blackington, PSM, NSA*
Managing Partner

*LionLink Networks | *Infrastructure Solutions That Power The Enterprise
ablacking...@lionlink.net email  *| * (571) 482.1490 direct

Service Desk:  (844) DATA-CENTER, Option 2 or  supp...@lionlink.net