Re: ATT Dry Pairs?
Try asking for one of the following: 1. Farmer Line 2. Alarm Circuit I think there are a few other ways to ask for a dry pair that might circumvent the limited know-how of the people you are talking to, but, I don't recall them off the top of my head. Owen On Sep 30, 2010, at 1:52 PM, Brandon Galbraith wrote: Has anyone had any luck lately getting dry pairs from ATT? I'm in the Chicago area attempting to get a dry pair between two buildings (100ft apart) for some equipment, but when speaking to several folks at ATT the response I get is You want ATT service without the service? That's not logical!. Had no problems 3-4 years ago getting these sorts of circuits, but it appears it's gone the way of the dodo now. Any emails off-list are appreciated. -- Brandon Galbraith US Voice: 630.492.0464
Re: ATT Dry Pairs?
I'd set up something wireless between them. Just my $0.02. --Curtis On 9/30/2010 4:52 PM, Brandon Galbraith wrote: Has anyone had any luck lately getting dry pairs from ATT? I'm in the Chicago area attempting to get a dry pair between two buildings (100ft apart) for some equipment, but when speaking to several folks at ATT the response I get is You want ATT service without the service? That's not logical!. Had no problems 3-4 years ago getting these sorts of circuits, but it appears it's gone the way of the dodo now. Any emails off-list are appreciated.
Re: ATT Dry Pairs?
Or a (utility) telemetry circuit. None of these will necessarily get you a dry copper loop, depending on the facilities serving your two locations. Also the circuit length will undoubtedly be longer than 100ft so keep that in mind for whatever you're planning to do with it. You might also try a local CLEC. They can get dry loops from ATT in different qualities that match your intended use from a simple dry voice grade loop to an unloaded DSL capable loop. Whether the CLEC provide it to you in that form is another matter. Even if they do so, the loops may not be straight copper all the way through. On Oct 1, 2010, at 3:25, Owen DeLong o...@delong.com wrote: Try asking for one of the following: 1.Farmer Line 2.Alarm Circuit I think there are a few other ways to ask for a dry pair that might circumvent the limited know-how of the people you are talking to, but, I don't recall them off the top of my head. Owen On Sep 30, 2010, at 1:52 PM, Brandon Galbraith wrote: Has anyone had any luck lately getting dry pairs from ATT? I'm in the Chicago area attempting to get a dry pair between two buildings (100ft apart) for some equipment, but when speaking to several folks at ATT the response I get is You want ATT service without the service? That's not logical!. Had no problems 3-4 years ago getting these sorts of circuits, but it appears it's gone the way of the dodo now. Any emails off-list are appreciated. -- Brandon Galbraith US Voice: 630.492.0464
RE: ATT Dry Pairs?
We order these all of the time ( as a CLEC) for EoC connections or DSL on our equipment. The correct terminology is usually 2-wire or 4-wire copper loops. There will be specific NC/NCI codes depending on the iLEC region you are in and LEC you are working with. Within these loops, you will generally see at least the following types of circuits, normally these are really just different levels of qualifications the LEC is required to meet on the copper they provide (in terms of noise, attenuation, load coils, and # feet of bridge tap): HDSL (best) ADSL UCL (Unbundled copper loop - worst) Now the main issue is that these circuits are normally provisioned between a CO and an end-user location. I don't know if you'd be able to get them directly between two sites that are not ATT facilities without going back to the CO first (greatly increasing total loop length and probably decreasing max DSL speeds). The other thing to know is that in busy CO's, some of these line types (especially the higher quality loops) may be blacklisted meaning you either can't order them at all, or you can order them a different way at a much higher rate. The last issue I can think of is that you may not be able to get these at all from ATT's retail or business side of the house. If that is the case, find a local CLEC and see if they will help you out. -Scott -Original Message- From: Brandon Galbraith [mailto:brandon.galbra...@gmail.com] Sent: Thursday, September 30, 2010 4:53 PM To: nanog@nanog.org Subject: ATT Dry Pairs? Has anyone had any luck lately getting dry pairs from ATT? I'm in the Chicago area attempting to get a dry pair between two buildings (100ft apart) for some equipment, but when speaking to several folks at ATT the response I get is You want ATT service without the service? That's not logical!. Had no problems 3-4 years ago getting these sorts of circuits, but it appears it's gone the way of the dodo now. Any emails off-list are appreciated. -- Brandon Galbraith US Voice: 630.492.0464
Followup and Thanks: ATT Dry Pairs?
I just wanted to follow up and say Thank You to everyone who responded to my email regarding getting an alarm line from ATT. I've made some headway once I reached someone with clue, and everyone was extremely helpful with the information they provided. -- Brandon Galbraith US Voice: 630.492.0464
ATT Dry Pairs?
Has anyone had any luck lately getting dry pairs from ATT? I'm in the Chicago area attempting to get a dry pair between two buildings (100ft apart) for some equipment, but when speaking to several folks at ATT the response I get is You want ATT service without the service? That's not logical!. Had no problems 3-4 years ago getting these sorts of circuits, but it appears it's gone the way of the dodo now. Any emails off-list are appreciated. -- Brandon Galbraith US Voice: 630.492.0464
Re: ATT Dry Pairs?
Years ago I managed to get a dry pair from Verizon for some homebrew DSL, but there was some telco specific term for the dry pair, like series 7 alarm circuit or something. ATT may have their own term. -Ryan On Thu, Sep 30, 2010 at 4:52 PM, Brandon Galbraith brandon.galbra...@gmail.com wrote: Has anyone had any luck lately getting dry pairs from ATT? I'm in the Chicago area attempting to get a dry pair between two buildings (100ft apart) for some equipment, but when speaking to several folks at ATT the response I get is You want ATT service without the service? That's not logical!. Had no problems 3-4 years ago getting these sorts of circuits, but it appears it's gone the way of the dodo now. Any emails off-list are appreciated. -- Brandon Galbraith US Voice: 630.492.0464
RE: ATT Dry Pairs?
-Original Message- From: Ryan Shea Sent: Thursday, September 30, 2010 2:21 PM To: Brandon Galbraith Cc: nanog@nanog.org Subject: Re: ATT Dry Pairs? Years ago I managed to get a dry pair from Verizon for some homebrew DSL, but there was some telco specific term for the dry pair, like series 7 alarm circuit or something. ATT may have their own term. -Ryan Just plain alarm circuit works in most cases but it has been a while here as well.
Re: ATT Dry Pairs?
If your sales contact don't know what an alarm circuit is, go find ATT's tariff filed with your state's PUC. It will contain the name of the service. This will take some digging... Verizon Maryland calls this an Intraexchange local channel, regular voice grade and they go for $15.53/month. There are a plethora of different types of dry pairs that you can order depending on the signal bandwidth of the circuit and allowed attenuation. On Thu, Sep 30, 2010 at 4:52 PM, Brandon Galbraith brandon.galbra...@gmail.com wrote: Has anyone had any luck lately getting dry pairs from ATT? I'm in the Chicago area attempting to get a dry pair between two buildings (100ft apart) for some equipment, but when speaking to several folks at ATT the response I get is You want ATT service without the service? That's not logical!. Had no problems 3-4 years ago getting these sorts of circuits, but it appears it's gone the way of the dodo now. Any emails off-list are appreciated. -- Brandon Galbraith US Voice: 630.492.0464
Re: ATT Dry Pairs?
If the buildings are a 100ft apart, can't you just go with a wireless connection? Speeds would probably be better and no monthly fee! On 09/30/2010 06:08 PM, Robert Johnson wrote: If your sales contact don't know what an alarm circuit is, go find ATT's tariff filed with your state's PUC. It will contain the name of the service. This will take some digging... Verizon Maryland calls this an Intraexchange local channel, regular voice grade and they go for $15.53/month. There are a plethora of different types of dry pairs that you can order depending on the signal bandwidth of the circuit and allowed attenuation. On Thu, Sep 30, 2010 at 4:52 PM, Brandon Galbraith brandon.galbra...@gmail.com wrote: Has anyone had any luck lately getting dry pairs from ATT? I'm in the Chicago area attempting to get a dry pair between two buildings (100ft apart) for some equipment, but when speaking to several folks at ATT the response I get is You want ATT service without the service? That's not logical!. Had no problems 3-4 years ago getting these sorts of circuits, but it appears it's gone the way of the dodo now. Any emails off-list are appreciated. -- Brandon Galbraith US Voice: 630.492.0464
Re: ATT Dry Pairs?
On 9/30/2010 15:12, Bret Clark wrote: If the buildings are a 100ft apart, can't you just go with a wireless connection? Speeds would probably be better and no monthly fee! Wireless is not the end all solution for everything. ~Seth
Re: ATT Dry Pairs?
On Sep 30, 2010, at 6:30 PM, Seth Mattinen wrote: On 9/30/2010 15:12, Bret Clark wrote: If the buildings are a 100ft apart, can't you just go with a wireless connection? Speeds would probably be better and no monthly fee! Wireless is not the end all solution for everything. Understood, but for $160 you can get equipment that acts as a L2 bridge with RJ45 and PoE at 50Mb/s duplex. (UBNT Nanobridge 5, they're $79 per and do 5Ghz 802.11n MCS-15 @ 40Mhz channels). Just trying to help :) You may now shoot the off-topic messenger. - Jared
Re: ATT Dry Pairs?
On Thu, 30 Sep 2010 17:20:52 -0400, Ryan Shea ryans...@google.com wrote: ATT may have their own term. The industry standard term is UNE (unbundled network element.) However, the sales drones may not recognize that either. --Ricky
Re: ATT Dry Pairs?
On 9/30/2010 15:34, Jared Mauch wrote: On Sep 30, 2010, at 6:30 PM, Seth Mattinen wrote: On 9/30/2010 15:12, Bret Clark wrote: If the buildings are a 100ft apart, can't you just go with a wireless connection? Speeds would probably be better and no monthly fee! Wireless is not the end all solution for everything. Understood, but for $160 you can get equipment that acts as a L2 bridge with RJ45 and PoE at 50Mb/s duplex. (UBNT Nanobridge 5, they're $79 per and do 5Ghz 802.11n MCS-15 @ 40Mhz channels). Just trying to help :) The biggest laugh I always got when I worked at the local university as a student were trouble tickets to the Faraday cage rooms because the campus wireless internet didn't work inside them. But it's wireless! Yes, that's the problem. Please just use the damn cable. ~Seth
