Re: The Choice: IPv4 Exhaustion or Transition to IPv6
On Thu, 28 Jun 2007 10:33:25 EDT, JORDI PALET MARTINEZ said: I'm working on it ... But I think it will be really difficult to capture in a couple of pages what the document try to explain ! The story goes: Richard Feynman, the late Nobel Laureate in physics, was once asked by a Caltech faculty member to explain why spin one-half particles obey Fermi Dirac statistics. Rising to the challenge, he said, I'll prepare a freshman lecture on it. But a few days later he told the faculty member, You know, I couldn't do it. I couldn't reduce it to the freshman level. That means we really don't understand it. And he was talking about quantum mechanics. Surely we understand IPv4 exhaustion and IPv6 transitioning well enough to get it down to a few pages? pgp0kZpKmBUM2.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: The Choice: IPv4 Exhaustion or Transition to IPv6
I'm working on it ... But I think it will be really difficult to capture in a couple of pages what the document try to explain ! A. v4 runs out, use v6 or similar B. not run out of v4 The detail of A and B may safely be debated by all for some time as nobody knows what will happen, feel free to speculate wildly (with a nod to Deep Thought) brandon
Re: The Choice: IPv4 Exhaustion or Transition to IPv6
On Thu, 28 Jun 2007 16:00:36 BST, Alexander Harrowell said: 1. IPv4 address space is a scarce resource and it will soon be exhausted. 2. It hasn't run out already due to various efficiency improvements. 3. These are themselves limited. 4. IPv6, though, will provide abundant address space. 5. But there's no incentive to change until enough others do so to make it worthwhile. 6. Economists call this a collective action problem. Traditional solutions include legislation, market leadership, and agreements among small actors to achieve such leadership. OK? Ezzactly. :) pgpAx8EpaCpbe.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: The Choice: IPv4 Exhaustion or Transition to IPv6
Hmm I find this topic quite interesting. First is the belief that the Internet will suddenly break on the day when the last IP block is allocated by an RIR - the fact that most of the v4 space is currently not being announced may mean we have many years before there are real widespread shortages Second is the belief that this will prompt a migration to IPv6, as though moving to an entirely different and largely unsupported protocol stack is the logical thing to happen. Surely it is easier and far cheaper by use of existing technology for example for organisations to make efficient use of their public IPs and deploy NATs? As technology people we are looking at v6 as the clean bright future of IP, but the real world is driven by economics and I dont see v6 as being economically viable in the near future I'm also yet to hear a convincing explanation of how v6 and v4 are expected to interoperate in a v4 internet that contains v6 islands... Steve On Thu, Jun 28, 2007 at 10:33:25AM -0400, JORDI PALET MARTINEZ wrote: I'm working on it ... But I think it will be really difficult to capture in a couple of pages what the document try to explain ! Regards, Jordi De: Iljitsch van Beijnum [EMAIL PROTECTED] Responder a: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fecha: Thu, 28 Jun 2007 15:25:22 +0200 Para: [EMAIL PROTECTED] CC: nanog@nanog.org Asunto: Re: The Choice: IPv4 Exhaustion or Transition to IPv6 On 27-jun-2007, at 21:08, JORDI PALET MARTINEZ wrote: I've published a document trying to analyze the IPv4 exhaustion problem and what is ahead of us, considering among others, changes in policies. http://www.ipv6tf.org/index.php?page=news/newsroomid=3004 Ugh, a link to a page with a link... Do you have an executive summary for us? ** The IPv6 Portal: http://www.ipv6tf.org Bye 6Bone. Hi, IPv6 ! http://www.ipv6day.org This electronic message contains information which may be privileged or confidential. The information is intended to be for the use of the individual(s) named above. If you are not the intended recipient be aware that any disclosure, copying, distribution or use of the contents of this information, including attached files, is prohibited.
Re: The Choice: IPv4 Exhaustion or Transition to IPv6
Steve - For the first end site that has to connect via IPv6, it will be very bad if there is not a base of IPv6 web/email sites already in place. While there are going to efforts to recover unused IPv4 space, we're currently going through 10 to 12 blocks of /8 size annually, so you may get an additional year or two, but it doesn't change the end state. There's no reason for end organizations to change their existing IPv4 infrastructure, but they do need to get their public facing servers reachable via IPv6. Anyone who thinks that the ISP's community can continue to grow using smaller and smaller pieces of reclaimed IPv4 address space hasn't considered the resulting routing table. We've build an entire Internet based on the assumption that most new end user sites are getting hierarchical, aggregatable PA assignments. This assumption is soon to fail until there's an option for connecting customers up via new hierarchical address space. Interoperability is achieved by having public facing servers reachable via IPv4 and IPv6. /John At 4:00 PM +0100 6/28/07, Stephen Wilcox wrote: Hmm I find this topic quite interesting. First is the belief that the Internet will suddenly break on the day when the last IP block is allocated by an RIR - the fact that most of the v4 space is currently not being announced may mean we have many years before there are real widespread shortages Second is the belief that this will prompt a migration to IPv6, as though moving to an entirely different and largely unsupported protocol stack is the logical thing to happen. Surely it is easier and far cheaper by use of existing technology for example for organisations to make efficient use of their public IPs and deploy NATs? As technology people we are looking at v6 as the clean bright future of IP, but the real world is driven by economics and I dont see v6 as being economically viable in the near future I'm also yet to hear a convincing explanation of how v6 and v4 are expected to interoperate in a v4 internet that contains v6 islands... Steve On Thu, Jun 28, 2007 at 10:33:25AM -0400, JORDI PALET MARTINEZ wrote: I'm working on it ... But I think it will be really difficult to capture in a couple of pages what the document try to explain ! Regards, Jordi De: Iljitsch van Beijnum [EMAIL PROTECTED] Responder a: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fecha: Thu, 28 Jun 2007 15:25:22 +0200 Para: [EMAIL PROTECTED] CC: nanog@nanog.org Asunto: Re: The Choice: IPv4 Exhaustion or Transition to IPv6 On 27-jun-2007, at 21:08, JORDI PALET MARTINEZ wrote: I've published a document trying to analyze the IPv4 exhaustion problem and what is ahead of us, considering among others, changes in policies. http://www.ipv6tf.org/index.php?page=news/newsroomid=3004 Ugh, a link to a page with a link... Do you have an executive summary for us? ** The IPv6 Portal: http://www.ipv6tf.org Bye 6Bone. Hi, IPv6 ! http://www.ipv6day.org This electronic message contains information which may be privileged or confidential. The information is intended to be for the use of the individual(s) named above. If you are not the intended recipient be aware that any disclosure, copying, distribution or use of the contents of this information, including attached files, is prohibited.
Re: An IPv6 address for new cars in 3 years?
On Fri, 29 Jun 2007, Paul Ferguson wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 - -- Suresh Ramasubramanian [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 6/29/07, Rich Emmings [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Topicality: Looks like someone, somewhere intends to be live with IPv6 in 3-5 years. Off Topic: The privacy and security ramifications boggle the mind Fully mobile, high speed botnets? *bing* I can't help it: If a bot-car is headed north on I-75 at 73 miles per hour for 3 hours and a bot-truck is headed west on I-90 at 67 miles per hour, how long until they are 129 miles apart?
