Re: [neonixie-l] Re: IN-28's in real life...

[Bill Notfaded]

When I was in college at OSU we ran a 12 node ringdown BBS with all USR 16.8 
modems.  We used node PC's connected by netware 3.1. Each PC ran two USR 16.8 
modems online simultaneously and we had 6 node machines on the network.  We ran 
a proprietary underground BBS software called celerity.  Most days our 12 
telephone line were tied up and we had people calling our BBS from all over the 
world.  Our project was self funded by our members who would donate $ and 
hardware to our project.  It was a lot of fun.  It's funny when we had the 
phone company come to the house we were living in.  They mounted a box on the 
brick wall outside the second story window that could contain up to 128 phone 
lines to host our 12 phone line ringdown.

US Robotics were the Kings of modems... Every BBS like ours ran USR 16.8 
because while everyone else had 14.4k or slower modems we could all talk 
16.8k... the good ol' days for sure!

Bill

Fixed some phone spelling errors that irritated me.. 

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Re: [neonixie-l] Re: IN-28's in real life...

[Bill Notfaded]

When I was in college at OSU we ran a 12 node ringdown BBS with all USR
16.8 modems.  We used node PC's connected by netware 3.1. Each PC ran two
USR 16.8 modems online simultaneously and we had 6 node machines on the
network.  We ran a proprietary underground BBS software called celerity.
Most days our 12 telephone line where tied up and we had people calling our
BBS from all over the world.  Our project was stuff funded by our members
who would donate $ and hardware to our project.  It was a lot of fun.  It's
funny when we had the phone company come to the house we were living in.
They mounted a box on the brick wall outside the second story window that
could contain up to 128 phone lines to host our 12 phone line ringdown.

US Robotics were the Kings of modems... Every BBS like ours ran USR 16.8
because while everyone else had 14.4k or slower modems we could all talk
16.8k... the good ol' days for sure!

Bill
Bill

On Fri, May 31, 2019, 8:50 PM Terry Kennedy  wrote:

> On Friday, May 31, 2019 at 11:02:10 PM UTC-4, charles wrote:
>>
>> I was always sad about Gandalf, they kinda Zigged when everyone else
>> zagged.  Way Back when I recall showing one of their engineers one of
>> the First HAYES modems -and I asked why Gandalf was not in the market.
>> He answered that PCs were Kids stuff, and that they only made products
>> for data centers.
>>
>
> To be fair, that wasn't just Gandalf - that was the mind-set of most of
> the industry. In the product space that Gandalf occupied there were also
> companies like Case and DCA, neither of whom were able to successfully
> transition to the new market. DCA did a quick save by purchasing the IRMA
> company, who made 3270 adapters for PCs (and later Macs and also standalone
> units). So they had a new market, pretty much all to themselves, while
> continuing to have sales / support income from legacy customers.
>
> On the other hand, those established companies were selling their products
> at much higher prices (the 4-port terminal-side board for the PACX IV was
> $600, and most of that was profit) and they also had partnerships with
> established modem vendors like ComData and perhaps didn't want to disrupt
> those deals in order to get into a very price-sensitive market of unknown
> (at the time) size.
>
> There wasn't a lot of movement in the other direction - of the early
> low-end modem makers, US Robotics was probably the only one to get any sort
> of sizable penetration of the host-side market. Part of this was a complete
> lack of understanding about how sales were made on the host side - I don't
> think any of the low-end modem makers offered reasonable quantity discounts
> to end users, none offered lease / financing options, and all of them
> wanted MORE for a rackmount unit (which was a bare board - no case, manual,
> software, power adapter, cables, etc.) than they wanted for a standalone
> unit, and of course they also wanted big $ for the rackmount chassis. The
> sole example was Microcom, who graciously sold their rackmount modems for
> the same price as the standalone models.
>
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Re: [neonixie-l] Re: IN-28's in real life...

[Terry Kennedy]

On Friday, May 31, 2019 at 11:02:10 PM UTC-4, charles wrote:
>
> I was always sad about Gandalf, they kinda Zigged when everyone else 
> zagged.  Way Back when I recall showing one of their engineers one of 
> the First HAYES modems -and I asked why Gandalf was not in the market. 
> He answered that PCs were Kids stuff, and that they only made products 
> for data centers. 
>

To be fair, that wasn't just Gandalf - that was the mind-set of most of the 
industry. In the product space that Gandalf occupied there were also 
companies like Case and DCA, neither of whom were able to successfully 
transition to the new market. DCA did a quick save by purchasing the IRMA 
company, who made 3270 adapters for PCs (and later Macs and also standalone 
units). So they had a new market, pretty much all to themselves, while 
continuing to have sales / support income from legacy customers.

On the other hand, those established companies were selling their products 
at much higher prices (the 4-port terminal-side board for the PACX IV was 
$600, and most of that was profit) and they also had partnerships with 
established modem vendors like ComData and perhaps didn't want to disrupt 
those deals in order to get into a very price-sensitive market of unknown 
(at the time) size.

There wasn't a lot of movement in the other direction - of the early 
low-end modem makers, US Robotics was probably the only one to get any sort 
of sizable penetration of the host-side market. Part of this was a complete 
lack of understanding about how sales were made on the host side - I don't 
think any of the low-end modem makers offered reasonable quantity discounts 
to end users, none offered lease / financing options, and all of them 
wanted MORE for a rackmount unit (which was a bare board - no case, manual, 
software, power adapter, cables, etc.) than they wanted for a standalone 
unit, and of course they also wanted big $ for the rackmount chassis. The 
sole example was Microcom, who graciously sold their rackmount modems for 
the same price as the standalone models.

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Re: [neonixie-l] Re: IN-28's in real life...

[Charles MacDonald]

On 2019-05-31 10:36 p.m., Terry Kennedy wrote:
 Gandalf Quad PACX IV which was a 1024-terminal to 
512-host-port concentrator. Each port had 4 red LEDs, so a total of 6144 
LEDs. It also had a "lamp test" button. I bet you can see where this is 
going... Those LEDs gave off enough IR that you could feel it from quite 
some distance away 


I was always sad about Gandalf, they kinda Zigged when everyone else 
zagged.  Way Back when I recall showing one of their engineers one of 
the First HAYES modems -and I asked why Gandalf was not in the market. 
He answered that PCs were Kids stuff, and that they only made products 
for data centers.


I also recall lightly  hacking a PACX one time.  The computer I wanted 
at a certain local site had limited dial up lines, but the site where it 
was had other lines for commercial users - dialing up that line the PACX 
asked me to provide the "CLASS" I wanted and was happy to connect me.


--
Charles MacDonald Stittsville Ontario
cm...@zeusprune.ca  Just Beyond the Fringe
No Microsoft Products were used in sending this e-mail.

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Re: [neonixie-l] Re: IN-28's in real life...

[Terry Kennedy]

On Thursday, May 30, 2019 at 5:59:48 PM UTC-4, gregebert wrote:
>
> My big clock simulates clock-hands with 306 NE-2H bulbs; during self-test, 
> all of them light-up and you can actually *feel* the light on your face. 
> It's a weird sensation because the bulbs dont actually heat-up and 
> re-radiate in that short of time.
>

When I ran the computer center at St. Potato's (see 
https://www.glaver.org/blog/?p=926 for some background) we had acquired a 
donated Gandalf Quad PACX IV which was a 1024-terminal to 512-host-port 
concentrator. Each port had 4 red LEDs, so a total of 6144 LEDs. It also 
had a "lamp test" button. I bet you can see where this is going... Those 
LEDs gave off enough IR that you could feel it from quite some distance 
away - we'd have people stand there with their eyes closed and hit the lamp 
test button. I wonder how much of the power supply capacity was in there 
just to handle the lamp test function. Of course, IBM 370 systems had 
incandescent lamps and the CPU "lamp test" button would light up everything 
on the CPU and most peripherals - but that CPU had a 3-phase 60A power 
connector.

I eventually got a trade-in credit from DEC to replace the PACX with a 
bunch of DECserver 550 units. Between that credit, the educational 
discount, and some special discounts I applied creatively, they actually 
paid us to take the DS550s. And then we made them haul away the PACX, 
because it was a trade-in after all.

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RE: [neonixie-l] Restoring tube which will not light up

[Bill van Dijk]

No, for added traction the speakers must be facing up. Duh. ;-)

-Original Message-
From: neonixie-l@googlegroups.com [mailto:neonixie-l@googlegroups.com] On 
Behalf Of Mac Doktor
Sent: Friday, May 31, 2019 3:34 PM
To: neonixie-l@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: [neonixie-l] Restoring tube which will not light up


> If you have a neon testing wand, that would show if there was a possibility 
> of recovery.

The igniter from a gas stove or barbecue grill will work in a pinch. I use a 
Zerostat "pistol". It's also a piezoelectric device but mounted inside a 
convenient housing.


Terry Bowman, KA4HJH
"The Mac Doctor"

Q: Should car stereo speakers be pointed to the rear for more thrust or up for 
more traction?

A. On long trips, the 20- to 30% improvement in gas mileage you might get with 
speakers pointing to the rear is certainly worthwhile. On the other hand, if 
you drive on snow or ice, the extra traction of speakers pointing upward gives 
you added control.

Don Lancaster

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Re: [neonixie-l] OT - 20 chr VFDs >blech

[【ツ】John Smout]

Hi Keith,

I just found out where my boards are. I got hit with some customs duty and I 
only just got a bill to say so today. My displays should be with me on Monday 
now as I’ve sent the government its due.

The manual was sent out to me via second class post yesterday, so I might get 
it tomorrow or perhaps on Monday. I told the guy there was no hurry and second 
class was fine, because he was paying for the postage and I didn’t even know 
where my boards had disappeared to or, indeed, if I’d ever see them.

I am sure that among us all, we shall find a way to drive these babies.

Best wishes,

John S

> On 31 May 2019, at 19:53, Keith Moore  wrote:
> 
> John, 
> 
> Great. Let me know when you get this.  These boards look luscious.  It looks 
> like a parallel interface in, but the mapping of the pins would be tedious 
> without manual/schematics. 
> - Keith 

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Re: [neonixie-l] Restoring tube which will not light up

[Mac Doktor]

> If you have a neon testing wand, that would show if there was a possibility 
> of recovery.

The igniter from a gas stove or barbecue grill will work in a pinch. I use a 
Zerostat "pistol". It's also a piezoelectric device but mounted inside a 
convenient housing.


Terry Bowman, KA4HJH
"The Mac Doctor"

Q: Should car stereo speakers be pointed to the rear for more thrust or up for 
more traction?

A. On long trips, the 20- to 30% improvement in gas mileage you might get with 
speakers pointing to the rear is certainly worthwhile. On the other hand, if 
you drive on snow or ice, the extra traction of speakers pointing upward gives 
you added control.

Don Lancaster

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Re: [neonixie-l] OT - 20 chr VFDs >blech

[Keith Moore]

John, 

Great. Let me know when you get this.  These boards look luscious.  It 
looks like a parallel interface in, but the mapping of the pins would be 
tedious without manual/schematics. 
- Keith 

On Thursday, May 30, 2019 at 3:33:43 AM UTC-4, Nixcited delighted wrote:
>
> I have a complete manual, inc. schematics, for Alvin G’s 'Dinosaur Eggs' 
> on its way to me. This should be compatible with the VFD display boards. 
>
>
> https://www.ipdb.org/search.pl?name=dinosaur+eggs=20=name=advanced
>  
>
> Once I have the manual, I’ll scan the relevant pages and post them 
> somewhere. 
>
> Best wishes, 
>
> John S

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Re: [neonixie-l] Re: IN-28's in real life...

[Tyler Bourne]

I haven't gone over the power supply yet.  It looks like the main transformer 
is missing.  If I can figure out what voltages it needs I can find/make a 
replacement. The wires from the socket to the transformer look incredibly thin. 
With all digits lit it must draw around 150-200 watts if each one draws around 
50W.  The draw would depend on the time but I'm not sure how those thin wires 
handled it.  It might have some sort of multiplexing going on so that all 
segments are not lit at once.

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Re: [neonixie-l] Re: IN-28's in real life...

[Bill Notfaded]

Sounds like you could light up a stadium with it!

On Thursday, May 30, 2019 at 2:59:48 PM UTC-7, gregebert wrote:
>
> My big clock simulates clock-hands with 306 NE-2H bulbs; during self-test, 
> all of them light-up and you can actually *feel* the light on your face. 
> It's a weird sensation because the bulbs dont actually heat-up and 
> re-radiate in that short of time.
>

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[neonixie-l] Restoring tube which will not light up

[Nick]

A lot of ZM1350s are outgassed - they have a variable life.

Out of the several 100 I have bought, probably 10% to 15% were completely dead.

Jan (the main supplier) and I exchanged emails on this some years ago and he 
kindly replaced the dead ones that came from him - subsequently he tested all 
tubes before shipping with an amazing factory tester that he shows on his 
website.

Your one may indeed be outgassed and completely dead.

If you have a neon testing wand, that would show if there was a possibility of 
recovery.

Cheers

Nick

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