Re: [neonixie-l] Re: Half-digit neon bulb 25/15 mm long

[JohnK]

The web is full of fact and OPINION so be careful which content you choose to 
believe [we all know this].
AFAIK the usual electros that we encounter are not a PCB problem, but ARE 
various other problems. If standard electros have PCB content I definitely want 
to know - but I really avoid contact/association with any leakage anyway. I 
worry about the aroma that can be detected from certain brands. I have some 
small green electros from the 1990s that are stored in small sealable plastic 
bags with a small square of paper inside as a label. Many of the pieces of 
paper show brown stains where they have been in conact with the capacitors 
[particularly the seal around the legs]. They obviously do leak  - and who 
knows how much gas comes off too.
These particular ones I kept because there was a spate of these exploding 
during product testing. The very obnoxious "dead fish" smell given off bothered 
me. The management made poor attempts to garner information from the 
manufacturers. I kept them in case health issues arose.

[On the subject of outgassing:- last year we had twenty light bulbs/CFLs 
replaced free through a system forced on power companies by the government.
The Edison screw 10W bulbs were OK. The bayonet 10W bulbs produced an acrid 
chemical smell. The opaque white plastic of the base was the culprit. I had 
quite a bit of difficulty getting replacements out of that supplier. They may 
or may not have been in discussions with the lamp manufacturer/supplier BUT 
were exceedingly annoyed when I kept a single sample back from the exchange. 
That probably says something !
I made a couple of simple attempts to interest government and goverment 
utilities in the possibility of a danger. I would have to push quite hard for 
it to go anywhere. I currently have serious health issues that have put that on 
hold.]



Here is a nice document for those in Australia:-
http://nepc.gov.au/system/files/resources/378b7018-8f2a-8174-3928-2056b44bf9b0/files/anzecc-gl-identification-pcb-containing-capacitors-information-booklet-electricians-and-electrical.pdf

John K
  - Original Message - 
  From: gregebert 
  To: neonixie-l 
  Sent: Tuesday, October 31, 2017 10:55 AM
  Subject: [neonixie-l] Re: Half-digit neon bulb 25/15 mm long


  If I had to guess, one or more electrolytic caps has probably dried-up and is 
no longer working as a capacitor. Probably a good idea to replace all of them 
with fresh ones. Keep an eye out for corrosion on the PCB from leaky 
electrolytics, and be aware that some probably contain PCBs (not printed 
circuit boards, but highly toxic Poly-Chlorinated Bi-phenyls).


  I always got a laugh about cost-cutting by using a neon bulb instead of a 
nixie tube for the leading '1' digit.


  I bought 2 Fluke 8000 DMMs several years ago (they are LED, not nixie) 
because they were very reliable when I was a technician. But they have accuracy 
issues, and some of the pushbuttons dont work very well. I'll probably give 
them away as-is to anyone willing to pay shipping costs. Some things dont 
improve with age

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   Virus-free. www.avg.com  

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Re: [neonixie-l] Re: Half-digit neon bulb 25/15 mm long

[Tomasz Kowalczyk]

There are three test points in there, two for voltage rails and one 
apparently for a time base. I suspect the power is OK if it does power up 
at all (unless all the logic chips needed for display do not use it and 
have separate voltage rails), what about the 5HZ point?
Also, if the reading is random, I suspect that the problem might be 
somewhere outside the boards - disconnected input socket or one of buttons 
not contacting.

W dniu wtorek, 31 października 2017 10:03:37 UTC+1 użytkownik Paolo Cravero 
napisał:
>
> Funny thing is that it worked when I first powered it after opening the 
> box it was shipped into. That's how I confirmed the bulb was not lighting 
> up by measuring 12 V: I got only units and decimals when varying from 9V to 
> 12V (20V range). 
>
> Once the circuit was out it started misbehaving. No matter what I put in 
> input, it just randomizes numbers. Well that could be entertaining 
> nevertheless! No signs of leaks or fat capacitors. It has been serviced and 
> a couple of traces rebuilt. I will check traces or bad joints in case 
> something got damaged while on my desk. I attach two pictures of the 
> digital section for the curious ones (I can share other internals too).
>
> Still, I can't fit a full size Nixie in that space: I need the bulb or 
> arrange something with LEDs.
>
> Paolo
>
>
>
> Il 31/Ott/2017 01:25, "gregebert"  ha 
> scritto:
>
> If I had to guess, one or more electrolytic caps has probably dried-up and 
> is no longer working as a capacitor. Probably a good idea to replace all of 
> them with fresh ones. Keep an eye out for corrosion on the PCB from leaky 
> electrolytics, and be aware that some probably contain PCBs (not printed 
> circuit boards, but highly toxic *P*oly-*C*hlorinated *B*i-phenyls).
>
> I always got a laugh about cost-cutting by using a neon bulb instead of a 
> nixie tube for the leading '1' digit.
>
> I bought 2 Fluke 8000 DMMs several years ago (they are LED, not nixie) 
> because they were very reliable when I was a technician. But they have 
> accuracy issues, and some of the pushbuttons dont work very well. I'll 
> probably give them away as-is to anyone willing to pay shipping costs. Some 
> things dont improve with age
>
> -- 
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> "neonixie-l" group.
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>  
> 
> .
> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
>
>
>

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Re: [neonixie-l] Re: Half-digit neon bulb 25/15 mm long

[gregebert]

>From the photo, I see what looks to be a blue electrolytic capacitor at the 
top (photo is clipped). It's a long-shot, but that's almost 50 years old so 
I wonder if it dried-out. I had the same thing happen to me with a Heathkit 
that was 30 years old: small electrolytic cap dried-out, became a 
short-circuit, and blew-out the fuse (actually, it was a resistor that was 
put there to behave as a fuse).

If you have a scope, look for AC voltages across an electrolytic; that's 
usually a clue the cap is defective because it's unable to do any 
filtering. After that, look for burn-spots or corroded traces (I didn't see 
any on the photos). Wiggling potentiometers [I saw at least 1 in the photo] 
might be worth trying, but that is risky because you dont know what they do 
and you will probably affect the calibration. Over time, I think the wiper 
contact can get dirty so wiggling it might help clear-away contaminants 
that alter the resistance to the wiper. That pot looked like a high-quality 
Bourns multi-trim, so you may want to leave it alone; the cheap 3/4 turn 
units are the ones I consider suspect.

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[neonixie-l] Re: Half-digit neon bulb 25/15 mm long

[Tomasz Kowalczyk]

I think producers of neon bulbs decided to make searches extra hard 
(datasheets with no dimensions or dimensions not tied to bulb name, using 
same name for different bulbs etc). But I think I've found something quite 
similar in size:
http://www.bulbtown.com/A1A_NE_2_NEON_GLOW_BULB_WIRE_TERMINAL_BASE_p/a1a.htm
The digit will be most likely shorter, but I couldn't find anything closer.

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[neonixie-l] Re: Half-digit neon bulb 25/15 mm long

[gregebert]

If I had to guess, one or more electrolytic caps has probably dried-up and 
is no longer working as a capacitor. Probably a good idea to replace all of 
them with fresh ones. Keep an eye out for corrosion on the PCB from leaky 
electrolytics, and be aware that some probably contain PCBs (not printed 
circuit boards, but highly toxic *P*oly-*C*hlorinated *B*i-phenyls).

I always got a laugh about cost-cutting by using a neon bulb instead of a 
nixie tube for the leading '1' digit.

I bought 2 Fluke 8000 DMMs several years ago (they are LED, not nixie) 
because they were very reliable when I was a technician. But they have 
accuracy issues, and some of the pushbuttons dont work very well. I'll 
probably give them away as-is to anyone willing to pay shipping costs. Some 
things dont improve with age

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