Re: [NTG-context] math: ± and ∓ are shifted
On 4/5/2013 9:32 AM, Hans Hagen wrote: On 4/5/2013 2:16 AM, Khaled Hosny wrote: On Fri, Apr 05, 2013 at 12:55:40AM +0200, Hans Hagen wrote: On 4/5/2013 12:13 AM, Aditya Mahajan wrote: On Fri, 5 Apr 2013, Hans Hagen wrote: On 4/4/2013 11:44 PM, Aditya Mahajan wrote: On Thu, 4 Apr 2013, Xenia wrote: Hi context list, I noticed that the ∓ sign is a little higher than the ± sign, so that the + signs are at the same height. But this looks strange and should be changed. Indeed. These look very odd. I tested this with cambria and the outcome is similar, so this is not a font bug, but something wrong in ConTeXt's math handling. I'm not sure if I understand the issue - lm has + and - touching with the + in the same position as the regular + - cambria has a gap between + and - and moves the + up and down Afaik context isn't doing any magic here as these are precomposed glyphs that directly map. $a \ruledhbox{$+$} b \ruledhbox{$-$} c$ $a \ruledhbox{$±$} b \ruledhbox{$∓$} c$ they are 'binary' in math mode, just like + and - The question is not about the shape of the glyph, but their location. But after looking at the output of latex for CM and Cambria, I am no longer sure what the correct output should be. For Cambria, ConTeXt and LaTeX give similar outputs. For CM/LM they give different outputs. it looks like the open type version has a fitting boundingbox while the type 1 variants have a bit of the + sticking out: CFF fonts do not store bounding box info anywhere, the engine just calculates it based on glyph outlines. For TFM fonts the metrics can be adjusted to achieve specific alignment. Sure, but one can 'cheat' with the boundingboxes as they're not cropboxes. It's no big deal to adapt some metrics in mkiv, but best have the font do the job. Experimental in beta: \definefontfeature [lm-math] [mathdimensions=signs] \starttext \startTEXpage[offset=10pt] $x \ruledhbox{$\pm$} x \ruledhbox{$\mp$} x$ \stopTEXpage \stoptext (explanation in font manual, not yet uploaded) Hans - Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands tel: 038 477 53 69 | voip: 087 875 68 74 | www.pragma-ade.com | www.pragma-pod.nl - ___ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net archive : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___
Re: [NTG-context] math: ± and ∓ are shifted
On 4/5/2013 2:16 AM, Khaled Hosny wrote: On Fri, Apr 05, 2013 at 12:55:40AM +0200, Hans Hagen wrote: On 4/5/2013 12:13 AM, Aditya Mahajan wrote: On Fri, 5 Apr 2013, Hans Hagen wrote: On 4/4/2013 11:44 PM, Aditya Mahajan wrote: On Thu, 4 Apr 2013, Xenia wrote: Hi context list, I noticed that the ∓ sign is a little higher than the ± sign, so that the + signs are at the same height. But this looks strange and should be changed. Indeed. These look very odd. I tested this with cambria and the outcome is similar, so this is not a font bug, but something wrong in ConTeXt's math handling. I'm not sure if I understand the issue - lm has + and - touching with the + in the same position as the regular + - cambria has a gap between + and - and moves the + up and down Afaik context isn't doing any magic here as these are precomposed glyphs that directly map. $a \ruledhbox{$+$} b \ruledhbox{$-$} c$ $a \ruledhbox{$±$} b \ruledhbox{$∓$} c$ they are 'binary' in math mode, just like + and - The question is not about the shape of the glyph, but their location. But after looking at the output of latex for CM and Cambria, I am no longer sure what the correct output should be. For Cambria, ConTeXt and LaTeX give similar outputs. For CM/LM they give different outputs. it looks like the open type version has a fitting boundingbox while the type 1 variants have a bit of the + sticking out: CFF fonts do not store bounding box info anywhere, the engine just calculates it based on glyph outlines. For TFM fonts the metrics can be adjusted to achieve specific alignment. Sure, but one can 'cheat' with the boundingboxes as they're not cropboxes. It's no big deal to adapt some metrics in mkiv, but best have the font do the job. Hans -- - Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands tel: 038 477 53 69 | voip: 087 875 68 74 | www.pragma-ade.com | www.pragma-pod.nl - ___ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net archive : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___
Re: [NTG-context] math: ± and ∓ are shifted
On Fri, Apr 05, 2013 at 12:55:40AM +0200, Hans Hagen wrote: > On 4/5/2013 12:13 AM, Aditya Mahajan wrote: > >On Fri, 5 Apr 2013, Hans Hagen wrote: > > > >>On 4/4/2013 11:44 PM, Aditya Mahajan wrote: > >>>On Thu, 4 Apr 2013, Xenia wrote: > >>> > Hi context list, > > I noticed that the ∓ sign is a little higher than the ± sign, so that > the + signs are at the same height. But this looks strange and > should be > changed. > >>> > >>>Indeed. These look very odd. I tested this with cambria and the outcome > >>>is similar, so this is not a font bug, but something wrong in ConTeXt's > >>>math handling. > >> > >>I'm not sure if I understand the issue > >> > >>- lm has + and - touching with the + in the same position as the > >>regular + > >> > >>- cambria has a gap between + and - and moves the + up and down > >> > >>Afaik context isn't doing any magic here as these are precomposed > >>glyphs that directly map. > >> > >>$a \ruledhbox{$+$} b \ruledhbox{$-$} c$ > >> > >>$a \ruledhbox{$±$} b \ruledhbox{$∓$} c$ > >> > >>they are 'binary' in math mode, just like + and - > > > >The question is not about the shape of the glyph, but their location. > >But after looking at the output of latex for CM and Cambria, I am no > >longer sure what the correct output should be. For Cambria, ConTeXt and > >LaTeX give similar outputs. For CM/LM they give different outputs. > > it looks like the open type version has a fitting boundingbox while > the type 1 variants have a bit of the + sticking out: CFF fonts do not store bounding box info anywhere, the engine just calculates it based on glyph outlines. For TFM fonts the metrics can be adjusted to achieve specific alignment. Regards, Khaled ___ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net archive : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___
Re: [NTG-context] math: ± and ∓ are shifted
On 4/5/2013 12:13 AM, Aditya Mahajan wrote: On Fri, 5 Apr 2013, Hans Hagen wrote: On 4/4/2013 11:44 PM, Aditya Mahajan wrote: On Thu, 4 Apr 2013, Xenia wrote: Hi context list, I noticed that the ∓ sign is a little higher than the ± sign, so that the + signs are at the same height. But this looks strange and should be changed. Indeed. These look very odd. I tested this with cambria and the outcome is similar, so this is not a font bug, but something wrong in ConTeXt's math handling. I'm not sure if I understand the issue - lm has + and - touching with the + in the same position as the regular + - cambria has a gap between + and - and moves the + up and down Afaik context isn't doing any magic here as these are precomposed glyphs that directly map. $a \ruledhbox{$+$} b \ruledhbox{$-$} c$ $a \ruledhbox{$±$} b \ruledhbox{$∓$} c$ they are 'binary' in math mode, just like + and - The question is not about the shape of the glyph, but their location. But after looking at the output of latex for CM and Cambria, I am no longer sure what the correct output should be. For Cambria, ConTeXt and LaTeX give similar outputs. For CM/LM they give different outputs. it looks like the open type version has a fitting boundingbox while the type 1 variants have a bit of the + sticking out: \starttext $x \ruledhbox{$\pm$} x \ruledhbox{$\mp$} x$ \stoptext Hans - Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands tel: 038 477 53 69 | voip: 087 875 68 74 | www.pragma-ade.com | www.pragma-pod.nl - ___ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net archive : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___
Re: [NTG-context] math: ± and ∓ are shifted
On Fri, 5 Apr 2013, Hans Hagen wrote: On 4/4/2013 11:44 PM, Aditya Mahajan wrote: On Thu, 4 Apr 2013, Xenia wrote: Hi context list, I noticed that the ∓ sign is a little higher than the ± sign, so that the + signs are at the same height. But this looks strange and should be changed. Indeed. These look very odd. I tested this with cambria and the outcome is similar, so this is not a font bug, but something wrong in ConTeXt's math handling. I'm not sure if I understand the issue - lm has + and - touching with the + in the same position as the regular + - cambria has a gap between + and - and moves the + up and down Afaik context isn't doing any magic here as these are precomposed glyphs that directly map. $a \ruledhbox{$+$} b \ruledhbox{$-$} c$ $a \ruledhbox{$±$} b \ruledhbox{$∓$} c$ they are 'binary' in math mode, just like + and - The question is not about the shape of the glyph, but their location. But after looking at the output of latex for CM and Cambria, I am no longer sure what the correct output should be. For Cambria, ConTeXt and LaTeX give similar outputs. For CM/LM they give different outputs. Aditya test.pdf Description: Adobe PDF document test-cm.pdf Description: Adobe PDF document ___ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net archive : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___
Re: [NTG-context] math: ± and ∓ are shifted
On 4/4/2013 11:44 PM, Aditya Mahajan wrote: On Thu, 4 Apr 2013, Xenia wrote: Hi context list, I noticed that the ∓ sign is a little higher than the ± sign, so that the + signs are at the same height. But this looks strange and should be changed. Indeed. These look very odd. I tested this with cambria and the outcome is similar, so this is not a font bug, but something wrong in ConTeXt's math handling. I'm not sure if I understand the issue - lm has + and - touching with the + in the same position as the regular + - cambria has a gap between + and - and moves the + up and down Afaik context isn't doing any magic here as these are precomposed glyphs that directly map. $a \ruledhbox{$+$} b \ruledhbox{$-$} c$ $a \ruledhbox{$±$} b \ruledhbox{$∓$} c$ they are 'binary' in math mode, just like + and - Hans - Hans Hagen | PRAGMA ADE Ridderstraat 27 | 8061 GH Hasselt | The Netherlands tel: 038 477 53 69 | voip: 087 875 68 74 | www.pragma-ade.com | www.pragma-pod.nl - ___ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net archive : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___
Re: [NTG-context] math: ± and ∓ are shifted
On Thu, 4 Apr 2013, Xenia wrote: Hi context list, I noticed that the ∓ sign is a little higher than the ± sign, so that the + signs are at the same height. But this looks strange and should be changed. Indeed. These look very odd. I tested this with cambria and the outcome is similar, so this is not a font bug, but something wrong in ConTeXt's math handling. Aditya___ If your question is of interest to others as well, please add an entry to the Wiki! maillist : ntg-context@ntg.nl / http://www.ntg.nl/mailman/listinfo/ntg-context webpage : http://www.pragma-ade.nl / http://tex.aanhet.net archive : http://foundry.supelec.fr/projects/contextrev/ wiki : http://contextgarden.net ___
[NTG-context] math: ± and ∓ are shifted
Hi context list, I noticed that the ∓ sign is a little higher than the ± sign, so that the + signs are at the same height. But this looks strange and should be changed. $ context --version mtx-context | ConTeXt Process Management 0.60 mtx-context | current version: 2013.03.24 15:11 Thanks, Xenia (/home/maja/context/tex/texmf-context/tex/context/base/cont-yes.mkiv ConTeXt ver: 2013.03.24 15:11 MKIV fmt: 2013.3.24 int: english/english system > 'cont-new.mkiv' loaded (/home/maja/context/tex/texmf-context/tex/context/base/cont-new.mkiv system > beware: some patches loaded from cont-new.mkiv ) system > files > jobname 'plus_minus', input 'plus_minus', result 'plus_minus' fonts > latin modern fonts are not preloaded languages > language 'en' is active (plus_minus.tex{/home/maja/context/tex/texmf-context/fonts/map/pdftex/context/mkiv-base.map} fonts > preloading latin modern fonts (second stage) fonts > typescripts > unknown library 'loc' {/home/maja/context/tex/texmf/fonts/map/dvips/lm/lm-math.map}{/home/maja/context/tex/texmf/fonts/map/dvips/lm/lm-rm.map} fonts > 'fallback modern rm 12pt' is loaded backend > xmp > using file '/home/maja/context/tex/texmf-context/tex/context/base/lpdf-pdx.xml' pages > flushing realpage 1, userpage 1 ) ) system > files > start used files used files >1: filename=cont-yes.mkiv filetype=tex foundname=/home/maja/context/tex/texmf-context/tex/context/base/cont-yes.mkiv usedmethod=database used files >2: filename=cont-new.mkiv filetype=tex foundname=/home/maja/context/tex/texmf-context/tex/context/base/cont-new.mkiv usedmethod=database used files >3: filename=lang-us.lua filetype=lua foundname=/home/maja/context/tex/texmf-context/tex/context/patterns/lang-us.lua usedmethod=database used files >4: filename=plus_minus.tex foundname=plus_minus.tex usedmethod=direct used files >5: filename=mkiv-base.map filetype=map format=map foundname=/home/maja/context/tex/texmf-context/fonts/map/pdftex/context/mkiv-base.map usedmethod=database used files >6: filename=lm.lfg filetype=tex foundname=/home/maja/context/tex/texmf-context/tex/context/fonts/lm.lfg usedmethod=database used files >7: filename=lm-math.lfg filetype=tex foundname=/home/maja/context/tex/texmf-context/tex/context/fonts/lm-math.lfg usedmethod=database used files >8: filename=lm-math.map filetype=map format=map foundname=/home/maja/context/tex/texmf/fonts/map/dvips/lm/lm-math.map usedmethod=database used files >9: filename=lm-rm.map filetype=map format=map foundname=/home/maja/context/tex/texmf/fonts/map/dvips/lm/lm-rm.map usedmethod=database used files > 10: filename=lmroman12-regular filetype=otf format=otf foundname=/home/maja/context/tex/texmf/fonts/opentype/public/lm/lmroman12-regular.otf usedmethod=database used files > 11: filename=latinmodern-math.otf filetype=opentypefonts foundname=/home/maja/context/tex/texmf/fonts/opentype/public/lm-math/latinmodern-math.otf usedmethod=database used files > 12: filename=latinmodern-math.otf filetype=otf format=otf foundname=/home/maja/context/tex/texmf/fonts/opentype/public/lm-math/latinmodern-math.otf usedmethod=database used files > 13: filename=lpdf-pdx.xml filetype=tex foundname=/home/maja/context/tex/texmf-context/tex/context/base/lpdf-pdx.xml usedmethod=database system > files > stop used files system > structure > start used structure used structure > text: plus_minus system > structure > stop used structure system > files > start used files used file >1: filename=cont-yes.mkiv filetype=tex foundname=/home/maja/context/tex/texmf-context/tex/context/base/cont-yes.mkiv usedmethod=database used file >2: filename=cont-new.mkiv filetype=tex foundname=/home/maja/context/tex/texmf-context/tex/context/base/cont-new.mkiv usedmethod=database used file >3: filename=lang-us.lua filetype=lua foundname=/home/maja/context/tex/texmf-context/tex/context/patterns/lang-us.lua usedmethod=database used file >4: filename=plus_minus.tex foundname=plus_minus.tex usedmethod=direct used file >5: filename=mkiv-base.map filetype=map format=map foundname=/home/maja/context/tex/texmf-context/fonts/map/pdftex/context/mkiv-base.map usedmethod=database used file >6: filename=lm.lfg filetype=tex foundname=/home/maja/context/tex/texmf-context/tex/context/fonts/lm.lfg usedmethod=database used file >7: filename=lm-math.lfg filetype=tex foundname=/home/maja/context/tex/texmf-context/tex/context/fonts/lm-math.lfg usedmethod=database used file >8: filename=lm-math.map filetype=map format=map foundname=/home/maja/context/tex/texmf/fonts/map/dvips/lm/lm-math.map usedmethod=database used file >9: filename=lm-rm.map filetype=map format=map foundname=/home/maja/context/t